Posted over at Warseer:

xxRavenxx wrote:Very exciting news for the world of retail.

If you meet certain criteria (Essentially the criteria is being a reasonably sized hobby store), you will now recieve the following:

£500 of stock per year for demoing to customers, placing terrain on the table, etc.

£100/200 (I forgot the given number) in stock to give prizes out for competitions.

Trophies. Made specially by GW to give out to winners. (Which presumably will be fairly cool.)

So yeah. GW move to give people free stuff for participating in organised play, and in stores. I think its a lovely move on their part. Long may it continue

Fantastic move - I really like this and think it will help bring a lot of new players into the hobby.

WOW sweeet

makes me feel that much better about taking the 30 dollars in store credit prize for taking first in the local tourney recently

Well ... if this is true, works for me and my local peeps.

This is along side the new product margin levels they just set. (margin level is the type of stockist you are, and are required to stock specific things in concordance with your level).

Depending on how fast you fill out the form and send it in conforming to the new rules dictates what level of the above benefits your store will recieve.

at least thats the gist of what my gw rep told me on the phone yesterday, will have to see exactly what we get when we sign the forms.

That isn't half bad

A couple free new armies every year to do cool demo's with (maybe rafle the old one's off at the end of the year)

And enough free prizes for several good sized tourniments

The money prize pool its a money that will probable be back in no time, since the winners surely will spent in other stuff or some armys they want to get, anyway, its a good move on their side

Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Sweet more terrain my the FLGS guy will want painted in exchange for store credit.

*Waiting to see how long till a person inevitably bitches about this as well*

Its a good idea GW is implementing this.

GW has really been trying to make us forget about their recent slump. A good move, in my book.

That's pretty cool .. but, didn't they already give free product to stores for tournaments and prizes? At least I thought they did a couple years ago when I was planning to open up my own shop.. Or do they give even more now than before?

Mr Hyena wrote:*Waiting to see how long till a person inevitably bitches about this as well*

Too true, unfortunately.

I thought GW already gave out at least prize support?

Either way this is a good move.

GW currently gives out prize support per quarter based on some such or another. You'd have to get the specifics from someone like Mikhaila. So the new amount they are giving out would depend on whether it's once a year or quarterly or what. But i like the reward for demoing in retail stores.

Wow, seems like one of the better marketing choices GW has made, re: their fanbase.

The £1-200 prize money will presumably be GW vouchers, but still these sound like a fairly good idea.

Well color me impressed

Hulksmash wrote:GW currently gives out prize support per quarter based on some such or another. You'd have to get the specifics from someone like Mikhaila. So the new amount they are giving out would depend on whether it's once a year or quarterly or what. But i like the reward for demoing in retail stores.

Is the 100/200 # per event or per year with trophies taking the place of monthly prizes?

It's great news...if you have a FLGS near you :(

Congratulations to GW.


Finally catching up to all its competitors! Warmachine et al and even MAGIC the card game have been donating tons of FREE Gear in order to drum up support for its games...

Maybe GW is finally seeing its fanbase wither away and is actually trying to fix it!

Good stuff

Come on, guys. If you're inventing rumours, try to make them believable.

Great idea, step in the right direction, now if they were at all intelligent, they would shut down most of their own hobby stores, and then offer a tiered program to existing independent retailers where they can double this level of prize support if the store increases its support for GW product (say by putting up a large sign underneath the existing store name proudly proclaiming it to be a "GW Hobby Center" and prominently featuring GW product in window displays etc. In effect getting a similar amount of representation as their actual stores but with minimal cost/overhead to themselves.

That would be good indeed.

This sounds great.

That said, given how prone GW is to changing horses mid-race, how long will this program last?

Necros wrote:That's pretty cool .. but, didn't they already give free product to stores for tournaments and prizes? At least I thought they did a couple years ago when I was planning to open up my own shop.. Or do they give even more now than before?

Not sure about the rest of the world, but each of my stores have been recieving 1800.00 a year to use for terrain, paints, demo models, and prize support, based on the shops being at the Partnership level. It's one of the reasons we supply free paints and glue at the store at the painting tables.

The new program looks like the top end stores will get at least what they used to get, and maybe a bit more. Nice to see it rolling out for the rest of the world.

Yay! Finally a reason to visit a GW store!

Milisim wrote:Congratulations to GW.


Finally catching up to all its competitors! Warmachine et al and even MAGIC the card game have been donating tons of FREE Gear in order to drum up support for its games...

Maybe GW is finally seeing its fanbase wither away and is actually trying to fix it!

You are dead wrong on that statement. Yes, WOTC gives out a lot of support for MTG, totally agree there. But if I want a league kit or trophies from Privateer, I have to buy them, They are way behind GW in support. And as I stated above, (and in many other posts over the years) GW has offered stores in the US this support for a long, long time. Battlefront have also been offering a lot of support for tournaments. Privateer? Not so much, although I certainly wish they would.

I just got that rising feeling....

Does anyone know if this applys to FLGS or just official stores

Johnny-Crass wrote:I just got that rising feeling....

Does anyone know if this applys to FLGS or just official stores

It doesn't have anything to do with GW stores at all. This is support for independent gaming stores that order product from GW. (FLGS)

*cue happy dance*

Prize support? Well it is time to throw comp out the door and get mean!!!!!

I was only going by what my FLGS tells me...

They say they get much greater support for warmachine, FoW and other games than they do GW... I do not own a store so I dont know...

Maybe the owner is FOS?

Or maybe they get greater support up in Canada?

I'd go with the first option, as Mikhaila knows what he's talking about.

H.B.M.C. wrote:This sounds great.

That said, given how prone GW is to changing horses mid-race, how long will this program last?

Does GW like turning down money? if it causes profit, they'll keep it.

Cool. This will be a good way for them to sell a lot more Grey Knights.

Mr Hyena wrote:*Waiting to see how long till a person inevitably bitches about this as well*

Its a good idea GW is implementing this.

Cue "inevitable person" now:

I may have to wait until USD figures are released, but on its face, this "new" program appears to offer similar support as the existing program, with less flexibility on how stores use their product support. It seems like they are encouraging FLGS to focus on demos rather than using larger in-store events as a method to promote the hobby. Our store focuses on in-store events much more than new customer demos, so this program may be a downgrade for us.

I'm not the type of person to look a gift horse in the mouth, but if I was asked to trade my gift horse for another, I might take a quick peek at the teeth.

I thought they already did all this. I wonder what kind of volume is needed before they give the $500. It would help my FLGS to get some much needed terrain.

It's about time that they made a generous gesture like this, respect has been earned this day!!

Kanluwen wrote:I'd go with the first option, as Mikhaila knows what he's talking about.

Or maybe they're both right because not every store is the same.

Just a thought...

Mr Hyena wrote:Does GW like turning down money?

You'd be surprised...

GW and free stuff in the same sentence?? How can this be! How can this be!

It can not be a coincidence that this happens in the year 2012!!

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:I'd go with the first option, as Mikhaila knows what he's talking about.

Or maybe they're both right because not every store is the same.

Just a thought...

That would be possible...if they weren't both under the auspices of GW North America.

My God, it almost seems as if GW is trying to make amends for their crappy public relations.
Could GW be having a change of heart?!

What's the difference between this and existing GW policy? In other words, what's the change?

The trophies will be molten down skull shaped Dreadfleets!

***heart attack***

And the prizes will consist of the Finecast items returned by customers around the world!

The trophies will be molten down skull shaped Dreadfleets!


That has to be the line of the week!

GG

Sweet

Just hope these prizes aren't largely remaindered copies of Dreadfleet.

As a manager of a FLGS I have to say I'm very suspect. Yes, free stuff is always good, but just exactly HOW free is it? If I am expected to stock LotR/Hobbit product I'll pass. I'd likely be required to keep two of each core item for that lousy line on hand (which does not sell in this region...see collection of WotR crap still on shelves from 5 years ago, regardless of specials and/or events) which will cost me well over $2000 at cost, which translates into a financial loss. And this doesn't count a rumored future outlay of significant cost for new paints/rack. Nothing free is ever free. If you're a player/customer and you think this is great, then be prepared to support your FLGS by purchasing sh!t you don't want so it can pay electricity for the next 5 months.

Kanluwen wrote:That would be possible...if they weren't both under the auspices of GW North America.

Given that the point of contention was what sort of discounts/support they got from PP, I don’t see how being under GWNA would make any difference Kan.

So shields down, ok?

commissarkurn wrote:As a manager of a FLGS I have to say I'm very suspect. Yes, free stuff is always good, but just exactly HOW free is it? If I am expected to stock LotR/Hobbit product I'll pass. I'd likely be required to keep two of each core item for that lousy line on hand (which does not sell in this region...see collection of WotR crap still on shelves from 5 years ago, regardless of specials and/or events) which will cost me well over $2000 at cost, which translates into a financial loss. And this doesn't count a rumored future outlay of significant cost for new paints/rack. Nothing free is ever free. If you're a player/customer and you think this is great, then be prepared to support your FLGS by purchasing sh!t you don't want so it can pay electricity for the next 5 months.

???? Sorry, I don't understand. Do you talk to your GW rep at all? For the US, this is nearly the same program as we've had in place. As it used to be: To get 600.00 a year in free items, you had to carry the better selling plastic models. If you already have LOTR items, then your fine, as they required very little of that line, and sounds like you have it. If you carry a full line of GW, you should be eligible for about 1800.00 a year. This doesn't include extra stuff they send for 'ardboyz, release parties, etc.

How Free is it?!: you decide what you want. Scenery kits, paints for painting classes, models for demo armies or to give as prizes. GW will make suggestions anyone really can't figure out how to ask for free stuff. Personally, I've never had a problem finding something I wanted for free. And no, no one from GW is going to check on how you use it. They just ship it to you and are done with it. I've known some stores to just keep it and sell it. (Stupid, IMHO, as you screw yourself by screwing your customers. )

They've been doing this for years in the US. Has your store been ignoring it? What store are you? If you pass can I have your stuff?!

See, this is smart.

Its essentially making lfgs as effective as a GW shop, especially when GW closed down their official ones.

All for a very cheap price to pay per store.

Bloodfever wrote:It's great news...if you have a FLGS near you :(

Yep, maybe they will invest in a store near me also!

Still, good on ya GW, should make a flgs a great place to be.

Milisim wrote:I was only going by what my FLGS tells me...

They say they get much greater support for warmachine, FoW and other games than they do GW... I do not own a store so I dont know...

Maybe the owner is FOS?

Or maybe they get greater support up in Canada?

Might be a situation where you store isn't taking advantage of the support GW offers, which in my mind doesn't make GW's support less, but he could freely state that he gets nothing from GW.

WOTC gives oodles of support in Myriad ways. Won't even try to go into it.

Privateer will send you some certificates to give out at a tournament for free. Coins you have to buy,same with league kits.

FOW will send out prizes for tournaments you register with them. If you don't order FOW direct, and just get the little bit at distributors, this won't be an option. They also supply free wire racking for their product.

Currently, GW gives 600.00 in models to stockists, 1800.00 to Partnership accounts. Plus extra for events they push like 'ardboyz. Extra again if the store/club is hosting a GT on the IGT circuit. Plus free racks, which could be hundreds or even thousands of dollars to a new store starting up. I expanded my shop and had a truckload of new racks arrive for it. We put in a 70' long wall of GW product, lots of racks needed. Partnership accounts also recieve a copy of new Codices or Army books. It all adds up to a lot of stuff in a years time.

If a store isn't ordering directly from GW, and just orders a few things from a distributor, they won't get this offered to them. They need to have a GW account. Not hard at all to set up. You also get free shipping on your orders from them.

Going forward, it looks like they rolled out that program to the rest of the world with some tweaks, and redid the US program.

Fralethepalewhale wrote:My God, it almost seems as if GW is trying to make amends for their crappy public relations.

Never lol!

I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales. Given that GW probably makes the most revenue on retail sales (as well as the fact that the retail receives heavy competition from online discounters), increasing the focus on retail sales via “grass roots” type schemes is a sound strategy. I personally doubt it will be the winning strategy that GW is hoping for (as Timmy will always choose to save $10-20 and buy his spacemen online).

Don’t get me wrong, it’s awesome that GW is doing this but it’s not because it is from the goodness of their hearts.

candy.man wrote:

Fralethepalewhale wrote:My God, it almost seems as if GW is trying to make amends for their crappy public relations.

Never lol!

I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales. Given that GW probably makes the most revenue on retail sales (as well as the fact that the retail receives heavy competition from online discounters), increasing the focus on retail sales via “grass roots” type schemes is a sound strategy. I personally doubt it will be the winning strategy that GW is hoping for (as Timmy will always choose to save $10-20 and buy his spacemen online).

Don’t get me wrong, it’s awesome that GW is doing this but it’s not because it is from the goodness of their hearts.

GW is re-balancing their sphere of influence in areas.
They were forced to close some stores, they make it back by supporting LFGS.
If some locations are lacking GW, they'll do the same.

They wont need to pay rent to lease a whole new building
or hire a whole new staff.

This is cheap, effective, and smart.

LunaHound wrote:GW

LunaHound wrote:cheap, effective, and smart.

Is this... possible?

ph34r wrote:

LunaHound wrote:GW

LunaHound wrote:cheap, effective, and smart.

Is this... possible?

Not cheap for US CuSTOMERs

cheap for them.

I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales.

Absolutely a marketing strategy, but then, so is me having tables in my stores for people to play on.) Anything a business does to increase sales is a marketing strategy.

Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

mikhaila wrote:I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales.

Absolutely a marketing strategy, but then, so is me having tables in my stores for people to play on.) Anything a business does to increase sales is a marketing strategy.

Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

Yes it makes it harder to balance your different games.
by focusing on GW and the criteria, you'll unknowingly start alienating other systems.

LunaHound wrote:Not cheap for US CuSTOMERs

cheap for them.

I know, just the thought of GW doing something smart and practical that also makes the community happy is a breath and fresh air.


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mikhaila wrote:Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

I have encountered this before at stores, usually ones that do not stock many GW products. I feel for them that it takes investment to have everything on your shelves, but the only reason I would have something shipped in through a physical store is if I really want to support my FLGS. Otherwise it's more effort than ordering online, less convenient/slower than ordering online, and costs more than ordering online.

ph34r wrote:

LunaHound wrote:Not cheap for US CuSTOMERs

cheap for them.

I know, just the thought of GW doing something smart and practical that also makes the community happy is a breath and fresh air.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mikhaila wrote:Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

I have encountered this before at stores, usually ones that do not stock many GW products. I feel for them that it takes investment to have everything on your shelves, but the only reason I would have something shipped in through a physical store is if I really want to support my FLGS. Otherwise it's more effort than ordering online, less convenient/slower than ordering online, and costs more than ordering online.

This. The game store in my town has almost no GW on the shelves, and only offers to order stuff. What's the point? If I want it now and you don't have it, you don't help me and I'll go get it elsewhere. Also, impulse buys? "I'm going down to the game store to look around...Oooo, they have a box of scouts, and I'm kinda short by 5...hmm, maybe I should snag some." I've been in this position before. Mikhaila, I still really want to visit your store sometime. Convince my boss to have a job that requires me to drive through Philly.

LunaHound wrote:

candy.man wrote:

Fralethepalewhale wrote:My God, it almost seems as if GW is trying to make amends for their crappy public relations.

Never lol!

I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales. Given that GW probably makes the most revenue on retail sales (as well as the fact that the retail receives heavy competition from online discounters), increasing the focus on retail sales via “grass roots” type schemes is a sound strategy. I personally doubt it will be the winning strategy that GW is hoping for (as Timmy will always choose to save $10-20 and buy his spacemen online).

Don’t get me wrong, it’s awesome that GW is doing this but it’s not because it is from the goodness of their hearts.

GW is re-balancing their sphere of influence in areas.
They were forced to close some stores, they make it back by supporting LFGS.
If some locations are lacking GW, they'll do the same.

They wont need to pay rent to lease a whole new building
or hire a whole new staff.

This is cheap, effective, and smart.

I agree with both postings above and have a few possibilities "cough... cough" on perhaps the reason why this happening right now.

In no apparent order.

1. The Squeaky Wheel Syndrome.

A negative campaign that has many view points on what is wrong with Games Workshop. This does not have to be completely true nor does it have to be the majority of people that agrees with that viewpoint. If that viewpoint is is loud enough, long enough in duration and with some validity, corporations will do something to lessen the noise of whatever negative that is happening.
The interwebs is the great communicator that combine common ideals from people that are global regions apart.

2. Customer Base Erosion.

Regardless of the companies profits, their has been an erosion within their customer base. Some of the reasons have been stated before but regardless people are leaving this hobby. This is a way to help stem the tide of their customer base erosion, keeping their old customers as well as trying to increase newcomers into the hobby.

3. Competition.

Regardless of what people think that GW is the 800 pound gorilla (in 2004 they definitely were), I believe that the 800 pound gorilla has gotten a little lazy as there are now a few healthy companies that are providing a similar service for the same hobby dollars GW gathers. Competition is a good thing for the consumers but for a not for a company that is organized like Games Workshop is.

There are probably more possible reasons why this is happening now. What I can say that this is a good idea to help promote the hobby that some of us old timers (since 87 with this game) have gone cynical towards the corporation's past actions. How long will this policy last will be the direct result on it's success on increasing sales in the short term.

LunaHound wrote:

mikhaila wrote:I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales.

Absolutely a marketing strategy, but then, so is me having tables in my stores for people to play on.) Anything a business does to increase sales is a marketing strategy.

Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

Yes it makes it harder to balance your different games.
by focusing on GW and the criteria, you'll unknowingly start alienating other systems.

Not really at all. The required product is all boxes. You order them in, then re-order what sells. Inventory takes me about 5 minutes on a monday morning, about 5 minutes to place the order, then my rep and I chat for 5 minutes and done.

Then you walk over to the warmachine section and do that inventory, then Flames of War, etc. This is just standard work in a game store. If a store has a POS system, even easier. And once a store realizes that by stocking more GW, they sell more GW, they may even realize that by stocking more Privateer, they sell more Privateer......etc. etc. If you can figure out how to stock, inventory and sell GW, you can apply the same lessons to selling other games.

I see the most 'alienation' of game systems happen when a Retailer can't seperate his own preferences from his store.

mikhaila wrote:It doesn't have anything to do with GW stores at all. This is support for independent gaming stores that order product from GW. (FLGS)

I am not aware of such a support for German stores. Never heard of anything like that nor expected it from GW.

LunaHound wrote:

mikhaila wrote:I suspect this is probably part of a marketing strategy. The criteria to quality for the free stuff is probably high volume+sales.

Absolutely a marketing strategy, but then, so is me having tables in my stores for people to play on.) Anything a business does to increase sales is a marketing strategy.

Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

Yes it makes it harder to balance your different games.
by focusing on GW and the criteria, you'll unknowingly start alienating other systems.

You haven't seen mikhaila's store...

I swear he must wake up from bad dreams yelling things like "No your dreadnought doesn't have boosted attack rolls!"

Did they change the minimum stock requirements? That is what keeps GW out of some local stores.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That and order requirements, you can't order one blister, but 3 of each.

jabbakahut wrote:Did they change the minimum stock requirements? That is what keeps GW out of some local stores.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That and order requirements, you can't order one blister, but 3 of each.

There never has been a stock requirement to carry GW, you can have a GW account with no stock requirements. You get the same discount, but have to pay shipping if the order is under about 400.00, which is similar to ordering from about 10 other places that I deal with.

If you carry the bare minimum of plastic boxes, they give you free shipping all the time, no minimum order.

As you agree to carry more product, they will give the store more free terrain, paints, models, etc.

Old requirement on blisters was two. Never three. And has been 1 for about a year.

Stores can also order from distributors rather than GW. Loses them money, as they get no GW support, and loose 5-10% of their discount, which is 11-22% of their profits.

Wow, never ceases to amaze me how many people think that GW's ordering policy is harsh. I happen to know how great mikhaila's stores are (though I have not been to the new one) since he was one of the better retailers when I was a sales rep. And actually, GW's policies have gotten much easier than they were back in 2000. Besides working there, I have helped or run 3 gaming stores, and meeting any minimum requirements (even the older ones) was never a problem. And it would not be, especially if those stores followed mikhaila's advice above about stocking versus ordering. I have a friend who owns a store locally now. He's been getting free stuff for some time (though at the lower level since his store is just about 2 years old). Surely if a store that is just beginning can make purchases easily to qualify for free terrain for the store, then any successful store can do so. If not, I agree, it is probably the owners own prerogatives that hurt or hinder his ability to sell GW. Also, PP's support is not as good for my friend's store here as the GW one is - though he does do well with that line as well.

I have another friend from high school who has a successful comics store. He's never liked wargaming and can't sell it out of his store to save his life. He's smart enough to not "Blame" GW, as he knows this - when he talks to me. Doesn't stop him from talking it down to his customers though (he'd rather sell more magic!). Note - he has also only dabbled in GW from time to time (took a stab at it every few years by buying a few box games).

This policy is great for both the stores (and their PLAYING customers) and for GW. The stores get (if they are smart), free terrain or paints for their players to use in the store, also prize support for the bigger events, etc. And GW gets to have their terrain on a lot of tables (presumably painted up to look good) and helps them highlight and sell more things. After all if a NEW gamer went into mikhaila's store and uses some of the store paints to learn how to paint some models, don't you think they'd be more likely to buy the same paints to take home? Mikhaila gets to use some free paints to get someone firmly into the HOBBY, and then he probably gets to sell them some paint. And remember, regardless if you are different (because you still spend 200-300 a month on GW), every new gamer has LOTS to buy: books, models, paints, tools, terrain or battle mat for home, etc. A "newbie" can and will easily outspend a normal veteran just to get into the hobby. Also note - this is the same for PP, Magic, even a role playing game (to larger or lesser degrees.)

If this is just the US policy going to the rest of the world, great! It is a small marketing investment that can easily pay off for the stores and for GW. And it can also be good for the whole hobby, as hopefully more stores with better support means more gamers. Regardless of perceptions, GW is really cooking when LOTS of retailers, the GW stores and word of mouth are bringing in lots of new gamers. Without the retailer portion, even in saturated markets, GW can't afford the overhead for only their stores, and they lose the doorways for someone to discover GW. Anything marketing wise that they do to help prop this up is only good for them and the GAMERS.

Grrr, I just used Mikhaila as example since he owned a store, I guess it doesnt apply to him,
but my point still stands on other stores perhaps?

This program has been around a very VERY long time and has had many faces. I ran a "Chapter Approved" store in AZ back in the mid 90's and back then it was 50/100/150$( at least that is what our store got, cant speak to other or if this was the standard across the board) a year in prize support for events.

We stocked EVERY THING they made at the time because to be "Chapter Approved" its what you had to do. You got a black box at the first of each month that contained all the releases for the month so you could get pre-orders rolling and get guys excited about what was on the way. There were most Definitely min- order requirements back then. 2 on new box sets and 6 on new blisters and if you did not order them on new release day you had to wait a week to order them so that other stores that did get them on release day had a jump on selling them first because you passed on them.

Epic got redone during this time and that game was crazy with the amount of product we had to order. The all out release of product was very large all with min orders, that was painful. I am actually a bit surprised at the 1800$ quote, that's a lot of money but if you supporting the company to that sort of level it make perfect sense.

Also weather its a policy or not for the last 20 or so years I have been with stores or the game as a player there has always been "prize support" officially or not. If your making your rep money, he is making sure you get a little something when you need it, that's just good business.

mikhaila is my hero. For all of you guys assuming the worst, actually read what mikhaila is saying since that is from direct first-hand experience and not 'OMG I HEARD'.

Of all the things GW does wrong, Customer and Retailer support are not it.

This is such a great marketing move (i.e. utterly out-of-character for GW), that I have a hard time believing it.

Omegus wrote:This is such a great marketing move (i.e. utterly out-of-character for GW), that I have a hard time believing it.

If they've been doing it in the US for over a decade, how is it out of character? )

But it is nice to see them recognizing that it's working here in the states, and rolling it out to the rest of the world.

I'm really happy for this. The flgs where I go to school is an amazing place, And he already stocks loads of gw product. the way I see it, The consumer is going to benefit from this in small flgs instances because now the store will be able to field more terrain. I see it as a reward system not only for the store but the customer

This is stupid.
It's just a ploy by GW to have one more thing on their books that costs them money, so they have an excuse to gouge us in the future!

LOL

In all seriousness, I'm glad to see this. I know that GW used to do all this stuff (and, reading Mik's post, it's obvious that they still did, with some retailers). It's nice to see them getting back into something like this on a larger scale. They're at a spot where they (IMO) desperately need to clean up their image. I think this will go a long way.

Eric

MagickalMemories wrote:This is stupid.
It's just a ploy by GW to have one more thing on their books that costs them money, so they have an excuse to gouge us in the future!

LOL

In all seriousness, I'm glad to see this. I know that GW used to do all this stuff (and, reading Mik's post, it's obvious that they still did, with some retailers). It's nice to see them getting back into something like this on a larger scale. They're at a spot where they (IMO) desperately need to clean up their image. I think this will go a long way.

Eric

You laugh and joke, but it all makes sense now.

Mr Hyena wrote:*Waiting to see how long till a person inevitably bitches about this as well*

Its a good idea GW is implementing this.

Not me.

Even I can't bitch about a move like this, but I will buy it when I see it!

PhantomViper wrote:

Mr Hyena wrote:*Waiting to see how long till a person inevitably bitches about this as well*

Its a good idea GW is implementing this.

Not me.

Even I can't bitch about a move like this, but I will buy it when I see it!

Just recieved my monthly alotment of 300.00 in goodies for my two stores. Unpacking it now.)

But he can't see that from where he is! : )


Eric

MagickalMemories wrote:But he can't see that from where he is! : )


Eric

I assume everyone is watching me until I find the wires and tear out their cameras.

Would explain why there is suddenly a 40k Escalation league at my local store. Though, they're still charging a $40 dollar entrance fee.

Sounds cool. This looks like a big year for GW

mikhaila wrote:They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

The counter to this is that some stuff just doesn't sell. Thanks to a minor printing error (Eldar symbol on a Tau box) we've been able to watch a single unit not move at my FLGS for going on 3 years now. Now that may just be Tau, but I'm fairly certain that at least 1/5 of the GW boxes have been sitting on the same shelf since 4th ed.

Bounty wrote:

mikhaila wrote:They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

The counter to this is that some stuff just doesn't sell. Thanks to a minor printing error (Eldar symbol on a Tau box) we've been able to watch a single unit not move at my FLGS for going on 3 years now. Now that may just be Tau, but I'm fairly certain that at least 1/5 of the GW boxes have been sitting on the same shelf since 4th ed.

Sorry, it's a poor counter.)

The cost of having extra product is far less than the cost of lost sales.

If you order something and don't sell it, it costs you one time. That cost is even recoverable by selling the merchandise at a discount.

If you don't have the product, you lose money every time that product would have sold, and there's no way to recover that profit unless the
person is willing to make a special order with you.

If a product sells twice, it has paid for more than the cost of 3 units. The box on the wall is profit, and the store has some profit in their pocket. At that point, it produces profit every time it sells, whether once a year, or 12 times a year. Product on the wall isn't costing a store money, that money has been spent. The product in the store is the tool a store needs to produce profit. Under inventoried stores will make less profits than stores with a full inventory.

If a store gets in a product that doesn't sell, find out why it didn't sell. You need the information to order better on other products, or to change how you sell the product, or how you promote it. Getting in things that don't sell is quite common, for GW, games in general, or any other type of merchandise. Lets not even go into comic books /shudder.)

As an example, look at every fething store that goes out of business. What do they do when times are tight? Quit ordering. Then next month they have less inventory, less sales, less profits, which then makes the next month harder. I call it a death spiral. I avoid it ever happening to me at all costs. When the economy got bad, I started working 80 hours a week, quit taking days off, skipped some paychecks. Anything EXCEPT lowering inventory. In fact, I increased inventory every year over the past 3 years. Store is much bigger, has metric tons of stuff to sell, and we're in a good financial position after riding out the crappy economy.

As to the box with the printing error: Your store should simply tell their sales rep they have a misprinted box, and GW will ship another one. Problem solved.

mikhaila wrote:As to the box with the printing error: Your store should simply tell their sales rep they have a misprinted box, and GW will ship another one. Problem solved.

I actually plan on buying it before the end of the year. I just don't need it, yet.

mikhaila wrote:When the economy got bad, I started working 80 hours a week, quit taking days off, skipped some paychecks. Anything EXCEPT lowering inventory. In fact, I increased inventory every year over the past 3 years. Store is much bigger, has metric tons of stuff to sell, and we're in a good financial position after riding out the crappy economy.

That's pretty sweet, mikhaila! And I would think, very true... I game at a store regularly, but there's hardly any Privateer Press stock (and what there is is quite random). Wanted to buy a Trollbloods Champions box (the same one that happened to be the only thing you were Out of stock in while I was up at your store ) but they didn't have it... figured I could settle for a Ghordson Basher that I was also looking for, but they didn't have it either. Called around and found another local store that did, and they ended up getting my business...

Having stuff in-stock gives me the opportunity to buy things, not having it takes away that chance for the most part... ordering through a FLGS is possible, but usually more hassle than it's worth where I'm at, unfortunately.

timetowaste85 wrote:

ph34r wrote:

LunaHound wrote:Not cheap for US CuSTOMERs

cheap for them.

I know, just the thought of GW doing something smart and practical that also makes the community happy is a breath and fresh air.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mikhaila wrote:Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

I have encountered this before at stores, usually ones that do not stock many GW products. I feel for them that it takes investment to have everything on your shelves, but the only reason I would have something shipped in through a physical store is if I really want to support my FLGS. Otherwise it's more effort than ordering online, less convenient/slower than ordering online, and costs more than ordering online.

This. The game store in my town has almost no GW on the shelves, and only offers to order stuff. What's the point? If I want it now and you don't have it, you don't help me and I'll go get it elsewhere. Also, impulse buys? "I'm going down to the game store to look around...Oooo, they have a box of scouts, and I'm kinda short by 5...hmm, maybe I should snag some." I've been in this position before. Mikhaila, I still really want to visit your store sometime. Convince my boss to have a job that requires me to drive through Philly.

Be nice to your FLGS. The minimum price I can order at for new products is the same as your retail price if I bulk buy from overseas (or an extra $10/product from an Australian distributor), so be a little grateful for it mate.

I'd kill to be able to use international distributors outside of ebay.

I approve of this rumor.

mikhaila wrote:
Sorry, it's a poor counter.)

The cost of having extra product is far less than the cost of lost sales.

If you order something and don't sell it, it costs you one time. That cost is even recoverable by selling the merchandise at a discount.

If you don't have the product, you lose money every time that product would have sold, and there's no way to recover that profit unless the
person is willing to make a special order with you.

If a product sells twice, it has paid for more than the cost of 3 units. The box on the wall is profit, and the store has some profit in their pocket. At that point, it produces profit every time it sells, whether once a year, or 12 times a year. Product on the wall isn't costing a store money, that money has been spent. The product in the store is the tool a store needs to produce profit. Under inventoried stores will make less profits than stores with a full inventory.

If a store gets in a product that doesn't sell, find out why it didn't sell. You need the information to order better on other products, or to change how you sell the product, or how you promote it. Getting in things that don't sell is quite common, for GW, games in general, or any other type of merchandise. Lets not even go into comic books /shudder.)

As an example, look at every fething store that goes out of business. What do they do when times are tight? Quit ordering. Then next month they have less inventory, less sales, less profits, which then makes the next month harder. I call it a death spiral. I avoid it ever happening to me at all costs. When the economy got bad, I started working 80 hours a week, quit taking days off, skipped some paychecks. Anything EXCEPT lowering inventory. In fact, I increased inventory every year over the past 3 years. Store is much bigger, has metric tons of stuff to sell, and we're in a good financial position after riding out the crappy economy.

As to the box with the printing error: Your store should simply tell their sales rep they have a misprinted box, and GW will ship another one. Problem solved.

This post just owned all your faces.

It's a shame so many LGS retailers are so utterly clueless about business.

I find the lack of Skulls in the offer to be disturbing.

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

CT GAMER wrote:

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Did you read the thread? According to mikhaila, it has already been going on for quite some time and this is just an enhancement.

CT GAMER wrote:

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Yeah? Is that counting or not counting all the years it's already been going on?

There is nothing like that in Germany. Actually the support decreased since the infamous June 2011. No more Black Boxes, not even a free store WD to show the customers. And what you seem to have in USA wouldn't be "a new GW policy". So we have to find out what this really means.

pretre wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Did you read the thread? According to mikhaila, it has already been going on for quite some time and this is just an enhancement.

The thread title is a little misleading then isn't it...

Thats pretty cool. wish there was a GW store closer.

CT GAMER wrote:

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

It really has been going on a long time. I used to play a lot of RT tournaments back in 02-06 or so. I played in two different shops that were within 60 miles of me. Both were partner stores, and both had great prize support. In 2 of the tournaments everyone got a miniature, not just winners. I have both a Gideon Lore, and Sergeant Aurelius from those tournies. So not only did we get minis, but they were both Limited Editions.

This could still have been a marketing campaign for GW. Bring the fact into the spotlight etc, but it is nothing new.

The funny part about this is that 20 Years ago this is how GW was

inquisitorlewis wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

pretre wrote:Wow, that's a pretty awesome program

Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

It really has been going on a long time. I used to play a lot of RT tournaments back in 02-06 or so. I played in two different shops that were within 60 miles of me. Both were partner stores, and both had great prize support. In 2 of the tournaments everyone got a miniature, not just winners. I have both a Gideon Lore, and Sergeant Aurelius from those tournies. So not only did we get minis, but they were both Limited Editions.

This could still have been a marketing campaign for GW. Bring the fact into the spotlight etc, but it is nothing new.

Perhaps CT gamer is referring to this and only this variation to the prize support?

What I do know that according to my LFGS owner is that in his case, how much sales of GW product he does per month affects his amount of prize support per year. In his case he will get $300.00 per year of GW product prize support. He can use whatever amount per year in his allotted prize support to run his events. The prize support is initially taken from product on hand and replenished by GW on a later date.

More details by xxRavenxx

xxRavenxx wrote:

Wintermute wrote:So what are the actual criteria, because I very much doubt its a simple as you've stated

See. Thats why you's the boss, because you ask the useful questions

From what I remember:

For stocking the core 52 items: Access to mail order items in a limited quantity, Money each year for games tables, demos, etc. Free display racks, no minimum order value on orders.

For stocking most of the paints, glues, and scenery: More money to play with, free racking for the store.

For stocking white dwarf, and ordering one of all new releases: Posters to advertise the new products up front, cash,

For stocking about 200 extra items (which are variable, and aimed at letting stores be flexible): Racking / cash. tournament prizes.

For stocking the last of the painting stuff: Racking/cash.


I think theres overlap on the racking/Cash front to let people get the maximum by following say 3/5 of the criteria. I may have jumbled some of the "prizes" too. I really don't remember which is which. I run a small(ish) store and I had no trouble agreeing to all 5 results. I have to order maybe... a dozen boxed sets I wasn't stocking to get the full perks.

The only milestone I can see is that the 200ish products you stock must include all three ranges, and the core 52 (I think its 52 anyway...) does too. If you didn't like stocking say, LOTR, you'd be stuffed.

Wintermute wrote:However my cynical side is still asking how does this benefit GW?

Several things, I can think of:

GW giving out prizes encourages people to go to store tournaments. This makes them more likely to buy things. It also is good PR. People like companies who give them free things.
This policy "discriminates" against webstores, who cannot claim any of the benefits, without actually... discriminating. This is probably the best way they can support brick and mortar stores, which they need, to recruit people.
The policy encourages stores to stock more complete GW ranges. No more skipping on pesky stuff like LOTR. GW will like the "enforcement" this gives. I know I spent several years not bothering with LOTR due to lack of local interest.
The demo pack portions of the deal encourage 3rd partes to do painting days, teaching people, etc. This furthers "THE HOBBY" (tm). It helps them set people up with their range as inclusive. For the benefit of the more cynical: "Hi there Little Timmy. Take your GW clippers, and GW glue, and build this. Now get your GW paint and GW brush and paint up your GW space marine. Was that fun? Go get your mother. She'll need her purse."

Gw being nice to its customers is a first. Can any one say price jump coming? It just seems odd that Gw would give free things to hobby stores that aren't Gw stores. maybe they will be closing some GW stores in the near future.

Reminds me of the last...line-up-outside-the-store-and-maybe-win-a-battle-force-comp at my local GW...

When they gave the winner the prize...even his friend didn't clap...

PapaPiggy wrote:Gw being nice to its customers is a first. Can any one say price jump coming? It just seems odd that Gw would give free things to hobby stores that aren't Gw stores. maybe they will be closing some GW stores in the near future.

GW, at least in the US as I can't speak for other countries, has done this for years. Decades even. My stores have recieved thousands of dollars in GW support every year for over 20 years. It's encouraged me to work on my business model, run events and classes, and work to increas my GW sales. And I apply the lessons learned to supporting Flames of War, Warmahordes, and other games. I've got a much finer game store than I had when I opened, a good deal in part due to help and advice from people at GW. (Some of whom are now in Battlefront, Warlord, Mantic, etc.)

Why help a non GW store? Because it makes them money! US trade sales is doing very good, moreso than similar programs in other countries. This looks to be an overhaul of the US system, and a rolling out of the program to other countries. Not a lot is going to change in the US. This last week was pretty normal, my sales rep reminded me about my monthly support, and we picked out 300.00 in stuff for my two stores, and it shipped to me for free. Been making new terrain all weekend using a lot of the kits we got in.

mikhaila wrote:GW, at least in the US as I can't speak for other countries, has done this for years. Decades even.

As said, nothing at all in that direction in Germany. They even declined to give the stores a free 7€ WD while at the same time urging the stores to have a store copy to show all customers. That's why I believed it is something new worldwide.

Kroothawk wrote:

mikhaila wrote:GW, at least in the US as I can't speak for other countries, has done this for years. Decades even.

As said, nothing at all in that direction in Germany. They even declined to give the stores a free 7€ WD while at the same time urging the stores to have a store copy to show all customers. That's why I believed it is something new worldwide.

Definitely knew to rest of world. Over the years, talking to UK stores, it always seemed like I got a ton more support, and could order more products.

Shaozun wrote:

timetowaste85 wrote:

ph34r wrote:

LunaHound wrote:Not cheap for US CuSTOMERs

cheap for them.

I know, just the thought of GW doing something smart and practical that also makes the community happy is a breath and fresh air.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mikhaila wrote:Criteria is simply having the GW models in your store. Doing 1k a month in business or 10k, you get the same support. They've just found that stores that actually have the items to sell tend to sell more. It's a basic concept in retailing, that it's hard to sell something you don't have in the store. Sadly, I argue with many retailers over this. "If they want it, they have to tell me and I'll order it" is all to common an attitude.

I have encountered this before at stores, usually ones that do not stock many GW products. I feel for them that it takes investment to have everything on your shelves, but the only reason I would have something shipped in through a physical store is if I really want to support my FLGS. Otherwise it's more effort than ordering online, less convenient/slower than ordering online, and costs more than ordering online.

This. The game store in my town has almost no GW on the shelves, and only offers to order stuff. What's the point? If I want it now and you don't have it, you don't help me and I'll go get it elsewhere. Also, impulse buys? "I'm going down to the game store to look around...Oooo, they have a box of scouts, and I'm kinda short by 5...hmm, maybe I should snag some." I've been in this position before. Mikhaila, I still really want to visit your store sometime. Convince my boss to have a job that requires me to drive through Philly.

Be nice to your FLGS. The minimum price I can order at for new products is the same as your retail price if I bulk buy from overseas (or an extra $10/product from an Australian distributor), so be a little grateful for it mate.

I'd kill to be able to use international distributors outside of ebay.

Notice I said game store, not FLGS. This store doesn't deserve my money. They'll happily let you prepay for an item, then not order it for months. And they keep little product on the shelf. This store follows the EXACT formula that Mikhaila is warning against. They order small and order what the owner thinks is cool, not what the customers want. If I had a good store in my town, I'd go there, instead I have to go an hr away for supplies-or online. My friend and I have been talking of opening up a gamestore in town and if these rumors are true, it provides more incentive and more open knowledge as to GW's support for stores.

Awesome..good move for them

CT GAMER wrote: Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Ill take that bet.

mikhaila wrote: My stores have recieved thousands of dollars in GW support every year for over 20 years.

Epic win!

mattyrm wrote:

CT GAMER wrote: Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Ill take that bet.

mikhaila wrote: My stores have recieved thousands of dollars in GW support every year for over 20 years.

Epic win!

Except that mikhaila is talking about a US store and this is a new policy only for stores outside the US, so completely unrelated.

Got to love white knights...

PhantomViper wrote:

Got to love white knights...

Sorry, enlighten me as to what I apparently am please. I'm a white knight?

Based on what exactly?

PhantomViper wrote:

mattyrm wrote:

CT GAMER wrote: Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Ill take that bet.

mikhaila wrote: My stores have recieved thousands of dollars in GW support every year for over 20 years.

Epic win!

Except that mikhaila is talking about a US store and this is a new policy only for stores outside the US, so completely unrelated.

Got to love white knights...

Got to love Epic Failures.)

What I was told by my sales rep: This is a new world wide policy based on what the US Trade Sales Team has been doing for over a decade. Not a lot of change for us in the US, lots of change for other parts of the world.

Not sure where you picked up the 'only stores outside the US' bit. I think I've said the same thing several times now. I've got the paperwork for it on my desk in front of me, so fairly sure of my facts that it applies to stores in the US.)

As for the White Knight part, that's amusing.) I yell/curse/criticize/debate/ GW more than you could ever imagine. I just tend to do it directly to them, and not on forums. Far more effective that way. But I'll certainly defend them on this topic. They are going to be literally giving away millions of dollars in product and scenery to trade accounts. (LGS). But some people are so used to complaining that they don't want to believe it.

How often is it discussed on these boards about what the raw materials for their products really cost? Product is cheap for GW to give away, a fraction of the retail value of the product. This is a very effective way to support stores.( Although I have to admit that WOTC does it even better. They can litterally spend less than a penny for a promo card, and had them out for the added cost of 2 bucks for shipping, and pack people in for events to win them.)

mattyrm wrote:

Sorry, enlighten me as to what I apparently am please.

Dakka policy prevents us from telling you what you are mattyrm, you know that...

CT GAMER wrote:

mattyrm wrote:

Sorry, enlighten me as to what I apparently am please.

Dakka policy prevents us from telling you what you are mattyrm, you know that...

PM me it, I'm all ears.

Actually, seeing as its you again it might take a while to type, do you want my phone number?

mikhaila wrote:

PhantomViper wrote:

mattyrm wrote:

CT GAMER wrote: Enjoy it while it lasts. I'll give it 1-2 years max.

Ill take that bet.

mikhaila wrote: My stores have recieved thousands of dollars in GW support every year for over 20 years.

Epic win!

Except that mikhaila is talking about a US store and this is a new policy only for stores outside the US, so completely unrelated.

Got to love white knights...

Got to love Epic Failures.)

What I was told by my sales rep: This is a new world wide policy based on what the US Trade Sales Team has been doing for over a decade. Not a lot of change for us in the US, lots of change for other parts of the world.

Not sure where you picked up the 'only stores outside the US' bit. I think I've said the same thing several times now. I've got the paperwork for it on my desk in front of me, so fairly sure of my facts that it applies to stores in the US.)

Re-read what I've wrote, that is exactly what I've said.

PhantomViper wrote:
Except that mikhaila is talking about a US store and this is a new policy only for stores outside the US, so completely unrelated.

Its a new policy for stores outside the US because stores in the US already have this policy in place for decades, like you said.

No one is saying that you are lying about it or anything, just that mattyrm was using a US store (yours), as an example to prove that CT GAMER was wrong, when CT GAMER was referring to a "rest of the world" policy.

On a side note, this is for non-GW stores only. I was talking to the manager at a GW store and he said he didn't understand how Trade got away with this policy give how much Corporate loaths it. Apparently Corporate is of the opinion that it devalues the product and feels that it should be scrapped altogether. The manager said he knows of instances where other GW staffers have been fired for doing prize support at GW stores. Too bad, really, given that independent stores seem to be unreliable (even for legitimate reasons) in my area.

<thread terminated; see here for confirmation/discussion>