It's heavily implied that he has a Primarch, but it isn't said who. However, we can guess based on the Primarchs who are dead/missing:
-Alpharius/Omegon (possibly)
-Jaghatai Khan (possibly, although it seems unlikely considering that he's been rumoured to have been seen fighting Eldar in the Webway... then again, since Necrons can break into it now, it's a possibility)
-Leman Russ (possible, but unlikely)
-Vulkan (possible)
-Corax (possible, but unlikely)
-One of the 2 unknown Primarchs
FinalAnswer wrote:Which primarch do we know who's face is contorted in a permanent scream?
I'll give you a hint, his name starts with an "R".
Russ? That makes no sense...
At any rate 'A giant clad in armour' is not heavily implying it is a primarch.
Why wouldn't it? I doubt they would include that text, for a typical space marine. Plus, what could be more valuable to history than one of the Primarchs. Trazyn calls Guliman an "Old Friend" and says that he would be "Better served in his company" in the WD battle report. The man clearly has a thing for Primarchs.
FinalAnswer wrote:Which primarch do we know who's face is contorted in a permanent scream?
I'll give you a hint, his name starts with an "R".
Russ? That makes no sense...
At any rate 'A giant clad in armour' is not heavily implying it is a primarch.
Rogal Dorn?
Only his hands were recovered.
I said that we know is permanently contorted in a scream.
Considering he's moments away from a painful death, and has been stuck in stasis feeling that same pain for about 10000 years or so.
If your talking about Rowboat Girlyman, He's on the Ultramarines home world.
That's what you think.
The Ultramarines books and the Space Marine Codex all say he's in the Fortress of Hera, Thousands of people visit him everyday, including any of the Ultramarines chapter than are on Macragge.
Couldn't it just be a normal Space Marine? They are bigger than Necrons anyway.
It cant be Rogal Dorn, because the statue doesnt have missing hands. I reckon its one of the 2 missing primarchs, because it specifically states that he is "a giant of a man, clad in baroque power armour" and none of the primarchs that I know of wear baroque power armour.
FinalAnswer wrote:Which primarch do we know who's face is contorted in a permanent scream?
I'll give you a hint, his name starts with an "R".
Russ? That makes no sense...
At any rate 'A giant clad in armour' is not heavily implying it is a primarch.
Rogal Dorn?
Only his hands were recovered.
I said that we know is permanently contorted in a scream.
Considering he's moments away from a painful death, and has been stuck in stasis feeling that same pain for about 10000 years or so.
If your talking about Rowboat Girlyman, He's on the Ultramarines home world.
That's what you think.
The Ultramarines books and the Space Marine Codex all say he's in the Fortress of Hera, Thousands of people visit him everyday, including any of the Ultramarines chapter than are on Macragge.
Couldn't it just be a normal Space Marine? They are bigger than Necrons anyway.
Considering how Trazyn has Sebastian frigging Thor's head, him magically replacing Rowboat's body with a fake isn't out of the question. Furthermore, I doubt a normal space marine would be worth being mentioned in Trazyn's collection.
Besides, this is all part of Ward's master plan to have Rowboat revived.
FinalAnswer wrote:Which primarch do we know who's face is contorted in a permanent scream?
I'll give you a hint, his name starts with an "R".
Russ? That makes no sense...
At any rate 'A giant clad in armour' is not heavily implying it is a primarch.
Rogal Dorn?
Only his hands were recovered.
I said that we know is permanently contorted in a scream.
Considering he's moments away from a painful death, and has been stuck in stasis feeling that same pain for about 10000 years or so.
If your talking about Rowboat Girlyman, He's on the Ultramarines home world.
That's what you think.
The Ultramarines books and the Space Marine Codex all say he's in the Fortress of Hera, Thousands of people visit him everyday, including any of the Ultramarines chapter than are on Macragge.
Couldn't it just be a normal Space Marine? They are bigger than Necrons anyway.
Considering how Trazyn has Sebastian frigging Thor's head, him magically replacing Rowboat's body with a fake isn't out of the question. Furthermore, I doubt a normal space marine would be worth being mentioned in Trazyn's collection.
Besides, this is all part of Ward's master plan to have Rowboat revived.
Yes, because getting onto Macragge and stealing a Primarch's body is a walk in the park for a metal skeleton.
Your stating your personal opinion and not true fluff.
JohnnoM wrote:It cant be Rogal Dorn, because the statue doesnt have missing hands. I reckon its one of the 2 missing primarchs, because it specifically states that he is "a giant of a man, clad in baroque power armour" and none of the primarchs that I know of wear baroque power armour.
What about all the ones that don't wear Terminator Armour?
Thamor wrote:Yes, because getting onto Macragge and stealing a Primarch's body is a walk in the park for a metal skeleton.
Your stating your personal opinion and not true fluff.
This entire thread is about speculation, so I'm not sure "true" fluff has any meaning here.
And, like I said, Trazyn doesn't seem to have had any issue stealing the preserved head of fething Sebastian Thor, are you denying it's utterly impossible for the most advance race in the galaxy to steal Rowboat's body, especially when backed by Mat Ward?
It isnt "heavily implied" it could just be a high ranking space marine. The necrons also do not refer to space marines as space marines they call them "the gene-bred" and so it doesnt mean that it is a primarch
Beastmaster wrote:It isnt "heavily implied" it could just be a high ranking space marine. The necrons also do not refer to space marines as space marines they call them "the gene-bred" and so it doesnt mean that it is a primarch
It would make no sense to trump it up or make it mysterious for it to be just a high ranking Space Marine though. It would have just said "a high ranking space marine". It has to be someone we already know about in fluff and someone who is fairly significant in the setting or its history.
Custodes?
He 'd like to have constantin valdor then...
Trazyn collects important pieces of history, so I doubt its a generic space marine.
The style of the PA is the hint at the HH. If not a Primarch, it will be at least one of the characters of the series.
TheAngrySquig wrote:I've never liked it, the video feed cut out and Kurze could have made a deal, he's very persuasive
Slight spoiler which reveals Curze's fate:
Spoiler:
Soul Hunter (by Aaron Dembski-Bowden) confirms Curze as dead.
Note: He let himself be killed.
Also, as to the Power Armoured fella, I'll quite myself from another thread:
Just Dave wrote:
Maelstrom808 wrote:Anyway, nothing about that statement lends me to jump to the Primarch conclusion. ALL space marines are giants among men, and baroque power armor basicly just means that it's elaborate, which being a subjective term, really could belong to any important or well-decorated marine.
This guy is pretty much spot on.
I think Games Workshop clearly wrote it to imply that it's a Primarch - and therefore create hype/speculation like this - but to also leave it ambiguous so it can still be debated over. IIRC a similar thing occurs in the new DE 'dex.
I wouldn't think about it too much; I highly doubt an answer will ever be revealed.
Well lets still look at our options
Russ- No, armour not baroque
Corax- Possible, but not particularly big as primarchs go, still 10 feet tall tho
Vulkan- Probable, baroque armour, huge, everything fits
Khan- No, probably owned by Vect
I'm not including the two missing ones because their dead
The two lost primarchs are heavily implied to have been destroyed and their legions absorbed into the Ultramarines. I don't know where it says this, but I've heard about it enough.
Russ is noted as not adorning his armour, but that is a comment by Magnus so it may well just be a slam. Corax is definitely stated to be small as primarchs go, but I cant remember where. The missing two are dead because Russ killed one and the other was probably dead when they found him, causing Guilliman to swallow his legion
TheAngrySquig wrote:Russ is noted as not adorning his armour, but that is a comment by Magnus so it may well just be a slam. Corax is definitely stated to be small as primarchs go, but I cant remember where. The missing two are dead because Russ killed one and the other was probably dead when they found him, causing Guilliman to swallow his legion
Both ere found. One is hinted to have been killed by Russ and his legion and the other is a touch more mysterious...
TheAngrySquig wrote:Russ is noted as not adorning his armour, but that is a comment by Magnus so it may well just be a slam. Corax is definitely stated to be small as primarchs go, but I cant remember where.
Because you haven't. The "smallest" Primarch was Curze. Corax was fairly large, about on par with most of the Primarchs.
The missing two are dead because Russ killed one and the other was probably dead when they found him, causing Guilliman to swallow his legion
You're right on the first one, second one we don't know about.
But the Guilliman thing was speculation. Seriously. The Word Bearer who makes that accusation is immediately told to man up and shut up, as it's unbecoming even after the shaming of the Word Bearers by the Ultramarines.
acekevin8412 wrote:The two lost primarchs are heavily implied to have been destroyed and their legions absorbed into the Ultramarines. I don't know where it says this, but I've heard about it enough.
States it in the First Heretic.
TheAngrySquig wrote:Russ is noted as not adorning his armour, but that is a comment by Magnus so it may well just be a slam. Corax is definitely stated to be small as primarchs go, but I cant remember where. The missing two are dead because Russ killed one and the other was probably dead when they found him, causing Guilliman to swallow his legion
Look at the cover of Prospero Burns; that's pretty baroque.
I don't recall ever hearing of Corax being stated as small for a primarch, and as you said, he's still a primarch.
The Missing and The Lost is speculation, your opinion on them even more so; it's implied that the Wolves were unleashed on one, doesn't mean that killed their primarch though.* You have no reason to state the other was dead, it's just as likely he's "missing", hence his Legion being dissolved, which again is speculation, though likely.
*
Spoiler:
Terra has facilities enough to capture/imprison a primarch.
Then you have to ask yourself how Trazyn would overcome a Primarch, why a primarch would be screaming and if the answer would ever be revealed. It's just the writer trying to make his character seem more extreme and create speculation for the reader which won't be answered.
It's the same case as the fella in the Dark Eldar 'dex.
Kanluwen wrote:But the Guilliman thing was speculation. Seriously. The Word Bearer who makes that accusation is immediately told to man up and shut up, as it's unbecoming even after the shaming of the Word Bearers by the Ultramarines.
To be fair, whilst speculation it's pretty reasonable.
The Ultramarines are HUGE, the Word Bearer wasn't told to shut up because he was wrong, just because it's speculation within the text doesn't mean it isn't written to hint at the truth.
Then again, like the captured Giant in Power Armour, this is unlikely to ever be revealed and should therefore be considered "speculation, but reasonable" IMHO.
Kanluwen wrote:This was people going wild with speculation, as per normal.
That's the point of the reference in the Codex really IMHO; make the character seem awesome(r) and create interest/speculation within the fanbase.
And thankfully, Ward at least can do it without going all Goto.
And yes, it does, but so do the Dark Angels and some others and how much can good gene seed do alone? Again, it's not unreasonable speculation.
The Dark Angels and Imperial Fist seed is relatively stable, but not entirely complete or receptive to mutations.
There's a reason there are so many Ultramarines Successor Chapters. It's because of several factors:
1) The Ultramarines' geneseed is stable.
2) The Ultramarines, and their Successors, are relatively well behaved in terms of how they react to higher authority figures.
3) They have no "big flaws" which come through the reaction of the seed to the host. Imperial Fists, for example, have a compulsion to collect the bones of their fallen comrades and scrimshaw them--as per the Deathwatch: Rites of Battle book, but had been mentioned elsewhere before in brief.
Kanluwen wrote:The Dark Angels and Imperial Fist seed is relatively stable, but not entirely complete or receptive to mutations.
There's a reason there are so many Ultramarines Successor Chapters. It's because of several factors:
1) The Ultramarines' geneseed is stable.
2) The Ultramarines, and their Successors, are relatively well behaved in terms of how they react to higher authority figures.
3) They have no "big flaws" which come through the reaction of the seed to the host. Imperial Fists, for example, have a compulsion to collect the bones of their fallen comrades and scrimshaw them--as per the Deathwatch: Rites of Battle book, but had been mentioned elsewhere before in brief.
I know this, but we're talking about Heresy/Great Crusade era here, so you can include the other Legions in this. The Word Bearers for example have stable geneseed also IIRC and are a notably large Legion, but even they are dwarfed by the Ultramarines. Again, you can speculate at the reason for this...
Again, I'm not saying the Ultramarines do or don't contain Marines from a missing Legion, but I think it's reasonable speculation.
When you say "dwarfed by the Ultramarines"--that's speculation.
If I'm remembering right, there wasn't some kind of incredibly huge difference. It was a Chapter(and before anyone tries to go "CHAPTERS DIDN'T EXIST THEN!"--yeah, they did. The Dark Angels, specifically, used "Chapters" as an organizational designation for multiple Companies) or two of Marines difference between the Ultras and Word Bearers at best.
Kanluwen wrote:There's a reason there are so many Ultramarines Successor Chapters. It's because of several factors:
1) The Ultramarines' geneseed is stable.
2) The Ultramarines, and their Successors, are relatively well behaved in terms of how they react to higher authority figures.
3) They have no "big flaws" which come through the reaction of the seed to the host. Imperial Fists, for example, have a compulsion to collect the bones of their fallen comrades and scrimshaw them--as per the Deathwatch: Rites of Battle book, but had been mentioned elsewhere before in brief.
4) They're face smashingly big.
And it's hardly speculation. The Emperor says something like, "You are the second biggest legion bar, of course, the Ultramarines." I think that that alludes to them being big.
TheAngrySquig wrote:4) They're face smashingly big.
And it's hardly speculation. The Emperor says something like, "You are the second biggest legion bar, of course, the Ultramarines." I think that that alludes to them being big.
No, it doesn't.
It's YOU assuming that the allusion is making it a huge deal.
The Word Bearers could be thirty Marines less than the Ultramarines--that would still make the Ultramarines bigger.
They could be thirty THOUSAND Marines less than the Ultramarines--that would still make the Ultramarines bigger.
This is why you don't assume things, especially based upon incomplete information.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just Dave wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:When you say "dwarfed by the Ultramarines"--that's speculation.
IIRC Dan Abnett said that the Ultramarines were ~50,000 Marines larger than the Word Bearers, pre-calth.
Cite a source, because that would mean that they were not simply having the "leftovers" of a purged Legion. It would mean that they were inflated to that size, knowingly--as "Legions" were 10k Astartes or so--with Word Bearers and Ultras having more, the rest hovering fairly close to that number for the most part.
Kan, mate, this was the side of you I was trying to avoid;
Much of 40K background is based off speculation and implication, like I've tried to express in this thread, making the baseless foundation that "the other was probably dead when they found him" is wrongIMHO, whereas the implication that Ultramarines include a missing Legion has a lot of foundation to it IMHO.
As we speak, I'm trying to find where/if Dan Abnett mentions the relative sizes. As I said before: "IIRC"
Just Dave wrote:
I think Games Workshop clearly wrote it to imply that it's a Primarch - and therefore create hype/speculation like this - but to also leave it ambiguous so it can still be debated over. IIRC a similar thing occurs in the new DE 'dex.
I wouldn't think about it too much; I highly doubt an answer will ever be revealed.
Kanluwen wrote:Truth be told, I don't think it's a Primarch. This was people going wild with speculation, as per normal.
"A giant in baroque armor" can be any Space Marine--or even a freakin' Thunder Warrior.
Thunder warriors didn't run around in power armor. But its specifically PA in the dex....
Kanluwen wrote:
The Dark Angels and Imperial Fist seed is relatively stable, but not entirely complete or receptive to mutations.
The DA geneseed incomplete? Instable? Mutations?
I doubt that.
The DA are just not obedient enough to act as source.
TheAngrySquig wrote:Legions were bigger, in first heretic it is stated that the WB have 100,000 marines
I'm starting to think people are confusing "Marines" with "Combat Troops".
Legions did actually include normal humans in their ranks as what amounted to their own "personal armies".
Just Dave wrote:Kan, mate, this was the side of you I was trying to avoid;
Much of 40K background is based off speculation and implication, like I've tried to express in this thread, making the baseless foundation that "the other was probably dead when they found him" is wrong IMHO, whereas the implication that Ultramarines include a missing Legion has a lot of foundation to it IMHO.
As we speak, I'm trying to find where/if Dan Abnett mentions the relative sizes. As I said before: "IIRC"
I actually just found it for you.
Abnett states that the Word Bearers were "150k combat troops" and talking about Cultists, while the Ultramarines are fully supported by the Imperial Army in vast numbers.
He states something of that "Calth will have a 3:1 ratio of Ultramarines to Word Bearers in terms of Astartes".
1hadhq wrote:Thunder warriors didn't run around in power armor. But its specifically PA in the dex....
"Thunder Armor" is Power Armor.
It's not as advanced as Mk2 and beyond--but it was Power Armor.
It's YOU assuming that the allusion is making it a huge deal.
The Word Bearers could be thirty Marines less than the Ultramarines--that would still make the Ultramarines bigger.
They could be thirty THOUSAND Marines less than the Ultramarines--that would still make the Ultramarines bigger.
This is why you don't assume things, especially based upon incomplete information.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just Dave wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:When you say "dwarfed by the Ultramarines"--that's speculation.
IIRC Dan Abnett said that the Ultramarines were ~50,000 Marines larger than the Word Bearers, pre-calth.
Cite a source, because that would mean that they were not simply having the "leftovers" of a purged Legion. It would mean that they were inflated to that size, knowingly--as "Legions" were 10k Astartes or so--with Word Bearers and Ultras having more, the rest hovering fairly close to that number for the most part.
First of all: it wasn't aimed at you. I've edited it to reflect it.
Second of all: I posted that video, as an embed and starting at the "important" bits.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So let me put this bluntly here:
With this, we're now looking at a complete overhaul of the previous fluff. Prior to now, at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy--we're looking at 10-15k for Legions as a whole, at tops.
Now, we're seeing 100-150k for the two "biggest" Legions, Space Wolves being 7k, Thousand Sons being 5k, et al.
TheAngrySquig wrote:Legions were bigger, in first heretic it is stated that the WB have 100,000 marines
I'm starting to think people are confusing "Marines" with "Combat Troops".
Legions did actually include normal humans in their ranks as what amounted to their own "personal armies".
So? In first heretic 100.000 word bearer space marines kneel before the Emperor.
There were no serfs or imperial army elements...
Kanluwen wrote:
1hadhq wrote:Thunder warriors didn't run around in power armor. But its specifically PA in the dex....
"Thunder Armor" is Power Armor.
It's not as advanced as Mk2 and beyond--but it was Power Armor.
Mk1 or thunder armor is the predecessor of power armor. A necron and dedicated collector like Trazyn wouldn't make the mistake of confusing them. It doesn't fit into the paragraph's context, to put a mere thunder-warrior as a subject in Trazyns collection.
He displays pieces from lost Eldar craftworlds, the head of the man who ended the apostasy, a display of the death scene of solar macharius, etc etc and you claim "it could be a warrior of the unity wars" ? Really?
As per 'outcast dead' those thunderwarriors were culled after the final battle and they never left Terra.
Access of Trazyn to one is most unlikely.
TheAngrySquig wrote:Legions were bigger, in first heretic it is stated that the WB have 100,000 marines
I'm starting to think people are confusing "Marines" with "Combat Troops".
Legions did actually include normal humans in their ranks as what amounted to their own "personal armies".
So? In first heretic 100.000 word bearer space marines kneel before the Emperor.
There were no serfs or imperial army elements...
I'm seriously having to have glossed over this when I read "First Heretic", and will have to reread the stupid book when I find it again. I do not remember 100,000 Word Bearers "kneeling before the Emperor".
I'm not sure how I feel about this change though.
Kanluwen wrote:
1hadhq wrote:Thunder warriors didn't run around in power armor. But its specifically PA in the dex....
"Thunder Armor" is Power Armor.
It's not as advanced as Mk2 and beyond--but it was Power Armor.
Mk1 or thunder armor is the predecessor of power armor. A necron and dedicated collector like Trazyn wouldn't make the mistake of confusing them. It doesn't fit into the paragraph's context, to put a mere thunder-warrior as a subject in Trazyns collection.
"A mere Thunder-Warrior". You realize how silly that statement is?
Thunder Warriors were the whole reason the Imperium of Man actually came about. Thunder Warriors were the stepping stone towards the Astartes and Mankind's dominion over the stars. For a "dedicated collector like Trayzn", what could have more importance in terms of a historical footnote?
He displays pieces from lost Eldar craftworlds, the head of the man who ended the apostasy, a display of the death scene of solar macharius, etc etc and you claim "it could be a warrior of the unity wars" ? Really?
As per 'outcast dead' those thunderwarriors were culled after the final battle and they never left Terra.
Access of Trazyn to one is most unlikely.
As someone said earlier...
"He has the head of Sebastian friggin' Thor".
If he wants something, I'd say it's feasible he could have gotten it.
Kanluwen wrote:
I'm seriously having to have glossed over this when I read "First Heretic", and will have to reread the stupid book when I find it again. I do not remember 100,000 Word Bearers "kneeling before the Emperor".
I'm not sure how I feel about this change though.
OK, lets speed up your research:
> First heretic ( ADB ) page 58:
One hundredthousand word Bearers kneeled in the dust of the perfect city, rendered prone by Imperial Decree.
A Legion was on its knees.
>First heretic ( ADB ) page 61:
The Emperor speaks:
+Word Bearers, hear me well. You among all my Legions , are guilty of failure.
You number more warriors than any other, except the XIII. Yet your conquests are the slowest and your victories ring hollow.+
The Emperor, beloved by all, talks of Space Marine Legions here, not serfs, not attached imperial army elements or any other troops.
To question him, about the size of the Legions he created?
Kanluwen wrote:
If he wants something, I'd say it's feasible he could have gotten it.
He got some impressive pieces, but is also banned on Tomb-worlds. It goes on to state he awakens his troops to fetch what could be lost in the wars to come, even occupying imperial worlds to achieve his goal. So yes he's dedicated to his "hobby".
Now, most collectors know its impossible to get everything....
In case of Trazyn, time is a factor. The head of a long dead somewhere on display can be 'acquired', a whole body directly from Terra before the IoM moved out to the inner system ( Mars, Saturn,..) again? Wouldn't bet on Trazyn.
With this, we're now looking at a complete overhaul of the previous fluff. Prior to now, at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy--we're looking at 10-15k for Legions as a whole, at tops.
Now, we're seeing 100-150k for the two "biggest" Legions, Space Wolves being 7k, Thousand Sons being 5k, et al.
This is what I call "A Big Deal".
It is a fairly big deal, aye.
Then again, I don't think 100k is unreasonable at all.
Kanluwen wrote:As someone said earlier...
"He has the head of Sebastian friggin' Thor".
If he wants something, I'd say it's feasible he could have gotten it.
Again, this all just seems to be extreme things to make his character seem so much more awesome/bad-ass, and without trying to fuel the hate-train, it does sound very like Mat Ward's (or GW's) current style of fluffing characters.
1hadhq wrote:He got some impressive pieces, but is also banned on Tomb-worlds. It goes on to state he awakens his troops to fetch what could be lost in the wars to come, even occupying imperial worlds to achieve his goal. So yes he's dedicated to his "hobby".
Now, most collectors know its impossible to get everything....
In case of Trazyn, time is a factor. The head of a long dead somewhere on display can be 'acquired', a whole body directly from Terra before the IoM moved out to the inner system ( Mars, Saturn,..) again? Wouldn't bet on Trazyn.
"The Outcast Dead" takes place during the Horus Heresy, yeah?
I'd bet that there'd be enough confusion that it'd be easy enough for him to get one.
Or that whole "Unification War" timeframe...
And it's not like the Imperium was aware of who the Necrons were at the time.
I'd bet that there'd be enough confusion that it'd be easy enough for him to get one.
Which of the two left, the subedar or the jamedar?
I am more concerned what the Inquisition traded for these tesseract labyrinths. Usually Necrons don't share tech...
Must have been something valuable and a collector like Trazyn could be mad enough to swap Necron tech for a few shiny additions to his collection.
Well, going back to the face stuck in a scream thing could make a reasonable argument for it being kurze. I know that this probably just the ramblings of a KL fan but hear me out, he is repentant for what he did, so it's not unreasonable that his face could be stuck in a scream if M'Chen stabbed him, then Trayzn popped up and stasised him and took him back to his zoo
With this, we're now looking at a complete overhaul of the previous fluff. Prior to now, at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy--we're looking at 10-15k for Legions as a whole, at tops.
Now, we're seeing 100-150k for the two "biggest" Legions, Space Wolves being 7k, Thousand Sons being 5k, et al.
This is what I call "A Big Deal".
It is a fairly big deal, aye.
Then again, I don't think 100k is unreasonable at all.
Didn't Dan at that video interview said that they recon Ultramarines having 250.000 Space Marines ( and he noted that were only the combat ready marines, with more in reserves )?
TheAngrySquig wrote:Well, going back to the face stuck in a scream thing could make a reasonable argument for it being kurze. I know that this probably just the ramblings of a KL fan but hear me out, he is repentant for what he did, so it's not unreasonable that his face could be stuck in a scream if M'Chen stabbed him, then Trayzn popped up and stasised him and took him back to his zoo
They can, but like Astartes, they typically don't.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Brother Coa wrote:
Just Dave wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:So let me put this bluntly here:
With this, we're now looking at a complete overhaul of the previous fluff. Prior to now, at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy--we're looking at 10-15k for Legions as a whole, at tops.
Now, we're seeing 100-150k for the two "biggest" Legions, Space Wolves being 7k, Thousand Sons being 5k, et al.
This is what I call "A Big Deal".
It is a fairly big deal, aye.
Then again, I don't think 100k is unreasonable at all.
Didn't Dan at that video interview said that they recon Ultramarines having 250.000 Space Marines ( and he noted that were only the combat ready marines, with more in reserves )?
Yeah, he did; hence my posting the video in the 1st place.
In my basic maths example, it arguably evens out the million Space Marines needed through some Legions being less than 100,000, there only being 9 loyalist Legions, casualties, but then new Space Marines and larger than 100,000 Legions, such as the UM's.
Guilleman is stasis? I have seen another picture of it floating around with him with black hair that is almost identical....and they both have that permanant scream going on. Combined with the WD article I kind of think it's impliied to be Guilliman too.
It CANNOT be Rowboat because Trazyn implies that he is interested in going to Ultramar and adding him to his collection. It is either in the Necron Codex or the latest White Dwarf. I'm guessing that it is one of the Loyalist Primarchs that went missing. Probably Vulkan as Russ and Corax went to the EoT and Khan is in Commoragh as an arena fighter!
1.(often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to a style of architecture and art originating in Italy in the early 17th century and variously prevalent in Europe and the New World for a century and a half, characterized by free and sculptural use of the classical orders and ornament, by forms in elevation and plan suggesting movement, and by dramatic effect in which architecture, painting, sculpture, and the decorative arts often worked to combined effect.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the musical period following the Renaissance, extending roughly from 1600 to 1750.
3. extravagantly ornate, florid, and convoluted in character or style: the baroque prose of the novel's more lurid passages.
1.(often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to a style of architecture and art originating in Italy in the early 17th century and variously prevalent in Europe and the New World for a century and a half, characterized by free and sculptural use of the classical orders and ornament, by forms in elevation and plan suggesting movement, and by dramatic effect in which architecture, painting, sculpture, and the decorative arts often worked to combined effect.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the musical period following the Renaissance, extending roughly from 1600 to 1750.
3. extravagantly ornate, florid, and convoluted in character or style: the baroque prose of the novel's more lurid passages.
4. irregular in shape: baroque pearls.
Except in the 40k universe it's generally established that we will see baroque descriptions as the first definition.
1.(often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to a style of architecture and art originating in Italy in the early 17th century and variously prevalent in Europe and the New World for a century and a half, characterized by free and sculptural use of the classical orders and ornament, by forms in elevation and plan suggesting movement, and by dramatic effect in which architecture, painting, sculpture, and the decorative arts often worked to combined effect.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the musical period following the Renaissance, extending roughly from 1600 to 1750.
3. extravagantly ornate, florid, and convoluted in character or style: the baroque prose of the novel's more lurid passages.
4. irregular in shape: baroque pearls.
Except in the 40k universe it's generally established that we will see baroque descriptions as the first definition.
Heh? I'm pretty sure that most Imperial buildings look like nothing that came out of 17th century Italy. I'd say that definition #3 is the correct one to use when talking about 40k.
And Thunder Armor is powered armor, it's just clunky, has lots of exposed cables, and isn't environmentally sealed like the Mk II and later versions.
Primarchs don't wear regular Power Armor or Terminator Armor. Primarchs are just so large that they wear custom armor, and I always assume that what they're wearing is more effective than Terminator Armor, yet allows more freedom of movement than regular armor. Basically they get the best of the best of the best equipment (assuming that they didn't just make it themselves) and they're so freaking strong that they're able to clump around in what they're wearing without any issue.
TheAngrySquig wrote:But remember its not power armour it's "powered" armour. That just means its armour with a generator, which primarchs do wear
Thing is, 'power armor' is a generic term. Tau wear power armor, astartes wear power armor, even Eldar wear power armor (those Dark Reaper whatever guys, maybe others too). Just saying it's power armor doesn't narrow things down enough.
1.(often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to a style of architecture and art originating in Italy in the early 17th century and variously prevalent in Europe and the New World for a century and a half, characterized by free and sculptural use of the classical orders and ornament, by forms in elevation and plan suggesting movement, and by dramatic effect in which architecture, painting, sculpture, and the decorative arts often worked to combined effect.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the musical period following the Renaissance, extending roughly from 1600 to 1750.
3. extravagantly ornate, florid, and convoluted in character or style: the baroque prose of the novel's more lurid passages.
4. irregular in shape: baroque pearls.
Except in the 40k universe it's generally established that we will see baroque descriptions as the first definition.
Heh? I'm pretty sure that most Imperial buildings look like nothing that came out of 17th century Italy.
1.(often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to a style of architecture and art originating in Italy in the early 17th century and variously prevalent in Europe and the New World for a century and a half, characterized by free and sculptural use of the classical orders and ornament, by forms in elevation and plan suggesting movement, and by dramatic effect in which architecture, painting, sculpture, and the decorative arts often worked to combined effect.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the musical period following the Renaissance, extending roughly from 1600 to 1750.
3. extravagantly ornate, florid, and convoluted in character or style: the baroque prose of the novel's more lurid passages.
4. irregular in shape: baroque pearls.
Except in the 40k universe it's generally established that we will see baroque descriptions as the first definition.
Heh? I'm pretty sure that most Imperial buildings look like nothing that came out of 17th century Italy.
Durza wrote:Not big enough! The Emperor's palace can be seen from Mars, making it bigger than Earth!
You can't see Earth from Mars...unless you have a very powerful telescope
Heh? How do you figure that? One can easily see Mars from Earth, and we can easily see Venus from Earth, so why would Earth not be visible from Mars?
That's true, I think when they said you could see the palace from mars they meant, with the assistance of_______ (most likely a telescope or something of the sort). We can see mars and venus but to the naked eye, they're nothing more than stars. So I think obviously they mean with some sort of viewing device. Which is still pretty amazing that you can see a palace on the planet's surface
TheAngrySquig wrote:Well lets still look at our options
Russ- No, armour not baroque
Corax- Possible, but not particularly big as primarchs go, still 10 feet tall tho
Vulkan- Probable, baroque armour, huge, everything fits
Khan- No, probably owned by Vect
I'm not including the two missing ones because their dead
Mentioning him as a giant and specifically mentioning baroque power armour leads me to think of Vulkan. Someone who meticulously crafts his own armour in his own style and is noted as being amongst the biggest primarch (IIRC he and Ferrus were the biggest). With that kind of statement obviously written to invoke this kind of discussion, they've obviuosly put in clues as to who it is in what they wrote. They know people will assume a Primarch, GW writers aren't known for subtlety. So we're looking for a giant amongst giants.
It's probably Vulkan, I would guess that they would only mention a giant in baroque Armour if he was super huge and super baroque. So second biggest Primarch with best craftmanship ever is a pretty good guess
TheAngrySquig wrote:Well lets still look at our options
Russ- No, armour not baroque
Corax- Possible, but not particularly big as primarchs go, still 10 feet tall tho
Vulkan- Probable, baroque armour, huge, everything fits
Khan- No, probably owned by Vect
I'm not including the two missing ones because their dead
Mentioning him as a giant and specifically mentioning baroque power armour leads me to think of Vulkan. Someone who meticulously crafts his own armour in his own style and is noted as being amongst the biggest primarch (IIRC he and Ferrus were the biggest). With that kind of statement obviously written to invoke this kind of discussion, they've obviuosly put in clues as to who it is in what they wrote. They know people will assume a Primarch, GW writers aren't known for subtlety. So we're looking for a giant amongst giants.
Now that you mention it... GW are known for their obvious subtlety... if that made anysense...
They're so obvious they're subtle? Or.... I've confused myself.....
Perhaps one of Vulkan's artifacts was taken by Trayzn and something.......
Durza wrote:Maybe it's meant to be a Chaos primarch.
As far as we know, they are all accounted for, except maybe for Omegon, but it seems unlikely that the most cunning, devious, sneaky and mysterious being of all time (save the Deceiver, perhaps) got captured by a space robot.
This captured being can't be one of the two lost primarchs either, they were lost/destroyed/corrupted long before the awakening of the necrons.
It can't be Guilliman, or Rogal Dorn, or any of the primarchs whose location is still known to the IoM for very obvious reasons.
That leaves us with: Vulkan, Khan, Russ and Corax.
-Khan is rumored to be held captive by the DE, and I find it really hard for someone to be held captive by two different groups of douche-bags at the same time, even for a primarch.
-Russ and Corax were last seen heading for the EoT, and if there's one place in the entire galaxy where the necrons don't go, that's the EoT.
-That leaves us with Vulkan. Indeed, his craftsmanship among the primarchs was unrivaled (which could explain the "baroque power armor") and he was described as a pretty strong primarch (second only to Ferrus in sheer physical strength, which could explain the "giant man").
So yeah, I'd say Vulkan, he is the "least unlikely" of the four primarchs to get captured by the necron super-villain.
TheAngrySquig wrote:It has to be like, New York City sized or bigger
The palace sits on top of Himalayas. And remember how big that chain of mountains is?
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blazinpsycho&typhooni wrote:
Heh? How do you figure that? One can easily see Mars from Earth, and we can easily see Venus from Earth, so why would Earth not be visible from Mars?
That's true, I think when they said you could see the palace from mars they meant, with the assistance of_______ (most likely a telescope or something of the sort). We can see mars and venus but to the naked eye, they're nothing more than stars. So I think obviously they mean with some sort of viewing device. Which is still pretty amazing that you can see a palace on the planet's surface
This, we can't see Mars from Earth trough naked eye but we would mistaken it for a star. Adn it's impossible for us to see surface of Mars with naked eye from Earth without telescope.
Durza wrote:Maybe it's meant to be a Chaos primarch.
As far as we know, they are all accounted for, except maybe for Omegon, but it seems unlikely that the most cunning, devious, sneaky and mysterious being of all time (save the Deceiver, perhaps) got captured by a space robot.
This is Matt Ward. Matt Ward who said that Mortarion, the primarch who never leaves his daemon world, magicked himself into the middle of a Grey Knights army for no particular reason. Do you really think he's above claiming they stole Pertuabo or Lorgar for the lolz?
daveNYC wrote:Isn't Lorgar the only daemon primarch who has actually dropped off the map?
No. Fulgrim has completely vanished, not even the Emperor's Children can find the planet of infinite pleasure he lives on. Mortarion rarely leaves his plague planet apart from his occasional extreme open heart surgery.
daveNYC wrote:Isn't Lorgar the only daemon primarch who has actually dropped off the map?
No. Fulgrim has completely vanished, not even the Emperor's Children can find the planet of infinite pleasure he lives on. Mortarion rarely leaves his plague planet apart from his occasional extreme open heart surgery.
) 1 million Space Marines. So that would require 10 Legions - loyal - numbering 100k each.
and U Mad? written all over him
