Just have some questions about the Tau. How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat? I thought it to believe the incoming Tyranids but I've recently read that the Orks are trying to take over conquered Tau land. Thats where Commander Farsight is fighting supposedly trying to stop them.
The Imperium of man is composed of a million worlds covering most of the galaxy. The Tau Empire is one hundred worlds in a densely packed are of space.
coolyo294 wrote:In terms of size, comparing the Tau Empire to the Imperium of Man is like comparing a raindrop to an ocean.
Thats what I thought. I just wasn't sure because in all the fluf I've read it seems like the Tau Empire is growing FAST. So quickly and fast that some of the Eldar ae impressed with them.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Thanks for the imge that was absolutely perfect.
The Tau Empires consists, at least during the Taros war, of about 100 planets and colonies. This number seems to have grown during the 13. Black Crusade but exact numbers are hard to come by.
The Tau Empire is threatened by the Tyranids ( which threaten pretty much everything at the Eastern Fringe ) and of course the Orks ( The War of Dakka...).
The Imperium of Man seems to be uninterested in large scale warfare with the Tau Empire, at least for the moment.
It's tiny. about 100 worlds. It's actually only one very dense cluster. Orks are the biggest threat right now. You would think it would be the Tyranids, but last I checked that fleet only took 1 and a half worlds. Orks are more common.
coolyo294 wrote:In terms of size, comparing the Tau Empire to the Imperium of Man is like comparing a raindrop to an ocean.
This was just to sweet not to laugh at
But in all seriousness, Tau have 100+ worlds. But only 20+ or more have population of a Hive city ( the rest have population from few million to few billion probably ). Tau Empire is now ok, but constant Ork raids is starting to amuse them and there is some Tyranids out there, lurking in the dark...
The biggest threat to the Tau now is Humanity. Aldo Humans don't see Tau as a threat ( they are after all in peace, and Imperium is fighting hard to keep that peace ) but Tau may only see Humans as an obstacle to their domain. Since Tau still thinks that Humans are not that big, and have no knowledge of the Chaos whatsoever ( they killed one Grater Daemon and they thought that they kill Tzenetz ).
Before traitor Beff and others arrive, let me say that any other Tau-Imperium conflicts will be resolved in Iron Hammer and 6'th editions of Black Templars and Tau codex. Until then I will say not a word on the subject anymore...
the Tau were expanding rapidly, but have hit a wall so to speak.
their method of Warp Travel limits the distance they can reach with their jumps.
the worlds they now control are in a very tightly packed cluster of stars. all the nearest stars beyond their cluster are too far to reach, with the exception of the Democles gulf(which is still a massive jump)
the Tau are basically stuck where they are at the moment. Many of the races they have subjugated have the ability for true warp travel but have managed to keep it from the Tau.
The Tau, being a race of psychic neutrals, have no Psykers and as such can't use true warp travel. they would require a subjugated rac with psykers to be able to do this(and the psychic races they have taken over have managed to keep this from the Tau)
Farsight is removed from the Tau, but he did and still does fight many orks. It is hard to what their biggest threat is, but personnally I would say nids.
There's not any mention of the Tau expansions coming to a grinding halt, if anything they seem to be expanding without even stopping for breaks.
The 5th Edition Tyranid codex hints at the largest conflict between the two races to date, which will most likely be fleshed out in Tau 5th Ed. I highly doubt a massive reclamation effort was sent to wipe the Tau out for being stagnant.
Given that the Tau are constantly running into new races, it is highly unlikley their campaign has slowed down at all. Given the Imperium's sheer size, I doubt anyone even cares outside of local PDF and PGs.
Brother Coa wrote:Aldo Humans don't see Tau as a threat ( they are after all in peace, and Imperium is fighting hard to keep that peace ) but Tau may only see Humans as an obstacle to their domain.
Not so sure on that - the Imperium had already planned the destruction of the Tau when they were still at stone age tech-level. But when the Imperial ship arrived a couple millennia later (talkin 'bout red tape!) the Tau had suddenly developed into a spacefaring race capable of resisting that attack. The IoM grumbled a bit but thought the Tau weren't worth the hassle, so they delayed an armed response ... only to realize this was a mistake when the Tau Empire suddenly began making contact to human colonies near their Septs and making them switch sides. So they sent an all-out Crusade fleet. But after some initial success that one was repelled, too, the Imperials forced to negotiate peace as their advance grinded to a halt and they were losing more and more troops to the advanced weaponry of the Tau.
I'm sure the Imperium sees something that keeps resisting its attacks and continueing to be a border nuisance as a threat. It's just that there are bigger threats right now that deserve more attention, and the massive forces that would be required to break the Tau cannot be redeployed from elsewhere without serious destabilization and the potential loss of many worlds to another enemy that would exploit this weakness in the Imperium's defence.
In short, the Tau are to the Imperium what a stain on your shirt is whilst your house is on fire. But they do not ignore them because they don't care.
(I guess this might even be what you were trying to say, but it came off as a bit misleading, so this here is just meant for clarification)
BeefCakeSoup wrote:The 5th Edition Tyranid codex hints at the largest conflict between the two races to date, which will most likely be fleshed out in Tau 5th Ed. I highly doubt a massive reclamation effort was sent to wipe the Tau out for being stagnant.
Hive Fleet Gorgon attacked/was attacked by the Tau, but they've had numerous wars with the Orks.
The way that the Tau codex waffles on about them, I'm going to say Orks are the biggest threat to them at the moment. As soon as the Tyranids are dealt with and the Imperium comes back for the Damacoles Gulf, then I'd say it would be the Imperium.
The Tau have had conflicts with pretty much all the major players. Like everyone else - the Tau are fighting on multiple fronts but in a small area so can focuss their defences better.
Tryanid fleets remain a threat
Orks keep attacking
the Imperium has an increasingly fortified border but has bigger things to worry about
The Necrons "saved" a Tau world only to devour the population
The Dark Eldar enjoyed a major raid into Tau space taking many many captives. They had first folled the tau into thinking they were there to help against the Tryanids.
Chaos has had minor incursions but the Tau have thus far been spared the worst
Eldar have had little contact I can see but think they are important
Kroothawk wrote:Tau don't have Hive cities, they are not numerous enough.
He was talking population size
And so is Kroothawk, 'they are not numerous enough' is directly talking about how the Tau do not have any world with a level of population coming close to the population of an imperial hive city.
Kroothawk wrote:Tau don't have Hive cities, they are not numerous enough.
He was talking population size
And so is Kroothawk, 'they are not numerous enough' is directly talking about how the Tau do not have any world with a level of population coming close to the population of an imperial hive city.
I didn't even said anything about that. I only compared them to the most familiar thing with Humanity.
Kroothawk wrote:Tau don't have Hive cities, they are not numerous enough.
He was talking population size
And so is Kroothawk, 'they are not numerous enough' is directly talking about how the Tau do not have any world with a level of population coming close to the population of an imperial hive city.
Kroothawk was saying they don't have hive cities because they aren't numerous enough. Coa said that 20+ planets have the popluation of hive cities. He never said they would have hive cities if they did have the numbers which is what Kroothawk implied.
what he meant was that theu Tau have 20ish planets with population comparative to a single Hive city in the Imperium. Hive Cities are usually found in their dozens on Hive Worlds.
so the Tau have a tiny population with only a few planets having anywhere close to a few billion people.
Alright from doing a little bit of research on the Tau. (By the way I do have a sizeable Tau army but I really never got into their fluff like my other amies) I have seen online that the Eldar actually admire the Tau and how they have expanded so far. Im not sure which leader of the Eldar said it, but they had stated that they were "imopressed" by the Tau and their culture. Could that be a future thing for 40k fluff do you think? In all senses it seems more then possible.
iproxtaco wrote:Eldrad mentioned that he felt protective of them. He saw that they could do good in the galaxy in their future.
Possible plot twist when the new Tau codex comes out? Me thinks yes
Plot twist would be if Greater Good was a sham. If they actually did something for the sake of the universe it would just be continuing with the Tau actually being goody goody and ruining the Grimdarkness we all love
I hope they don't change the background. Something like this would be lame and disappointin:
"Oops, sorry folks. Forget everything you know about Tau. They are now like everyone else and mindlessly killing everything in sight."
Matt "Chaos Grey Knights" Ward wouldn't hesitate to do that, Phil Kelly and Robin Cruddace would.
Brother Coa wrote:Aldo Humans don't see Tau as a threat ( they are after all in peace, and Imperium is fighting hard to keep that peace ) but Tau may only see Humans as an obstacle to their domain.
Not so sure on that - the Imperium had already planned the destruction of the Tau when they were still at stone age tech-level. But when the Imperial ship arrived a couple millennia later (talkin 'bout red tape!) the Tau had suddenly developed into a spacefaring race capable of resisting that attack. The IoM grumbled a bit but thought the Tau weren't worth the hassle, so they delayed an armed response ... only to realize this was a mistake when the Tau Empire suddenly began making contact to human colonies near their Septs and making them switch sides. So they sent an all-out Crusade fleet. But after some initial success that one was repelled, too, the Imperials forced to negotiate peace as their advance grinded to a halt and they were losing more and more troops to the advanced weaponry of the Tau.
I'm sure the Imperium sees something that keeps resisting its attacks and continueing to be a border nuisance as a threat. It's just that there are bigger threats right now that deserve more attention, and the massive forces that would be required to break the Tau cannot be redeployed from elsewhere without serious destabilization and the potential loss of many worlds to another enemy that would exploit this weakness in the Imperium's defence.
In short, the Tau are to the Imperium what a stain on your shirt is whilst your house is on fire. But they do not ignore them because they don't care.
(I guess this might even be what you were trying to say, but it came off as a bit misleading, so this here is just meant for clarification)
Savage Scars goes into deeper detail about this. The Damocles Gulf Crusade did not end because the Tau defeated the Imperium(quite the contrary, while the Tau put up a stoic resistance, the Imperium was well on its way to taking the world of Dal'yth), it ended because Inquisitor Kryptman recalled the crusade fleet to the defense of Macragge. Its pretty much stated that the terms of the ceasefire/sort-of alliance of the two would last only as long as the Tyranid threat continued to exist, the Imperium having the resources to eliminate the entirety of the Tau Empire if it put the effort into it, but rather choosing to let the Tau continue because they are acting as a rearguard against Tyranid incursions on the Eastern Fringe, allowing the Imperium to divert its resources elsewhere.
Also, what I found hilarious is that several Imperials tried to convince the Tau that the Imperium has lasted for 10 millenia and encompasses something like two-thirds of the known galaxy, and the Tau wrote it off as posturing and exaggeration, refusing to believe that the Imperium could be so large and powerful.
As for current expansion, there is none. The Third Sphere expansion is over, and the Tau did not launch a fourth sphere. This was the result of the Medusa V campaign where the Tau were forced to abandon research into warp technology by order of the Ethereals, and were thus forced to call of the Fourth Sphere expansion. It even mentions something about that in the current codex, IIRC.
To sum it up, GW really didn't think things through when coming up with the size, composition, and role in the 40K universe when describing the Tau Empire.
Maybe, in the next Tau codex, they'll bite the bullet and massively retcon most of the Tau fluff.
Brother Coa wrote:Aldo Humans don't see Tau as a threat ( they are after all in peace, and Imperium is fighting hard to keep that peace ) but Tau may only see Humans as an obstacle to their domain.
Not so sure on that - the Imperium had already planned the destruction of the Tau when they were still at stone age tech-level. But when the Imperial ship arrived a couple millennia later (talkin 'bout red tape!) the Tau had suddenly developed into a spacefaring race capable of resisting that attack. The IoM grumbled a bit but thought the Tau weren't worth the hassle, so they delayed an armed response ... only to realize this was a mistake when the Tau Empire suddenly began making contact to human colonies near their Septs and making them switch sides. So they sent an all-out Crusade fleet. But after some initial success that one was repelled, too, the Imperials forced to negotiate peace as their advance grinded to a halt and they were losing more and more troops to the advanced weaponry of the Tau.
I'm sure the Imperium sees something that keeps resisting its attacks and continueing to be a border nuisance as a threat. It's just that there are bigger threats right now that deserve more attention, and the massive forces that would be required to break the Tau cannot be redeployed from elsewhere without serious destabilization and the potential loss of many worlds to another enemy that would exploit this weakness in the Imperium's defence.
In short, the Tau are to the Imperium what a stain on your shirt is whilst your house is on fire. But they do not ignore them because they don't care.
(I guess this might even be what you were trying to say, but it came off as a bit misleading, so this here is just meant for clarification)
Savage Scars goes into deeper detail about this. The Damocles Gulf Crusade did not end because the Tau defeated the Imperium(quite the contrary, while the Tau put up a stoic resistance, the Imperium was well on its way to taking the world of Dal'yth), it ended because Inquisitor Kryptman recalled the crusade fleet to the defense of Macragge. Its pretty much stated that the terms of the ceasefire/sort-of alliance of the two would last only as long as the Tyranid threat continued to exist, the Imperium having the resources to eliminate the entirety of the Tau Empire if it put the effort into it, but rather choosing to let the Tau continue because they are acting as a rearguard against Tyranid incursions on the Eastern Fringe, allowing the Imperium to divert its resources elsewhere.
Also, what I found hilarious is that several Imperials tried to convince the Tau that the Imperium has lasted for 10 millenia and encompasses something like two-thirds of the known galaxy, and the Tau wrote it off as posturing and exaggeration, refusing to believe that the Imperium could be so large and powerful.
As for current expansion, there is none. The Third Sphere expansion is over, and the Tau did not launch a fourth sphere. This was the result of the Medusa V campaign where the Tau were forced to abandon research into warp technology by order of the Ethereals, and were thus forced to call of the Fourth Sphere expansion. It even mentions something about that in the current codex, IIRC.
Dal'yth Prime wasn't a sure win. The IoM was waging a solid ground war that got halted by stretching supply lines thin. In a desperate attempt to gain control of the situation, a daring Guard Commander ordered an all out push with every asset available to make a break for a star port. The push was so unexpected it nearly routed 15,000 Firewarriors into an ocean. Once the star port was seized, the Imperial ground forces had a means to get troops off the surface. A wise choice given they had zero idea how many Tau fleets or forces were en route to the planet. Given their situation in orbit, they were anything but prepared for another fleet battle against the Tau. It was during this time they negotiated a peaceful exit off the world. Both sides learned a lot about each other in combat, and both walked away from the fight in a pretty civil manner for 40K.
I think the largest thing protecting the Tau is that they are a civilized race, that doesn't blindly pillage and murder their way into Imperial space, they wandered into it and people join them. On occasion they get into fights and annexations, but they have a very solid track record of winning.
I like the excellent mental image of them being a stain on your t-shirt while your house is burning down. But the Tau are more lethal and subtle than that, they are more akin to a cancer, slowly growing inside of you that you aren't aware of. If left unchecked, the Tau could pose a major threat to Imperial control on the Eastern Fringe. While it may not seem major at first glance, a large or even small but highly organized portion of any space can pose a significant threat by simply existing. Requiring substantial resources to subdue that could be far better spent in any number of endless shorthanded fronts.
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Mercadian Masque wrote:To sum it up, GW really didn't think things through when coming up with the size, composition, and role in the 40K universe when describing the Tau Empire.
Maybe, in the next Tau codex, they'll bite the bullet and massively retcon most of the Tau fluff.
A lot of Tau players would favor this. While I enjoy the Tau background, it really is poorly thought out in many ways. Timelines don't match up, Cadians being sent to the Damocles Gulf isn't practical, The lack of FTL is also just so awkward, in a setting where races fight on a galactic front...
I hope for a ton of additions to the fluff with "magical" fixes and "huge" gains in empire size. I hope they do something substantial, because I personally think the Tau vs Imperium conflicts have some of the best potential at great fluff and imo some of the most fun fights on TT.
There werent any Cadians in the Damocles Gulf according to savage scars. It was mostly Brimlock Dragoons and Rakarshan Rifles or something like that. Not a single mention of cadians anywhere in the book.
So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
chaos0xomega wrote:There werent any Cadians in the Damocles Gulf according to savage scars. It was mostly Brimlock Dragoons and Rakarshan Rifles or something like that. Not a single mention of cadians anywhere in the book.
This is where the fluff gets stupid, but yes, there were Cadians.
In the Tyranid Codex, it details that a Cadian element was sent to assist with the DGC but arrived 150 years late due to warp anomalies.
Apart from being bad fluff at best, it also doesn't make sense that the Cadians would send forces that far out into the middle of nowhere, during constant fighting on their homeworld. When people talk about the humans teaming up with the Tau vs Nids, it was that Cadian element that teamed up against Gorgon.
After the Nids were defeated, the Cadians assumed that this tiny remnant had almost defeated the Tau, without knowing the Hive's adaptive nature, they then sent a report that would lead to the greatest conflict to ever occur between the IoM and the Tau called the Iron Hammer Campaign.
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Spartan 117 wrote:So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
The IoM doesn't allow them to exist, they just don't have the resources to really do anything to them. According to the Nid dex we can expect a second attempt at wiping the Tau out in the Iron Hammer Campaign, which if it fails is the second such attempt at NOT letting them exist.
Spartan 117 wrote:So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
The IoM doesn't allow them to exist, they just don't have the resources to really do anything to them. According to the Nid dex we can expect a second attempt at wiping the Tau out in the Iron Hammer Campaign, which if it fails is the second such attempt at NOT letting them exist.
You're looking at it wrong, that would be the END of the period of the Imperium LETTING the Tau exist. As stated, several times already, the Imperium allowed the Tau to continue to exist to act as a rearguard/roadblock on the eastern fringe (as stated quite clearly in Savage Scars). With the defeat of Gorgon, we can assume that the Imperium assumed that the Tyranid threat in the east was neutralized, making the Tau the bigger cause for concern in the area, and thus public enemy number 1.
Spartan 117 wrote:So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
The IoM doesn't allow them to exist, they just don't have the resources to really do anything to them. According to the Nid dex we can expect a second attempt at wiping the Tau out in the Iron Hammer Campaign, which if it fails is the second such attempt at NOT letting them exist.
You're looking at it wrong, that would be the END of the period of the Imperium LETTING the Tau exist. As stated, several times already, the Imperium allowed the Tau to continue to exist to act as a rearguard/roadblock on the eastern fringe (as stated quite clearly in Savage Scars). With the defeat of Gorgon, we can assume that the Imperium assumed that the Tyranid threat in the east was neutralized, making the Tau the bigger cause for concern in the area, and thus public enemy number 1.
Gorgon was a total variable. To the IoMs knowledge there was no Gorgon until Cadians reported about Gorgon after the battle. Cadians that were written off as lost to the warp long ago.
Which brings up a sad realization... Do Guard Regiments carry just soldiers on campaigns? Or do they bring wives/children along for campaigns? Because if not, those Cadians pretty much would of lost all their wives, kids, girlfriends, and pretty much family in a single warp accident.
Have a gander at The Forever War by Joe Haldemann (sp?), its hardly a new concept in sci-fi. In short, yes they probably did lose all their family in the process, that is most likely a risk that you knowingly take when you volunteer for the Guard... unless you're one of the guys that get drafted... sucks to be you then.
Spartan 117 wrote:
Thats what I thought. I just wasn't sure because in all the fluf I've read it seems like the Tau Empire is growing FAST. So quickly and fast that some of the Eldar ae impressed with them.
In Regards to amount of time in comparison to how much they conquered, esspecially since the Tau were cut off visually from the other races for soooooo long. They have counquered alot in a short time. Someone Correct me if I am wrong, but i believe the Tau are the youngest race.
they are the youngest race. they have only had a space capable empire for around a thousand years. to have gone from club thumping savages to an empire of 100 worlds in less only a few thousand years is pretty remarkable.
As far as I know from a friend who plays T'au, the T'au empire covers about the same area as the system of space controlled by the smurfs, although the T'au have about 100 planets in densely packed space.
It is nothing compared to the Imperium of Man, and if they really cared, the IoM could just swat the T'au away.
Grey Templar wrote:they are the youngest race. they have only had a space capable empire for around a thousand years. to have gone from club thumping savages to an empire of 100 worlds in less only a few thousand years is pretty remarkable.
The passage of time from when the Tau where non gun powerder using primitives to space faring empire is not much different than the span of our own human recorded history. We're on the verge of a number of the things the Tau use (we have various remote drones that are moving towards limited artificial intelligence, mechanized battle armor, railguns, targeting lasers, space collonization, etc), and have had a number of large scale problems the Tau did not have (repeated battles with the Black Plague, the Spanish Influenze outbreak in the early 1900s, mini ice ages, and so forth).
So, not really mega advanced all that quick. It just looks that way as all of the other races have pretty much stagnated or are sliding backwards.
Maniac_nmt wrote:The passage of time from when the Tau where non gun powerder using primitives to space faring empire is not much different than the span of our own human recorded history. We're on the verge of a number of the things the Tau use (we have various remote drones that are moving towards limited artificial intelligence, mechanized battle armor, railguns, targeting lasers, space collonization, etc), and have had a number of large scale problems the Tau did not have (repeated battles with the Black Plague, the Spanish Influenze outbreak in the early 1900s, mini ice ages, and so forth).
So, not really mega advanced all that quick. It just looks that way as all of the other races have pretty much stagnated or are sliding backwards.
Your point is semi valid, we have not perfected Railgun technology it is still prototyped, same goes for mechanized battle suits. and there is not enough in depth lore for you to say they didnt have large scale problems such as the black plague.
I have had a similar discussion with an owner of my LGS and he said that he thought that a C'tan was behing the growth of the tau. Citing that they were not all accounted for and that since there was a (I believe) warp storm that hid the tau for a while they advanced far past what they should have technologically and socially. And that that hinted at an outside influence. After all the C'tan want power and if the necrons don't give it to them this one tried to gain power through a new young race that it could manipulate.
He also believes that another C'tan is doing the same thing to humanity...since one is captured and being used for marine tanks he said that he thought that that would explain PoMS and since he wants power what better way than to let humans think that they are controlling him only to surprise them later when he can control their vehicles.
I don't remember it all maybe they were shrouded. I am trying to remember a conversation that took place 5 months ago here. He is big on the backstories of races and loves the horus heresy books, he seemed pretty conving, and I have no reason not to believe him. I mean they grew fast, very very very fast. Much faster than should have been posible, So something had to have changed.
Akroma06 wrote:I don't remember it all maybe they were shrouded. I am trying to remember a conversation that took place 5 months ago here. He is big on the backstories of races and loves the horus heresy books, he seemed pretty conving, and I have no reason not to believe him. I mean they grew fast, very very very fast. Much faster than should have been posible, So something had to have changed.
The ethereals came. That's what changed the Tau. They were busy throwing rocks at each other than two ethereals mysteriously came and convinced everyone to stop fighting and work towards one goal. While we have problems with infighting and things the Tau were unified under the Ethereals thus advanced faster.
This brings to my mind the Ethereal pheromone theory which i think they should go with in the next codex, to add just a spice of grimdarkness.
Tau have a shorter lifespan than humans but they sleep less than half as much as humans. They probably mature more quickly as well.
3,000 years previously the Tau were cavemen. 3,000 years ago on Earth, humans IRL were building large cities, writing, farming and metal working.
Humans IRL are now (21st century) are not as advanced as the Tau after 3,000 years of development.
However, for the Tau, 3,000 years is more like 3,750 Earth/human years, because Tau get more done each day. Let's see where we are in another 750 years.
It follows that it is not necessary to invoke supernatural powers to explain the rapid development of the Tau.
(It's not impossible either that Tau are more intelligent, or perhaps their society is more productive thanks to universal peace and harmony.)
Tau have a shorter lifespan than humans but they sleep less than half as much as humans. They probably mature more quickly as well.
3,000 years previously the Tau were cavemen. 3,000 years ago on Earth, humans IRL were building large cities, writing, farming and metal working.
Humans IRL are now (21st century) are not as advanced as the Tau after 3,000 years of development.
However, for the Tau, 3,000 years is more like 3,750 Earth/human years, because Tau get more done each day. Let's see where we are in another 750 years.
It follows that it is not necessary to invoke supernatural powers to explain the rapid development of the Tau.
(It's not impossible either that Tau are more intelligent, or perhaps their society is more productive thanks to universal peace and harmony.)
Can you do that again but with 6,000 years ago them being cavemen? That is what is actually the background.
I'm not saying it was the pheremones that led to advancement, that's just my favorite theory for Tau. You have to admit that without the unification of the Ethereals, however they do it whether it's simply good leadership or whatever other theory, the Tau would have advanced much slower. Faster or slower than us I have no idea, but definitely slower as they would have had more problems to deal with and not been left to simply prosper.
Akroma06 wrote:I don't remember it all maybe they were shrouded. I am trying to remember a conversation that took place 5 months ago here. He is big on the backstories of races and loves the horus heresy books, he seemed pretty conving, and I have no reason not to believe him. I mean they grew fast, very very very fast. Much faster than should have been posible, So something had to have changed.
Approx 6000 years is the actual number given (in the last codex at least). Thats not a very short time period by any means. To put it into perspective 6000 years ago in our timeframe the global human population was approx 7 million people, and we were just developing writing...
Tau were cavemen in 789.M35 according to the codex. At the end of the 37th millenium they had rifles and cannons then the Ethereals came and the next 1000 years saw them develop into what you see today (pages 4,5 and 6 of the codex).
agnosto wrote:Tau were cavemen in 789.M35 according to the codex. At the end of the 37th millenium they had rifles and cannons then the Ethereals came and the next 1000 years saw them develop into what you see today (pages 4,5 and 6 of the codex).
agnosto wrote:Tau were cavemen in 789.M35 according to the codex. At the end of the 37th millenium they had rifles and cannons then the Ethereals came and the next 1000 years saw them develop into what you see today (pages 4,5 and 6 of the codex).
I have no idea when 789.M35 was.....
Considering we've only had rifles for less than two centuries, gunpowder weapons in general for under a millenium, I'd say thats pretty good, not necessarily a very fast rate of advancement, and entirely believable.
Spartan 117 wrote:So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
The IoM doesn't allow them to exist, they just don't have the resources to really do anything to them. According to the Nid dex we can expect a second attempt at wiping the Tau out in the Iron Hammer Campaign, which if it fails is the second such attempt at NOT letting them exist.
You're looking at it wrong, that would be the END of the period of the Imperium LETTING the Tau exist. As stated, several times already, the Imperium allowed the Tau to continue to exist to act as a rearguard/roadblock on the eastern fringe (as stated quite clearly in Savage Scars). With the defeat of Gorgon, we can assume that the Imperium assumed that the Tyranid threat in the east was neutralized, making the Tau the bigger cause for concern in the area, and thus public enemy number 1.
Gorgon was a total variable. To the IoMs knowledge there was no Gorgon until Cadians reported about Gorgon after the battle. Cadians that were written off as lost to the warp long ago.
Which brings up a sad realization... Do Guard Regiments carry just soldiers on campaigns? Or do they bring wives/children along for campaigns? Because if not, those Cadians pretty much would of lost all their wives, kids, girlfriends, and pretty much family in a single warp accident.
I like to think that those in charge would have kept the troops in the dark about it, leaving them knowing nothing about the time lapse
Kilkrazy wrote:
Humans IRL are now (21st century) are not as advanced as the Tau after 3,000 years of development.
Gee... I wonder why....?
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Kilkrazy wrote:
However, for the Tau, 3,000 years is more like 3,750 Earth/human years, because Tau get more done each day. Let's see where we are in another 750 years.
Spartan 117 wrote:So does the Imperium pretty much allow for the Tau Empire to exist because they can be a buffer against the nids? Because from my understandig thus far thats what it seems to be.
In short yes. The Damocles crusade to quote this man from spacebattles was.
Captain Orsai wrote:It's a bit simpler than that. The forces that made up the Damocles Gulf Crusade were put together with no small degree of haste, and without much idea of what they were up against. The assumption was that they'd fight their way across the Gulf and establish a foothold while reinforcements were moving up. Of course, those reinforcements were then redirected to counter Hive Fleet Behemoth.
The haste with which it was organised is why the DGC is strong in some areas (fleet strength for a gunnery action, high quality ground forces), but weak in others (carrier strength, the lower end ground troops supporting the elites).
Also; within the context of the Imperial Guard, "regiment" is an extremely broad category, and can range from units less than a thousand strong (the Phantine Skyborne, w/600 all ranks), to those more than three-quarters of a million strong (50th Gudrun Rifles), and everything in between (although the average seems to be the 2-10,000 all ranks bracket).
I expect when the new codex comes out we will see an increase in expansion or tech (in fluff terms) to make the Tau a much more formidable race in such they will be much more than a blip on the intergalactic map.
Right now they are protected from the Imperium because it would just be too bothersome to take them out. I hope they are expanded to the point where it becomes very obvious that it was a mistake to leave them alone for so long.
Jayden63 wrote:I expect when the new codex comes out we will see an increase in expansion or tech (in fluff terms) to make the Tau a much more formidable race in such they will be much more than a blip on the intergalactic map.
Right now they are protected from the Imperium because it would just be too bothersome to take them out. I hope they are expanded to the point where it becomes very obvious that it was a mistake to leave them alone for so long.
b
Well the problem with that is their skim drive, unless the somehow increase the speed they're gonna experinece rebelllions ( look at Farsight as an example) because of the less comunication between the T'au and the other worlds.
Jayden63 wrote:I expect when the new codex comes out we will see an increase in expansion or tech (in fluff terms) to make the Tau a much more formidable race in such they will be much more than a blip on the intergalactic map.
Isn't the whole point of the Tau that they're like dozens of other minor alien empires in the galaxy? They might have more potential than most, but their character is still very much an insignicant but slowly growing force on the world stage. I feel that just making them a major faction would remove that idea and make them more dull.
Jayden63 wrote:Fluff gets changed all the time. Anything could be written in the next codex and it would have to be taken as cannon. You never know.
So you're hoping for a retcon so that the Tau suddenly become bigger and more powerful for no logical reason?
Jayden63 wrote:I expect when the new codex comes out we will see an increase in expansion or tech (in fluff terms) to make the Tau a much more formidable race in such they will be much more than a blip on the intergalactic map.
Isn't the whole point of the Tau that they're like dozens of other minor alien empires in the galaxy? They might have more potential than most, but their character is still very much an insignicant but slowly growing force on the world stage. I feel that just making them a major faction would remove that idea and make them more dull.
Jayden63 wrote:Fluff gets changed all the time. Anything could be written in the next codex and it would have to be taken as cannon. You never know.
So you're hoping for a retcon so that the Tau suddenly become bigger and more powerful for no logical reason?
The Tau are expanding, they develop a superior FTL, expand faster, unite more factions, create more technology, life goes on.
I don't see why the Tau would need any real retcons if GW just progresses their story. Though I'd be good with a total re-write but I don't see that ever happening. They have a pretty poorly written section of fluff that has lots of contradictions in dates and numbers. Hopefully we get a better dex down the road.
Last time Tau failed in researching faster FTL ( Medusa Campaing), unless they get past their lack psyker, only options is that they somehow magically invent their own version of the Inertialess Drive.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:
The Tau are expanding, they develop a superior FTL, expand faster, unite more factions, create more technology, life goes on.
Not quickly enough unless the timeline jumps forward a thousand years or so. After the Medusa Campaign didn't an Ethereal ban, or at least restrict, further research into Warp-based faster-than-light travel? Non-Warp based faster-than-light travel is only seen in Tyranids (though I dislike that retcon) and Necrons; the Tau don't come anywhere near either of those two, and unless the Tau will gain greater technology than humanity had during the Dark Age of Technology, then they're stuck with their currect version. They're also hitting into greater Imperial resistance, so their expansion can't go that quickly unless they're indirectly helping by yet another great threat to the Imperium.
iproxtaco wrote:If a C'tan were behind the growth of the Tau then there never would have been any Warp Storm.
I read a passage online about the theory of the creation of the Tau, but I dont remeber where I read it from since it was a while back. But basicly the Eldar made them as their answer to the threat of Chaos. I guess that would make sense what with all the odd praise the eldar bestow upon them.
You guys are missing the point. It wouldn't need to be a massive story breaking change to make the Tau more interesting.
Personally, I would love to see the Tau grow to become a major threat in their neck of the woods. I can't think of any reason why anyone wouldn't want more scraps between IoM and Tau! Advance the fluff and keep the fights going!
I actually think GW did a good job with Tau fluff. They are supposed to be tiny and inconsequential. Anyway, if the IoM put any effort into it, the Tau would be crushed. Unfortunately, they never will, because that wouldn't make any sense from an out-of-universe perspective. But I do think it's comical how wrong the Tau are on their estimates of the Imperium. They seem so smart, too. I wonder what they would think if they found out just how epic the Imperium is...
Tau are meant to be a part of the greater picture. They are the foremost among the "emerging Alien empires" which together are further draining Imperial resources in war after war. The Reek Worldweave, Ulimeathic League, and Dracolith World Church were cited as other such fledging Empires.
People often underestimate how much force the IoM would need to destroy the Tau Empire entirely in any regard. It would be a large undertaking. I honestly don't think commanders on the Eastern Fringe could get enough resources from the Adeptus Terra given ongoing conflicts like the 13th Black Crusade, Tyranid Splinter Fleets, and Armageddon Wars.
There is something that always struck me as odd about how the IoM handles the tau. First fight they don't send the needed troops and they recall them right before they are about to drop a virus bomb. Happens again with taros. Then there was the Zeist campaign. That had a bunch of SM all ready to clean out the tau, but they where also recalled. One time is accident, twice is quiescence, but three times is enemy action. The IoM seems to be actively avoiding wining. It could be that the IoM is just stupid, but I like to theory that there is something more sinister going on. Someone high up in the IoM is shielding the tau.
Crazy idea I know, but wouldn't it be fun if that was the case.
SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:
Not quickly enough unless the timeline jumps forward a thousand years or so. After the Medusa Campaign didn't an Ethereal ban, or at least restrict, further research into Warp-based faster-than-light travel? Non-Warp based faster-than-light travel is only seen in Tyranids (though I dislike that retcon) and Necrons; the Tau don't come anywhere near either of those two, and unless the Tau will gain greater technology than humanity had during the Dark Age of Technology, then they're stuck with their currect version. They're also hitting into greater Imperial resistance, so their expansion can't go that quickly unless they're indirectly helping by yet another great threat to the Imperium.
There is no way for the other FTL drive, Humans during the Golden Age were even more advanced than the Eldar in some fields. And yet, only Warp technology was proven fast enough for them to colonize the galaxy, with their 2'nd fastest tech they needed some 30 - 50 years toward nearest star. The only way for Tau to advance to that level is to replicate Necron teleportation tech. But since every peace of Necron tech is "disappearing" from the battlefield after every battle touch luck on that. There is one other solution, to trade with Eldar. But they think of Humanity as children and about Tau even less + they are racist so good luck capturing one Craftworld.
Brother Coa wrote:
The only way for Tau to advance to that level is to replicate Necron teleportation tech. But since every peace of Necron tech is "disappearing" from the battlefield after every battle touch luck on that.
I remember reading somewhere that what specimens are managed to be recovered have a habit if driving the observer insane under any sort of close study.
So yeah, no one's getting any true Necron tech for themselves without some cheating.
SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:
Not quickly enough unless the timeline jumps forward a thousand years or so. After the Medusa Campaign didn't an Ethereal ban, or at least restrict, further research into Warp-based faster-than-light travel? Non-Warp based faster-than-light travel is only seen in Tyranids (though I dislike that retcon) and Necrons; the Tau don't come anywhere near either of those two, and unless the Tau will gain greater technology than humanity had during the Dark Age of Technology, then they're stuck with their currect version. They're also hitting into greater Imperial resistance, so their expansion can't go that quickly unless they're indirectly helping by yet another great threat to the Imperium.
There is no way for the other FTL drive, Humans during the Golden Age were even more advanced than the Eldar in some fields. And yet, only Warp technology was proven fast enough for them to colonize the galaxy, with their 2'nd fastest tech they needed some 30 - 50 years toward nearest star. The only way for Tau to advance to that level is to replicate Necron teleportation tech. But since every peace of Necron tech is "disappearing" from the battlefield after every battle touch luck on that. There is one other solution, to trade with Eldar. But they think of Humanity as children and about Tau even less + they are racist so good luck capturing one Craftworld.
Actually Eldar think of Tau as a promising, intelligent new race. There were a few quotes about it in the 3rd edition codex.
But Eldrad was pretty intelligent now that I think about it. Apart from trying to take a Blackstone Fortress with nothing but a few sphess elfs and a fancy dress. Still, I suppose you can't criticise him for making the effort.
I actually have heard that the Eldar think of the Tau as a promising new race, but that doesn't mean cooperation is in the cards. The Tau might not like the Eldar. I mean this in a sense of the Tau not believing that they need the help. They don't believe humans when they say they have a million worlds, so why would they believe a gay-looking human who just walked out of thin air with depressing news on how everyone is screwed?
The Necrons invented their own technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
When Apple were designing the original windows mouse pointer interface, they saw the Xerox PARC Labs where they were working on a similar interface. One of the big problems in that kind of interface is how to make the computer not draw the bits of windows that are hidden behind the visible windows. Without this, you need an ubber powerful computer to draw everything, which wasn’t possible in about 1980, as a desktop model.
At Xerox PARC, the engineers had got around the problem by designing some really clever code to sort out the problem. Knowing this, the Apple engineers set to and designed their own code.
Thing was, the Xerox engineers had not actually conquered the problem, they were in fact using brute force (i..e a very powerful processor) to draw the graphics.
Kilkrazy wrote:
The Necrons invented their own technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
So very wrong. Necrons have some tech but the tech they have now ( their bodies, their weapons, Monoliths and their FTL drive ) was all given by the C'Tan. Read the Necrontyr history, their own FTL tech was even worse than Tau one.
And as I sad Humanity in the Golden Age was more advanced than Tau now, and even they didn't find anything beside warp drive.
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TrollPie wrote:Actually Eldar think of Tau as a promising, intelligent new race. There were a few quotes about it in the 3rd edition codex.
The Taldeer ( one of the most famous Farssers ) have told to Tau Ethereal: "Naive Child."
Kilkrazy wrote:So the C'Tan invented the Necron technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
It isn't space magick.
C'tan is not a moral being...he is a divine being. And that tech IS magic ( teleporting across space in just a few seconds ). And it was design so that no race can't get aces to it ( like parts of it just teleporting away after being damaged ).
An I am pretty sure that Tau will have technological apocalypse long before they even start to understand the Necron tech.
Kilkrazy wrote:
So the C'Tan invented the Necron technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
Because it essentially makes very other species out to be (comparatively, at least) idiots. The Tau get done in a few thousand years which only the C'tan were able to achieve (Tyranids don't really count in the same way, since the only I can actually see that working is through using Warp power)? Then presumably their weapons and spacecraft will be far superior to any other faction (apart from the Necrons).
Kilkrazy wrote:
The Necrons invented their own technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
So very wrong. Necrons have some tech but the tech they have now ( their bodies, their weapons, Monoliths and their FTL drive ) was all given by the C'Tan. Read the Necrontyr history, their own FTL tech was even worse than Tau one.
And as I sad Humanity in the Golden Age was more advanced than Tau now, and even they didn't find anything beside warp drive.
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TrollPie wrote:Actually Eldar think of Tau as a promising, intelligent new race. There were a few quotes about it in the 3rd edition codex.
The Taldeer ( one of the most famous Farssers ) have told to Tau Ethereal: "Naive Child."
They created necrodermis before ever actually communicating with the C'tan
Kilkrazy wrote:So the C'Tan invented the Necron technology. I don't see why the Tau can't too.
It isn't space magick.
C'tan is not a moral being...he is a divine being. And that tech IS magic ( teleporting across space in just a few seconds ). And it was design so that no race can't get aces to it ( like parts of it just teleporting away after being damaged ).
An I am pretty sure that Tau will have technological apocalypse long before they even start to understand the Necron tech.
"Divine" does not mean the same in the 40K universe as it does IRL. In 40K it just means very powerful and not fully understood. To quote Arthur C Clarke, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic".
C'Tan or Necron technology isn't magic, though, and technologists who do not believe in magic will take the existence of an unknown technology as evidence that it can be recreated.
That was the point of my story about the Apple engineers. They merely needed to believe that a technological solution was possible, and they invented it from scratch.
The Tau do not need to capture Necron technology to know that it is capable of teleportation. The IoM is also capable of teleportation. It would certainly be helpful to capture some, however merely knowing it exists tells the Tau that they can create their own system.
Kilkrazy wrote:
The Tau do not need to capture Necron technology to know that it is capable of teleportation. The IoM is also capable of teleportation. It would certainly be helpful to capture some, however merely knowing it exists tells the Tau that they can create their own system.
Yes, they physically can create it. That does not mean that they will be able to do so any time soon, or even that they can create the required materials at their current technological level. Simply because it is possible does not make it remotely likely that the Tau will be capable of something only the C'tan could achieve (and even then, we don't know why or how they were capable of it but the Necrontyr seemed unable to. Perhaps the C'tan or the Warp are necessary).
Kilkrazy wrote:Still, the possibility exists. I would have thought it's the kind of thing the Tau would achieve over 10 to 100 years.
Really? I wasn't aware that the Tau were so much more intelligent than everyone else. That'd pretty much put them over the Emperor in terms of intelligence.
The C'Tan are allergic to the Warp, so it's unlikely they used it to make their teleportation drive.
As far as I know, the Warp doesn't necessarily harm C'tan more than it does anything else (and, indeed, likely harms them less than most things), it's just that they can't control it like they can the Materium (which let's face it, essentially means they have magic. So if they are responsible for the Necron faster-than-light drives, it may be impossible for the Tau to come up with it). Still, they almost certainly don't use the Warp for teleportation. I assume it's something to do with their phasing technology.
Kilkrazy wrote:Still, the possibility exists. I would have thought it's the kind of thing the Tau would achieve over 10 to 100 years.
Really? I wasn't aware that the Tau were so much more intelligent than everyone else. That'd pretty much put them over the Emperor in terms of intelligence.
Well, an entire race being more intelligent than a single person isn't too far fetched.
Kilkrazy wrote:Still, the possibility exists. I would have thought it's the kind of thing the Tau would achieve over 10 to 100 years.
Sadly, all discussion of "sooner" or "later" in the 40K background is meaningless as the story never advances.
The C'Tan are allergic to the Warp, so it's unlikely they used it to make their teleportation drive.
The tau aren't allergic to warp though. I don't see the tau just switching gears to make a pure tech FTL drive. They have warp drive right now. It would take less effort to improve that then to make a totally new system.
Nerivant wrote:Well, an entire race being more intelligent than a single person isn't too far fetched.
Very well. The Tau being vastly more intelligent than humanity (in dozens of separate empires, no less), the Eldar, the Necrontyr and, as far as we know, any other sentient speices in the galaxy.
Besides, the Emperor dedicated a lot time and resources (including the Adeptus Mechanicus and such) to alternative faster-than-light forms of travel, and I'm not sure just how many researchers the Tau would actually commit to one particular project. The other major powers have had a lot more time and resources, but the Tau somehow outstrip them all just because they are Tau? That doesn't sound great to me.
nomotog wrote:They have warp drive right now. It would take less effort to improve that then to make a totally new system.
I think further reseach into the Warp was banned after the Medusa Campaign though. Not to mention the need for Navigators unless the Tau wish to lose significant amounts of their spacecraft.
nomotog wrote:They have warp drive right now. It would take less effort to improve that then to make a totally new system.
I think further reseach into the Warp was banned after the Medusa Campaign though. Not to mention the need for Navigators unless the Tau wish to lose significant amounts of their spacecraft.
They also don't have to do it in the exact same way as the IoM. I don't see the tau building their own light house or using navigators. I suspect they would do something closer to what they have now. Something like a large space station that allows ships to jump farther then they can unassisted.
nomotog wrote:They also don't have to do it in the exact same way as the IoM. I don't see the tau building their own light house or using navigators. I suspect they would do something closer to what they have now. Something like a large space station that allows ships to jump farther then they can unassisted.
How far and how fast are we talking here? Besides, how'd they even make something like that without Psychic input?
Kilkrazy wrote:Still, the possibility exists. I would have thought it's the kind of thing the Tau would achieve over 10 to 100 years.
Sadly, all discussion of "sooner" or "later" in the 40K background is meaningless as the story never advances.
The C'Tan are allergic to the Warp, so it's unlikely they used it to make their teleportation drive.
The tau aren't allergic to warp though. I don't see the tau just switching gears to make a pure tech FTL drive. They have warp drive right now. It would take less effort to improve that then to make a totally new system.
To rehearse the argument again, the Tau have decided not to pursue further warp drive development because of the dangers of the warp. At the same time, they want a faster drive to expand farther.
They know that faster drives exist (e.g. Necron) based on non-warp principles. Logically, they will seek to develop their own faster drive based on non-warp principles.
As someone has already developed such a drive, it is possible to invent it independently, without the benefit of "industrial espionage" (though they might well get helpful data from the Necrons).
If no-one has invented such a drive, that would not stop the Tau from doing so, as they believe it is possible.
Kilkrazy wrote:
To rehearse the argument again, the Tau have decided not to pursue further warp drive development because of the dangers of the warp. At the same time, they want a faster drive to expand farther.
They know that faster drives exist (e.g. Necron) based on non-warp principles. Logically, they will seek to develop their own faster drive based on non-warp principles.
As someone has already developed such a drive, it is possible to invent it independently, without the benefit of "industrial espionage" (though they might well get helpful data from the Necrons).
If no-one has invented such a drive, that would not stop the Tau from doing so, as they believe it is possible.
I agree, Tau will sooner or later develop that kind of tech. But it will be very difficult, remember hat Humans in the Golden Age was far more technologically advanced than Tau and even they didn't found other solution then Warp. Or maybe they didn't try all options, I don't know. More likely scenario for Tau would be new ally with that tech already developed.
nomotog wrote:They also don't have to do it in the exact same way as the IoM. I don't see the tau building their own light house or using navigators. I suspect they would do something closer to what they have now. Something like a large space station that allows ships to jump farther then they can unassisted.
How far and how fast are we talking here? Besides, how'd they even make something like that without Psychic input?
As far as the plot demands. Basically the reason people want to see the tau zoom around faster is because they want to be able to include the tau more easily, so this device drops the tau where ever you want to have them in a battle.
Well they use their warp drive without psychic input. They just kind of push on the wall of the warp and it knocks them back. My idea is just more of that. Use a larger drive to set up like a slingshot where the warp is pushed back more and the ships are thrown longer range. One way trip. Unless you have another slingshot, your hoofing it back.
Kilkrazy wrote:I was under the impression that the Golden Age humans didn't use Warp Drive, they used something else.
I have mistaken, they invented warp drive at the very beginning of the golden age. http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/M22 Before that they use cryo ships and froze crew for 150 years until the next star.
KamikazeCanuck wrote:They did use Warp Drive with Navigators, Geller fields and the whole shebang. The only difference was there was no Astronomicon.
Then how did they navigate or make navigators?
hellspawn22 wrote:I don't see how you would use the Warp otherwise, then.
Well you see you need the Astronomicon to hold an empire together. You need to get from planet A to planet B in X amount of time to stop invasion from Z alien.
Back in the intersteller exodus days they weren't going anywhere specifically. They were simply seeing "what was over the next hill". "Oh, look a nice planet. Let's settle there." It's similiar to our own age of exploration/colonization. They didn't have maps, they just keep going.
So what the Tau have in space travel is not good then? That doesn't make any sense in the fluff. The Tau are suppossed to be one of the most technologically advanced races in 40k and their space travels sucks.
Spartan 117 wrote:So what the Tau have in space travel is not good then? That doesn't make any sense in the fluff. The Tau are suppossed to be one of the most technologically advanced races in 40k and their space travels sucks.
They are also bad at bio engineering. They are not good at everything after all.
KamikazeCanuck wrote:
nomotog wrote:
KamikazeCanuck wrote:They did use Warp Drive with Navigators, Geller fields and the whole shebang. The only difference was there was no Astronomicon.
Then how did they navigate or make navigators?
hellspawn22 wrote:I don't see how you would use the Warp otherwise, then.
Well you see you need the Astronomicon to hold an empire together. You need to get from planet A to planet B in X amount of time to stop invasion from Z alien.
Back in the intersteller exodus days they weren't going anywhere specifically. They were simply seeing "what was over the next hill". "Oh, look a nice planet. Let's settle there." It's similiar to our own age of exploration/colonization. They didn't have maps, they just keep going.
Ya, but you can't actually make an navigator without the astronomicon. Exposing to the astronomicon is part of the process.
Spartan 117 wrote:So what the Tau have in space travel is not good then? That doesn't make any sense in the fluff. The Tau are suppossed to be one of the most technologically advanced races in 40k and their space travels sucks.
It's a safe alternative to the very dangerous and unreliable warp travel they could use. Remember, they don't have a god emperor guiding them. So for the Tau, its a shot in the dark they prefer to avoid. In time, its very likely they will develop a superior form of FTL travel and expand rapidly.
Killkrazy actually posted a pretty solid way problems like that get solved in his example that got Cool Story Bro'd. The Tau don't have what they need at the moment, but they see what they want and will find a way to get it, what they may end up building could possibly be better than what they were trying to design. In short, it wouldn't be surprising for the Tau to create a form of FTL on par with the Necrons through sheer force of will and innovation.
Spartan 117 wrote:So what the Tau have in space travel is not good then? That doesn't make any sense in the fluff. The Tau are suppossed to be one of the most technologically advanced races in 40k and their space travels sucks.
You can navigate by taking fixes from quasars, but you can't do that from within the warp.
Of course you can't take a navigational fix from a single point like the Astronomican. There are repeater stations throughout the galaxy.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:In short, it wouldn't be surprising for the Tau to create a form of FTL on par with the Necrons through sheer force of will and innovation.
Care to explain what makes the Tau so amazingly intelligent and rich in resources that they can do what no-one else in the Milky Way was capable of doing despite trying to do so, aside from the C'tan (who basically cheat)?
nomotog wrote:Someone told me that you have to expose a navigator to the astronomicon. I looked it up, turns out they lied to me.
I think Astropaths are Soul-bound to the Emperor, but I'm sure if that's actaully a necessity or simply to make it safer for them to transmit messages.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:In short, it wouldn't be surprising for the Tau to create a form of FTL on par with the Necrons through sheer force of will and innovation.
Care to explain what makes the Tau so amazingly intelligent and rich in resources that they can do what no-one else in the Milky Way was capable of doing despite trying to do so, aside from the C'tan (who basically cheat)?
nomotog wrote:Someone told me that you have to expose a navigator to the astronomicon. I looked it up, turns out they lied to me.
I think Astropaths are Soul-bound to the Emperor, but I'm sure if that's actaully a necessity or simply to make it safer for them to transmit messages.
Tau are a more productive race than humanity. They sleep less, work more, live to fufill a role in a caste driven society that strives toward progress. If ever a race was destined to create a new form of travel that sets a benchmark it will be the Tau.
They have every reason to create it and everything to lose it they can't. Won't be surprised if next dex they create an amazing form of FTL travel.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:
Tau are a more productive race than humanity. They sleep less, work more, live to fufill a role in a caste driven society that strives toward progress. If ever a race was destined to create a new form of travel that sets a benchmark it will be the Tau.
Be that as it may (where'd you read the sleep less and work more part, out of curiosity?), to say that they can develop that in such a short space of time whereas humanity couldn't even with amazingly intelligent AI and vastly superior technology in other regards over thousands of years essentially makes huamns out to be drastically less intelligent. Let alone the poor Necrontyr, who were more technologically advantaged in some respects than the Old Ones but still couldn't develop it (despite have just as much reason, if not more, than the Tau).
BeefCakeSoup wrote:In short, it wouldn't be surprising for the Tau to create a form of FTL on par with the Necrons through sheer force of will and innovation.
Care to explain what makes the Tau so amazingly intelligent and rich in resources that they can do what no-one else in the Milky Way was capable of doing despite trying to do so, aside from the C'tan (who basically cheat)?
nomotog wrote:Someone told me that you have to expose a navigator to the astronomicon. I looked it up, turns out they lied to me.
I think Astropaths are Soul-bound to the Emperor, but I'm sure if that's actaully a necessity or simply to make it safer for them to transmit messages.
Tau are a more productive race than humanity. They sleep less, work more, live to fufill a role in a caste driven society that strives toward progress. If ever a race was destined to create a new form of travel that sets a benchmark it will be the Tau.
They have every reason to create it and everything to lose it they can't. Won't be surprised if next dex they create an amazing form of FTL travel.
This is true, Tau society allows them to be more productive than humanity. They may only live 40 years, but they live only for the greater good so they have less distractions and infighting then humanity. Unless humanity find something that makes them less self destructive the Tau will catch up with them fast.
Edit: I wouldn't say they are more intelligent just more driven to the goal. Where humans are selfish.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:In short, it wouldn't be surprising for the Tau to create a form of FTL on par with the Necrons through sheer force of will and innovation.
Care to explain what makes the Tau so amazingly intelligent and rich in resources that they can do what no-one else in the Milky Way was capable of doing despite trying to do so, aside from the C'tan (who basically cheat)?
Kilkrazy wrote:
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Tell that to Necrontyr, who arguably had more reason to discover faster-than-light technology but were still totally incapable of it. And aside from Warp Drives, were presumably more technologically advanced than the Tau.
Yes, you see each codex shows them making incremental steps forward in the area of warp travel. This proves they are focusing their attention on something completely different.
Kilkrazy wrote:
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Tell that to Necrontyr, who arguably had more reason to discover faster-than-light technology but were still totally incapable of it. And aside from Warp Drives, were presumably more technologically advanced than the Tau.
The Necrontyr didn't have any examples to inspire them.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Kilkrazy wrote:
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Tell that to Necrontyr, who arguably had more reason to discover faster-than-light technology but were still totally incapable of it. And aside from Warp Drives, were presumably more technologically advanced than the Tau.
The Necrontyr didn't have any examples to inspire them.
Neither do Tau as Necron technology is uncapturable or whatever. They see it, but without any basis on how the magic tech works they would be just as far as if they hadn't seen it.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Shadowsun destroyed Farsights marble statue with every Firewarrior in the empire watching. Tau communication is ace and capable of being flexible enough to wage coordinated attacks on different targets at once. So good, that Shadowsun was able to keep her fleet closely intact and pinpoint precise and went on to wipe a splinter fleet without losing one vessel. A technique of rapid communication we saw repeated when she launched the 3rd expansion... playing hell with Imperial defenses as she probed several worlds before collapsing on one. On a dozen different headings her fleet made brutal, quick hit and run attacks.
The only time I hear of pony express is in regards to the Nid invasion, in which I can totally see how comms could be blocked out. Even against Necrons the Tau knew almost instantly they were under attack from Crons and ordered all nearby planets to be evacuated.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Shadowsun destroyed Farsights marble statue with every Firewarrior in the empire watching. Tau communication is ace and capable of being flexible enough to wage coordinated attacks on different targets at once. So good, that Shadowsun was able to keep her fleet closely intact and pinpoint precise and went on to wipe a splinter fleet without losing one vessel. A technique of rapid communication we saw repeated when she launched the 3rd expansion... playing hell with Imperial defenses as she probed several worlds before collapsing on one. On a dozen different headings her fleet made brutal, quick hit and run attacks.
The only time I hear of pony express is in regards to the Nid invasion, in which I can totally see how comms could be blocked out. Even against Necrons the Tau knew almost instantly they were under attack from Crons and ordered all nearby planets to be evacuated.
This communication works now, what we're saying is what happens when they get bigger and have to communicate at a level close to the IOM
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Shadowsun destroyed Farsights marble statue with every Firewarrior in the empire watching. Tau communication is ace and capable of being flexible enough to wage coordinated attacks on different targets at once. So good, that Shadowsun was able to keep her fleet closely intact and pinpoint precise and went on to wipe a splinter fleet without losing one vessel. A technique of rapid communication we saw repeated when she launched the 3rd expansion... playing hell with Imperial defenses as she probed several worlds before collapsing on one. On a dozen different headings her fleet made brutal, quick hit and run attacks.
The only time I hear of pony express is in regards to the Nid invasion, in which I can totally see how comms could be blocked out. Even against Necrons the Tau knew almost instantly they were under attack from Crons and ordered all nearby planets to be evacuated.
This communication works now, what we're saying is what happens when they get bigger and have to communicate at a level close to the IOM
If a spec on the galactic map can create what they can, imagine what a few trillion Tau could come up with. It's very likely that they would literally push technology to a possible apex.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Shadowsun destroyed Farsights marble statue with every Firewarrior in the empire watching. Tau communication is ace and capable of being flexible enough to wage coordinated attacks on different targets at once. So good, that Shadowsun was able to keep her fleet closely intact and pinpoint precise and went on to wipe a splinter fleet without losing one vessel. A technique of rapid communication we saw repeated when she launched the 3rd expansion... playing hell with Imperial defenses as she probed several worlds before collapsing on one. On a dozen different headings her fleet made brutal, quick hit and run attacks.
The only time I hear of pony express is in regards to the Nid invasion, in which I can totally see how comms could be blocked out. Even against Necrons the Tau knew almost instantly they were under attack from Crons and ordered all nearby planets to be evacuated.
Indeed. The Tau Empire is small enough that word travels fast. The Imperium is stretched across many light years, and relies heavily on astropathic choirs. On top of that, it takes a long time for news to reach the Departmento Munitorum. Vraks and Taros are good examples of the Imperium's slow response to to emergencies in distant sectors.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Shadowsun destroyed Farsights marble statue with every Firewarrior in the empire watching. Tau communication is ace and capable of being flexible enough to wage coordinated attacks on different targets at once. So good, that Shadowsun was able to keep her fleet closely intact and pinpoint precise and went on to wipe a splinter fleet without losing one vessel. A technique of rapid communication we saw repeated when she launched the 3rd expansion... playing hell with Imperial defenses as she probed several worlds before collapsing on one. On a dozen different headings her fleet made brutal, quick hit and run attacks.
The only time I hear of pony express is in regards to the Nid invasion, in which I can totally see how comms could be blocked out. Even against Necrons the Tau knew almost instantly they were under attack from Crons and ordered all nearby planets to be evacuated.
This communication works now, what we're saying is what happens when they get bigger and have to communicate at a level close to the IOM
If a spec on the galactic map can create what they can, imagine what a few trillion Tau could come up with. It's very likely that they would literally push technology to a possible apex.
The biggest thing holding back Tau expansion isn't their warp speed. If they're slow they're slow, whatever. The biggest problem they are going to face soon is empire wide communication. An empire beyond their current size cannot be administrated and protected with their current method. It's too ineffective.
Thanks for that link. That thread was a good read. I always figured that they used their waypoint stations are relay stations with routing software like we have today. So a tau wants to send a message to his friend on another planet. The message would be packeted up and sent by way of computer.
Beauty of the Tau is that not every innovation lies on their shoulders. They could easily assimilate a race to problem solve for them. While Tau are easily some of the brightest minds out there, they don't have an affinity for the warp. However, they could easily absorb a psyker race into their ranks.
Mr Morden wrote:The Tau have had conflicts with pretty much all the major players. Like everyone else - the Tau are fighting on multiple fronts but in a small area so can focuss their defences better.
The Necrons "saved" a Tau world only to devour the population
Hey Mat Ward: THAT is how you have Necrons and anyone "team up."
BeefCakeSoup wrote:Beauty of the Tau is that not every innovation lies on their shoulders. They could easily assimilate a race to problem solve for them. While Tau are easily some of the brightest minds out there, they don't have an affinity for the warp. However, they could easily absorb a psyker race into their ranks.
Bingo, problem solved!
Problem just begun. Soon as you let in the psykers you have to deal with all the problems of Chaos.
KamikazeCanuck wrote:
Problem just begun. Soon as you let in the psykers you have to deal with all the problems of Chaos.
Just like in the Age of Strife. I think that Tau recruiting alien psykers into their ranks would = doom to their race. As Tau don't have nothing against Daemons, unlike the Imperium.
Mr Morden wrote:The Tau have had conflicts with pretty much all the major players. Like everyone else - the Tau are fighting on multiple fronts but in a small area so can focuss their defences better.
The Necrons "saved" a Tau world only to devour the population
Hey Mat Ward: THAT is how you have Necrons and anyone "team up."
Or "Caves of Ice" starring Ciaphas Cain.
You're aware that even before Ward, the Necrons 'teamed up' with the Imperium yeah?
Necrons gated in on several worlds in the Cadian sector during the 13th Black Crusade. They did not engage Imperial forces, unless Imperial forces got in their way.
BeefCakeSoup wrote:Beauty of the Tau is that not every innovation lies on their shoulders. They could easily assimilate a race to problem solve for them. While Tau are easily some of the brightest minds out there, they don't have an affinity for the warp. However, they could easily absorb a psyker race into their ranks.
Bingo, problem solved!
It would solve some problems, then make more. Tau's greatest hope is to eventually get non warp FTL right now stay small, advance more, until the Imperium is too weak to deal with them.
Mr Morden wrote:The Tau have had conflicts with pretty much all the major players. Like everyone else - the Tau are fighting on multiple fronts but in a small area so can focuss their defences better.
The Necrons "saved" a Tau world only to devour the population
Hey Mat Ward: THAT is how you have Necrons and anyone "team up."
Or "Caves of Ice" starring Ciaphas Cain.
You're aware that even before Ward, the Necrons 'teamed up' with the Imperium yeah?
Necrons gated in on several worlds in the Cadian sector during the 13th Black Crusade. They did not engage Imperial forces, unless Imperial forces got in their way.
True, but before Mat Ward, they never acknowledged their food and made a sort of seperate piece with them where both sides honored and respected their erstwhile foes or found killing them "distasteful."
The sum total of words exchanged between the species, if any, pretty much boiled down to
I never have been able to figure out why people had a problem with the Tau in the Grimdark 40k universe. I think their inclusion is all the more perfect for the universe. They're young, they're dynamic, they're UTTERLY EFFING CLUELESS ABOUT THE UNIVERSE OF HORRORS they so foolishly think is their birthright. The Tau is like so many co-eds camping at Crystal Lake. They drink, they smoke dope, they investigate strange noises at night. We as the audience know of the horrors that the galaxy holds, but these schmucks just blunder forward. Let them remain guilless and pure: the joy is watching them realize the true nature of the galaxy and wrestle with their own ideology in the face of that, not making them just "blue guys with moar skullz and dakka."
I never have been able to figure out why people had a problem with the Tau in the Grimdark 40k universe. I think their inclusion is all the more perfect for the universe. They're young, they're dynamic, they're UTTERLY EFFING CLUELESS ABOUT THE UNIVERSE OF HORRORS they so foolishly think is their birthright. The Tau is like so many co-eds camping at Crystal Lake. They drink, they smoke dope, they investigate strange noises at night. We as the audience know of the horrors that the galaxy holds, but these schmucks just blunder forward. Let them remain guilless and pure: the joy is watching them realize the true nature of the galaxy and wrestle with their own ideology in the face of that, not making them just "blue guys with moar skullz and dakka."
It's not the Tau, it's their fans ( some of them ). Because they took that young and well balanced race and put it on huge/awesome/totally cool position over everyone else. Next thing: Tau can now kill Chaos gods and rape Titans with millions upon billions of Railguns. And they are advancing so fast that even we ( real Humans ) are to stupid in comparison to them.
In fluff ( real fluff not fan made Tau ), they are quite well balanced. They have tech but they are limited to their 100 planets and have FTL drive that is so slow it's like comparing 1933 Ford with Bugatti Veyron in terms of speed. And they can take almost any enemy, except great hordes. But they never fought full Tyranid invasion or big Ork WARRGHHHH!!!!, nor they have saw true Necron uprising or true Imperial war might. They are quite fragile when it comes to this things, but they live in Ultramar witch is quite peaceful place in the galaxy. And since Imperium have no interest in them they are good, for now.
The tau have already assimilated a psyker race into their empire, the nomadic nicassar. There are no known occurances of daemonic posession among them so they either have developed defences against
the more unfriendly denizens of the warp or the nicassar keep such incidents secret.
What people fail to understand is that the Imperium of Man is ultimately not a centralised state but deeply feudal in nature with obligations in the entire galaxy which do not allow to concentrate significant forces in one area unless the situation is truly dire ( and therefore the losses that come with abandoning/weakening other fronts are considered to be acceptable ). It is this inherent weakness, which allows minor xenos races and piratical orkempire to survive ( in some cases even relatively large empires of the archenemy, as the loss of the Sabath sector shows ) and not necessarily some perceived imperial disinterest.
It's not the Tau, it's their fans ( some of them ). Because they took that young and well balanced race and put it on huge/awesome/totally cool position over everyone else. Next thing: Tau can now kill Chaos gods and rape Titans with millions upon billions of Railguns. And they are advancing so fast that even we ( real Humans ) are to stupid in comparison to them.
On the other hand we have imperial hardcorefanboys who can't seem to accept that the corrupt imperium of man could ever be ( in some aspects ) inferior to some filthy xenos race. No matter that the dogmatic martian brotherhood stunts allmost all technological progress, no matter that they are kept in the clutches of a deeply corrupt church which keeps them in perpetual ignorance, all in the name of some uncaring god emperor ( who wanted to create an Imperium based on knowledge and understanding and not on superstition and fear ). No, a xenos race cannot be balanced at all unless the oh so great Imperium of Man is superior to them in all possible aspects, because one is filthy xeno ( or gods beware, chaos aligned) and the other is human, and therefore always right and pure and super.
On the other hand we have imperial hardcorefanboys who can't seem to accept that the corrupt imperium of man could ever be ( in some aspects ) inferior to some filthy xenos race. No matter that the dogmatic martian brotherhood stunts allmost all technological progress, no matter that they are kept in the clutches of a deeply corrupt church which keeps them in perpetual ignorance, all in the name of some uncaring god emperor ( who wanted to create an Imperium based on knowledge and understanding and not on superstition and fear ). No, a xenos race cannot be balanced at all unless the oh so great Imperium of Man is superior to them in all possible aspects, because one is filthy xeno ( or gods beware, chaos aligned) and the other is human, and therefore always right and pure and super.
You know, I'm not sure if I really believe it, or if I'm just playing along... either way, the Imperium of Man is totally superior. If for no other reason than they're the ones in charge, the ones everyone compares others to. Besides, they're human. Who are we to go against our own brethren?
KingDeath wrote:The tau have already assimilated a psyker race into their empire, the nomadic nicassar. There are no known occurances of daemonic posession among them so they either have developed defences against
the more unfriendly denizens of the warp or the nicassar keep such incidents secret.
What people fail to understand is that the Imperium of Man is ultimately not a centralised state but deeply feudal in nature with obligations in the entire galaxy which do not allow to concentrate significant forces in one area unless the situation is truly dire ( and therefore the losses that come with abandoning/weakening other fronts are considered to be acceptable ). It is this inherent weakness, which allows minor xenos races and piratical orkempire to survive ( in some cases even relatively large empires of the archenemy, as the loss of the Sabath sector shows ) and not necessarily some perceived imperial disinterest.
It's not the Tau, it's their fans ( some of them ). Because they took that young and well balanced race and put it on huge/awesome/totally cool position over everyone else. Next thing: Tau can now kill Chaos gods and rape Titans with millions upon billions of Railguns. And they are advancing so fast that even we ( real Humans ) are to stupid in comparison to them.
On the other hand we have imperial hardcorefanboys who can't seem to accept that the corrupt imperium of man could ever be ( in some aspects ) inferior to some filthy xenos race. No matter that the dogmatic martian brotherhood stunts allmost all technological progress, no matter that they are kept in the clutches of a deeply corrupt church which keeps them in perpetual ignorance, all in the name of some uncaring god emperor ( who wanted to create an Imperium based on knowledge and understanding and not on superstition and fear ). No, a xenos race cannot be balanced at all unless the oh so great Imperium of Man is superior to them in all possible aspects, because one is filthy xeno ( or gods beware, chaos aligned) and the other is human, and therefore always right and pure and super.
Are we not admitting that both Eldar and Necrons are superior to the IOM in tech. As of now the IOM IS the biggest Empire in the 40K fluff. Eldar were better then failed, Necrons were better and could be better but they are sleeping, if ork's could ever unify IOM is in huge trouble, chaos isn't an Empire it's a force that affects everyone and want no form of social order, and if Tau keep growing then they will be a big problem, and their is no doubt the Imperium is in trouble. But as of now they are the most successful race in 40K.
KingDeath wrote:
On the other hand we have imperial hardcorefanboys who can't seem to accept that the corrupt imperium of man could ever be ( in some aspects ) inferior to some filthy xenos race. No matter that the dogmatic martian brotherhood stunts allmost all technological progress, no matter that they are kept in the clutches of a deeply corrupt church which keeps them in perpetual ignorance, all in the name of some uncaring god emperor ( who wanted to create an Imperium based on knowledge and understanding and not on superstition and fear ). No, a xenos race cannot be balanced at all unless the oh so great Imperium of Man is superior to them in all possible aspects, because one is filthy xeno ( or gods beware, chaos aligned) and the other is human, and therefore always right and pure and super.
That's not the point. I know all these things are true, even so Imperium is quite powerful entity in the galaxy ( read codex: the most powerful political entity in the galaxy ). I never said that Imperium is so powerful that can defeat Chaos Gods, nor that it can exterminate Orks nor that can defeat everyone at the same time. But Imperiun can exterminate Tau if they want to - and that's a fact. And they are not pure, nor did I said that. I only implemented that Imperium is necessary for continued Human survival as without it galaxy would be like Earth today with who knows how many Human empires. And they would all fall one by one.
An I am with the Imperium because I am with my race ( unlike some people here, traitors ).
Nicholas wrote:
Are we not admitting that both Eldar and Necrons are superior to the IOM in tech. As of now the IOM IS the biggest Empire in the 40K fluff. Eldar were better then failed, Necrons were better and could be better but they are sleeping, if ork's could ever unify IOM is in huge trouble, chaos isn't an Empire it's a force that affects everyone and want no form of social order, and if Tau keep growing then they will be a big problem, and their is no doubt the Imperium is in trouble. But as of now they are the most successful race in 40K.
The Imperium isn't a massive empire so much as a collection of empires. There is no meaningful central control, and most organisations within it have their own agenda and would gladly see their "allies" burn if it would further their own goals. In technology they are inferior to Necrons, Eldar and even some Orks and, unlike their competition, they aren't advancing because of their superstitions. In size, they are large-but because of the massive distances between worlds and their unreliable Warp usage they can rarely co-ordinate their efforts, and as such every planet is pretty much an independent nation that can never fully rely on their fellow worlds. Only through tyranny and oppression can they keep themselves from collapsing. Meanwhile, their military is overstretched, their government is corrupt and their enemies outnumber them by millions to one. And, no matter what they do, they are destined to lose as their very existence fuels the Chaos Gods.
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
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Brother Coa wrote:
That's not the point. I know all these things are true, even so Imperium is quite powerful entity in the galaxy ( read codex: the most powerful political entity in the galaxy ). I never said that Imperium is so powerful that can defeat Chaos Gods, nor that it can exterminate Orks nor that can defeat everyone at the same time. But Imperiun can exterminate Tau if they want to - and that's a fact. And they are not pure, nor did I said that. I only implemented that Imperium is necessary for continued Human survival as without it galaxy would be like Earth today with who knows how many Human empires. And they would all fall one by one.
An I am with the Imperium because I am with my race ( unlike some people here, traitors ).
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Who in the GDotFF isn't split with infighting, though? The Tyranids, I suppose, but that's it. Orks go to war with orks as a matter of course, Chaos fights itself constantly. The Craftworld Eldar are mostly loyal to their craftworld, but the different craftworlds are divided. Dark Eldar make treachery and murder a lifestyle. Even the Tau have the farsight enclaves holding out against the empire proper. Everyone's divided, and if the Imperium is moreso, that's largely because there are just more groups to be divided into.
As far as the daemons, Nicholas is right that they aren't a proper military in the same way as the other armies. Their numbers are beyond counting, sure, but in the warp. In the material universe, which the other armies fight over, the daemonic power is severely restricted. They almost function more like a natural disaster than an interstellar empire.
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
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Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
TrollPie wrote: Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them.
Wrong, just remember 3'rd War for Armageddon. Who answered the call? ( Imperial Gaurd, SoB, Space Marines )
Or 13'th Black Crusade.
They aren't united in means of territory. They are united in means of the nececity of the situation and their faith. And they are the single most unified thing in the galaxy.
TrollPie wrote: Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them.
Wrong, just remember 3'rd War for Armageddon. Who answered the call? ( Imperial Gaurd, SoB, Space Marines )
Or 13'th Black Crusade.
They aren't united in means of territory. They are united in means of the nececity of the situation and their faith. And they are the single most unified thing in the galaxy.
I wouldn't say most unified. Tau, Tyranid, perhaps Eldar( Not DE) are more unified.
TrollPie wrote: Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them.
Wrong, just remember 3'rd War for Armageddon. Who answered the call? ( Imperial Gaurd, SoB, Space Marines )
Or 13'th Black Crusade.
They aren't united in means of territory. They are united in means of the nececity of the situation and their faith. And they are the single most unified thing in the galaxy.
Can't rely. Thanks to Warp travel you can never be sure that anyone will help, and, if so, if they'll arrive in time. Major conflicts will always have reinforcements coming, since far more troops are dispatched in the first place.
TrollPie wrote: Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them.
Wrong, just remember 3'rd War for Armageddon. Who answered the call? ( Imperial Gaurd, SoB, Space Marines )
Or 13'th Black Crusade.
They aren't united in means of territory. They are united in means of the nececity of the situation and their faith. And they are the single most unified thing in the galaxy.
Can't rely. Thanks to Warp travel you can never be sure that anyone will help, and, if so, if they'll arrive in time. Major conflicts will always have reinforcements coming, since far more troops are dispatched in the first place.
So obviously when need be they can help each other, it isn't that unreliable because of the astronomican.
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
No Idea we shall see
It'll be an adventure! And at the end, we'll have learned 3 things.
1. We will have been remade as gods.
2. We may find out just how long posts can be.
3. We will find out just how much time we have on our hands...
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
No Idea we shall see
It'll be an adventure! And at the end, we'll have learned 3 things.
1. We will have been remade as gods.
2. We may find out just how long posts can be.
3. We will find out just how much time we have on our hands...
It's incredibly annoying to scroll down to see what you say then back up to quote it, but it will be worth it. Also notice how thin the center posts are getting.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
No Idea we shall see
It'll be an adventure! And at the end, we'll have learned 3 things.
1. We will have been remade as gods.
2. We may find out just how long posts can be.
3. We will find out just how much time we have on our hands...
It's incredibly annoying to scroll down to see what you say then back up to quote it, but it will be worth it. Also notice how thin the center posts are getting.
Definitely worth it. And it raises the suspense, too!
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
No Idea we shall see
It'll be an adventure! And at the end, we'll have learned 3 things.
1. We will have been remade as gods.
2. We may find out just how long posts can be.
3. We will find out just how much time we have on our hands...
It's incredibly annoying to scroll down to see what you say then back up to quote it, but it will be worth it. Also notice how thin the center posts are getting.
Definitely worth it. And it raises the suspense, too!
Don't ruin it for us Kamikaze. If you want to post on this thread do it in quotes.
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:Why didn't you quote me? Then we could have had:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Nicholas wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
Brother Coa wrote:
TrollPie wrote:
In short, the Imperium isn't the dominant faction in 40k. That title would go to Chaos, if anything.
True, Imperium is most powerful when it comes to military might in the galaxy and unity. Chaos is stronger because Chaos work on a different level ( in another realm ), witch is basicly cheating. But we have many ways to overcome them ( Necron pylons, the Tau, the Eldar, Grey Knights... ). And aldo Imperium is decentralized empire all planets work together in the Imperium toward the grater good of Mankind. Since they all know that they will stand together or die alone.
In military might Necrons or Daemons take the cake. And, while everyone in the Imperium is working towards the survival of mankind, they will always place their own lives above those of the masses. As I said, every organisation has their own agenda and won't necassarily serve just the Imperium.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
For TrollPie: "The Imperium is the largest and most powerful political entity in the galaxy, consisting of at least a million worlds, which are dispersed across most of the Milky Way galaxy. Consequently, an Imperial planet might be separated from its closest neighbor by hundreds or thousands of light years. As a stellar empire, the size of the Imperium can not be measured in terms of continuous territory, but only in the number of planetary systems in its control."
Political entity. Emphasis on that; while technically they are united under one banner, in reality corruption, backstabbing and treachery are rife.
Your still missing the point the Imperium is the most powerful Empire in the 40K universe at this moment that is a fact stated in canon, nobody is saying that this is changing, because that also is canon. You talk about backstabbing and infighting being the reason why the Imperium is weak, yet call chaos more powerful. The necrons right now are not stronger than the Imperium, they could be but they are not now. I don't know why you think demons are more powerful because 1. they are not an empire and 2. They are one of the rarest things in 40K because they need the veil to be thin between worlds. Every empire will eventually have infighting as well, Eldar war in heaven, Tau farsight, Orks do it 24/7, C'tan eat each other. Chaos backstab twice as much as the IOM, in reality of 40K we are all screwed
Again, it isn't a completely united empire. Each planet is a semi-independent nation that's often hundreds of light years from their nearest neighbour. Every aspect of the Imperium is scattered across the galaxy and can't rely on anyone helping them. If the Imperium was more densely packed and Warp travel was more reliable, they would be the most powerful force in the galaxy. As it is, they are in no way dominant.
Edit: And the War in Heaven wasn't a civil war.
Source for them not being able to help each other, we do have warp drives. It is said explicitly in fluff that they are currently the dominant race, and that they are falling, who right now in this moment in 40K has more power than the IOM, without making up scenarios that may or may not happen such as orks uniting, Necrons waking up, or a massive hole tearing through reality allowing all the demons to come through.
Warp dries are the problem: they're so unreliable. The fractured and scattered state of the Imperium means that while their total power may be greater than that of any other force, they can't apply it effectively. The Imperium is the most powerful empire as a whole, but they aren't dominant- in the same way a lion is the most powerful creature in the forest, but it doesn't have power over the pack of hyenas.
Anyway, this is off topic and I'm going to lose this arguement. Lets pretend it never happened and that I'm the genius you all used to think I am...
It is dominant, It isn't fighting a pack of hyenas that assumes it's enemies are unified, it's more like a lion fighting a cheeta a hyena a tiger and a wolf who are all also fighting each other. We should get back on topic though, anyone remember what we were talking about.
From OP:
"How large is the Tau Empire? In respects to the Imperium? ANd who are the Tau's biggest threat?"
That was answered on page one...so what have we been talking about for the last six and a half pages?
We were both sort of calling each other fanboys over and over Oh well it happens sometimes I blame GW
That always happens with Tau threads.
See what could have been? SEE???
You are right so much wasted potential I shall have to make up for it.
There
And so the chain of quotes goes ever on.
And on, and on, until the MODquisition
It'd be pretty hilarious if they just popped up screaming, "Noooooobody expects the Modquisition!"
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
And so we will.
Should we talk about something else now?
Only if you want to do it in really long quotes.
Whoa... I leave for like, 12 hours, and this.... this... work of art is born?? I feel like this should somehow be commemorated.
Just think if we can get one post to be as long as a page we will become gods and own the Internetz
Well I think that this is a worthy goal! Is there any limit on how long a post can be?
No Idea we shall see
It'll be an adventure! And at the end, we'll have learned 3 things.
1. We will have been remade as gods.
2. We may find out just how long posts can be.
3. We will find out just how much time we have on our hands...
It's incredibly annoying to scroll down to see what you say then back up to quote it, but it will be worth it. Also notice how thin the center posts are getting.
Definitely worth it. And it raises the suspense, too!
Don't ruin it for us Kamikaze. If you want to post on this thread do it in quotes.
Oh well it happens sometimes I blame 
Unfortunately I must leave you all to continue the infinite quote.
