So this is just an over view of the army book.
A quick description of the unit a run through of what they can have what they can take and some set ups that work.
Here goes.

Hope everyone enjoys


Lords.

Kholek:
He is pricey and a cannon magnet.
Yet he fits in really well with a monster army and if he makes it to combat he tears things up to the point where it stops being funny.

Sigvald:
A little on the expensive side.
No themed Slaanesh army is complete without him, his special rules make terrain less of a problem and him with a strong unit can and will massacre units.

On to the generic lords.

Chaos lord:
Great stat line, he is your cc lord choice he has the stats to lay down the law.
He has lots of options different marks, mounts and combine with the magical items and weapons from the army book and brb he is more than a formidable foe.
Personal favorite set up:



Sorcerer lord:
He is your level 4 sorcerer with a little more punch and defense than most other casters (as in he can duke it out if he has to).
He has access to Lore of Death, Fire, Shadow, Heavens, Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh.
The sorcerer wears chaos armor meaning he can take magic armor he also has a 100 points worth of magic items allowance and 50 point of gifts limit.
Personal favorite set up:



Daemon Prince:
The big mean nasty flying beasty.
He is a bit on the pricier side and lacks an armor save how ever with mot and a few wizard levels and a gift or 2 and he can be a real menace.
Boss salvage came up with several good builds that I cannot find at the moment.



Heroes.

Festus:
A worth while character to take for a good points cost.
Gives a unit 5+ regen saves and guaranties you the nurgle spell curse of the leper and another spell from the lore of nurlge.
Like my friend Ralin runs him with a unit of marauders, this makes him them way more livable.

Troll king Throgg:
Hes the big bad troll king.
He makes trolls a core choice so if you are interested in a troll and or monster army he is the character to have.
Throgg stops trolls from suffering from stupidity and confers his ld to other beasties like the army general would.

Chaos sorcerer:
Your support caster lvl 1 or lvl2 sorcerer with access to the lore of death, fire, Tzeentch, Slaanesh and Nurgle.
He has a 50 point magic item allowance and 25 point gift allowance.
Personal favorite set up:



Exalted hero:
Your watered down combat lord and your armies battle standard bearer.
He has a pretty good stat line very punchy with access to all 4 marks of chaos or choose to be left unmarked.
The exalted hero has a magic item points allowance of 50 points and a 25 point gift allowance.
Personal favorite set up:



Core.

Chaos warriors:
Your core choice that has a better stat line than most armies elite unites but with a great stat line comes a cost, they are not cheap.
They have the option to take one of the four chaos marks or remain unmarked, with a variety of options to take: shields, AHW, GW and halberd.
Personal liked set ups.



Marauders:
The cheap horde in the chaos army book.
They have the choice to take one of the 4 marks of chaos or choose to remain unmarked.
The choices for extra equipment is: Shields, flails, GW and light armor.
Some effective set ups.



Marauder horsemen:
The fast cav of the chaos army.
They are quite costly for the lack of armor but can be quite effective.
They have the choice to take one of the marks of chaos with the choices of taking Shields, light armor, flails, spears,throwing spears, throwing axes, with the choice of a command.
Some effective set ups.



War hounds:
The pets of the marauders. They are large menacing dog like creatures that travel to war with the angry mobs of marauders and warriors.
Some effective set ups.



Special.

Chosen:
The beefed up version of a chaos warrior.
They have the same basic choices as a chaos warriors for marks and gear.
The main difference is the chosen champ can take a magic item with a limit of 25 points.
An effective set up.



Forsaken:
They are unpredictable and only wear heavy armor.
They do not have access to any marks or upgrades.
With a low stat line, over all unpredictability and a large points cost they are not a great investment.

Chaos chariot:
The chariot choice for the chaos army.
It can take any of the 4 marks of chaos.
Crewed by 2 chaos warriors with halberds.


Ogres:
Ogres that have turned to fight for the chaos gods, they can take any of the 4 marks of chaos.
They have the choice to upgrade their armor from heavy armor to chaos armor, AHW and great weapons along with the option of a fc.
Some set ups.



Dragon Ogres:
A combination of a giant lizard and an ogre.
They have a high movement lots of wounds high str.
They do not have a choice in marks but they have the choice of taking AHW and GW also one may be upgraded to a champ.
An effective set up.



Trolls:
They are trolls, they have a good movement and are armed with hand weapons.
They do not have access to any marks of chaos and no access to any upgrades.
They have mutant regeneration and troll vomit making them hit hard in cc.
An effective set up.



Chaos Knights:
These heavily armored bringers of death are fast moving heavy hitters.
The knights are armored with chaos armor and a shield and mounted on a barded chaos steed and are armed with ensorcelled weapons.
They have the choice to take any of the marks of chaos as well as being able to chose normal lances.
A couple of set ups.



Rare.

Chaos spawn:
These monstrosities fall stumble roll and flail randomly across the battle field.
With a random move and random attacks and the choice of the 4 mars of chaos.
An effective set up.



Chaos warshine:
They carry the symbols of the dark gods into battle making them more aware of the battle and the warriors that are taking part in it.
The shrines bless units with rolls on the eye of the god rolls bestowing gifts from the dark gods themselves.
An effective use.



Hellcannon:
Daemon spirit bound to the metal making an angry metal beast the spits the molten flesh and crushed bones of its victims onto anything that stands before it.
The cannon shoots a small template at high str like a stone thrower.
It is great fro watching the back of the battle line and stands up to most war machine hunters and can hold its own in combat.
It has no access to any marks an no access to any additional equipment.
An effective use.



Dragon Ogre Shaggoth:
Bigger than a dragon ogre but smaller than Kholek and all around just nasty.
It is very strong has a good movement and over all a good stat line.
It does not have access to any of the marks but has the choice for an AHW or a gw.
An effective use.



Giant:
These abominations trudge across the battle field stumbling every now and again stepping on everything smaller than him and hitting anything too small to step on with his massive club.
The giant does not attack as normal but has its own special table of attacks.
He also has access to all 4 marks but does not have access to any equipment.
An effective set up.



So this is a quick over view of the chaos army book.

cowpow16 wrote:
Hellcannon:
Daemon spirit bound to the metal making an angry metal beast the spits the molten flesh and crushed bones of its victims onto anything that stands before it.
The cannon shoots a large template at high str like a stone thrower.
It is great fro watching the back of the battle line and stands up to most war machine hunters and can hold its own in combat.
It has no access to any marks an no access to any additional equipment.
An effective use.

Sitting in the back field for a turn or 2 then charging headlong into combat and eating and stomping the enemy.

I thought the hellcannon only used the small template?

Ooops


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Fixed it thanks for pointing that out.

a good read i just wanted to make sure i hadnt been cheating myself out of alot more kills lol

Haha ya no worries and ya wouldnt that be terrible?

But ya think this is a decent general overview?

yeah its good.
i like the idea on giving tips for character / unit builds.

Well some tips never hurt to point you in a direction that makes it easier to start.
Thought it would be a nice little add on.

Looks pretty good, but I'd disagree on 2 points.
120 points for a chariot is a good purchase when used supporting deep infantry. 5 wide marauders of tzeench that strip steadfast, supported by a chariot charge will win you combat. D6+1 hits, and another 4S5 attacks is a great deal at 120 points.
If you're running warriors in wide units, or marauders in horde formation, you won't have the narrow front that will let the chariot go corner to corner. But in a list designed for chariots that deploy narrow and deep, they work very well. The swiftstrider lets the chariot run down things that warriors and marauders don't catch.

On the topic of Fast Cav, that comes down to the opponent. Marauder cav is ~20 points more expensive than goblin fast cav, only hits more often, and much harder. Also has very nifty Horse Lords rule, which has won me games.
85 points gives you 5, with shields and spear, and mark of slaanesh. That's S4/S3 attacks on warmachines, turn 2.
In an army that lacks scouts, fliers and warmachines, this is a very cheap way to deal with enemy gun-ines.
MoS means you won't panic, forcing an opponent to kill them all to save their warmachines.
If 2 units of fast cav can divert attention from the real threats (advancing infantry), you can do pretty well.



You left out chaos hounds.
Cheap meat shield that gives other units a round of protection from BS based shooting.

-Matt

Thanks for that I have not yet used horsemen until September.

Oops forgot about hounds my bad ill add that in.

Still tho for 10 points more a shrine is that will get you a lot more and has more and better saves and giver of glory is pretty nice.

I'm a 40k player looking to jump into fantasy with WoC being my first army. This is greatly appreciated.

cowpow16 wrote:Thanks for that I have not yet used horsemen until September.

Oops forgot about hounds my bad ill add that in.

Still tho for 10 points more a shrine is that will get you a lot more and has more and better saves and giver of glory is pretty nice.

i agree id rather pay 10 points more for a shrine over a chariot.
mark slaanesh is a must for the horse riders tho. they tend to get shot at alot lol

Well glad I could help

With a 5+ armor save may as well make em useful and not run away.

Even tho I ammo a fan of running shrines without chosen (since my rolls suck) they are a better investment.

Just an observation: Sigvald as he stands is pretty much completely useless. I constructed a Lord with the Mark of Khorne on a Juggernaut that can quite literally do absolutely everything better than Sigvald can for 10pts less.

If used properly he can be quite devastating.

Point being I believe I also mentioned that he is usually used in a themed list, which is usually not the same as a super competitive list.

There are lord builds that can do more damage too but Sigi is a useful character in a themed army he can pull his weight and would fit, I would see no other use for him.

Nice One Cowpow, A great report This should help me make my new WoC army list

Why thank you and hey that was the intent, make things a little easier for people or at least give them something to start with.

Sounds like this was worth doing

AnomanderRake wrote:Just an observation: Sigvald as he stands is pretty much completely useless. I constructed a Lord with the Mark of Khorne on a Juggernaut that can quite literally do absolutely everything better than Sigvald can for 10pts less.

Really?
You were able to make a lord with 1+ armor, 4+ regen, stubborn, ASF, ItP, 7 attacks, he and his unit treat dangerous terrain as clear; AND gets a look out roll?
Or wait, I also forgot about Ld10.

I'm thinking you glossed over some of those abilities.

-Matt

Congrats to Matt for looking over the finer points of Sigi.
I didnt even remember all that.

As I said I have seen him be very effective and make himself more than worth his points.

Looks good Cow, should I post up the Items and Spells here or just send em to you and let you edit them in?

Looks good, but Im not glad that you left Wulfrik out.... He is by far one of the most effective SC in the army, but except for that it looks good. I hope for maybe a battle plan? or a show of how you build your army

Ralin doo it up ill link your link in this

Sorry I thought I had him in there.
The thing with him which Ralin pointed out was the enemy will hug the sides and the back meaning your main troops have further to go which is a good counter strategy.

I am not sure how to actually teach or tell people how to build an army since I dont know how I do it myself.

The way I usually start is figuring out what my points limit for each section is as in lords heroes core blah blah.

Then I go with what I want in the army like say I want a hellcannon or a lord or hero set up a certain way or a unit.

I write that down, I prefer microsoft word since I have a PC.
Enter him in and continue on.

Fill out the required core and then see what you have left for points.

At that point just see what unit that would still be effective you could fit in.

See what you have left for points and if you need to drop some drop them off the lord or hero or drop useless upgrades adn or gifts.

Then toy with it.

Ralin Givens wrote:Looks good Cow, should I post up the Items and Spells here or just send em to you and let you edit them in?

when is this been added.?

Cowpow,

I like some of your ideas here but you didn't go as in depth as I'd have liked. =(

You left out a few SC's because you think they can be countered, but forgot to consider their synergy with certain builds.

Valkryia can be used effectively as a Fear-Causing flyer with killing blow and a devastating charge.

Wulfrik is best used in an army with two hellcannons and a BSB in the back sporting the Doom Totem along with a Lore of Death Wizard. Sure.. they see Wulfie and 50 Marauders.. but they cant castle up because you will destroy them with focused cannon-fire. Then, all their units are testing against hellcannon wounds at -3 Ld. Wulfrik eats up whats left or engages their biggest threat in endless marauder combat while your main force advances up.

He also poops on Slaans and Teclis.

I didnt know if this was supposed to be a rudimentary rundown or an in-depth look at the army book, but it was informative without breaking everything down to nuts and bolts.

Nice work.

I know I didn't include everything I didn't have the time to.

The reason for wulfrik isthe rest of your army gets tofoot slog it further because an opponent will hug the backand flanks.

This was supposed to be for just a general idea for starters and such.

This wasn't meant for me to tell people how to build an army but rather to give a starting point and then go from there.

As for the rest it will be added soon might leave out characters since you should figure them outfit yourself.

But thanks if you want to know something in detail I could prob help ya but ya this was supposed to be general.

Very informative! Thank you!

Just one question though: the BSB, if he takes a magic banner, is he then not allowed to take any magic items?

I may be wrong, since I'm a noob, but I would just like to make sure.

saintevil wrote:Very informative! Thank you!

Just one question though: the BSB, if he takes a magic banner, is he then not allowed to take any magic items?

I may be wrong, since I'm a noob, but I would just like to make sure.

Yes that is true for all armies.

You hit the nail on the head.

Just a suggestion there is no banner that the bsb needs for what he costs give him magic stuff works way better and is much more fun.

Just a quick mention, unless it's been FAQ'd, Throgg does not get rid of stupidity for trolls. He just gives them better leadership. He doesn't have it, but his unit will, and thus has to test. Also, Chaos armor is allowed to be worn while casting spells, but other magic armor (shield) is not. So, if the magic armor has "chaos armor" in the rules, it's ok for the sorc. If it doesn't say "chaos armor," he can't wear it. Just wanted to help out.

Where does it say you cant have shield and cast?
The sorcerer has armor hence he can take magic armor as far as I am aware.

The book and the FAQ state they can wear magic shields.

I cant find anything about throgg in the faq at first skim.

My apologies on the magic shields. You are absolutely correct on that. In the previous book it was Chaos Armor only, and everyone I play with continued that rule-I'll have to take advantage of it. It's kind of hidden, when it should be showing up in either the magic item section or the sorcerer rules.

However Throgg definitely does not remove stupidity for trolls. His rules state that he causes fear, has will of chaos, eye of gods, mutant regen, trolls become core and all monsters may use his leadership within 12 inches and re-roll failed breaktests, and he has vomit. Nowhere in there does he remove stupidity.

Sorry my bad on the trolls.
Yes they stay stupid but ld 8 beats ld 4 woot.
Keep a bsb close enough and or be in range of charging stupid units

Nice little overview, as a player interested in starting WOC, I'm loving this.

Good to hear thanks hope it helps I will update it and do a little adding hopefully next week good luck and hope you join the dark gods

cowpow16 wrote:Good to hear thanks hope it helps I will update it and do a little adding hopefully next week good luck and hope you join the dark gods

not good enough!!! update it now i need more pearls of wisdom

timetowaste85 wrote:My apologies on the magic shields. You are absolutely correct on that. In the previous book it was Chaos Armor only, and everyone I play with continued that rule-I'll have to take advantage of it. It's kind of hidden, when it should be showing up in either the magic item section or the sorcerer rules.

However Throgg definitely does not remove stupidity for trolls. His rules state that he causes fear, has will of chaos, eye of gods, mutant regen, trolls become core and all monsters may use his leadership within 12 inches and re-roll failed breaktests, and he has vomit. Nowhere in there does he remove stupidity.

Actually they get his LD regardless of being within 12 inches or not, the only thing that is affected by the 12 inches is they get to re-roll failed Break Tests.

I am still new but did just read that rule this evening and thought i would help.

I do like the over view!

Thanks

I think I will have some time in a few weeks to update this and hopefully make it more helpful.

But remember these are only ideas everyone has to get their army built because everyone want something else out of their army.

Nice review! I first disagreed about that chariots suck, since I have found a use of them as a mount to my exalted hero. It may not be competitive or cheap, but it sure hell is devastating and fun

cowpow16 wrote:Thanks

I think I will have some time in a few weeks to update this and hopefully make it more helpful.

But remember these are only ideas everyone has to get their army built because everyone want something else out of their army.

Your Welcome

When you fight cannons that hero and chariot goes poof.
The model is quite bad looking IMO.

Would you mind posting the hero build? I would be interested in seeing it.

What other lore do you think would work well against orcs/beastmen, I find unless I roll 4+6, I cant really do much with my magic phase, I dunno if its worth it for the occasional big hit with infernal gateway

A level 4 shadow and level 2 nurgle work well together, I think a lot of people are a bit too tunnel visioned on the lore of Tzeentch at times so always hear the gateway mentioned .
Slaanesh against low Ld armies even with BSB and generals I think could be very interesting, add in -ld hellcannon hits after lowering ld here and there... Still to try it out admittedly

Vermillion wrote:A level 4 shadow and level 2 nurgle work well together, I think a lot of people are a bit too tunnel visioned on the lore of Tzeentch at times so always hear the gateway mentioned .

QFT
Withering/ Enfeebleing Foe + Curse of the Leper

I like festus because he makes my marauders awesome and gives me 2 nurgle spells.

Shadow always useful lots of really good spells to help your units.

Fire is always fun if you have a lvl 2 fire mage to help out.

Not so sure about lore of slaanesh, I havent tried it.

i think I killed myself once with lore of death but had a really good game with that another time.

But ya I mean I like the fluff behind tz and thats why I run a lot of tz stuff.

he seems pretty squishy though, do you put him on the end of the front rank or something? I can see him being killed quite easily by a few attacks directed his way

I haven't had him die in combat to be honest.
He makes marauders quite durable and the poison makes them good against monsters and other really tough things.

Ill be giving him a go next game, I tried my horde without, they do some serious damage but without any saves some units can reduce their attacks before they get a chance.

Also, can a character in a unit use favor of the gods to alter warshrine results for the whole unit he is in? (just like a champ in a chosen unit if he had the item) Im thinking the warshrine looks pretty damn good and I have a chariot model and loads of spare bits waiting.

Yes to the modifying the eotg results with favor of the gods.
Makes chosen pretty scary.

Marauders do die pretty fast without the saves it is very sad to see them get decimated by arrows :(

This is EXACTLY what I was looking for! Thank you! I'm a 40k player looking at taking a stab at fantasy and I've finally settled on WoC.

This was my plan...
2x Battalion Box
Chosen
Chosen Command
Lord on Juggernaut
Sorc Lord
Then maybe a hellcannon, chariot, or marauder horsemen depending on what kind of $$ I can budget.

Does that sound like a good start? Would a (mostly) Khorne themed army be effective? I'm willing to mark a few things something else but I think I'd like the overall theme to be Khorney. I mostly picked WoC because the models look friggin fantastic, especially warriors, knights, and chosen, so naturally I'd love to play an army with a fair amount of those bad boys in there... assuming it won't just get me killed every game. Anyway, any advice would be great! Thanks!

Suggestions just one you may want to also get the finecast khorne hero with shield and ax he is super sexy and his fine cast model looks way better than the metal.

Two battalions is a great start you get a lot of what you need.

Khorney armys definitely work. Just can't have a marked sorcerer but oh well.

Mok marauders, warriors, and knights kick but hard.

I'm glad this helped good luck and post up a list when you write one up.

So I can't mark the sorc if I'm running.... a Khorne Lord, what exactly prevents me from marking the sorc?

Thanks for the help!

We all know I used this to help build my list and starter army, which is coming along quite nicely and should be getting 30 of the 38 models needed any day now!

Thanks CowPow you were my only hope

fleetofclaw wrote:So I can't mark the sorc if I'm running.... a Khorne Lord, what exactly prevents me from marking the sorc?

Thanks for the help!

I think he just means theme wise, you cant really count the sorc, nothing is stopping you running a nurg/slaa/tz sorc in your list though.

At least old warriors you could ignore wizards with all the dispel dice you got from MoK!

Yes sorry I didnt clarify you cant give a sorcerer mok (because its not an option in the book).

Glad I could help cutthroat.

Really helpful, looking at starting up a WoC force once I have my current 40k projects taken care of and this'll really help when I come to build my list! Thanks!

Glad to hear it

-Edit-

Info was wrong, nvm!

I so want to try the daemonsword mok lord out sometime, what other items would you take for him? Too scared atm taking a lord without a ward, but imagine the destruction he could cause!

I would say give him the sword give him the helm of many eyes and put him in a unit of chosen.
Give him mot and run him in a chosen starish sort of unit.
That way he dosnt have to worry about a ward save, hes in a unit and well ya he would make quite a mess.

So what would being in the group of chosen do for him?

Cutthroatcure wrote:So what would being in the group of chosen do for him?

It means when he butchers his own troops, they will hopefully have 3++ to minimise dmg :p (and yeah 3+ ward for himself without having to spend magic items)

Good idea cow, although Im sick of having to run MoT for anything decent :( hope the new book whenever it comes changes em so we can have a themed army without one mark reigning supreme

So with Sigvald, Did I read correct that he has a +1 Armor save?

yes (1+ though not +1, but I assume that is what you meant anyways!)

Yeah it is.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So can anyone tell me the downsides of Valkia? Because she seems like a total beast!

She takes up alot of points for someone who does not have a ward save and is fairly fragile for a chaos lord. Really out of the special lords only Sigvlad seems to be worth while IMO.

Chaos special heroes are all amazing and viable

I like Kholek and think with 8 wounds he should make it thru cannon fire, but as i have yet to play my first fantasy game I don't have much experience.

My problem with Kholek is not his wounds but his I and his points. One purple sun or pit of shades can leave you without a 600+ point general.

Kholek can mess cannons up if he gets first turn

You gentlemen are correct that was the plan with the 3++.

I do like the mot but I also feel that it's time for some options. I wouldn't mind painting up some nurgle warriors to be completely honest.

Valkia is fragile and I don't think she is stuborn. This means you usually have to charge along side another unit. Even then she can still be poked to death.

I am a fan of sigi he is actually pretty useful and is quite well protected.

The big lizard eats pretty much all your lord points. This can give you a disadvantage because you will not have a lvl4 cutting down on your magic offense and defence.
How ever if he makes it to combat he could end the existance of what ever unit he was fighting.

Ok so I had a question about the Warshrine, does the Champion in the unit of Chaos Warriors benefit from the "Eye of the gods" special rule?

Yupp warshrine works for all champions

That's pretty bonkers!

Yup very crazy. Especially for chosen.

In 6 games ive got 1 roll on eye of the gods. Definately need myself a warshrine and some chosen :(

Its kinda annoying they give us those rules and everyone just goes lol unit champ lol combat over :(

With chaos trolls I normally get a eye roll atleast twice during a opponents turn

I wouldnt mind 6 trolls tbh, might save up for just that

2 sets of the forgeworld ones would be a cool addition to my army

I agree about eye of the gods. Haven't gotten many myself because no one wants to fight my hero.

Trolls do seem pretty sweet I haven't gotten any yet but
at some point a troll unit would be sweet.
The forge world ones look quite nice.

I am doing 7 trolls and Throgg in my 1500 list so I should have some good chances, and my Lord is a Sorc. So hopefully he gets some kills as well!

Trolls are crazy unless you get hit by fire.
Throgg is pretty darn helpful.
Usually you don't want you sorcerer lord in combat because he can't cast damage spells out of combat and he isn't up to par with other races fighty characters just as a heads up.

What are you guys using for throgg(model) out of interest?

Reaper makes a great cheap one but I am using a converted dire troll mauler

I am going to use a secondhand companies Resin Version.


also Cowpow with my list, Where would I be running my Sorc Lord? And I am running 19 Warriors with Shields and swords, would I throw him in there? Also for Movement Trays Should i do my Warriors 6 across 4 long? Or 5 across 4 long?

You run him by his lonesome! He can dart around, abuse terrain, and easily avoid most combats.

I like going 6 wide for combat blocks and 5 wide for steadfast

I am so confused, so your saying both...Which is better?

I run my warriors wide wide.

5 wide would be a marauder bus.

I havent made a throgg so I have used an ogre model

A friend runs his lvl4 in a masive tz warriors block and he seems to do alright so that could work.

Cutthroatcure wrote:I am so confused, so your saying both...Which is better?

He means, if they are there to blow things up, namely most WoC units, then 6 wide is a good bet. If they are there to tarpit and hold things up, they go 5 wide so they can use steadfast to hold combats they might not be able to win, since 6 wide warriors are rarely steadfast.

Cutthroatcure wrote:I am so confused, so your saying both...Which is better?

If your opponent is running 50 night goblin 5 wide by 10 deep, you want to be 6 wide because you're not going to win on steadfast.

If you expect to hit a group of Ogres, go 5 wide so even if you lose you will be steadfast.

So for my movement trays I should go 5 by 4 and give up the extra attack for Steadfast when they will only be four ranks deep?

Not necessarily, I would make them 6 wide anyway as thats probably the max width you will run them normally, and you can also go 5 wide pretty easily.

What biccat is saying is, if you are against a tough, low count unit, it may be worth getting the extra ranks as you might lose combat and thus being steafast would be advantagous.

EDIT: Remember, you can reform from combat and in the movement phase.

So i am still at a loss for how I should build my movement Trays lolz!

Make your movement trays 6x5 then you are made in the shade!

Johnny-Crass wrote:Make your movement trays 6x5 then you are made in the shade!

Awesome Thanks lolz!

Now for a question re the destructive potential of the following chaos lord load out. My main opponent will be a Bretonnian player and his general is a bit of a beast from what I remember him telling me (will look up the load out as soon as I can). So I'm thinking

Chaos Lord
- Crimson armour of durgan for killing blow immunity
- mark of khorne for frenzy
- axe of khorne for +1 strength & killing blow
- helm of many eyes for asf
- mounted on a manticore for a flying mount with killing blow

That sounds awesome to me, though as a fantasy noob I was hoping someone could tell me about its weaknesses? I'm guessing it'll be a beast of a target as it'll be out by itself all the time? Any others?

Crimson armor makes you loose your LD bubble so I would swap it for the cheaper talisman that does the same thing

Let him have his ld its a nice bonus.
I would say charmed shield and a ward save maybe mot to boost the ward.

I played a pretty stong lord set up the other day.
Lord
Mot
Tali of preservation
charmed shield
Rune sword.

Pretty nasty and I mean his lord will have to come at you to do anything.
If you put him with sword and board warriors or halberd warriors and his unit will have more than enough punch to deal with the brets,

Yeah I was gonna try the same but with MoK and on demonic mount since I have ye olde khorne lord model, looks pretty beastly on paper

really cant afford to try daemonsword with a bunch of expensive knights with no shrine and dice gods

Here's a cheeky combo

Crown of everlasting conquest: gain regenerate ability
Pendant of slaanesh: +1 attack for every wound suffered

Makes no mention of losing those attacks by regenerating those lost wounds!

Except regen is just a save that does not restore wounds.

Now lore of lifes atribute with pendant is fun

Maybe a combat focused sorcerer then... Are there any life spells that can be cast whilst locked in combat?

All besides dwellers and wrath of the wood

Too bad we don't get to use life magic yaay. The only chance is with the boon I think and with 3rd eye and even then we can't bring back dead warriors :(
how ever throne of vines is pretty solid and toughness 8 warriors is funny.

I would say stay awayfrom the cc sorcerer it may seem like a good idea but he doesnot match up with other fighty characters.

Yeah that sucks. As a matter of interest could ot be done through storm of magic and pacting to someone that can? sorry for asking ot questions!

Reckon third eye etc is a bit too hit or miss, and like you say hell suck in combat anyway. Cool if it were possible though!

Ypu can pact with vc tk and daemons I think daemons can do what ever they feel like doing in terms of magic.

Woc sorcerers are better at cc than most armies casters for several reasons. Warrior stats and fancy armor being the main ones.
He will not suck at cc it's just fighty characters can out do him so keep that in mind.


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Also as a side note I am quite interested to see what others are runnig so feel free to post character builds as well as unit and army builds if you feel like sharing.

I have been running a lvl4 heavens with carpet tali-pres charmed shield and third eye and then throgg

Question, why are there gifts of the gods over 50 points when no one can take a gift over 50 point value?

Daemonprinces can!

But in all fairness many people never run them, or feel those gifts are worth it. Only regularly see 4 or 5 of them used, and thats on casters and killy BSB's

Sad but true a lot of them cost too much for the little good they do.

The dp seem a little expensive for how squishy it is.

Lets hope that when a new book comes out they become worth it I have the old dp character kicking around here somewhere.

Agree about the DP, 300 point base cost seems steep, though I suppose when compared to the named characters at 400-600 points it isn't so bad, am I right in thinking that woc have some of the most expensive hq choices in the game?

Nope Vampires Lords can be stupidly expensive (like 700+ expensive)

OUCH!

Well, in fairness their statline, abilities etc do make them justify the points . The vampires I mean, not the princes. Pity, because I really do need a reason to justify buying one to sit and play with the plastic kit a bit

Also the Beleakor model is one of the best sculps GW has EVER made sooo

Belakor is a great model.
Sigval especially justifies his cost. Same with throg and festus.
A decked out chaos lord or sorcerer can do a ton of damage or just overall good things for you and are stupidly resilient usually.

Also a fully decked out lord or sorce lord can go above 700

My Maniticore lord is Like over 600 points.

You can get a vamp lord up to 855 max though I do not know how or why you would

Ok, so when the funds roll in I should end up with...

20 chosen
20 knights
36 warriors
40 marauders
20 hounds (from the 2x battalions)
tzeentch sorc on disc
khorne lord / hero
either a lord on a juggernaut or mount, probably both eventually, those models are just so bad ace

After looking at the book a little bit I thought maybe I'd mix tzeentch and khorne as opposed to all khorne (with the sorc as an exception). maybe tzeentch warriors, unmarked knights, khorne chosen and maruaders? I dunno, still figuring this all out.

Just a early heads up there will be very few cases where it makes sense to have 20 chaos knights 10 is more than enough since they are quite pricey.


Other than that seem pretty good.
Khorne warriors with halberds are pretty good.

When would anyone need 20 Knights except for during SOM?

A knight star instead of a chosen star would be fairly interesting....

Oh would it ever but soo soo pricey.
Still If anyone can get 20 knights in a list and second make them super useful do post it.

Are we talking one unit of 20 knights, or 20 knights spread out over a number of different units? And what points limit would you be looking at... I'm up for the challenge


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(I mean what points limit would you need to field them, not how many points would they cost )

I think it would be a D-Star (so one big unit) and I think 2500 would be a good size.

(I mean what points limit would you need to field them, not how many points would they cost )


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Wow, I didn't expect a reply so soon! My last post was supposed to be an edit to the one before lol

I'm up for that, 2500 doesn't sound too bad

Well lets make this the challenge chaps.

Either a 2.5k list or a 2999 list.

Everything has to follow the rules for building an army as in % have to be correct as well as magic items etc.

20 knights used in any way seen fit. As in it can be one unit or several.

The 20 have to be knights you cant use a knight as a lord if that makes sense.

You can use special characters etc.

Imma be back online tonight ill post what I came up with then.

I just sold my warriors book so I must decline the challenge.

Though mine would of involves Archaon and his Swords

Could anyone with a BRB post a quick summary of the army build rules for those of us that only have an army book? Ie, what percentage of your army can be lords / heroes, core choices, special, rare etc. Nothing too detailed, just enough to get me by.

Cheers

25% lord
25% hero
25% core
50% special
25% rare

Core 25% minimum.

3 Duplicates of special.
2 Duplicates of rare.

So I wrote out the whole list on my supposed 'smart' phone only for it to crash just as I was about to hit submit, and then found it had wiped the post clean

As a quick stop gap (will write it up properly tomorrow night) can you read this well enough?

Here it is.

Holy CRAP that is a ton of marauders!!!!!!

I just can't help myself, those chaos knights are some of the best looking models. Also as a flying heavy Nid player I guess I like speed. I guess that's why I was planning on buying 20 knights haha. Would you recommend the possibility of throwing a mounted lord in there as an alternative? Even if it's not optimal the idea of a lord thundering down the field with 20 knights is so epic.

Here's mine, typed up from el laptopo:

Running a mounted lord would work too, I ran mine on foot because the army is built more towards a marauders hold the front while knights flank charge.
Mixing marauders with gw and knights makes for a ton of dead what ever you are fighting.

I wouldnt put the knights all in one unit simply because of debuff spells and other nasty things.
If I were to mount the lord I would drop his shield give him favor of the gods and put him on a pony.

I find that the bsb is better off on foot because of the large amount of infantry with rather slow movement not that they get caught out of position because of a failed restrain test for a charge that is just barely possible to make.

I would not give any of my knights lances you pay points for an upgrade that makes your knights worse in a sense. With their normal weapons even ethereal things wont batter.
As well as always str 5 is nice.

The list was built on the strength of the knights. That being their speed armor and damage. The unit of 7 knights would get a total of 21 str 5 magical attacks where as the 6 man unit would only get 18. Still this usually does quite a number of wounds considering a lot is str and t 3 meaning the knights would wound on 2+. The other upside is the 1+ armor save makes even str 4 attacks be saved on a 2+.
The knights also cause fear which is nice to have. It will not always work but hey when you have a unit that fails its fear test it is good times they can barely hit you and you have an awesome armor save. Combine this all with the hitting power and ranks that marauders can offer and you have yourself a pretty nasty set up. Everyone with str 5 attacks chopping away at the enemy. The mobility and hitting power plus your possible ranks along with all other modifiers should make that combat yours to own.
The army has a bit of a weaker magic phase but never the less can handle itself. What is the enemy going to do when there are 3 units of knights and 3 units of marauders running around, they cant debuff all of them.
As well throwing a large fireball at things is usually pretty successful and the lore has a nice buff or 2 that will help deal with regen if the fireball dosnt do it.

Writing this list was actually quite interesting to be honest and if it were to be a 2999 list there would be at least one hellcannon if not two and the marauder units will get topped up to 50.

So the Marauders are your tar pits?

No the marauders are there to mess things up.

Those guys do a lot of damage they have ws4 and are str 5 with gw. Combining that with 2 attacks from the front (including frenzy) a full horde of marauders will dish out 41 str 5 attacks. There isnt much that can stand up to that and not say ouch.

Can't believe this is still going haha, I will get down to my WoC eventually, but first I will have to finish my GK's, Imperial Guard, Elven Kingdoms (LoTR) and Lizardmen, so this will probably be of no use to me because most likely we will be in 10th Edition!

I'll try to keep it updated as best as I can so who knows.

Makes Sense.

So im taking a 2000pts list to throne of skulls in march and I have a choice to make. Warshrine or a lvl 2 with the mark of slaanesh and a spell familiar.

I have used a warshrine up until now but I tested a slaanesh sorcerer the other day and he was awesome. Titallating delusions was literally a game winner for me. Hellshriek with the combination of Panamonium caused absolute havoc and hysterical frenzy basically boosted my chosen to make them killing machines.

What im worried about is that I already have a lvl 4 tzeentch but the addition of the 3 extra spells gives me more options.

Any thoughts?

I would say LVL 2 Slaanesh as they are amazing

The lvl 2 sounds pretty good as long as you have some experience with them rather than taking a never tested unit to a tournament doesnt seem like a good idea.

I would say post the 2 lists that way we have a better idea of what else you are taking to make a better decision.