Im sure there has been a post on this before, but why does it seem in this day and age people just let their kids walk all over them...
Example:
On my lunch break I went to a little place a block or so from my office. Sat down, was having a nice meal when suddenly screaming!!! I was like seriously what the hell. Turns out two kids, probably not more then 6-7 years old were playing tag in the restaurant. Whats more is the parents were just sitting there ignoring them completely. I thought about saying something, but didnt.
When their food arrived the kids sat down and ate, then one of them "demanded" ice cream from the mother. I figured this would be funny since if I demanded something from my parents I got smacked. So the mom calmly says no. Suddenly the child starts screaming ICE CREAM ICE CREAM ICE CREAM over and over. Im sure you can guess what the mom did, she ordered the little gak some ice cream. Again I know if I tried that on my parents when I was a kid I would have gotten an escort out of the restaurant to the car, gotten the mother of all spankings, then escorted back inside once I stopped crying...
Are parents just that badly whipped now? This is literally starting to become the norm, parents who dont even try to control their children in public places. Im guessing its just that parents are afraid to discipline their children?
Im only 25 so im no expert, but I was raised WAY different, and when me and the wife have kids they will be raised different also...
ShivanAngel wrote:Im sure there has been a post on this before, but why does it seem in this day and age people just let their kids walk all over them...
Example:
On my lunch break I went to a little place a block or so from my office. Sat down, was having a nice meal when suddenly screaming!!! I was like seriously what the hell. Turns out two kids, probably not more then 6-7 years old were playing tag in the restaurant. Whats more is the parents were just sitting there ignoring them completely. I thought about saying something, but didnt.
When their food arrived the kids sat down and ate, then one of them "demanded" ice cream from the mother. I figured this would be funny since if I demanded something from my parents I got smacked. So the mom calmly says no. Suddenly the child starts screaming ICE CREAM ICE CREAM ICE CREAM over and over. Im sure you can guess what the mom did, she ordered the little gak some ice cream. Again I know if I tried that on my parents when I was a kid I would have gotten an escort out of the restaurant to the car, gotten the mother of all spankings, then escorted back inside once I stopped crying...
Are parents just that badly whipped now? This is literally starting to become the norm, parents who dont even try to control their children in public places. Im guessing its just that parents are afraid to discipline their children?
Im only 25 so im no expert, but I was raised WAY different, and when me and the wife have kids they will be raised different also...
Now visualize being a parent, taking the kid outside and being arrested by police for battery because others called the police on you for spanking them?
Now visualize being the cop having to show up, thinking "that moms needs to beat the out of that kid the little er," and having to arrest them?
When the took paddling away it all went down hill.
Plus the mom that bought the ice cream, guess what? She just reinforced the bad behavior with positive reinforcement. If I kid screams for a toy at Wal-Mart and you buy the toy to shut him up, then you pretty much told him it is ok to scream to get what he wants.
Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
A town council over here in England turned down the chance to have an automatic defibrillator machine to be kept in the town hall - which could save a life - in case someone sued them if it was used improperly.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
A town council over here in England turned down the chance to have an automatic defibrillator machine to be kept in the town hall - which could save a life - in case someone sued them if it was used improperly.
We have one here. I don't want anyone touching me with that here and have told them that. better to wait the extra minute for experts versus incompetents.
Automatically Appended Next Post: in some parts. Its getting so you can't rabbit punch your kid for back talking you.
I know I'm going to sound like a "grumpy old man" saying this,and I know many may also say "things have always been this way and I'm just now aware of it"...but..
I Agree,there does indeed seem to be a lot more disrespectful kids running about ,not simply disrespectful to their parents ( or parent),but to everyone ...
A trip to the Mall/Wall-Mart..etc will often ave me shaking my head as I see young children talking back to their parents,running around knocking into people and merchandise,throwing tantrums when they are told they can't have something they want and so on...
I know if I'd behaved in this manner as a child...I'd have gotten knocked out (same for most kids I knew growing up)...and I really can't recall the same amount of "out of control" children when I was growing up....of course "discipline" wasn't "frowned upon" then.
I'm left to conclude that to many parents simply can't be bothered to parent...or are to worried about being "friends" with their kids...rather than being parents to them...
My own children (who are by no means saints) will often stare in amazement at children from their peer groups who are behaving badly and ask me "what's wrong with them?" or "Why their Mother won't saying anything to them?"...I wish I had an answer for my kids...but...I don't.
Frazzled wrote:We have one here. I don't want anyone touching me with that here and have told them that. better to wait the extra minute for experts versus incompetents.
They're automatic. The machine won't shock unless it's absolutely right to do so, they're idiot proof.
Frazzled wrote:We have one here. I don't want anyone touching me with that here and have told them that. better to wait the extra minute for experts versus incompetents.
They're automatic. The machine won't shock unless it's absolutely right to do so, they're idiot proof.
I know, I've been trained on it. The people I work with can test that theory.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
A town council over here in England turned down the chance to have an automatic defibrillator machine to be kept in the town hall - which could save a life - in case someone sued them if it was used improperly.
We have one here. I don't want anyone touching me with that here and have told them that. better to wait the extra minute for experts versus incompetents.
Yeah. You can do a lot of damage with a defibrillator. People should carry their own if they are so keen on being defibrillated. No more namby-pamby socialist health care.
Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
As MiracleFish noted,most DeFib units are idiot proof these days.
We had two at the Psych Center I worked at and every employee there had a min.8 hour training seminar on their use/application...I personally never had to use one on any one,but fely that if the situation arose I would be able to do so.
....Speaking of positive applications of electricity ...Cattle prods for out of control kids...?..?...just an idea..
My mother was no slouch about hitting me over the head if I misbehaved. The one time I threw a tantrum over a toy I wanted, she grabbed me and dragged me kicking and screaming out of the store. I wish more parents did that nowadays....one of my uncles is that kind of 'let the kids do whatever' parents, and...yeah...I hate visting their house. Let's just leave it at that.
ChrisWWII wrote:My mother was no slouch about hitting me over the head if I misbehaved. The one time I threw a tantrum over a toy I wanted, she grabbed me and dragged me kicking and screaming out of the store. I wish more parents did that nowadays....one of my uncles is that kind of 'let the kids do whatever' parents, and...yeah...I hate visting their house. Let's just leave it at that.
I didnt get drug out of the store kicking and screaming.... My dad smacked me across the behind right in the toy department.
Really, I never acted like that in public. At least, not that I remember. I think there was something wrong with those kids, to be running around everywhere.
There were three things that were completely terrifying for me..
1. I knew I had misbehaved at school and my dads care was in the driveway when I got off the bus.
***Translation: The executioner hath come!
2. the "wait till your father gets home"
***Don’t make me outsource your beat down to an expert consultant!
3. "your father had to leave work early because you couldn’t behave"
***Your father had to come home early for your beating. Leaving early would normally make him happy but instead he’s mad, really mad. If you can convince him leaving early was good and he should go enjoy it playing golf or whatever WIN, if however this just annoys him even more FAIL*2.
Number three meant I might as well start writing my will...
ChrisWWII wrote:My mother was no slouch about hitting me over the head if I misbehaved. The one time I threw a tantrum over a toy I wanted, she grabbed me and dragged me kicking and screaming out of the store. I wish more parents did that nowadays....one of my uncles is that kind of 'let the kids do whatever' parents, and...yeah...I hate visting their house. Let's just leave it at that.
We had to do that with GC on multiple occasions (hence the name Genghis Con). She would have snot slingers and writhe like a snake in your hands so I would end up holding her above my head as we walked out. After a certain point it was actually really really funny as she so got into it. It was an Oscar winning perofrmance and she even had people clapping once.
sexiest_hero wrote:Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
I partly agree with you here Hero....yes,there have always been "bad" kids...hell I was a "bad" kid myself,but the amount and the nature of the disrespect (particularly among young children 4-12) has definatley seemed to increase,very rarely as a child myself did I see another kid tell their Mother to @%*! off!!...and if I did that kid got slapped...I see it all the time now.
I do agree that many parents aren't taking resposibility for raising their kids and really taking the time to sit them down and teach them right from wrong,but disagree that a good swat on their backside doesn't help bring them back in line if they "forget" what you've taken the time to teach them.
As for prayer in school...meh...I went to public school in the 70's and 80's...we didn't have it...and we still knew better than to act like a bunch of little savages.
ShivanAngel wrote:yah thats some bstbh... A swat on the behind is considered battery now?
Hitting someone is in fact the very definition of battery.
Honestly if the best way you can think of to deal with any situation is to restrain and hit a child... you need better ways to deal with that situation.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
Here we go again...
I'm politically left wing and I believe a child should be smacked if it misbehaves enough to warrant it (ie if it annoys me).
Also, I would imagine many of those drooling cretins who spoil and indulge their children without boundaries are well off enough and stupid enough to belong to the tea party.
sexiest_hero wrote:Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
I partly agree with you here Hero....yes,there have always been "bad" kids...hell I was a "bad" kid myself,but the amount and the nature of the disrespect (particularly among young children 4-12) has definatley seemed to increase,very rarely as a child myself did I see another kid tell their Mother to @%*! off!!...and if I did that kid got slapped...I see it all the time now.
I do agree that many parents aren't taking resposibility for raising their kids and really taking the time to sit them down and teach them right from wrong,but disagree that a good swat on their backside doesn't help bring them back in line if they "forget" what you've taken the time to teach them.
As for prayer in school...meh...I went to public school in the 70's and 80's...we didn't have it...and we still knew better than to act like a bunch of little savages.
Now you are sounding like Socrates.
"Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers."
sexiest_hero wrote:Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
I partly agree with you here Hero....yes,there have always been "bad" kids...hell I was a "bad" kid myself,but the amount and the nature of the disrespect (particularly among young children 4-12) has definatley seemed to increase,very rarely as a child myself did I see another kid tell their Mother to @%*! off!!...and if I did that kid got slapped...I see it all the time now.
I do agree that many parents aren't taking resposibility for raising their kids and really taking the time to sit them down and teach them right from wrong,but disagree that a good swat on their backside doesn't help bring them back in line if they "forget" what you've taken the time to teach them.
As for prayer in school...meh...I went to public school in the 70's and 80's...we didn't have it...and we still knew better than to act like a bunch of little savages.
Now you are sounding like Socrates.
"Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers."
Working in a jail, you can imagine what I see....
Occasionally there will be a 15yo locked up in General population. They're just as beligerant as any Gang member or typical jerk in the block...with a total disregard for any authority figure.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
Here we go again...
I'm politically left wing and I believe a child should be smacked if it misbehaves enough to warrant it (ie if it annoys me).
Also, I would imagine many of those drooling cretins who spoil and indulge their children without boundaries are well off enough and stupid enough to belong to the tea party.
Do not equate left wing politics with weakness.
I agree that this isn't a "left wing /right wing" thing...my politics are a mix of both and I'll still clout my kids sideways if they need it...
sexiest_hero wrote:Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
I partly agree with you here Hero....yes,there have always been "bad" kids...hell I was a "bad" kid myself,but the amount and the nature of the disrespect (particularly among young children 4-12) has definatley seemed to increase,very rarely as a child myself did I see another kid tell their Mother to @%*! off!!...and if I did that kid got slapped...I see it all the time now.
I do agree that many parents aren't taking resposibility for raising their kids and really taking the time to sit them down and teach them right from wrong,but disagree that a good swat on their backside doesn't help bring them back in line if they "forget" what you've taken the time to teach them.
As for prayer in school...meh...I went to public school in the 70's and 80's...we didn't have it...and we still knew better than to act like a bunch of little savages.
Of course Socrates was right...
-the got soft and those barbarians from the north took over. Neh look I invented 18 foot long pikes meh...look I'm the new king and we should invade Persia meh...
Now you are sounding like Socrates.
"Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers."
sexiest_hero wrote:Yeah kids are bad. But that's nothing new. I watch a lot of rifftrax and MST3k and they have these old PSA about bad kids. gangster beatnics hoods. It's all the same. The answer is not hitting children but teaching them how to behave. But is'a just easy to say "They took prayer out of school" and "I can't hit my kid." Rather than "I'm a bad parent who relies on the school system and grandparents to raise my kid while I play Farmville." It's not that people don't hit their children (God knows they do) it's that they don't bother to teach them, or even explain why they are being beaten.
I partly agree with you here Hero....yes,there have always been "bad" kids...hell I was a "bad" kid myself,but the amount and the nature of the disrespect (particularly among young children 4-12) has definatley seemed to increase,very rarely as a child myself did I see another kid tell their Mother to @%*! off!!...and if I did that kid got slapped...I see it all the time now.
I do agree that many parents aren't taking resposibility for raising their kids and really taking the time to sit them down and teach them right from wrong,but disagree that a good swat on their backside doesn't help bring them back in line if they "forget" what you've taken the time to teach them.
As for prayer in school...meh...I went to public school in the 70's and 80's...we didn't have it...and we still knew better than to act like a bunch of little savages.
Now you are sounding like Socrates.
"Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers."
C'Mon Killkrazy...I realize that each generation tends to belive the generation that follows it are " just the worst ever"...but I don't think this is a case of hindsight bluring perspective....
As I said...there where plenty of "bad" kids when I was young...I myself was one...got in trouble...had to be disciplined..etc.
But...the degree to which the disrespect goes these days didn't exist on the same leval as it does now...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kilkrazy wrote:My daughter has been hit twice, I think. Both times when she was quite little and not amenable to reason. All it took was a slap on the arm.
I don't think it works for older children. The fact that some parents have to use beating a lot shows that it isn't working with their children.
I don't use it a lot...hardly ever anymore...I haven't spanked my daughter in years and my sons last pop on the butt was over six months ago when he was rude to his Mother.
In general I prefer talking to my kids...always have...but...if it's waranted I will spank.
I've raised my two with a mixture of explaining/teaching/talking and if needed a swat on the butt...and both have turned out to be fairly well behaved....so for me and mine...my way worked just fine.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
A town council over here in England turned down the chance to have an automatic defibrillator machine to be kept in the town hall - which could save a life - in case someone sued them if it was used improperly.
We have one here. I don't want anyone touching me with that here and have told them that. better to wait the extra minute for experts versus incompetents.
Yeah. You can do a lot of damage with a defibrillator. People should carry their own if they are so keen on being defibrillated. No more namby-pamby socialist health care.
The problem I have with "you could hurt yourself!" as an argument is that I can buy a pair of scissors with no prescription and stab my face all I want. There's no reason i need to fork out an extra hundred bucks every year to buy contacts.
I spank my little one on the arm only hard enough to hurt her feelings. then tell her why she can't do something.After that I tell her all the things she can do and do them with her. It's a great parenting tip I learned in the military. Like when your kid has something, take it and offer their favorite toy instead. God forbid parents take a parenting class. Kids are bad because parents are bad. It's not the children's fault.
When I was a child and started doing gak like that, I'd know I'd be getting:
A: A spanking
B: Thrown into the creek, again, cause it was funny as well as effective.(no drowning risks or anything mind you, only leeches.. lots of them)
C: Get the opposite of what I wanted. Like if i'd have been screaming Ice cream, They would'v brought extra vegetables or something.
These are all reasons why I handcuff and lock my 7yo son in the basement without light. (you know, so he can sleep)
Oh I thought you were depriving him of light to keep him small!
Honestly if the best way you can think of to deal with any situation is to restrain and hit a child... you need better ways to deal with that situation.
This is exactly what the parents of the yelling and screaming kids always say!
These are also the same people that think its their to right bring their screeching children to inappropriate places! When you call them on it you are the jerk!
There were three things that were completely terrifying for me..
1. I knew I had misbehaved at school and my dads care was in the driveway when I got off the bus.
***Translation: The executioner hath come!
2. the "wait till your father gets home"
***Don’t make me outsource your beat down to an expert consultant!
3. "your father had to leave work early because you couldn’t behave"
***Your father had to come home early for your beating. Leaving early would normally make him happy but instead he’s mad, really mad. If you can convince him leaving early was good and he should go enjoy it playing golf or whatever WIN, if however this just annoys him even more FAIL*2.
Number three meant I might as well start writing my will...
Really, if it got to #3 in my family, there was no more room for negotiation, crying or anything else, because the rocket had already been launched, it just hadn't impacted yet. I didn't need to be beat too much when I was a kid, mostly because I witnessed my older brother getting thrashed, not that it did any good. If it wasn't streaking or stealing cars it was promising to pay a hooker (Undercover cop) in pills. It was the sort of brutality that even a chaos space marines would shrink from, and he never learned his lesson. If some parents really believed in god, they would be inspired on occasion to return their little monster to the workshop stamped "Defective, incinerate and replace with properly functioning model." I was also too apathetic to act out, I would rather sulk, which my parents responded to by looooooonnnnnnggggggg lectures, which made me wish sometimes that they would just beat me and get it over with.
Reading the OP, it's times like this that I'm glad I live in Canada - It's still legal to spank a child. Apparently our politicians are still smart enough to discern between discipline and abuse. Any time y'all would like to come up from the United States of Jesusland, you feel welcome
I used to get spanked all the time when I was little, until about the age of 7 or 8 when I watched my mother chop a 2" thick cutting board in half in anger once when my brother and I wouldn't stop screaming at each other. I still misbehaved a bit after that, but no one ever went upside my backside ever again. I was a very mild kid after that. Scared the crap out of me, then scared it back in.
metallifan wrote:Reading the OP, it's times like this that I'm glad I live in Canada - It's still legal to spank a child. Apparently our politicians are still smart enough to discern between discipline and abuse. Any time y'all would like to come up from the United States of Jesusland, you feel welcome
That could be a new threat. "Don't make me take you to Canada".
I know someone will follow that up so might as well do it myself
Bakerofish wrote:smart parents know that its not the frequency of the spankings that matter but the quality of the spankings
Hear Hear. I didn't get spanked often as a child, but sonofabitch did I ever get damn walloped when I did.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also:
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:The problem I have with "you could hurt yourself!" as an argument is that I can buy a pair of scissors with no prescription and stab my face all I want.
Punishments were the wooden spoon, the bar of soap and if Dad was choppered in for festivities the belt. My older sister messed up her kids by always freaking out and over hitting her kids lightly to the point they're completely immune to her insanity and she will die a sad old lonely woman. Her being a slut and having a parade of boyfriends didn't help either. The OP witnessed my sister at lunch with her kids 20 years ago. (She never got the beatdowns as she always 'ran away' for hours and hours getting Mom all worked up who would be so happy when she was found that the beating would be cancelled.)
In Japan, kids are generally well behaved. There are a few that need to meet a sack full of doorknobs once in while, but they prefer to go the indirect, and slow,social route of ostracization for punishment.
Bakerofish wrote:smart parents know that its not the frequency of the spankings that matter but the quality of the spankings
This is very true constant small punishments don't work and begin to affect self esteem, they do become truly abusive. One or two good beatings can put the fear of God into a kid though. My dad had a fraternity paddle, with raised letters for extra pain and air holes for less air resistance. Let me tell you, he just walked towards that thing and a halo formed over my head.
Khornholio wrote:Punishments were the wooden spoon, the bar of soap and if Dad was choppered in for festivities the belt. My older sister messed up her kids by always freaking out and over hitting her kids lightly to the point they're completely immune to her insanity and she will die a sad old lonely woman. Her being a slut and having a parade of boyfriends didn't help either. The OP witnessed my sister at lunch with her kids 20 years ago. (She never got the beatdowns as she always 'ran away' for hours and hours getting Mom all worked up who would be so happy when she was found that the beating would be cancelled.)
In Japan, kids are generally well behaved. There are a few that need to meet a sack full of doorknobs once in while, but they prefer to go the indirect, and slow,social route of ostracization for punishment.
Oh god the bar of soap... If I swore, I'd have to keep that bar in my mouth for as many minutes as there were letters in the word I used. If I tried to take it out before the time was up, I'd get another 4 or 5 minutes on top of the time I still had left. If I kept trying, I'd get a spank and/or I'd have to do all my younger brother's chores on top of my own.
Come to think of it, maybe that's why I'm the one that actually learned work ethic and did something with his life
Khornholio wrote:Punishments were the wooden spoon, the bar of soap and if Dad was choppered in for festivities the belt. My older sister messed up her kids by always freaking out and over hitting her kids lightly to the point they're completely immune to her insanity and she will die a sad old lonely woman. Her being a slut and having a parade of boyfriends didn't help either. The OP witnessed my sister at lunch with her kids 20 years ago. (She never got the beatdowns as she always 'ran away' for hours and hours getting Mom all worked up who would be so happy when she was found that the beating would be cancelled.)
In Japan, kids are generally well behaved. There are a few that need to meet a sack full of doorknobs once in while, but they prefer to go the indirect, and slow,social route of ostracization for punishment.
Oh god the bar of soap... If I swore, I'd have to keep that bar in my mouth for as many minutes as there were letters in the word I used. If I tried to take it out before the time was up, I'd get another 4 or 5 minutes on top of the time I still had left. If I kept trying, I'd get a spank and/or I'd have to do all my younger brother's chores on top of my own.
Come to think of it, maybe that's why I'm the one that actually learned work ethic and did something with his life
We were out of bar soap once, my mom made me sit with a mouth of liquid hand soap in my mouth. I'll take the bar any day.
Kilkrazy wrote:Children are a blank slate when born. They have drives but no social skills.
They learn clues about correct social behaviour from their parents and other close relatives.
Hence, you are the product of your environment.
Chongara wrote:
ShivanAngel wrote:yah thats some bstbh... A swat on the behind is considered battery now?
Hitting someone is in fact the very definition of battery.
Honestly if the best way you can think of to deal with any situation is to restrain and hit a child... you need better ways to deal with that situation.
No, hitting someone is the definition of assault. battery means repetition. Though, disciplining your children should not be a matter for the Law unless you proceed to go above and beyond basic discipline.
Andrew1975 wrote:We were out of bar soap once, my mom made me sit with a mouth of liquid hand soap in my mouth. I'll take the bar any day.
Apparently it was always the lolz when I had to nom the soap, because I would do running commentary. I think they just gave me the soap sometimes because I would constantly be talking about how gross it was -while- the bar of soap was hanging out of my mouth, making everything I say "thound 'ike thith"
Kilkrazy wrote:Children are a blank slate when born. They have drives but no social skills.
They learn clues about correct social behaviour from their parents and other close relatives.
Or conversely, they don't learn social skills due to their parents are to lazy to teach them.
i have very mixed feelings on this. i was spanked, alot, as a child. that was how it was done when i grew up, period.
My wife and her brother where beaten, well past abuse. When we went into business having our brood, we discussed
it at great length and decided that wouldn't be our course of action. and don't get me wrong it wasn't easy. but i can
count on one hand the number of time our kids have been spanked/swatted on the butt, each.
there is a happy middle ground that can be reached. it just takes parents willing to care to do it.
When I was growing up I was always threatened with being hit with a wooden spoon to discipline me.
I never WAS hit (bar the odd smack on the arse if I was really bad), but the threat of it was generally enough to stop me being bad. And I'm pretty well adjusted as a human being.
I think some people today need to be taught how to be good parents, really. I'm not endorsing battering your child, but sometimes the odd spank is the way forward. Or at least threaten to do it. Like someone said, giving in to kids is just going to make them worse...
Hell, my sister threw a tantrum once because she wanted a barbie, and my parents just walked off and left her screaming (but kept her in eyesight). Needless to say, my sister thought she was being abandoned because she did it, and never did it again.
If kids are acting out in public, it’s a symptom of what is going on--or not going on, in the home, regarding discipline. I've seen too many weak and lazy parents talk, threaten, and cajole from a distance at their misbehaving children. It's all sound and fury, and means nothing to the child. Kids play such parents like a fiddle.
The key to making children behave is for parents to say very little, and just get off their butts and firmly take ahold of the errant child. They need to get physically close, look them in the eyes, and give them a choice. Stop the behavior, or the consequence will be going home, time out in the car, or up in your room. Even if the parent has to interrupt their public meal to sit out in the car with the child, you do it. Do it once or twice, and the child learns you mean what you say. It’s the down payment you make to insure better behavior in the future. It’s the only way. If the kids scream, cry or kick, so be it. Weather it out, and the kids learn soon enough they are not going to get their way, and you as the parents mean business. This is the part some parents wimp out on, especially moms. No kid has ever died or suffered psychological damage from throwing a tantrum. The key is to remove the child from the audience that want to mantipulate.
There is no need to resort to physical punishment to tame kids. In our house, spanking, or as we called it, a pop on the pants, was not meant to punish, but to get their attention when they were out of control. Once they quieted down, we would give the consequnces to choose from.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
A town council over here in England turned down the chance to have an automatic defibrillator machine to be kept in the town hall - which could save a life - in case someone sued them if it was used improperly.
Blame something random on the leftists. Yeah, nice one. Do you think before you spout that kind of flamebait?
in all fairness i didnt get spanked too much but i was often sent out to do about 2 or 3 hours manual labour for being 'naughty', it taught me to work and to do it to perfection it also meant by the age of five i could handbrake-turn a car, drive a tractor, quad bike, 21 ton digger and have a work ethic which has got me past my inter exams. now im fifthteen and the only person in my class of 30 that would even consider doing a full days work.
as a student of shotokan i see on average, 14 young four to five year olds wanting to be jackie chan and who actully have the nerve to talk back to the sensi, then come the competitions the parents come in all guns blazing asking why their little kiddies cant go to it and win automatically.
My grandad and pa taught me most of what i know , hell it was my granda that gave me a love of all things military.
rant over
assultmarine
I think the only time I was ever really swatted was when I did something potentially dangerous as a kid, like running across the street without looking.
Otherwise, it's been more along the lines of:
"Don't touch that, it's hot" One warning, then they would let me touch it and learn for myself kind of thing.
Miraclefish wrote:Well the world is run by a bunch of lefties who prize political correctness and paperwork against common sense and morality.
Funny, here in Texas the country is run by a bunch of douchebag conservatives who prize nothing more than political control and couldn't care less about common sense and morality.
Oh wait, you thought right-wingers who are in power give a damn about morality? HAH, they care even LESS about it than your "lefties" in power.
Melissia wrote:Oh wait, you thought right-wingers who are in power give a damn about morality? HAH, they care even LESS about it than your "lefties" in power.
I'm pretty sure NO politicians have any morals in equal amounts left and right.....
On topic; You know what I hate? Kids who do something they should know their not supposed to, they get caught, and the parent looks at you like its your fault. Case in point: We were at one of the local resturants one day, My dad and I had pizza and my mom had a burger with Tater Tots. We finish eating, my mom leaves and my dad goes up to pay the bill. This six year old is walking past, looks me in the eye, and then takes my moms leftover tater tots, doesn't even ask. When I ask "Hey, what do you think your doing?!" the mom comes over says "Sorry" with a sneer, and then walks off. The kid isn't even told to give us back our damn tater tots......
My da shut me into the shed with the lights off when I went off on uncontrollable wobblers as a child. I still remember that, and I am not afraid of the dark in the slightest, so I guess it didn't eff me up.
I got the wooden spoon too, if I was bold, or a swift kick up the arse if I was particularly bad.
I dunno that I would hit my own kids, simply because I think there are more effective ways to teach a kid a lesson. The worst thing from the OPs story is that the kid got the ice cream. Reinforcement is for the behaviour you want, not the behaviour you don't, silly parent!
Worse than the "you can't hit a kid" thing is the "parents are immune to criticism" and "you can't comment on other people's parenting" tabboos. Both are bs.
AvatarForm wrote:
No, hitting someone is the definition of assault. battery means repetition. Though, disciplining your children should not be a matter for the Law unless you proceed to go above and beyond basic discipline.
In Australia hitting(or threatening to hit) someone is assualt under the Criminal Code. Battery is a civil matter that applies only to unconsented contact (in Qld). The media often confuses assualt to mean only a physical attack.
Neither of these requires repetition. Though there is a seperate law that allows this for discipline.
I was hit a few times before it became illegal. Honestly... I don't think it did a thing, because I remember (not too vividly) a few things I was smacked for that I would still do now, only i'd now be able to justify it and/or fight back, although I tend to bottle up my rage and then erupt, I don't fight a lot.
My brother is similar, but he's overly violent (and doesn't seem to learn from any mistakes or take anyone's advice) and will get physical, in-your-face and do the breathe-in-and-stand-on-partial-tiptoes-so-I-look-bigger thing to try and intimidate, and will keep doing that until he gets bored (if I hit back, he hits harder, the only way to stop him is to aim for a possibly fatal blow, which would end up with me getting the gakky end of the stick anyway, so simply taking it is the lesser of these two evils).
He was smacked a hell of a lot when he was younger (and not small but frequent, some of them were quite brutal), but it doesn't seem to have deterred him at all, as soon as it was banned in the UK he'd step up everything and gloat about my parents not being to touch him.
Melissia wrote:Yeah, I get that from my sister all the time.
Dumb country hick twit needs to learn how to raise a kid.
You would think they would learn by having their first kid when they are still in High School, but apparently not. (not saying your sister had one in High School).
The lady who it happened with had two kids, was in her early twenties, and yeah.....
The discipline has to start at day one. If you leave it till there four, of five- the child has already built up the behaviour patterns. Discipline needs to be firm, and constant between both parents. Beating is not nessecary, and it can cause many problems in the future.
I have 5 younger siblings, and the rearing and discipline is very different with my Mum's house being more strict, and my Dad's being liberal and inconstant. Guess whos kids are better behaved?
One of the main problems is that there is too many people out there trying to get in other peoples business and trying to tell people how to raise their kids and the people let them do it.
For Example: Why does the MPAA have to label the contents of a R rated movie now? Because irresponsible people take their kids to an R rated movie and then complain "I didn't know that kinda of stuff would be in that movie!" cause a big stink and the goverment steps in and labels everything so the parent doesn't have to do any work in being a parent.
The Government has done all the work for them.
My wife's cousin had the cops called on her in a pizza hut because her child would not sit down in her high chair and could have fell over and got hurt. So she swats her kid on the but to get her to sit down. Some person got up and called the cops.
It's too easy for people to get involved in how someone disciplines their kids.
The sad thing is people are too focused on calling the cops on people who are simply disciplining to protect and teach their children, when there are children that are getting seriously abused and no one says a thing.
It so bad that, children now know that if they don't get their way they can make a phone call and a fake sob story and have their parents get in serious trouble. Once again there are children who seriously need help and these brats are out there making phony claims because they are mad at their parents.
We need to institute the Battle Royale program....hehe
Blarglord wrote:It so bad that, children now know that if they don't get their way they can make a phone call and a fake sob story and have their parents get in serious trouble.
You know, a friend of my brother tried to threaten his dad with that once. The Dad's reply?
"Yes, you could do that, and I couldn't stop you. But I know it takes them a good ten minutes to get here, and in that time, somebodies gonna get hurt....."
Melissia wrote:Yeah, I get that from my sister all the time.
Dumb country hick twit needs to learn how to raise a kid.
You would think they would learn by having their first kid when they are still in High School, but apparently not. (not saying your sister had one in High School).
The lady who it happened with had two kids, was in her early twenties, and yeah.....
She basically did. I think she was twenty when she got knocked up and married the jerkass deadbeat she later divorced.
If I messed up my mom would create a sentence and for each syllable I would get spanked, she wouldn't cut corners either. She never said "won't" she said "will not".
One time my brother and I got into a fight outside, "You will not fight each other again." resulted in 9 smacks to the rear.
The worst was when we acted up in the store, similar to the kids playing tag. Sitting in the car, heart in my stomach, knowing what was waiting for us.
We tried that whole thing with the social services, "Good, I need the break." my mom would always say.
halonachos wrote:If I messed up my mom would create a sentence and for each syllable I would get spanked, she wouldn't cut corners either. She never said "won't" she said "will not".
One time my brother and I got into a fight outside, "You will not fight each other again." resulted in 9 smacks to the rear.
The worst was when we acted up in the store, similar to the kids playing tag. Sitting in the car, heart in my stomach, knowing what was waiting for us.
We tried that whole thing with the social services, "Good, I need the break." my mom would always say.
...My Grandmother and to a lesser degree my Mother were masters at the "speech/whippings"...
My Grandmother was "very very long winded"...as in.." Don't (smack) you (smack) ever (smack) ever (smack) ever (smack) let (smack) me (smack) catch (smack) you (smack)ever (smack) ever (smack)ever (smack)..."...well you get the point.
My Father was different...he'd just knock us out...never said much during the whipping...but it stuck with you...
EDIT:...Speaking of social service involvement in child raising...several years ago,my Missus Brother piped my Daughter on her hand for almost grabbing a very hot BBQ grill,his finger nail scratched her hand (barely)...the following day at school her teacher asked what happened to her hand....she replied her Uncle "hit her"...guess who showed up at my house the following day...absolutely silly.
I'm 100% for protecting children from "real" abuse...but please...a scratch..
Funny thing is...my Daughter then got it in her head that she could "tell" anytime she was disiplined...stating to her Mom..." You can't spank me...I'll tell"....the Missus picked up the phone and said she'd make the call for her.
My dad didn't really do much, he was out to sea for the most part and really only hurt us by accident. Those power windows will get you every time you know.
One time we were acting up and my mom had company over, my dad took my brother and I into our room and gave us a talk. He then told us to pretend that he spanked us. We walked out pretending to cry and rubbing our rears until my little brother was dumb enough to say "Daddy pretended to spank us."
halonachos wrote:My dad didn't really do much, he was out to sea for the most part and really only hurt us by accident. Those power windows will get you every time you know.
One time we were acting up and my mom had company over, my dad took my brother and I into our room and gave us a talk. He then told us to pretend that he spanked us. We walked out pretending to cry and rubbing our rears until my little brother was dumb enough to say "Daddy pretended to spank us."
Me and the Missus share in guiding/discipline etc....but I tend to be the one who our kids "pay more attention to"...I usually only have to give them the "look" or raise my voice just a slight bit and they fall in line pretty quickly.
Though the Missus is more of "The Punisher" in the lines of taking away privaleges and such...
ShivanAngel wrote:Im sure there has been a post on this before, but why does it seem in this day and age people just let their kids walk all over them...
Example:
On my lunch break I went to a little place a block or so from my office. Sat down, was having a nice meal when suddenly screaming!!! I was like seriously what the hell. Turns out two kids, probably not more then 6-7 years old were playing tag in the restaurant. Whats more is the parents were just sitting there ignoring them completely. I thought about saying something, but didnt.
When their food arrived the kids sat down and ate, then one of them "demanded" ice cream from the mother. I figured this would be funny since if I demanded something from my parents I got smacked. So the mom calmly says no. Suddenly the child starts screaming ICE CREAM ICE CREAM ICE CREAM over and over. Im sure you can guess what the mom did, she ordered the little gak some ice cream. Again I know if I tried that on my parents when I was a kid I would have gotten an escort out of the restaurant to the car, gotten the mother of all spankings, then escorted back inside once I stopped crying...
Are parents just that badly whipped now? This is literally starting to become the norm, parents who dont even try to control their children in public places. Im guessing its just that parents are afraid to discipline their children?
Im only 25 so im no expert, but I was raised WAY different, and when me and the wife have kids they will be raised different also...
Now visualize being a parent, taking the kid outside and being arrested by police for battery because others called the police on you for spanking them?
Now visualize being the cop having to show up, thinking "that moms needs to beat the out of that kid the little er," and having to arrest them?
Now think of that cop going, good for you. Give the little gak a kick in the ass because they deserve it.
Just because someone calls the police doesn't mean you're going to be arrested. Not sure in the USA but up here you can actually apply some form of force to a child to discipline them.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Some people need not only a swift kick but a good ole fashioned ass kicking.
Blarglord wrote:
It so bad that, children now know that if they don't get their way they can make a phone call and a fake sob story and have their parents get in serious trouble. Once again there are children who seriously need help and these brats are out there making phony claims because they are mad at their parents.
Actually, not only in the US of A. Discipline these days is definitely slipping. If my sister was hit every time she whined, she'd have many bruises. As it is, she has none. When I was her age (6 years ago) if I misbehaved, I would get smacked on the bottom. It reinforces the point without being overly painful.
I didn't get it half as bad as my own dad did from his alcoholic father - at least that's what he kept telling me.
I only got the soap once and it was pretty shocking - at around the age of six or seven my little sister and I recorded 'bad words' on a cassette recorder and replayed them, drawing attention from my mother with our giggling. I sure learned not to say "poo", "bum" and "wee".
I was actually a pretty good kid, but my dad was also pretty reactive. Sometimes the way your parent was raised will affect the situation - at least that's the impression I got. My olds knew I was pretty game on them, though - I knew they weren't seriously going to hurt me.
I still decided to break and throw away all the wooden spoons in the house once (they'll never look in the GARBAGE BIN!) - that was the first time I got the belt!
When my dad was out of town working my mom made us write lines.....
These werent "I will not talk in class" lines either...
These were " I will not talk in class because I go to school to get an education, and talking in class will hinder that" or something like that... 500 times... No TV, Games, or playing outside till we finished....
After about the first 100 you were begging to be spanked...
On the social services note... Yeah its getting stupid. My little brothers day care called CPS on my mom because he had bruises... He was like 4, me and my other brother were 14 and 16... Of course he had bruises, he had two older brothers who he wrestled with all the time...
Kind of like when my wife slipped and sprained her wrist. In the ER I had to leave the room while they got her side of the story, just to make sure I wasnt forcing her to give a false statement in case I did it... Im a nurse so I knew it was coming, but its still kind of a seriously? moment.
Everyone comments on how polite I am to adults. Its not that I am more polite, its just that everyone else is less. Seriously, what happened to manners?
My Mom used to hit me with a wooden spoon, until one day i through it out the apartment window and ran away for 4 hours. Then is was a rubber spatula, i missed the spoon.
She also loved to say: "you just wait til your Dad gets home"
And if he ever does i'm sure i got about 32 years worth of whoopins.
I got the gak kicked out of me when I was little; I was pretty well behaved as a result, but our relationship is still less than healthy. I'm still getting over the metric ton of fear they ut into me and my little bro.
I just don't think you should hit kids, but I sure as hell don't think you should let them get away with being an arse either. you can scold a kid (and make em listen!) without hitting them.
We used to have a wooden paddle, worked well until one day it just gave up and cracked. Then it was a plastic spatula with aerodynamic slits in it.
When we grew up my mom got more creative and made me and my brother hug each other for about 10 or 15 minutes, now that was terrible.
I also get compliments about how polite I tend to be, I know, shock over the fact that halonachos is sometimes a jerk on the internet but polite in real life! Its more to do with the fact that I was also taught and made to work as well as punished when needed.
I guess I was one of those weird kids. My parents gave me the occasional spanking, but overall I was a good kid. But whenever I did something and wasn't punished for it, I would end up excercising physical violence upon myself.
...I guess my parents just weren't doing a good enough job at it...
By the way, from what I have learned from umpteen death by powerpoint presentations from ACS, you CAN spank a child, but with an open hand, on the bum, and you cannot leave any marks.
Two memorable beatings that I can honestly remember is when my mom beat me with the bladed snow shovel, and the time my dad broke a yardstick over my back, the latter case was the last time I got beat, because after I got hit I picked my dad up and threw him to the ground, ( the other DCMS should know I am a pretty big guy ) due to the fact that I got blamed for something I did not do.
out of that kid the little 
...My Grandmother and to a lesser degree my Mother were masters at the "speech/whippings"...