I sent Mike some figures to paint and haven't heard from him in awhile.

I've called him (and left a couple of messages) and sent him some email, but I haven't heard back from him.

Does anybody know if he is ok?

Hmmm, some details please? maybe link to which member is doing it. Or some quotes from the agreement.

I heard about him via The Eternal Warriors podcast and he also painted something for the 11th Company and he lives in MD like I do so I thought this wouldn't be yet another painting service that screws me..

This is his service's FB page:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/paintingapothecary/

This is the chat we had:
Nick Evancich
Quote?
I just bought this army off ebay and I'd like it finished. Basically paint the unpainted models like the painted one. I live in MD and can drop them off.

1x Bloodthirster - Painted
1x Great Unclean One
1x Lord of Change - Painted
1x Daemon Prince - Painted
1x Skulltaker on Juggernaut

1x Soul Grinder - Painted

30x Bloodletters - Painted x16
15x Plaguebearers Painted x10
19x Pink Horrors Painted x2
19x Daemonettes

5x Bloodcrushers Painted x2
9x Flamers of Tzeentch Painted x8
1x Changling
6x Screamers
5x Fleshhounds Painted x1
1x Karanak Painted
4x Nurglings

June 30Mike Krakosky Jr.
ok i need pics of the models and how detailed do you want them.

June 30Nick Evancich
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260806199305&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT#ht_500wt_1413

Warhammer 40k Chaos Daemons Army
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eBay: Find Warhammer 40k Chaos Daemons Army in the Toys Hobbies , Games , Miniatures, War Games , Warhammer , Fantasy , Chaos category on eBay.
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June 30Mike Krakosky Jr.
so of them look dusty from mate coat, so I can do the unpainted like the painted ones. they look like tier 2.

June 30Nick Evancich
Cool, how much?

June 30Mike Krakosky Jr.
$400 for all of it. if you want me to touch up any of them i can do that too.

June 30Nick Evancich
Awesome! What are the terms? paypal 50% up front? Where in MD are you? What is the time line?

June 30Mike Krakosky Jr.
I usually have 100% paypal up front. I live in bowie ,MD and would take 2 months

This is the last contact I've had with him:
Nick Evancich
What is the ETA on the project?

September 14Mike Krakosky Jr.
in couple of weeks

October 6Nick Evancich
Just checking in to see how things are coming along and when everything will be finished?

I'm think I'm going to file a police report tomorrow

Sounds like you live close to him, any chance you drop in for a visit before police report?

Totally. But, he isn't returning my calls, SMS's, or emails. I have his address (I shipped the models to him). So, do I just show up and knock on his door and ask for my models + refund?

I'm kind of asking dakka for a head check, the last message I have from him is in the middle of Sept and he hasn't returned my attempts to contact him. Am I being a jerk? I figure he: under estimated the quote or hasn't finsihed the job or wants to steal my models & $.

If he isn't returning calls, emails or SMS, I would go to his address. Take someone with you, not to threaten, but just in case he threatens you. Politely ask for your models and a refund.

Then if he doesn't give you your models back, take it to the police and treat it as a theft. Have a scan through his blogs etc to check if he has sold them or tried to sell them. If you can get evidence, the more the better.

Good luck!

evancich wrote:Totally. But, he isn't returning my calls, SMS's, or emails. I have his address (I shipped the models to him). So, do I just show up and knock on his door and ask for my models + refund?

I'm kind of asking dakka for a head check, the last message I have from him is in the middle of Sept and he hasn't returned my attempts to contact him. Am I being a jerk? I figure he: under estimated the quote or hasn't finsihed the job or wants to steal my models & $.

No you aren't being a jerk at all. The only reason you need to show up at his house is due to his lack of responses.
And he have only himself to blame to be in that situation ( anything else he should let you know )

Myself is a commission painter so a siren went off in my head when i read what you said he responded.

September 14Mike Krakosky Jr.
in couple of weeks

There is only 1 possibility for that answer, because lets look at the scenarios. Since an army he should have been working on shouldn't take much additional time to complete.
That much time needed is as if he never started. So one thing he can use as an excuse is that he worked on multiple commissions simultaneously.
This is also a nono for a lone commissioned painter that works on whole army. To take so many commissions he have no capability to finish.

Then the excuse 90% of people use in a corner like that would be "family emergency" by then I guess you already found him or contacted him...
Tell him you dont want to wait anymore if he hasnt start it ( insist on seeing whether he did anything or not ) the moment you confirm its not started, get your money + army back.
Tell him you are sorry for the loss but, you have the right to your property + your money that he never honored the work done.

How old is he? showing up and asking his parents also helps xD

That is a good point, I hadn't thought about my personal safety. I'll bring some other guys with me.

Yeah, that is what I figured. He hadn't started it and is just delaying me. My problem is, I've sent him messages saying that if he needs more time or money, we can talk about it. But he hasn't returned my messages.

Based on www.zillow.com it looks like he is in his 30's and own's his house.

I wish I would have sent these models to Blue Table Painting. So, far they are the only painting service that I've used that I can trust.

evancich wrote:I've sent him messages saying that if he needs more time or money, we can talk about it. But he hasn't returned my messages..

I would say don't offer that again, if he can ditch you once, he can ditch you again. ( especially if he didn't start working on it yet )

As a commission painter myself, I'm sorry to hear you're having troubles. It sounds like he took too much on to his plate and can't get it done as quickly as he thought he could. You have every right to ask for the return of your money and your models, and he's just going to have to suck it up.

It also sounds like you've done everything reasonably possible to contact him, and the next step would indeed be to knock on his front door and ask for your models back if he hasn't even touched them. If he has worked on them, he's still taken way too long to do them and he's ignored your attempts to contact him. In that case you should probably ask for your models back and at least most of your money.

Do go with at least one of your friends, but I wouldn't say more than one. Anymore than one other guy (or girl) might make the situation worse, as in he might think you're going to try and beat him or something equally horrid.

Experiences like this illustrate how incredibly important reputation is in the commission painting industry, not only of the painter but also of the very idea of commission painting. Painters who don't get the job done, or who do not communicate with their clients throughout the process make it harder on the rest of us to establish ourselves as reliable, hardworking people who take pride in our work.

You may also want to try to locate a local constable or the local police department. Explain the situation to them and ask if someone could accompany you to the house. If someone does come then I can almost guarantee that trouble will be held to a minimum. If he can't/won't come then at least they will be on notice so that if something does happen there shouldn't be much of a kerfuffle. Sometimes the police will come so that they can do something without having to "do something" about the situation.

Knocked on his door today. No answer. I could see him in his house and cars were parked outside.

Spent like 45 min trying to get him to come to the door.

:(

Keep coming every day you can. Make damn well sure he knows that you want your models back.

You heard about him on the Eternal Warriors podcast. Perhaps they'd like to know that they are endorsing a possible thief, or at the least a poor excuse for a business man. Maybe they'd call him out on the next podcast regarding the issue.

I'd just file a police report. Let them do the policing for you.

If you know he's in there and ignoring you now is the time to call the Police and let them handle the situation. He's committed theft and will be punished for it.

It is an hour each way to Bowie, MD for me. I'd rather not make the trip again (we had a freak snow storm here and it made the drive longer).

Yeah, I think it is time to file a police report.

I guess it goes without saying, but please don't use:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/paintingapothecary/

I don't know if I'm reading it right but he appears to have posted on facebook every week or two up until the start of September and then nothing.

It looks suspicious given the other horror stories from painting services but for all we know something genuine may have happened to him. It's shame you can't make a personal call before calling the police.

@Treesong

Not sure if you read the thread.

#1: I asked if anybody knows him and if he is ok

#2: I've been trying to contact him for weeks

#3: I saw him in his house today and he ignored me

I'd definately call that blatant theft. File a police report AND make you have printed evidence of all accounts.

Good to have on you when you get your stuff back

I really hate to read stories like this, as I feel it makes all of us who are doing commissioned work look shady (which we are not). I provide home address, shop address, multiple phone numbers/emails and facebook info to my personal page, if I agree to take on a commision. If you can't get a hold of me, you aren't trying. This is probably also the reason that I have people from as far away as Australia as clients.

At this point let the police earn thier money. File the report & then stay on top of them over it. If you paid through PayPal, start a dispute, and in the future, beware of any service that wants your models & your money upfront. Good Luck!

evancich wrote:#3: I saw him in his house today and he ignored me

Ehh that'[s not good. I would have kept banging and shouting until I got a response.

It seems a bit odd that a service would want the models and payment up front. Aside from a payment for some costs to make and paint, really the models themselves are a deposit.

Are you quite sure it was him you saw in the house?

No, I'm not sure if it was him. It looked like him, but I didn't get a good look.

I filed a police report today and got the commissioner to file charges. Either a warrant will happen and / or a court summons.

I know Mike is a volunteer fire fighter... perhaps a lot of calls happening. I follow him on twitter, and he hasn't done anything since Sept. 2, so perhaps he finally got a job and hasn't gotten time to your models (or he's homeless now).

Well Mike has legal trouble now.

The last time Mike contacted (or returned one of my attempts to get ahold of him) was 9-14-11. It has been 49 days. I called and left voice mail, sent him SMS's, emails, and Facebook messages and he hasn't returned any of them.

I just want my property and money back.

Alfndrate wrote:I know Mike is a volunteer fire fighter... perhaps a lot of calls happening. I follow him on twitter, and he hasn't done anything since Sept. 2, so perhaps he finally got a job and hasn't gotten time to your models (or he's homeless now).

My son is a volunteer firefighter, goes to school and holds down two jobs - as well as being married. He's only 22 years old.
If he could find the time to return a phone call or answer the door, so can this guy.

Eric

MagickalMemories wrote:

Alfndrate wrote:I know Mike is a volunteer fire fighter... perhaps a lot of calls happening. I follow him on twitter, and he hasn't done anything since Sept. 2, so perhaps he finally got a job and hasn't gotten time to your models (or he's homeless now).

My son is a volunteer firefighter, goes to school and holds down two jobs - as well as being married. He's only 22 years old.
If he could find the time to return a phone call or answer the door, so can this guy.

Eric

Maybe he's had a lot of fires to put out recently. It could they can't spare the water for washing brushes. I suggest that next time evancich goes to see him he takes some water in case there's a shortage.

I would set up camp at his front door. The guy can't stay inside his house forever.

Call the police, time to bring it to the next level.

"I usually have 100% paypal up front"

A warning sign if there ever was one.

I've been burned BIGTIME on this one.

Best thing really is some sort of one third to start, one third half way through (with WIP pics) and the final third upon receipt.

Or some sort of 50/50 deal.

Once they have your models and your money up front?

Well, if they are a scammer, you've been scammed.

Luckily you leave relatively close to this guy AND can bring legal action to bear against him.

I think you'll be OK, but of course there is the time, money and hassle - but if you get your stuff back, and some or all of the money, well it will be worth it.

Good luck - I'm pulling for you!

Well Mike crawled out of whatever rock he was hiding under.

He claims his computer was broken (which I don't believe since I saw him of FB during the time his computer {he claims} was broken). And, I have no idea why he couldn't answer his phone during all of this.

He says he doesn't have the money to pay me back and no mention of the status of the job.

evancich wrote:Well Mike crawled out of whatever rock he was hiding under.

He claims his computer was broken (which I don't believe since I saw him of FB during the time his computer {he claims} was broken). And, I have no idea why he couldn't answer his phone during all of this.

He says he doesn't have the money to pay me back and no mention of the status of the job.

Other than his FB where else does he advertise his work and have his followers?
Its best to also raise your issue there for all to see, while simultaneously get police involved.

Since he still refuse to be honest with you at this point, its time to get serious.
The if and but period is over.

Just drive down to his house again. Tell him to give you your models and eat whatever monetary loss is involved. It's probably not worth your time or effort to invest anything more into this situation.

Now I know not to use this guy. When I went to the NOVA Open, I won a door prize from this guy. Although I never met him, it was 10 25mm scenic bases that he painted and I assumed he made. If I had the desire, I might be able to dig up the little card that came with it. Regardless this is either someone who became really busy(but that doesn't explain the lack of returning calls) or the worst scammer in the world.

Going to his house could be potentially dangerous, although getting the police involved could leave you feeling bitter. After all, what if there was a good reason for all of this?



Edit: Oh wait never mind, he responded. Have you considered getting the attention of a collection agency?

I already involved the police. I've filled out the paperwork for a small claims suit (I guess sometimes it pays to be a patent attorney).

I told Mike that I won't file the suit if he could show up at my office in DC with my models and some money.

He, of course, hasn't replied. So, I guess we are headed to court.

My county is figuring out how to play the charge. Since the value of the models and cash I paid him is over a thousand dollars is it a felony. Either they will issue a warrant for his arrest or a summons to court to answer the charge.

I've heard he has trouble finding a job and I'm going to get a felony theft charge added to his record. That won't help his job search at all.

I feel for you. I lost $500 and models to Painter6479 when he imploded. I ended up getting my models and $50 back, but the $450 loss sucked.
I've had a friend lose thousands in models and over a $ thousand before.

Hopefully, you get your stuff back. Stay on top of the police to be sure they don't dally too long.


Eric

gak like this is always depressing, so I'll attempt to make you feel better with a great visual aid in painting/model building .

So when you snag yourself a new Apothocary to build:











Humor aside; just stay on the guys case he'll either break from the constant pressure or get slammed for it by the proper authorities.

All the horror stories I read on dakka make me worry about ever getting a commish painting

I hope you get all your models and cash back

Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:All the horror stories I read on dakka make me worry about ever getting a commish painting

I hope you get all your models and cash back

Not all commission painter are bad, I've had some very good experiances with one in perticular. There are several things you as a buyer can do to protect yourself, mainly reserching the painter in question and not giving him everything up front. Reputation seems to be everything in the internet commission buisness.

Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:All the horror stories I read on dakka make me worry about ever getting a commish painting

I hope you get all your models and cash back

That's really like saying, 'all the horror stories I read about lousy opponents on dakka makes me worry about ever getting a game in.'

People talk a lot more, and a lot more fervently, about the exceptionally bad experiences than the good ones. You also generally don't see threads titled, "help, the commission painter did a good job fast! What do i do now?"

Portugal Jones wrote:

Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:All the horror stories I read on dakka make me worry about ever getting a commish painting

I hope you get all your models and cash back

That's really like saying, 'all the horror stories I read about lousy opponents on dakka makes me worry about ever getting a game in.'

People talk a lot more, and a lot more fervently, about the exceptionally bad experiences than the good ones. You also generally don't see threads titled, "help, the commission painter did a good job fast! What do i do now?"

True, but I paint all my own stuff, so I never planned a commish in the first place

Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:

Portugal Jones wrote:

Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:All the horror stories I read on dakka make me worry about ever getting a commish painting

I hope you get all your models and cash back

That's really like saying, 'all the horror stories I read about lousy opponents on dakka makes me worry about ever getting a game in.'

People talk a lot more, and a lot more fervently, about the exceptionally bad experiences than the good ones. You also generally don't see threads titled, "help, the commission painter did a good job fast! What do i do now?"

True, but I paint all my own stuff, so I never planned a commish in the first place

Then why worry in the first place?

In the off chance I changed my mind?

You should find out if he has a business license. If he hasn't been reporting income and is operating without a license, not charging tax etc maybe you can blast him with alot more trouble than small claims court.

MagickalMemories wrote:

Alfndrate wrote:I know Mike is a volunteer fire fighter... perhaps a lot of calls happening. I follow him on twitter, and he hasn't done anything since Sept. 2, so perhaps he finally got a job and hasn't gotten time to your models (or he's homeless now).

My son is a volunteer firefighter, goes to school and holds down two jobs - as well as being married. He's only 22 years old.
If he could find the time to return a phone call or answer the door, so can this guy.

Eric

I know, I'm not defending him, I answer emails and phone calls all day while I grade like 60 pages of work at a day. I'm just giving more background information. I mean the man did start this commission business because he was out of work.


The idea of camping outside his house is not only creepy, its also illegal I believe. BUT you're right, there has to be a way to get a hold of him.

The_Stormrider wrote:You should find out if he has a business license. If he hasn't been reporting income and is operating without a license, not charging tax etc maybe you can blast him with alot more trouble than small claims court.

Depending on where he is based, he might not need a Business license. You never pay tax on service (painting), and and he is possible he is reporting income to the state and IRS.

However, I highly doubt it if he has a normal job.

This is a civil issue. The police will take a report as a matter of record, but ultimately, little will be done other than that.

Going to his house to knock on his door to ask for your items back is not illegal. Banging on the door until someone answers can backfire with you getting a summons for disturbing the peace. It's not trespassing until you're told by them not to come back (they have to prove they told you) or the Police advise you not to go back.

I'd contact his FD. Since it's a volunteer company, you'd likely need to leave a message with the PD or other service the Chief gets info from. Likely there's a web page for the FD that can give you some leads.

Looks like he's posted on Facebook claiming he's 'alive'.

His painting services sound like utter crap to... Tier 1: 3 colors? wtf is that lol

IdentifyZero wrote:Looks like he's posted on Facebook claiming he's 'alive'.

His painting services sound like utter crap to... Tier 1: 3 colors? wtf is that lol

Its for those of us that REALLLY don't want to paint their models, and Tier 1 for him is the low end...

I just don't buy the "my computer was down" excuse.

First of all, I'd never take on a commission without exchanging full contact info with a client. Secondly, there's internet access everywhere. He didn't have a friend who would let him sit on his computer for 10 minutes and get in touch with his clients? Also, there should still be a bunch of freshly painted stuff ready to ship... unless he painted models with his computer. It just all seems fishy to me.

As for "tiers"... that has always seemed like a bad idea to me. I paint armies I am proud to say I painted. period. I can't imagine doing anything else.

It is not civil it is criminal. Not sure of the actual law up there but it is essentially theft of property. He has physical control of another persons property and refuses to return.

@OP Stay on your local authorities. And I would recommed not going to his home anymore. You showing at his place and something goes wrong is real easy to get turned into you are over there looking for trouble. You have done all you can legally just let it play out in court.

Battle Ready Studios wrote:I just don't buy the "my computer was down" excuse.

First of all, I'd never take on a commission without exchanging full contact info with a client. Secondly, there's internet access everywhere. He didn't have a friend who would let him sit on his computer for 10 minutes and get in touch with his clients? Also, there should still be a bunch of freshly painted stuff ready to ship... unless he painted models with his computer. It just all seems fishy to me.

As for "tiers"... that has always seemed like a bad idea to me. I paint armies I am proud to say I painted. period. I can't imagine doing anything else.

I agree with everything.

Not sure what internet and having a computer, have to do with finishing peoples models; not to mention the plentiful access to WiFi in any Urban Area both through coffee shops and/or unsecured networks.

Sounds like snatch'n'grab strategy.

Analyzing pattern of "excuses"

-after loss of internet / hacked computer/ broken camera etc etc

- sickness in family
the level of sickness will get worse depending how long OP tries to get back his items.

- perhaps escalates to "death"

at this stage its pretty "grim" literally. chances are using this specific excuse to cut all ties with OP / customer.
Or use it to get angry that the excuse isnt enough, customers must be inhumane to not let him go etc etc.

evancich wrote:I already involved the police. I've filled out the paperwork for a small claims suit (I guess sometimes it pays to be a patent attorney).

I told Mike that I won't file the suit if he could show up at my office in DC with my models and some money.

He, of course, hasn't replied. So, I guess we are headed to court.

My county is figuring out how to play the charge. Since the value of the models and cash I paid him is over a thousand dollars is it a felony. Either they will issue a warrant for his arrest or a summons to court to answer the charge.

I've heard he has trouble finding a job and I'm going to get a felony theft charge added to his record. That won't help his job search at all.

I'm truly sorry to see another hobbyist having to deal with this, but you're taking the right course of action. At this point you've given him more than ample opportunity to rectify the situation. And if you're not satisfied with just getting your models back, don't stop there. Regardless of what's happened in his personal life, this person has stolen from you and should be held accountable for these actions. If it's worth over $1k, let him face the felony charges. I have no sympathy for people who run from their problems, if you can't do something you committed to, at least put in some effort to try and fix it. Best of luck to you with the rest of this, I hope it works out for you in the end.

Good luck with the court case, hope you get your stuff back.

Its scary to see these stories, people are right, commishers like this really bring shame to the franchise.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but $400?! And that didn't worry you? That's basically working for nothing. The timescale he gave you is dodgy as hell too - 2 months to paint something like 5 Large Monsters and damn near 60 Infantry size, to various schemes and to match what was already done?

It does make me chuckle sometimes that people think commission paintwork (to a professional standard) can be done for that sort of money. Yeah mate, I'll sell you a Ferrari... 25 bucks... yeah, it's genuine, honest, would I lie to you? Just to make it clear I AM NOT SELLING YOU A FERRARI FOR $25. DON'T BE STUPID. No, not even a Scalextric one.

Working at that rate is an indicator straight off that the guy isn't serious about what he does. It's just not maintainable.

I'm honestly sorry you got burned, but I'm not remotely surprised.

To those looking for commission work some simple lessons:
1) Get to know your commission guy. Well. If it looks too good to be true, it probably is. Shop around, follow up on people BEFORE you send them any money or any miniatures. There are a good few honest commission folk who work at minimum wage or below because they love the work or it fits with their lifestyle. See what their reputation is around - check Dakka, Warseer, B&C...

2) Don't worry about shipping / international work. The honest folks charge reasonable shipping, and it's a fraction of what you're paying for the work. Good quality work and good quality service are what you're looking for. Not someone 'local and convenient'. Not that the two are mutually exclusive. Edit: It's the service side that's more important. A good service will correct things you don't like, even if they think it's better. A *really* good service will have convinced you that what they like was actually your idea, and you'll never know it.

3) Talk the job through! A decent commission service will take the time to talk to you about the job in some detail, even if they don't take it. Get them to break down (roughly, these things are never exact) the time they'll spend on each miniature. If they can't / won't, you know they're not really thinking it through or aren't experienced enough to make the call. Either is bad business sense for them, and an indicator things may go tits up faster than a Broxtowe schoolgirl.

Edit: And that modelling photo story... fething genius.

winterdyne wrote:Please don't take this the wrong way, but $400?! And that didn't worry you? That's basically working for nothing. The timescale he gave you is dodgy as hell too - 2 months to paint something like 5 Large Monsters and damn near 60 Infantry size, to various schemes and to match what was already done?

It does make me chuckle sometimes that people think commission paintwork (to a professional standard) can be done for that sort of money. Yeah mate, I'll sell you a Ferrari... 25 bucks... yeah, it's genuine, honest, would I lie to you? Just to make it clear I AM NOT SELLING YOU A FERRARI FOR $25. DON'T BE STUPID. No, not even a Scalextric one.

Working at that rate is an indicator straight off that the guy isn't serious about what he does. It's just not maintainable.

I'm honestly sorry you got burned, but I'm not remotely surprised.

To those looking for commission work some simple lessons:
1) Get to know your commission guy. Well. If it looks too good to be true, it probably is. Shop around, follow up on people BEFORE you send them any money or any miniatures. There are a good few honest commission folk who work at minimum wage or below because they love the work or it fits with their lifestyle. See what their reputation is around - check Dakka, Warseer, B&C...

2) Don't worry about shipping / international work. The honest folks charge reasonable shipping, and it's a fraction of what you're paying for the work. Good quality work and good quality service are what you're looking for. Not someone 'local and convenient'. Not that the two are mutually exclusive. Edit: It's the service side that's more important. A good service will correct things you don't like, even if they think it's better. A *really* good service will have convinced you that what they like was actually your idea, and you'll never know it.

3) Talk the job through! A decent commission service will take the time to talk to you about the job in some detail, even if they don't take it. Get them to break down (roughly, these things are never exact) the time they'll spend on each miniature. If they can't / won't, you know they're not really thinking it through or aren't experienced enough to make the call. Either is bad business sense for them, and an indicator things may go tits up faster than a Broxtowe schoolgirl.

Edit: And that modelling photo story... fething genius.

I totally agree,.

When someone deals with me, they get my name, full address, phone number, email, alternate email, etc. Communication is key.

Now that timeline he presented does seem realistic to me... though I get to do this full time, and naturally am a fast painter.

You're right, the hourly wage for this sucks. bad. But I have a thousand armies I'd like to bring to life... armies I'd never have to time or money to collect and/or play myself... breathing life into someone else's force is an exciting thing.

Another thing I never understood are those painting services that drybrush-n-go.. that offer lesser "tiers" of work. I just can't do that. When I do a commission, I paint it as if I was going to take it to a tournament myself... that army represents my passion for the hobby, I can't do anything less that something I'm proud of.

Though I'm not sure I could give a breakdown of time spent on each model... I'm usually multi-tasking... switching from vehicle to unit to character and back again, while stages dry on something, I'm painting something else, then come back to the unit.

Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

The Grundel wrote:Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

SO he should just let this kid get away with theft then? *rolleyes*

Battle Ready isn't advertizing at all, he's just stating his experience. Simmer down.

The Grundel wrote:Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

Really? All he has to do is return the models and money ... simple. If the charge goes through, it's through his personal inability to reach a settlement and he has no one to blame but himself.

I thought BRS' views on this matter have added far more to the thread than yours.

ruminator wrote:

The Grundel wrote:Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

Really? All he has to do is return the models and money ... simple. If the charge goes through, it's through his personal inability to reach a settlement and he has no one to blame but himself.

I thought BRS' views on this matter have added far more to the thread than yours.

Completely agree. Felonies do ruin lives. However, he only has himself to blame. and BRS comments were spot on.

He may be charged with a felony. But, he should have no problem pleading down to a misdemeanor.

I wouldn't have any moral issues with reporting this to the police.

I've been busy. I went to the 11th's Company's tour last weekend, but I was able to file my case. As, to the felony charge, all this guy has to do is return my stuff. If he wants to avoid that, all he has to do is pick up the phone / email / meet me and it'll go away. He isn't doing these things. Maybe he sucks at life that much, but I'm trying to not go to court, but he seems to not be able to do anything other than that, hence I believe he wanted to steal from me from day 1. I don't have data to support any other conclusion. Plus, it isn't really my problem, soon it'll be between him and the State of Maryland.

Here are the newer posts via Facebook I've had with him, please note, he's gone off the grid again:

September 14Mike Krakosky Jr.
in couple of weeks

October 6Nick Evancich
Just checking in to see how things are coming along and when everything will be finished?

November 6Mike Krakosky Jr.
i am sorry my comp was down

November 6Nick Evancich
I want my models and $ back

November 6Mike Krakosky Jr.
ok
i will send them out to you as fast i can i am broke due to my comp and doctors bills

November 6Nick Evancich
Well, I have bad news for you. I filed a police report and MoCo has turned it into a theft charge. Tomorrow I'm filing small claims court papers.

It is outrages that it took 58 days for you to contact me. I called, emailed and drive over to your house

November 6Mike Krakosky Jr.
you don't have to do that

November 6Mike Krakosky Jr.
my comp was down and you have not been to my house
why are you charging me with threft

November 6Nick Evancich
You have my money and property. Why didn't you answer your phone?

Well the papers are getting filed tomorrow and I've already filed the police report and went to see the commissioner to get it turned into a charge. If you can make it right before, Monday morning, I'll drop the charge and not file the papers.

November 6Mike Krakosky Jr.
i don't have any money
i can give 150 on tues and another in 2 weeks

November 6Nick Evancich
How much of the work is completed?

November 6Nick Evancich
We both know that your computer being broken is simply an excuse, from your facebook stream, I can see that you were on-line between 9-14-11 and now. So, to me that means you were ignoring me. Because you were ignoring my attempts to contact you, I got the police involved.

Once I file charges against you, you magically come out from whatever rock you were hiding under, coincidence? I don’t think so. But, I don’t really care.

I don’t believe you had any intentions of painting my models. I asked many times for a work in progress picture and you didn’t send one.

I’m not dropping the charges until I get all of my money and models back (I’d be stupid to since you have shown a tendency to go off the grid). I will delay filing in small claims court for a couple of days.

Here is my proposal:
You show up at my office on Tuesday morning around 1100 with all of my models and whatever money (in cash, since there is no way I’d take a check or MO from you) you can scrap-up (your finical status is of no concern to me, since I’ll happily take this to court). I’ll give you the police report of your theft (and you can call MoCo and start dealing with them) and we will figure out a payment system for you to pay me back.

My office is:
3000 K St NW
Washington, DC

November 9Mike Krakosky Jr.
i am sorry that couldn't get to your office on tuesday
let me know when is the next time i can come to your office
i didn't get paid last night until after 1pm

Just take him to court already. He obviously thinks you aren't serious.

keep us posted evancich, hope it finally gets resolved.

hang in there!

nectarprime wrote:

The Grundel wrote:Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

SO he should just let this kid get away with theft then? *rolleyes*

Battle Ready isn't advertizing at all, he's just stating his experience. Simmer down.

Indeed, and he isn't taking away his right to vote, own a gun, etc., the kid is forfeiting them through his own actions. He knows the consequences of going down this road and was given many opportunities to resolve it outside of legal action, and chose not to. The way this is being handled is 100% the right way.

If this were you, you wouldn't say "a thousand + dollars of mine were stolen, well, it's okay, I don't want the guy who stole them to get arrested or anything, just forget about it".

Uhhh I saw these fellows at Philcon today. If they are there tomorrow I will grab a picture. I am looking at the picture on his fb page for the date of 8/31. I know it was him because the 2 in the photo were together.

inquisitorlewis wrote:Uhhh I saw these fellows at Philcon today. If they are there tomorrow I will grab a picture. I am looking at the picture on his fb page for the date of 8/31. I know it was him because the 2 in the photo were together.

Thank you for the vigilance!

I mentioned it because he claims to be broke. The convention membership is 50 dollars I believe.

I remember faces because I am vending there. I know it was those 2 100%.

Thanks, if you see him again, ask him to call me

Did not see him today. Sorry I hadnt made the connection sooner.

My advice is to avoid all communication with him. Let the police handle it from here on out. I have a feeling this is not his first rodeo so him communicating with you is planned, and it might bite you. If he contacts you again, tell him he needs to contact the police department you filed the report with. Or what ever they told you to do.

You have my support Evancich.

I agree that Battle Ready hasnt done anything wrong, relax Grundel, and yes felonies are a dangerous thing to your life, so try to avoid getting them. Fraud would be something i probably would avoid...

Jesus, just read the entire thread. Really hope you get your stuff back.

Is this the same guy that "the eternal warriors" podcast were pimping a while back?

The Grundel wrote:Keep this in mind, felony ruins your life. This kid owes you money but to take away his right to vote, own a gun, ect.. Is too much.

battle ready studios, it is totally inappropriate to plug yourself (for 5 paragraphs) and advertise in someone's thread about a negative experience and how to resolve it.

He took away his own rights when he committed a felony and broke the law.

Keep up hunting this guy down, he's obviously a scammer.

So, I drove over to Mike's house today. He was home (he lives with his parents, they answered the door). He gave me my models back. I asked him how much of the work was completed and he said 85%. I gave him a copy of the police report I filed. And I drove home.

I unpacked everything when I got home. 2 of the boxes I sent him were unopened. The army transports I sent him still had the packing peanuts in the trays, which means to me that he did not open or paint anything. Also, everything smells like smoke now.

I'm not dropping the charges (to the folks that are claiming it is civil vs criminal, they are ignorant of the law {my work address is in this thread, google that and you see that I work for one of the most prestigious law firms in DC [it became criminal when somebody can get the state interested in the case and if you know folks in that line of work it is easy]}). I'm not dropping the suit.

All this guy had to do was to return my models and money. Obviously he spent the money and do 0 work on the project, so I'm not sure why he thinks he is entitled to my $.

To sum up:
I asked him for months after the project was overdue to return my stuff & $
He did not
I got the police involved
He started talking to me again
I asked for him to return my stuff, he did not
I drove over and got it back

I paid for this adventure, how was that my fault?

evancich wrote:So, I drove over to Mike's house today. He was home (he lives with his parents, they answered the door). He gave me my models back. I asked him how much of the work was completed and he said 85%. I gave him a copy of the police report I filed. And I drove home.

I unpacked everything when I got home. 2 of the boxes I sent him were unopened. The army transports I sent him still had the packing peanuts in the trays, which means to me that he did not open or paint anything. Also, everything smells like smoke now.

I'm not dropping the charges (to the folks that are claiming it is civil vs criminal, they are ignorant of the law {my work address is in this thread, google that and you see that I work for one of the most prestigious law firms in DC [it became criminal when somebody can get the state interested in the case and if you know folks in that line of work it is easy]}). I'm not dropping the suit.

All this guy had to do was to return my models and money. Obviously he spent the money and do 0 work on the project, so I'm not sure why he thinks he is entitled to my $.

To sum up:
I asked him for months after the project was overdue to return my stuff & $
He did not
I got the police involved
He started talking to me again
I asked for him to return my stuff, he did not
I drove over and got it back

I paid for this adventure, how was that my fault?

Don't worry, I think it's just been one solo poster that's felt that criminal charges are "too harsh". The truth is that he brought this on himself, and actions have consequences.

Good luck getting everything resolved, and out of curiosity, he stated 85% was done, you mentioned stuff that wasn't done, but I'm not clear, was ANYTHING painted or done? This doesn't change the matter of him not delivering and keeping your money, but I find myself curious.

Yeah, so this army is off to Blue Table Painting. Shawn, is so far the only painting service that I trust / rely on.

Mike @ the Painting Apocicary is a scammer.

I've had nothing but trouble with Painted Figs.

The only great experience I've had is with Shawn at Blue Table Painting. If it wasn't for him and his company, I would have given up on this painting service idea.


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@targetawg, to the best I can tell he painted 0 (no) models

Glad to see you got your items back. Hopefully you get your money back from him in court. Don't back down.

Firstly, well done on getting your stuff back and sticking to your guns. A lot of people whinge and complain when these things happen but aren't willing to put a bit of effort in to get a resolution.

evancich wrote:Yeah, so this army is off to Blue Table Painting. Shawn, is so far the only painting service that I trust / rely on.

Mike @ the Painting Apocicary is a scammer.

I've had nothing but trouble with Painted Figs.

The only great experience I've had is with Shawn at Blue Table Painting. If it wasn't for him and his company, I would have given up on this painting service idea.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
@targetawg, to the best I can tell he painted 0 (no) models

This is a real shame. I'm seeing more and more scammers lately when it comes to commission painters / converters.
It aggravates and infuriates me to see such tarnishing of a service that many companies and individuals work hard to polish. I guess people just really need to take a step back and really research their potential service provider before committing.

~Ghost

@Ghost, sure.

I went with Painted Figs in 2008 due to the D6 Generation recommending them. Plus, their prices were very low. I sent them around $10k and 5 armies. After 3 years, I got 1/2 a Space Marine army and 1/2 an ork army back. I've offered to pay Navin to ship the rest (probably 2k models) back, but he keeps falling thru. So, I'm probably going to have to re-buy that DKoK army that he has of mine and all the Warmachine and Firstorm stuff.

Mike (that this thread is about) was recommended by the 11th Company and Eternal Warriors. Mike lies, is a thief, and doesn't seem to answer email or calls, hence he is a scammer.

Shawn, at Blue Table Painting, I found during a google search for painting services, when I was looking into using Painted Figs, years ago. I went with Painted Figs due to price. Shawn is more expensive, but not that much more. Plus, (which is the most important), he gets the project done. I've had hundreds of models painted by him.

So, this experience has taught me that: don't listen to advertisers on podcasts and only use painting services that show results.

Part of the reason this thread piqued my interest from the get go was that I met Mike at the NOVA briefly this year when he came by my army on display. When he heard me mention that I sculpted/cast the bases I made for my army, he chatted with me for a minute or two and asked me to consider doing some sculpting/casting for him, and gave me a card for his "business".

I'm leery about turning my hobby into a business, and so I didn't end up contacting him, also, I want to be careful who I work with.

Turns out, it was a very good thing I decided to be careful, and seeing this thread of yours definitely made up my mind 100%, which is a good thing.

I'd never use a commission painting service, just because it's one of the (if not the) biggest part of the hobbies for me that I enjoy. However if I did, even I think I'd stick to the big name guys like GMM/BTP/etc, which is a shame. I've painted commission before myself for friends and various folks on the internet over the years, and people who scam/don't follow through/refuse to make their mistakes right, make it very very hard for the "little guy" to get into the business, as people are just very reluctant to trust them (for good reason).

evancich wrote:@Ghost, sure.

I went with Painted Figs in 2008 due to the D6 Generation recommending them. Plus, their prices were very low. I sent them around $10k and 5 armies. After 3 years, I got 1/2 a Space Marine army and 1/2 an ork army back. I've offered to pay Navin to ship the rest (probably 2k models) back, but he keeps falling thru. So, I'm probably going to have to re-buy that DKoK army that he has of mine and all the Warmachine and Firstorm stuff.

Mike (that this thread is about) was recommended by the 11th Company and Eternal Warriors. Mike lies, is a thief, and doesn't seem to answer email or calls, hence he is a scammer.

Shawn, at Blue Table Painting, I found during a google search for painting services, when I was looking into using Painted Figs, years ago. I went with Painted Figs due to price. Shawn is more expensive, but not that much more. Plus, (which is the most important), he gets the project done. I've had hundreds of models painted by him.

So, this experience has taught me that: don't listen to advertisers on podcasts and only use painting services that show results.

Fair dinkum. My condolences mate because you have no luck at all >_<

BTP, as much as they have their 'haters', have got to be the most reliable painting service I've ever heard of. Consistent quality, consistent turn around and generally good customer service. Sure, there are services that can get you a 'better' paint job, but I don't think you can go past BTP for the things that matter
~Ghost

evancich wrote:@Ghost, sure.

I went with Painted Figs in 2008 due to the D6 Generation recommending them. Plus, their prices were very low. I sent them around $10k and 5 armies. After 3 years, I got 1/2 a Space Marine army and 1/2 an ork army back. I've offered to pay Navin to ship the rest (probably 2k models) back, but he keeps falling thru. So, I'm probably going to have to re-buy that DKoK army that he has of mine and all the Warmachine and Firstorm stuff.

Mike (that this thread is about) was recommended by the 11th Company and Eternal Warriors. Mike lies, is a thief, and doesn't seem to answer email or calls, hence he is a scammer.

Shawn, at Blue Table Painting, I found during a google search for painting services, when I was looking into using Painted Figs, years ago. I went with Painted Figs due to price. Shawn is more expensive, but not that much more. Plus, (which is the most important), he gets the project done. I've had hundreds of models painted by him.

So, this experience has taught me that: don't listen to advertisers on podcasts and only use painting services that show results.

You sent $10,000 and 5 armies all at once to a commission painter, you had never used? Word to the wise man, maybe start with just 1 new time and not sending them $10,000... I'm sorry you got ripped off, but I can see why. The fact is, people scam, because they can get away with it.

I hear so many horror stories of X being ripped off by Y, but except in this case (The OP) I rarely see anyone follow through and have any legal action done.

The fact that so many people let it slide, is why some of these kids think they can get away with it. They read about some guy on Dakka who is going to send him $1000s up front and an entire army to do work and of course, his eyes get big and his sense flies out the window. It's not right, but, the reason people scam, is because they can get away with it. Don't let them, ever.

@IdentifyZero: No, I sent Painted Figs a Space Hulk job, which they did a great job on. Then I sent them my Descent figs, which they did a great job on.

Then I sent 1/2 of my UM's, which they did a great job on and ditto with my Orks.

After 10 or so successfully completed projects, I felt comfortable and went all in. This was the time Navin ran into some business trouble.

I know the story and have independent data to collaborate the story, so I believe. Basically, he hired the wrong person and that person caused his business to implode.

If I would have sent all that stuff and money 6 months before I did, I would have had everything painted and painted well.

But, as it stands, Navin is doing what he can to stay afloat and packing up and shipping back 2k models is not high on his list of things to do.

You can go here: http://www.paintedfigs.com/gallery/complete

Search on my name and see all the stuff he painted for me.

I don't really care all that much about money (my wife and I are both independently wealthy); I want to have every 40k army (and Firestorm and Warmachine / Hordes) painted with every possible combination of FoC, and I don't want to paint them myself. I have the models to do this, I just need them painted.

That said, I didn't really go after Mike for the $, I went after him because he wronged me and I'm tired of being wronged by painting services.

+1 for independently wealthy.

On a serious note, I have followed this thread for a long time and it's been really interesting. I feel for you, having to deal with person(s) like him.

Regarding the painting services and all the scammers, there should be a thread here on DD with recommended services and their current status...

evancich wrote:
But, as it stands, Navin is doing what he can to stay afloat and packing up and shipping back 2k models is not high on his list of things to do.

Wrong.

This should have been his priority. Packing the stuff back up and getting it returned. Bad business practices and issues are not the problem of the consumer.

I'm glad you're independently wealthy as well and I'm happy that you're willing to take a loss from Navin and co because you're so rich. Not sure what the relevance to the topic is or that anyone cares about your financial status, I'm sure many browsers and posters on Dakka have more then some of us realize, they just know something called humility or even in this case, being humble goes a very long way.

If you were talking like that to this guy, is it any wonder he decided to rip you off after bragging about your wealth?


EDIT: I have been on your side this entire topic and I still don't endorse any theft, even the one committed by Navin and co. However, that has to be one of the most conceited comments on these forums I've ever heard from anyone regarding your wife and yourselfs Independent wealthiness.

evancich wrote:
I don't really care all that much about money (my wife and I are both independently wealthy);

Guys... give him a break.
I know that, to a lot of people, financial status is a taboo topic. Regardless of where you stand financially, from wealthy to dirt poor, there are people in all kinds of financial situations who just don't mind discussing it.

I have friends in various different levels of personal income who don't care about it and freely discuss it with friends and even casual acquaintances. It might just be that he's one of those who doesn't mind sharing it.

It does, in fact, make sense to mention it in this case. He's telling you all that he is not doing it for the money and why.

Please, stay on topic with it. Don't let that little facet drag it off.


Eric

MagickalMemories wrote:Guys... give him a break.
I know that, to a lot of people, financial status is a taboo topic. Regardless of where you stand financially, from wealthy to dirt poor, there are people in all kinds of financial situations who just don't mind discussing it.

I have friends in various different levels of personal income who don't care about it and freely discuss it with friends and even casual acquaintances. It might just be that he's one of those who doesn't mind sharing it.

It does, in fact, make sense to mention it in this case. He's telling you all that he is not doing it for the money and why.

Please, stay on topic with it. Don't let that little facet drag it off.


Eric

It is quite on the topic.

He's justifying the theft of his models and money by one individual and saying he did not do anything, because they had been good in the past basically.

Yet, for a lesser ammount of money and models, he is going after an obviously desperate individual in a poor financial situation.

Why is Painting Apothecary subject to this level of prosecution or action but not Painted Figs aka Navin?

His later mention of being 'wealthy' doesn't make sense in regards to this as why was Navin exempt from prosecution? To me, it seems like Painted Figs did more damage and likely needed prosecuting more than this pathetic guy at Painting Apothecary.

I mean literally, Painting Apothecary guy sounds so pathetic, I'd give him a quarter for a cup of coffee.

I'm trying to understand, what OPs wealth has to do with prosecuting one thief, but allowing another, greater thief, to go free.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Basically:

You let Painted Figs get away with theft, but not Painting Apothecary. Obviously, painting apothecary is in a worse situation and stole less from you then painted figs. Yet you're nailing this loser to the wall.


#1) What does that have to do with being wealthy?
#2) Why do you let the bigger thief go, but try to ruin the smaller ones life?

I think they should both be charged, but in a case of triage here, it seems like Navin and painted figs = the bigger crooks and therefore, should have been a large priority then the painting apothecary guy who lives in his moms house.

I'm not justifying that folks have robbed me. You obviously aren't privy to all of the communication I receive about this: from groups of people that know me and from strangers.

Frankly, I was a bit tired of answering inquiries of whether or not $770 would effect my situation. So, I answered that question in the form.

Me saying that $770 doesn't mean much to me has nothing to do with Mike stealing that from me, but rather to decrease the msg I got over that subject. You are reading your own basis into that statement and frankly over reacting.

How do you know I'm not going after Navin?

Navin is in a country that the USA legal system has almost no affect on for private citizens. A law suit from me to Navin would mean next to nothing, especially in a corrupt country like Sri Lanka. BTW, he bribes the post office workers in Sri Lanka to get the models he receives out of customs. It is just the way things are done there.

I've asked Navin many, many times to return my models. I've told him I'll pay for the return shipping. If I flew to Sri Lanka, I think he'd give the models back to me, but I'm not sure I'd be able to get them out of the country. He could call a customs officer that he bribes monthly if not weekly to impound my stuff. What would I do then? I'm not saying he'd do that, but I don't speak the language and don't know how to get things out of customs there.

Since you are such an expert on my situation with Painted Figs, please tell me how to get my models back in 2011.

As to your #2 point, Mike ruined Mike's life. I repeatably asked him what the status of the project was, which went unanswered or delayed and there was never any photographic proof that he was painting anything. When it was past 48 days of Mike ignoring me and some 90 days of the project being over-due. I started using the police and legal options that were available to me. At that point, he crawled from whatever rock he was under (I believe due to the cops calling him). I gave him 3 weeks to return my $ and models and he was unable to. So why should I cut him anymore slack?

evancich wrote:I'm not justifying that folks have robbed me. You obviously aren't privy to all of the communication I receive about this: from groups of people that know me and from strangers.

Frankly, I was a bit tired of answering inquiries of whether or not $770 would effect my situation. So, I answered that question in the form.

Me saying that $770 doesn't mean much to me has nothing to do with Mike stealing that from me, but rather to decrease the msg I got over that subject. You are reading your own basis into that statement and frankly over reacting.

How do you know I'm not going after Navin?

Navin is in a country that the USA legal system has almost no affect on for private citizens. A law suit from me to Navin would mean next to nothing, especially in a corrupt country like Sri Lanka. BTW, he bribes the post office workers in Sri Lanka to get the models he receives out of customs. It is just the way things are done there.

I've asked Navin many, many times to return my models. I've told him I'll pay for the return shipping. If I flew to Sri Lanka, I think he'd give the models back to me, but I'm not sure I'd be able to get them out of the country. He could call a customs officer that he bribes monthly if not weekly to impound my stuff. What would I do then? I'm not saying he'd do that, but I don't speak the language and don't know how to get things out of customs there.

Since you are such an expert on my situation with Painted Figs, please tell me how to get my models back in 2011.

As to your #2 point, Mike ruined Mike's life. I repeatably asked him what the status of the project was, which went unanswered or delayed and there was never any photographic proof that he was painting anything. When it was past 48 days of Mike ignoring me and some 90 days of the project being over-due. I started using the police and legal options that were available to me. At that point, he crawled from whatever rock he was under (I believe due to the cops calling him). I gave him 3 weeks to return my $ and models and he was unable to. So why should I cut him anymore slack?

Not trying to be snide, but for a man as wealthy as yourself; I cannot see a problem getting your things back from Sri Lanka. Whether through the means you mentioned or:

Step one, contact your US embassy in Sri Lanka (Located in Colombo, Sri Lanka) and inform them of the theft/situation.
Step two, inform them, you will incur all expenses for the trip down there if they can help with the situation.
Step three, fork out the cash, fly down to Sri Lanka and recover your models with their help.

I'm not saying you won't seem a little off when you call them and say this, but this is an option. You could also take a trip to the Sri Lankan embassy in Washington and plead your case.

If this is all about principal, I can see many options you have on the table; the first of which is contacting either embassy. You may think, that nothing will be done, but when you actually make a proper case for yourself, provide documentation and proof; they are obligated to assist.

Obviously you did not read, because I never asked you to cut Mike slack. I said prosecute them both. I suppose, the fact that you misinterpreted that, despite me agreeing with you the entire topic and urging you to go to the police... I'm not sure what to tell you there.

Just throwing it out there, I assume you might be very busy, so if you need to hire someone to recover your models from Sri Lanka including travelling there and any other work that might be assumed, toss me a PM and we can discuss a retainer fee. I can guarantee that I will recover the models you sent to Navin. (This isn't sarcasm in any way, I put my old job skills to good use)

P.S. - Navin fed you a line about the Sri Lanka situation, I just made a call to a Sri Lankan friend who sends over barrels on a monthly basis (Filled with goods, usually for family & friends) and he laughed at the implication that his family would have to bribe customs to get it. The biggest worry, is that items are often stolen from these barrels and similarly, boxes etc... I don't think Sri Lankan customs has any interest in stealing toy miniatures.

It's not sarcasm, it's just being silly, or deliberately obtuse. You seem to have failed to pay attention to the parts of the thread where Painted Figs didn't stop returning messages or dropping off the face of the earth. Funny how staying in contact, even if you are conducting your business quite poorly, earns more leniency with people than trying to cut and run.

Bookwrack wrote:It's not sarcasm, it's just being silly, or deliberately obtuse. You seem to have failed to pay attention to the parts of the thread where Painted Figs didn't stop returning messages or dropping off the face of the earth. Funny how staying in contact, even if you are conducting your business quite poorly, earns more leniency with people than trying to cut and run.

I have paid attention, I fail to see how painted figs is any less guilty of theft of models and money; then this Mike guy was.

I like the message you are giving though, that these guys run businesses and not theft rings. That's the funny part. Theft is theft. Communicating to your victim on a regular basis doesn't justify it.

Do not look at these individuals as business owners, look at them as criminals.

At least in Mike's case, the models were recovered.


It's a shame that individuals like this ruin the hobby, but I hope this will serve as a lesson to anyone else considering sending out full armies and potential thousands of dollars to strangers.

If you took your car to the mechanic, you would not be paying him the money in full for your work before it is done. Neither, would you allow him to keep your car after he took your money and did no work. The same should go for a painter.

It isn't all about principal, I got robbed by Navin. I tried Shawn at BTP and he did an amazing job. I tried Mike (because of the podcast recommendations) and he attempted to scam me. So, he got what he earned.

I've called the USA embassy in Sri Lanka and they have bigger problems, namely terrorist cells there.

Since I work in DC, I've walked in to Sri Lanka embassy and they don't care. They don't really like hearing that a foreigner is saying bad things about a non-terrorist citizen of Sri Lanka and basically couldn't care less.

I have basically one option, which is to ask Navin (nicely) to return my stuff.

I agree he should return my stuff and it should be high on his list. But that is your PoV and my PoV.

I'm sure to Navin, those models are associated with him getting conned and that money is long gone. So, he'd have to further damage his business in order to get those models back to me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Painted Figs is not any less guilty than Mike.

There are just fewer options to recover my $ and models from Sri Lanka

evancich wrote:It isn't all about principal, I got robbed by Navin. I tried Shawn at BTP and he did an amazing job. I tried Mike (because of the podcast recommendations) and he attempted to scam me. So, he got what he earned.

I've called the USA embassy in Sri Lanka and they have bigger problems, namely terrorist cells there.

Since I work in DC, I've walked in to Sri Lanka embassy and they don't care. They don't really like hearing that a foreigner is saying bad things about a non-terrorist citizen of Sri Lanka and basically couldn't care less.

I have basically one option, which is to ask Navin (nicely) to return my stuff.

I agree he should return my stuff and it should be high on his list. But that is your PoV and my PoV.

I'm sure to Navin, those models are associated with him getting conned and that money is long gone. So, he'd have to further damage his business in order to get those models back to me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Painted Figs is not any less guilty than Mike.

There are just fewer options to recover my $ and models from Sri Lanka

Fair enough. I understand your situation a bit better now.

Thanks, if I ever get them back, I'm going to change my return shipping address to Blue Table Painting

Im from asia and to give perspective on how customs and shipping here works, we sometimes need to bribe customs officials to get our imported stuff because its either that or they place a high custom's tax on your package, sometimes the same value as the package itself. Its all very arbitrary.

Barrels or shipping boxes on the other hand are different, for my country those arent checked by customs because its all considered personal belongings.


@identifyzero
Dont talk like its that easy to lawsuit someone from half way around the world as opposed to a guy living within driving distance.

Wow that is great news to hear, anymore updates with the police evancich? My analysis seems 100% spot on back on page 1 xD

I am sorry to hear all these problems you have had mate. I had a bit of problems with painted fig last year as well but I did finally get everything I ordered. I hope you the best of luck with getting everything you own mate.

If you still haven't gotten stuff just remind Navin imo because he did take a bit of reminding on stuff that they had "lost". Not saying you should have to do that but it will get you stuff you ordered.

Painted Figs, yeah, I'll see how that turns out.

@Luna: Yeah, you were right. I'm working within the system to get my $ back. I called the firehouse he volunteers at and gave my side of the story. All of the legal and police pressure is still happening.

I still can't get over how bad of a human being Mike is. I gave him so many chances to make this right and he wasn't able to.

I guess that is why he lives with his parents and can't get a "real" job.

If somebody came at me with legal and police action and said: "all you have to do is show up 20 miles away from where you live with my models and return the $ and all the trouble will go away", I'd totally do that.

I still don't understand why he didn't take the easy road out of this.

evancich wrote:I still don't understand why he didn't take the easy road out of this.

Does he currently know there are legal actions on him?
Im shocked that he didn't attempt to apologize or attempt to solve this privately.

My next analysis, expect a counter strike towards you " some how". So don't be surprised xD

Christ, what a mess.

He is aware. I gave him a copy of the police report when I picked up my models.

The county has contacted him about the civil suit against him.