Can't name my source, but this person is a fairly new source to me so please take this with a large helping of salt. I can't even be sure that I can trust this person 100% yet. We'll see if I can trust him if what he said actually comes to pass.

Codex: Necrons (Late October & all November)
Codex: Tau Empire (Early 2012)
6th Edition AND Codex: Legions of Chaos (Mid 2012)
Codex: Eldar (Late 2012)

The following are supposedly to be released in 2013, but I was not given a specific release order. With that said, the following is NOT in order of release.

Codex: Dark Angels (2013)
Codex: Sisters of Battle (2013)

He/She mentioned that there would be a third Codex in 2013, but couldn't give me specifics as to what it was (or was unwilling to at this point in time). He/She mentioned quite a lot of other things as well (6th Edition, narratives, etc), but I don't want to push too much out there when I don't know if I can trust this person yet or not. So again, please take this with a grain (or a spoonful) of salt.

It's actually hard to believe that Codex Tau would come right after Codex: Necrons. There needs to be a Space Marine codex in between.

Or maybe Codex: Necrons is the Space Marine codex.

:Release Order:
Orks
Space Marines + 5th Edition of Marinehammer
Imperial Guard
Vampire Marines
Tyranids
Wolf Marines
Dark Eldar
Silvershiny Supermarines
Sisters of Battle
Robot Marines
Tau Empire
Spiky Marines + 6th Edition of Marinehammer
Eldar
Dark Marines
Sisters of Battle
Crusader Marines??
Orks??
Space Marines??
Tyranids 2nd wave??
(Rinse and Repeat)

Taken that way, it's much more believable.

Whats sad is your joking reference to the Tyranid 2nd wave in 2013 is probably accurate

Doubt the Necrons are being considered a marine chapter. Plus, there are rumors about DA & BT chapters.

I don't think two xenos releases would be totally crazy. However, no SM codex for 3-4 releases does seem VERY unlikely.

And hooray for Tau! (if it's true)

SickSix wrote:I don't think two xenos releases would be totally crazy.

it goes against their usual release process, which is Marine/Non-Marine/Marine. Having 2 xenos books in a row then the long awaited Legions of Chaos book would be really, really strange for GW.

I pray to the star gods that Tau are not a pre 6th release. i don't think my heart can take having my army nerfed by a new edition w/in a year of the new codex AGAIN.

Marik Law wrote:
Codex: Necrons (Late October & all November)
Codex: Tau Empire (Early 2012)

No way do they do two non-Imperials in a row.

Marik Law wrote:
6th Edition AND Codex: Legions of Chaos (Mid 2012)

Straight wishlisting.

Marik Law wrote:
Codex: Eldar (Late 2012)
Codex: Dark Angels (2013)
Codex: Sisters of Battle (2013)

They have simply never planned this far ahead.

It's not that unusual. If you look at the 4th edition releases, the pattern doesn't really hold.

They were:

Black Templars - Tau Empire - Eldar - Dark Angels - Chaos Space Marines - Orks - Chaos Daemons

They've certainly broken the pattern before, so it's not unthinkable that they'd do it again.

Seems unlikely - a much more credible rumour earlier said that Tau weren't even in the planning stages yet.

GamesPoet wrote:Doubt the Necrons are being considered a marine chapter.

Sure they are. Chaos Space Marines are a marine "chapter" with an addition of cult marines (the important ones have FNP). Necrons are a hidden "marine" chapter consisting exclusively of Scouts with a FNP-derivative. It's like fielding an army of Blood Angels Scouts and attaching Sanguinary Priests (borrowed from the Blood Angel bro-fisting) all over the place. Necrons, being mostly of Space Marine Scouts, are thus faster and their Rhinos and Land Raiders are skimmers. Rumor has it that Plague Marines and Grey Knight Interceptors will be in the codex; they'll be named more NecronMarine-friendly names such as Immortals and Crypteks, of course. Plus, the NecronMarine Captain Special Characters revealed are actually rather cool-sounding.

Again, just going with what I was told by somebody who may or may not be questionable. He/She was pretty detailed in his/her description of Codex: Tau Empire though, so either he/she was incredibly creative and pulling it out of his/her arse or it was completely true. Some of the stuff he/she said seemed to coincide with a lot of the Tau Empire rumors that are out there right now.

I actually asked him/her about why there wasn't an Imperial release in all of this. He/She stated that Imperial Guard would be getting some new models and Finecast sometime during or shortly after the Holiday season. As for the reasoning, if I recall what he/she said correctly, they said that with 6th Edition Chaos would become even more of a major threat to the entire galaxy and not just to the Imperium (the long arm of Chaos has apparently, somehow, now reached the Tau Empire, hence Tau coming out prior to 6th). Chaos Space Marines rules will also apparently be getting a White Dwarf update as Renegade Marines (don't know why, he/she never elaborated as to what exactly Chaos Legions/Legions of Chaos was or how it differed from Chaos Space Marines or Daemons).

Hopefully my source isn't just relaying rumors they heard and actually has some inside info. If it is true this may very well be the first time we see this many Codex releases that don't have a single Imperial book within 4-5 releases. If it's not true well...balls...wasted a good hour of my life interviewing said person and probing them for information.

Again, take with a grain of salt. If it's true, wow. If not, another article for the Rumour Rubbage Bin.

EDIT: If anything, I'm really disappointed at not even a single mention of Black Templars. Really want to start a Templars army but with how behind they are power-wise I've been holding off, hoping that they get a new Codex. If this stuff is true...could be waiting a while. :(

A lot of that is what we've already heard from previous rumours. If they're not simply regurgitating what's already out there, they're probably the same source BoK got their OMG HUGE 6TH EDITION LEAK from.

Marik Law wrote:

Codex: Eldar (Late 2012)
Codex: Dark Angels (2013)
Codex: Sisters of Battle (2013)


They have simply never planned this far ahead.

I think assuming that GW does not plan that far ahead is a bit silly, I work for a company a lot smaller than GW and we have 2015 projects on the table.
A company whos product relies on a strong cohesive narrative would certainly be thinking 2 years down the road.

DarknessEternal wrote:
They have simply never planned this far ahead.

Well we do know they plan that far ahead, Harry noted they'd been working on Dreadfleet for two years and where already working on the next one.

They've also had longer plans in the past, just because 'we' don't have a clue whats happening in the future, doesn't mean they don't.


I have no idea on these rumours, but to suggest they have no plans further than one year ahead is laughable, things might change the order about on occasion, but they'll be planning and working on ideas well in advance.

I don't think Tau are coming next. I think DA or BT would be next in line, followed by sixth ED, then Legions. Maybe Tau sometime after that.

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Seems unlikely - a much more credible rumour earlier said that Tau weren't even in the planning stages yet.

My understanding is that there are few rumourmongers given more credibility than Harry over on warseer and he has stated that the Tau models are about 90% done and while he doesn't know exactly if Tau are next since he doesn't bother to keep track of 40k stuff quite as much because it doesn't really interest him what he did say is that based on what he can recall they are slotted in as the April release net year and the last before 6th ed......

Since keep getting in trouble for no links http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=321393&page=4

I would swear I have seen this post before.......about a month or two ago worded almost exactly if not exactly

My own sources concur with the OP as do those of a few peeps on Warseer. Guess it's not so crazy.

Mild correction to Absolutionis release order. Sorry, but I'm a pedant

Absolutionis wrote:
Release Order

Orks
Space Marines + 5th Edition of Marinehammer
Imperial Guard
Wolf Marines
Tyranids
Vampire Marines
Dark Eldar
Silvershiny Supermarines
Sisters of Battle
Robot Marines

What did your source say about 6th edition?

I hope that it was the rumors from long ago are wrong.

Flashman wrote:Mild correction to Absolutionis release order. Sorry, but I'm a pedant

Absolutionis wrote:
Release Order

Orks
Space Marines + 5th Edition of Marinehammer
Imperial Guard
Wolf Marines
Tyranids
Emo Vampire Marines
Dark Eldar
Silvershiny Supermarines
Sisters of Battle
Robot Marines

Fixed that for you

But it seems odd to be theres no vanilla marine codex as is customary at each edition... More annoying is not being able to play DA again for maybe 2 years... But lets hope that eldar rumours are true, a year to save I should be able to afford a single squad by then

Absolutionis wrote:It's actually hard to believe that Codex Tau would come right after Codex: Necrons. There needs to be a Space Marine codex in between.

Why is this so hard to believe? They're literally playing with rules and models that haven't changed much over the last, oh, 8 years?

peebzguy wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:It's actually hard to believe that Codex Tau would come right after Codex: Necrons. There needs to be a Space Marine codex in between.

Why is this so hard to believe? They're literally playing with rules and models that haven't changed much over the last, oh, 8 years?

This IS Games Workshop we're talking about. They love space marines over xenos

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Seems unlikely - a much more credible rumour earlier said that Tau weren't even in the planning stages yet.

Not sure if you follow Warseer, but between Harry and Ghost21 there is quite a bit of information. Between these two rumor mongers it seems as though one sculptor has spent the better part of 18 months reworking the line. A number of dual purpose kits are planned including a dual vespid kit and more choices for Kroot. It was also stated that Demigurg are in but 'bizzare' and not what is expected. Not sure what this means. There are also hints that another, four armed critter might be included as well. And a large ship/ vehicle or some sort.
As others have stated, this is mostly complete and awaiting the green llight for release.

Naaaaa... It seems unlikely, and there are dexes that need a redo much more: Templars... (for they still are 3rd), Chaos (they are the ubervillains... and have a crappy codex), Dark Angels ( obvious)...
In addition Tau already have pretty nice kits so... I don't think they're going to remake them...

Im still waiting for a Black Templar Codex.. because the old one is very very limited and outdated, and some wording conflicts with some of the new stuff.

Marik Law wrote:Can't name my source, but this person is a fairly new source to me so please take this with a large helping of salt. I can't even be sure that I can trust this person 100% yet. We'll see if I can trust him if what he said actually comes to pass.

Codex: Necrons (Late October & all November)

I don't even think this part qualifies as rumor anymore. The only Necron stuff in October will be articles in the WD. Everything else is in November.

If these rumors are true, I'm thinking Farsight is going to Chaos.

Expanded Reach of Chaos, (possible) Daemon Blade wielding commander of Tau Forces far exceeding his expected lifetime. Excellent mix for Chaos right there. (All the little Dark Tau children will be so happy).

Should be fun to see how things shake out anyway that they do.

Pretty sure his blade isn't chaos, much more likely to be some other xenos blade.

Yeah, I prefer the rumors that he is joining the Necrons. That makes more sense.

Farsight wants order and unity. So do the Necrons.

Chaos is the antithesis for Order and Unity, so it makes no sense for Farsight to join them.

If it's written as a Daemon Blade, I'm gonna personally take a Sharpie and redact it from every copy of the book I come across.

Since the Tau's release, the Dawn Blade has been hinted at as either an Eldar relic or a Necrontyr relic.

That depends, is the Tau dex gonna be written by Ward?

What does that have to do with anything?

Ohhhh, you're trying to be clever.

Well in that case let me finish your attempted humor for you.

"If it's written by Ward, Farsight is going to be a super Chaos Tau!".

Now, what you failed to realize is that while Ward does do some extreme stuff--he also doesn't do the level of retcon that people point fingers at him for doing. The Dreadknight is the most major piece that he did, and that is a concept that is acceptable but the execution was a major fail.

So no sisters in 2012 ??! :(

I really really hop this isent true ...

Kanluwen wrote:What does that have to do with anything?

Ohhhh, you're trying to be clever.

Well in that case let me finish your attempted humor for you.

"If it's written by Ward, Farsight is going to be a super Chaos Tau!".

Now, what you failed to realize is that while Ward does do some extreme stuff--he also doesn't do the level of retcon that people point fingers at him for doing. The Dreadknight is the most major piece that he did, and that is a concept that is acceptable but the execution was a major fail.

Yeah Ok you got me. Old memes never die...regrettably.

Though seriously, Tau better not be able to turn to Chaos. That would be very, very dumb.

Ward, while capable of silly ideas, is also a bit of a hardcore fanboy of 40k to begin with. I really can't see him doing something as big as Chaos Tau.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Yeah, I prefer the rumors that he is joining the Necrons. That makes more sense.

Farsight wants order and unity. So do the Necrons.

Chaos is the antithesis for Order and Unity, so it makes no sense for Farsight to join them.

Exactly. But Chaos can, when well-written, be very subtle. You don't start off with the gibbering horrors and the tentacles and the hey-ey. You give the pursued morsel what it wants. It wants order.. it gets order. But to get MORE order, it's goign to need to carve it out with martial might (Khorne), cast powerful sorceries (Tzeentch), infiltrate and take over (Slaanesh), or jsut bomb everything and pick up the nearly-dead pieces (Nurgle).

Chaos can be subtle. You don't convince someone to abandon deep-set beliefs with some amorphous demons, spine-tinglinging occult rituals, and debased ceremonies. You convince them by finding out what they want, and making them do what Chaos wants to achieve it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
(To be honest, I think Tau using Necron or Eldar artifacts is a more interesting option, but I also think that going a tad more Lovecraftian with Chaos would be an improvement at times.)

Chaos can be subtle all it wants, the Tau don't hear its whispers.
In effect, Chaos might as well be shouting at a deaf man.

I think the biggest problem is that there's this assumption that the Dawn Blade needs to be 'doing' something to Farsight. It doesn't necessarily have to be doing anything, outside of perhaps extending his lifespan. Even that is uncertain though, as the Imperium and even the Tau think that it's simply a case of Farsight becoming the title for the leader of this faction.

You know...with all this talk of C'tan shards floating around, the dawn blade might be one.
It's a bit weird, but its a possibility.

I find it odd that half the races in the game are immune to chaos. How can chaos be a big bad if half the races ignore them? HM?!

Maybe Ward will write a nice story about it in the new chaos codex.

There's actually very few races(two) which are effectively "immune" to the predations of Chaos.

The Tau and the Necrons are it.

Noisy_Marine wrote:I find it odd that half the races in the game are immune to chaos. How can chaos be a big bad if half the races ignore them? HM?!

Maybe Ward will write a nice story about it in the new chaos codex.

Well, humanity isn't immune to chaos...and Eldar certainly isn't immune to Chaos. Their very existence depends on them not getting eaten by Slaanesh.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kanluwen wrote:There's actually very few races(two) which are effectively "immune" to the predations of Chaos.

The Tau and the Necrons are it.

What about Orks?

Orks aren't so much immune to Chaos as they don't realize it exists.

The Ruinous Powers have used Orks as tools for destruction before, but generally the two leave each other alone as Orks just figure that the aspects of the Ruinous Powers are those of Gork(or possibly Mork) and that Daemons are just good to fight.

Kanluwen wrote:Orks aren't so much immune to Chaos as they don't realize it exists.

The Ruinous Powers have used Orks as tools for destruction before, but generally the two leave each other alone as Orks just figure that the aspects of the Ruinous Powers are those of Gork(or possibly Mork) and that Daemons are just good to fight.

Isn't that why the Tau are "immune" to chaos? Because they don't believe it exists?

No, the Tau have pretty much no presence within the Warp, and it requires a massive expenditure of energy to even simply do the 'mindgames' against the Tau that Chaos likes to do against the other races like Eldar and Humanity. The whispers, altering perception of reality, mutations, etc.

Think of the Ruinous Powers like an investment firm. They go for the 'best investment'--in this case, it's Humanity, due to the fact that we show up in the Warp quite brightly and aren't generally as well shielded against the predations of Chaos as the Eldar are.
Because the Tau require more expenditure of energy, they are left alone for the most part in terms of attempts of possessions and the like, and generally they just are killed by the physical manifestations of Daemons.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Orks aren't so much immune to Chaos as they don't realize it exists.

The Ruinous Powers have used Orks as tools for destruction before, but generally the two leave each other alone as Orks just figure that the aspects of the Ruinous Powers are those of Gork(or possibly Mork) and that Daemons are just good to fight.

Isn't that why the Tau are "immune" to chaos? Because they don't believe it exists?

I'm fairly certain that the Tau are just a race of what basically amounts to psychic nulls. I mean, they aren't really Pariahs or the assassins guys, but they have an extremely weak connection to the Warp. They're basically a slightly lesser version of the Necrons.

If Ward writes the Tau codex I will kill something, because he'll either have the Tau turn to Chaos or rape their fluff like he did with the Grey Knights.

I wouldn't say "nulls".

I would say they just have a really, really muted presence. Imagine it like they're wrapped in layers of saran wrap.

Also: Ward isn't nearly as bad as people make him out to be. When he first started out at GW, he wrote some fairly good fluff in White Dwarf for the various wildlife of Catachan(even had rules for it too).

Kanluwen wrote:There's actually very few races(two) which are effectively "immune" to the predations of Chaos.

The Tau and the Necrons are it.

Tyranids?

Tyranids can be mutated and the like, but we can't say definitively if the Hive Mind is immune to the predations of Chaos.

You get chaos orks.

Anyway four xenos in a row seems a bit unlikely IMO.

Kanluwen wrote:I wouldn't say "nulls".

I would say they just have a really, really muted presence. Imagine it like they're wrapped in layers of saran wrap.

Also: Ward isn't nearly as bad as people make him out to be. When he first started out at GW, he wrote some fairly good fluff in White Dwarf for the various wildlife of Catachan(even had rules for it too).

Do you have a 5th ed. Codex: Space Marines? Turn to page 48. Read the name of the campaign.

The Zeist Campaign.

He put a Highlander 2 reference into the Space Marine codex. Highlander 2 is a terrible, terrible movie, and was one of the worst sequels of all time. Nothing about highlander 2 is good. I don't know if Ward thought that Zeist sounded cool, or if he even knew what it was, but I wouldn't put it past him to include a reference to a movie so god-awful that people have spent years trying to retcon it out of existence or fix the entire movie by removing anything having to do with Zeist.

On the whole I don't have a HUGE problem with Matt Ward, but I do not like how he makes Space Marines (esp. Grey Knights) into super-marines capable of killing Daemon Primarchs and carving their names into the DPs heart. No. Just no.

Then there's also the "Bloodtide" incident, where GKs slaughter pure and untainted SoB and cover themselves with the SoB blood to not get tainted by Chaos, which fluff should tell us is already impossible (something about faith, and the GK training, and the whole "their faith is pretty much the strongest weapon they have" thing). Those GKs essentially became Khornate Knights instead of Grey Knights.

Grey Knights have always been super-marines.

And truth be told if you're getting "Khornate Knights" out of the whole Bloodtide incident, you're reading it wrong.
I've explained that one so many times it's not worth me doing it again.

I'm not saying I would want it, but the Dawn blade would be an easy, Oh Chaos all along bit.
Chaos:
Necron Anti Chaos (Draigo is secretly one of these (Haha, more bandwagon Matt Ward hating, seriously though, he's not that bad, and who knows if he actually wrote everything in the codex.)
Tau Mute
Orks Neither really one way or the other
Humans Tasty, and easily found
Eldar Chaos Buffet

I have a sad feeling that the only thing making GW break the usual Marine/Non-marine/Marine cycle......is running out of Marine codexes. :(

And then only for a short while as a new edition is always right around the corner at that time, meaning GW feels justified in releasing Marine codexes again. :(:(

I think people are missing an important point! THERE IS NOT A SM CODEX BEING RELEASED NEAR THE NEW GAME RELEASE! What if, what if GW is going to sell the future B?B WITH the new SM codex, only $100 for the two. Wait, that will not work, that would be a discount. Now for only $120!!!!!!

Wow, new Ork Smilies too (well, new to me).

temprus wrote:I think people are missing an important point! THERE IS NOT A SM CODEX BEING RELEASED NEAR THE NEW GAME RELEASE!

Well, I guess we'll just see shall we... and wouldn't Spiky Marines count as a Marine codex?

The biggest strike against the rumour is the lack of a new vanilla Space Marine codex coming along with the new edition. GW won't allow it's cash cow to be left with an outdated book.

Good grief - its only stories - who cares! What did the source say about the Tau rules? Am I getting my T5 suits?

A new tau 'dex would be interesting. And Sisters/DA will be awesome. Cant wait to get my hands on the new stories and fluff bound to be inside!

Mahu wrote:What did your source say about 6th edition?

I hope that it was the rumors from long ago are wrong.

He/She wouldn't go into specifics, but said that a lot of what had been said online was true, some of it wasn't entirely correct, and some of it was correct but just worded extremely poorly to a point where it made the rule seem more complex than it actually was or made the rule seem somehow different. He/She said he/she had played games using the new rulebook and said that the games didn't take much longer to complete than they already are, if anything they were making a point that some of the more convoluted rules have been streamlined and some of the rules that were "too basic" got changed as well. He/She said that, if anything, the game feels much more strategic with the new rulebook, though he/she did say that some of the rules take "a bit of getting used to."

EDIT: Codex books won't be invalidated by the new rules apparently, but the new rulebook will come with an FAQ section for each already existing army to clarify any confusion or mix-ups in concern to the new rules.

Also, to those worried about the lack of Imperial releases, my source did say that new models and finecast were coming out over the next year for a few Imperial loyalist armies, including Imperial Guard, and that after Eldar we'd be, and I quote, "sick of Imperial releases."

As for why they chose certain armies over armies that needed it more (Dark Angels, Black Templars, etc), it was apparently due to lore/fluff reasons. Chaos is going to be a major threat come 6th Edition to everyone, not just the Imperium, and apparently they (Chaos) will have a front against the Tau Empire, hence why Tau are getting a release before-hand. The perspective/narrative is also changing apparently and it won't be only or heavily Imperial, he/she said that GW wanted to make some of the other "good" races (Tau Empire, Eldar) feel just as important as the Imperium when it comes to lore/fluff and the fate of the galaxy. This was apparently some of the reasoning behind why Tau Empire and Eldar are getting books before armies like Dark Angels and Black Templars.

As for the actual Tau Empire rules, all my source was willing to say was that a good deal of the rumours currently on the internet about Tau are true, but that some were false or just poorly worded, and that he/she couldn't give out or confirm/deny specifics as he/she "might get in trouble." Apparently, some GW staff are allowed to leak certain details to the public via the internet, but are very specific as to what is allowed to be said by who.

Again, take with a grain of salt.

While I would like it, if GW really did take fluff and lore into account as far as releases go, this would seem to be completely diffrent from what the current company is doing.

I have my doubts, but I would love it, if they are really becoming more serious about the fluff, and lore. Perhaps maybe even moving the timeline forward a bit!

Seriously, all of these rumors makes it sound like GW is entirely staffed by paranoid cold-war era spies.

Some rumours from Warseer:

ghost21 wrote:

The starter set(s) are Chaos and Dark Angels.

Hate to burst your bubble, but it's not Dark Angels.
(...)
The first thing I have to say is that there are 2 chaos books planed.
One more renegade based, the other legion based. The legion one will be that, dudes who are 10000 years old kicking ass n taking names.

There "may" be an inquisitor who hass gone bad but really expect new guys in the renegade one.

It's lost and the damned influenced... but it has other options....

also 2012??...maybe at a push

junk wrote:Seriously, all of these rumors makes it sound like GW is entirely staffed by paranoid cold-war era spies.

Took you quite a while
Actually it's mainly the management, not the creative staff.

junk wrote:Seriously, all of these rumors makes it sound like GW is entirely staffed by paranoid cold-war era spies.

Most companies are ran by people like this, sadly. I can't say where I work, but basically all of the higher ups even where I work treat everyone beneath them like they're liars, thieves, and con-artists trying to get one over on them.

I just want to see some amazing models to be honest i dont care what army they are for

*Starts dusting off his Alpha Legion* Please please PLEASE be playable in the next Chaos 'dex!

@Marik- I can appreciate your wanting to keep your source secret but I want to point out that in English using "he/him" when referencing a person of unknown sex is appropriate. I hope that will save you some time and key strokes.

While I understand that folks who have been waiting years for their codex would love some attention sooner rather than later, I'd rather wait for 6th and hopefully hardback codexes. I'd also hope that some of the less loved races like Tau are kept back till after 6th so that they can benefit from any rebalancing the way that Tomb Kings and Ogres have in WHFB. I'm most excited about the new chaos books following on from Aaron Dembski-Bowden's Nightlords books and the feeling of renegade but not chaos marines.

Impossible that we'd have to wait that long for new Marines. Just not possible.

Marik law, no offense but when you strip out the "It might be this, or it might be that" you really aren't saying much more than "Expect Chaos, lots of Imperial stuff, etc."

Remember that Chaos Space Marines are still Space Marines. I think if your looking for loyalists, it sounds like it's going to be awhile, it is starting to sound like loyalists may not get another marine book until 2013 at the earliest. With the rumored DA stuff getting squashed, I haven't heard any of the normal rumor posters say anything positive about BT or a normal marine release.

Also, the marines every other book may have been happening, but that doesn't logically mean it will continue. Just because it rains four days in a row, doesn't mean it will rain the 5th day. It has been happenstance due to the fact that marine (variants) are about 1/2 of all 40K codex's (there are 7 b.t.w. Ultramarines, Dark Angels, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Black Templars, Grey Knights, Chaos Space Marines). There are only six alien codexs at all (tyranids, Dark eldar, Craftworld Eldar, Tau, Necrons, Orks, Demons). The last codex(s) is imperial guard and sisters of battle.

In addition I think we are about to see the break from the historical precedent of Space Marines always being in the boxed set, and always seeing them as the first codex out. The background we are hearing sounds to me like they are trying to take 40K to a more fantasy position where it is Order vs. Disorder and not Imperiam vs. Everyone. I don't mean that the Imperium is getting any less xenophobic, but that the races are getting deeper. Look at the necrons a "exterminate... exterminate." race going much closer to a Stargate style gauld rulership position. I expect tau to both widen and deeper from a background position.

Marine hammer has been fun the last few years, but I'm glad it sounds like that's over. Long live the Xenos.

In regards to "MARINES BETWEEN EVERYTHING"- we did just get several Fantasy releases in a row. Admittedly you're talking about 40k in regards to the Marine-love, but don't you think that if that happened we would have got all those Fantasy things? In a row? With no 40k?

@Marik - As others have said.. you can just use he instead of he/she!.. also you said "grain of salt" and that makes me weep :( (No salt in the tears tho)

Sisters of Battle are probably getting the next Codex(that or discontinued, I am hoping simply a new codex)

As a Tau player I am of course ready for an updated book. To be fair the Tau still play reasonably well considering how some of the more desperate armies needed an update.

At most the Tau need more Hero characters, and to have a few things fixed, like giving the Etherial a more viable role?

Sisters of Battle aren't getting the next codex man. They just got a WD article, and last time GW did that (Blood Angels) it was two years before they got around to updating them. IMHO your looking at late 2013 for a real sisters release with miniatures etc...

Now, don't get me wrong, that codex needs a release, but I bet you see it as a DE style huge affair of all plastic set for october/november of 2013.

Marik Law wrote:
Chaos is going to be a major threat come 6th Edition to everyone, not just the Imperium, and apparently they (Chaos) will have a front against the Tau Empire, hence why Tau are getting a release before-hand.

Front - Tau empire.

I like it.

Marik Law wrote:
The perspective/narrative is also changing apparently and it won't be only or heavily Imperial, he/she said that GW wanted to make some of the other "good" races (Tau Empire, Eldar) feel just as important as the Imperium when it comes to lore/fluff and the fate of the galaxy.

So is it "good" vs "evil" or "order" vs "disorder" ?

Now we all know the Tau feel as important already and the Eldar deem themselves as the only important ones so this will be interesting times for the background. How are the "dying"/"leaving this realm" space elves and the "new upstart empire" blue-greys as important to the fate of the Galaxy ?
Moving the fluff perspective

Well the Tau have been getting some prominent stories in the Newer Codices of some of the other races.

You have a major defeat for a Tyranid hive fleet in their codex. This also leads into a new major conflict between the Imperium and the Tau.

Now I am not expecting a Tau Codex for a while. I mean Clearly the main focus is on the Necrons. I Feel the Necron update was needed way more then a Tau update.

Kanluwen wrote:Chaos can be subtle all it wants, the Tau don't hear its whispers.
In effect, Chaos might as well be shouting at a deaf man.

I think the biggest problem is that there's this assumption that the Dawn Blade needs to be 'doing' something to Farsight. It doesn't necessarily have to be doing anything, outside of perhaps extending his lifespan. Even that is uncertain though, as the Imperium and even the Tau think that it's simply a case of Farsight becoming the title for the leader of this faction.

What are you saying? That Tau = Gingers and therefore have no souls? (look it up on YouTube and you'll see the South Park Episode I'm talking about)

Kanluwen wrote:There's actually very few races(two) which are effectively "immune" to the predations of Chaos.

The Tau and the Necrons are it.

Tau aren't immune, in old codex daemonhunters it was perfectly acceptable to have allied daemons (inc leaders inhabited by greater daemons) in Tau armies. The only armies where this couldn't happen were Necrons and Tyranids. Tau and Orks are difficult to corrupt and possess due to their biology/society but its not impossible.

Totalwar1402 wrote:Tau aren't immune, in old codex daemonhunters it was perfectly acceptable to have allied daemons (inc leaders inhabited by greater daemons) in Tau armies.

Not in my Daemonhunter Codex, or do you have a page and quote? Even the scenarios avoided any hint on Chaos corruption in Tau.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't BTs still be one of the starter sets? Seems like the kind of nostalgia thing GW might do, given that BTs were the cover art for 3rd ed.

Kroothawk wrote:Some rumours from Warseer:

ghost21 wrote:The first thing I have to say is that there are 2 chaos books planed.
One more renegade based, the other legion based. The legion one will be that, dudes who are 10000 years old kicking ass n taking names.

There "may" be an inquisitor who hass gone bad but really expect new guys in the renegade one.

It's lost and the damned influenced... but it has other options....

I'm more hopeful now than ever that this might happen, but I'll believe it when I see it.

Kanluwen wrote:Tyranids can be mutated and the like, but we can't say definitively if the Hive Mind is immune to the predations of Chaos.

I think the safe bet is that they're not, given that the Ruinous Powers feed on emotions, and Tyranids basically have none other than hunger. Of course, in the old fluff before Genestealers became Tyranids, Genestealer Cults were Chaos Cults worshipping a Genestealer god in the warp. *shrug*

Just asked my source about the two Chaos books ghost21 mentioned. He said that Legions was coming first and that Renegades would first get a WD article soon after that and that a new Codex would come out later (about 1-2 years after the WD article).

For those worried that Tau Empire aren't going to be as mean as a post-6th Edition Codex, fear not. From what my source said, the last several Codex books are going to have "the shortest FAQs in the rulebook" as they were "designed with the 6th Edition rules in mind."

Marik Law wrote:

Mahu wrote:What did your source say about 6th edition?

I hope that it was the rumors from long ago are wrong.

He/She wouldn't go into specifics, but said that a lot of what had been said online was true, some of it wasn't entirely correct, and some of it was correct but just worded extremely poorly to a point where it made the rule seem more complex than it actually was or made the rule seem somehow different. He/She said he/she had played games using the new rulebook and said that the games didn't take much longer to complete than they already are, if anything they were making a point that some of the more convoluted rules have been streamlined and some of the rules that were "too basic" got changed as well. He/She said that, if anything, the game feels much more strategic with the new rulebook, though he/she did say that some of the rules take "a bit of getting used to."

EDIT: Codex books won't be invalidated by the new rules apparently, but the new rulebook will come with an FAQ section for each already existing army to clarify any confusion or mix-ups in concern to the new rules.

Also, to those worried about the lack of Imperial releases, my source did say that new models and finecast were coming out over the next year for a few Imperial loyalist armies, including Imperial Guard, and that after Eldar we'd be, and I quote, "sick of Imperial releases."

As for why they chose certain armies over armies that needed it more (Dark Angels, Black Templars, etc), it was apparently due to lore/fluff reasons. Chaos is going to be a major threat come 6th Edition to everyone, not just the Imperium, and apparently they (Chaos) will have a front against the Tau Empire, hence why Tau are getting a release before-hand. The perspective/narrative is also changing apparently and it won't be only or heavily Imperial, he/she said that GW wanted to make some of the other "good" races (Tau Empire, Eldar) feel just as important as the Imperium when it comes to lore/fluff and the fate of the galaxy. This was apparently some of the reasoning behind why Tau Empire and Eldar are getting books before armies like Dark Angels and Black Templars.

As for the actual Tau Empire rules, all my source was willing to say was that a good deal of the rumours currently on the internet about Tau are true, but that some were false or just poorly worded, and that he/she couldn't give out or confirm/deny specifics as he/she "might get in trouble." Apparently, some GW staff are allowed to leak certain details to the public via the internet, but are very specific as to what is allowed to be said by who.

Again, take with a grain of salt.

"It could be... but then...."

Seriously you wrecked it when you mentioned GW doing this for fluff/lore. They ar doing it for MONEY.
You actually do not give out any info except it "could be this or that.." There have been Tau rumours for a good year now and it is known they already HAD a dex ready end of 2010 but discarded it as basically all info had leaked.

My source tells me Tau soon but whether in Q1 or 3 is not known. Yes Tau are ready, so no news here. Tau need an update and something against Uberarmies that go into CC in round 1, also no news.

After all the kids still like the Mech look and the new kits are quick to do (Finecast Vespids and Kroot Hounds), Pathfinders will be a upgrade Kit for FWs, new Tank (?) and Barracuda. The rumours I like are those of the envoys for the Ethereal and that XV9s will be in the new Dex. Apparently the XV8 will get a resculpt and come in a 3 box.... so far what you did not tell us.

Sorry to ruin your day but "maybes" and "possibly ... or.." are not rumours they are attention seekers. Essentially you aint telling us anything and for that you need to open 2 threads???

I heard that the tyranid and space wolf second waves were ready for release, but are being scrapped and the moulds destroyed because of chapterhouse.

I Digress; I remember reading several Canon quotes and one basically states "No Tau has ever fallen to Chaos"

I think the fact that GW is focusing on non imperial releases is a good thing. Makes me wonder why people are seeing the opposite considering the over focus on the imperium (in terms of releases and rules) was a negative aspect of 5th edition.

That being said I reckon the focus on non IoM is probably a business decision rather than a fluff/balance decision. Considering GW has already milked the IoM cash cow to death and the success of Dark Eldar, moving onto other things makes sense (regardless of how popular the former may have been). It also looks like CSM has purposely been delayed as a 6th edition release in order to be a big selling point for 6th.

The FAQs thing sounds a bit stupid IMO. The current online rules FAQs didn’t do enough to solve rules queries (e.g. CSM Dreadnaught fire frenzy) and I doubt including them in the rulebook will be any better unless they are better written. The success of older rulesets in 6th will largely depend on how GW tackles errata and power creep otherwise I can see similar issues with what happened to 5th edition occurring.

Could that Dark Millenium business have plans to be coinciding with something else in 2013? Or am I giving someone to much credit.

God damn you sixth edition. Eff off.

Well im looking forward to dark angels so let's hope there sooner rather then later

SGASheppard wrote:Well im looking forward to dark angels so let's hope there sooner rather then later

This right here. I'm tired of having the best astartes terminators in the fluff and yet they cost more than grey knights...

Kanluwen wrote:If it's written as a Daemon Blade, I'm gonna personally take a Sharpie and redact it from every copy of the book I come across.

Since the Tau's release, the Dawn Blade has been hinted at as either an Eldar relic or a Necrontyr relic.

Boo hoo, you're acting as if retcons in 40k aren't as common as nerds who don't shower at tabletop wargaming tournaments.

Kanluwen wrote:If it's written as a Daemon Blade, I'm gonna personally take a Sharpie and redact it from every copy of the book I come across.

Since the Tau's release, the Dawn Blade has been hinted at as either an Eldar relic or a Necrontyr relic.

Really Kan? After all the externally and internally contradictory fluff we've had throughout all of 5th Ed, and all the crap Matt Ward has shovelled all over us this - the idea that the Dawn Blade might be Chaos related - that sets of your bs meter?

A-fething-mazing.

CpatTom wrote:Could that Dark Millenium business have plans to be coinciding with something else in 2013? Or am I giving someone to much credit.

GW? Cross-promote? I don't think they even know how to. It'll get a paragraph mention in that month's WD. That'll be about it.

They can keep all the Nid waves I don't want them I will take a new codex written by someone that is not a complete moron like Crudace. How about Phil Kelly!

MDizzle wrote:They can keep all the Nid waves I don't want them I will take a new codex written by someone that is not a complete moron like Crudace. How about Phil Kelly!

Sorry I already started the campaign to chain him to a desk to write the Eldar and DA ones first. Also a campaign to force Ward to be chained to a desk and write out "I will think before I write" for 8 hours each day for each person he ruined an army for, even if he didn't play it. With no pay.

On topic, having some FAQ's in the rule book is a good idea for starting off 6th edition. Armour save modifiers been mentioned yet or am I putting too much hope up that balance can return to 40k?

Cruddace isn't a complete moron, the guard codex was decent.

Decent yes, but also dull and completely arbitrary.

4oursword wrote:Cruddace isn't a complete moron, the guard codex was decent.

Isn't IG, still consistently considered the top Codex of 40k?

It seems Cruddance either writes a codex too strong, or too weak.

I heard someware that Cruddance was the one writing the new Tau dex. It can't be ward anyway. He wrote greay knights and now crons, two in a row. One of the others would write it. I have high expectations.

I sort of like the good vs bad/order vs chaos idea. It resonates with the general faction war setting. Reminds me a bit to much of LOTR though.

I call the new blood reach to be Tau vs Chaos. My wild ghessing said it first, and I so called the Tau dex in feb. God help me find the post though.

Sasori wrote:

4oursword wrote:Cruddace isn't a complete moron, the guard codex was decent.

Isn't IG, still consistently considered the top Codex of 40k?

It seems Cruddance either writes a codex too strong, or too weak.

IG and Space Wolves are usually up there as the two bestest best best codices of bestiness.

Kroothawk wrote:

Totalwar1402 wrote:Tau aren't immune, in old codex daemonhunters it was perfectly acceptable to have allied daemons (inc leaders inhabited by greater daemons) in Tau armies.

Not in my Daemonhunter Codex, or do you have a page and quote? Even the scenarios avoided any hint on Chaos corruption in Tau.

If a tau army fought the old daemonhunters it states that any army can select a greater daemon (that has possesed a HQ choice) as a free HQ choice with stats included. This is provided that the army is not necrons or tyranids; by process of elimination that includes the Tau. They also have a book with lists of why the two factions could fight and Iam fairly certain that daemonic corruption is one of them.

They also did a White Dwarf article that went into more detail over the process for orks, eldar, Imperial Guard and Tau. They stated that it was difficult but they are far from immune. In fact it states that their unawareness of chaos, coupled with their faith in reason (not shying away from places that give you a bad feeling) means they put themselves in greater risk of being corrupted.

I sold my daemonhunters a while back, but the contents should point you to the allied daemons.

CpatTom wrote:If these rumors are true, I'm thinking Farsight is going to Chaos.

Expanded Reach of Chaos, (possible) Daemon Blade wielding commander of Tau Forces far exceeding his expected lifetime. Excellent mix for Chaos right there. (All the little Dark Tau children will be so happy).

Should be fun to see how things shake out anyway that they do.

So we're talking a little bit of Frostmourne making it's way into a Games Workshop army?

peebzguy wrote:

CpatTom wrote:If these rumors are true, I'm thinking Farsight is going to Chaos.

Expanded Reach of Chaos, (possible) Daemon Blade wielding commander of Tau Forces far exceeding his expected lifetime. Excellent mix for Chaos right there. (All the little Dark Tau children will be so happy).

Should be fun to see how things shake out anyway that they do.

So we're talking a little bit of Frostmourne making it's way into a Games Workshop army?

I'm pretty sure Corrupted Daemon blades have been around longer than Frostmourne.

poontangler wrote:I Digress; I remember reading several Canon quotes and one basically states "No Tau has ever fallen to Chaos"

The backgrounds open enough that you could quite easily imply Farsight as having to fallen to chaos.

Actually I do have my hunters dex, I got rid of witchhunters.

p49 On daemon allies everyone canp pick them except 'Necron and Tyranid players also cannot use these rules as the concept of chaos wroship is totally alien to these races.'

p50 Stats for allied greater daemon that begins play 'inside' the Tau HQ choice and reveals itself at some point in the game.

p53 Daemonhunters would fight Tau because a Tau commander will commit some great evil and must be stopped 'thought all manner of nastiness will no doubt occur as the battle unfolds.' This crptic statement is a joke that the Tau commander is possessed and will reveal himself during the fight.

Sasori wrote:

peebzguy wrote:

CpatTom wrote:If these rumors are true, I'm thinking Farsight is going to Chaos.

Expanded Reach of Chaos, (possible) Daemon Blade wielding commander of Tau Forces far exceeding his expected lifetime. Excellent mix for Chaos right there. (All the little Dark Tau children will be so happy).

Should be fun to see how things shake out anyway that they do.

So we're talking a little bit of Frostmourne making it's way into a Games Workshop army?

I'm pretty sure Corrupted Daemon blades have been around longer than Frostmourne.

Ah, forgive me then, I've only been around the 40k verse since about 2001.

Sasori wrote:

4oursword wrote:Cruddace isn't a complete moron, the guard codex was decent.

Isn't IG, still consistently considered the top Codex of 40k?

It seems Cruddance either writes a codex too strong, or too weak.

People are hitting themselves with sticks over the matter wether IG, SW, BA or GK is the most OP book, and then sometimes the DE come in and rain on their parade...

Either case, IG has lost a lot of steam without the Allies.

kenshin620 wrote:

peebzguy wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:It's actually hard to believe that Codex Tau would come right after Codex: Necrons. There needs to be a Space Marine codex in between.

Why is this so hard to believe? They're literally playing with rules and models that haven't changed much over the last, oh, 8 years?

This IS Games Workshop we're talking about. They love space marines over xenos because of the many 10-year olds that buy a box a day from them.

EDIT: fixed it for you.

I hope chaos comes a little later after 6Th ed so that I will have mass overpowered units AND a codex that is in time with the rule book ('nids Need To Pay for the many losses over them be a crappy codex...).

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:If it's written as a Daemon Blade, I'm gonna personally take a Sharpie and redact it from every copy of the book I come across.

Since the Tau's release, the Dawn Blade has been hinted at as either an Eldar relic or a Necrontyr relic.

Really Kan? After all the externally and internally contradictory fluff we've had throughout all of 5th Ed, and all the crap Matt Ward has shovelled all over us this - the idea that the Dawn Blade might be Chaos related - that sets of your bs meter?

A-fething-mazing.

Notice how the dawn blade looks... Khopesh-like? Who uses those? Tomb Kings? Necrons?

My money's that its a crazy C'Tan weapon. Farsight's just embracing the machine is all...

Farquestor wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:If it's written as a Daemon Blade, I'm gonna personally take a Sharpie and redact it from every copy of the book I come across.

Since the Tau's release, the Dawn Blade has been hinted at as either an Eldar relic or a Necrontyr relic.

Really Kan? After all the externally and internally contradictory fluff we've had throughout all of 5th Ed, and all the crap Matt Ward has shovelled all over us this - the idea that the Dawn Blade might be Chaos related - that sets of your bs meter?

A-fething-mazing.

Notice how the dawn blade looks... Khopesh-like? Who uses those? Tomb Kings? Necrons?

My money's that its a crazy C'Tan weapon. Farsight's just embracing the machine is all...

Thousand Sons. Especially Crusade Era.

Mid 2012? I still haven't gotten the hang of the current edition... At least Chaos is getting a new book... actually... when they say Legions are they talking about the CSM too or is it just stuff like rogue psykers and renegade guardsman?

Legions is presumably about the original 9 traitor legions of CSM.

When is the second wave of nids coming out?,also isn't there meant to be a summer of flyers,im hoping this means a harpy.

-Loki- wrote:

it goes against their usual release process, which is Marine/Non-Marine/Marine.

Which is absolutely obscene. Curse you GW!!!!!!!!!

imark789 wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

it goes against their usual release process, which is Marine/Non-Marine/Marine.

Which is absolutely obscene. Curse you GW!!!!!!!!!

At the end of 4th edition, they had 4 xenos dexs in a row, how do you explain that?

Ledabot wrote:

imark789 wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

it goes against their usual release process, which is Marine/Non-Marine/Marine.

Which is absolutely obscene. Curse you GW!!!!!!!!!

At the end of 4th edition, they had 4 xenos dexs in a row, how do you explain that?

Heresy

Ledabot wrote:

imark789 wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

it goes against their usual release process, which is Marine/Non-Marine/Marine.

Which is absolutely obscene. Curse you GW!!!!!!!!!

At the end of 4th edition, they had 4 xenos dexs in a row, how do you explain that?

That was then, this is now.

Ok so far your source was right about necrons, since it comes in next week.

New source:1 - 0

So now all we have to wait for is the new tau codex, if they are right about this then...well they're a good source i suppose.