Hello all,
This game keeps coming up more and more in the forums I read, so I thought I would ask for some honest, imparial feedback: How is this game? I currently play 40k right now and the models for Infinity just keep catching my eye.
It's hard to be impartial and to give feedback on a game - I've played it and I like it a lot, so that's my partiality declared anyway
Small number of minis involved makes it a lot cheaper to get into that 40K or Warmachine - the two other larger systems I've played. It's more like the malifaux entry cost.
Miniatures are the best sci-fi minis there are imo - they've also won TTG sci-fi mini of the year the last two years running so that's a widely held view it seems.
Rules are good with an excellent faq and responsive devs. I particularly like the ability to respond to actions you see during your reactive turn, it keeps the game interesting and removes the boredom you sometimes have in other games, especially if your opponent is slow.
Very cinematic as you have a small number of important troops who will duck and dodge through cover, up over walls etc while they run and gun. Weapons are realistically deadly. If a sniper rifle can see you and you're not a heavy infantry then you're odds-on to die. I like this, it keeps the games tense and snappy.
Tension and cinema is also added by the fact that as you work your way across the battlefield you don't know if an invisible (not even on the board, just location written down) sniper will decloak and shoot you, or an invisible ninja will appear behind you and stab you in the back, or a drop troop land behind you and shoot you down. So you need to work your way forward while covering your guys and watching your back. I find that fun.
Lots of skills to use, like climb, throw grenades, duck, jump, dodge, supression fire, speculative shot, hacking etc. Gives you a lot of tactical possibilities but the game flows quickly - friend and I typically have one hour long 300 point (most common size I think) games. This is partially due to the viciousness of the weapons though, you can wipe a complete army in a turn if your opponent is really silly.
Negatives: Not enough official scenarios, fan made ones are ok but I would like official ones. Apparently due out this year as part of a campaign book.
Works better with lots of terrrain. This is actually a positive imo, as terrain is fun and the game is so much better for the ability to climb it, jump between it, duck behind it, but you need a lot of terrain. Terrain doesn't need to be anything special just as long as you break up long shooting alleys and provide cover. It'll play fine with a table full of paper back books. It will NOT play fine with 40K style gothic ruins. You will have LOS everywhere and people won't be able to do anything other than turtle up for fear of being blown away the second they move.
Never as easy to get a game of it as it would be to get a game of 40k or WHFB as there's a million players of those systems available to game with on any given day.
As a competitive 40k player and a newer Infinity player (5 games under my belt) I have to say the game is amazing. Check out the free rules and army builder from their site.
The default is straight up kill each other battle but it is better with scenarios imo.
There are only two official scenarios but plenty of community ones and there will be an official scenario/campaign book this year. I don't know when this year, I missed that if it was announced.
Infinity is a highly-detailed skirmish game. In appearance, it's gorgeous. Gameplay for new players can get very quickly bogged down in detail and playing against experienced players who know the ins and outs of the tactics will see newbies quickly plastered.
However, the guys at Beasts of War have recently had an Infinity Week, producing loads of videos to introduce the game, plus a set of Quick Start rules that are free to download (just like the main rules, albeit without the cool background).
If you've ever player a high-detail skirmish game like Inquisitor, then you'll find the gameplay familiar (albeit with mechanics distinctly different to Inquisitor!). Don't expect it to be like Necromunda, though - it's a much more tactical game!
Also, the minis are fabulous but very tricky to assemble. These are not minis for novices. If you aren't comfortable with pinning, greenstuff and other such advanced assembly techniques, you might want to play with substitute models to start with. Plus, painting-wise, the minis reward skill and are poorly-suited to speed-painting techniques like drybrushing and dipping. Not to say that you can't use those techniques, but you'll find that they don't bring out the details and qualities of the miniatures, which are very finely sculpted.
As someone with 6 month old twins I'd have to disagree that the models don't suit speed painting
You are wasting their potential to look really amazing but the fine detail works wonderfully with inks and washes in my opinion. Even base coating with a paint watered down with acrylic paint thinner added gives a nice effect. Certainly for the time involved.
The firefights can be fast and vicious and often pyrrhic (your heavy might just gun down those three LI threatening him, but that flamethrower might also toast him in return - and 3 LI are often cheaper than 1 heavy.
You can (if unlucky, badly deployed, or just inexperienced) get wiped out in turn 1 of your opponent's active turn (I have, several times at a tournament. Meant I could go shopping or have a beer.).
Nothing beats the gotcha! moments though. Like when your hidden ninja ganks your opponent's lieutenant.
(such cc moments are rare, though).
I'm a noob at this game and fully expect to lose quite a few more tourney games the same way. I don't care. I don't even care about an ITS ranking, it just means that those players ranked higher than me (all of them) won't get as many points for beating me as they would from someone else. hah.)
That's exactly how I played my first game. I selected the forces out of the starter boxes and proxied Eldar and Marine/IG figs for the two sides.
I know it was mentioned that the game works better with lots of terrain. That's an understatement. Lots of terrain is a must if you want to have any chance of survival. The two players I demoed the game with said they didn't want the clutter. I said okay but the game would be short. It was. 3 turns to be exact (and with only 5 guys a side turns were not that long.)
The best/worst scene of the game was when the sniper (probably the most deadly fig on the table), who waited all game to do anything, lines up the opposing army commander, fires, fumbles the roll and is immediately plinked in the face with a critical hit from reaction fire from his target.
Download the rules and proxy away. It's worth the effort.
Excellent! I'll probably start with the new Beasts of War quick start rules, since they present 3 model 'squads' for each faction that have been relatively simplified.
I was first interested by the PanOceania faction, but then got my eyes on the Ariadna. Scots/Frenchmen of the future? Score!
The game is certainly well designed to allow for cinematic drama in a way that 40k and other larger-scale combat tabletop games aren't (but which is highly reminiscent of Inquisitor).
I really like the game and the mini's.
Man I even like the rules a lot, the only thing what bothers me are all those extra single miniature rules/options/abbilities.
Thats what makes the rules really hard to play (IMHO) if you only played 40K before.....
Method wrote:I really like the game and the mini's.
Man I even like the rules a lot, the only thing what bothers me are all those extra single miniature rules/options/abbilities.
Thats what makes the rules really hard to play (IMHO) if you only played 40K before.....
Once you have a couple games under your belt it is easy to handle. When you area only dealing with ~10 enemy models and usually only one is moving at a time, you learn fast.
@Method - I thought the same thing. Starting with the Quick Start rules produced by Beasts of War helps you get to grips with the core rules and basic tactics without being overwhelmed by all the special rules, which you can then add in as your confidence grows.
precinctomega wrote:Infinity is a highly-detailed skirmish game. In appearance, it's gorgeous. Gameplay for new players can get very quickly bogged down in detail and playing against experienced players who know the ins and outs of the tactics will see newbies quickly plastered.
However, the guys at Beasts of War have recently had an Infinity Week, producing loads of videos to introduce the game, plus a set of Quick Start rules that are free to download (just like the main rules, albeit without the cool background).
If you've ever player a high-detail skirmish game like Inquisitor, then you'll find the gameplay familiar (albeit with mechanics distinctly different to Inquisitor!). Don't expect it to be like Necromunda, though - it's a much more tactical game!
Also, the minis are fabulous but very tricky to assemble. These are not minis for novices. If you aren't comfortable with pinning, greenstuff and other such advanced assembly techniques, you might want to play with substitute models to start with. Plus, painting-wise, the minis reward skill and are poorly-suited to speed-painting techniques like drybrushing and dipping. Not to say that you can't use those techniques, but you'll find that they don't bring out the details and qualities of the miniatures, which are very finely sculpted.
R.
So putting the minis together is somewhat difficult in comparison to 40K?
Yep, the miniatures are definitely more difficult to assemble than 40K ones.
The models are much more finely detailed, the poses less blocky and the pieces themselves are finer so it is definitely trickier. Except compared to the old metal tyranid gargoyles. Nothing I have ever assembled has been lamer to put together than those damn things.
I don't have great difficulties with Infinity minis although there is the odd swear word. You're not assembling more than a couple of them at a time and I've got a few years practice of 40K, Warmahordes and blood bowl minis to prepare me.
Yeah the models are a bit trickier then most. They are metal with a lot of little detailed pieces, but when they come together they are totally worth it.
Played three games now (6 with the quickstart rules, added in more normal guys to try stuff out with friends), 250 points Yu Jing.
As many has described, small game, fun. You can get bogged down by the rules sometimes, but if you keep it simple it will be simple. If you want it advanced, you can have it advanced.
I really enjoy that there is almost a Beginner, Medium and Advanced split up in the rules. We are playing on a medium level and haven't dived into the more advanced parts (like Linked troops, special army compositions etc).
We've proxyd allot of our games, prolly gonna order some next month :3
Easy to start, medium dificult to get further into it. But we are still reading the rules to understand it all, but the PDF for it are odd. They are trying to cram in soooooooooo long examples of stuff, but they want to be specific and be clear.
Buy what you like the look of would be the single most important piece of advice I'd give about Infinity.
Obviously limiting it to one faction, not single models from many! (Let's ignore merc lists).
It's very well balanced and you can use pretty much anything you like, with a caveat that you will struggle to use the super-expensive TAGs in a 200 point list. I wouldn't use them until 300 points.
Some Sectorials are somewhat more complicated for a beginner (like the almost all camo Shasvastii) but it's not that much of a difference and if you like the models then get them and you'll learn quickly enough.
Start off at lower points like 100 and keep it to basic troopers and basic guns for the first game.
Then add in a nasty gun per side, HMG or spitfire while moving up to 150 points.
Then add in a basic camo or basic drop-troop (not HMG/Spitfire) guy per side.
Then add in TO models, hacking, TAGs, whatever.
That's how I try and teach people the game. You can go all out from the start but it's a lot to learn.
But I guess I take both of the Standard starter to start out with so I have some standard like the Line Kazaks and some Ghulam Infantry to learn the basic rules.
I am going to have to look and see if there are any local players in my area. I would love to see a game of this played out. Right now, 40k just dominates the miniature games played here.
If you prefer the Bahram starter then get it and just proxy the two Daylami infantry as Ghulams. The reason I'd proxy them is that they're irregular and won't provide orders to your pool, so you'd want a few more regular models to use them alongside. The Ragik is a drop trooper, so with 2 of the 6 being irregular, and 1 being off the board, you would only have 3 regular orders. This problem goes away when you have a few more models and a Daylami is a cheap point filler.
The rest of the minis in both those boxes have no particular caveats to watch out for - Hunzakut in the main Haqq box is also irregular but he's only one of 6 so it's fine .
Method wrote:But I guess I take both of the Standard starter to start out with so I have some standard like the Line Kazaks and some Ghulam Infantry to learn the basic rules.
I'd go that route. Sectorials are strong with their link troops, but it adds even more complexity to the mix.
40k dominates here too, buy two starters and find someone who wnats to give it a shot with ya. After one match most people will crave the game, if played right.
Most (if not all) of the sectorial units are available in the main army as well (it's just that the sectorial often has higher numbers of certain units available, and none of certain others). PanO for example (main) can have ONE (1) of the Aquila guard models, Neoterra (PanO sectorial) can have THREE (3) of them, but can't take any of the regular (and best mainline hackers) kamau units (MI hacker with a BTS-6, yes please).
General Ariadna can use ALL of the caledonian stuff, or the merovingians, yet (for example) Cal and Mero can't use each other's specific units.
Method wrote:I really like the game and the mini's.
Man I even like the rules a lot, the only thing what bothers me are all those extra single miniature rules/options/abbilities.
Thats what makes the rules really hard to play (IMHO) if you only played 40K before.....
I've just been reading the rules. My impression is that there are a lot fewer special rules than 40K.
The main complexity is special ammunition types, which you can just ignore if you like.
I have just found this from the CB official forum. Some advice about deployment.
How to deploy
The color dots are just to say which troop is the best for those positions.
Point A. Ok, this is where a line troop with a template gun could be very useful.
If you put there a Kuang Shi, Caledonian Volunteer with chainrifle, Naffatun... the enemy #2 will think twice about turning that corner around. When you have a chainrifle you have to force a close shootout, because it will be a automatic hit roll for the enemy. It is dissuasive: -"Am I going to risk my 30pts para-trooper against that 5 pts. Line Infantry?" thinks the enemy.
Point B. Infiltrators. Hacker infiltrators, minelayer infiltrators... that position is where they can make an effective reactive turn. Inside the building or maybe on a rooftop wiht a Prone marker. No Line of Shoot against him.
Imagine that the red dot #1 is an enemy TAG, if it gets into the red zone, the hacker range, it could get inmovilized. If that Hacker is a TO, there will be nothing there until the TAG gets into the danger zone, if it was a simple cammo marker, nothing could say that it has a Hacker device.
Points C & D. That is where a good shooter/sniper and a medic or Palbot/YaoZao/SalveDrone/Nasmat/Zondbot could be very useful.
As you already know, a good shooter in an elevated position with cover is good, if thta shooter has a HMG or Sniper rifle, is better, if that troop has the benefits of Mimetism/Cammo/DDO/TO Cammo, is better, and if it has a Visor it is GREAT!
But, we can make it even better wit some support, placing a medic or a remote extension of a medic to heal some wounds or recovering that sniper from unconsciousness, it is worthy.
Point E. That is were a Light Infantry with Rifle should be. It will have cover and make the shootout in an optimal range (+3). It is diffcult to succeed in a confronted roll, so, don´t make it harder. Never try to overcome the enemy in a -3 range zone. The linked fireteams with no special weapons should try to deploy in this kind of zones, where the enemy cannot use the distance to attack them.
When I look at the graphic example my mind says "Boy, I need to make a lot of cover..."
BobbaFett wrote:When I look at the graphic example my mind says "Boy, I need to make a lot of cover..."
I'm not super familiar with infinity, but "Lots of Cover" seems to go hand in hand with "Semi-realistic weapon ranges." Especially if a lot of sci-fi stereotypes are in use, railguns and such are likely to have ridiculous ranges at 28mm, and artillery (even WWII and older) would probably be rated at dozens of feet.
Honestly you are correct, to get started just some boxes or books work fine for learning the rules. If you get anything that comes with the infinity box sets that box alone will make two pieces of cover if stood on the side.
The diagram above I would honestly say is a little too open lol. A sniper in the C or D position would have pure domination of the board since it looks like that building is taller then everything up to the #1 mark. You also want some cars or other things in any wide open paths so your guys have something to run up to for cover.
To a 40k or other similar game, a good infinity board should look like a total nightmare. Here is some samples from the infinity community, and remember these are what to shoot for and don't be intimidated since like I said even boxes work great.
quozl wrote:This problem goes away when you have a few more models and a Daylami is a cheap point filler.
So you still have to buy cheap dudes to generate orders. Unfortunate as that's the only thing that turns me off about the game.
Why would this be a reason not to play the game? Every game has it's meat sheilds and or lower points costs troops that fill out the list and are designed to soak up fire, in this case the cheap troops are used to generate more orders....
You don't HAVE to buy cheap guys, you can plya 300pt games with 10 guys in the the mid range of points. Even cheap guys win games, and in sectoral lists those cheap guys are usually linkable and make them nasty lil buggers.
Delephont wrote:Why would this be a reason not to play the game? Every game has it's meat sheilds and or lower points costs troops that fill out the list and are designed to soak up fire, in this case the cheap troops are used to generate more orders...
Now, it's been years and I only played a few games but here it is:
I'm not adverse to cheap dudes being meat shields, at all. But it seemed like, in Infinity, all of the cheap dudes would huddle in a corner sending good wishes to someone that can actually do something in the form of more orders, not actually on the line getting shot like cheap dudes in other games.
As far as what I play, do you want a (23 year) history or what I have on the shelves right now?
Yep, you don't have to have cheap guys as long as you play around 300 points. At 150 points you really do have to have some cheap models imo otherwise you'll be starved of orders. The game designers say it is designed for 300 points and 300 points is only a starter box and 2 heavy infantry blisters, so if you like the game you'll get there very quickly.
The cheap models don't have to just be cheerleaders though:
In Haqqislam I have 12 point (very cheap) light infantry with a 10.5" flame-thrower template. They rock and are amongst my favourite troopers to use.
There are 16 point light infantry ghulams with a 2 use panzerfaust missile launcher. Those are very fun too. In a 250 or 300 point list a 16 point model is a cheap order but with a 2 use missile-launcher it's also something you will be using and your opponent will have to fear giving AROs to.
I could go to the extreme and take 9 point moderators in my Nomad army for nothing other than order generating. Even then though they still have BS 10 and combi-rifles so they are dangerous. I would be choosing to take them for orders probably, to compensate for taking something really expensive like a TAG. Although I could also make a very nice moderator link team with spitfires and grenade launchers for not that many points. It would be very dangerous too. I don't tend to go the TAG fueled by cheap cheerleaders approach though and in Nomad 300 points I'm more likely to have a lot of 18 ('zero' infiltrators) to 45 (intruder HMG) point models with maybe one or two 10 point combi rifle alguaciles.
Here's the list I played most recently (Combined Armies)
http://www.infinitycreator.com/users/500/army_lists/10983 There's only one model in there that I took as a cheerleader and I only took him because I had 15 points left - the seed soldier.
The daturari is 14 points but he's no cheerleader - he's an impetuous (free order that has to be towards nearest enemy model each turn) smoke throwing martial arts monster, with the lowest level of camo. Again, he's one of my favourite troopers and he's the cheapest thing I can get in Combined Armies.
There are only 4 cheap troopers (out of 12). 3 of those are big flame templates, they may provide orders but they also burninate any enemy drop troopers that try to land in my deployment zone or they go hunting camo markers with intuitive attacks. The 4th cheap guy is my lieutenant and he is my lieutenant because he's cheap and costs no SWC. I could instead have taken a heavy infantry guy and made him my lieutenant but I generally prefer cheap fragile lieutenants who can hide and shout orders from the back - it's a personal choice thing, some prefer making the toughest thing they have their lieutenant (and bringing something really tough).
So it's pretty much up to you at 250 and 300 points. At lower levels you will, imo, be order starved if you don't bring some cheap models. Don't think that cheap means boring though, a 9 point combi rifle moderator is not very exciting but a light infantry with a rocket launcher or a big flame thrower is still cool.
quozl wrote:Yep, you don't have to have cheap guys as long as you play around 300 points. At 150 points you really do have to have some cheap models imo otherwise you'll be starved of orders. The game designers say it is designed for 300 points
I see, so there's an army list sweet spot where you can buy moderately priced minis that are worthwhile and have enough order to go around. I guess the problem I saw was that you'd take 1 uber trooper and as many scrubs as you had points left over for. These were typically 150 point games.
robertsjf wrote:But it seemed like, in Infinity, all of the cheap dudes would huddle in a corner sending good wishes to someone that can actually do something in the form of more orders, not actually on the line getting shot like cheap dudes in other games.
You can choose to play that way and that's probably the first strategy that someone will try when they start Infinity.
Take something big, and then as many cheap guys as possible to fuel it.
I don't think it's something that you'll do for long though, and I never do it, not because it's not-fun (I've played against it and enjoyed that) but because it's not really effective.
There's a lot of counters for it:
1) Ignore the big thing and kill the order monkeys. Drop troopers will do it, especially any with heavy weaponry, of which there are a lot. Impersonators will do it. Infiltrating skirmishers are good at it too. Fast moving guys who can go around the big thing will do it nicely - bikes, super-jump Exrah.
2) Kill the big thing. If it's on it's own and un-supported then it'll die to massed fire. It will end up isolated near multiple enemies and you can co-ordinate orders between multiple models in the game - so you can order 4 of your guys to step out and shoot the big thing at the same time. It only gets one ARO so can only attack one of them. It'll go down to weight of fire. It may only need 7s to save against a combi rifle but that means 1/3 hits are a fail and enough shots also means crits are a risk.
3)Hack the big thing. It's probably a TAG or a heavy infantry. So hack it if you brought hackers. Depends on your faction but if you don't have a good hacker you'll have more good weapons for option 2 above.
4)Mono-filament CCW. One failed saved kills anything. If a TAG is on its own with the rest of your army hiding then it has nobody else to help it discover camo tokens. This means camo tokens have an easy job getting into melee with it. Speculo killer, Oniwaban etc can 1-shot it in melee and strike first.
5) Combat camo attacks. Again an isolated model is vulnerable to camo tokens. They can attack first in a normal instead of face to face roll. ADHL is another 1 shot kill (well 1-shot you're immobilised and you didn't bring an engineer, or at least he's hiding miles away in this list.). Multiple sniper rifles from out of camo will hurt a TAG. Many TAGs have nasty mid-range weapons but won't be able to do jack to a TO sniper 36" away. If the TAG tries to close it will be killed for sure. So it can't go forward. The solution is for the rest of his army to surpress or kill the TO sniper, the TAG isn't meant for that job.
6) Mines. If they're mono-filament or viral they are especially dangerous. You can block off routes of advance for the big scary thing. Admittedly it can probably walk through and only likely take a wound but that makes it much more vulnerable to massed rifle fire.
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robertsjf wrote:
quozl wrote:Yep, you don't have to have cheap guys as long as you play around 300 points. At 150 points you really do have to have some cheap models imo otherwise you'll be starved of orders. The game designers say it is designed for 300 points
I see, so there's an army list sweet spot where you can buy moderately priced minis that are worthwhile and have enough order to go around. I guess the problem I saw was that you'd take 1 uber trooper and as many scrubs as you had points left over for. These were typically 150 point games.
Sort of. I'm playing a 150 point game against a fairly new player tomorrow and this is the list I'm bringing.
It has two cheap guys that are tbh mostly there for order generating - the alguaciles. I could swap them for another zero for example and I'd have no cheap guys and the downside would be one less order. Because it's 150 points it is a bit of a balancing act. The basic alguaciles are not very exciting imo but they have decent ballistic skill and a combi rifle and you should do more with them than just hide them somewhere but the reason they're in that list mostly is to give me 2 cheap orders.
The Morlock is also 10 points but he's irregular so he keeps his order for himself. He's there because he's a bad ass! He's another cheap but really fun trooper.
As a comparison, even at 250 point you can ignore the cheap guys. Here's a 250 point Nomad list that I like:
http://www.infinitycreator.com/users/500/army_lists/10658 It only has a single cheap line infantry - and he's not actually there to be an order monkey he's there because as well as being a forward observer (I don't care in this list) he has deployable repeaters So he won't be hiding - he'll be workng his way forward and either trying to drop a repeater within 8" of a juicy target for hacking, or blocking off some route by lacing it with repeaters. The other cheap thing is a droid that provides hacking support. It's not a cheap order generator - it's going to be hated by an opponent
quozl wrote:You can choose to play that way and that's probably the first strategy that someone will try when they start Infinity.
Take something big, and then as many cheap guys as possible to fuel it.
I don't think it's something that you'll do for long though, and I never do it, not because it's not-fun (I've played against it and enjoyed that) but because it's not really effective.
I see, so I just didn't play enough to overcome my Newbism. Secret is to stock up on a fair number of medium grade guys that overall can fulfill a variety of functions with maybe one big dude and only 1-2 order batteries? I'll check it out again if I see it at the FLGS.
quozl wrote:
As a comparison, even at 250 point you can ignore the cheap guys. Here's a 250 point Nomad list that I like:
http://www.infinitycreator.com/users/500/army_lists/10658 It only has a single cheap line infantry - and he's not actually there to be an order monkey he's there because as well as being a forward observer (I don't care in this list) he has deployable repeaters So he won't be hiding - he'll be workng his way forward and either trying to drop a repeater within 8" of a juicy target for hacking, or blocking off some route by lacing it with repeaters. The other cheap thing is a droid that provides hacking support. It's not a cheap order generator - it's going to be hated by an opponent
Another fun part is nothing is useless. I play nomads and my lists are completely different then even quozl here
@BlueDagger; yes indeed, I love that nothing in the armylists are saying "you MUST take this", the only "restriction" I see is that some units can't be lieutenants... that's it. And of course, I played a bit with the army creator with nomands, the list I made was totaly diferent. aaah, freedom of choice in a game <3
quozl wrote:
Then add in a nasty gun per side, HMG or spitfire while moving up to 150 points.
Then add in a basic camo or basic drop-troop (not HMG/Spitfire) guy per side.
Then add in TO models, hacking, TAGs, whatever.
That's how I try and teach people the game. You can go all out from the start but it's a lot to learn.
Well... depends really.
In 200 points I find myself including maybe 1-2 REM's, and some HI. And with that 1 doctor, found it quite usefull, one time my I got quite lucky with a Daofei with HMG moving down 4 guys, and then he had his LT and 2 guys left. And he had considered making one of the guys a Doctor, cause his LT took down the Daofei, and the rest of my army was quite far away. Considering that a TAG costs so much, i think the cheapest is 85 pts, its mostly for larger games on.. maybe 400+?
light&medium for start -> heavy infantry and REMs -> TAGS, (mixing ofc) but yeah from easy to more specialised works bests.
Wow! This thread is getting quite some love. I thought it would get a few folks saying either they love or hate the game and a brief reason why, but there are some great posts here!
This is what makes Dakka so great! Awesome members who are willing to really discuss the ins and outs of a game.
quozl wrote:Start off at lower points like 100 and keep it to basic troopers and basic guns for the first game.
Then add in a nasty gun per side, HMG or spitfire while moving up to 150 points.
Then add in a basic camo or basic drop-troop (not HMG/Spitfire) guy per side.
Then add in TO models, hacking, TAGs, whatever.
How many basic troopers would one start with?
Example, The Ariadna Starter has 3 Line Kazaks. Should I buy another blister with thes so I have 6 as a basic even for bigger games?
Is it ok to mix those Line Kazaks with basics like Caledonian Volunteers?
robertsjf wrote:Secret is to stock up on a fair number of medium grade guys that overall can fulfill a variety of functions with maybe one big dude and only 1-2 order batteries? I'll check it out again if I see it at the FLGS.
Yep, that's definitely an option. I often have no big guys at all - not even any heavy infantry as m personal taste is for medium infantry and the skirmishers.
You could even do up a good list with 16 or so light infantry in two combat groups of 8 - I've done it with Haqqislam for variety. Light Infantry can still carry heavy machine guns, missile launchers, sniper rifles etc. Their ballistic skill won't be as good but for that reason the big weapons are usually a little cheaper on them, you get a lot of bodies and you can get more AROs as your opponent advances. I do prefer keeping it to around 10 miniatures though.
If you do check it out again, then I'd really advise avoiding things like TAGs or really big expensive HI like the Asura for the first half dozen games - if you don't know the basic game you'll really struggle to deal with them. I'd suggest starting with line troopers with just rifles and shotguns. Then escalate it per game by adding camo, then a HMG or spitfire, then drop troopers. then TO camo. Once you have big guns, drop troops, camo, TO camo and some experience then enemy tags won't be so scary. A single line-infantry with a missle launcher can even one shot one if you get really lucky!
The biggest problem I ran into when starting the game was that we didn't realise quite how much line of sight blocking terrain we needed and we gave ourselves fantastic sniper towers in our deployment zones without thinking it through. So the first games turned into sniper battles with any advancing troops massacred Watch out for that one too!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Method wrote:
quozl wrote:Start off at lower points like 100 and keep it to basic troopers and basic guns for the first game.
Then add in a nasty gun per side, HMG or spitfire while moving up to 150 points.
Then add in a basic camo or basic drop-troop (not HMG/Spitfire) guy per side.
Then add in TO models, hacking, TAGs, whatever.
How many basic troopers would one start with?
Example, The Ariadna Starter has 3 Line Kazaks. Should I buy another blister with thes so I have 6 as a basic even for bigger games?
Is it ok to mix those Line Kazaks with basics like Caledonian Volunteers?
I wouldn't buy anything that you don't think you'll use at higher points levels. I don't remember using more than 3 of the most basic troopers in a full size game - I might bring more light infantry than that but they'll be things like flame-thrower guys, panzerfausts, grenade launchers or HMG.
The only thing I left out is the Highlander Grey - simply because something had to be dropped to fit and he was a handy point value to drop. At 100 points 49 points on one guy is a lot but I restricted it to the contents of the starter box so this is the list that I would make out of it for a demo game.
It'd be quite a good intro game list imo. The only possibly difficult thing is the camo troop. If there are other models that you're buying and they're basic you could swap them in for him. Camo is actually very simple enough once you understand it - there are three minute or so long videos made by corvus belli explaining it if you're interested.
Playing that list against a similar list will let you get used to the game. There are no nasty surprises and nothing too confusing but it'll still be interesting imo while you're learning. I would leave the camo guy in personally but balance it by making sure the other guy has one too, so you're both at the same level of newbie confusion
Is it ok to mix those Line Kazaks with basics like Caledonian Volunteers?
Yep, absolutely in a general Ariadna list. If you later decide to run a sectorial army for a particular game then I doubt they're both in the same sectorial so you would be restricted then.
If I have 9 points left over in a Nomads list that has Alguaciles in it, then I either spend the 9 points upgrading something, down-grade something by a couple of points and add something worth more than 9, or stick in a 9 point moderator. Alguaciles and Moderators are two of the three Nomad line-troopers (the other, the Securitate are kind of like medium-light). There's no restriction having them in the same list unless sectorial and they actually complement each other very nicely because for example Alguaciles can have deployable repeaters for hacking, and moderators can have a 2-shot gun that fires deployable repeaters So in a hacking orientated list I might want to bring both of them to get both of those toys.
Method wrote:
How many basic troopers would one start with?
Example, The Ariadna Starter has 3 Line Kazaks. Should I buy another blister with thes so I have 6 as a basic even for bigger games?
Is it ok to mix those Line Kazaks with basics like Caledonian Volunteers?
Yeah on higher pts as qouzl you will.. at the most use 3 regular guys. there is almost always like 10-13 points left. But generaly you want to use REM's, Medium and Heavy infantry (TAG's later) as your base
I really don't know about those specific ones but it's not a stupid question as I do know that the Cateran Sniper
comes with that base.
You are allowed use the scenic base or not. The scenic base is cool looking but you might prefer to base it on a normal 25 mil base for game-play reasons.
Yes, they do come with that "base". YOu get eh model in that position then the metal terrain piece that goes on the base. Really give the Ariadna a gritty feel
The only miniatures i really like are the Panoceania dewds with the knives, they look like rad cyborg commandos. Can i have an army of just them? Sikh commandos i think, but there seem to be similar guys with different names.
Perkustin wrote:The only miniatures i really like are the Panoceania dewds with the knives, they look like rad cyborg commandos. Can i have an army of just them? Sikh commandos i think, but there seem to be similar guys with different names.
With the Acontecimento Shock Army Sectoral army you can take 4 of them.. and even have them as part of a link team which is brutal. The sectoral pack shows how well the units mesh as far as looks and here is a list made up of those units. As a new player you would have a hell of a time trying to play it without someone showing you the rules since it include various type of deployment and a link team, but wit ha few games under you belt you'd quickly find the list incredibly powerful.
Yes, that is a 4 man link team with 3 HMGs at BS 12 w/ MSLV1 and mimetism. Outside of that it's an alright list, but uses all the models you like.
ACONTECIMENTO SHOCK ARMY ──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────
There are INFINITY threads in NEWS & RUMORS, OTHER SCI-FI GAMES and MAILIFAUX & OTHER SKIRMISH SCALE GAMES...
I'm all for the INFINITY love, but there aren't many of us on here, we should try to coordinate our actions, perhaps even link them up...
Well... Corvus Belli is a company that releases 5 new products for Infinity every month, if that does not require a thread in the news section I don´t know wich company does.
Also, as a user, if a forum is named "Malifaux and other games..." that means "Malifaux". I guess is a matter of time to that section to became the Malifaux section.
I would love a seperate Infinity section on the forum.....
+1 to the Infinity section.
I guess that the interest for Infinity has raised since the Beasts of War themed week. Many people is asking for the game system and there are a few users here (Bluedagger, Navarro...) who are willing to answer those questions. Also, now there is a whole bunch of videos that shows how the game works, without mention the awesome online army builder that they have.
I mean... if we have here a growing community of Infinity willing to make good introduction threads, a separate section sounds right.
It is just my opinion, the Mods have all the numbers to guess if this is correct.
I think Dakka Dakka is just worried about if the game would have enough volume to justify it's own section. Perhaps we could talk them into a 2 forum area, one for Rules/Fluff/ etc and the others for Lists/Batreps.
BlueDagger wrote:Honestly you are correct, to get started just some boxes or books work fine for learning the rules. If you get anything that comes with the infinity box sets that box alone will make two pieces of cover if stood on the side.
The diagram above I would honestly say is a little too open lol. A sniper in the C or D position would have pure domination of the board since it looks like that building is taller then everything up to the #1 mark. You also want some cars or other things in any wide open paths so your guys have something to run up to for cover.
To a 40k or other similar game, a good infinity board should look like a total nightmare. Here is some samples from the infinity community, and remember these are what to shoot for and don't be intimidated since like I said even boxes work great.
Those are the tables they had at Adepticon.
I played a demo with Knights vs Haqqislam.
One of the order sergeants was able to CC shoot the Haqq leader in combat.
I rolled a crit to hit him, and shot him in the eye.
It was an interesting gam,e, lots of potential.
There are INFINITY threads in NEWS & RUMORS, OTHER SCI-FI GAMES and MAILIFAUX & OTHER SKIRMISH SCALE GAMES...
I'm all for the INFINITY love, but there aren't many of us on here, we should try to coordinate our actions, perhaps even link them up...
Well... Corvus Belli is a company that releases 5 new products for Infinity every month, if that does not require a thread in the news section I don´t know wich company does.
BobbaFett wrote:
Also, as a user, if a forum is named "Malifaux and other games..." that means "Malifaux". I guess is a matter of time to that section to became the Malifaux section.
Thanks for the very thorough answer blue dagger, can i just say you are making some great contributions to this thread. I am sure i am not the only one who is now alot more interested in infinity.
Perkustin wrote:Thanks for the very thorough answer blue dagger, can i just say you are making some great contributions to this thread. I am sure i am not the only one who is now alot more interested in infinity.
Not a problem, I'm all about welcoming people to this game. I'm a big 40k fan and own like 8k+ point of Eldar, but since I started Infinity about 5 weeks ago... it has consumed me. The game is utterly fantastic, the company/makers really care about their players, the models are incredibly beautiful, and the fluff opens the doors for a non-grimdark world with urban sci-fi boards and modern politics/scenarios.
I still plan on always playing 40k, but Infinity has my heart right now and they just keep impressing me.
@skrulnik: Yeah the crits add a twist to games and simulate pure dumb luck in combat. It also means that your basic guys can sometimes pull off amazing feats that make you both go WTF. Even being a mathhammer nut though the chances of it happening barely surface on my radar though when you start throwing lots of dice it happens at the most random times. It's not WHFB where you throw a bunch of spell dice and you blow up the opponent and they lose the game, but it does change the face of the game with that lucky shot from a piddly combi rifle vs a TAG with one wound left.
The Massive Armor TAG pokes around the corner and spots Timmy the rifleman, hiding for his life. Timmy closes his eyes and blindly fires a single shot critically hitting some wiring and shutting down the monstrous TAG. Timmy cheers, but doesn't realize a little drone ran up behind the tag and is repairing it. The TAG comes back online... Timmy's luck doesn't hold out twice.
The Combined Army is one of my 4 right now, and I was just starting to look at some of their T.A.G.s.
The ARM on some of them is unreal!
So, that 5% critical chance... you never know!
Because otherwise, they are beasts!
Also, I'm lobbying to get INFINITY billing on the SKIRMISH GAME forum sub-header, while at the same time removing MALIFAUX from the main title, and putting it in the sub-header.
If successful, and really, why wouldn't I be? , we should setup shop there.
Additionally, please check the 'main' INFINITY thread in the NEWS & RUMORS forum as that's where I'll be updating anything new that crops up for the game...
I´m also interested in this game, sharing and introducing everyone who wants to know more about it.
Many small companies release a new game and then die after 2 years, Infinity was released in 2005, they believe so much in what they were doing that they uploaded the rules pdf for free since day 1.
They have been releasing miniatures every single month since then. Expanding the game. Corvus Belli is a small company but those numbers are BIG.
The quality of the sculpts... they remember me the best moment of Rackham.
CA Tags are the nastiest little beast around, but the TAG cost combined with typical high cost of good CA stuff makes them a tough choice. The Sphinx is just ridiculously gross beyond imagination.
I like! Do you find that the roadways being as open as they are in those pictures becomes an issue when trying to make it from one set of cover to another with HMG/Sniper AROs?
BlueDagger wrote:I like! Do you find that the roadways being as open as they are in those pictures becomes an issue when trying to make it from one set of cover to another with HMG/Sniper AROs?
Those gaps are only 6 inches across and dangerous... But they should be!
I would love to get into this game, but my problem is that my area is not one that normally plays games that are not the most popular (like now, 40K dominates my FLGS). What would you all think of a player locator? Everyone can list where they are out of so that, if you start playing, you know if there are other players in your area as well.
There was I think 4-6 people that played infinity spread across Colorado, and we have a billion 40k/fantasy players. After 4-5 consecutive weeks of playing infinity on a local store's busiest day now 3/4ths of the games played that day are infinity and our numbers are growing. It only takes 1-2 games and most people are hooked on the game.
Also with the tiny number of models involved it's very easy to use 40K figures as Infinity proxies.
So if you can convince someone to try a demo game and they like it (which they typically do) then you can play games against them straight away using their 40k figures.
It lowers the barrier to entry and I'm sure will lead to buying Infinity minis soon enough.
Remember all the rules and army lists are freely downloadable as PDFs.
Yeah we still ahve a bunch that proxy 40k stuff, and it doesn't cause any issues. The makers entice you to buy their mini by just putting out amazing models lol.
BUY Infinity miniatures. That´s it.
Maybe I´m too excited because they have just released more f***ng awesome miniatures in their website minutes ago but, the best thing we can make to support this people is to buy their product.
They are not making this just to make us have fun looking at the photos. It is a company and it is a product.
They did upload the rules for free, they did make that army builder, the tutorial videos, the 50% offer, the Wiki... all is there for free just to make us taste and enjoy Infinity.
If we do not support small companies that make things so goddamn well, they will die, and that means no more updates like today´s update.
You have there GW growing bigger and bigger year after year selling plastic and resin. Doing nothing except remaking an already created game. for 30 years.
Play Infinity using 40k minis and no company would ever release free rules ever.
And we have there Corvus Belli, the Infinity guys, selling metal miniatures, extreme detail, releasing products every month since 2005. Showing everyone that is possible to be original, create a different game. This guys deserve my cash. That´s it.
I 100% agree with you BUT when it comes down to the player base deciding if they want to get into a game or not I'm perfectly fine with them proxying. The more you play the game the more you'll like it and eventually you'll see these people pickup miniatures here and there
BobbaFett wrote:Wanna read my point about this? ok, here I go.
BUY Infinity miniatures. That´s it.
Maybe I´m too excited because they have just released more f***ng awesome miniatures in their website minutes ago but, the best thing we can make to support this people is to buy their product.
They are not making this just to make us have fun looking at the photos. It is a company and it is a product.
They did upload the rules for free, they did make that army builder, the tutorial videos, the 50% offer, the Wiki... all is there for free just to make us taste and enjoy Infinity.
If we do not support small companies that make things so goddamn well, they will die, and that means no more updates like today´s update.
You have there GW growing bigger and bigger year after year selling plastic and resin. Doing nothing except remaking an already created game. for 30 years.
Play Infinity using 40k minis and no company would ever release free rules ever.
And we have there Corvus Belli, the Infinity guys, selling metal miniatures, extreme detail, releasing products every month since 2005. Showing everyone that is possible to be original, create a different game. This guys deserve my cash. That´s it.
I am now impatiently waiting for my sale purchase from Corvus Belli during the BoW sale.
It was marked sent last Monday, so it should arrive any day, I would think.
I am thinking of using the Warmachine/Dark Age bases (30mm rounded lip) for my minis.
Will this create any issues during gameplay if both sides are based the same?
@redeyed - Cheapest is Warstore, follow by Maelstrom Games.
Skrulnik - I'd really advise against it because there is certain things like prone position that use the base's profile as your LoS. To each their own, but it'll definitely effect game play sometimes and make them illegal for official tourneys if you ever go that route.
I've gotten people to try the game by letting them try it with 40K miniatures in a beginners campaign.
They've then bought Infinity armies.
I'm confident that Corvus Belli would be happy to have people try the game out using any miniatures they want. I'd say that's a large part of why the rules and army lists are free to download.
I believe that even the Beasts of War Infinity week (produced in association with Corvus Belli) suggested doing this to try the game out.
Anything that gets someone to try the game is a good thing, because the game is fantastic and trying it usually leads to playing it imo.
quozl wrote:I'm confident that Corvus Belli would be happy to have people try the game out using any miniatures they want. I'd say that's a large part of why the rules and army lists are free to download.
I believe that even the Beasts of War Infinity week (produced in association with Corvus Belli) suggested doing this to try the game out.
wha.....
Beasts of War filming tutorial videos for Infinity using 40K miniatures?! and everyone happy everyone agree?! even Corvus Belli?!
Is Pepsi available in Coca-Cola machines? Can you buy "Windows Vista" in an Apple store? Are the McLaren engineers happy when Ferrari wins the race?
Is CB uploading the rules, the army builder, the Wiki... for free because they are happy when people play the free rules using 40k miniatures? have we all gone mad?!
They are a miniature company, I suppose they are not friendly hippies sharing their stuff for free and being full of joy when they see you playing their game with Malifaux, Rackham, 40k, ExIllis miniatures.
I guess there is a big difference between trying the game and playing the game. Maybe I overreacted.
LOL BobbaFett. BoW didn't demo with 40K figures, I agree, that would be daft.
They suggested that people watching the videos who are interested try it out with 40K minis.
I agree with you that people who like the game should buy the minis and support them - I own three Infinity armies and the models imo are vastly better than anything else in the sci-fi market.
There is that big difference between trying and playing, I agree.
Even still though - Infinity is a niche game currently. I would hazard that it would work out better for Infinity in the long run if my local gaming shop's play-group of about 7 or 8 people with Infinity miniatures were to be added to by 5 more people who played and extolled how great the game was but used GW minis until they had the money to buy Infini ones. That's 5 more people telling people about the game and most games will still involve Infinity minis on one side or the other.
And GW minis in the same game would just make Infinity ones look even better!
I would not be a fan at all of someone using GW minis long-term to play Infinity. Infinity is a great game and I like to see the company supported.
Yeah I personally have no beef with proxying 40k, but the person is at least playing the game, learning the rules, and prob telling other's of the game. The player base is small so saying "ante-up for minitures or don't play" won't support growth nearly as much as "Oh np on proxying, got 5 games under your belt? Dude then you gotta check out the model they just released for your faction and here is the model for that guy you like so much"
The miniatures can sell themselves really, even to people that haven't even glanced at the rules.
I've mixed feelings about the models in each range, some I love in each range, some I can't stand... so I'm not sure where to start. For example I like some of the newer models for the Nomads, such as the Bakunin Überfallkommando, but can't stand the faces on the Alguaciles in the starter box. I'm pretty sure picking an army based purely on which models I like will lead to some very unbalanced forces.
Getting back into 40k was easy as I did the "own every army" thing back in 2nd ed, so this time around I got to just build up the one army I liked, knowing how all the others played already. Considering starting a new system feels daunting
Also, what's the official tournament (not that I'm ever so likely to attend one) stance on converting models from other factions? For example taking the really nice Al Hawwa' model and making it look a bit more Nomad for use as one of their hackers?
Honestly you can take models you think just look good and make a good force within reason. You have to have the basic synergy of a list, but you'd be surprised how much tactics makes up for a pile.
Infinity actually has a VERY detailed document about their official tourneys. Anyone can run one as long as they abide by the rules they put forth and have a tournament package from CB.
Here is the section about restrictions:
What restrictions are applied to official tournaments?
- All miniatures used by the players must be part of the Infinity range produced
by Corvus Belli.
-All miniatures must faithfully represent their unit, including its equipment,
or main military hardware.
-If the miniature doesn’t exist in the Infinity collection, it can be replaced by
another miniature from the range, making sure your opponent is aware of
the characteristics of the unit it represents.
-The use of converted miniatures is permitted as long as most or all of the
main miniature is made up from Corvus Belli miniature components Se
permite el uso de miniaturas originales, no comercializadas por ninguna
compañía, que representen fielmente las tropas de Infinity.
-The use of original miniatures, which faithfully represent Infinity’s troops,
is permitted, as long as they are not sold by any other company.
The miniatures must be assembled with at least their main parts present
(it is not strictly necessary for them to include the smallest pieces, such as
antennae).
-The miniatures must be mounted on the base they were supplied with,
or a base of the same dimensions, because it can have an effect on some
aspects of the game such as hand-to-hand combat. For the Haqqislam
Maghariba Guard, supplied without a base, we recommend the use of a
round 8 cm/4 inch in diameter base.
-The use of mercenaries or mercenary armies is not permitted, as the Ranking
has been set up to take into account the commanders of each different
army, who must enforce the strong points of their troops and resolve
problems arising from their weak areas. The use of Sectorial Armies is
allowed, because those are official army lists.
endtransmission wrote:I've mixed feelings about the models in each range, some I love in each range, some I can't stand... so I'm not sure where to start. For example I like some of the newer models for the Nomads, such as the Bakunin Überfallkommando, but can't stand the faces on the Alguaciles in the starter box. I'm pretty sure picking an army based purely on which models I like will lead to some very unbalanced forces.
Getting back into 40k was easy as I did the "own every army" thing back in 2nd ed, so this time around I got to just build up the one army I liked, knowing how all the others played already. Considering starting a new system feels daunting
Also, what's the official tournament (not that I'm ever so likely to attend one) stance on converting models from other factions? For example taking the really nice Al Hawwa' model and making it look a bit more Nomad for use as one of their hackers?
Check out the Bakunin Starter Pack, those miniature are far more recent than the Nomads Starter Pack from 2006.
As I understand from your words, what you want is a Bakunin Army. Almost every new Nomad Miniature is from that sectorial army.
BlueDagger wrote:Se
permite el uso de miniaturas originales, no comercializadas por ninguna
compañía, que representen fielmente las tropas de Infinity.
WTF
Thx to you guys I started this game, bought my first 2 starters, but I'm already looking for more miniatures....
(For thos who are intrested •Methods Infinity Blog )
Check out the Bakunin Starter Pack, those miniature are far more recent than the Nomads Starter Pack from 2006.
As I understand from your words, what you want is a Bakunin Army. Almost every new Nomad Miniature is from that sectorial army.
Thanks. The Bakunin box does look much nicer, I just wasn't sure what I'd be letting myself in for by avoiding the figures from the original starter box. From what has been said here, and reading the Nomad section of the infinity board, it seems I can probably make do without them easily enough. Thanks!
Hey there, I have heard about this game a few times and can say I am VERY interested. The idea of a more tactical game where each model's individual actions matter, and rash charges are outclassed by clever positioning, ambushes, hidden ninjas etc seems like a great counterpoint to WH40k's "put loads of models on the table, shoot it out". Not that 40k isn't a skilled game, but the particulars matter less, when specific positioning comes up in the game it tends to be more obviously gamey LoS issues or who can fight in close combat - things that break suspension of disbelief more. I also like the idea that almost all models are useful in some way - I'm sure the game isn't perfectly balanced, but in 40k as it stands, there are some units and choices which are blatantly better than others.
I have some particular questions, if any of the old hands in this thread could give me a hand, that'd be great.
1. Is there any really good resource for the rules/army lists etc? I tried downloading them from the infinity site, but the army lists are in several pieces (I think they correspond to the different books released, so to really see all the choices requires flipping through 2 PDFs) and the formatting for the rules is quite hard to read. I keep hearing of X armybuilder or Y translation of the rules for the game, where can I download these?
2. The models that really attract me are the Nomads, particularly Intruders, Prowlers, Sin Eater Observants, some of the Zeros and Spektrs, and possible Mobile Brigadas. Basically any model with one of those cool high-tech full-face helmets! How viable is a list quite tightly restricted in this regard? I only see 9-10 currently available models in that range I really like, and I'm not particularly keen on the lower-tech punk type models which I understand are the cheap troops for Nomads. Are the robots (remotes? TAGs?) completely necessary to play? I'm not as keen on those as on high-tech future commandos!
------ Another army I think would be cool is PanOceanian Knights, and a lot of that faction's other armoured infantry like Akalis and Bagh-Mari - the army selection for those seems a lot freer, knights at least must be a common choice for a whole army.
3. Conversion in Infinity? I understand the models available tend to be 1-3 for most troop types, so there often isn't a model for X troop with Y weapon (which presumably might be a really cool/fun/good option for them) - are the models mostly seperate heads and weapons, or single-piece? Is there any way to buy weapons seperately or in packs? Are there any modelling resources available online for this sort of thing? Seems like once I've painted a small initial collection, I'd want to expand my options to more than the core range.
4. Finding a game in the UK? Seems difficult, I can always try and get friends involved, but if anyone knows of a network for Infinity in this country, that'd be great.
Seems like an awesome game to get into, I'm quite excited (to the extent I will have a hard time painting the IG sitting in front of me!) Any answers you guys can give me would be greatly appreciated. Finally, would someone in the know consider making up some sort of post to be stickied in this forum, explaining where to go for relevant info, and links to other good sites? I don't mean some high-effort essay on the principles of Infinity as looked at through old English poetry, just some links might be a good idea.
More basic one that is http instead of AIR based. So it works on my mobile phone.
http://infinitycreator.com/
2. The models that really attract me are the Nomads, particularly Intruders, Prowlers, Sin Eater Observants, some of the Zeros and Spektrs, and possible Mobile Brigadas. Basically any model with one of those cool high-tech full-face helmets! How viable is a list quite tightly restricted in this regard? I only see 9-10 currently available models in that range I really like, and I'm not particularly keen on the lower-tech punk type models which I understand are the cheap troops for Nomads. Are the robots (remotes? TAGs?) completely necessary to play? I'm not as keen on those as on high-tech future commandos!
Yep, completely viable. I often run the sort of MI heavy list you describe with my Nomads. I like the Camo Nomad troops particularly - Intruders, Zeros and I would like prowlers but have none currently.
3. Conversion in Infinity? I understand the models available tend to be 1-3 for most troop types, so there often isn't a model for X troop with Y weapon (which presumably might be a really cool/fun/good option for them) - are the models mostly seperate heads and weapons, or single-piece? Is there any way to buy weapons seperately or in packs? Are there any modelling resources available online for this sort of thing? Seems like once I've painted a small initial collection, I'd want to expand my options to more than the core range.
Mostly multi piece except for some starter box grunts. Some models have seperate heads (CA Shasvastii spring to mind) but it really varies. Converting is often not easy imo, there are some threads on the forum showing people's conversions. Some conversions are simple arm swaps, some require a jewellers saw...
4. Finding a game in the UK? Seems difficult, I can always try and get friends involved, but if anyone knows of a network for Infinity in this country, that'd be great.
Devil Team's army building is the best builder I've ever used. It even links to the infinity rules wiki, which by the way is: http://infinitythegame.wikispot.org/Home
Have a rules question? Whip out a internet phone and quickly wiki the rule.
On conversions the only real reason you don't see alot of them is because A) These guys are so incredibly detailed and beautiful that converting and keeping the same quality is intimidating B) Corvus releases 4+ boxes/blisters per month of new sculpts so most people just proxy the weapon and wait for a release. It's actually legal per Infinity's official tournament rules to proxy a different Infinity miniature to represent a model if there is no sculpt for it as long as it's close to what it's suppose to be (AKA no zondbot to represent an Iguana TAG) .
So finding a game does seem a bit grim. I will do a bit more research on that front.
I daresay some simple converting (weapon and head swaps) would be doable, but expensive since all models are sold as complete. Possibly I could take some of the basic Nomads troopers and make them look a bit more gnarly with the smooth-helmeted wych heads, or even have a crack at sculpting my own.
I've gone on the army builder, as an example of the sort of thing I am looking at, would this be an ok list?
I started by putting in 2 heavy infantry and 2 medium infantry combat types, because they're cool, because I like the models, and it seemed sensible. Then I put in the other stealthy types and a sniper. That seems like good reasoning to me, and I would have several riflemen, a sniper, a machine gun, and a hacker. Decent? Not looking to derail into a huge tactics discussion, but is this sort of list sensible or do I NEED either big robots or cheap gunmen?
I will start off by saying that list building makes up only a fragment of win/loss in Infinity. Anything you bring to the table is good or bad depending on how you are planning to use it. I'll give the very from my playstyle.
- Brigada, my big beef with these guys is their point cost, though I really can't deny how powerful they are. I had one brigada basically win a game for my last week with a boarding shotgun.
- Intruder, I like to bring these guys with a HMG. They have a MSVL2 which will allow you to gun down camo tokens and guys throwing smoke, and I personally like to make my opponent feel that - Prowler, I haven't played then due to their pointcost, but they are worth that cost.
- Spektr, thay have the cool ability to pop out and hack something, but I kinda prefer mine with a sniper rifle to appear in a corridor or rooftop... much more havok . The other downside is they have no BTS so they aren't the best defensive hackers.
- Sin-Eaters, these guys are so under rated I prefer the HMG version, but there isn't one out yet.
- Zero, These guys are FUN. I take the minelayer version which allows you to place your 3 mines within 8" of the model. So essentially you can deploy anywhere in your half of the board and place 4 camo tokens.. then your opponent gets to sweat bullets on what the hell is there
Overall, lots of fun units I would definitely recommend playing your first few games at like 150 pts. The ARO and basic rules will take you a bit to get use to, so 300pts leads to a LOT more rules being involved.
BlueDagger wrote:I will start off by saying that list building makes up only a fragment of win/loss in Infinity. Anything you bring to the table is good or bad depending on how you are planning to use it. I'll give the very from my playstyle.
- Brigada, my big beef with these guys is their point cost, though I really can't deny how powerful they are. I had one brigada basically win a game for my last week with a boarding shotgun.
- Intruder, I like to bring these guys with a HMG. They have a MSVL2 which will allow you to gun down camo tokens and guys throwing smoke, and I personally like to make my opponent feel that - Prowler, I haven't played then due to their pointcost, but they are worth that cost.
- Spektr, thay have the cool ability to pop out and hack something, but I kinda prefer mine with a sniper rifle to appear in a corridor or rooftop... much more havok . The other downside is they have no BTS so they aren't the best defensive hackers.
- Sin-Eaters, these guys are so under rated I prefer the HMG version, but there isn't one out yet.
- Zero, These guys are FUN. I take the minelayer version which allows you to place your 3 mines within 8" of the model. So essentially you can deploy anywhere in your half of the board and place 4 camo tokens.. then your opponent gets to sweat bullets on what the hell is there
Overall, lots of fun units I would definitely recommend playing your first few games at like 150 pts. The ARO and basic rules will take you a bit to get use to, so 300pts leads to a LOT more rules being involved.
Haha, OK, about 9/10s of that went right over my head. I suppose I'm stuck in a 40k mindset where taking the 'wrong' stuff is a fast track to defeat against anyone with the right stuff! I'll see about finding some other interested Britons, then see about getting 5-6 models to learn the rules with.
LOL sorry, I'm an infinity addict so I don't even realize when I use waaay too much in game terminology. If you can find someone else willing to try it out just make a basic list each with like 5 guys toting combi rifles, maybe 1 camo guy, and use 40k figures to represent them. Grab a bunch of boxes of different heights and toss them on a 4x4 board. Finally have a laptop or smart phone handy with Infinity wiki pulled up. If you need someone that knows the rules feel free to PM me and I'll shoot you my email, so you can toss me a question whenever... just remember timezones you silly brits
Here are some shots from last night's game night. We setup 4 boards (14 players were there), 3 were store terrain with some AT-43 stuff some of our guys had and one was enough of my personal stuff to make a decently good board.
My random junk spewed onto the board... (Yes those are future cherry blossom trees, they were basically felled trees for this game lol)
3 Board made of house terrain...
This one was a "oh crap, we need another board *scrounge scrounge*"
The pics are actually a little misleading on that. The only board that had a eral snipe haven was the board with the blown up building in the middle, but they rules not deploying in the crows nest up top. The city board was so tall that snippers had a lot of trouble getting LoF on the alleyways, the castlelike board was all equal level for the most part , and my stuff board had so much crap on it that even the building rooftops had LoF issues.
For the most part though the skill level of our folks has negated sniper domination to a lesser extent. You'll usually see a lot of HMGs in our area so those snipers get rained with shots all too often.
Nice, they are right on the money for all the rules that time round. I however did get a giggle out of hear "hit" with a heavy Spanish accent constantly coming out "it".
Welcome to the fun just for giggles here is a VERY watered down play by play of one of my matches last night to give you an idea of the flow...
- He deploys first guarding his ass behind buildings on his side, sets up a gunner on the other side of a parkinglot full of cars, tucked behind one.
- I deploy hard to the one flank, Total Reaction HMG pointed right back at his dude on the other side of the parking lot, anti-TAG stuff near the middle on my side, camo on a rooftop on my side.
- He deploys his last guy: Heavy infantry HMG with MSV next to his other guy on the other side of the parking lot.
- I deploy my last camo token on another rooftop, halfway up the board.
- He goes first
----- Guy lobs a smoke grenade from backfield, scatters off the board.
----- Does it again and sticks it
----- HMG moves up, Awe crap I figure out what he is up to and uncloak my forward guy to forward observer marker him, HMG mows down the forward observer
----- With the HMG FOed if I survive the shots I can fire back without penalty since I know where he is… I don’t survive the shots and he obliterates my Total Reaction HMG bot.
----- Now safe he struts upfield and rapes another one of my bots
----- Another HMG in the backfield attempts to discover my other camo guy on the roof.. **** he passes
----- HMG fires at my guy, I fire back and I win but he makes his save
----- HMG fires again, I fire back… not so lucky that time
----- Does so other positioning
- My turn
----- Down 3 guys turn 1 >< I drop in a combat jumper medic to try to save my guy on the roof… and scatter way off my mark
----- I move a bot up to guard the flank that the HMG is creeping up on
----- I hack his airborne deployment, woot he has a guy waiting to drop in and I succeed. I change his entry point to deep in his side of the board and force him to scatter like mad off the table. He will have to bring him in from the spot he went off ----- I move the Combat jumper failsauce into a safe position.
- His turn 2
----- HMG rapes one of my little repair drones for giggles
----- Mr HMG keeps strutting up the field, catches 3 of my guys in his sights and gets over confident. 2 shots at my anti-TAG bot, 1 shot at my engineer, 1 shot at my hacker bot.
--------- Face to Face roll vs the Engineer I fail the dodge his hits – I save
--------- Face to Face roll vs the Hacker I I dodge successfully
--------- Face to Face roll vs my bot, I win and he take an Armor piercing + Explosive round to the face. 3 saves needed at half armor, he gets turned into chum.
----- He hauls his failed dropper up field on the other side of the board.
- My turn
----- My Anti-TAG bot rounds the corner and opens fire across the parking lot at the other guy that was originally next to the HMG guy, FtF roll I win but he only takes one wound and goes unconcious
----- I struggled to get my Medic Jumper to climb up the side of the building
----- He goes prone on the building and heroicly crawls to the unconscious forward observer, burning order after order till he finally reaches him!
----- I roll to heal! …. And fail epicly killing his ass instead.
- His turn 3
----- The HMG jumper continues his hike through the middle of the board sneaking up behind my Anti-TAG bot, but my jumper hears him alerting everyone. I change facing on all my guys to cover my ass, but leave the bot he is going for facing the wrong way.
----- Puzzled he keeps creeping up till he gets it in his sights on me out of cover, but he forgot that the remote has a 360 degree visor so it sees him and opens fire.
--------- FtF roll vs my Anti-TAG bot, he wins and I only fail one save but become immolized still.
----- He uses his last order to get the guy to safety
- My turn
----- I drop in another combat jumper, that I delayed waaaay too long on bringing in, and I scatter again ><
----- My engineer fixes the repair drone next to him and sends him to go fix the anti-tag bot… but he can’t make it there due to a horribly low order pool now ><
- His turn 4
----- The HMG jumper fires at my jumper on the roof that just came in, FtF roll vs my adhesive launcher, he wins and I fail all saves *splat*
At this point the store was closing so I conceded defeat, clearly out gunned at this point. Had we kept going there was a slight chance I could have pulled it off, but very unlikely. A great game and still learning a ton every game.
This is why I just don't take medics in my army. With my dice rolls, my docs practice euthanasia, not medicine.
I'd rather save the time (and orders that will invariable be spent to kill the guy - since unconscious models don't generate them anyway) and just remove the unco models.
The best game I've had had a PanO Aquila guard (Lt) defying the odds (last man standing), staying on the board and gunning down half of my opponent's army before expiring messily to repeated AP rounds.
I just played some Quickstart rules games myself and got shot to pieces in my own first turn....
There is no "40K running trough the open middle of the board tactic" in Infinity
That looks cool, Method. I really like the sci-fi style gaming tiles it's sitting on.
It's hard to tell from this angle but be careful that the tall buildings in the deployment zones don't give too good LOS over the battle-field.
Especially as those buildings have been constructed with small walls around their roofs. That means that a TO sniper up on that roof wll have a great vantage point and -9 to hit them (for cover and TO).
If that bogs things down then a building or two or the same height in the middle of the board will give lots of space for people to hide behind while working their way forward.
Looks excellent anyway and I may be wrong in my worry - it's hard to tell from this angle Just keep it in mind if you find your games bogged down by TO snipers and TO missile launchers!
quozl wrote:That looks cool, Method. I really like the sci-fi style gaming tiles it's sitting on.
It's hard to tell from this angle but be careful that the tall buildings in the deployment zones don't give too good LOS over the battle-field.
Especially as those buildings have been constructed with small walls around their roofs. That means that a TO sniper up on that roof wll have a great vantage point and -9 to hit them (for cover and TO).
If that bogs things down then a building or two or the same height in the middle of the board will give lots of space for people to hide behind while working their way forward.
Looks excellent anyway and I may be wrong in my worry - it's hard to tell from this angle Just keep it in mind if you find your games bogged down by TO snipers and TO missile launchers!
You are so right, thats excactly what happend in the first game.....
Second game the biggest building was placed in the middle. I plan to make more buildings in these heights so it will get better in bigger games.
There are also some amusing things you can do in game once the good sniper spots are limited.
One of my fondest Infinity memories is playing on a board with a great sniper spot on the middle line. I was deploying second and guessed that my opponent would put his omni-present TO sniper on that small tower roof-top. So I deployed an infiltrating mine-layer and put his mine on the last step up to the roof So if his TO sniper ever appeared he would be smeared by a mine.
It was just an educated guess but it turned out he HAD put his TO sniper there and he never got to do anything with him all game long
So, moral of the story is, limit the good sniper spots and then treat any that remain with a healthy level of paranoia
As stated keeping all the buildings about the same height makes a big difference, also having trees or other LoS blockers that can't be placed on limits the "OMG HMGs and Snipers are broke!".
There's one minor point that I haven't seen addressed about the rules yet: the font size. Good heavens, is that a six or seven point font and its still 57 pages for the core rules (excluding the background material and army lists)?
Yeah the main thing that isn't apparent from the pics is there is actually 4 "limbs. 2 are "legs" for the back wheels, one in the front wheel, the other is the gear load out.
However, I keep thinking of a horribly bad cartoon from the 80s
Ive been wanting to get in to the game, ive gotten the rule book a couple of starters, army builder thing, everything i need, the only problem i cant paint these models for all the detail on them and it kinda drives me away from to play it. I guess ill just have to take more time on painting.
Solid patches of color and washes. Their are indimidating as hell but they still look good if you just do the basics of washes and drybrushing. The big upside though is that it's only like 10 models you REALLY need to paint to field.
Another +1 for thinning your paint (with water and some 5$ acrylic paint thinner from an art store). Then using it as washes over base coats.
I did up 6 Haqqislam in about 4 hours that way, and they look perfect for the table-top. The detail takes washes superbly.
Admittedly, I used to spend 4 hours on a single model because I was a perfectionist (despite being mediocre) but with 8 month old twins it's either speed paint, or no paint!
This thread is a breath of fresh air compared to the conversations in the 40k forums.
Just picked up a PanO Shock Troop starter and Aleph Starter last night. This game looks amazing and seems to be a following here in Adelaide as well. Sweet.
Can't wait to get into it! Will certainly be relocating my dakka attention here for a while...
I have no interest in playing the game, as everyone I know is loving the the Malifaux (myself included) however this thread has made me look at some of the minis, and honestly, I really like the Knights so I'm thinking of picking some up just for painting (Cos Knights are cool, whatever the century!)
Do they come in blisters/clamshells or is there a box set? Inifinitys website seems to indicate there isnt a stater box of them and I can't work out whether their blisters contain 1 or more of the minis?!
It contains all four knights in the box. If you look under the name in the top right, you can see a box shape and four human shapes to indicate that there are four in a box.
KoganStyle:
There are some limitations, you can only have 2 kinds of Knights from the orders in your force and there are 5 or 6 orders in total iirc.
You choose a main and a secondary Order, you may have up to 4 of the main order and 2 from the secondary.
You will be playing a stupid amount of points to be able to field all 6.
Perkustin:
- The two rulebooks have the background in them.
- There are no codexes, every army have lists in the two rulebooks.
You can check the book in this russian vids. Two hand passing the pages, as simple as that.
Notice that 3/4 of the book is background and art. Many people think that Infinity Rulebooks are the same as the free rules to download, they are so wrong.
How large is a typical game of Infinity? I'm thinking about getting one of their recommended 300 point armies. Also, I don't see any army lists or points values in their downloadable rules. Are these just a few of the rules and I will have to buy some books or can I get all the info I need for free
Hey, although I'm a bit of a newbie myself I will try and answer your questions.
How large is a typical game of Infinity? I'm thinking about getting one of their recommended 300 point armies
I believe typical games range from 150-300+, although it is recommended to start with smaller games. The rules are more complex than GW's core games, with more going on on the tabletop, so it is also recommended that some of the more dynamic rules (guided missiles, TO camoflauge troops, defensive hacking etc.) wait until you have a couple of games under your belt (and understand the core stuff) before you start using. Personally, I am making up a couple of 200pt forces to begin with, and then going from there.
Also, I don't see any army lists or points values in their downloadable rules
The points values are in the Infinity army builder, which is available for free either online, or in a downloadable form:
Are these just a few of the rules and I will have to buy some books or can I get all the info I need for free?
All of the rules are available online and downloadable for free. One of the awesome things about Infinity, with the lack of 'WYSIWYG' (letting you proxy models, a good way to find if you like the way something plays before you buy it) and the free rules it is one of the cheapest games on the market to get into. That being said, the rule books (2 of them released so far) are really nice: They have loads of background and nice artwork that is only available through them. So, they are not strictly a necessity if you want to play the game, but if you are like me and enjoy the feeling of a nice big rulebook in your hands they are definitely a recommended purchase
Hope that helps! I can't recommend this game enough, it has revitalised my interest in wargaming, there are so many fresh ideas in it and the models are absolutely beautiful and a step above pretty much anything else on the market at the moment.
I'd highly recommend newer players start at the 100-150pt range and try to use mainly basic troops. It's not so much the complexity of the rules that is hard for players (really in their essence they are very simple), but rather the tactical know how.
Infinity is very realistic as funny as that sounds. List building is about 5% of winning in the game and about 85% is strategy. For this reason you have to get the basics of movement, cover, firing ranges, and simple tactics down before you try and jump into special rules. If you jump in knee deep at 200-300pts you'll get a sour taste in your mouth when a Caskuda air drops into your backfield and lights up your whole army with a heavy flamer.
There is a LOT of nasty tactics, tricks, and maneuvers you can do in Infinity that you simply won't know how to deal with as a new player. Once you have seen them though you learn how to counter those tricks. Everything is so insanely balanced in Infinity that it is generally accepted by it's players as "It's not your list, it's you" as the reason for wins or losses.
So I just picked up the Infinity rulebook and I'm starting an Ariadna army and I had a few questions.
How do the minis work? I mean, when you buy them, do they come with multiple weapon options in the box (soldier that can be built a number of ways with what's in the box), or do you buy specific models (i.e. soldier with chain rifle)? If you buy specific models, how do people normally model their troops if the mini has not yet been released? Is there a weapon pack you can buy somewhere?
Models generally come with one type of weapon.
Often there are multiple sculpts of a troop type with different weapons.
There is NO weapons pack available - although certain models DO come with a spare weapon (because they are holding a sword or whatever and their hands are already full).
The minis are also metal and multi-part often with fiddly bits.
If you can't deal with metal models then regardless of how pretty you find the minis, you'd best be advised to steer clear.
Corvus Belli have said they will not be making weapons packs.
Despite repeated demands from "enthusiastic" infinity players (who approach a certain type of 40k player in their rabid consumption of all things CB).
Certain of the hacker models come with a combi rifle and no way to hold it.
Certain other models also.
BlueDagger wrote:Actually the weapons packs do in fact exist. However they are available via retail but rather CB saves them for special tournies.
I think we wrote about this point before.
While I have also heard about weapon blisters included with tournament packs, no one in the official forums has confirmed their existence yet. No one has seen a weapon blister ever. Not as a product, not even as a special gift from CB.
Is this an idea? a project? candy for the ITS season 3?
I don't know.
But... while I would like to have weapons for my miniatures, I think that CB does not release them because they sell miniatures, they are a company. if you want to use an Akalis Sikh Hacker in a legal tournament you have to buy an Akalis Sikh Hacker to do so. That's the system.
They were given away at the ITS in Spain a few months back, my guess is the winners are from the Spanish forum therefor it didn't show up in English forums.
Fernando with CB told me about it when he advised me my ITS # of players record had been beaten :/
Thanks guys I've decided on PanO and Yu Jing,so the misses can play. But do you have to paint them a certain way or are you free to use your creativity?
porkchop806 wrote:Thanks guys I've decided on PanO and Yu Jing,so the misses can play.
YuJing and PanO are bitter enemies, therefore if you're a true player that cares about the fluff then you don't want to collect the eternal enemy of each faction:
-PanO vs YuJing
-Aleph vs Nomads
-Aleph vs Combined Army
Alpharius wrote:I collect Nomads, Aleph and Combined, among others - so don't listen to that advice at all!
LOL. I collect the same 3 forces. Plus with the new releases over the past few month I getting read to start a PanO and YuJing. Then there the new Muls, damn you CB.
Nice thread and Infinity certainly looks good. So damn good in fact I'm ordering some minis! The Haqqid faction really grabbed my eye and I'm gonna buy some of the ones I liked. Looks like a popular game as many of the models and nearly every starter kit is currently sold out on warstore.com.
I don't imagine I'll have a good chance of actually finding a game where I live, but it'll be fun to paint those models, as they're quite amazing.
Oh and BlueDagger you live in CO? I live up in Fort Collins!
Cave_Dweller, your actually lucky since Colorado has a lot of infinity players. I know of several players up that way lol. Head to Dark Matter Games in denver if you need Infinity stuff. They have practically the whole line in stock.
BlueDagger wrote:Cave_Dweller, your actually lucky since Colorado has a lot of infinity players. I know of several players up that way lol. Head to Dark Matter Games in denver if you need Infinity stuff. They have practically the whole line in stock.
Nice I'll have to check that out. Do they have a game night for that with scenery etc?
I know of at least 3 guys up that way that have Infinity Specific terrain that play at Total Escape Games. I'm usually at DMG Wednesday nights and keep a 4x8 worth of my personal Infinity terrain at the store for people to use.
If you want to poke around for a match just follow the link in my sig.
There's about 6 of us fellas here in Southern WY that are starting Infinity up. Both myself and a friend have signed up for the Infinity tournament at Adepticon too. We may be looking at travelling to CO for tournaments on occasion. Is Total Escape Games the best location for that? Is there anyway to stay informed of tournaments that crop up in your area?
Edit: Just noticed the rm40k.com link, very nice! I'm assuming this is way to keep track of Infinity tournaments in CO?
Yep, if there is one going on it'll be found there. There is a tournament in the planning for Dark Matter Games (Denver Area) I believe for next month which I believe will be 300pts.
Total Escape will have a 150pt tourney eventually I think.
porkchop806 wrote:Thanks guys I've decided on PanO and Yu Jing,so the misses can play.
YuJing and PanO are bitter enemies, therefore if you're a true player that cares about the fluff then you don't want to collect the eternal enemy of each faction:
-PanO vs YuJing
-Aleph vs Nomads
-Aleph vs Combined Army
Why not? I'm not sure what you mean. I'd love to have a Tanith IG army and a Blood Pact army for 40k. And both armies would have a lot of character. It's not like he is going to mix the units or something. I think that an army is fluff-friendly by the units wich are chosen. Not by what other armies are being collected for a gamer. And, if he wants to play some demos with friends, using opposite armies is the most usual. The starter boxes of other games don't use to include two friendly armies.
I'm hopefully going to get my first playtest of Infinity tonight at Maelstrom, I have a friend painting up my Pan-O so I will be having a shot with some friends gear. Like the idea of Aleph, so might get some of their stuff as a secondary force.
Captain Jack wrote:I'm hopefully going to get my first playtest of Infinity tonight at Maelstrom, I have a friend painting up my Pan-O so I will be having a shot with some friends gear. Like the idea of Aleph, so might get some of their stuff as a secondary force.
I've got this.
PanO as primary (currently at 22 figures) and an Aleph secondary (because I also play as Neoterran sectorial, which can take some Aleph units).
My PanO are a two-tone blue and white scheme, with the Aleph taking on a TRON scheme (Devas are general programs, Asuras are Sirens (game grid armourers).) Only have the Aleph starter at present though, so no Garudas or other models yet (and I won't be getting fabio ever - I just don't like the model).
I'm going to have my first game of Infinity tonight. Can't wait. I am/was a GW player but more recently I've just been playing Malifaux.
My opponent hasn't played Infinity either, but I've been reading the rules and the wiki for the past few weeks, so I think I'll be okay with the basics.
I have PanO and Haqqislam. Just going to use 4 basic LI to start with to see how we go.
I have the dice, templates and markers ready. Does anyone have any tips for me before the D20's start to roll?
#1 Start simple, which it sounds like you guys are
#2 Make sure that you clearly follow the flow of declaring orders to the point where it sounds like you following a script.
A - "I'm going to activate this model and my first skill will be to move along here up to here" *moves model*
B - "I'm going to take a shot with this model as he is passing out of cover"
A - "I'm going to shoot back"
AB - *Measure Range and gather up any modifiers like cover or camo*
AB - *roll D20s and follow Face to Face dice roll*
B - "I'm hit, here is my ARM save" *rolls die* "Pass, he will choose to fail his guts test
B- *moves model 2" behind cover to get out of LoF
#3 Hug cover, learn cover, make sweet love to cover. If you are out of cover it should only be because you are moving into a new position to get closer and into different cover. If you play the game like it was real life and bullets were flying at you, your guys will live a lot longer.
#4 Have a great time and when you are done playing and go home to reread the rules after you play... your brain will explode with the possibilities.
It came in very useful. Particularly calling out what we were doing step by step.
We played a couple of games on a fairly small table. The first game was incredibly brutal and most of the models were unconscious by the end of the 2nd turn. The second game lasted a longer with both Lieutenents shooting it out at the end.
The shooting range was normally around 24". Almost every role seemed to be +3 for range then -3 for cover.
Speaking of cover, I did as you suggested and seduced the cover at every opportunity. I think at times we both fell for the 40k method of wandering out, only to get shot to pieces.
If you are in base contact with a barrier but your opponent can basically see your entire model, are you still 'in cover'?
Also , it felt like more people were wounded by ARO than by normal shooting. Is that normal?
I loved the game, my friend enjoyed it but felt something was lacking. He's not as aware of the possibilities as I am, so I think a larger game with a few more interesting rules is needed before he is convinced.
Yeah, when you are just doing the basics it is "fun", but not the OMG *drool* that is say 300pts. Once you get all the craziness out there it's a whole different game, but if you don't have the basics down then some things may seem unbalanced because you don't know how to properly combat them.
If you are in bases to base with cover and the cover is at least knee height (waist height for a TAG) you are in cover. Also if you are in base to base with an object that is as tall or taller then the mini (such as a building corner etc) then you are in cover as long as even a sliver of your base is no visible behind the object. Cover is by far the thing that takes the longest to get use to, but eventually it becomes second nature.
Remember that you need to have a LOT of terrain to keep AROs and long range weapons in check, so the board should feel like a first person shooting level. +3/-3 and +3/-6 is the most common modifications because a smart play will stay in cover and a smart active player won't fire till they are in their optimal range.
As you get more skilled you'll start maneuvering to get then in a negative range or use camo and smoke to mess with any return fire. Also remember that if the measurement is over the Inch mark you always round up. So 24.1" will be 25".
Okay, I'm sold! It all looks very cool and I like the minis so much. From what I read here the rules are quite awesome as well and I decided to go with Combined Army. My friends will go with The Haqqislam and the Yung Jii
I was wondering if someone can help me clarifying something:
if I buy starter set for the expeditionary force, I'm going to need 4-5 more minis to be able to play 300 pts game. Now I know that sound pretty cloudy, 4-5 minis can be anything, so let's say 4-5 from each choice, i.e. light, medium and heavy infantry and few cool looking minis?
Do I have some restrictions with choosing stuff? I will get to the Infinity forum and find out more, but I just wanted a quick opinion from you guys first, so I can prepare my wallet for new carnage. This is going to be my 4th system and 5th army so I don;t wanna upset wife more than I have to.
I read here that between 10 and 15 minis are usually enough for a 300 pts game, and to be honest, that;s too cheap to be true.
Regards,
Milos
Yes, I'm afraid it is true, Infinity really is that cheap to play! Especially Combined army in fact who have some very expensive (points) models.
To some extent you can just pick the miniatures you like, and make an army from them. But, my friend did this for Combined Army and chose the Avatar, Cascuda, Sphynx TAG etc. (the most expensive points models in the game). So, like you have said, you need to have a mix of things.
I would use the army builder on the Infinity website so you get a basic idea of points cost. But one of the starter packs would be ideal - the general CA one if you like strong and aggressive infantry, plus one of the most fun units in the game (Charontid), or the Shas'vasti force which are more like a glass hammer (maybe a little more difficult to play), but again a very fun special infantry in the box (the Speculo Killer, who can disguise herself as an enemy )
If your friends are also starting the game with you, I would recommend small points totals - 150 or even 100pts - just to learn the basics of the rules without lots of difficult special rules, and then gradually introduce new units into your games as you learn the game
dreamspirit wrote:Thanks buddy, so that's what that is. haven't had the patience to wait, but now will. Thanks a bunch
Automatically Appended Next Post: Awesome 11 models 300 points! Oh man, I can't wait to dive into this!
You can also download the program from Devil Team on their website, then have it accessible from a button on your desktop.
Access in 3 seconds every time, definitely worth doing I think.
dreamspirit wrote:
Awesome 11 models 300 points! Oh man, I can't wait to dive into this!
Keep in mind that you can't have 11 models in the same group, you'll have to split those 11 models into two groups.
Sorry I'm not familiar with the rules just yet, so I don't have a clue what are you talking about. I will download them tonight and start reading, but currently am busy with commission work. Since I have a terrain making studio I look forward making some Infinity stuff for our games and I will post bat reps, studio updates and tutorials on my channel. All of this will have to wait 2012 however, enough time for me to plan what to buy. Starter definitely, the one with seed soldiers, couple of Gwailos and a vector operator for starters. What do you think?
BTW thanks Bobba for the army builder, the guys from Corvusbelli really tried to make a very special wargame with tons of player support. Everything looks amazing, and from what little research that I made, fluff is also cool. God I get so easily hooked on new systems.
dreamspirit wrote:enough time for me to plan what to buy. Starter definitely, the one with seed soldiers, couple of Gwailos and a vector operator for starters. What do you think?
I'll quit the Vector Operator and go for a full Shasvastii Army.
You'll be picking up Shasvastii Starter and Gwailos, they are all shasvastii figures, just complete your list with Shasvastii figures and you could use Shasvastii Sectorial army...and make FIRETEAMS!!
Fireteams are only allowed for Sectorial Armies, the generic faction army lists cannot make fireteams.
So, What the feth is a fireteam?
Fireteams are a group of miniatures from the same Innfantry corp. (Ex: Seed Soldiers) behaving like a squad. When one moves the rest will follow him. So that allows the player to move more his troops.
When the Fireteam Leader shoots he will have benefits for being in a fireteam:
- 3 men fireteam: +1 to Burst
- 4 Men Firetam: Sixth Sense Level 2
- 5 Men Fireteam: the BIG deal +3 to BS EVERYONE WANTS A 5 MEN FIRETEAM!!!!!
I think someone needs to add all the infinity acronyms to the mouse over text feature
Read this thread (didn't really get too much of it - I don't learn from reading too well - I need to play to get the rules etc ) and have to say I am interested. My declining interest in GW and desire to actually have some space in my front room (ie selling off all the GW stuff I am not using ) may mean I have room in my life for some Infinity. Unfortunately the only LGS that I know in the city I live in doesn't actually sell Infinity, so I can't really go in there and talk about the game.
So, I was wondering if you can answer some questions!
I've had a look through the models and skimmed some of the downloadable rulebook/wiki and have to say that I like the look of the Nomad faction, especially the stealther style models - would it be possible to make essentially an entirely stealth/infiltrator style army?
What kinds of models would I be looking at in order to deal with the typical threats faced (heavy troops, mechs, etc?). I was thinking an army mostly comprised of Zeros and Spektrs, with Bran do Castro as the "leader" (not really sure how this thing works ). Perhaps some Tomcats/Hellcats (as they look cool) to just jump in when required?
On a related note, I think the rules for playing the stealth models says you put down 4 counters for each stealth unit and move them all separately until the real model is revealed? That sounds awesome
Anyway - I was going to pick up the rule book and then decide how to go ahead.
would it be possible to make essentially an entirely stealth/infiltrator style army?
What kinds of models would I be looking at in order to deal with the typical threats faced (heavy troops, mechs, etc?). I was thinking an army mostly comprised of Zeros and Spektrs, with Bran do Castro as the "leader" (not really sure how this thing works ). Perhaps some Tomcats/Hellcats (as they look cool) to just jump in when required?
Yes it is, combining troops like Spektr, Zeros, Prowlers, BrandoCastro, Intruders... you can have a table full of cammo markers. It is more usual for Ariadna to make things that way, but the Nomad army has also many Skirmishers.
I think the rules for playing the stealth models says you put down 4 counters for each stealth unit and move them all separately until the real model is revealed?
Not correct. A cammo troop can be deployed as a marker. Markers can move and attack by surprise revealing the miniature, that's it. No aditional markers.
Let me put here these videos that will tell you how cammo works, the voice over has an accent but they are going to make new versions with Warren from beasts of War:
If you like these videos you should probably go to the Corvus Belli Youtube Channel or Beasts of War to watch the "How to Play INFINITY" series.
Cheers - I was actually looking through the videos now and saw a link to the camo one on the featured bar
Thought I would go through the game basics first though.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I'm watching a demo game (think this is the 3rd video), and although long winded, it is good talking though the game and rules.
One thing that is really confusing is some dice rolls need to be less than a certain score, while others need to be higher. I would have thought it would make more sense to have everything worked out either higher or lower than a certain score (probably higher as that is the standard D20 method).
But yeah, having watched this and some of the other videos, it looks like a pretty cool game (and probably quite quick to play if you know the rules )
One thing that is really confusing is some dice rolls need to be less than a certain score, while others need to be higher. I would have thought it would make more sense to have everything worked out either higher or lower than a certain score (probably higher as that is the standard D20 method).
But yeah, having watched this and some of the other videos, it looks like a pretty cool game (and probably quite quick to play if you know the rules )
All dice rolls are under or tie for crit.
Except ARM saves and BTS saves, in other words when your guys take a wound and you test to see if your armor saves you.
Noir wrote:All dice rolls are under or tie for crit. Except ARM saves and BTS saves, in other words when your guys take a wound and you test to see if your armor saves you.
It just seemed a little strange that they are not all done the same way round, so you need to roll at least 15 to hit, with 20 being a crit, rather than rolling up to 5, with 5 being a crit
Anyway, I had a play around with the army builder and came up with an all stealth army with a few special weapons. Sadly I could not quite squeeze in any sniper rifles on anything and keep it under 300 points with as many models as I could get, but it should be able to get in reasonably close without being able to be shot at, or lay in wait for the enemy to come to it... Plus all the models look great (except Bran, but I am sure some GS will soon sort that out ), and plenty of mines too (which sound fun!).
C&C welcome. Obviously remembering I have never played and have only looked at the PDF rule book today
SilverMK2 wrote:It just seemed a little strange that they are not all done the same way round, so you need to roll at least 15 to hit, with 20 being a crit, rather than rolling up to 5, with 5 being a crit
Actually, they are all done the same way if you think of ARM rolls being made by the attacker. However people like their saving throws so much that I assume Corvus Belli 'swapped' the ARM roll to the player whose model has been damaged.
SilverMK2 wrote:C&C welcome. Obviously remembering I have never played and have only looked at the PDF rule book today
To be honest, there's not much point making 300 point lists until you've got to grips with lower-point games to know how the different types of units work and what kind of force you want to play. Seriously.
There are a few pitfalls that new players sometimes make when putting together lists (mainly not having enough Regular Orders). List-building is generally less important than most other games and are much more fluid - there are plenty of players who never use the same list twice...
IJW wrote:Actually, they are all done the same way if you think of ARM rolls being made by the attacker. However people like their saving throws so much that I assume Corvus Belli 'swapped' the ARM roll to the player whose model has been damaged.
Your logic hurts my mind
To be honest, there's not much point making 300 point lists until you've got to grips with lower-point games to know how the different types of units work and what kind of force you want to play. Seriously.
Sure
But this is the kind of force that I want to aim towards; entirely stealthed, mostly infiltrating with models that look cool. Just wanted to know if an army like this will actually be useable, or if it is more of a "nice concept but unplayable".
You have a reasonable number of Regular Orders but you'll 'lose' two of them to start with if the Spektrs start in hidden deployment. It's a perfectly useable list.
The only definitely I'd change is bumping the two Zeros up to the Minelayer versions for an extra point and 0.5SWC each, this means that they each get to place a camouflaged Mine in their 8" zone of control during deployment. So you get to start the game with nine camo markers instead of seven.
One thing I'm never sure about is Zero or Spektr Lieutenants because of the high SWC but it's definitely worth a try. Swapping out one of the Prowlers for the ADHL/Light Flamethrower/Combi Rifle version as that gives you more variety in weapons. The ADHL glue gun can gunk up a model so that his mate with the D-Charges can have fun blowing up helpless models while a Light Flamethrower on an infiltrating camo marker is great for taking out bunched up models.
But this is the kind of force that I want to aim towards; entirely stealthed, mostly infiltrating with models that look cool. Just wanted to know if an army like this will actually be useable, or if it is more of a "nice concept but unplayable".
Never let anyone tell you a list is unplayable with this game. Sure, I think some of them will be more difficult with certain combinations or against certain opponents, but spend some time looking through batreps on the official forums and there are people winning with some really funny combinations of stuff.
Pacific wrote:Never let anyone tell you a list is unplayable with this game. Sure, I think some of them will be more difficult with certain combinations or against certain opponents, but spend some time looking through batreps on the official forums and there are people winning with some really funny combinations of stuff.
Cool
I was just wondering really if there would be any significant problems with playing this list (ie they would not be able to take out TAG's, they would not have enough orders, they ould be vulnerable to X, Y, Z, etc...)
I've changed the proposed list slightly based on some of the stuff I have read on the Infinity forums and seen on youtube, if you wanted to take a look:
There really is no such thing as "unplayable" in Infinity. How good or bad you are with units is based on your tactics and playstyle. Yes, some combinations of things will make you better or worse but the viability of those combinations is like 10% of if you win or lose with 90% being how you play it.
I think one of the hard job Infinity has is convincing players coming from other games (specifically 40k) about the differences in terms of how the games work on the tabletop. Because 40k is quite limited in terms of what you can do when manoeuvring units, and the interactions between those units, more emphasis has been placed on list building and creating an advantage prior to the game. This has lead to a 'list building' culture which I think has started to trickle down into even casual games and club level.
I hope this doesn't come across as me being an elitist snob - I still play and enjoy 40k, and in some ways I enjoy how relaxed you can afford to be when playing, in Infinity if you lose concentration or make some bad moves against someone who is on the ball you will get your ass handed to you.
NOMADS
INTERVENTOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife (26 | 0.5)
MOV:4-4 
ALGUACIL Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife (14)
2x REAKTION ZOND 
SALYUT Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse (21)
LUNOKHOD Boarding Shotgun, Heavy Flamethrower, CrazyKoalas (2) / Electric Pulse (29)
TSYKLON Feuerbach / Electric Pulse (38 | 1.5)
HELLCAT Combi Rifle + Light Shotgun, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, Knife (25 | 0.5)
CLOCKMAKER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife (18)
3x ZONBOT Electric Pulse (3)
ACONTECIMENTO SHOCK ARMY
BAGH-MARI Lieutenant HMG / Pistol, Knife (27 | 1.5)
2x COMANDO AKAL Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, CCW (23)
TRAUMA-DOC Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife (14)
2x PALBOT Electric Pulse (3)
MOBILE BRIGADA Lieutenant MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife (43)
2x INTRUDER Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Grenades / Pistol, CCW (36)
PROWLER Spitfire, D-Charges / Pistol, CCW (37 | 2)
SPEKTR Hacker Combi Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife (45 | 0.5)
SIN-EATER MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, CCW (39 | 1.5)
ZERO Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife (18)
) and have to say I am interested. My declining interest in 
BRAN Combi Rifle+ E/Mitter / Pistol, DA CCW (36)