im a necron player who is a bit tight on money. i can't decide on which hq(s) to get. help in deciding would be appreciated
also, when you vote, post the reason your choice is superior to the others

Everyone is saying Imotehk the Stormlord. That's who I will be fielding!

Imhotek gives some very intriguing army-building options, but you have to build the army around him.

I really like the Nemesor for your purposes...he's got some cool rules, and his bodyguard can be taken at higher points to really up his abilities. Otherwise, I really like the Illuminar because he is one of the cheapest HQ options, but he still adds to your army by pumping up one unit. Also, there's no model for him, so you can scratch-build/kit bash him from whatever you have lying around, so he's one of the cheaper options atm $wise.

I like szeras for his upgrade ability.

I have seen some people use Anrakyr and had some very good results, especially if he is in a CCB. Fly around slashing vehicles and then take one over even after turbo boosting.

I maintain that a Warscythe overlord in a CCB will prove to be the premier HQ choice for necrons.

I love Capt Crazy and his buddy. Crazy can influence the battle in very interesting ways when used correctly and his buddy is a beast in CC.

There are a lot of rumors floating around that you can shoot after deep striking in 6th edition. If those hold true, The Nemesor will be one of the greatest HQ choices... the ability to instantly deep strike and fire on a reserve unit will be great.

No you don't get to fire, just deep strike IF you could deep-strike originally . . .

The bog standard Overlord is IMO the best bang for your buck. Imotekh is practically a nerf to the army-- after playing a few test games using him, I'm not sure why so many people think he's good and don't expect him to stick around for much longer.

Achilles, hes talking about 6th ed rumors, and holy crap you have a lot of armies

fetterkey, explain how big man is a nerf?

Hammer18 wrote:Achilles, hes talking about 6th ed rumors, and holy crap you have a lot of armies

fetterkey, explain how big man is a nerf?

Limits your own shooting just as much as your opponent; and GK are the same range as necrons basically, so it helps them just as much as the 'Crons.

Base overlord; hes pwnsauce

that is why you make an army around him, preferably with solar pulse. but i do get the reasoning

I personally like Our time-warping friend.

Hammer18 wrote:that is why you make an army around him, preferably with solar pulse. but i do get the reasoning

Well, if you use a solar pulse to free up your own shooting phase, then you lose his lightning. I'd rather just take a solar pulse or two and use them to constrain my opponents and not myself. This will also be cheaper and allow me to get an HQ that provides combat power as well as utility.

good point. the fact that solar pulse got rid of the lightning escaped my mind. but i was going for more of extend night fighting for the enemy after the storm is over

The average nightfighting roll is 21", so most Necron shooting only loses 3" in the dark (and a lot of necron shooting is 12" while moving anyway). As long as you're not using Doomsday Arks or Heavy Gauss Cannons you're probably not gonna be that hurt yourself by the night fighting rules.

I have 6 games in the belt with different hq's, some more than once. The one that influences the game the most is Zandrekh, he is a must take without a doubt! Imotekh is too random, needing 6's to get results.

if you wouldn't mind, could you explain some tactics with zandrekh

Anrakyr. All abilities you will want, not paying for much that is questionable, and very affordable points cost. And as a bonus, you can move flat out in his CCB, take your warscythe sweeps, and still take control of an enemy vehicle.

His Pyrrhian Eternals also turns one of your Immortals squads into a legitimate assault threat.

I don't know if you can really class any HQ as "the best", but there are certainly some very viable options.

I see a regular Overlord in a CCB with Warscythe and maybe even a Tachyon Arrow as a solid choice. Versatile, fast and not too points heavy. Anrakyr is a nice upgrade from this kind of character.

Zandrekh and Obyron make a nice combo, though you don't necessarily need both. Zandrekh cripples other armies that rely on their USR's to shine and buffing your own units in the process, while Obyron is just a beast in cc (or at least as much of a beast as a Necron can be...which is still pretty brutal).

Imotekh I'm just not getting. Night fight for the majority of the game. Sounds good. But then if you ever get rid of it you lose it's main benefit. Why not just use a couple of solar pulses? Let's be honest, after 2 turns your opponent is probably in shooting range anyway, regardless of night fight.
But if you want to do a cc Heavy list I can see that working. Of course you will be putting a lot of points into resilient units so model count may be low, but I see potential if built right.

Other haven't really thought about too much.

Fetterkey wrote:The bog standard Overlord is IMO the best bang for your buck. Imotekh is practically a nerf to the army-- after playing a few test games using him, I'm not sure why so many people think he's good and don't expect him to stick around for much longer.

Huh?

After you add up his wargear your basically paying 50 points for a few turns of NF, lightning strikes, pinpoint DSing FOs, and a OS Sr 6 AP 1 2D6" line of death weapon.. If the lightning strikes alone hit two units/turn for the first two turns (Statistically very likely if your opponent has at least 12 units) they pay for those 50 points. Two Crypteks with Solar cost more then 50 points. A OS SR6 AP1 line of death cost ?? and pinpoint DS Flayed Ones is another ?? in point cost, but certainly has value.

Practically a nerf?

Interwebs logic.

Edit: Said Sacrabs meant Flayed Ones

What's this about pinpoint scarabs?

tedbpb wrote:What's this about pinpoint scarabs?

Sorry meant Flayed Ones.

just a q

ive seen absolutely no one mention the d lord. why?

Hammer18 wrote:just a q

ive seen absolutely no one mention the d lord. why?

no retinue, no eternal warrior.

pratell wrote:

Hammer18 wrote:just a q

ive seen absolutely no one mention the d lord. why?

no retinue,

Wraiths. Arguably the best assault unit in the Codex too.

i thought he meant the court

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:The bog standard Overlord is IMO the best bang for your buck. Imotekh is practically a nerf to the army-- after playing a few test games using him, I'm not sure why so many people think he's good and don't expect him to stick around for much longer.

Huh?

After you add up his wargear your basically paying 50 points for a few turns of NF, lightning strikes, pinpoint DSing FOs, and a OS Sr 6 AP 1 2D6" line of death weapon.. If the lightning strikes alone hit two units/turn for the first two turns (Statistically very likely if your opponent has at least 12 units) they pay for those 50 points. Two Crypteks with Solar cost more then 50 points. A OS SR6 AP1 line of death cost ?? and pinpoint DS Flayed Ones is another ?? in point cost, but certainly has value.

Practically a nerf?

Interwebs logic.

Edit: Said Sacrabs meant Flayed Ones

I actually only added up 35 points for his special abilities, after all of his wargear. Did you include the Phaeron upgrade in his cost as well?

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:The bog standard Overlord is IMO the best bang for your buck. Imotekh is practically a nerf to the army-- after playing a few test games using him, I'm not sure why so many people think he's good and don't expect him to stick around for much longer.

Huh?

After you add up his wargear your basically paying 50 points for a few turns of NF, lightning strikes, pinpoint DSing FOs, and a OS Sr 6 AP 1 2D6" line of death weapon.. If the lightning strikes alone hit two units/turn for the first two turns (Statistically very likely if your opponent has at least 12 units) they pay for those 50 points. Two Crypteks with Solar cost more then 50 points. A OS SR6 AP1 line of death cost ?? and pinpoint DS Flayed Ones is another ?? in point cost, but certainly has value.

Practically a nerf?

Interwebs logic.

Edit: Said Sacrabs meant Flayed Ones

Imotekh's special night fighting is inferior to standard Solar Pulse night fighting in a balanced list, and the Solar Pulse option also costs substantially less. Seize the Initiative on 4+ is nice, but paying 225 points for a super character that can't even fight competently isn't worth it, especially since he causes your own army to operate under Night Fighting as well as theirs.

Corseth wrote:The average nightfighting roll is 21", so most Necron shooting only loses 3" in the dark (and a lot of necron shooting is 12" while moving anyway). As long as you're not using Doomsday Arks or Heavy Gauss Cannons you're probably not gonna be that hurt yourself by the night fighting rules.

It does hurt the Crypteks that have the Solar Pulse as well (36" Eldritch Lance), and are the most likely Harbinger weapon to be taken more than once. Not that it is a reason not to take it, but it's yet another thing to take into consideration.

Sasori wrote:

I actually only added up 35 points for his special abilities, after all of his wargear. Did you include the Phaeron upgrade in his cost as well?

Maybe so. I did the calculation a few days ago and posted that off memory.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Fetterkey wrote:

Imotekh's special night fighting is inferior to standard Solar Pulse night fighting in a balanced list, and the Solar Pulse option also costs substantially less. Seize the Initiative on 4+ is nice, but paying 225 points for a super character that can't even fight competently isn't worth it, especially since he causes your own army to operate under Night Fighting as well as theirs.

Oh yeah, that's something else I forgot to throw in (and some how you still are contesting this?) So if Sasori is right that's 35 points your paying for NF for 2+ turns, Pinpoint FO's, a 2D6" SR6 AP1, Lightning strikes, AND seize on a 4+.

Man That is a frikken steal by any measurable quantity I can comprehend, and "can't even fight competently" is simply not true. Some one else did the math hammer on his CC versus a warscythe and it's actually better against some opponents and worse against others. With 4WS and 5S he has a .67 wounds/round against MEQ versus 1.25 with WS, however against something like Wyches its 1.10 (gauntlets) versus 1.25 for WS and against TEQ its .33 (Gauntlets) VS .83 (WS). The WS is definitely better but the disparity isn't as great as people make it out to be.

Immo actually seems very viable with long range shooting like Arks. Just take a Solar Pulse and a Chrono and you can set up their firelanes and then get two turns firing for each ark with no counter-shooting.



Stormlord - 225
Harbinger of Storm, Chronometron 40
Harbinger of Destruction, Solar Pulse 55

8 warriors, Ghost Ark 219

Doomsday Ark - 175
Doomsday Ark - 175
Doomsday Ark - 175

1064.

What else to add to this core besides one Troops to compliment the alpha strike?

Immo gives you a reasonable chance to go first, limits first turn firepower by a significant degree and will throw some damage around to MSU armies (IE most everyone). So, if you built an alpha strike around him;


Doom Scythe x 3
Lychguard in Night Scythes
Scarabs running forward

Supported by relentless Warriors advancing forward into range---that seems pretty doable. At least some pretty difficult decisions for your opponent next turn.

A solar pulse cryptek gives just as much defensive advantage for only 20 points. And using him to negate Imotekh's night fighting is an even bigger waste of points. His seize bonus amounts to a 1/6 increase in the odds of going first.

Necrons don't need help beating units like wyches, they need help against Meq and Teqs.

Emperor awfulness wrote:A solar pulse cryptek gives just as much defensive advantage for only 20 points. And using him to negate Imotekh's night fighting is an even bigger waste of points. His seize bonus amounts to a 1/6 increase in the odds of going first.

Necrons don't need help beating units like wyches, they need help against Meq and Teqs.

And your only paying 35 points for it on Immo, and it can last more then two turns, and it causes lightning, and that's not even including all the other things he does that no one else in the dex can do. A 1/6 increase in going first is HUGE, especially in an army that can minimise the impact of NOT going first, so you can really stack a flank against an opponent when going second and have NF to fall back on if you don't get it.

CC contingency is something that needs to be accounted for in any Necron List against any opponent, and Immo, while not quite as awesome sauce as some overlords in CC, is no slouch.

But I guess if you already have determined that 35 points is too much for:
2+ turns of NF
Lightning
4+ Seize
Pinpoint FOs
Str6 AP1 2D6" line of death

Then I suppose there will be no convincing you

Trazyn the infinite


there i said it. I haven't played all of them, but to me, he seems very neat. He isn't a power house, but he does offer some very cool powers. First, i love his ability to capture objectives. I find this can be a pain because you can effectively make a non scoring unit scoring by adding him to it. Also, his empathic obliterator. On the one hand, its very circumstantial, on the other hand, charge him into 30 orks, kill ~15 before combat res. I know that that is not always going to happen, but it is a great nieche threat. That and his ability to "not die" can be a real pain, and it will make getting rid of your objective capturing capabilities much more difficult. also, i think he might be the best (relative) HQ to put with a squad of lychguard. Now not only can they capture objectives, but they can't be bogged down by swarms any more. I forget the rest of his abilities, but he would be my number one choice.

canadianone wrote:Trazyn the infinite


there i said it. I haven't played all of them, but to me, he seems very neat. He isn't a power house, but he does offer some very cool powers. First, i love his ability to capture objectives. I find this can be a pain because you can effectively make a non scoring unit scoring by adding him to it. Also, his empathic obliterator. On the one hand, its very circumstantial, on the other hand, charge him into 30 orks, kill ~15 before combat res. I know that that is not always going to happen, but it is a great nieche threat. That and his ability to "not die" can be a real pain, and it will make getting rid of your objective capturing capabilities much more difficult. also, i think he might be the best (relative) HQ to put with a squad of lychguard. Now not only can they capture objectives, but they can't be bogged down by swarms any more. I forget the rest of his abilities, but he would be my number one choice.

Good points. I like where your going with the Trazyn+LG.

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Emperor awfulness wrote:A solar pulse cryptek gives just as much defensive advantage for only 20 points. And using him to negate Imotekh's night fighting is an even bigger waste of points. His seize bonus amounts to a 1/6 increase in the odds of going first.

Necrons don't need help beating units like wyches, they need help against Meq and Teqs.

And your only paying 35 points for it on Immo, and it can last more then two turns, and it causes lightning, and that's not even including all the other things he does that no one else in the dex can do. A 1/6 increase in going first is HUGE, especially in an army that can minimise the impact of NOT going first, so you can really stack a flank against an opponent when going second and have NF to fall back on if you don't get it.

CC contingency is something that needs to be accounted for in any Necron List against any opponent, and Immo, while not quite as awesome sauce as some overlords in CC, is no slouch.

But I guess if you already have determined that 35 points is too much for:
2+ turns of NF
Lightning
4+ Seize
Pinpoint FOs
Str6 AP1 2D6" line of death

Then I suppose there will be no convincing you

I'm going to call his 95 points of phylactery/weave/phase shifter/phaeron fair game, too. Assuming he joins a squad, because he's garbage hanging out on a CCB, phaeron is only helping gauss Immortals and Warriors. Nobody else wants/needs relentless. And in those squads, he probably won't be needing 75 points in survivability upgrades. If he joins Lychguards or a Royal Court, phaeron isn't much help, but his mediocrity in CC is apparent. He can take a beating, but can't dish it out. So he's best off hiding in the back where all of those survivability upgrades do nothing.

I'm going to call his night fighting worse than a solar pulse, because it affects you also. If not for the lightning, it would be directly worse than solar pulses. And flayed ones are a pretty lame unit to buff, probably the weakest in the codex.

So his strength 6 line is okay, if short ranged, and his lightning is good, and a 16% higher chance of going first is better than nothing. But his gear is certainly suboptimal, and you are still paying the points for it.

Emperor awfulness wrote:
I'm going to call his night fighting worse than a solar pulse, because it affects you also. If not for the lightning, it would be directly worse than solar pulses. And flayed ones are a pretty lame unit to buff, probably the weakest in the codex.

So his strength 6 line is okay, if short ranged, and his lightning is good, and a 16% higher chance of going first is better than nothing. But his gear is certainly suboptimal, and you are still paying the points for it.

Well, pulse only gives you one turn of Night Fight--which most of the time he will be giving you at least 2--so comparing it to a single pulse really isn't fair. It would be different perhaps if pulses were a bit cheaper and Crons had more long range alpha strike components in their army--but they really don't outside of ordinance range--which have always failed to impress in popping armor (Not to mention if they setup second, you'll likely have to move them anyways to avoid cover).

So, he gives you 2+ turns of Night Fight (Plus the ability to turn it off if you position well enough turn 1) + Lightning Strikes (Against MSU will be handy first turn).


And while his Seize only gives you 16-17ish increase in odds--it does play a larger factor on the table (and how players setup). You can setup rather aggressive, knowing you will have Night Fight first turn even if you fail to seize. Your opponent has to setup knowing that even though he has first turn, he might not get a turn in--get hit by lightning--and alpha striked. I'd almost rather give my opponent first turn with Imo, just so I could deny flank with some Scythes, make him think twice about an aggressive setup and waste his first turn.

I'm going to call his 95 points of phylactery/weave/phase shifter/phaeron fair game, too. Assuming he joins a squad, because he's garbage hanging out on a CCB, phaeron is only helping gauss Immortals and Warriors. Nobody else wants/needs relentless. And in those squads, he probably won't be needing 75 points in survivability upgrades. If he joins Lychguards or a Royal Court, phaeron isn't much help, but his mediocrity in CC is apparent. He can take a beating, but can't dish it out. So he's best off hiding in the back where all of those survivability upgrades do nothing.

I'm going to call his night fighting worse than a solar pulse, because it affects you also. If not for the lightning, it would be directly worse than solar pulses. And flayed ones are a pretty lame unit to buff, probably the weakest in the codex.

So his strength 6 line is okay, if short ranged, and his lightning is good, and a 16% higher chance of going first is better than nothing. But his gear is certainly suboptimal, and you are still paying the points for it.

Fair point on the survivability upgrade, but I envision him in a group of 20 warriors, making the Phaeron ability nails (1 point per model to give 20 shots a 30" mobile threat range instead of 24" static, yes please), and the survivability anti Warrior wipe contingency. Stick him out in front of the Phalanx and force your opponent to fight through him instead of dinging wounds off the warriors, also use him to soak wounds with his 2+/3++. You've got the Phylactery, might as well be a bit aggressive with him.

I just don't understand the FO hate, especially FOs enhanced by Immo. For 13pts a model there stat line is solid, there warriors that trade there gun for 2 CC attacks. What is it that you want them to do that they don't do already?

I say zandrek and obryon are the best, even if you don't use both, they still have some extremely versatile tactics and abilities. Obryon and lychguard? Hell yes, zandrek plus anything within LOS? even better. Both?=win

Has anyone used Illuminor Szeras and how good is he?

he is not the best but for his point cost he is very good. lord stat line (basically), high strength gun, improved stat on 1 squad and gaze of flame. but compared to the other HQ choices he pales. if ur in a low point game and want a little extra then he is perfect

My vote is Zahndrekh, his points cost is decent for his gear and the ability to enhance your forces for what ever job they are trying to achieve at the time. I would have him off with a unit of immortals adding and removing USR's while enabling your immortals to take some return fire without withering.

Obyron is also extremely useful if you are going to be taking Lychguard, he is a power house himself, and allows you to slam your shield guard at an enemy deathstar, give and take decent damage and them warp out if you are able to position enough fire power to really wail on them.

Mr Nobody wrote:Has anyone used Illuminor Szeras and how good is he?

My current vision for him is in a group of 20 warriors with a res orb and the gaze of flame he provides the unit plus the 5BS-or-5T-or-5S (and GA's providing cover) make the unit as a whole just nails (I also have Imo in the unit).

ShadarLogoth wrote:

I'm going to call his 95 points of phylactery/weave/phase shifter/phaeron fair game, too. Assuming he joins a squad, because he's garbage hanging out on a CCB, phaeron is only helping gauss Immortals and Warriors. Nobody else wants/needs relentless. And in those squads, he probably won't be needing 75 points in survivability upgrades. If he joins Lychguards or a Royal Court, phaeron isn't much help, but his mediocrity in CC is apparent. He can take a beating, but can't dish it out. So he's best off hiding in the back where all of those survivability upgrades do nothing.

I'm going to call his night fighting worse than a solar pulse, because it affects you also. If not for the lightning, it would be directly worse than solar pulses. And flayed ones are a pretty lame unit to buff, probably the weakest in the codex.

So his strength 6 line is okay, if short ranged, and his lightning is good, and a 16% higher chance of going first is better than nothing. But his gear is certainly suboptimal, and you are still paying the points for it.

Fair point on the survivability upgrade, but I envision him in a group of 20 warriors, making the Phaeron ability nails (1 point per model to give 20 shots a 30" mobile threat range instead of 24" static, yes please), and the survivability anti Warrior wipe contingency. Stick him out in front of the Phalanx and force your opponent to fight through him instead of dinging wounds off the warriors, also use him to soak wounds with his 2+/3++. You've got the Phylactery, might as well be a bit aggressive with him.

I just don't understand the FO hate, especially FOs enhanced by Immo. For 13pts a model there stat line is solid, there warriors that trade there gun for 2 CC attacks. What is it that you want them to do that they don't do already?

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Imotekh in our test games has been amazing. Pricey yes, but awesome. As Age of Egos said, you have to build a list around him.

We have found that the Alpha Strike shooty list or Scarab Farm assault oriented list works best.

I have tried basic Overlords with Phaeron, Warscythe, orb and a big brick of Warriors, and they work great! I really liked them quite a bit, and I think you can get away without taking the Phase Shifter on him.

The Destroyer Lord has also proven to be really good! Surprisingly so. I would certainly recommend giving hm a shot.

We haven't tried all the other HQ's yet, so I'll reserve judgement on which is "best" but for now, I'd tentatively say that in most lists, the Stormlord is the business.

Kevin949 wrote:

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Fair enough, though from my personal experience of building lists the last couple of weeks It seems the Elite FOS is the last I tend fill generally speaking.

They are 4.33 points/4S-4WS-2I attack, with the resiliency of a space marine, that can deepstrike and infiltrate. Stack that up against any comparative bog standard CC model and I think they stack up pretty well.

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Fair enough, though from my personal experience of building lists the last couple of weeks It seems the Elite FOS is the last I tend fill generally speaking.

They are 4.33 points/4S-4WS-2I attack, with the resiliency of a space marine, that can deepstrike and infiltrate. Stack that up against any comparative bog standard CC model and I think they stack up pretty well.

Hey, I'm on your side about flayed ones. Two squads of 20 in an Imotekh army with some JI fast attack support will tear it up for sure! The problem is that the flayed ones, especially now, can't feasibly be taken in groups smaller than 10 in just about any game size.

Kevin949 wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Fair enough, though from my personal experience of building lists the last couple of weeks It seems the Elite FOS is the last I tend fill generally speaking.

They are 4.33 points/4S-4WS-2I attack, with the resiliency of a space marine, that can deepstrike and infiltrate. Stack that up against any comparative bog standard CC model and I think they stack up pretty well.

Hey, I'm on your side about flayed ones. Two squads of 20 in an Imotekh army with some JI fast attack support will tear it up for sure! The problem is that the flayed ones, especially now, can't feasibly be taken in groups smaller than 10 in just about any game size.

Agreed, I say 15 to 20 or leave them at home. I just really love their synergy with Imo. They do exactly what I want an assault squad to do against foot based HS, stick um between them and the board and use your victims as cover.

I have used Orikan the Diviner in a couple of games and found that with two squads of LG or even Praetorians supporting him makes for a nasty day at the table for the other guy especially if you are playing a cc minded opponent. Open with with a truck load of warriors and immortals and then just let them wade into the fray with Orikan and his legion of cc troops plus when the "stars align" it really gets frisky cause your opponent will tend to grit his teeth. I really feel all the Lords have their benefit based on what kind of army you want to play. So my suggestion would be get either the Overlord model or just the Lord model and you can do a playing as option and try out all the different play styles with all of them.

Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

SGrimhart wrote:I have used Orikan the Diviner in a couple of games and found that with two squads of LG or even Praetorians supporting him makes for a nasty day at the table for the other guy especially if you are playing a cc minded opponent. Open with with a truck load of warriors and immortals and then just let them wade into the fray with Orikan and his legion of cc troops plus when the "stars align" it really gets frisky cause your opponent will tend to grit his teeth. I really feel all the Lords have their benefit based on what kind of army you want to play. So my suggestion would be get either the Overlord model or just the Lord model and you can do a playing as option and try out all the different play styles with all of them.

That's a cool idea. If you haven't done so already drop a chronomotron in Orikan's unit, that way if the stars align early (say turn 3ish) you don't get gimped on turn 4 or 5 with an unlucky role.

Define "best"

Depends on what army type you field. A slow army with little ranged weapons would benefit from Imotekh. If you want a cheap one go for the Overlord, or similarly pump him up. A fast, tough unit for tying up units is the Destroyer. A fun version is the Overlord in Command Barge, sweeping everyone. The others all offer fun and unique armies but aren't worth it IMHO. However if you can be bothered to create a Nemesor Zandrekh & Vargard Obryon they seem pretty cool and relatively competitive and I love the fluff.

I'm currently tumbling around an Diviner+Infinite list. Still a work in progress but it has some exciting potential, a lot of time manipulation and what not.

Hammer18 wrote:just a q

ive seen absolutely no one mention the d lord. why?

pratell wrote:

Hammer18 wrote:just a q

ive seen absolutely no one mention the d lord. why?

no retinue, no eternal warrior.

Not even an invul save :(

ShadarLogoth wrote:

SGrimhart wrote:I have used Orikan the Diviner in a couple of games and found that with two squads of LG or even Praetorians supporting him makes for a nasty day at the table for the other guy especially if you are playing a cc minded opponent. Open with with a truck load of warriors and immortals and then just let them wade into the fray with Orikan and his legion of cc troops plus when the "stars align" it really gets frisky cause your opponent will tend to grit his teeth. I really feel all the Lords have their benefit based on what kind of army you want to play. So my suggestion would be get either the Overlord model or just the Lord model and you can do a playing as option and try out all the different play styles with all of them.

That's a cool idea. If you haven't done so already drop a chronomotron in Orikan's unit, that way if the stars align early (say turn 3ish) you don't get gimped on turn 4 or 5 with an unlucky role.

No, but I will this weekend when I am butchering my opponent I have put a couple of Crypteks with him and that really makes for a mess all over the table. I started doing this since most of the people at my local shop use either tyranids, orcs or GK and I needed something to offset the cc aspect. I have also used Trazyn which works wonders against horde armies.... my buddy can't stand it as he is a 'nid player. LOL

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Fair enough, though from my personal experience of building lists the last couple of weeks It seems the Elite FOS is the last I tend fill generally speaking.

They are 4.33 points/4S-4WS-2I attack, with the resiliency of a space marine, that can deepstrike and infiltrate. Stack that up against any comparative bog standard CC model and I think they stack up pretty well.

I think the problem is being swept.
Init 2 means if you win and break an opponent, they are likely to get away.
If you lose and break yourself, you're likely to lose them all.
3S4 attacks each is nice, but the risk/reward aspect of them is not. If 6th edition changes what happens when you lose combat and makes initiative less critical, they will see the light of day. As is, they are extremely EXPEN$IVE models.

-Matt

HawaiiMatt wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

The hate stems from the fact that they're costed and built like a troops choice but they're stuck in the Elites section, competing with MUCH better options (that are MUCH more expensive, of course). They're just terribly underwhelming even though they can bring a TON of attacks to the board.

Fair enough, though from my personal experience of building lists the last couple of weeks It seems the Elite FOS is the last I tend fill generally speaking.

They are 4.33 points/4S-4WS-2I attack, with the resiliency of a space marine, that can deepstrike and infiltrate. Stack that up against any comparative bog standard CC model and I think they stack up pretty well.

I think the problem is being swept.
Init 2 means if you win and break an opponent, they are likely to get away.
If you lose and break yourself, you're likely to lose them all.
3S4 attacks each is nice, but the risk/reward aspect of them is not. If 6th edition changes what happens when you lose combat and makes initiative less critical, they will see the light of day. As is, they are extremely EXPEN$IVE models.

Yeah I feel you on that last point, I've had 20 metal FO's since 2002 so it doesn't affect me as much as others.

I think the 2I is a bit over played, especially in a large group. I've math hammered 15 FOs against most opponents I would expect and with 10 LD its very rare that the FOs lose combat by enough for them to even have a chance to get swept. The difficult to sweeping advance themselves is true, but not complete uncommon, hindrance. Termies can SA but still remain popular as an assault unit.

Grundz wrote:Define "best"

just take into account the cost, abilities, regular stats, and how they help out the army.
then pick out which one in ur opinion is the best.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

First post on the boards!

Nemesor Zahndrekh for sure. Dishing out special rules to your squads, whilst snatching them away from your enemies will definitely throw your enemies for a loop. Why yes, I will give my Shard with Gaze of Death Furious Charge.
Failing the Nemsor, either a straight up Overlord, or maybe even Szeras..he's cheap, gives you more points to fiddle with your Court (Don't take that out of context). he's sort of the Bile of the Necrons.

Tin_cannon wrote:First post on the boards!

Nemesor Zahndrekh for sure. Dishing out special rules to your squads, whilst snatching them away from your enemies will definitely throw your enemies for a loop. Why yes, I will give my Shard with Gaze of Death Furious Charge.
Failing the Nemsor, either a straight up Overlord, or maybe even Szeras..he's cheap, gives you more points to fiddle with your Court (Don't take that out of context). he's sort of the Bile of the Necrons.

Szeras is a Cryptek; he can't take a Royal Court.

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Yuber wrote:

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Ew that's nasty. 3 10/2's should pretty safely eliminate, or at least cripple, most tanks.

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Yuber wrote:

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Ew that's nasty. 3 10/2's should pretty safely eliminate, or at least cripple, most tanks.

Lol railguns are still stronger

I'm agreed with Shadarlogoth.

I also enjoy Orikan the Diviner. Particularly in conjunction with some Tremorstaves and a Writhing Worldscape C'Tan Shard.

im2randomghgh wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Yuber wrote:

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Ew that's nasty. 3 10/2's should pretty safely eliminate, or at least cripple, most tanks.

Lol railguns are still stronger

Yeah...well...our codex is NEWER And last I checked Broadsides can't DS?

ShadarLogoth wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Yuber wrote:

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Ew that's nasty. 3 10/2's should pretty safely eliminate, or at least cripple, most tanks.

Lol railguns are still stronger

Yeah...well...our codex is NEWER And last I checked Broadsides can't DS?

Last I checked 72" range and TL means that doesn't matter?

Ostrakon wrote:I maintain that a Warscythe overlord in a CCB will prove to be the premier HQ choice for necrons.

I Second this.

im2randomghgh wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Yuber wrote:

Irdiumstern wrote:Nemsor Zhandrek allows an all deepstrike list (Except for him, he has to be on the board) to all arrive at the same time, if an enemy comes in from reserves. That's insane. You can leave your entire army, except for him, in reserves, and then bring them in in response to where the enemy is arriving. Then, those units can act normally in your turn, since they arrived during the enemies' turn. Wraiths can DS in and charge. Good times.

This.

Allows you to instantly put wraiths into desired locations for countercharge or bubble wrapping. Deepstriking S10 (tank hunters) destroyers work best with zandrekh, they also deepstrike too.

Ew that's nasty. 3 10/2's should pretty safely eliminate, or at least cripple, most tanks.

Lol railguns are still stronger

Yeah...well...our codex is NEWER And last I checked Broadsides can't DS?

Last I checked 72" range and TL means that doesn't matter?

You clearly checked wrong.

<broadcast mode active: topic deviating from intended purpose; resume focused discussion>

Okey dokey, janthkin.

Overlord with tri-linked heavy railguns is the best necron hq.

wuestenfux wrote:

Ostrakon wrote:I maintain that a Warscythe overlord in a CCB will prove to be the premier HQ choice for necrons.

I Second this.

I third this.

Tyranids? Tyranids. wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

Ostrakon wrote:I maintain that a Warscythe overlord in a CCB will prove to be the premier HQ choice for necrons.

I Second this.

I third this.

I fourth this (quote pyramid à la monolith? let's do this!)

im2randomghgh wrote:

Tyranids? Tyranids. wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

Ostrakon wrote:I maintain that a Warscythe overlord in a CCB will prove to be the premier HQ choice for necrons.

I Second this.

I third this.

I fourth this (quote pyramid à la monolith? let's do this!)

Well, I guess we'll a lot a Necron armies with 2 Overlords w/ warscythe in a CCB and Crypteks with some gimmicks like solar pulse.

Also, that HQ (forget name) who can randomly transform into a super-powerful version of himself sounds cool.

im2randomghgh wrote:Also, that HQ (forget name) who can randomly transform into a super-powerful version of himself sounds cool.

But he isn't an overlord, so you only get 1 court.

2x night fighting, or 2x veils is IMO much better. Also, that guy who powers up, also powers down. It would be tough to plan on him doing anything, the window of butt-kicking is very small.

Overlord in Barge.

-Matt

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Imhotek gives some very intriguing army-building options, but you have to build the army around him.

No you don't. You have to include one solar pulse... which should always be included anyways. Imhotek is too stupidly good from about 1750 and up to leave behind. A few good roles with his silly storm/nightfight rules can alone win you games against parking-lots. Well worth spending a few more points over a slightly cheaper HQ.

Man how it sucks to play the entire game in the darkness...

HawaiiMatt wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Also, that HQ (forget name) who can randomly transform into a super-powerful version of himself sounds cool.

But he isn't an overlord, so you only get 1 court.

2x night fighting, or 2x veils is IMO much better. Also, that guy who powers up, also powers down. It would be tough to plan on him doing anything, the window of butt-kicking is very small.

Overlord in Barge.

-Matt

What? you get a court for overlords AND special characters.

It says specifically in the Royal Court entry which Special characters grant access to it.

I think Trazyn is pretty cool. He has some interesting abilities. I like the fluff too.

All necron HQ's are insane. i like Imhotek because he has night fighting and as long as it is then gets his awsome S8 lightning shot of awsomeness. Plus he syeals the initiative on aa 4+ (except against orks. confusing buggers they are).

HawaiiMatt wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Also, that HQ (forget name) who can randomly transform into a super-powerful version of himself sounds cool.

But he isn't an overlord, so you only get 1 court.

2x night fighting, or 2x veils is IMO much better. Also, that guy who powers up, also powers down. It would be tough to plan on him doing anything, the window of butt-kicking is very small.

Overlord in Barge.

-Matt

Nightfighting is actually an advantage for me and my tau. I usually include a HWBF on most of my suits, and my SMS can ignore it by default. Basically, it hinders crons and only affects my kroot's shooting.

Lukus83 wrote:It says specifically in the Royal Court entry which Special characters grant access to it.

Hm, I'll have to go look closer. I though it just named overlords and special characters but not destroyer lords.

I didn't say anything about Destroyer Lords...But there is a list at the top of the Royal Court entry which shows which Special Characters "unlock" the Court. Other than that it's just the regular Overlords.

Lukus83 wrote:I didn't say anything about Destroyer Lords...But there is a list at the top of the Royal Court entry which shows which Special Characters "unlock" the Court. Other than that it's just the regular Overlords.

I didn't say *you* did say anything about destroyer lords, *I* said *I* thought it was all the named characters and overlords but not destroyer lords. But ya, I read the entry last night and saw that wasn't the case.

Standard overlord with warscythe, ccb and aarow is what i've had the best success with. the storm lord is too gimmicky my tastes. In theoryhammer hes great but in realhammer he is a lot of points, you have to build your army around him, he limits you as well, and you get one or two 6's a turn rolling for lightining ( except for the usual' this 1 time...').

Imhotek!

The Grundel wrote:Standard overlord with warscythe, ccb and aarow is what i've had the best success with. the storm lord is too gimmicky my tastes. In theoryhammer hes great but in realhammer he is a lot of points, you have to build your army around him, he limits you as well, and you get one or two 6's a turn rolling for lightining ( except for the usual' this 1 time...').

Third time I fielded Imotekh and his lightning alone destroyed a chaos dread, half of what I think was a havoc squad (lascannons and missile launchers), did a bunch of "Crew Stunned" on stuff and took out a couple other little guys. First game I used imotekh, lightning ended on round 2. Ya, pretty gimmicky but great when it works.

Kevin949 wrote:

The Grundel wrote:Standard overlord with warscythe, ccb and aarow is what i've had the best success with. the storm lord is too gimmicky my tastes. In theoryhammer hes great but in realhammer he is a lot of points, you have to build your army around him, he limits you as well, and you get one or two 6's a turn rolling for lightining ( except for the usual' this 1 time...').

Third time I fielded Imotekh and his lightning alone destroyed a chaos dread, half of what I think was a havoc squad (lascannons and missile launchers), did a bunch of "Crew Stunned" on stuff and took out a couple other little guys. First game I used imotekh, lightning ended on round 2. Ya, pretty gimmicky but great when it works.

He can win you games alone. Against IG - side armour 10 on pretty much everything. Hit a hydra squadron, a manticore etc, and you just took out something dangerous. If you get lucky and nightfight lasts for 3-5 turns, Imotehk may win you the game alone. Last time I played against him, it was night fight until turn 5. I played bikers, so lightning+night fight wasn't that bad, but it still won my opponent the game, when in turn 4, the damn lightning killed off two one-bike squads I had hid away, giving him 2 extra KP's. I can only thing about what had happened if I had played him with my IG list. That would have been a ton of wrecked tanks and an insane amount of lost shooting.

I just don't get what people are talking about that you have to build your army around him. Include one solar pulse, and you are good to go. Necrons are not long range fighters anyways, so night fight generally doesn't bother them. Even in match-ups where it would bother them, you can choose to end it after turn 1. Seriously, Imotehk is broken good.

Destroyer Lords are the shizzle as well

I like the vanilla overlord

Although the Traveler on a barge is also a cool choice. Have both of them running around doing sweeps

I haven't been able to play test any of these yet so take this with a grain of salt.
I usually play around 2000 pt games and of the ones I've studied Immotehk seems to be really good if you build our army to match his strengths. Solar Pulses can help offset the night fighting for you if you need to get some ranged shots on your opponent. He also is a bit of a steal for what you get, though depending on your opponent it could be difficult to get close enough use his line of death effectively without risking him to a counter charge.

Some of the other specials are good to but really most of them seem like they are too random (Diviner and Illuminar) and others are just meh. Tranzen is the only other one who I am moved by. Tranzen + Lichgard seems to be a potentially sick combo, but its also a massive point (and Money) pit.

Over all the Overlord with a Warscythe on a CCB is probably the best combo as he can sweep over multiple tanks smacking them for 7 +2d6 armor pen. He is one of the cheapest and best bang for your buck.

One Notable mention would be Nemesor Zandrekh (Leave the Vanguard at home unless you can afford a full unit of Shield LG as a backup.) Leave him on foot and let him buff a squad for more killing, and debuff a squad for less killing. What I play on using him for is to give my army more anti-Tank ability. Str 10 Destroyers, or other many others. if your into the Doomsday Ark, (Which I am not, personally) you can go a str 10 on that, if you hit things are going to go away. And hes only a few more points then a generic lord. Only downside is there is no Scythe, but that saves you points as theres no real reason to pay for a CCB.
A note for this: Could one make the argument that the Royal Court is one unit? If so then the Crypteks can throw str 9 lances at 36"

Purely from scanning the Codex (I'm still reanimating my Necrons at present, so no game experience), I like Anrakyr the Traveller. The ability to control your opponent's best vehicle (well, sort of) for two thirds of the game? Yes, please! The arrow is nifty too, a nice bonus if it comes off.

If the rumours are true that we'll see a model for him in Feb, he'll be my main HQ choice.

Having used Imotekh, I really like him. I'm not sure how much you really need to build your army around him since practically all Necron shooting is 24 inches or below.

If you can keep the night fighting going for a few turns (chronometron helps with that) the Lightning can really do a job your opponent. Even if it just blasts apart some transports it's handy. I'm also somewhat underwhelmed by the Tachyon Arrow. I just wish that the Characters carrying it weren't BS4. I miss with those things a lot.

@rako: If the crypteks aren't spread out they just stay part of the royal court, becoming one unit.
my last game i tried Trazyn with LG. beat the crap out of hormagaunts, genestealers, and held an objective.
i have a q: if you did a sweeping attack with Trazyn would it do the whole wound everyone thing?

I have to say that I'm a little surprised at the lack of love the Destroyer Lord is getting.

Those things are pretty bad ass.

i am as well. in higher points games i try to fit one in. with wraiths they really screw my foes plans. they are still beating those two crypteks

If destroyer lord could unlock court he would be top of my list. He is decent, but that court is too good to pass up. I also don't like dropping 400 points on HQ just to get overlord and destroyer overlord.

I don't think I'd take just a Destroyer Lord, but running with Wraiths or even other destroyers with an Orb he can soak up shooting and mount a mean assault on anyone who gets too close.

that's how i use him