There've been a lot of threads recently that have been discussing various aspects of GW policy based on secrecy. What with WD not being shipped to third party stores to prevent early release, not showing hints of what's going to be released until at most one month before in WD, and even then scant information or pictures. If certain rumours are to be believe, we'll not get shots of or information on new releases until one week before release date, and mail subscription customers of WD will get their copy a week later than stores, to prevent early access.
Now, as someone who spends more than he should on minis, I appreciate seeing what's coming in terms of miniatures. It builds up a nice anticipation, and gets me excited about new products hitting the market. Aside from GW games, I currently play Warmachine and Dystopian Wars. Both PP and Spartan are in the habit of previewing existing releases, and more that one I've pre-ordered stuff from them, and set aside money to purchase new releases in my monthly budget. As a retailer, I've always seen the value in pre-orders, as they represent guaranteed sales and a marvellous way of anticipating the popularity of an item. I can't see any reason not to build up hype for a new product.
Please note, I'm not ranting against GW here. Whilst I do not agree with their business practices, they don't infuriate me either. What I'm asking is, can anyone see a good reason for GW's inordinately high desire for secrecy?
Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
I like to laugh at these folks. They make my time at Dakka all the more enjoyable.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
Has anyone actually made this argument? Like, for reals?
Knowing that GW will make a model should prevent 3rd party kitbashes like the Chapterhouse not-Tervigon or all the gazillion not-Thunderwulf cav models to some extent; why try to ramp up production if the 'real deal' is going to hit shelves, etc.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
Has anyone actually made this argument? Like, for reals?
Knowing that GW will make a model should prevent 3rd party kitbashes like the Chapterhouse not-Tervigon or all the gazillion not-Thunderwulf cav models to some extent; why try to ramp up production if the 'real deal' is going to hit shelves, etc.
If GW releases the model first, it has better grounds to argue IP. If all they have is a verbal concept in a book somewhere, but no physical model to back it up, it makes the issue a bit trickier. Technically, if a model doesnt exist, then it cant be copied, that kinda thing.
1.) Some people in higher management are furious at early leaks. This is an emotional response.
2.) They try to rationalize it by argueing that GW products are things you buy on impulse, because you want them, not because you actually need them (like e.g. food). So GW wants to give customers less time to think about a purchase before rationality kicks in.
3.) It won't work. Restricting marketing/advertising/information/word-of-mouth has been one cause for the decline of customer numbers. A total information boycott will only accelerate the decline.
Yeah, the 'official' stated reason for the secrecy is that GW believe that we all have the attention span of goldfish, and so if they let us know what they're working on more than a week before release, we'll all have lost interest by the time we're supposed to be mobbing the store to buy it.
Whether or not that's actually backed up by sales figures is anyone's guess.
The letter they put out recently to people who wrote in and complained about finecast and other issues said the secrecy is used to build hype and excitement for upcoming releases.
I can't even begin to describe just how hilarious I find them trying to seriously explain that not telling people what you're releasing is the best way to get them excited about it.
Yep, I sure am excited for whatever it is they're releasing next month! Oh boy oh boy! Even though I have no clue what it is, I'm totally going to rush to my FLGS and buy it, that's how excited I friggin' am!
How the hell is one supposed to get excited about something when one doesn't even know what it is? I can't imagine this will increase impulse buys except...
well, except amongst little kids with no self-control. Which is GW's main focus. So actually, I guess this is brilliant on their part.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
Has anyone actually made this argument? Like, for reals?
Knowing that GW will make a model should prevent 3rd party kitbashes like the Chapterhouse not-Tervigon or all the gazillion not-Thunderwulf cav models to some extent; why try to ramp up production if the 'real deal' is going to hit shelves, etc.
I think it's simply a form of advertisement. Putting a tight lid on any info makes for rampant speculation and wild-guessing.
Coupled with the seemingly inevitable (or even unofficially endorsed!) leaks that allow for bits of info to seep out into the community one by one, this keeps a specific topic "hot" for several months and thus creates a great sense of anticipation.
Has anyone actually made this argument? Like, for reals?
Sometimes my ironiometer goes blinky on the internet but yes.
It has been claimed several times at least to my knowledge.
This has been a bemusement and bafflement to me as long as I have been on Dakka and much argued the toss about it.
But apparently GW know what they are doing. So I have been repeatedly told.
Dan Brown is currently writing another best seller with the protagonist dashing around European cultural centres looking for clues for the next GW release.
Masons, Templars, cognicenti &c The usual suspects.
Difference is this one is non-fiction and this time it all based on fact!
I was joking around the ideia of build an army of space dwarfs (full converted from mantic+GW), or an army of Sisters of Battle (after the buzz around the new WD codex).
Mantic released their agenda for six months, declaring the release of warpath, and my beloved space dwarf (in no less than 3 months)
GW dont showed anything except mistery about the new sisters codex, and the new models (if any) will cost more than the metal old ones (so say the rumors, that GW dont talk about).
So, what means that? Means i will save my money and buy forgefathers when they come out, until there i will play with converted models i alredy own and burrowed vehicles.
GW secrecy made them lost a costumers to another company. Great market strategy, should work with kids...
Oh, just remembered how i got excited about GK when they came out last time, and how i saved money to buy a squad, and how i felt cheated when they released 5 mans in a box, for the price of 10.
Reading some of Worglock's other posts, I wouldn't say he's joking. Either trolling, or he's a good, obedient Hobbyist, who realizes the truth, that GW provides the finest toy soldiers in the world at a fair price, not to mention their superb rule systems and complete respect for their customers.
Worglock wrote:It's because people like you are bad for the hobby and they want you to go play Warmafail.
This right here, this is what a bad post looks like.
(post) + Personal attack + (instance of usage of the word fail) x (portmanteaus utilizing "fail") = bad post
Dwarf Wolf explained why in his experience the secrecy policy doesn't work. Which to me sounds reasonable
The irony is that people like Dwarf Wolf are actually good for the hobby, though not for THE Hobby
Also the attempt to denegrate another games system with the portmanteau was the fail, rather than the game itself.
If uninteresting thread is so uninteresting, are you here just to proclaim yourself as messiah and the one true prophet of THE one true Hobby?
altogether He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy.
Read the OP again 9000th incarnation of GW Secrecy thread has a reason. Apart from which if GW weren't so paranoid the 1st GW secrecy thread would not have seen the light of day.
Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Because paranoid toy soldier maker is paranoid.
If uninteresting thread is so uninteresting, are you here just to proclaim yourself as messiah and the one true prophet of THE one true Hobby?
altogether He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy.
Read the OP again
9000th incarnation of GW Secrecy thread has a reason.
Apart from which if GW weren't so paranoid the 1st GW secrecy thread would not have seen the light of day.
Wut?
So, tell me, in all honesty, what *exactly* have you accomplished, or more accurately *failed to accomplish* in the previous 9000+ threads about GW secrecy that requires the dead horse to be flogged again?
And yes, I'm the one true prophet. Now buy me a Dark Elf army.
Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Because paranoid toy soldier maker is paranoid.
If uninteresting thread is so uninteresting, are you here just to proclaim yourself as messiah and the one true prophet of THE one true Hobby?
altogether He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy.
Read the OP again
9000th incarnation of GW Secrecy thread has a reason.
Apart from which if GW weren't so paranoid the 1st GW secrecy thread would not have seen the light of day.
Wut?
So, tell me, in all honesty, what *exactly* have you accomplished, or more accurately *failed to accomplish* in the previous 9000+ threads about GW secrecy that requires the dead horse to be flogged again?
And yes, I'm the one true prophet. Now buy me a Dark Elf army.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Wait... he just said "Previous 9000+ threads".
9000+ = Over 9000!!!
We're being trolled by someone using base-level 4Chan memes.
No, no, no, you just don't get it cuz you're a whining kiddie.
Only a brilliant, mature genius could come up with "Warmafail".
If there was a "eye-roll" Orkmoticon, it'd go here.
There's a wink one. That usually satisfies when someone intends a sarcastic/ironic comment.
As to GW's supposed 'secrecy'... what are they keeping secret? We know about Sisters. We have Necron rumors. There was even the whole '6th Edition rumors' tripe going around for a bit. The only thing they've been successful in doing is keeping people from getting White Dwarf, and some stockists are even ignoring that!
DaNewBoy wrote:There are quite a few cry babies on this forum.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.
Crybabies? Really?
The people who complain are the ones who care the most. They don't want to see the worlds and games they enjoy be ruined by corporate mistakes. It's the people who stop complaining who need to be worried about, since they've just stopped caring.
RatBot wrote:If there was a "eye-roll" Orkmoticon, it'd go here.
You mean:
Errr... Yes. I somehow missed that one.
The people who complain are the ones who care the most. They don't want to see the worlds and games they enjoy be ruined by corporate mistakes. It's the people who stop complaining who need to be worried about, since they've just stopped caring.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Wait... he just said "Previous 9000+ threads".
9000+ = Over 9000!!!
We're being trolled by someone using base-level 4Chan memes.
No, no, no, you just don't get it cuz you're a whining kiddie.
Only a brilliant, mature genius could come up with "Warmafail".
If there was a "eye-roll" Orkmoticon, it'd go here.
There's a wink one. That usually satisfies when someone intends a sarcastic/ironic comment.
As to GW's supposed 'secrecy'... what are they keeping secret? We know about Sisters. We have Necron rumors. There was even the whole '6th Edition rumors' tripe going around for a bit. The only thing they've been successful in doing is keeping people from getting White Dwarf, and some stockists are even ignoring that!
DaNewBoy wrote:There are quite a few cry babies on this forum.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.
Crybabies? Really?
The people who complain are the ones who care the most. They don't want to see the worlds and games they enjoy be ruined by corporate mistakes. It's the people who stop complaining who need to be worried about, since they've just stopped caring.
Yes, and all the boo-hooing will fix that.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
H.B.M.C. wrote:They're just overflowing right now, aren't they?
Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
I don't have to be happy with the way things are going with GW to still be able to be 1) An adult and 2) enjoy playing a game and having fun with friends.
If you let corporate antics flip your "Piss poor" attitude switch every time they do something you don't like, you are in for a long miserable life. You may as well try to stop air, or kill yourself. It's all about the bottom line, not benevolence. Sorry to be one to inform you, and oh yea, there isn't a Santa Clause either.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
Yes, Boo-hooing won't change anything. I suppose we're getting spoiled, you know, with all the other gaming companies that actually listen to their customer base and treat them with at least a modicum of respect.
Showing information/plans/designs ahead of time is also good for feedback. If the vast majority of folks don't like something, you can still change it. but you won't ever see them change something AFTER it's been released. Unless an update rolls around.
GW strikes me as the company that spends weeks developing something (in secret), and then unveils whatever it is, and just expect you to buy it, because you didn't know what it was, and now you do.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
Yes, Boo-hooing won't change anything. I suppose we're getting spoiled, you know, with all the other gaming companies that actually listen to their customer base and treat them with at least a modicum of respect.
All they care about is your money. Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get. Yeah you can get "costumer service" if your Ipod is defective, but in the larger picture, they don't give a crap you, just your money.
You can wish in one hand and crap in the other and you'll see which fills up faster.
DaNewBoy wrote:Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
And aren't you Mr... uhh... no wait I don't know who you are.
Because you're very new and very vocal and can join the train of GW fanbois who appear to have shown up over the past day or two, all with the same litany of nonsense. Get in line.
Ah, well. At least when the inevitable Dakka-based nuclear holocaust between the Alliance of the White Knights and the Underground Resistance of Semi-Organized Hatred goes off, we'll still have the other subforums to retreat to!
Flames of War, anyone? Malifaux? Infinity?
-----------------------
Goddard,
Wasn't the new approach for White Dwarf supposed to have the last page be a 'teaser' page for whatever big release was next month?
If so, then at least there's a bit of a warning. And (hopefully) whatever local FLGS people go to don't require them to purchase the catalog if they want to check the next page.
-----------------------
All they care about is your money. Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get. Yeah you can get "costumer service" if your Ipod is defective, but in the larger picture, they don't give a crap you, just your money.
First, try to get your perspective correct. I didn't say Apple, I said other wargaming companies. And I didn't mention money either, did I?
So, let's see what I did talk about. Listening to your customer base? Well, Privateer Press is well known for their actions before they released mk.II by allowing their customer base to play test the rules, and responded in kind to feedback.
Spartan Games actually went overboard when listening to their customers when The Uncharted Seas was their only game. In an attempt to keep everyone happy, they actually released too many FAQs. They've backed off a bit, but Spartan Games employees (important ones) still frequent their forums.
And what about Wyrd? Well, people were complaining about the massive amount of FAQ and errata the game had since its release. So Wyrd released a mini-rulebook, for $15. Or you could download the full game rules online for free as a PDF.
So, you know what? If, in the end, it's all about the money, then that's fine. But I'll give my money and attention to the companies that actually interact and respect their costumers. And I'll encourage new people coming into the hobby to do likewise.
Oh, and I forgot respect, as well! Let's see, back to Privateer Press. Recently, they announced that since such a massive influx of sales has come in, they'll be delaying their August releases to help get out the orders they have yet to fulfill. They were upfront, apologetic, and sincere (or came off as so). The release was generally met with positive responses, with many people happy that Privateer Press was doing so well.
DaNewBoy wrote:Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
And aren't you Mr... uhh... no wait I don't know who you are.
Because you're very new and very vocal and can join the train of GW fanbois who appear to have shown up over the past day or two, all with the same litany of nonsense. Get in line.
Booo-Hooo-hooo, I want my way!
If a "fanboi" is someone who doesn't live in a fantasy world where crying and name calling is how to get your way, then with pride.
You enjoy your "daycare lady won't let me swing" tactics and, "I've got more time to be on forums so my opinion has more weight then yours" rhetoric 1, 2 combo.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
Yes, Boo-hooing won't change anything. I suppose we're getting spoiled, you know, with all the other gaming companies that actually listen to their customer base and treat them with at least a modicum of respect.
All they care about is your money. Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get. Yeah you can get "costumer service" if your Ipod is defective, but in the larger picture, they don't give a crap you, just your money.
You can wish in one hand and crap in the other and you'll see which fills up faster.
Of course they don't care about us. But a lot of companies at least pretend to appreciate their customers. GW instead seems to treat their customers as enemies, actively insulting them while they expect money from them.
And I think infinite_array calling us haters "Semi-Organized" is a bit too generous. :p
Wasn't the new approach for White Dwarf supposed to have the last page be a 'teaser' page for whatever big release was next month?
If so, then at least there's a bit of a warning. And (hopefully) whatever local FLGS people go to don't require them to purchase the catalog if they want to check the next page.
I don't subsribe to WD, but I don't think that is enough time to change anything anyway,
Ah, well. At least when the inevitable Dakka-based nuclear holocaust between the Alliance of the White Knights and the Underground Resistance of Semi-Organized Hatred goes off, we'll still have the other subforums to retreat to!
Flames of War, anyone? Malifaux? Infinity?
-----------------------
Goddard,
Wasn't the new approach for White Dwarf supposed to have the last page be a 'teaser' page for whatever big release was next month?
If so, then at least there's a bit of a warning. And (hopefully) whatever local FLGS people go to don't require them to purchase the catalog if they want to check the next page.
-----------------------
All they care about is your money. Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get. Yeah you can get "costumer service" if your Ipod is defective, but in the larger picture, they don't give a crap you, just your money.
First, try to get your perspective correct. I didn't say Apple, I said other wargaming companies. And I didn't mention money either, did I?
So, let's see what I did talk about. Listening to your customer base? Well, Privateer Press is well known for their actions before they released mk.II by allowing their customer base to play test the rules, and responded in kind to feedback.
Spartan Games actually went overboard when listening to their customers when The Uncharted Seas was their only game. In an attempt to keep everyone happy, they actually released too many FAQs. They've backed off a bit, but Spartan Games employees (important ones) still frequent their forums.
And what about Wyrd? Well, people were complaining about the massive amount of FAQ and errata the game had since its release. So Wyrd released a mini-rulebook, for $15. Or you could download the full game rules online for free as a PDF.
So, you know what? If, in the end, it's all about the money, then that's fine. But I'll give my money and attention to the companies that actually interact and respect their costumers. And I'll encourage new people coming into the hobby to do likewise.
Oh, and I forgot respect, as well! Let's see, back to Privateer Press. Recently, they announced that since such a massive influx of sales has come in, they'll be delaying their August releases to help get out the orders they have yet to fulfill. They were upfront, apologetic, and sincere (or came off as so). The release was generally met with positive responses, with many people happy that Privateer Press was doing so well.
And I'm positive ABSOLUTELY everybody was happy. And probably all held hands and sang together and had a bar-b-que and before everyone got into their sleeping bags after smores to get some sleep they all got into a circle and touched each other.
The companies on a large scale don't care. It would be easier for smaller companies to pan handle to their customer base, but for the most part they are stepping stones and when the companies grow up and become big boys and girls, it'll be the same story different chapter. And you'll be on some forum somewhere shocked and amazed at how they only care about making money and not keeping your diaper poopy free and ranting about the good ole circle jerk days.
Your fooling yourself and thats it. Like I said before, I'm not always happy with GE but I can still play a GAME and have fun if I want to.
Wasn't the new approach for White Dwarf supposed to have the last page be a 'teaser' page for whatever big release was next month?
If so, then at least there's a bit of a warning. And (hopefully) whatever local FLGS people go to don't require them to purchase the catalog if they want to check the next page.
I don't subsribe to WD, but I don't think that is enough time to change anything anyway,
Hm. Yeah, I don't think it would be enough time.
Then again, does GW actually listen to costumer feedback? And if they did, would they actually heed it?
You know, that would've been a great idea for Finecost. Send out a poll in one of the WDs, asking what models people would like to see come out in plastiresin, with options like 'Larger metal kits', 'smaller metal kits', 'everything metal' or 'nothing, please keep the metal'.
That would've stopped things like the Incubi and Mandrake packs going to plastiresin (honestly, they should've been multi-part plastic packs in the first place), and prevented Wracks coming out in the same material. But bigger, more annoying kits - Nurgle Daemon Prince, which I believe is the best example of what Finecost could have been. Oh, and Obliterators! - would be released in the new material. Any imperfections small enough to fix/ignore would have been offset by the ease of putting the new models together.
One wonders if the many GW apologists who basically demand that we all just accept what GW gives us like happy little automatons, do as we are told, and be grateful we even GET to play their fabulous games...do they demonstrate the same attitude towards all the other companies and services they receive?
"The water coming out of this tap has crap in it. We should phone the Water Company.... Or we should just STFU and be grateful they deign to provide us with any water at all. In fact the Water Company say this crap is actually the finest crap available to man."
"This I-item is buggy and does not work, and there are holes in the casing. I should just be grovellingly happy that I-company even bothered to make the I-item to start with. I certainly shouldn't complain about it."
In the rest of the real world, customer feedback, customer goodwill, advertising, marketing and complaints are all sensible grown-up things that adults become involved in in order to receive correct goods and services, and serious matters that companies pay attention to, because it affects their profits.
My apologies, Worglock, that this 9001 whining thread annoys you so much.
Please note, I'm not ranting against GW here. Whilst I do not agree with their business practices, they don't infuriate me either. What I'm asking is, can anyone see a good reason for GW's inordinately high desire for secrecy?
Who said that? Oh yes, it was me, in the first post. Which, sadly, seems to have been misunderstood by some people who were perhaps a bit too ready to leap to GW's defence.
Now I know it's easy to become very attached to a company that produces something you love, and I know that there's a lot of whining out there that is unjustified. However, this thread was started due to a genuine interest into the policies that GW has made which, as someone who has worked for many retail companies in his life, including GW, seem unusual and counterproductive. I was, perhaps naively, hoping for an intelligent approach to discussion on the subject. I was not looking to bash GW. So please, with respect, if you're going to post something defending the secrecy policy please make it something more relevant than just 'you're a whiner, shut up and buy your dollies.'
No need to apologise HTJ Your OP was reasonable and polite imho The guy is either trolling and/or attempting to be witty and failing miserably.
He has been doing the same across a few threads
Worglack Again read the OP instead of beating on about previous threads. Also cf my posts on the thread about NOT buying anymore GW stuff If I ain't buying for myself, why would I buy for a tedious child who obviously has far more cash than is respectable to keep GW shareholders happy. Any more trolling from you and the yellow button gets hit. Have been reluctant to so so up to now but enough is enough. If you have is a problem with the thread I suggest you also contact the Mods, though I suspect that if there was a problem it would have be locked already.
ArbeitsSchu wrote:One wonders if the many GW apologists who basically demand that we all just accept what GW gives us like happy little automatons, do as we are told, and be grateful we even GET to play their fabulous games...do they demonstrate the same attitude towards all the other companies and services they receive?
"The water coming out of this tap has crap in it. We should phone the Water Company.... Or we should just STFU and be grateful they deign to provide us with any water at all. In fact the Water Company say this crap is actually the finest crap available to man."
"This I-item is buggy and does not work, and there are holes in the casing. I should just be grovellingly happy that I-company even bothered to make the I-item to start with. I certainly shouldn't complain about it."
In the rest of the real world, customer feedback, customer goodwill, advertising, marketing and complaints are all sensible grown-up things that adults become involved in in order to receive correct goods and services, and serious matters that companies pay attention to, because it affects their profits.
Yes, Steve job looses sleep all the time over a costumer who just isn't satisfied enough. I hear, every time someone calls costumer service and complains, he guiltily burns all his money and tries to leave his wife.
I love how we are all just jumping right on this fantasy wagon of "Company X knows and cares about ME!"
Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers. GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot. Like I said, call Apple and play your 4 year old "I didn't get my way again" tactics on their advertisement and see how much they care then.
DaNewBoy wrote:Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers.
No, it's not. But it sure as hell isn't not giving a damn about them. And it's not just replacing faulty merchandise. It's supplying merchandise that isn't faulty to begin with. There's a word for companies that produce products without caring what the market thinks about them. Bankrupt.
Nope
We are not all jumping on any bandwagon
Some of us are talking from experience of dealing with other companies.
No they don't love us. We never said they do.
But they do behave courteously and treat customers with respect.
That is what is distinctly lacking from GW at present.
I don't mean the guys on the shop floor nor customer services. Which in any case is not relevant to this thread
So please, can we have less of the GW is "behaving like any other business" because they don't.
I have been reliably informed that Apple also employ the news blackout tactics.
Which is no justification for GW to do so.
DaNewBoy wrote:There are quite a few cry babies on this forum.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.
DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, and all the boo-hooing will fix that.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
H.B.M.C. wrote:They're just overflowing right now, aren't they?
Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
I don't have to be happy with the way things are going with GW to still be able to be 1) An adult and 2) enjoy playing a game and having fun with friends.
If you let corporate antics flip your "Piss poor" attitude switch every time they do something you don't like, you are in for a long miserable life. You may as well try to stop air, or kill yourself. It's all about the bottom line, not benevolence. Sorry to be one to inform you, and oh yea, there isn't a Santa Clause either.
DaNewBoy wrote:Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get.
DaNewBoy wrote:Booo-Hooo-hooo, I want my way!
If a "fanboi" is someone who doesn't live in a fantasy world where crying and name calling is how to get your way, then with pride.
You enjoy your "daycare lady won't let me swing" tactics and, "I've got more time to be on forums so my opinion has more weight then yours" rhetoric 1, 2 combo.
DaNewBoy wrote:And you'll be on some forum somewhere shocked and amazed at how they only care about making money and not keeping your diaper poopy free and ranting about the good ole circle jerk days.
DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, Steve job looses sleep all the time over a costumer who just isn't satisfied enough. I hear, every time someone calls costumer service and complains, he guiltily burns all his money and tries to leave his wife.
I love how we are all just jumping right on this fantasy wagon of "Company X knows and cares about ME!"
Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers. GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot. Like I said, call Apple and play your 4 year old "I didn't get my way again" tactics on their advertisement and see how much they care then.
Wow. That's what I call a 100% troll account. Almost no post without insulting fellow Dakka members, Please can a mod take care of that person?
1.) For some reason they hate leaks and perhaps believe that somehow, someone is going to beat them to the market with a similar miniature.
2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.
3.) They believe that this will increase impulse purchases of new shiny releases. I don't know anyone who buys their minis on impulse, my wargaming friends and I usually plan out what we want to buy. But I bet a lot of younger players do not do this and will buy the new shiny Necron/Sisters of Battle/Dark Eldar kit on impulse.
I'd have to agree that GW's impulse buy strategy is a farce. Red Shirts telling you to buy a new release 'because it looks cool' is what really indicates to me that is what they are going for. But you just don't impulse buy something thats in excess of 50$. It's too expensive for that kind of shopping.
Yeah, that's the other thing, when they're charging as much as they do for their minis, their product is outside the realm of an "impulse buy" for a lot of people. Even if I had a ton of money to waste... well, it doesn't mean I would.
Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.
Even the ten year olds at our library group go on the GW website, look at pics and stats as part of an army building project.
They are savvy enough to know that the cost is not cheap. I get told of their latest purchases always in the context of how they want the army to operate.
Don't ever recall them saying, "I bought the latest shiny cos it was so cool, I just had to have it."
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
I like to laugh at these folks. They make my time at Dakka all the more enjoyable.
Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up? Have there been any examples of a company doing this?
£15 is my limit for an impulse buy, it seems. But I won't even walk into a GW shop unless I want something, due to my distaste for the sales tactics the poor redshirts are forced to use.
But when I saw that necromancer on Dakka, I thought "He looks awesome! Plastic too? I'll get one!" and made time to go down to the local shop and pick one up. Rumour sites are free advertising for GW! Fans so rabid for a bit of information we spend hours chatting about it online are something that most companies would KILL for!
Goddard wrote:Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.
Heh, no, they wouldn't.) Or not all of them.
I sell a hell of a lot of games by showing parents that it's better for them to spend money on miniatures (painting, chesslike strategy and thinking, hand eye co-ord, socialization, math and reading) than on a video game. Younger generations have 0 money, it all comes from someone else.
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Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Even the ten year olds at our library group go on the GW website, look at pics and stats as part of an army building project.
They are savvy enough to know that the cost is not cheap. I get told of their latest purchases always in the context of how they want the army to operate.
Don't ever recall them saying, "I bought the latest shiny cos it was so cool, I just had to have it."
I find it's mostly the veterans who act this way. )
Yeah, the veterans have done all their planned purchases, and have more income. So a lot of times, they might be looking for something new and interesting. I know that's how I work!
Goddard wrote:Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.
Heh, no, they wouldn't.) Or not all of them.
I sell a hell of a lot of games by showing parents that it's better for them to spend money on miniatures (painting, chesslike strategy and thinking, hand eye co-ord, socialization, math and reading) than on a video game. Younger generations have 0 money, it all comes from someone else.
True, it really depends on the parents. But most of my friends parents, and parents I know in general, would not really spend this amount of money on this hobby. They would spend this kind of money on piano lessons, or the basketball team, etc. To them, this is just a very expensive game. They don't see it how we do.
mikhaila wrote:Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up?
Not really. I've seen Mystery and even Hobbs say it. I think even Kan mentioned it once, but he's not dumb enough to believe it (I hope).
Mystery and I both said it when the Tyranid codex was leaked and we hadn't seen pictures of the Tyrannofex/Tervigon.
My statement was something like "We likely haven't seen the models because they're the second wave" or something to that effect.
mikhaila wrote:Have there been any examples of a company doing this?
Of course not, because it's a ridiculous concept.
Not that ridiculous.
I could point at certain third parties that had begun showing WIPs before the end of the first year that Tyranids was released for certain beasties that have yet to receive kits.
RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.
Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...
RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.
Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...
The week thing is new, and I would be very surprised if we don't see it repealed.
Unless of course, they have some kind of information we don't about impulse buys that suggests a week before release is 'the sweet spot'.
I will be scared if they really do have some kind of information like that.
I should also clarify, before HBMC jumps all over my case, that Tyranids really has been a weird exception to the rule in terms of the 'wave' system.
It's mindboggling why we have yet to see a second wave.
RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.
Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...
Yeah, look at how terrible Spartan Games is doing. I mean, they showed us the Covenant ships already! Now their sales are going to tank because we've alr-
You know what? I can't even twist the logic to make it a bad thing. I cannot conceive it, let alone write it.
Like I said--we did see certain third party companies begin announcing their plans for Tyranid kits within months of the codex launch.
Or are we just pretending that the boatloads of Doom of Malan'tai, Swarmlord, Tyrannofex, Spore Pods, and Tervigon kits out there don't exist?
Were they available "before the Codex"? No. Were they based off GW's models? No.
The "secrecy" in this point came back to bite GW in the bum, because now their own model kits for these whenever they're released, will just be more noise in an already noisy room.
In my view a rather better idea of planning would be to have the new unit kits ready to go when the book is released. Capitalise on the excitement of the release, and the marketing and publicity surrounding it.
Instead, GW left a gap of a year between releasing the Tyranid book without Tervigons, Spods and Tyrannofexes, and any sign they might release the missing models. It's hardly brain surgery to think that players might want those units and go to other sources to get hold of them.
With the IT"S A SECRET policy, even if GW actually plan to release official models, no-one will know in advance. There isn't any reason for a Tyranid player to decide to wait for the GW kit.
As the SAS kind of say, Piss Poor Planning and Preparation Prevents Proper Performance.
Kilkrazy wrote:In my view a rather better idea of planning would be to have the new unit kits ready to go when the book is released. Capitalise on the excitement of the release, and the marketing and publicity surrounding it.
Instead, GW left a gap of a year between releasing the Tyranid book without Tervigons, Spods and Tyrannofexes, and any sign they might release the missing models. It's hardly brain surgery to think that players might want those units and go to other sources to get hold of them.
With the IT"S A SECRET policy, even if GW actually plan to release official models, no-one will know in advance. There isn't any reason for a Tyranid player to decide to wait for the GW kit.
Exactly. This isn't a case of "GW kept it secret because they didn't want someone to copy their model", it was a case of their standard "six month window" then biting them in the bum.
I still want to know why there has not been a second Tyranid wave yet.
Were their models too similar to what ended up being put out? Did they decide they didn't want to do the kits because they probably are removing the kits from the next Tyranid book? Is it because Tyranids are going to be in the starter set, with Swarmlords and Tervigons in there?
Da Boss wrote:Honestly Kan? I think it can't be anything other than disorganisation and incompetence. Too few creative people to do the work that is there.
This is the most likely explanation, but it's not like it's stopped them before right?
Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.
Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.
Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.
Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.
I'm curious as to how many members of Design and Development are actually sculptors responsible for doing the work.
It sounds kind of like movies, where you've got a few dozen jobs that nobody really knows what they do and when you look they're responsible for like handing out scripts or something of that nature.
As to GW's supposed 'secrecy'... what are they keeping secret? We know about Sisters. We have Necron rumors. There was even the whole '6th Edition rumors' tripe going around for a bit. The only thing they've been successful in doing is keeping people from getting White Dwarf, and some stockists are even ignoring that!
Oh dear, someone fell off the logic train. You realize that the necrons, sisters and 6th edition rumors came down the pipe BEFORE GW's recent clampdown on items and secrets, right?
ArbeitsSchu wrote:One wonders if the many GW apologists who basically demand that we all just accept what GW gives us like happy little automatons, do as we are told, and be grateful we even GET to play their fabulous games...do they demonstrate the same attitude towards all the other companies and services they receive?
"The water coming out of this tap has crap in it. We should phone the Water Company.... Or we should just STFU and be grateful they deign to provide us with any water at all. In fact the Water Company say this crap is actually the finest crap available to man."
"This I-item is buggy and does not work, and there are holes in the casing. I should just be grovellingly happy that I-company even bothered to make the I-item to start with. I certainly shouldn't complain about it."
In the rest of the real world, customer feedback, customer goodwill, advertising, marketing and complaints are all sensible grown-up things that adults become involved in in order to receive correct goods and services, and serious matters that companies pay attention to, because it affects their profits.
Yes, Steve job looses sleep all the time over a costumer who just isn't satisfied enough. I hear, every time someone calls costumer service and complains, he guiltily burns all his money and tries to leave his wife.
I love how we are all just jumping right on this fantasy wagon of "Company X knows and cares about ME!"
Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers. GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot. Like I said, call Apple and play your 4 year old "I didn't get my way again" tactics on their advertisement and see how much they care then.
Nice way to drag it to the extreme there, with a ridiculous proposition that bears no relevance to what people are actually saying. If giant globo-corps don't care about consumer goodwill, why is News International/Rupert Murdoch giving away newspapers free, and printing all manner of apologies and whatnot? Nobody is claiming that these companies care about individual customers, but they DO care about bad press, and falling sales, and all manner of other things that any company in the real world faces.
There is also an epic difference between "I didn't get my way." and making a legitimate complaint about the goods or services a company is providing.
ArbeitsSchu wrote:There is also an epic difference between "I didn't get my way." and making a legitimate complaint about the goods or services a company is providing.
This is a very important point to keep in mind in these sorts of discussions. People complaining about something, or stating that they dislike something, is not the same thing as 'throwing a tantrum'.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up? Have there been any examples of a company doing this?
Yeah, Chapterhouse made a much requested female Farseer only 17+ years after GW presented them in a Codex, they practically ninja'd them All current Tyranid stand-ins were done after Codex release though.
Gamezone released a corpse cart one or two months before GW.
But major point is that GW doesn't react to year long customer requests like e.g. female Farseers/Guard and doesn't reveal plans on doing essetial units like Tervigons either. So GW's fear of early pirate copies is an irrational response hurting GW sales.
carmachu wrote:Oh dear, someone fell off the logic train. You realize that the necrons, sisters and 6th edition rumors came down the pipe BEFORE GW's recent clampdown on items and secrets, right?
To be fair, half the 6th edition rumours have reputedly been posted as a REACTION to the new secrecy policy. Even if I don't really trust this new set of rumours.
Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.
Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.
I'm curious as to how many members of Design and Development are actually sculptors responsible for doing the work.
It sounds kind of like movies, where you've got a few dozen jobs that nobody really knows what they do and when you look they're responsible for like handing out scripts or something of that nature.
"So if you pick something up, that makes you a 'Grip' now?" (Or words to that effect) springs to mind. MST3k quote, as I recall.
DaNewBoy wrote:There are quite a few cry babies on this forum.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.
DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, and all the boo-hooing will fix that.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.
H.B.M.C. wrote:They're just overflowing right now, aren't they?
Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
I don't have to be happy with the way things are going with GW to still be able to be 1) An adult and 2) enjoy playing a game and having fun with friends.
If you let corporate antics flip your "Piss poor" attitude switch every time they do something you don't like, you are in for a long miserable life. You may as well try to stop air, or kill yourself. It's all about the bottom line, not benevolence. Sorry to be one to inform you, and oh yea, there isn't a Santa Clause either.
DaNewBoy wrote:Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get.
DaNewBoy wrote:Booo-Hooo-hooo, I want my way!
If a "fanboi" is someone who doesn't live in a fantasy world where crying and name calling is how to get your way, then with pride.
You enjoy your "daycare lady won't let me swing" tactics and, "I've got more time to be on forums so my opinion has more weight then yours" rhetoric 1, 2 combo.
DaNewBoy wrote:And you'll be on some forum somewhere shocked and amazed at how they only care about making money and not keeping your diaper poopy free and ranting about the good ole circle jerk days.
DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, Steve job looses sleep all the time over a costumer who just isn't satisfied enough. I hear, every time someone calls costumer service and complains, he guiltily burns all his money and tries to leave his wife.
I love how we are all just jumping right on this fantasy wagon of "Company X knows and cares about ME!"
Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers. GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot. Like I said, call Apple and play your 4 year old "I didn't get my way again" tactics on their advertisement and see how much they care then.
Wow. That's what I call a 100% troll account. Almost no post without insulting fellow Dakka members, Please can a mod take care of that person?
Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.
Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.
They'd need to not only sort out what the design guys make that is actually worth putting into production, then, out of that, figure out what is actually affordable to put into production. For example, rumours have been saying the Harpy is done, and has been done, for a long time. It's a plastic kit ready to go. They'd likely have quite a few models left ready to go waiting for a release slot, waiting for the greenlight to make that expensive plastic mold.
The amount of plastic molds being made for Space Marine accessory sprues probably eats into other ranges as well.
'We can make a new accessory sprue so we can give Blood Angels sculpted shoulderpads or we can get to work on that Harpy mold'
*checks Space Marine and Tyranid sales*
'Go with the accessory sprue'.
Apple is a big company that keeps its products secret until the last minute. Of course, for followers of tech blogs it is a very poorly kept secret, but the masses are taken very much by surprise when a new Apple product is released.
For example, the iPad 2 was announced on March 2, only 9 days before it went on sale on March 11. Many people were shocked, especially those who had bought theirs on March 1 (Apple eventually ended up giving refunds to these people) and iPad 1 sales between March 2-11 were drastically lower. Again, people who read engadget and gizmodo knew what was happening, but many/most did not. iPad 2's were sold out within hours.
Granted, Apple has built a name for itself on being 'cool', appeal to a much wider market and are over 1000 times GW's size, but they do have some superficial similarities.
GW's idea with secrecy is not to increase hype, but to decrease the lost sales between announcement and release: if you were in a GW store and knew the kit you wanted was going to be re-released in new and improved form next month, would you buy it? Most probably not. But if you didn't know, you might buy said model this month, AND buy the new shiny version next month because it is newer and shinier.
And, as others have said, long release previews can hurt sales as people are like 'o that model? i saw it 3 months ago and have been thinking about it, decided it doesn't fit in my army' or 'the stormdodo? everyone on the internet hates it so I'm not buying one'.
Not saying it works, but I am sure this is how GW is thinking.
Because playing the guessing game is fun! Who doesn't love to peice together Scant information and pictures to come up with an idea to what is coming out. I like to think this is tue case, GW playing little Guessing games with the customer, however sadly it is more likely due to their Paranoid lawyers.
I think they are because they want to be #1 at sales always. Like today, the staff couldn't tell me where the necron book was after it disapeared of the shelf.
GW's idea with secrecy is not to increase hype, but to decrease the lost sales between announcement and release: if you were in a GW store and knew the kit you wanted was going to be re-released in new and improved form next month, would you buy it? Most probably not. But if you didn't know, you might buy said model this month, AND buy the new shiny version next month because it is newer and shinier.
So are you saying that the stock of the older product by planning decreases to zero by the release of the update and GW are never left with the old ones?
And you spend your gaming budget on a new army to find out next week there will be some better designs
or that a new edition Army Book has nerfed the toys you just bought and you paid for something that is now obsolete
If you a good HHHobbyist of course it matters not a jot and you will gladly go back next week and buy load of the shiny new ones
Would be grateful if one of our store owners/employees in games store could explain the process and what happens to old stock on a new release please.
Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Next person to mention Apple gets put in a barrel an bobbed for by hungry polar bears
Next person to offer the astounding information that "GW is a busnuss" gets to join the Apple guy
ditto "niche" and "Porsche"
It is a business model though, and it is nothing new under the sun. Every company does it. I am under several NDAs at work because I get access to developer's tools, beta versions, and so forth that have not been released yet. I am under contract to never share any of that information. Apple is just one of the best well known companies that does this.
GW desperately want to be like Apple but the wargames industry will never be large enough or frankly serious enough. They want to be aggressive and corporate and apply the same approaches in business they see in fast moving technologies to their own approach. But half the time GW don't even understand advertising or the internet. That's why they have become so brutal and possessive over IP and think all this 'secrecy' is somehow deeply clever and impressive. That's what works for other industries, so it must work for them. But they are just making toy soldiers and the rest is puffed up self importance and aggrandisement by senior management. It's like senior management sorts feel a bit silly being in charge of a toy soldier company and want to feel they are running something so much more important.
Even allowing previews of their stuff their competitors can't 'get the jump' on them releasing their own stuff. Even GW know the turn around on design, sculpting, creating moulds and then producing, packaging and distributing figures.
The only time other manufactures have benefited from producing GW proxies isn't because they rushed a release from a GW preview to undercut GW's sales, it's because GW have released an official Codex and not bothered to make all the figures for long periods of time, sometimes even years. Who can they blame apart from themselves for that?
Howard A Treesong wrote:The only time other manufactures have benefited from producing GW proxies isn't because they rushed a release from a GW preview to undercut GW's sales, it's because GW have released an official Codex and not bothered to make all the figures for long periods of time, sometimes even years. Who can they blame apart from themselves for that?
This.
What has more negative effect on GW sales?
2 months of rumor mill, blurry pictures of sprues and box art, ridiculous MS-Word test codices released on the internet, and thousands of forum posts raging or praising the newest beautiful/horrible GW kit...
Lynata wrote:I think it's simply a form of advertisement. Putting a tight lid on any info makes for rampant speculation and wild-guessing.
Coupled with the seemingly inevitable (or even unofficially endorsed!) leaks that allow for bits of info to seep out into the community one by one, this keeps a specific topic "hot" for several months and thus creates a great sense of anticipation.
Much more than an official preview could.
Or at least I could see them thinking like that.
Or alternatively putting a tight lid on info makes people spend money on other things.
Howard A Treesong wrote:GW desperately want to be like Apple but the wargames industry will never be large enough or frankly serious enough. They want to be aggressive and corporate and apply the same approaches in business they see in fast moving technologies to their own approach. But half the time GW don't even understand advertising or the internet. That's why they have become so brutal and possessive over IP and think all this 'secrecy' is somehow deeply clever and impressive. That's what works for other industries, so it must work for them. But they are just making toy soldiers and the rest is puffed up self importance and aggrandisement by senior management. It's like senior management sorts feel a bit silly being in charge of a toy soldier company and want to feel they are running something so much more important.
Even allowing previews of their stuff their competitors can't 'get the jump' on them releasing their own stuff. Even GW know the turn around on design, sculpting, creating moulds and then producing, packaging and distributing figures.
The only time other manufactures have benefited from producing GW proxies isn't because they rushed a release from a GW preview to undercut GW's sales, it's because GW have released an official Codex and not bothered to make all the figures for long periods of time, sometimes even years. Who can they blame apart from themselves for that?
Tronbot2600 wrote:*It should be noted that I do not believe the crazy person theory I am about to throw out*
Maybe they're just trying to "The Producers" the whole thing, kill the miniatures, games, stores, etc. and live off the sweet, sweet IP juices.
If there was no overhead, a few higher ups could make a killing just licensing the IP.
...of course, without the miniatures game would the IP be worth a dime?
They are licensing it out to video games and they just released their first official full length animated film. I think their marketing is wrong, but that is what happens when you try to take something like 40K and take it form it's current set and try to bring it into the main stream. I mean the ultra marines movie was OK, but the story was bland, the voice acting was average, and the animation while very cool had room for improvement. However, try making an animated movie for the masses and then imagine someone who has never even heard of 40K and then trying to make a story that anyone can follow.
I mean an animated series of the Horus Heresy would be EPIC, and I think it could be done where someone could not know what 40K is and watch it and understand it.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.
I like to laugh at these folks. They make my time at Dakka all the more enjoyable.
I'm sure GW will have copyright on everything they release and therefore no-one would be allowed to copy design/names of stuff...
Kilkrazy wrote:I strongly doubt the IP would last 20 minutes without the wargamers to support it.
The Dawn of War video games made some money, but I agree their cash cow is in the game. However, it saddens me to think they have some very good original science fiction material that could be brought into some really awesome computer animated series, but they don't. Then again they'd probably ruin it and make it PG-13 anyway, and we all know to make a good 40K series it would have to be TV-MA. The marketing derpers will convince the producers that a larger audience will be met at PG-13.
Live action movies would be super expensive. Imagine if showtime or HBO or some other network allowed them to put out a TV-MA animated series, and I would still think the Horus Hersey is the best place to start. They could introduce the Emperor, the Space Marines, you could get a feel for it, then they could bring in Chaos and chapters would fall, and civil war.
I think their biggest problem would be a balance to please the fan boys (who would watch it anyway but complain) and the newbies who have never heard of 40K. Perhaps that is why they haven't tried to push for it yet. Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
I think it is hilarious those individuals bashing everyone complaining and then comparing how Apple doesn't care about customer feed back and neither should GW.
I will site only one example; does everyone remember when the iPod was first introduced? Yes good now does everyone remember what a customer had to do when the iPod’s battery went bust? No well Apple would actually tell them to buy a new iPod.......
What did the customers do? Well one count him ONE customer made a video about it and blasted it on the internet and ipod sales dropped and Apple came running to its knees to apologize for this "slight" misstep.
Now you can buy a new battery for your iPod not a completely new iPod.
Pael wrote:I think it is hilarious those individuals bashing everyone complaining and then comparing how Apple doesn't care about customer feed back and neither should GW.
I will site only one example; does everyone remember when the iPod was first introduced? Yes good now does everyone remember what a customer had to do when the iPod’s battery went bust? No well Apple would actually tell them to buy a new iPod.......
What did the customers do? Well one count him ONE customer made a video about it and blasted it on the internet and ipod sales dropped and Apple came running to its knees to apologize for this "slight" misstep.
Now you can buy a new battery for your iPod not a completely new iPod.
It had a 90 day warranty which was not end user replaceable. I know this because when the iPod first came out I was employed by an AASP and performed warranty work on everything Apple made. They never said buy a new iPod, unless it was out of warranty and even then you didn't buy a new one. You paid a nominal fee and traded in your broken one for a refurbished one, which was a lot cheaper than buying a brand new one. While I cannot say I fully agree with everything Apple does, having to support their products for over the past decade as my job, they have very good customer service. They just don't give two craps about enterprise customers, but if you are a consumer they will replace your computer.
Never, in my 12 years in IT, have ever seen a company besides apple replace a 3 year old machine with a brand new one because it had too long of a repair history and the extended warranty was about to run out. I have seen Apple do that over a dozen times. They just did it to my buddy's Macbook which was 6 months out of warranty but had so many repairs on it (Macbook 2007, they had cosmetic issues with that model) in a 3 year span, and it was like 5 total repairs, they just swapped him out a brand new Macbook at no cost.
I am not a fan boy either, just stating facts, as I have had to support Apple products for a decade now professionally. I also do PC/Windows/Linux/Unix as well, so I have many experiences with most major computer companies from my work buying their products.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
They already did. It's called "Aliens".
Badoom, tish!
Seriously though, you are right.
Actually someone did an awesome Space Hulk movie. It's on You Tube.
Crom wrote:Never, in my 12 years in IT, have ever seen a company besides apple replace a 3 year old machine with a brand new one because it had too long of a repair history and the extended warranty was about to run out.
Haven't seen that, specifically, but I did once see Nintendo replace a 10-year-old original Gameboy under warranty after the customer cracked the screen by accidentally driving over it with her car...
Oh, it was undoubtedly cheesy, but, well... it's 40K. Not just 40K, but a 40K movie done with miniatures and a hand held camera and no budget.
I haven't seen the comments but I imagine somewhere there's someone who's authentically upset that the Heavy Flamer didn't shoot fire and the Terminator referred to the Sergeant as "Sir" instead of "Brother-Sergeant".
Well think about it. They do a Horus Hersey animated series. Episode one starts in the middle of the civil war in a battle, with one of the primarchs and a chaos defector. Then it starts to tell the story of the Emperor and the Primarchs in flash backs as the series progresses. Giving you the full background. In between flash backs you can have specific stories for all 20 of the original Primarchs. Then you can see the birth of the Space Marine all the way to the death of them and how they slaughtered each other in civil war. You can see how outside forces influenced the Horus Heresy. Eldar, Dark Eldar, Squats (hahahaha for humor), Orks, and so forth .
I admit I am not familiar with the story past what GW has published. I never read any of the third party books. I want to read them some day, but I got a lot to read on my plate as far as fiction goes at the moment. I just think it would make a really awesome animated series. Plus it would be the golden age of technology.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
They already did. It's called "Aliens".
Badoom, tish!
Seriously though, you are right.
Actually someone did an awesome Space Hulk movie. It's on You Tube.
Yea...they glued that Sarcophogas upside down, gahahaha.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
Crom wrote:Heck they could even start out just doing a Space Hulk movie, that would be a good introduction that doesn't need a deep story line or a huge understanding of the 40K universe to pick up on.
They already did. It's called "Aliens".
Starship Troopers...
IG v Nids...
Nuff sed
Yes but Alien and Starship Troopers (which is an actual book) lacked the lore and mythos of the 40K world. No space Orks, Eldar, Chaos, Emperor, and so forth.
