I once had a discussion with a GW staff member about who the hardest primarch was. I said that I thought Sanguinius was the most gifted at fisticuffs when the member of staff, suddenly full of excitement and enthusiasm, grabbed a copy of Collected Visions from the shelf and proceeded to open it at the page that shows Leman Russ with his bodyguard.
"You see, you see?" The member of staff said as he prodded the picture rapidly.
"What am I looking at?" I said "Are you saying that Leman Russ is the daddy?" I looked at the picture again and he did indeed look well 'ard. The staff member then went on to qualify his reasons for the claim which, to be completely honest, made an awful lot of to me.
"If you look closely" the man continued "you will notice that the body guard is actually BIGGER than Leman Russ" I simply blinked back at him which bade him to continue "He was only about six feet tall you see? In fact he was the shortest primarch of them all" The look of sheer delight on his face as he told me this was bloody priceless "The runt of the litter" he went on when I didn't say anything.
And then suddenly it all made sense to me. Every school I went to and including the army the shortest person was ALWAYS one of the most violent and aggressive.
The light bulb above my head must have flashed when I said "Bloody 'ell, yeah!" because the guy began clapping as though congratulating me on working it out.
But it got me to thinking, is there a primarch that is known to be the daddy of them all or not? I'm convinced that my black shirted friend was on to something so if nobody can give me a better example I'm staying with told Leman, coz it makes sense.
Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Alpharius is the shortest, it's been said numerous times.
I don't recall this ever being mentioned.
But, Leman was created pretty much to take down other Primarchs.
Aren't the Space Wolves the only ones to actually suggest that?
Personally, I'd like it if Angron was actually the most gifted at no-holds barred combat (whereas someone like the Lion might well be a the best swordsman, or Curze the best brawler). Of course, it all depends on the situation. A combat ground with lots of cover and ambush points would quite possibly favour Corax, whereas a more confined area would give the advantage to the other. It's never actually definitively said, though. Although I would rate Sanguinius quite highly as well.
Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Alpharius is the shortest, it's been said numerous times.
I don't recall this ever being mentioned.
Alpharius is the only one who could impersonate 'regular' Marines with any level of success, I believe it's mentioned in Legion (if it is not, then accept my humble apologies, I am tired ).
But, Leman was created pretty much to take down other Primarchs.
Aren't the Space Wolves the only ones to actually suggest that?
Didn't Magnus, or the Emperor say something to that effect as well (if not, then again I apologise *slaps wrist*)?
purplefood wrote:I'm not sure who says it first but there are several mentions in Prospero Burns that it wasn't the first time the Wolves had fought other Astartes...
Were they the only ones though? It seems a bit unlikely that they'd be against another full strength Legion (or two, as the case may have been).
Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Alpharius is the only one who could impersonate 'regular' Marines with any level of success, I believe it's mentioned in Legion (if it is not, then accept my humble apologies, I am tired ).
Yeah, but wasn't that just because he had an Alpha Legionnaire (or more) who was (or were) very tall as well? I think he was said to be a head taller than any of Horus' Astartes when he was found, that the chances are that that was without power armour.
Didn't Magnus, or the Emperor say something to that effect as well (if not, then again I apologise *slaps wrist*)?
The Wolves were ruthless... The point was they didn't particularly care about restraint they just go for it.
Spoiler:
Like in Prospero Burns where they drop a space station on the planet they are attacking, more or less destroying the place they are attacking before landing and assaulting any survivors
At any rate this is a discussion for a different thread methinks...
purplefood wrote:I'm not sure who says it first but there are several mentions in Prospero Burns that it wasn't the first time the Wolves had fought other Astartes...
Were they the only ones though? It seems a bit unlikely that they'd be against another full strength Legion (or two, as the case may have been).
Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Alpharius is the only one who could impersonate 'regular' Marines with any level of success, I believe it's mentioned in Legion (if it is not, then accept my humble apologies, I am tired ).
Yeah, but wasn't that just because he had an Alpha Legionnaire (or more) who was (or were) very tall as well? I think he was said to be a head taller than any of Horus' Astartes when he was found, that the chances are that that was without power armour.
Didn't Magnus, or the Emperor say something to that effect as well (if not, then again I apologise *slaps wrist*)?
I honestly have no idea.
Alpharius was a huge dude; all the Primarchs were. He was just small enough to be mistaken as a gigantic Space Marine, but a marine nonetheless. Its all in Legion.
purplefood wrote:I'm not sure who says it first but there are several mentions in Prospero Burns that it wasn't the first time the Wolves had fought other Astartes...
Were they the only ones though? It seems a bit unlikely that they'd be against another full strength Legion (or two, as the case may have been).
Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:Alpharius is the only one who could impersonate 'regular' Marines with any level of success, I believe it's mentioned in Legion (if it is not, then accept my humble apologies, I am tired ).
Yeah, but wasn't that just because he had an Alpha Legionnaire (or more) who was (or were) very tall as well? I think he was said to be a head taller than any of Horus' Astartes when he was found, that the chances are that that was without power armour.
Didn't Magnus, or the Emperor say something to that effect as well (if not, then again I apologise *slaps wrist*)?
I honestly have no idea.
Alpharius was a huge dude; all the Primarchs were. He was just small enough to be mistaken as a gigantic Space Marine, but a marine nonetheless. Its all in Legion.
IMO, it would be either Russ or Angron. In the HH series they are the only ones that seem to earn respect from other primarchs thanks to their sheer brutality and physical prowess.
I remember reading several times about Angron being described as a "butcher" or a "brute" by other primarchs, while Russ was said to be the "animal", the "beast". These words were sometimes said in a degrading way, but they always conveyed a hidden respect (I would even say fear).
Leman russ was the most ferocious and tenacious primarch; if your looking for the toughest in terms of endurance, i think it's puturabo. He's always made out to be a walking tank, and he just strikes me as being extremely unkillable.
The shortest people are always the meanest because they're compensating, chihuahuas are meaners than mastiffs.
Mr Nobody wrote:Leman russ was the most ferocious and tenacious primarch; if your looking for the toughest in terms of endurance, i think it's puturabo. He's always made out to be a walking tank, and he just strikes me as being extremely unkillable.
The shortest people are always the meanest because they're compensating, chihuahuas are meaners than mastiffs.
if i remember legion correctly is Alpharius a twin and i think sangunius would be the toughest because he fought horus in his damon form and struck him
I think it's pretty sad that everyone is saying Russ.
Did we forget that Magnus was kicking Russ's ass until Russ(in a skillful display of random flailing) accidentally poked him in the eye?(reference: A Thousand Sons)
Did we also forget that Magnus was a daemon primarch (Or at least powered up by Tzeentch) at that point and after that got trounced by Russ to the point he ran away? At any rate there were some primarchs that were good at one-on-one fighting and others that weren't. The ones that weren't tended to specialise in areas other than warfare which kinda balanced them out as leaders.
He didn't "run away" per say according to the book. He was merely stalling to pull the remainder of his legion away from the fight, as it was a fight he wanted to avoid in the first place (Knowing that it was Tzeenth's plan to have both legions cripple each other).
He didn't want to hurt Russ since he wanted the wolves to be able to aid in the upcoming treachery of Horus.
Mr Nobody wrote:Leman russ was the most ferocious and tenacious primarch; if your looking for the toughest in terms of endurance, i think it's puturabo. He's always made out to be a walking tank, and he just strikes me as being extremely unkillable.
The shortest people are always the meanest because they're compensating, chihuahuas are meaners than mastiffs.
No love for Montarion being tenacious and tough?
I totally forgot about him, he drinks poison like water, that's pretty tough.
Amanax wrote:He didn't "run away" per say according to the book. He was merely stalling to pull the remainder of his legion away from the fight, as it was a fight he wanted to avoid in the first place (Knowing that it was Tzeenth's plan to have both legions cripple each other).
He didn't want to hurt Russ since he wanted the wolves to be able to aid in the upcoming treachery of Horus.
So he then leaves and joins Horus int he Siege of Terra...
The Heresy seems way too complex for its own good...
About the magnus vs russ argument, Magnus was facing Leman russ and his armies. I distinctly remember him going moses on everyone while fighting Leman russ.
In a no-rules fight to the death, I'd say Magnus every time. You just don't mess with that powerful a psyker unless you pull a wuss move like Russ did and bring loads of untouchables to the fight
Erm, Much as i love Sanguinius (and i do, hes my pick for hardest - he flies, try fighting that! ), he was wounded by Ka'Bandha when the BA were ambushed near the start of the HH. Not on Terra, sorry. Although i dont know how long there was between the ambush and then the battle for Terra. He did still fight and hold the Eternity Gate single-handed which is bad- enough for me.
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Sanguinius
@BBL
Sanguinius had his legs crushed on the world of signus prime. The bloodthirster crushed his legs and then flew off after sanguinius passed out. On his way to terra his legs had time to heal and then when he faced him the second time he broke his back over his knees. He didnt fight him again with crushed legs twice.
The strongest and toughest were Vulkan and Ferus Manus.
Spoiler:
This is stated in the short story "Forgotten Sons" by Nick Kyme in Age of Darkness.
During the battle of the dropsite massacres Vulkan is throwing Demolisher tanks and other tanks around with his bare hands and it states:
Age of Darkness wrote:He was not the most gifted swordsman, nor was he a master strategist or a psyker of any note, but his strength and fortitude... in that, the Eighteenth Primarch was unrivaled.
It then goes on to say that if Ferus Manus were alive there may have been cause for debate, but since he his head is separated from his body the argument is settled.
This doesn't make either the "daddy" per se, but answers some questions posed in this thread.
DarknessEternal wrote:But Lion also did defeat Leman Russ in a fist fight.
Russ stopped fighting and started laughing, and the Lion sucker-punched him. Hardly a "defeat".
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DEUS VULT wrote:No love for Montarion being tenacious and tough?
Mortarion is the biggest punk of them all. I mean, he not only got schooled by an Astartes, he had a dude's name carved into his heart. Now that's getting served.
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purplefood wrote:Did we also forget that Magnus was a daemon primarch (Or at least powered up by Tzeentch) at that point and after that got trounced by Russ to the point he ran away?
Not at that point, he wasn't. I'd be forced to agree with the prior sentiment that in a no-holds-barred fight, no one could stand up to Magnus.
Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:Ka'banda broke his legs at the ambush. Sangy broke his back, with the broken legs (I believe)
If someone can photoshop a picture of Sangy meme style with the text "Ka'Banda broke my legs
I broke his back " I would be your best friend/ give you a cookie
Ka'banda fought him on signus prime, broke his legs, threw him to the ground and left him alive. Sanguinus's legs healed on the way to Terra. They fought again, and Sanguinus won, breaking Ka'banda's back across his healed legs.
Sanguinus is still an almighty badass. If I had to choose, I would pick Angron, the only Primarch who can get sh*t done, Or Lorgar, the other Primarch who got sh*t done, but left it to his incompetent brother to finish, who then failed. Lorgar's also a psyker, with a kickass mace, golden skin.
Mortarian. Come near me, let me reap you with my scythe. Oh and I'm probably the toughest overall, seeing as i grew up on a planet that tries to kill you with the freaking air.
Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:The way the title was phrased I was afraid you were asking who their father was
But for toughest?
Sanguinius
Not only did he fight for an extremely long amount of time, single-handedly, with broken legs, he broke Ka'banda's back over his knee.
Ya know, with his broken leg. Pretty bad ass.
He then went on to fight Horus, with no rest in between.
This isn't entirely accurate. Ka'banda broke his legs on Signus Prime and they slaughtered the Blood Angels then left the planet once the Blood Angels started to kick ass again. Back en route to Terra is when Sanguinius recovered from his injuries and it was at the battle of the Eternity Gate where Ka'banda and he fought again.
NagothDaCleaver wrote:The strongest and toughest were Vulkan and Ferus Manus.
Spoiler:
This is stated in the short story "Forgotten Sons" by Nick Kyme in Age of Darkness.
During the battle of the dropsite massacres Vulkan is throwing Demolisher tanks and other tanks around with his bare hands and it states:
Age of Darkness wrote:He was not the most gifted swordsman, nor was he a master strategist or a psyker of any note, but his strength and fortitude... in that, the Eighteenth Primarch was unrivaled.
It then goes on to say that if Ferus Manus were alive there may have been cause for debate, but since he his head is separated from his body the argument is settled.
This doesn't make either the "daddy" per se, but answers some questions posed in this thread.
The problem is with the Primarchs is it depends on who is writing for them.
Mr Kyme does a great job, but is a writer who predominantly writes Salamander material, so could be biased.
It's also fairly difficult to pick one and say they are the best as they aren't all comparable to each other.
In terms of strength then I would probably agree with Mr Kyme and say that Ferrus and Vulkan were probably up there, as well as Magnus and Russ.
From a combat perspective Angron was probably the best, probably not the most skilled and fancy, but the one to always get the job done. Gav Thorpe says in 'Ravens Flight' that only perhaps Horus or Sanguinius could beat him.
Skilled fighter would maybe be Fulgrim or Sanguinius.
Tactical mind would be Alpharius, Corax or Guilliman. Horus praised Alpharius on numerous occasions and apparently used much of Corax's tactics in war. Guilliman wrote the Codex.
Toughtest maybe Dorn, Mortarion or Perturabo.
But thinking about it properly when typing this the best would have to be Horus. He was the brightest and most gifted of them all, he had the most victories, he bought Legions to betray the Emperor. He was a master manipulator and the Emperor chose him to be Warmaster for a reason.
iproxtaco wrote:And yet who manipulated him? Lorgar. Who was in turn manipulated by Kor Phaeron. But Lorgar was the architect.
Despite of his turning he was still the greatest before the Heresy.
I would also disagree that it was Lorgar who manipulated him, but there you go. Horus was having doubts before Erebus got involved and it was the whispers of Chaos that pushed Horus into betrayal. Kor Phaeron and Erebus were the architects, they never let go of the old ways of Cholchis, they planted the seeds and duped their own Primarch into taking back what they held above the Imperial Truth.
Lorgar wasn't much more than a glorified preacher and a bit dumb to boot. If Horus had not taken Chaos by the hand then Lorgar and the Word Bearers would've lasted 5 minutes if they rebelled openly.
It's difficult to know which of the three, Erebus, Kor Phaeron or Lorgar, actually started the Heresy. They all manipulated. Kor Phaeron and Erebus were largely together as a pair. The Emperor chastised Lorgar, the other two manipulated Lorgar into seeking the Chaos Gods. Lorgar then I suppose took command, but was still manipulated by the pair to a lesser extent. He sent Erebus to Horus, I guess it was at Istvaan that he let them go and went off by himself.
iproxtaco wrote:To be honest, it wasn't really even Lorgar. It was Erebus first, Lorgar was just a figure-head before he truly turned to Chaos, after which he was still manipulated by Kor Phaeron, until Istvaan.
Hopefully we see Lorgar take the mantle properly and become the true son of the four.
I like him because he's the most human of all the Primarchs. He also looks damn badass as a Daemon.
It's odd that he isn't Chaos's favored. Abaddon? Who is he? Some random First Captain. Lorgar is a Daemon Primarch and Architect of The Heresy. Move over top-knot.
iproxtaco wrote:I like him because he's the most human of all the Primarchs. He also looks damn badass as a Daemon.
It's odd that he isn't Chaos's favored. Abaddon? Who is he? Some random First Captain. Lorgar is a Daemon Primarch and Architect of The Heresy. Move over top-knot.
Lorgar will lead again eventually, he'll be the one to topple Abaddon. He just needs to do some soul searching first.
Either that or he realises that he has been wrong twice now and that his actions have made the Emperor a God. That must smart somewhat.
I have decided to model my own Lorgar just because of this conversation and add him to my Word Bearers army, leading the Gal Vorbak (Read First Heretic). He would have so much more power than Abbadon, and command a legion of around 100,000 Chaos Space Marines, obviously less depending on the number of casualties they took during the Heresy and over the years since, and countless Chaos converts and zealots in the cults across the Imperium.
Meh, so what if he didn't have broken legs, he still crushed a Bloodthirster with his bear hands. The Only ones to have done anything of the sort are The Grey Knights although I can't confirm at this moment, and Dante, but that was with an Axe, and against Scarbrand. And there was Ann'grath, but that was an inquisitor with a nice sword and massive shield backed up by a lot of Grey Knights. So, there may have been a few other incidents, but Sanguinus did it with only his hands, whilst nearly single-handedly holding the Gates of the Emperors Palace against everything Horus could through at it.
iproxtaco wrote:
Meh, so what if he didn't have broken legs, he still crushed a Bloodthirster with his bear hands. The Only ones to have done anything of the sort are The Grey Knights although I can't confirm at this moment.
Well Fulgrim killed an Avatar with his bare hands, as well as killed another Primarch.
This is where it starts to turn into a my Primarch is better than yours thread
Damn, forgot about that. Then what did Fulgrim do? pussied out at the end, he only killed Ferrus when the Daemon in his sword took control. Remember that Calgar beat an Avatar to death as well.
I guess most of the Primarchs have done something pretty spectacular.
iproxtaco wrote:Damn, forgot about that. The what did Fulgrim do? pussied out at the end, he only killed Ferrus when the Daemon in his sword took control. Remeber that Clagar beat an Avatar to death as well.
Yeah, but he did have him beat at that point, he just couldn't bring himself to kill his best friend.
iproxtaco wrote:I guess most of the Primarchs have done something pretty spectacular.
Ferrus Manus was supposed to have carried a whole Mountain Range on his back during a contest with a Storm Giant
purplefood wrote:I heard Russ killed a titan... on his own.
I can never find the reference for this, it's up there with finding the Lion and the Wolf story. Looks as if it is in WD 233.
And for your information, the answer is Sanguinius, he was the only one that had the foresight that if he allowed himself to be slain so that the Emperor would become mortally wounded, then it would solve the unemployment problem for millenia to come as everyone would be able or forceable be made to join the army. Smart guy, you could almost say he was a visionary
Alpharius was the boss man - he just needed more time to show off how superior he was.
Its so difficult to say who would be number 1 in a fight, pretty much all of them are epic badasses. As an unmentioned darkhorse, how about Konrad Curze? They name just screams epic-badassery, and he had freakin' claws!
Curze rocks hard, and even though I like lorgar the most out of all the primarchs, he did get beaten up by Corax, who is also one hard dude. But Curze was better IMO.
iproxtaco wrote:And yet who manipulated him? Lorgar. Who was in turn manipulated by Kor Phaeron. But Lorgar was the architect.
Being stabbed by an ancient alien demon weapon that allowed him to be possessed by Chaos to some extent is hardly "manipulation".
Lorgar was a crybaby ("Waah, my daddy doesn't pay enough attention to me as I flaunt all his edicts about secularism!"), and has spent every moment since the Heresy crying himself to sleep in his tower. /lame
Omegus wrote:
Lorgar was a crybaby ("Waah, my daddy doesn't pay enough attention to me as I flaunt all his edicts about secularism!"), and has spent every moment since the Heresy crying himself to sleep in his tower. /lame
This is after his father let him do it for countless years without reprimand or reproach, I think anyone would be a bit annoyed at this and many of the Primarchs had issues with the Emperor. True, most of these if not all of these were the ones that would be traitors.
At least a day - wasnt it until the Dark Angel fleet departed for more crusades? I imagine it takes a couple of days to get an invasion fleet space worthy. Thats quite the sucker punch
iproxtaco wrote:And yet who manipulated him? Lorgar. Who was in turn manipulated by Kor Phaeron. But Lorgar was the architect.
Being stabbed by an ancient alien demon weapon that allowed him to be possessed by Chaos to some extent is hardly "manipulation".
Lorgar was a crybaby ("Waah, my daddy doesn't pay enough attention to me as I flaunt all his edicts about secularism!"), and has spent every moment since the Heresy crying himself to sleep in his tower. /lame
Although that's not actually how things happened. The Sword was made by the Kinebrach, the process of making it or if it's connected to Chaos is not specified or even hinted at.
The sword also just wounded Horus. No possession occurred. Horus willingly turned to Chaos.
Who got the sword? Erebus. Who placed the sword in hands of a traitor? Erebus. Who persuaded the Luna Wolves to seek the help of the Serpent Lodge? Erebus. Who then persuaded Horus during the Ritual and guided him afterwards? Erebus. Why was Erebus there in the first place and who told him what to do? Lorgar.
A few things about Lorgar. He's a Daemon Prince. He's in command of one of the largest and most unified and powerful Legions that exists. He was the Architect of the Heresy, chosen of all the Chaos Gods.
Oh yeah, and he's not dead or missing. Horus, Konrad, Alpharius (maybe, maybe not) and most of the loyalists are dead, the rest of those are missing. So, only five traitor Primarchs are alive. Fulgrim isn't even in control of his own body. Got a source that says he weeps with sorrow? He meditates. He's the only other who could possibly do what Abbadon does, and he'd do it better.
It didn't kill the essence of Horus, it was particularly potent at reversing the physiology of his Primarch body. It was effectively designed to kill him, becoming his Nemesis. It left him unconscious and vulnerable, not hollow.
Yeah? His legion numbers a lot more than all the others, is more organised than most of them. What do you mean 'unremarkable'? As in, they aren't as strong as the World Eaters or Space Wolves? And? You don't have to be strong to be great. They were still Astartes. Fairly effective at raising cults, it is their primary goal as a Legion, they often contend with The Alpha Legion because of it
There's only two who do something. He's alive, powerful, favored, the majority are missing, or dead.
To be honest, there is no argument. Lorgar is not the fastest, strongest, or most skilled in body or in mind. He does however have vision.
The reason I like the Ultramarines is because im a Military man myself, and I look at it this way, much to the chargrin of the UM haters..
The Ultramarines were the most professional of all the legions, they all had their quirks, stoicism, feral aggression and what have you, but Ultramarines were all abot good solid drills, practice.
Gulliman would have practiced the most, he will have gone down the gym and trained like a professional fighter, and he killed Alpharius in a duel, so he musta been pretty rock anyways.
I think just like in boxing, the guy who trains the hardest is the hardest, and out of all of them, Roboute must have been the most professional right? Not given to rage and fury Perutarbo and Russ, not spending too much time on his books like Magnus, just a calm professional that trains hard and thinks hard, he woulda took them all apart!
And when he did lose, the guy had 6 arms and poisoned knives!
mattyrm wrote: The reason I like the Ultramarines is because im a Military man myself, and I look at it this way, much to the chargrin of the UM haters..
The Ultramarines were the most professional of all the legions, they all had their quirks, stoicism, feral aggression and what have you, but Ultramarines were all abot good solid drills, practice.
Gulliman would have practiced the most, he will have gone down the gym and trained like a professional fighter, and he killed Alpharius in a duel, so he musta been pretty rock anyways.
I think just like in boxing, the guy who trains the hardest is the hardest, and out of all of them, Roboute must have been the most professional right? Not given to rage and fury Perutarbo and Russ, not spending too much time on his books like Magnus, just a calm professional that trains hard and thinks hard, he woulda took them all apart!
And when he did lose, the guy had 6 arms and poisoned knives!
Yeah, I like all of these features about the UM's, seriously and I think they're underestimated in this regard.
It's worth mentioning however, that he APPARENTLY killed Alpharius in a duel, who wasn't the most talented swordsman as it was. Whilst he probably trained a lot, I think the minority of this training would be in close combat prowess/swordsmanship, but rather leadership/tactics etc. Guilliman was well regarded as possibly the best tactician/data handler of all the Primarchs, however the fluff seems to indicate he's fairly average (for Primarch standards) in close combat I think...
iproxtaco wrote: Lorgar is not the fastest, strongest, or most skilled in body or in mind. He does however have vision.
And his vision is an eternity of his beloved father being disappointed in him. He'll never get that atta'boy he so desperately craves now. So it's non-stop pouting for him.
I think if you put them all into a pit fit and told them to fight to the death Russ/Angron would get most the primarchs but they would basically get each other, one would stagger away and get stabbed in the back by Alpharius/Omegon who had dodged all the fighting by hiding
mattyrm wrote: The reason I like the Ultramarines is because im a Military man myself, and I look at it this way, much to the chargrin of the UM haters..
The Ultramarines were the most professional of all the legions, they all had their quirks, stoicism, feral aggression and what have you, but Ultramarines were all abot good solid drills, practice.
Gulliman would have practiced the most, he will have gone down the gym and trained like a professional fighter, and he killed Alpharius in a duel, so he musta been pretty rock anyways.
I think just like in boxing, the guy who trains the hardest is the hardest, and out of all of them, Roboute must have been the most professional right? Not given to rage and fury Perutarbo and Russ, not spending too much time on his books like Magnus, just a calm professional that trains hard and thinks hard, he woulda took them all apart!
And when he did lose, the guy had 6 arms and poisoned knives!
iproxtaco wrote:
Meh, so what if he didn't have broken legs, he still crushed a Bloodthirster with his bear hands. The Only ones to have done anything of the sort are The Grey Knights although I can't confirm at this moment.
Well Fulgrim killed an Avatar with his bare hands, as well as killed another Primarch.
This is where it starts to turn into a my Primarch is better than yours thread
Fulgrim is my favorite (basically tied with Sangy), so I must point out, he killed TWO primarchs
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Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:
Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:If someone can photoshop a picture of Sangy meme style with the text
"Ka'Banda broke my legs
I broke his back "
I would be your best friend/ give you a cookie
Best I could do with the tools at my disposal. Yes, I know Ka'Banda is spelt wrong. Would you believe I meant to do that :
Ok the only true Primarch that gets the title is Huron....after all he mortally wounded the Emperor and killed what 1-3 other primarchs before his death and there even I have a history issue. Angron comes in second as he has never been defeated, long live Khorne. as for Russ and those other p*$#*%@! I could care less as Angron still lives and the many others are dead or in hiding.
LordWynne wrote:Ok the only true Primarch that gets the title is Huron....after all he mortally wounded the Emperor and killed what 1-3 other primarchs before his death and there even I have a history issue. Angron comes in second as he has never been defeated, long live Khorne. as for Russ and those other p*$#*%@! I could care less as Angron still lives and the many others are dead or in hiding.
Huron was a chapter master... methinks you mean Horus, and he only killed the 1 primarch and that was before his utter annihilation at the hands of the Emperor.
Just Dave wrote:
purplefood wrote:
KingOfTheSwords wrote:Hourus..................... untill he went rouge :-(
Primarchs turning red is indeed a large problem in 40k...
iproxtaco wrote: Lorgar is not the fastest, strongest, or most skilled in body or in mind. He does however have vision.
And his vision is an eternity of his beloved father being disappointed in him. He'll never get that atta'boy he so desperately craves now. So it's non-stop pouting for him.
Quoted for truth and great justice!
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LordWynne wrote:Ok the only true Primarch that gets the title is Huron....after all he mortally wounded the Emperor and killed what 1-3 other primarchs before his death and there even I have a history issue. Angron comes in second as he has never been defeated, long live Khorne. as for Russ and those other p*$#*%@! I could care less as Angron still lives and the many others are dead or in hiding.
Huron = Horus? I believe Sanguinius was his only Primarch victim, unless you count his manipulation of the Space Wolves as another (in that Russ eventually succumbed to the wounds inflicted on him by Magnus).
Russ was created to punish the other primarchs (prospero burns). He broke magnus' back over his knee after beating him in one on one combat even with magnus using his powers. as far as im conserned it is definatly Russ.
MandalorynOranj wrote:Russ didn't win that fight, the Sisters of Silence did. If they hadn't been blocking Magnus's powers Russ would have been a stain on Tizca's pavement.
Pobaly not as Magnus did everything in his power to ahev prospero destroyed
MandalorynOranj wrote:Russ didn't win that fight, the Sisters of Silence did. If they hadn't been blocking Magnus's powers Russ would have been a stain on Tizca's pavement.
He flailed blindly and randomly in Magnus' direction and happened to graze his eye.
I got the impression that he was the only Primarch with diplomatic skill and ambition not corrupted by arrogance, like The Lion of Girlyman, making him the best leader.
NagothDaCleaver wrote:
It then goes on to say that if Ferus Manus were alive there may have been cause for debate, but since he his head is separated from his body the argument is settled.
Right,. and who separated them?
mattyrm wrote: The reason I like the Ultramarines is because im a Military man myself, and I look at it this way, much to the chargrin of the UM haters..
The Ultramarines were the most professional of all the legions, they all had their quirks, stoicism, feral aggression and what have you, but Ultramarines were all abot good solid drills, practice.
Gulliman would have practiced the most, he will have gone down the gym and trained like a professional fighter, and he killed Alpharius in a duel, so he musta been pretty rock anyways.
I think just like in boxing, the guy who trains the hardest is the hardest, and out of all of them, Roboute must have been the most professional right? Not given to rage and fury Perutarbo and Russ, not spending too much time on his books like Magnus, just a calm professional that trains hard and thinks hard, he woulda took them all apart!
And when he did lose, the guy had 6 arms and poisoned knives!
Oh right, that guy again.
At some point, you just gotta count the championships. On paper, Dan Marino may have been better than Joe Montana, but Montana got the rings. Fulgrim took down more other primarchs than anyone else (daemon-enfused or not)
At some point, you just gotta count the championships. On paper, Dan Marino may have been better than Joe Montana, but Montana got the rings. Fulgrim took down more other primarchs than anyone else (daemon-enfused or not)
Fulgrim won his duels thanks to the gifts of Chaos. End of story. Especially if we consider his fight against Guilliman (that some experienced gamers, for some reason, love so much to despise and mock).
But I will give you the fact that he probably bitch-slapped poor ferrus without the aid of anyone.
One could just as easily claim that any wins by loyalists were due to the 'Grace of the Emperor'. Whatever. Wins are what count, not how you got there.
P.S. I think Fulgrim also ripped apart a Wraithlord with his bare hands in one of the books.
At some point, you just gotta count the championships. On paper, Dan Marino may have been better than Joe Montana, but Montana got the rings. Fulgrim took down more other primarchs than anyone else (daemon-enfused or not)
I just finished Fulgrim by Graham Mcneill today, im slowly working through the HH books, so Im ready for this debate!
Fulgrim! haha!
Seriously, you haven't read the book right? You were correct about killing the wraithlord, and that WAS cool, and it was Fulgrim. So he wasnt a total piss ant, but after reading the first 5 books of the HH its impossible to like the guy! He wears make up and dresses like a girl, he is weak. He had no self control or willpower, he couldn't deny the lure of the whispering chaos Gods. In my eyes, that makes the man a weakling, he stared into the abyss and he walked on over it. If you get tempted and you resist your a strong man, Fulgrim wasn't that.
And after the death of Ferrus, he sobs and cries like a little girl, and begs the demon to take him into oblivion (instead of simplying commiting suicide like a sensible fella) and "makes the worst decision he could ever make" as his puny soul is dragged into a tiny corner of his essence, and is possessed utterly by a demon, who then goes and tosses Horus Ferrus Manus's head.
He then mocks Horus, tells him HE IS NO LONGER SPEAKING TO FULGRIM, because Fulgrim is suffering inside him, and he will keep him there in torment because it amuses him. And Horus swears silently to kill him, to release his brother from his suffering.
Ergo, several points for you.
1. Fulgrim is no more, and it wasnt him that killed anyone of note, as stated by the thing that now wears Fulgrims skin.
2. Fulgrim was a weak willed fool with no backbone or will power.
3. He wears perfume and make up and looked like a girl.
I think thats game set and match, im off to read the next book!
purplefood wrote: I'm not sure who says it first but there are several mentions in Prospero Burns that it wasn't the first time the Wolves had fought other Astartes...
Really? Just re-read that book and didn't see any. Could you give me the page?
At some point, you just gotta count the championships. On paper, Dan Marino may have been better than Joe Montana, but Montana got the rings. Fulgrim took down more other primarchs than anyone else (daemon-enfused or not)
I just finished Fulgrim by Graham Mcneill today, im slowly working through the HH books, so Im ready for this debate!
Fulgrim! haha!
Seriously, you haven't read the book right?You were correct about killing the wraithlord, and that WAS cool , and it was Fulgrim. So he wasnt a total piss ant, but after reading the first 5 books of the HH its impossible to like the guy! He wears make up and dresses like a girl, he is weak. He had no self control or willpower, he couldn't deny the lure of the whispering chaos Gods. In my eyes, that makes the man a weakling, he stared into the abyss and he walked on over it. If you get tempted and you resist your a strong man, Fulgrim wasn't that.
And after the death of Ferrus, he sobs and cries like a little girl, and begs the demon to take him into oblivion (instead of simplying commiting suicide like a sensible fella) and "makes the worst decision he could ever make" as his puny soul is dragged into a tiny corner of his essence, and is possessed utterly by a demon, who then goes and tosses Horus Ferrus Manus's head.
He then mocks Horus, tells him HE IS NO LONGER SPEAKING TO FULGRIM, because Fulgrim is suffering inside him, and he will keep him there in torment because it amuses him. And Horus swears silently to kill him, to release his brother from his suffering.
Ergo, several points for you.
1. Fulgrim is no more, and it wasnt him that killed anyone of note, as stated by the thing that now wears Fulgrims skin.
2. Fulgrim was a weak willed fool with no backbone or will power.
3. He wears perfume and make up and looked like a girl.
I think thats game set and match, im off to read the next book!
To say something on the green bit...
Fulgrim took down a wraithlord??? I LAUGH ATHIS FACE
Magnus took down a stompa and then another titan!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also fulgrim was killed by Perturabo in Angel Exterminatus
).
enough for me.
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