Tough call. I like the Alpha Legion for their unconventional tactics and the Thousand Sons for being individually the most powerful Astartes and their tragic fall. Neither Legion is what they used to before the Heresy, though.
Least favorite would probably be Space Wolves for being uncivilized and superstitious savages, or Word Bearers for being a bunch of tools.
Grey Knights, I remember them for how they were, not who they are now. Where every fight was a desperate struggle against an enemy so foreign they can't even comprehend the structure of their bodies. It's too easy for them nowadays.
Son's of Medusa, for their affintiy to technology and the fact that they hate anyone not willing to pick up a gun and fight for themselves. Plus they are better looking than the Iron Hands.
coolyo294 wrote:Bow down all you lesser Space Marines and claim Guilliman as your spiritual liege!
As a self respecting follower of dorn and rynn's world i will not claim that book obsessed jack wagon ..joking of corse*dont pull out the heavy flamer please*
nah but seriosly crimson fists gotta love that can do attiude.
As long as it isn't another Phail Kelly Scuba-Cavalry-Thunderhawk-stealing-Wolfy-Wolf-atrocity turning another close-and-personal-chapter into a pinnacle of bland heavy-weapon spam, there is little to fear.
As long as it isn't another Phail Kelly Scuba-Cavalry-Thunderhawk-stealing-Wolfy-Wolf-atrocity turning another close-and-personal-chapter into a pinnacle of bland heavy-weapon spam, there is little to fear.
I think he was refering to the rumours that Mat Ward is writing it...
As long as it isn't another Phail Kelly Scuba-Cavalry-Thunderhawk-stealing-Wolfy-Wolf-atrocity turning another close-and-personal-chapter into a pinnacle of bland heavy-weapon spam, there is little to fear.
Cool enough. Mat Ward has proven to have a good enough grasp of the rules to hit the theme of Chapters.. such as, ya know, giving Blood Angels a focus on assault, Salamanders a focus on fiery close-range firefight, Grey Knights a focus on elite-psyker-brotherhood.
That's already far more than can be said for Kelly who would likely turn it into another utterly uninspired, counter-intutive spam-army or Cruddace who couldn't find his way through basic 40K fluff like the Hive War if he tried and would likely want to turn Templars into a rank-and-file WFB-army anyhow.
Zweischneid wrote:Cool enough. Mat Ward has proven to have a good enough grasp of the rules to hit the theme of Chapters.. such as, ya know, giving Blood Angels a focus on assault, Salamanders a focus on fiery close-range firefight, Grey Knights a focus on elite-psyker-brotherhood.
That's already far more than can be said for Kelly who would likely turn it into another utterly uninspired, counter-intutive spam-army or Cruddace who couldn't find his way through basic 40K fluff like the Hive War if he tried and would likely want to turn Templars into a rank-and-file WFB-army anyhow.
I approve!
He made Blood Angels like best friends with Necrons.
He made Grey Knight suitable to Chaos corruption.
I have a hunch that he will made BT closer to Ultramarines, maybe even reduce their numbers to 1000.
Brother Coa wrote:
He made Blood Angels like best friends with Necrons.
No he didn't. He introduced on uneasy, unspoken highly temporary non-aggression pact contingent on a full blown Tyranid invasion. Those are different things. Presuming that Necron (leaders) have some inkling of intelligence and strategic acumen, that episode is not entirely out fo the ordinary. In my opinion, it is quite a cool bone to popular doubles-tournaments too. In any case, it is lightyears away from the idiocy of Underwater-Thunderwolves doing Scuba-Swim-Battles or womanizing Bloodclaws going GTA on their Chapters Thunderhawks.
Brother Coa wrote:
He made Grey Knight suitable to Chaos corruption.
What Grey Knight succumbed to Chaos? The only thing he did was emphasise how their "immunity" to Chaos is the result of the dire, demanding and personal struggle of each and every Grey Knight, rather than some obscure, automatic "anti-corruption-vaccine" that it was before. Nothing was changed, unlike, say, Codex Writers who rip the entire established Hive War fluff a new one to ram their little "Swarmy" invention inside or re-write the Dark Eldar menace as a gang of misunderstood Emo-Elves with leaky souls.
Zweischneid wrote: No he didn't. He introduced on uneasy, unspoken highly temporary non-aggression pact contingent on a full blown Tyranid invasion. Those are different things. Presuming that Necron (leaders) have some inkling of intelligence and strategic acumen, that episode is not entirely out fo the ordinary. In my opinion, it is quite a cool bone to popular doubles-tournaments too. In any case, it is lightyears away from the idiocy of Underwater-Thunderwolves doing Scuba-Swim-Battles or womanizing Bloodclaws going GTA on their Chapters Thunderhawks.
So if Tyranids ever attack galaxy in full force the Necons will rise and help us fight them. And then return to sleep? Necrons are ancient killer robots, they have no mind of their own, they are automatons and machines who only serve C'Tan now all of a sudden want's to help the races of the galaxy to combat mutual enemy? Necrons don't have anything to do with us exept to collect our souls, why help us? Why not just phase shift and let Tyranids slaughter Blood Angels? And it was not full blown Tyranid invasion, it was a splinter fleet. And not to mention the mighty Mephiston who held alone against Tyranid attack for 6 hours ( which was ok, some marines can do it ), and who then tears CARNIFEX to peaces with his BARE HANDS ( wow, Chuck Norris rule ). And in the final hour of his defense, he charged the Tyranids? Killed every Hive Mind brood and Hive Tyrant and all of his guardians until he was hit in his back by Trygon ( I assume that he would kill him to with his hands only if the bastard didn't hit him from the back ).
Zweischneid wrote: What Grey Knight succumbed to Chaos? The only thing he did was emphasise how their "immunity" to Chaos is the result of the dire, demanding and personal struggle of each and every Grey Knight, rather than some obscure, automatic "anti-corruption-vaccine" that it was before. Nothing was changed, unlike, say, Codex Writers who rip the entire established Hive War fluff a new one to ram their little "Swarmy" invention inside or re-write the Dark Eldar menace as a gang of misunderstood Emo-Elves with leaky souls.
Grey Knights, who are supposed to be purest and the most faithful of all Imperial servants need blood of Sisters for protection? And yet, those Sisters where there, and their faith has safeguard them from corruption of the daemon. They only retreat when suffered heavy losses. And after Grey Knights arrived, being better than Sisters in all aspects they should have no problem with that. But they cannot avoid corruption that Sisters can? Their action and ritual is more settling to Chaos worhipers than them. And it is the way of Khrone to slaughter your allies and bath in their blood. That's why are they now knows as Khornite Knights. And yet, some of them are so full of faith and so incorruptible that they can take down Fallen Primarch and their guard with ease, and even carve their master's name into their hearts. And even be manageable to do so alone. Some of them can even be eaten alive by Grater Daemons only to make them explode from the inside. They are even so awesome that they can call orbital bombardments on themselves and walk away like it was just a rain and hold down legions of daemons all by themself for 2 days without a scratch on the armor. And some of them are so awesome that they go trough warp like it is a walk in the park and kill daemons in their own reality ( talking about Chuck Norris rule ). They even crush city doors with their boot and entomb lords of change in the ruins. And they are so awesome that even Dark Gods of Chaos can't banish them from their own reality...?
I can't even imagine what will he do to Black Templars, especially when they are exact opposite to Ultramarines - Ward's most favorite chapter. He has openly talked against them in the past, now he is doing their new codex? He will either rise them to Emperor's level of glory or utterly destroy them. I just hope it will be the option 1, I don't want to see BT destroyed...
Zweischneid wrote:
No he didn't. He introduced on uneasy, unspoken highly temporary non-aggression pact contingent on a full blown Tyranid invasion. Those are different things. Presuming that Necron (leaders) have some inkling of intelligence and strategic acumen, that episode is not entirely out fo the ordinary. In my opinion, it is quite a cool bone to popular doubles-tournaments too.
Ah now, everyone and their dog thinks that fluff is aload of bull. I mean think of it. Humanity's greatest warriors, fighting along side an ancient sentient race bent on the death of every living organism in the universe....fighting with each other?! and then finding it 'distasteful' too fight each other after words?!
I think they should let Matt Ward write the army list, and Phil write the fluff.
Brother Coa wrote:And not to mention the mighty Mephiston who held alone against Tyranid attack for 6 hours ( which was ok, some marines can do it ), and who then tears CARNIFEX to peaces with his BARE HANDS ( wow, Chuck Norris rule ). And in the final hour of his defense, he charged the Tyranids? Killed every Hive Mind brood and Hive Tyrant and all of his guardians until he was hit in his back by Trygon ( I assume that he would kill him to with his hands only if the bastard didn't hit him from the back ).
Not sure what your beef is? That is NOTHING compared to Maugan Ra killing an entire splinter feet and defending a WHOLE planet all by himself!!!! (wonder how he managed to fight of the Tyranids on different sides of the planet simultaniously?).
Is 40K-fluff over the top? Sure. But whatever Mat Wards writes seems fairly tame compared to the drivel written by Cruddace or Kelly.
And not forget the brilliant Kelly piece about a guy called "the Decpatitator" wielding a weapon called the "the Decapitator" that he uses to "decapitate" people, hiding their heads away in his own private, secret "decapitator-dimension" that will end the universe. If Kelly would write the BT-Codex, we would probably get a Special Character known as "Bolter" who uses a "Bolter" to "bolter" people
Trust me. Mat Ward is currently the best pair of hands you could ever wish a Codex to be in: and by a very, very, very large margin too.
Zweischneid wrote: If Kelly would write the BT-Codex, we would probably get a Special Character known as "Bolter" who uses a "Bolter" to "bolter" people
Toastedandy wrote:
Ah now, everyone and their dog thinks that fluff is aload of bull. I mean think of it. Humanity's greatest warriors, fighting along side an ancient sentient race bent on the death of every living organism in the universe....fighting with each other?! and then finding it 'distasteful' too fight each other after words?!
At least they were fighting
In Kelly-fluff, they would have been joy-riding with a stolen Monolith and womanized among the Women of Baal (despite being, ya know, a-sexual and all that).
Zweischneid wrote:
Not sure what your beef is? That is NOTHING compared to Maugan Ra killing an entire splinter feet and defending a WHOLE planet all by himself!!!! (wonder how he managed to fight of the Tyranids on different sides of the planet simultaniously?).
Is 40K-fluff over the top? Sure. But whatever Mat Wards writes seems fairly tame compared to the drivel written by Cruddace or Kelly.
And not forget the brilliant Kelly piece about a guy called "the Decpatitator" wielding a weapon called the "the Decapitator" that he uses to "decapitate" people, hiding their heads away in his own private, secret "decapitator-dimension" that will end the universe. If Kelly would write the BT-Codex, we would probably get a Special Character known as "Bolter" who uses a "Bolter" to "bolter" people
Trust me. Mat Ward is currently the best pair of hands you could ever wish a Codex to be in: and by a very, very, very large margin too.
And trust me when I say that new BT codex will be more hated than Hitler and Satan together if it turn's out like GK codex.
NO! I will love it even if its the most under powered codex ever. If anything they are going to make it weaker. I mean, re roll all misses in combat? for 30 points?
Brother Coa wrote:
And trust me when I say that new BT codex will be more hated than Hitler and Satan together if it turn's out like GK codex.
The GK Codex is a brilliant book.
It has an exciting, challenging list to work with. It's by all first accounts a good middle-place in the overall balance of 5th Edition books (unlike, say, Space Wolves or Imperial Guard). It's FAQ/Errata is the shortest today (unlike, again, the Space Wolves one which, with over six pages of stuff that needed changing is nearly as long as the Errata for the entire 40K rulebook; and we don't even wanna start on Tyranids). The fluff throws some tangalizing bits and pieces (Terminus Decree) and ties in well with current BL stuff that Ward (unlike his two collegues) is evidently reading (e.g. Malcador the Sigilite, etc.. ). On the table, Grey Knights have already shown themselves capable of producing a great variety of different lists from Paladin-Wings over Purifiers to Henchmen lists (compare it to the ever-same Venom/Raider/Ravager-spam that is literally EVERY DE army out there; or the ubiquity of Long Fangs).
If the BT is only half as good as the Grey Knight book, it'll stand heads-above-shoulders above anything and everything Kelly or Cruddace have managed to piece together so far in their GW-careers.
Zweischneid wrote: Kelly or Cruddace have managed to piece together so far in their GW-careers.
What did they write? I know Kelly wrote the Dark Eldar book, and IMO its fantastic, fluff fits it, models are stunning. Not everyones cup of tea, but for what it is, its really good
Zweischneid wrote:
The GK Codex is a brilliant book.
It has an exciting, challenging list to work with. It's by all first accounts a good middle-place in the overall balance of 5th Edition books (unlike, say, Space Wolves or Imperial Guard). It's FAQ/Errata is the shortest today (unlike, again, the Space Wolves one which, with over six pages of stuff that needed changing is nearly as long as the Errata for the entire 40K rulebook; and we don't even wanna start on Tyranids). The fluff throws some tangalizing bits and pieces (Terminus Decree) and ties in well with current BL stuff that Ward (unlike his two collegues) is evidently reading (e.g. Malcador the Sigilite, etc.. ). On the table, Grey Knights have already shown themselves capable of producing a great variety of different lists from Paladin-Wings over Purifiers to Henchmen lists (compare it to the ever-same Venom/Raider/Ravager-spam that is literally EVERY DE army out there; or the ubiquity of Long Fangs).
If the BT is only half as good as the Grey Knight book, it'll stand heads-above-shoulders above anything and everything Kelly or Cruddace have managed to piece together so far in their GW-careers.
What?
It was fail, in fluff and rules. No matter all that up, what about other army's? The book is meant to bring balance to the game so that everyone can enjoy, insted it overpowerd Grey Knights like nothing else before. He give them rule to be virtually immune to plasma fire, and you call that balance? Tau can't do now nothing to them as 75% of their weapons are plasma, even Rail gun is that tech. And that Dredknight looks liek something from Matrix 2 and 3 mix with some Aliens robot mix.
And the point of rules for table is for every army to be balanced, if tabletop has rules like in 40k fluff the Marines would be the most powerful, 1 squad of Marines could virtually destroy entire company's. And in their new fluff GK are represent's like mini-Emperor's who rapes Daemons and even Chaos Gods - in WARP. This have taken the last grasp of reality from GK.
You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote.
I agree with Coa. Tau have a hard enough time as it is, now they litterally cant even scratch GK armour. The army list is good in the way it is so versitile. You could make rogue traders, elite coven of warriors anything could be made too fit with it. But they are overpowered. They have access to the best gun in the game, and the fluff is woeful.
And trust me when I say that new BT codex will be more hated than Hitler and Satan together if it turn's out like GK codex.
NO! I will love it even if its the most under powered codex ever. If anything they are going to make it weaker. I mean, re roll all misses in combat? for 30 points?
It's all misses against stuff with a WS for 50 points. Methinks you should reread the Templars Codex.
Brother Coa wrote:
It was fail, in fluff and rules. No matter all that up, what about other army's? The book is meant to bring balance to the game so that everyone can enjoy, insted it overpowerd Grey Knights like nothing else before. He give them rule to be virtually immune to plasma fire, and you call that balance? Tau can't do now nothing to them as 75% of their weapons are plasma, even Rail gun is that tech. And that Dredknight looks liek something from Matrix 2 and 3 mix with some Aliens robot mix.
And the point of rules for table is for every army to be balanced, if tabletop has rules like in 40k fluff the Marines would be the most powerful, 1 squad of Marines could virtually destroy entire company's. And in their new fluff GK are represent's like mini-Emperor's who rapes Daemons and even Chaos Gods - in WARP. This have taken the last grasp of reality from GK.
You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote.
1. Tau do need an update, a given. But an Ordo Xenos artifact that works against.. well.. Xenos? Shockingly unfluffy I guess! Also, it has a range of 12". Nothing that will cripple Tau (more than they are).
2. Dreadknight at least looks like it could walk, unlike the stunty-legged, knee-less unbalanced Dreadnaught-metal-boxes. I am aware of the limitations of early 1990s metal-miniatures; but with the new plastic casting, all current Dreads should be phased-out in favour of things like the Dreadknight that could conceivable actually walk. Also, it looks brilliant. Far better than any Emo-Elf model release so far.
3. Didn't you link that sci-fi-scales-problem-TV-thrope above? It's 40K. It's over the top. A given. A one-man-guerilla-war against Daemons is still more plausible than a one-man planetary defense against a Tyranid Hive Fleet. Draigo "only" survives. Maugan Ra exterminated an entire civilizations' worth of rabid attack-organisms bio-engineered to eat the galaxy. And he didn't even run out of ammo.
Zweischneid wrote:. A one-man-guerilla-war against Daemons is still more plausible than a one-man planetary defense against a Tyranid Hive Fleet. Draigo "only" survives. Maugan Ra exterminated an entire civilizations' worth of rabid attack-organisms bio-engineered to eat the galaxy. And he didn't even run out of ammo.
No, neither is more believable. A Daemon world is a seething mass of blood and spikey bits. Carving his name in a PRIMARCHS heart, a daemonified primarch at that. Smashing apart daemon cities etc. But TBH its hard to argue with such obviously biased post
Zweischneid wrote: The GK Codex is a brilliant book.
It has an exciting, challenging list to work with. It's by all first accounts a good middle-place in the overall balance of 5th Edition books (unlike, say, Space Wolves or Imperial Guard). It's FAQ/Errata is the shortest today (unlike, again, the Space Wolves one which, with over six pages of stuff that needed changing is nearly as long as the Errata for the entire 40K rulebook; and we don't even wanna start on Tyranids). The fluff throws some tangalizing bits and pieces (Terminus Decree) and ties in well with current BL stuff that Ward (unlike his two collegues) is evidently reading (e.g. Malcador the Sigilite, etc.. ). On the table, Grey Knights have already shown themselves capable of producing a great variety of different lists from Paladin-Wings over Purifiers to Henchmen lists (compare it to the ever-same Venom/Raider/Ravager-spam that is literally EVERY DE army out there; or the ubiquity of Long Fangs).
If the BT is only half as good as the Grey Knight book, it'll stand heads-above-shoulders above anything and everything Kelly or Cruddace have managed to piece together so far in their GW-careers.
What?
It was fail, in fluff and rules. No matter all that up, what about other army's? The book is meant to bring balance to the game so that everyone can enjoy, insted it overpowerd Grey Knights like nothing else before. He give them rule to be virtually immune to plasma fire, and you call that balance? Tau can't do now nothing to them as 75% of their weapons are plasma, even Rail gun is that tech. And that Dredknight looks liek something from Matrix 2 and 3 mix with some Aliens robot mix. And the point of rules for table is for every army to be balanced, if tabletop has rules like in 40k fluff the Marines would be the most powerful, 1 squad of Marines could virtually destroy entire company's. And in their new fluff GK are represent's like mini-Emperor's who rapes Daemons and even Chaos Gods - in WARP. This have taken the last grasp of reality from GK.
You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote.
So, what you're saying is, that no one is allowed a different opinion to you? The Plasma Syphon is a stupid and ineffective piece of kit, it doesn't effect the Railgun, and has a meager 12" range. The Dreadknight I agree with you. Wait what? The Grey Knights are now super-powerful Daemon-hunters!? No way! That's ridiculous, it's so unfluffy and definitely against the entire point of their existence! /sarcasm if it wasn't obvious already. Draigo is a stupid piece of fluff. Maugan Ra is just as bad or even worse, there's no arguing with that and Mat Ward is definitely not the first to write something as over the top. Thundewolves anyone?
Toastedandy wrote:
No, neither is more believable. A Daemon world is a seething mass of blood and spikey bits. Carving his name in a PRIMARCHS heart, a daemonified primarch at that. Smashing apart daemon cities etc. But TBH its hard to argue with such obviously biased post
Fair enough. But if, as you say, neither is more (or less) believable, than (bias aside, which I admit is favouring Mat Ward on my side; his writing just "flows" alot better and is more interesting to delve into compared to the more expositionary style of Kelly), neither Kelly's or Ward's writing could as a consequence be called more (or less) over-the-top than that of the respective other.
iproxtaco wrote:
So, what you're saying is, that no one is allowed a different opinion to you?
No, I am just saying my point. He has his and that's ok. Because we can write down stuff like this until 21.12.2012 I will not argue anymore and live others to express their opinions.
Wait what? The Grey Knights are now super-powerful Daemon-hunters!? No way! That's ridiculous, it's so unfluffy and definitely against the entire point of their existence! /sarcasm if it wasn't obvious already.
I knew that, but they are now super-powerful Daemon-hunters who eats Daemon Lords for launch and who are so powerful that they can be only struck down if they want to. Space marines are awesome at killing aliens and heretics to but they lose battles here and there, and there are limits to how many enemies they can take out. GK can now fight against Chaos Gods and kill them.
iproxtaco wrote:
So, what you're saying is, that no one is allowed a different opinion to you?
No, I am just saying my point. He has his and that's ok. Because we can write down stuff like this until 21.12.2012 I will not argue anymore and live others to express their opinions.
It's obviously not ok because he's a "mat ward fan" so his opinions are apparently wrong.
Wait what? The Grey Knights are now super-powerful Daemon-hunters!? No way! That's ridiculous, it's so unfluffy and definitely against the entire point of their existence! /sarcasm if it wasn't obvious already.
I knew that, but they are now super-powerful Daemon-hunters who eats Daemon Lords for launch and who are so powerful that they can be only struck down if they want to. Space marines are awesome at killing aliens and heretics to but they lose battles here and there, and there are limits to how many enemies they can take out. GK can now fight against Chaos Gods and kill them.
Woah there, calm down. Their fluff says absolutely none of the above, don't make things up. Fighting the Chaos Gods? I think you may be over-exaggerating to try an back up an already flawed point.
iproxtaco wrote:
It's obviously not ok because he's a "mat ward fan" so his opinions are apparently wrong.
I said that so what? He is M.W. fluff fan and I respect that. I have difference of opinion with M.W. fluff, he likes it so our arguments can go until dommsday.
I am also Imperial fan, did I offend myself? I said to im2randomghgh that he is a Tau fan and did I offend him?
Woah there, calm down. Their fluff says absolutely none of the above, don't make things up. Fighting the Chaos Gods? I think you may be over-exaggerating to try an back up an already flawed point.
No, but I get that kind of felling while reading their fluff. Like they can take on Chaos Gods themselves in battle. And it is stated that even Chaos Gods can't vanquish Draigo from Warp. And he is just 1 Grey Knight.
sapce kittens (an army of oen of the girls i play with) pink armour, hello kitty on the shoulder of each using space wolves rules... so overpowered kittens .... also JoTWW renamed to ball of yarn... kitten plays with ball of yard then throws it those on the 24 inch line are overcome by cuteness and leave the battlefield to go pick flowers and skip in the field... and she once got my ghaz with it... imagine ghaz the most powerful warlord ever off picking flowers in a field after seeinfg kittens play with yarn
Toastedandy wrote:
Ah now, everyone and their dog thinks that fluff is aload of bull. I mean think of it. Humanity's greatest warriors, fighting along side an ancient sentient race bent on the death of every living organism in the universe....fighting with each other?! and then finding it 'distasteful' too fight each other after words?!
At least they were fighting
In Kelly-fluff, they would have been joy-riding with a stolen Monolith and womanized among the Women of Baal (despite being, ya know, a-sexual and all that).
Or, y'know, they'd have acted in character and exterminated the ever-loving crap out of every life form to desecrate their tomb world.
Try reading Codex: Orks sometime, it might do your indigestion of Kelly fluff some good.
Now, on topic, I find it hard to decide between the Ultramarines, Space Wolves and Imperial Fists. All of them are, in my eyes, badasses in their own way. In terms of Traitors? Has to be Iron Warriors. I shouldn't even have to explain myself there.
Loyalists: Salamanders with Imperial Fists running a close second. Traitors: Night Lords, with Alpha Legion just behind them. As far as the traitors go, incidentally, these are the only two I like. I find the others to be nonsensical. (Which is an opinion rather than a fact. I don't like Chaos Marines in general, and in no way feel that opinion should detract from anyone else's enjoyment of them.)
iproxtaco wrote:
It's obviously not ok because he's a "mat ward fan" so his opinions are apparently wrong.
I said that so what? He is M.W. fluff fan and I respect that. I have difference of opinion with M.W. fluff, he likes it so our arguments can go until dommsday.
I am also Imperial fan, did I offend myself? I said to im2randomghgh that he is a Tau fan and did I offend him?
"You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote."
Try to convince me that this isn't a derogatory comment.
Woah there, calm down. Their fluff says absolutely none of the above, don't make things up. Fighting the Chaos Gods? I think you may be over-exaggerating to try an back up an already flawed point.
No, but I get that kind of felling while reading their fluff. Like they can take on Chaos Gods themselves in battle. And it is stated that even Chaos Gods can't vanquish Draigo from Warp. And he is just 1 Grey Knight.
Why though? There are no examples of this generalization, unless you can give us one. No it's not stated that even the Chaos Gods cannot vanquish Draigo, that is utter BS, don't make things up.
Automatically Appended Next Post: This has gone too-far off topic.
My favourites -
Loyalist - Salamanders, Grey Knights, Crimson Fists
Traitor - Word Bearers, Night Lords, World Eaters
1 = Ultras (Romans in Space!)
2 = Space Wolves (very very close second)
3 = Ravenguard
after that, I'd say Dark Angels and Imperial Fists or Black Templars... I like the top 7 or so, the rest I have no use for (and I really don't find the BA very appealing, though I get why others do)
iproxtaco wrote:
"You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote."
Try to convince me that this isn't a derogatory comment.
He is M.W. fan and he did ignore everything I wrote. And I didn't have wish to talk with him anymore because it was pointless.
Why though? There are no examples of this generalization, unless you can give us one. No it's not stated that even the Chaos Gods cannot vanquish Draigo, that is utter BS, don't make things up.
"Yet if the Dark Gods could not vanquish Draigo, then nor could Draigo win any meaningful victory."
I don't think we can judge Mr Ward just yet. He's written 3 marine codices, which have each been of poorer quality than the last, but the fluff is clearly designed to appeal to a 10 year old mindset (Nemesis Doomfist????? ), the ones that marines are marketed to, and when arguably GW's most reliable writer writes a marine codex it ends up being just as immature. I just think it's GW robbing the kiddies.
But this is off topic.
Anyway, definitely Black Templars. Badass paint scheme and badass fluff.
iproxtaco wrote: "You are obviously some M.W. fan, and because of that I am not more talking to you because you are just ignoring everything we wrote." Try to convince me that this isn't a derogatory comment.
He is M.W. fan and he did ignore everything I wrote. And I didn't have wish to talk with him anymore because it was pointless.
No he didn't. He responded to every point you made.
Why though? There are no examples of this generalization, unless you can give us one. No it's not stated that even the Chaos Gods cannot vanquish Draigo, that is utter BS, don't make things up.
"Yet if the Dark Gods could not vanquish Draigo, then nor could Draigo win any meaningful victory."
Page 39, Grey Knights codex.
You can't seriously have got that The Chaos Gods themselves couldn't kill Draigo form that, could've you?
I'm 100% certain that if Khorne himself were to come along and fight Draigo, Draigo would be completely annihilated. The quote does not refer to The Chaos Gods themselves, it refers to the followers they send to attack Draigo, which are part of them.
iproxtaco wrote:I'm 100% certain that if Khorne himself were to come along and fight Draigo, Draigo would be completely annihilated. The quote does not refer to The Chaos Gods themselves, it refers to the followers they send to attack Draigo, which are part of them.
iproxtaco wrote:I'm 100% certain that if Khorne himself were to come along and fight Draigo, Draigo would be completely annihilated. The quote does not refer to The Chaos Gods themselves, it refers to the followers they send to attack Draigo, which are part of them.
iproxtaco wrote:I'm 100% certain that if Khorne himself were to come along and fight Draigo, Draigo would be completely annihilated. The quote does not refer to The Chaos Gods themselves, it refers to the followers they send to attack Draigo, which are part of them.
So Dark Gods are actually followers of Chaos Gods
Technically, pretty much everything in the warp is a god of some caliber. The big 4 simply being the most powerful/famous. Every Daemon could be a god. Most would be simpley forms of the big 4, but there would be thousands if not millions of gods living in the warp. Source - Blood Gorgons by Henry Zou. The chapter had their own deity who was an ancient god, albeit a very weak one
The Wanderers whats not awesome about a bunch of bickering free minded space marines that constantly make fun of other chapters, and also use technology just because they feel like it.
That and they have kickass armor. (I like my chapter I made.)
okay but in canon Dark Angels.
TrollPie wrote:I don't think we can judge Mr Ward just yet. He's written 3 marine codices, which have each been of poorer quality than the last, but the fluff is clearly designed to appeal to a 10 year old mindset (Nemesis Doomfist????? ), the ones that marines are marketed to, and when arguably GW's most reliable writer writes a marine codex it ends up being just as immature. I just think it's GW robbing the kiddies.
But this is off topic.
Anyway, definitely Black Templars. Badass paint scheme and badass fluff.
With that logic, Dr. Zuess should write a codex. Mart Ward I am, I do not like green orks and spam.
TrollPie wrote:I don't think we can judge Mr Ward just yet. He's written 3 marine codices, which have each been of poorer quality than the last, but the fluff is clearly designed to appeal to a 10 year old mindset (Nemesis Doomfist????? ), the ones that marines are marketed to, and when arguably GW's most reliable writer writes a marine codex it ends up being just as immature. I just think it's GW robbing the kiddies.
But this is off topic.
Anyway, definitely Black Templars. Badass paint scheme and badass fluff.
With that logic, Dr. Zuess should write a codex. Mart Ward I am, I do not like green orks and spam.
This idea has be transcribed and marked for use by the GW ideas division.
Thank you.
The Mind Police.
My favorite chapter is Ultramarines. Because they are the definition of Astartes.
My least favorite chapter is Grey Knights. Because imo they have no real place in games of 40k. I suppose I'd like them better if they were only allowed to be fielded against choas related armies. And the dreadknight... WORNSTROM! I hate the dreadknight more than any unit in the game, it seems as if someone at GW was all "Did you see Avatar?! That machine thingy with the combat knife was so cool! We must add it to the newest marine book!". IMO it is the silliest, stupidest and most ugly marine thingy ever (Rogue Trader Dreadnaughts looked better). It has no place in the 40k universe unless it is given jet packs and a shas'o pilot. And yes I know it has history in the older books but those were the days when grey knights were the same color sceme as DeathWatch.
First I have to go with Space Wolves but I selectively ignore some of their fluff. I just dig the Vikings/barbarians in space. It gives me lots of room to convert cool stuff. I make their look more Viking and less wolf, and I hate the thunderwolves! My second would be Black Templars ’cause I like the knightly aspects.
Dark Angels first. Look at my profile image....... If its a Codex chapter I like the Doom Eagles because they look cool and their fluff of jump marines is pretty sweet. I also kind of like the Howling Griffons too because they have cool looking colors.
I've become quite the fan of the Executioners lately, and the name and iconography of Brotherhood of a Thousand is just cool (even if they have no fluff whatsoever).
Has to be Black Templars. Had them as my VERY FIRST army. My army wasn't that great, and I didn't know they had their own codec, but besides that, They're freaking cool
Chaos wise, I don't really have one, Anything Nurgley is cool in my book. So I guess Death Guard would have to be mine ?
In this order: Salamanders and Dark Angels are the only armies I've ever really gotten attached to. Legion of the Damned and The 13th Company are armies I've closely followed, but, in the regard to The 13th Company, I really dislike that they allowed them into the Space Wolves as a whole.
I like that chapter in Helsreach where Grimaldus tells the newly appointed Emperor's Champion in the heat of battle to "Pick up his sword." That whole chapter was pretty epic.
Imperial Fists (yeah I know I play DA). I really like the whole IF culture and Dorn is my favorite primarch. I plan to do a big IF project (An entire company or so of True Scale) once I'm done with DA.
ultra smurfs, blood angels black templars space wolves, and any other chapter that has their OWN codex are all bad, gw needs to give more love to the xenos instead of marine chapter with their own codex, if marines get a codex, I want my ork warbands to have their own codex, Codex:bad moons anyone?
As long as it isn't another Phail Kelly Scuba-Cavalry-Thunderhawk-stealing-Wolfy-Wolf-atrocity turning another close-and-personal-chapter into a pinnacle of bland heavy-weapon spam, there is little to fear.
Just a rumor, but I hope it's not.
As a BT player, I will personally see to the destruction of any BLASPHEMER or HERETIC who corrupts the image of the noble BT. MAT WARD YOUR SPINELESS SACK OF FLESH AND BONE IS MINE!!!!
snake wrote:Imperial Fists (yeah I know I play DA). I really like the whole IF culture and Dorn is my favorite primarch. I plan to do a big IF project (An entire company or so of True Scale) once I'm done with DA.
I have to actually agree with that on all counts(though a company may be a bit excessive)
snake wrote:Imperial Fists (yeah I know I play DA). I really like the whole IF culture and Dorn is my favorite primarch. I plan to do a big IF project (An entire company or so of True Scale) once I'm done with DA.
Space Marines are already True Scale, it's everyone else that's out of whack.
I love this hero. That is the best Chaplain ever. Wielding a power weapon and a crozarus ha! best idea ever, and the helmet omg.
But my most favorite in fanmade is probably the Wanderers and in real 40k has to be the Dark Angels as well. old prehersey black for the win.
But prehersey thousand sons was awesome.
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
CoughcoughIroncageCoughcough.
Coughcough Ultramarines kicked your ass Coughcough
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
CoughcoughIroncageCoughcough.
Coughcough Ultramarines kicked your ass Coughcough
Way to change the subject. And I play both Ultramarines and Iron Warriors, so that counts as a victory for me.
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
CoughcoughIroncageCoughcough.
Coughcough Ultramarines kicked your ass Coughcough
Way to change the subject. And I play both Ultramarines and Iron Warriors, so that counts as a victory for me.
I didn't change the subject, i just listed one of your pitfalls...
So you play Ultramarines and IW, do ya want a cookie?
Oh and who still has a homeworld? We do... (Yes, Terra does count)
Commissar Typhus wrote:Imperial Fists, they dont take s**t from anyone, dont need fluff to make them badass, and of course, Lysander, the S 10 SS eternal warrior goodness
Actually, the Imperial Fists take a lot of s*** from the Iron Warriors.
We dont take s**t from Iron Warriors, just bolter shells and Demolisher Rounds
So you dont recall the story of how Lysander got free, you know, how he broke out of an Iron Warriors prison and escape the planet with his bare hands?
Dont even try to mention Storm of Iron, 50 ImpFists vs over 100 Iron Warriors and DP?
Oh and the incident during the Heresy where you supposeldy bled us dry on at the Iron Cage, well, we still got to the middle didnt we?
CoughcoughIroncageCoughcough.
Coughcough Ultramarines kicked your ass Coughcough
Way to change the subject. And I play both Ultramarines and Iron Warriors, so that counts as a victory for me.
I didn't change the subject, i just listed one of your pitfalls...
So you play Ultramarines and IW, do ya want a cookie?
Oh and who still has a homeworld? We do... (Yes, Terra does count)
Medrengard. And yes, I would greatly appreciate a cookie.
I would give you a cookie but I dont trust a traitor with one
Im gonna leave it at this, we may kick our asses kicked once in a while in fluff, but we are still epic. (Not to mention one of the hardest Codex chapters to paint)
Blood Ravens, Raven Guard, Dark Angels, Pre-Heresy Thousand Sons, Imperial Fists, Blood Angels, Crimson Fists, Black Templar, and Ultramarines.... What can I say? Space Marines are amazing... Just noticed most of my chapters suffered horrible tragedies... (p.s. I am suprised no Angry Marines came up.)
even though I'm not too familiar with them I'd probably have to say Salamanders- all smiths, lots of flame weapons, forsaking the hit and run units for powerhouse infantry, and they don't appear to have this all high and mighty approach when it comes to doing what needs to be done.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Asherian Command wrote:
Eclno wrote:Dark Angels, because of this gent.
I love this hero. That is the best Chaplain ever. Wielding a power weapon and a crozarus ha! best idea ever, and the helmet omg.
But my most favorite in fanmade is probably the Wanderers and in real 40k has to be the Dark Angels as well. old prehersey black for the win.
But prehersey thousand sons was awesome.
I'm all for suped-up chaplains wielding extra power weapons but I have to disagree on the helmet, it looks to Ranger-ish to me
Salamanders. When I first bought my space marine codex, I looked through it and was like "hmm I like the green guys. I'm going to play them". Little did I know that everyone and their mother uses vulkan.
In canon, I love the Salamanders' humanity and humility, the Space Wolves' attitude (eat, drink, and go whoring, for tomorrow we may die... on a wolf) the Crimson Fists' refusal to lay down and die (What? An entire Chapter reduced to just 15 men in their first appearance? And they still get sh** done? Epic.). I also give props to the Imperial Fists for having the paint job that is among the least complicated, yet still most difficult to paint. Kudos, gentlemen.
For Traitors, it's the Thousand Sons all the way. I love the look of their post-Heresy armor, and I love the undead vibe they give off.
But my favoritest SM Chapter of them all is the one I created myself back in 1995 when I first came to 40K: The Emperor's Eagles. Been running them for 16 years, and I don't plan to stop.
1. Knights of Blood (everyone who realy knows me (a bit) knows why)
2. Blood Angels (the army that got me in 40k. Need I say more why?)
3. Grey Knights ( cool looks)
4. Black Templars (cool looks.. Well, black is cool..)
5. Flesh Tearers (most mean looking colour scheme. Ever)
There is a lot of the Scions of Sanguinius in this list, I see..
The Flesh Tearers for me. A chapter untrustworthy amongst allies and itself, one chapter master giving his all to stop the maddness, and become a chapter worth being honored.
there actually the vets of all and any chapters except GK and can be anyone,from a scout to a honour guard,techmarine,librarian,chaplain,anything.only a chapter master can say no and you have to stay for a certain time period.they were black.their left pad has something similar to grey knights but instead of a book its a gold skull and cross bones over a silver Inquisitiopn sign with engraved script.their left arm is silver and the right shoulder contains the colours and symbol of the chapter they were recruited from
no its a chapter in itself.recruiting from each chapter but the GK because GK are secret and cant be reveiled to anyone and stuff.they are a real chapter.the members are hand picked by the master who is a inquisitor IIRC
dont know them.i won a poster with a space marine for all the chapters on it.theres only 100,red scorpians not ther niether are carcarodons cause ther forge world
Viersche wrote:Black Templars even if they are fanatical, self righteous and lack a certain degree of common sense sometimes.
I gotta admit, Black Templars are pretty ballin'. Though, I am a tiny bit of a SW fan as well.
Then again, I pretty much hate the imperium, so it's all good.
I have to go with Imperial Fists, sure they don't have much written about them in the fluff, but when they do show up it's often because they are about to do something iimportant. Also consider when the Ultramarine's were nowhere to be found during the Hersey, who was it that the Emperor of Mankind leaned upon to defend Terra from the Traitors?
That's right the boys in Yellow and Gold.
While fundamentally they are not much different then any of the other SM's in the fluff, and on the tabletop they are vanilla marines to the core, unlike the Salamanders they have no siege warfare perks, imagine if they got meltaguns and lascannons at a discount, oh that would be nice.... sorry ranting,... however on the tabletop they look spectacular when done even moderately well compared to most of the chapter schemes that are out.
..joking of corse*dont pull out the heavy flamer please* 
), the ones that marines are marketed to, and when arguably 
?
old prehersey black for the win.
