http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/20/11306372-catholic-nuns-group-stunned-by-vatican-scolding-for-radical-feminist-ideas?lite/

A prominent U.S. Catholic nuns group said it was "stunned" that the Vatican reprimanded it for spending too much time on poverty and social justice concerns and not enough on abortion and gay marriage.

More and more I'm glad I'm no longer catholic....

I have edited the title of this article so as to avoid flamebaiting. ~Manchu

Thanks for another, more in depth link from Manchu:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/02/us/02nuns.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

Religion is a scourge on humanity. That's a fact.

Casey's Law wrote:Religion is a scourge on humanity. That's a fact.

True dat.

He has a cool mobile and hat.

However that is washed out by the fact that he was a natzi and runs an organization that harbors pedophiles...

So it's only gay when the boy's older than 13, right?

Slarg232 wrote:More and more I'm glad I'm no longer catholic....

If the Church was ever something you valued, you wouldn't leave it to the fools.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For anyone who is interested in the real problems at issue, rather than simply making a lot of idiotic jokes, you should take a look at this NYT piece on the Visitation, which began years ago:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/02/us/02nuns.html?pagewanted=all

Wow. Didn't think the dakka community was that narrow minded. I'm pretty shocked at the immediate response this thread got, not to mention fairly offended.

It is perfectly acceptable on Dakka to say that "religion is a scourge." You may also say things like "Tau are great in melee" or "Finecast is priced too cheaply."

Manchu wrote:

Slarg232 wrote:More and more I'm glad I'm no longer catholic....

If the Church was ever something you valued, you wouldn't leave it to the fools.

That is something I thought long and hard about when I was younger. You know what I realized? Religion is Irrational. People beleive it not because they want to beleive it, but because they feel they have to beleive it. That's why for the longest time priests have not been allowed to marry; it's just how it's always been done. Did God not create woman? Are you not spitting on his face telling him his creation isn't good enough for you, that you want to be "married" to him?

All people whom I have talked to (Read: I have not talked to every religious person) are very much the Holier than Thou type. Not even churchs, the holy places of worship, are safe from this; I can't tell you how many times I've seen people scoot away from those who have a disability or a strange physical appearance (This one lady has a black, disfigured hand that no one will shake, as though it could give them the plague). I've been called "Unchurchly" and "Satanic" for expressing a view that isn't "Hate gays, burn Abortionists". We recently had a flood up here that completley wiped out half of our state. The Churches answer? Send Money to starving kids in Africa.

God is alot like Lady Gaga in my eyes; I don't have a unfavorable opinion of them, but I can't fething stand their fan club. If anyone ever asks me, I do beleive in God. But I beleive in him on my own terms, not what some man in a pointy hat tells me.

Slarg232 wrote:People beleive it not because they want to beleive it, but because they feel they have to beleive it.

This has never been more wrong than among Catholics in 2012.

That's why for the longest time priests have not been allowed to marry; it's just how it's always been done.

Wrong again. Celibacy is a discipline required of Roman Rite priests by canon law -- and only since 1123 at that. Priests of other rites, like all the Orthodox, are allowed to marry.

All people whom I have talked to (Read: I have not talked to every religious person) are very much the Holier than Thou type.

You haven't talked to all the religious people? You clearly haven't talked to many religious people at all.

I've been called "Unchurchly" and "Satanic" for expressing a view that isn't "Hate gays, burn Abortionists".

So have I. I got over it.

We recently had a flood up here that completley wiped out half of our state. The Churches answer? Send Money to starving kids in Africa.

Yes, it's completely believable that the local parishes -- which constantly support their communities -- ceased all such efforts to further enrich those fat cats in Africa. Or at least on meth it is.

God is alot like Lady Gaga in my eyes; I don't have a unfavorable opinion of them, but I can't fething stand their fan club. If anyone ever asks me, I do beleive in God. But I beleive in him on my own terms, not what some man in a pointy hat tells me.

At some point, all of us have to grow up. You can make everything about you or you can look around and be a part of your real community. People who disagree with you will make things uncomfortable for you. They'll say "you're not really Catholic." They'll want you out of the Church so they can have it for their own agenda. If it means anything to you, anything more than another little trivial mark of identity that you can put on your facebook profile, then you'll stay anyway -- because if everyone who actually believes in the Gospel leaves then all that's left is the fear and the hate.

You give the example of a woman whose hand was disfigured so that the people wouldn't shake hands with her -- which is the sign of peace. That example is your responsibility, yours personally. It is your obligation to be there to make her welcome especially when no one else will do it. If you give up on your responsibility, fine. But own up to it. If you don't want to shake her hand, either, then don't blame it on everyone else who doesn't.

well I see NOM went straight to the top of the catholic church.

Manchu wrote:

Slarg232 wrote:People beleive it not because they want to beleive it, but because they feel they have to beleive it.

This has never been more wrong than among Catholics in 2012.

How so? It is easy to state that what someoen else is saying is Wrong, without anything to back it up.

That's why for the longest time priests have not been allowed to marry; it's just how it's always been done.

Wrong again. Celibacy is a discipline required of Roman Rite priests by canon law -- and only since 1123 at that. Priests of other rites, like all the Orthodox, are allowed to marry.

Romans.... Ain't they the guys who kinda crucified God's Son?

All people whom I have talked to (Read: I have not talked to every religious person) are very much the Holier than Thou type.

You haven't talked to all the religious people? You clearly haven't talked to many religious people at all.

Oh? Four Catholic Schools, five churches worth of people. I probably have talked to more religious people than anyone else here.

I've been called "Unchurchly" and "Satanic" for expressing a view that isn't "Hate gays, burn Abortionists".

So have I. I got over it.

Have you ever been branded as such by the entire congregation?

We recently had a flood up here that completley wiped out half of our state. The Churches answer? Send Money to starving kids in Africa.

Yes, it's completely believable that the local parishes -- which constantly support their communities -- ceased all such efforts to further enrich those fat cats in Africa. Or at least on meth it is.

This is true, your belief is not required. I truely wish I was making this up, but our Priest was hounding us to send money to Africa when we didn't have enough to rebuild houses.

God is alot like Lady Gaga in my eyes; I don't have a unfavorable opinion of them, but I can't fething stand their fan club. If anyone ever asks me, I do beleive in God. But I beleive in him on my own terms, not what some man in a pointy hat tells me.

At some point, all of us have to grow up. You can make everything about you or you can look around and be a part of your real community. People who disagree with you will make things uncomfortable for you. They'll say "you're not really Catholic." They'll want you out of the Church so they can have it for their own agenda. If it means anything to you, anything more than another little trivial mark of identity that you can put on your facebook profile, then you'll stay anyway -- because if everyone who actually believes in the Gospel leaves then all that's left is the fear and the hate.

Why do I have to stay anywhere near a Church to beleive in Gospel? "Where two or more are gathered in my name, there am I". The word Church is not mentioned. I do not have to be Catholic to believe in God. If everyone who beleives leaves and forms their own group, then the first group will be revealed for who they are; hate-filled "Catholics" in name only that have more in common with Westborrow than God.

Also, I took "Catholic" off on my facebook profile.

You give the example of a woman whose hand was disfigured so that the people wouldn't shake hands with her. That example is your responsibility, yours personally. It is your obligation to be there to make her welcome especially when no one else will do it. If you give up on your responsibility, fine. But own up to it. If you don't want to shake her hand, either, then don't blame it on everyone else who doesn't.

Every single day she was there and was close enough for me to get to her before the ritual went on, I shook her hand. When she was behind me, I shook her hand. When she was in front of me, I shook her hand. It is not my responsibility to go to a place of hypocrits who pat themselves on their backs thinking "Oh hey, look at me, I'm here and doing good!" while at the same time passing judgement on people and getting told not to pass judgement. That is something I refuse to do.

Casey's Law wrote:Religion is a scourge on humanity. That's a fact.

So is Science a scourge on humanity, based on your quote in your signature?

Slarg232 wrote:It is easy to state that what someoen else is saying is Wrong, without anything to back it up.

There no coercive force that compels Catholics to attend mass nor is there even significant social pressure. This isn't the 50s much less the 1550s. People, other than small children and moody pre-teens, attend mass because they want to.

Why do I have to stay anywhere near a Church to beleive in Gospel?

You don't. But you can't be a Christian by yourself:

"Where two or more are gathered in my name, there am I".

You just quoted it yourself.

The word Church is not mentioned.

And yet this is what the Church actually is: the community of believers.

Every single day she was there and was close enough for me to get to her before the ritual went on, I shook her hand. When she was behind me, I shook her hand. When she was in front of me, I shook her hand.

And if the rest of your story is true, now that you are gone, no one shakes her hand.

It is not my responsibility to go to a place of hypocrits ...

The community has bad characteristics so you leave it to those who are bad and then you complain that it's still bad? A fine position from which to call others hypocrites. In Jesus's time, too, the people who thought they were holy would not associate with those they considered sinners -- very much like you.

Haha, love it!

Dakka keeps me laughing for sure.

The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

People on the internet who don't actually care will complain about it?

Nope, that isn't new either.

Manchu wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

People on the internet who don't actually care will complain about it?

Nope, that isn't new either.

And people on the internet will complain about people complaining.

Wait a second...

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

My awesomesauce new signature, what else?

Nothing new under the sun, it seems.

Manchu wrote:The community has bad characteristics so you leave it to those who are bad and then you complain that it's still bad? A fine position from which to call others hypocrites. In Jesus's time, too, the people who thought they were holy would not associate with those they considered sinners -- very much like you.

Right, right.

Oddly though, I don't crucify people, I just let them wallow in their ignorance. As you said; "People go because they want to". They want to go because they beleive what they are doing is right, because they are a community of Beleivers. You, nore I, can be moved from our beleifs, and nore can they. I can not show them how wrong they are, I have tried, beleive me.

Also, another difference; I was in a bad spot long before I joined Dakka. It's not a time I like to discuss, and so I won't go into detail. I was surrounded by so called Catholics who just watched me burn and did very little to help. You want to know who did help me? A whore. She drank every weekend, fethed people every other day (From the sound of it, three of them at a time were not uncommon), and even did drugs. So think about that; people in the church who are taught to love eachother and help each other out stick their noses up at people who actually need help, patting themselves on the back because "Hey guis! WE'Z SO AWESOME!" wouldn't help a person in need, but the "lowest of the low", a drugged out drunken slut, saw someone who needed help and just did what was necessary to help someone.

You guess why I hate religion so.

I can not show them how wrong they are, I have tried, beleive me.

That's where you're wrong. You can't make anyone believe differently than they do. But you can do as you believe and people will see it. And some people will find it compelling on their own terms, in their own consciences. This is how the Church really works -- no matter what the hierarchy wants to believe; no matter what people who criticize the Church want to believe.

You want to know who did help me? A whore.

I think I must have heard that somewhere before ... hmm ...

Manchu wrote:

You want to know who did help me? A whore.

I think I must have heard that somewhere before ... hmm ...

Actually, you're quite probably incorrect if you're implying that the whore/adultress from the bible was the same woman in later passages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Magdalene#As_prostitute
Just linked to Wiki because it was the quickest one.

You want to know who did help me? A whore.

Slowly but surely, Chaos is begin to grow.

Glad to have been of service, Slarg. Now I'll need 10% of your income. Since that's out of the way...

Manchu, you seem extremely defensive and offended. Not sure if that's your intention, but it makes things look fairly unobjective from your side. There *IS* significant social pressure not to miss Mass around these parts at least. Things like "You give the example of a woman whose hand was disfigured so that the people wouldn't shake hands with her. That example is your responsibility, yours personally. It is your obligation to be there to make her welcome especially when no one else will do it. If you give up on your responsibility, fine. But own up to it. If you don't want to shake her hand, either, then don't blame it on everyone else who doesn't." come off as a little presumptuous as well. Slarg isn't a bad person for feeling like a group of people who wronged him actually wronged him, nor is he bad for saying his opinion.

Hang out with more whores. That goes for everyone.

What's this? The Vatican is pro-Life? They think members of the Catholic Church should follow doctrine? What's the world coming to?

I can't help but LOL at the idea of Manchu defending his personal beliefs being somehow more "unobjective" than the... views given elsewhere in the thread.

We'll never become pyschics and do space travel and make space marines if we dont cast off the shackles of religion!

I honestly ignore anything religious now, it always ends in stupid circular arguments.

CT GAMER wrote:He has a cool mobile and hat.

However that is washed out by the fact that he was a Nazi and runs an organization that harbors pedophiles...

I'm, sorry that is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

1. The Pope is not a Nazi, he was part of the Hitler Jugen... boys scouts, it was the stepping stone of becoming a Nazi, but the war ended before that could even happen. The Pope is a hell of guy and clearly has a touch more common sense then a lot of you.

2. Yes there has been a minority of pedos in the Church, but we must look back on why these things have happened, like years and years of no sex, or no sexual activity to a system that was instrumented hundreds of years ago. I mean look at the Anglican and most Protestant Churches. They allow their Bishops to marry because if they don't, things like what happened in the Catholic Church can happen to them and at least these guys are aware of the fact.

I mean Americans are cool and all, but seriously, you guys have a habit of spouting out Nazi to anyone who doesn't have the same Political or Religious views, or COMMUNIST or FASCIST.

I'm actually really surprised at the attitude of a lot of the people on Dakka. Do you guys even think about your posting. What people your offending or upsetting. Because I sure am.

Cheers Dakka.

Oh neat, another "lets bash other peoples religions" circle jerk. Can I ask why these type of threads arnt shut down immediately? Im being serious here. DAKKA shuts down threads about getting smashed and doped up from drugs, which really doesnt offend ANYONE, just annoys. Yet these threads are allowed to go fething page after page with some INCREDIBLY rude and offensive insults towards religion. I find it very insulting and unacceptable posting

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

Ok seriously dude, shut up, because that is just really unacceptable. You really don't think do you. I can see your not a Catholic, because most people who aren't involved in the Church or don't care about it sure seem to complain about it a lot.

Grow up, and think before you speak. I'm pretty sure you get taught that at the age of five.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

KingCracker wrote:Oh neat, another "lets bash other peoples religions" circle jerk. Can I ask why these type of threads arnt shut down immediately? Im being serious here. DAKKA shuts down threads about getting smashed and doped up from drugs, which really doesnt offend ANYONE, just annoys. Yet these threads are allowed to go fething page after page with some INCREDIBLY rude and offensive insults towards religion. I find it very insulting and unacceptable posting

You have point. But I have lost two members of my family due to drug/alcoholic related problems, so when people start to go on about how "wasted" and "baked" they are it does tend to annoy and offend people like me. Because the people saying that crap really don't know what they are talking about.

I'm trustfully trying to show restraint, but when people start making jokes and bashing your Church that has helped you get through a lot of heart ache and difficult times like the things I've just said, you tend to get a bit upset and angry.

Poppabear wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:He has a cool mobile and hat.

However that is washed out by the fact that he was a Nazi and runs an organization that harbors pedophiles...

I'm, sorry that is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

1. The Pope is not a Nazi, he was part of the Hitler Jugen... boys scouts, it was the stepping stone of becoming a Nazi, but the war ended before that could even happen. The Pope is a hell of guy and clearly has a touch more common sense then a lot of you.

2. Yes there has been a minority of pedos in the Church, but we must look back on why these things have happened, like years and years of no sex, or no sexual activity to a system that was instrumented hundreds of years ago. I mean look at the Anglican and most Protestant Churches. They allow their Bishops to marry because if they don't, things like what happened in the Catholic Church can happen to them and at least these guys are aware of the fact.

I mean Americans are cool and all, but seriously, you guys have a habit of spouting out Nazi to anyone who doesn't have the same Political or Religious views, or COMMUNIST or FASCIST.

I'm actually really surprised at the attitude of a lot of the people on Dakka. Do you guys even think about your posting. What people your offending or upsetting. Because I sure am.

Cheers Dakka.

This is why I can't stand the current pope.
He might not be a nazi, but he definitely told the people of Africa to NOT use condoms because condoms spread aids.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7947460.stm
"HIV/Aids is a tragedy that cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which can even increase the problem "

He also played a part in covering up the known child molesters:
http://www.newworldorderreport.com/News/tabid/266/ID/2701/Pope-Benedict-played-direct-role-in-protecting-priest-who-molested-over-200-deaf-boys.aspx
"The Catholic hiearchy has enabled and protected child rapists for decades. Over the past few months, we've seen the scandal get closer and closer to the Pope, mostly because of what's happening in his native Germany. But, this article shows that Benedict/Ratzinger was directly involved in the cover up here in the U.S."

And now apparently helping the poor comes in third after making sure gays can't get married and women can't get abortions.

Poppabear wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

Ok seriously dude, shut up, because that is just really unacceptable. You really don't think do you. I can see your not a Catholic, because most people who aren't involved in the Church or don't care about it sure seem to complain about it a lot.

Grow up, and think before you speak. I'm pretty sure you get taught that at the age of five.

First of all, you're breaking your own rule. "Grow up, and think before you speak."

Secondly, is complaining about a sexist, homophobic organization that's historically responsible for countless genocides and hiding pedophiles and is currently run by a former Nazi unacceptable now? Because really, I think the Catholic Church is one of the few organizations it'd be acceptable to complain about.

Thirdly, I never insulted the average Catholic. I only insulted the top figures in the Catholic Church. There's nothing wrong with yer average Catholic.

Please remember that rule no.1 applies in the OT forum.

You can complain about the leadership of a religion without insulting them.

By insulting the leaders you insult the followers too, which is not going to get them on your side.

It is the followers who have the power to influence the leadership. By alienating the followers you help to perpetuate the power of the leadership.

To be honest I would think that helping others with kindness and compassion would do more to align them with your cause than telling them they will burn in hell for doing something you don't like...

SilverMK2 wrote:To be honest I would think that helping others with kindness and compassion would do more to align them with your cause than telling them they will burn in hell for doing something you don't like...

And that is why you don't have a world spanning religion!

Kilkrazy wrote:Please remember that rule no.1 applies in the OT forum.

You can complain about the leadership of a religion without insulting them.

By insulting the leaders you insult the followers too, which is not going to get them on your side.

It is the followers who have the power to influence the leadership. By alienating the followers you help to perpetuate the power of the leadership.

What if we're not particularly interested in trying to win over anyone who genuinely believes that contraception is evil? I'm fine with just writing off that section of the population as unsalvageable.

Seaward wrote: I'm fine with just writing off that section of the population as unsalvageable.

So you are essentially that which you disdain?

Then you are just talking to yourself.

That little bit of comfort you find in your church is too high a cost to the rest of us. Pretty much supporting the hierarchy of any religion means you're an enabler, feeding them the right to say "Hey, we're now the majority listen to us". Well I don't want their voice to be heard if it's spewing hate filled bile, I want it to be snuffed out. Practice your religion quietly amongst your own. Don't bother the rest of us. We just want to get on with our lives. Thank you, goodbye.

LoneLictor wrote:

Poppabear wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:The Catholic Church is run by scumbags. What's new?

Ok seriously dude, shut up, because that is just really unacceptable. You really don't think do you. I can see your not a Catholic, because most people who aren't involved in the Church or don't care about it sure seem to complain about it a lot.

Grow up, and think before you speak. I'm pretty sure you get taught that at the age of five.

First of all, you're breaking your own rule. "Grow up, and think before you speak."

Secondly, is complaining about a sexist, homophobic organization that's historically responsible for countless genocides and hiding pedophiles and is currently run by a former Nazi unacceptable now? Because really, I think the Catholic Church is one of the few organizations it'd be acceptable to complain about.

Thirdly, I never insulted the average Catholic. I only insulted the top figures in the Catholic Church. There's nothing wrong with yer average Catholic.

You attack the Church, then you attack me as well, along with the other millions of Catholics as well. I just had a read of rule number one of the off topic forum, and your breaking it, you can complain about the leadership, but not about the structure or the Church in general, which you are. Now I would appreciate it if you would stop. There is no need to express your hate to the entire world, I can see you are one of those smug church haters, but you can be all smug as you will in your head.

Oh and FYI, I do think before I speak, I do for everything, I have a normal brain in which I am able to think about what is I am going to say and the reactions/consequences that will come along with what I am saying.

How bout this, go to Glasgow, and travel to Celtic Field, and shout at the top of your lungs about how the Catholic church is full of raging homosexuals and baby-touchers, then after you mayhem which will unsew, then you might get a grasp on reality and finally learn to "THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK"

Cheers

Poppabear wrote:How bout this, go to Glasgow, and travel to Celtic Field, and shout at the top of your lungs about how the Catholic church is full of raging homosexuals and baby-touchers, then after you mayhem which will unsew, then you might get a grasp on reality and finally learn to "THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK"

If you can't see the difference between that an what and how things have been said, then I'm afraid there is not really all that much point in continuing any form of "discussion". I also like that you assume the Catholics at Celtic Field will be unable to act like reasoned, sensible people, but instead will turn into some form of foaming mob because one person is being an idiot. Way to score an own goal

SilverMK2 wrote:

Poppabear wrote:How bout this, go to Glasgow, and travel to Celtic Field, and shout at the top of your lungs about how the Catholic church is full of raging homosexuals and baby-touchers, then after you mayhem which will unsew, then you might get a grasp on reality and finally learn to "THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK"

If you can't see the difference between that an what and how things have been said, then I'm afraid there is not really all that much point in continuing any form of "discussion". I also like that you assume the Catholics at Celtic Field will be unable to act like reasoned, sensible people, but instead will turn into some form of foaming mob because one person is being an idiot. Way to score an own goal

Actually no, that is not what I assume. I assume that if someone was spouting crap about the church in the middle of one the most populated catholic zones, someone would go up to said person and kick their bloody head in. I'm not saying that 100+ people will jump the bugger and form into a huge mob, please quote the part where I said that. And if you quote the mayhem bit, don't even, cause all I meant there was that if he did he was going to end up with a broken everything.

Edit:

If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

Casey's Law wrote:Religion is a scourge on humanity. That's a fact.

QFT

I totally agree.

Poppabear wrote:Actually no, that is not what I assume. I assume that if someone was spouting crap about the church in the middle of one the most populated catholic zones, someone would go up to said person and kick their bloody head in.

Still not really seeing the distinction - you are still saying that people are justified to react violently, possibly seriously hurt or even kill people because they disagree with what/how someone says something...

please quote the part where I said that. And if you quote the mayhem bit, don't even, cause all I meant there was that if he did he was going to end up with a broken everything.

Sorry, but when you say "mayhem which will unsew" when talking about a large crowd of people, that implies a mob of people, not "a single person going over and kicking someone in" (which is still far more than some idiot being an idiot deserves to have happen to them).

Though to be honest, I am having a hard time following what you are actually writing.

If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

I would quite possibly laugh in your face. Though more likely I would shut the door in your face (which is what I have done to door to door nut jobs/Christians/etc before)/walk off if it was in public. That is the reasonable response. Being reasonable does not always mean attempting to reason with someone - especially when it is clear they are beyond reason.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

No, they don't "deserve whatever comes to them". No matter how much of an idiot someone is being, or how much you disagree with what someone says/does/is, does not mean you can, for example, round them up and put them into a camp where they are worked to death and/or fed into the ovens. It is especially hypocritical coming from a religion where one of the core beliefs is supposedly in being nice to people - how exactly do you reconcile that attitude to beating the crap out of/killing people who don't agree with you?

SilverMK2 wrote:
No, they don't "deserve whatever comes to them". No matter how much of an idiot someone is being, or how much you disagree with what someone says/does/is, does not mean you can, for example, round them up and put them into a camp where they are worked to death and/or fed into the ovens. It is especially hypocritical coming from a religion where one of the core beliefs is supposedly in being nice to people - how exactly do you reconcile that attitude to beating the crap out of/killing people who don't agree with you?

Weeeeell, we do have laws that make racial verbal abuse illegal and the like. Not that attacking a religious organization is the same thing, but it is actually against the law to have the opinion that black people should be round up and hung (I think).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and Poppabear, it seems that Lonelictor is only using the very words you used against you. Frankly If anyone is making personal attacks against individual posters, it's you.

Hazardous Harry wrote:Weeeeell, we do have laws that make racial verbal abuse illegal and the like. Not that attacking a religious organization is the same thing, but it is actually against the law to have the opinion that black people should be round up and hung (I think).

There is no law that (as far as I am aware) determines what you can or cannot think. There are several which limit what you can and cannot say, or how you can say it. You are more than able to have the opinion that all black people should be rounded up and hung, however, to act on that opinion, or to incite hatred/a number of other things in relation to that opinion would be, in many places, illegal.

It is sometimes a fine line, and sometimes hard to tell when someone has crossed over it.

Well this thread is going well. I think that the Vatican made a really daft call on this one.

On another note please stop all the bashing of religion. Live and let live, people.

I take it that you are deists.

As soon as you decide that your position is irrefutable and un-open to debate, you have become as bad as the person you are trying to convince otherwise.

Why should the person whose beliefs you detest listen to your argument, if you are not listening to theirs? Blanket hate statements aren't going to get you anywhere.

I am decidedly areligious and have serious reservations about the nature of organised religion, but I cannot deny the good it can do. Whilst it does not conform to my own personal views I would never lambast those who practice it with hate-filled condescension.

It sickens me that homosexuality and contraception are decried as evil by the Catholic church, and I have debated it once or twice with those who hold it to be true. The only time I've ever made headway was when I was willing to calmly and reasonably listen to their point of view. Otherwise you sink to the level of children in the playgroud, and you only compound the views you seek to change.

I'm an atheist actually, but I don't get the hatred that religion can inspire.

SilverMK2 wrote:

Poppabear wrote:Actually no, that is not what I assume. I assume that if someone was spouting crap about the church in the middle of one the most populated catholic zones, someone would go up to said person and kick their bloody head in.

Still not really seeing the distinction - you are still saying that people are justified to react violently, possibly seriously hurt or even kill people because they disagree with what/how someone says something...

please quote the part where I said that. And if you quote the mayhem bit, don't even, cause all I meant there was that if he did he was going to end up with a broken everything.

Sorry, but when you say "mayhem which will unsew" when talking about a large crowd of people, that implies a mob of people, not "a single person going over and kicking someone in" (which is still far more than some idiot being an idiot deserves to have happen to them).

Though to be honest, I am having a hard time following what you are actually writing.

If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

I would quite possibly laugh in your face. Though more likely I would shut the door in your face (which is what I have done to door to door nut jobs/Christians/etc before)/walk off if it was in public. That is the reasonable response. Being reasonable does not always mean attempting to reason with someone - especially when it is clear they are beyond reason.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

No, they don't "deserve whatever comes to them". No matter how much of an idiot someone is being, or how much you disagree with what someone says/does/is, does not mean you can, for example, round them up and put them into a camp where they are worked to death and/or fed into the ovens. It is especially hypocritical coming from a religion where one of the core beliefs is supposedly in being nice to people - how exactly do you reconcile that attitude to beating the crap out of/killing people who don't agree with you?

I am totally in my right to express angry and disbelief at people who be little my faith and pretty much call me a homosexual and that I touch little boys. And yes they may have been aiming those silly immature remarks at the hierarchy of the church, but like what has been said before, you attack the Church, you also attack its followers.

You are correct on how the Church teaches goodwill towards others, but you can keep dreaming if you think I should tolerate someones immaturity and rudeness towards my faith. Its basic human nature. If you attack something that someone holds dearly to them or try and take it away, you can bet your bloody behind that your going to get a smack in the mouth, most people just don't walk away after the crap that has been posted. And they only post this crap because there to damn scared about really saying it, bloody keyboard warriors.

If I was to post a topic about the faults of the Anglican Church on the off-topic forum, I would get half the bloody English posters raging across the post because they would be upset to see that their church/faith is being ridiculed and belittled.

You tell me where I am not allowed to express my anger towards gits who think they can joke about my faith and the people of the Church, you show me? Or otherwise you can just get off your high horse and stop thinking your better then every Catholic out there. May I ask what your faith is?


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Edit:

On another note. The Church may see homosexuality as a evil, but most Catholics do not. I sure as hell don't. I have some gay mates who I would take a bullet for, they are a human being and they were born that way. They do not have tainted souls or have a instant ticket to hell or any of that nonsense.

Poppabear, if you follow the teachings of Christ then you should turn the other cheek and rise above the conflict, not resort to violence and hostility. It's understandable that you're angry about people attacking what's dear to you, but your best way to prove them wrong is to accentuate the positive beliefs to which you subscribe.

Yes you are two right there. I have said what I wanted to say. If I post any more Ill just raise my blood pressure. ;D.

Thank you for reminding me.

blood reaper wrote:

Casey's Law wrote:Religion is a scourge on humanity. That's a fact.

QFT

Agreed.

FTW

Agreed.

Humans are a scourge on humanity.

Mr Hyena wrote:Humans are a scourge on humanity.

Humanity is for the weak.

KingCracker wrote:Oh neat, another "lets bash other peoples religions" circle jerk. Can I ask why these type of threads arnt shut down immediately? Im being serious here.

Because the vaunted " Rule #1" does not apply to religion. In fact it seems to encourage bashing it. I missed that rule somewhere.

But we cant have a Emporer until we has none religions!

On the plus side.
The sky hasn't fallen on our heads...
So things aren't all bad...

SlaveToDorkness wrote:Because the vaunted " Rule #1" does not apply to religion. In fact it seems to encourage bashing it. I missed that rule somewhere.

Rule #1 is just "be polite" - what different people consider to be "polite" differs, especially when it comes to expression of religious beliefs/discussion of said beliefs.

However, just to clarify what Rule #1 actually says:

Rule #1 wrote:Rule 1: Be Polite
This seems obvious, however many folks can sometimes forget that common courtesy goes a long way to lending respect to both you and your opinions. Just because you don't see the other users' faces doesn't mean they don't have feelings and won't be hurt by rude comments or offensive images. When you see something that you find silly, rude or insulting first assume that perhaps there is more to it than you initially thought. Look at it again, keeping in mind that tone and inflection is difficult to convey in a visual format. It may be that the person is attempting a joke or is exaggerating on purpose. It is best to politely request clarification before accusing someone being ignorant, a liar, or worse.

If after clarification you still disagree with the person then politely outline your points. Try to avoid name-calling or even implying insults wherever possible. These tactics generally only inflame a situation and lead to what are known as "Flame Wars." Whenever a flame war starts it usually ruins a perfectly good discussion. Others will lose interest in the thread and the site in general if this kind of interchange becomes a common occurrence.

Please remember that posting and reading online is a visual format and as such the spelling, grammar and look of your posts is the only way others understand what you are saying. Therefore, in order to be polite, all users are expected to make an effort to use proper spelling, grammar and punctuation and should refrain from using internet shorthand or other distracting methods of writing, such as writing a post completely bolded, with capital letters, in a strange color, etc.

It also should go without saying that swearing, profanity, sexual references, etc, are strictly forbidden, including all images that are posted on or uploaded to our site. Remember that we have users of all ages and that Dakka should be a welcoming place for everyone to enjoy.

Ahtman wrote:

Seaward wrote: I'm fine with just writing off that section of the population as unsalvageable.

So you are essentially that which you disdain?

I don't follow. I disdain individuals who believe contraception to be evil because an imaginary being told them it was so, thus I am an individual who believes contraception to be evil because an imaginary being told me so?

I don't think that logic train left the station on the right track.

This is why I don't care for nor talk about religion, ever. People just get so...upset about it. Kind of like people who like all the different forms of screaming rock music. Light help you if you just call all of it screamo.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:

You want to know who did help me? A whore.

Glad to have been of service, Slarg. Now I'll need 10% of your income. Since that's out of the way...

It's in the mail. I thought I told you that before.

Slarg232 wrote:

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:

You want to know who did help me? A whore.

Glad to have been of service, Slarg. Now I'll need 10% of your income. Since that's out of the way...

It's in the mail. I thought I told you that before.

What a coincidence. Cannerus is in the male too

Preachy, rude and disrespectful atheists are bloody embarrassing. Learn to put forward your ideas without being rude and condescending, and maybe try a little less smug glibness in your posts, and you might get further. And if you're not posting with the intention of communicating, why are you posting?

Religion is a source of solace for many people- saying it's a "scourge" is idiotic.

I'm not religious either, but I can't stand the smug atheist routine.

Poppabear wrote:
If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

Nope, I'm fairly sure, reading this, that you're the one acting like an idiot here. You have made several references to homosexuality and pedophilia as one and the same. That marks you as someone drastically naive and bigoted. Your comment is homophobic and typical of the 'religious' people who persecute an agenda of discrimination against the gay population and their rights as equals in society.

Homosexuality is entirely acceptable in Western society, it is a lifestyle and choice of sexual partner conducted between two consenting adults. Pedophilia is a horrific and tragic crime perpetrated against vulnerable children by predatory and malfunctioning individuals. Blending the two, as you have done in several statements in this thread, is something I've heard in pubs before, it's a myth spread by the fearful and prejudiced and hateful, something Christians are not supposed to be. I worked with abused children for several years and can assure you pedophilia is not gender-specific. It's about someone in a position of power abusing someone without power, not about sexual orientation.

Defending your religion by making blanket attacks and ignorant comments on other lifestyles is not a great way to engender support from the rest of us.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Poppabear wrote:
If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

Nope, I'm fairly sure, reading this, that you're the one acting like an idiot here. You have made several references to homosexuality and pedophilia as one and the same. That marks you as someone drastically naive and bigoted. Your comment is homophobic and typical of the 'religious' people who persecute an agenda of discrimination against the gay population and their rights as equals in society.

Homosexuality is entirely acceptable in Western society, it is a lifestyle and choice of sexual partner conducted between two consenting adults. Pedophilia is a horrific and tragic crime perpetrated against vulnerable children by predatory and malfunctioning individuals. Blending the two, as you have done in several statements in this thread, is something I've heard in pubs before, it's a myth spread by the fearful and prejudiced and hateful, something Christians are not supposed to be. I worked with abused children for several years and can assure you pedophilia is not gender-specific. It's about someone in a position of power abusing someone without power, not about sexual orientation.

Defending your religion by making blanket attacks and ignorant comments on other lifestyles is not a great way to engender support from the rest of us.

This.

@All:

Please remember that "QFT," "FTW," and "This." type posts are all spam and spamming the forum is against the rules.

Thanks.

Poppabear wrote:You attack the Church, then you attack me as well, along with the other millions of Catholics as well. I just had a read of rule number one of the off topic forum, and your breaking it, you can complain about the leadership, but not about the structure or the Church in general, which you are. Now I would appreciate it if you would stop. There is no need to express your hate to the entire world, I can see you are one of those smug church haters, but you can be all smug as you will in your head.

If I'm breaking Rule 1, then you are too, mate. And yes, I do feel the need to express my opinion because I consider it horrible how people will purposefully blind themselves to the things that head members of the Catholic Church have done. And whenever you insult those horrible people, Catholics will claim religious discrimination despite the fact that you never said there's anything wrong with Catholicism or wrong with them, just those specific few people.

Poppabear wrote:Oh and FYI, I do think before I speak, I do for everything, I have a normal brain in which I am able to think about what is I am going to say and the reactions/consequences that will come along with what I am saying.

Same here bro. We should start a club for people like us.

Poppabear wrote:How bout this, go to Glasgow, and travel to Celtic Field, and shout at the top of your lungs about how the Catholic church is full of raging homosexuals and baby-touchers, then after you mayhem which will unsew, then you might get a grasp on reality and finally learn to "THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK"

Cheers

How bout this, go over to the parents of those molested kids and tell them to stop hating on the Catholic Church. Then maybe you'll learn to follow your own damn rule.

I don't get poppabear's argument. He's saying that violence will come upon you if you don't agree with the church? That's pretty typical of religion. "Agree with what we say or you get hurt".

You can criticize Ratzinger in a lot of ways that speak to real issues. One example is reprimanding these nuns -- it's a sign of his sympathy with centralizing power in the Church at the expense of the Church's pastoral relevance.

But calling Ratzinger a Nazi is just a baseless attack. It only proves that you (the generic, plural you; referring those who pop in to call Ratzinger a Nazi or similar inflammatory things) have no actual stake in the issue except to be self-righteous and/or anger other people.

I guess when the pope you up and tells you he's going to be having nun of your nunsense it really means the higher ups want nunthing to your current policies.

Eh eh eh?

They've developed an unfortunate habit.

Fun Fact! Not every Catholic want to make a uterus sacred and put holes into Trojans.

So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals. Both God/Gods worship and science is religion. And science is much easier to poke a hole into than religion. Christianity is a very definite thing, while science is a religion based on guesses.

Judging by those two descriptions, I would go with Religion. However, I go with science because it's easier for me to question than to believe. Most humans, however, find solace in the answers that religion gives us. It is much easier to believe that God created all than to hav to sift through a hundred different explanations of one event, each one having the possibility of being wrong itself.

Yes, religion has done bad by some accounts. But it was religion that brought us through the dark ages, it is religion that allows us to answer the hard questions with definite answers. It will be religion that will be the legs on which humanity, both Scientific religion and God worshiping Religion, will walk on.

I harbor no ill will towards religion. To people who abuse their powers who happen to be in religious positions, I do consider bad people. The church covered it up not because they are evil and want to brainwash everyone, but because they are scared of what would happen in the modern world if this got out. And we can see he results in this thread. Because less than 1% of 1% of 1% people affiliated with the church turned out to be pedophilles, we go after the organization as a whole. And just because a couple of idiots at the Vatican are more conservative than others, we blame the whole, not the individual.

It's easier to attack a group than a single person. I the names of the men who told these nuns this could be released, I would see it fit that they are heartily examined by a outside force to see if their radical views are full for the entire church. If they are not, perhaps they may not belong in that subsect of Christianity. If their ideas do fit, fine. He only people affected by it are he people who have a hard time thinking for themselves. And maybe when the views of the church become to radical, they can see what they are subscribing to and leave.

TL;DR: Hate the playa, not the game.

Chowderhead wrote:So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals.

There are plenty of things that have been around for a while - female circumcision, taking the women of your conquored enemies, etc... just because something is old or has been around a while does not make it either a) a good idea, b) right, or c) beyond criticism/mocking/etc.

science is religion... science is a religion based on guesses.

Edit: Fixed picture (hopefully)...

Manchu wrote:You can criticize Ratzinger in a lot of ways that speak to real issues. One example is reprimanding these nuns -- it's a sign of his sympathy with centralizing power in the Church at the expense of the Church's pastoral relevance.

But calling Ratzinger a Nazi is just a baseless attack. It only proves that you (the generic, plural you; referring those who pop in to call Ratzinger a Nazi or similar inflammatory things) have no actual stake in the issue except to be self-righteous and/or anger other people.

[blatant sarcasm]Yes, because calling a former Nazi a Nazi means that I'm a trolling idiot who doesn't care about the issue. Man, you sure are good at diagnosing people you don't even know over the Internet. You could be a psychologist![/blatant sarcasm]

LoneLictor wrote:[blatant sarcasm]Yes, because calling a former Nazi a Nazi means that I'm a trolling idiot who doesn't care about the issue. Man, you sure are good at diagnosing people you don't even know over the Internet. You could be a psychologist![/blatant sarcasm]

The Hitler Youth membership was required for all Aryans over the age of 14 (the Gesetz über die Hitlerjugend law), regardless of whether you went along with the Nazi ideology or not. I have no idea if he was Aryan or not though.

Female circumsicion is impossible, seeing as how they don't have a, you know, penis.

The guesses in science are based on information we gather. But still, more often than not, it's a theory. Gravity, the round earth, reality, they are all theories. And theories are all guesses with the knowledge we have at the current time. It's a massive leap in judgement to call science a religion of guesses, but that's what I consider it.

TAKE NOTE: I put my faith in science, not some crazy book written a few thousand years ago about an angsty cosmic zombie.

Chowderhead wrote:

So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals.

Thats the point, while the rest of us evolves religion stays the same stupid.

Chowderhead wrote:
Both God/Gods worship and science is religion. And science is much easier to poke a hole into than religion. Christianity is a very definite thing, while science is a religion based on guesses.

Are you saying religion is a proven fact and science is guesses? Are you even for real?

Chowderhead wrote:
Yes, religion has done bad by some accounts. But it was religion that brought us through the dark ages, it is religion that allows us to answer the hard questions with definite answers. It will be religion that will be the legs on which humanity, both Scientific religion and God worshiping Religion, will walk on.

Telling lies is bad, it says so in the bible. Stop doing it so blatantly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Chowderhead wrote:Female circumsicion is impossible, seeing as how they don't have a, you know, penis.

Female circumsicion is impossible..? How freaking stupid are you?

Chowderhead wrote:Female circumsicion is impossible

Oh really?

The guesses in science are based on information we gather

... from repeatable experiments done by, in some cases, thousands of different people/groups, peer assessed and checked, altered and updated to reflect new discoveries.

theory.

Please, look up the difference between a scientific theory and common usage of the word theory.

the round earth... are all theories.

What have you been smoking? I would advise you to stop and go and attend a science class

It's a massive leap in judgement to call science a religion of guesses, but that's what I consider it.

Well, I would say that it is a complete fallacy to call science a religion, but hey, each to their own

Bla_Ze wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:

So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals.

Thats the point, while the rest of us evolves religion stays the same stupid.

We haven't had the same religion as we did as Neanderthals. If we did, we would be worshiping bears and mounting their skulls onto or walls.

Religion changes based on societies needs.

Chowderhead wrote:
Both God/Gods worship and science is religion. And science is much easier to poke a hole into than religion. Christianity is a very definite thing, while science is a religion based on guesses.

Are you saying religion is a proven fact and science is guesses? Are you even for real?

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

Seaward wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

My Biology teacher said anything can be a theory. Whether you believe it or not is based upon the evidence supporting it.
So the Earth being round has a lot of evidence supporting it. The Earth being flat does not.
You still get to choose which one you back.

I'm more into the idea of the earth being on the back of a turtle.

purplefood wrote:

Seaward wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

My Biology teacher said anything can be a theory. Whether you believe it or not is based upon the evidence supporting it.
So the Earth being round has a lot of evidence supporting it. The Earth being flat does not.
You still get to choose which one you back.

Then your biology teacher is an idiot. Anything can be a hypothesis. It only gets to be a theory when it has a mountain of evidence supporting it. So while the earth being round could technically be a theory (it's not, incidentally, considering the supporting evidence is that the earth is round), the earth being flat is a hypothesis, and an easily disproven one at that (see bit about earth being round).

Chowderhead wrote:I just read the Wikipedia article on it, and the practice has nothing to do with Christianity, and more with Islam and the forceful keeping of virginity.

I raised it as an example of how something has been around for a while, doesn't make it right or beyond question, etc.


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Monster Rain wrote:I'm more into the idea of the earth being on the back of a turtle.

It's turtles all the way down!

No, I think the earth is round. I never said I didn't. Stop putting words into my mouth.

A scientific theory to me is a tested and expanded hypothesis that explains many experiments and fits ideas together in a framework. If anyone finds a case where all or part of a scientific theory is false, then that theory is either changed or thrown out.

So if we get a new piece of information that says that we are all actually living in pods on Xenu, we would have to change all science to fit it.

If religion got this news, it's Gods doing. It is a much easier thing to say than to completely re-do our definition of reality as we know it.

Also, I mean round earth used to be a theory. Sorry for being unclear.

Laughing Man wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Seaward wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

My Biology teacher said anything can be a theory. Whether you believe it or not is based upon the evidence supporting it.
So the Earth being round has a lot of evidence supporting it. The Earth being flat does not.
You still get to choose which one you back.

Then your biology teacher is an idiot. Anything can be a hypothesis. It only gets to be a theory when it has a mountain of evidence supporting it. So while the earth being round could technically be a theory (it's not, incidentally, considering the supporting evidence is that the earth is round), the earth being flat is a hypothesis, and an easily disproven one at that (see bit about earth being round).

Actually he probably said hypothesis rather than theory...
I was pretty hungover the day he said that...

Laughing Man wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Seaward wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

My Biology teacher said anything can be a theory. Whether you believe it or not is based upon the evidence supporting it.
So the Earth being round has a lot of evidence supporting it. The Earth being flat does not.
You still get to choose which one you back.

Then your biology teacher is an idiot. Anything can be a hypothesis. It only gets to be a theory when it has a mountain of evidence supporting it. So while the earth being round could technically be a theory (it's not, incidentally, considering the supporting evidence is that the earth is round), the earth being flat is a hypothesis, and an easily disproven one at that (see bit about earth being round).

And if one scrap of evidence is wrong, the entire theory is right oh the window.

With religion, you can say god did it, and be done with it. Much easier than research.

What I am trying to say is that Religion Is easier than science. No more, no less. I think that religion will become unneccisary at a later date, but for now, we need it.

Castiel wrote:Well this thread is going well. I think that the Vatican made a really daft call on this one.

On another note please stop all the bashing of religion. Live and let live, people.

Its up to religions to live and let live. You can't ask to be left alone to believe what you want to believe while demonizing women, atheists, and homosexuals., and trying to turn them into second class citizens. Nor while claiming a tax free status and comparing Obama to Hitler.


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Chowderhead wrote:

Laughing Man wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Seaward wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:the round earth...they are all theories.

You must consider orbital spaceflight to be theoretical as well, then.

My Biology teacher said anything can be a theory. Whether you believe it or not is based upon the evidence supporting it.
So the Earth being round has a lot of evidence supporting it. The Earth being flat does not.
You still get to choose which one you back.

Then your biology teacher is an idiot. Anything can be a hypothesis. It only gets to be a theory when it has a mountain of evidence supporting it. So while the earth being round could technically be a theory (it's not, incidentally, considering the supporting evidence is that the earth is round), the earth being flat is a hypothesis, and an easily disproven one at that (see bit about earth being round).

And if one scrap of evidence is wrong, the entire theory is right oh the window.

With religion, you can say god did it, and be done with it. Much easier than research.

What I am trying to say is that Religion Is easier than science. No more, no less. I think that religion will become unneccisary at a later date, but for now, we need it.

If one piece of data is wrong, that piece of data is removed. Then if the theory still stands on the mountains of other evidence, the theory still works.

You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

sirlynchmob wrote:You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

Eventually, we will no longer need religion.

But right now, we need it. Without it, a lot of political messes that have been fixed will become such clusterfeths that we won't be able to sort out our ass from anothers.

Chowderhead wrote:
I'm 16. There is an extremly large difference between ignorant and stupid. I just read the Wikipedia article on it, and the practice has nothing to do with Christianity, and more with Islam and the forceful keeping of virginity.

Blaze, please follow rule 1 and stop insulting me. Thank you.

If you even get clear of the community that is influencing you with this religious rubbish you will most definitely learn that the world has more to offer than your narrow minded and ignorant religion even could.

Chowderhead wrote:
With religion, you can say god did it, and be done with it. Much easier than research.

What I am trying to say is that Religion Is easier than science. No more, no less. I think that religion will become unneccisary at a later date, but for now, we need it.

Even the Ancient Greeks had more interesting hypothesis about gods and religion than the brain-dead cretin that plague the earth nowadays.

Edit: And btw im sorry, didin't know you were 16. And remember the clitoris is pretty much a penis. (tuck that piece of information away for your prom-night)

Chowderhead wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

Eventually, we will no longer need religion.

But right now, we need it. Without it, a lot of political messes that have been fixed will become such clusterfeths that we won't be able to sort out our ass from anothers.

Religions are creating most of our political messes today. If it wasn't for them gay marriage wouldn't be an issue, just marry anyone you want.

the Abortions issue was solved some 50 years ago, but the religions just can't drop it.

Religions are even come in against Global Warming, and they're pretty much anti science as it is. Creating more political messes by trying to push their fairy tales into the classroom.

so without religion we'd have a lot fewer political messes and the republicans would no longer have a platform to run a campaign. They might actually have to talk about relevant issues for a change.

Bla_Ze wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:
I'm 16. There is an extremly large difference between ignorant and stupid. I just read the Wikipedia article on it, and the practice has nothing to do with Christianity, and more with Islam and the forceful keeping of virginity.

Blaze, please follow rule 1 and stop insulting me. Thank you.

If you even get clear of the community that is influencing you with this religious rubbish you will most definitely learn that the world has more to offer than your narrow minded and ignorant religion even could.

I was born Jewish, raised Jewish, and am now a practicing Atheist. Christianity has never been part of my life, and never will be.

The fact that you claim I'm Catholic when I have stated about five times in my other posts on this thread shows me that you have no interest in this topic, but just want to troll.

Chowderhead wrote:

With religion, you can say god did it, and be done with it. Much easier than research.

What I am trying to say is that Religion Is easier than science. No more, no less. I think that religion will become unnecessary at a later date, but for now, we need it.

Even the Ancient Greeks had more interesting hypothesis about gods and religion than the brain-dead cretin that plague the earth nowadays.

It's only interesting because you find it interesting. You are stating opinion like it is fact, which is a very large logical fallacy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

sirlynchmob wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

Eventually, we will no longer need religion.

But right now, we need it. Without it, a lot of political messes that have been fixed will become such clusterfeths that we won't be able to sort out our ass from anothers.

Religions are creating most of our political messes today. If it wasn't for them gay marriage wouldn't be an issue, just marry anyone you want.

the Abortions issue was solved some 50 years ago, but the religions just can't drop it.

Religions are even come in against Global Warming, and they're pretty much anti science as it is. Creating more political messes by trying to push their fairy tales into the classroom.

so without religion we'd have a lot fewer political messes and the republicans would no longer have a platform to run a campaign. They might actually have to talk about relevant issues for a change.

They already do focus on relevant issues. The majority of Americans are Christian, and by talking about Christianity, they are speaking about the majorities issues.

It's also a massive stereotype to say that all Conservatives are Bible-thumping Jesus-freaks.

Science and religion don't have to be mutually exclusive. Just sayin'.

Monster Rain wrote:Science and religion don't have to be mutually exclusive. Just sayin'.

This is also true.

Why, I've been to busy white knighting "my" religion full of baby humpers and nazis to see it! Thanks, MR! I'll make sure god kills you first when he sends down the angels to kill the athiests, gay-enablers, and all the other heathens!

Yay!

Chowderhead wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

sirlynchmob wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

Eventually, we will no longer need religion.

But right now, we need it. Without it, a lot of political messes that have been fixed will become such clusterfeths that we won't be able to sort out our ass from anothers.

Religions are creating most of our political messes today. If it wasn't for them gay marriage wouldn't be an issue, just marry anyone you want.

the Abortions issue was solved some 50 years ago, but the religions just can't drop it.

Religions are even come in against Global Warming, and they're pretty much anti science as it is. Creating more political messes by trying to push their fairy tales into the classroom.

so without religion we'd have a lot fewer political messes and the republicans would no longer have a platform to run a campaign. They might actually have to talk about relevant issues for a change.

They already do focus on relevant issues. The majority of Americans are Christian, and by talking about Christianity, they are speaking about the majorities issues.

It's also a massive stereotype to say that all Conservatives are Bible-thumping Jesus-freaks.

If you think these are relevant issues you're are just a bible thumping jesus freak, or worse you agree with them.

Who are the people that think gays shouldn't get married, women shouldn't get abortions, and science is some sort of evil conspiracy? The bible thumping nut jobs.

For some reason, they think because they don't like these things, they can push their nonsense into laws, in essence they want tell others who are not part of their religion how to live their lives, and what to do with their lives.

sirlynchmob wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

sirlynchmob wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:You mean with religion its lazier, and we no longer need it.

Eventually, we will no longer need religion.

But right now, we need it. Without it, a lot of political messes that have been fixed will become such clusterfeths that we won't be able to sort out our ass from anothers.

Religions are creating most of our political messes today. If it wasn't for them gay marriage wouldn't be an issue, just marry anyone you want.

the Abortions issue was solved some 50 years ago, but the religions just can't drop it.

Religions are even come in against Global Warming, and they're pretty much anti science as it is. Creating more political messes by trying to push their fairy tales into the classroom.

so without religion we'd have a lot fewer political messes and the republicans would no longer have a platform to run a campaign. They might actually have to talk about relevant issues for a change.

They already do focus on relevant issues. The majority of Americans are Christian, and by talking about Christianity, they are speaking about the majorities issues.

It's also a massive stereotype to say that all Conservatives are Bible-thumping Jesus-freaks.

If you think these are relevant issues you're are just a bible thumping jesus freak, or worse you agree with them.

Who are the people that think gays shouldn't get married, women shouldn't get abortions, and science is some sort of evil conspiracy? The bible thumping nut jobs.

For some reason, they think because they don't like these things, they can push their nonsense into laws, in essence they want tell others who are not part of their religion how to live their lives, and what to do with their lives.

They can do this because people voted them in, not because they are the looniest of the loony bin.

And no, I do not agree with them. I will never agree with them that Christianity is important to out Gov't. I'm with Ben Franklin on this issue.

However, just because I disagree with them, it does not mean I can't be blinded from the facts.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'm going to bow out now, seeing as how people seem to be twisting my words to make me out to be some sort of monster.

People are being asshats, and I don't see myself being part of them. Goodbye.

Chowderhead wrote:
I was born Jewish, raised Jewish, and am now a practicing Atheist. Christianity has never been part of my life, and never will be.

The fact that you claim I'm Catholic when I have stated about five times in my other posts on this thread shows me that you have no interest in this topic, but just want to troll.

There is a reason i never specified what religion, but one thing is a fact. You got these notions from somewhere.

Chowderhead wrote:
It's only interesting because you find it interesting. You are stating opinion like it is fact, which is a very large logical fallacy.

I beg to differ, in the context of this discussion it should be seen as quite interesting. Especially if you consider most of ancient greece was religious. And yet its scientific contribution was, of the charts? (pun intended)

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Poppabear wrote:
If I came up to you and started to say that everything you believe in, and put your faith into, was a entire hunk of crap and because you believed that, makes you an idiot and a raging homosexual that likes to touch little boys!?!?!?!? You tell me where you would reason with me in that bloody situation. My guess is that any sort of reasoning up to that point would just be thrown out the window.

And its not just someone acting like an idiot (this has happened in the past because of people who "Just wanted to see what would happen") and they end up half dead on the side walk because of "What just happened". Its someone who attacks an entire religion and culture because they think its wrong and somewhere in that person self-righteous being is a git that deserves what ever comes to him.

Nope, I'm fairly sure, reading this, that you're the one acting like an idiot here. You have made several references to homosexuality and pedophilia as one and the same. That marks you as someone drastically naive and bigoted. Your comment is homophobic and typical of the 'religious' people who persecute an agenda of discrimination against the gay population and their rights as equals in society.

Homosexuality is entirely acceptable in Western society, it is a lifestyle and choice of sexual partner conducted between two consenting adults. Pedophilia is a horrific and tragic crime perpetrated against vulnerable children by predatory and malfunctioning individuals. Blending the two, as you have done in several statements in this thread, is something I've heard in pubs before, it's a myth spread by the fearful and prejudiced and hateful, something Christians are not supposed to be. I worked with abused children for several years and can assure you pedophilia is not gender-specific. It's about someone in a position of power abusing someone without power, not about sexual orientation.

Defending your religion by making blanket attacks and ignorant comments on other lifestyles is not a great way to engender support from the rest of us.

So you chose to ignore my last comment did you, you guys are now sounding like FOX NEWS, you'll only read the juicy parts but never the whole damn thing. I said time and time again, I have nothing, NOTHING against gays, I have few gay mates that I would take a bullet for, they are a person to and have the same rights as me, and why should I treat them any differently. But its a very different situation when people start calling me something I'm not. Hell, I get upset when I meat people and they say "Oh, are you American?" cause I must sound like one and god knows why I do.

I do not wish violence on anyone, I was merely saying that if you brought your stupid comments into the real world, I wouldn't be surprised if violence does come your way because that tends to happen./

I also have apologized for the some of the comments I made, at the time I was quite upset, yes there are many problems with the Church, I never denied that. but you guys can keep your smug atheist beliefs to your self and don't have to turn into keyboard warriors and right all your self-righteous bull crap about the Church, The Catholic Church has helped me in many ways, through hardship and heart-ache, and then when people pretty much start saying that it was all wrong or the Catholic Church is full of dickheads. And that's another thing, I have nothing against any other religion, cept I do have slight problem with atheism because of the attitude that comes along with it that a lot of the people have.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or, you can just keeping on quoting me and turning what I have to say into things that are not true.... kinda sounds like Bill O'Riley.

Poppabear wrote:I also have apologized for the some of the comments I made, at the time I was quite upset, yes there are many problems with the Church, I never denied that. but you guys can keep your smug atheist beliefs to your self and don't have to turn into keyboard warriors and right all your self-righteous bull crap about the Church, The Catholic Church has helped me in many ways, through hardship and heart-ache, and then when people pretty much start saying that it was all wrong or the Catholic Church is full of dickheads. And that's another thing, I have nothing against any other religion, cept I do have slight problem with atheism because of the attitude that comes along with it that a lot of the people have.

Wait, you say to stop insulting your beliefs...

Then you say you have a problem with atheists....

You're a huge hypocrite. But I'm glad that you admitted that the Church has had quite a few problems and that it ain't infallible. That's good.

Oh my, I forgot how silly this place can get during Adepticon.

This thread is like a minefield...made of mines!

LoneLictor wrote:

Poppabear wrote:I also have apologized for the some of the comments I made, at the time I was quite upset, yes there are many problems with the Church, I never denied that. but you guys can keep your smug atheist beliefs to your self and don't have to turn into keyboard warriors and right all your self-righteous bull crap about the Church, The Catholic Church has helped me in many ways, through hardship and heart-ache, and then when people pretty much start saying that it was all wrong or the Catholic Church is full of dickheads. And that's another thing, I have nothing against any other religion, cept I do have slight problem with atheism because of the attitude that comes along with it that a lot of the people have.

Wait, you say to stop insulting your beliefs...

Then you say you have a problem with atheists....

You're a huge hypocrite. But I'm glad that you admitted that the Church has had quite a few problems and that it ain't infallible. That's good.

OMG, fething knew you would take that out of context, I said I had a slight problem, because of the attitude that comes along with it.... kinda like yours. There is no problem with the "belief", but I do have a problem with people thinking their better then everyone else because so.

So again, thanks for proving my point.

Poppabear wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:

Poppabear wrote:I also have apologized for the some of the comments I made, at the time I was quite upset, yes there are many problems with the Church, I never denied that. but you guys can keep your smug atheist beliefs to your self and don't have to turn into keyboard warriors and right all your self-righteous bull crap about the Church, The Catholic Church has helped me in many ways, through hardship and heart-ache, and then when people pretty much start saying that it was all wrong or the Catholic Church is full of dickheads. And that's another thing, I have nothing against any other religion, cept I do have slight problem with atheism because of the attitude that comes along with it that a lot of the people have.

Wait, you say to stop insulting your beliefs...

Then you say you have a problem with atheists....

You're a huge hypocrite. But I'm glad that you admitted that the Church has had quite a few problems and that it ain't infallible. That's good.

OMG, fething knew you would take that out of context, I said I had a slight problem, because of the attitude that comes along with it.... kinda like yours. There is no problem with the "belief", but I do have a problem with people thinking their better then everyone else because so.

So again, thanks for proving my point.

The bolded part doesn't make sense. You claim you don't have a problem with atheism. Then you say atheists have attitude problems so you have a problem with them. I'm somewhat confused by this. How can you not have a problem with atheism if you have a problem with it? Ah well.

Also, I'm wondering how, by calling you out on your hypocrisy, I "proved your point", whatever that point might be. And no, I didn't take anything you said out of context. I included the entire paragraph, unedited.

TheRobotLol wrote:This thread is like a minefield...made of mines!

Made me LOL.

LoneLictor wrote:

TheRobotLol wrote:This thread is like a minefield...made of mines!

Made me LOL.

I try

I think you're just skimming what Poppabear's saying LoneLictor, he isn't talking about atheism, but the smugness some atheists, or anyone of any creed, religion, or belief can give off. That "I'm better than you because of this.." kinda thing.

To be honest, it is quite annoying. I'm all for bashing the Vatican and the higher ups of organizations for the stupid or scandalous things they do, but the normal people usually aren't the ones who deserve the scorn and whatnot.

Instead of just talking about and pointing to what's wrong and spewing biased views, we instead look at the problems and converse how to change it? Such a talk might actually give people ideas to start on and eventually change what is wrong.

I had decided not to read this thread any further because i don't like trying to show people the truth over the internet(i don't know who is worth the effort and who isn't) and the arguments from both sides looked pretty pathetic in a lot of cases. But i thought, 'hey, jump back in and see if things have changed.' I didn't get far before i read this:

Chowderhead wrote:So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals. Both God/Gods worship and science is religion. And science is much easier to poke a hole into than religion. Christianity is a very definite thing, while science is a religion based on guesses.

Now, your a good guy Chowder but this is scary. I hope it's one of your hilarious jokes which you have committed to with gusto, i really do. Whatever the case, i threw up in my mouth.

Casey's Law wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:So please, before you make attacks against religion, remember that it has been around since the time of the Neanderthals. Both God/Gods worship and science is religion. And science is much easier to poke a hole into than religion. Christianity is a very definite thing, while science is a religion based on guesses.

Now, your a good guy Chowder but this is scary. I hope it's one of your hilarious jokes which you have committed to with gusto, i really do. Whatever the case, i threw up in my mouth.

I was saying it gives more of a definite answer to hard questions to the masses than science can.

It also appeals more towards the "Least Common Denominator", if you get what I'm saying.

If you don't, it means Religion will be around for a while because humanity is made mostly up of people without two braincells to rub together, and as long as people like that exist, science will be foreign to them. And if they find solace in a book which is made up of absolutes that are made up of the most cop-out answer ever, "God did it". go ahead. They can be ignorant idiots in a corner. feth them. I'll have my actual answers from science, thank you.

Science is what I call a religion because people treat it as one in debates.

I just did some catch up and you have been very slowly changing your tune as evidence has been presented. Don't disguise that Chowder, it's a good thing. By reading the truth, realising that you were wrong and altering your opinions based on that then you could become a useful components of the human race. Do not pretend that you were simply misunderstood though.

I'm not trying to rat you out or put you down here, mate. I really think it's good that you are taking this stuff on board, stop fighting it though, it's not worth it. Be your own person, it'll be worth a lot to you over the next few years of your life, mate.

Also, science isn't a religion, please don't call it that. Anyone assuming that's what my signature means is making a horrid assumption by the way. What the quote is saying is that science is something we can have faith in. It plugs the whole that religion will leave behind, people need faith, have faith in science. The amazing things is, Huygens said that before the 1700. The fact that people still believe in religion, in the western world at the very least, is an insult to those of us who use our brains for the good of humanity.


I'd also like to point out that anyone calling themselves an atheist has hopefully done so in error. Atheists are just as mind-locked and blind as those who follow any religion. I am an agnostic, maybe a militant agnostic, yes. I am a militant agnostic and religion is a danger to humanity. Religion has had it's day, your faith should be in science.

That's all i have to say on the internet. I stuck around for a second post because Chowder is young and clearly worth taking the time to explain things to.

If anyone would like to discuss things further you'll have to take a pilgrimage to my house where i will present you with tea and guidance. Goodnight.

Casey's Law wrote:

I'd also like to point out that anyone calling themselves an atheist has hopefully done so in error. Atheists are just as mind-locked and blind as those who follow any religion.

Am I? I am a strong believer in the fact there is no God, and that will never change. I don't even mind religious people, and It's not like I go out of my way to go, "OHH GOD IS FAKE, MAAAAN! RELIGION IS STUPID FOOL!!!" I just don't. So tell me, how did I choose my belief in 'error'?

It's called I was trying to be nice. Big difference between trying not to post about how I feel that religion is a scourge on humanity and needs to die by fire ASAP, but not right now, because the majority of people are idiots who would be aimless in their lives without believing in Xenu and his 12 apostles and dancing around the issue so I don't come off as one of scumsuckers who just openly bash religion.

Religion is a great thing-it gives people something to believe in and have hope for. ORGANIZED religion is the problem, where people say "my religion is the only right religion." it's likely that every religion has part of the picture, nobody has the whole thing. See we can all stop fighting-Brian (me) answered it all for you. Pope is wrong, child molesters are wrong, nuns should help people and wear revealing clothing (the hot young ones anyway).

LoneLictor wrote:

Poppabear wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:

Poppabear wrote:I also have apologized for the some of the comments I made, at the time I was quite upset, yes there are many problems with the Church, I never denied that. but you guys can keep your smug atheist beliefs to your self and don't have to turn into keyboard warriors and right all your self-righteous bull crap about the Church, The Catholic Church has helped me in many ways, through hardship and heart-ache, and then when people pretty much start saying that it was all wrong or the Catholic Church is full of dickheads. And that's another thing, I have nothing against any other religion, cept I do have slight problem with atheism because of the attitude that comes along with it that a lot of the people have.

Wait, you say to stop insulting your beliefs...

Then you say you have a problem with atheists....

You're a huge hypocrite. But I'm glad that you admitted that the Church has had quite a few problems and that it ain't infallible. That's good.

OMG, fething knew you would take that out of context, I said I had a slight problem, because of the attitude that comes along with it.... kinda like yours. There is no problem with the "belief", but I do have a problem with people thinking their better then everyone else because so.

So again, thanks for proving my point.

The bolded part doesn't make sense. You claim you don't have a problem with atheism. Then you say atheists have attitude problems so you have a problem with them. I'm somewhat confused by this. How can you not have a problem with atheism if you have a problem with it? Ah well.

Also, I'm wondering how, by calling you out on your hypocrisy, I "proved your point", whatever that point might be. And no, I didn't take anything you said out of context. I included the entire paragraph, unedited.

TheRobotLol wrote:This thread is like a minefield...made of mines!

Made me LOL.

Hypocrisy-Hypocrisy is the state of pretending to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that one does not actually have. Hypocrisy involves the deception of others and is thus a kind of lie. You fail to relies what the word means, I suggest looking the up the entire meaning before you go spouting this type of a word. You also fail to relies that your silly and ignorant argument (if one can even call it that any more) is unjust and without merit. You are now at a point where you are just spouting big words in the hopes of actually make some effect. Glad to know I won this argument

You now also fail to relies what I mean by "Little problem with atheism". People have many quarrels with lots of different subjects, but it doesn't mean they despise it all together. Out of all my friends, I am the only religious one, two gay, four atheist, and the rest, well they're not sure. But the thing is with my atheist friends, is that they do not have the same "chip on their shoulder" like you do, and they also do not walk around thinking they know better then every other person that isn't.

You directly attack the heart of my faith, and so I asked, "Please stop saying these things for they are upsetting and offending me and possibly others". I on the other hand, simply made a referral to some atheists that they are "smug" which we all now know is very very true. I never attacked any person, smug isn't even considered an insult. I never attack atheism as a whole nor did I make any hint towards it.

How dare you all me Hypocrite, without even knowing what it fully means. To some people, saying that they are hypocrite is worse then calling them any other thing in the book. You are the most rudest and most selfish person I have ever spoken (typed to).

Until you truly know what Hypocrisy means, you simply cant make any more comments on the Catholic Church.

Cheers ;D.

Yo, Poppabear. Hypocrite. LoneLictor was quite right, and I for one agree with all he has said.

So have to be ashamed of my religon?

TheRobotLol wrote:Yo, Poppabear. Hypocrite. LoneLictor was quite right, and I for one agree with all he has said.

No, Hypocrisy has much more deeper meaning in a religious context, its more then just simply "saying one thing and then doing another" Which I have not done in any circumstance.

Claiming that someone is committing Hypocrisy can be seen as very offensive in someones eyes. That's how it is

I think it is safe to say this post was a violation of Rule #1. Please review the Dakka Rules. MT11

And that is an excellent example of a post we don't need.

I dislike religion, but that doesn't mean I have to be a dick about it.

MrDwhitey wrote:And that is an excellent example of a post we don't need.

Could say the same for you. AND me right now.

Everyone else is tossing their opinions around, why is mine invalid? Also Nazi's ARE terrible role models.

fire4effekt wrote:Everyone else is tossing their opinions around, why is mine invalid? Also Nazi's ARE terrible role models.

I don't think anyone is saying that they are good role models though. So.. ya, invalid.

Casey's Law wrote:I just did some catch up and you have been very slowly changing your tune as evidence has been presented. Don't disguise that Chowder, it's a good thing. By reading the truth, realising that you were wrong and altering your opinions based on that then you could become a useful components of the human race. Do not pretend that you were simply misunderstood though.

I'm not trying to rat you out or put you down here, mate. I really think it's good that you are taking this stuff on board, stop fighting it though, it's not worth it. Be your own person, it'll be worth a lot to you over the next few years of your life, mate.

Also, science isn't a religion, please don't call it that. Anyone assuming that's what my signature means is making a horrid assumption by the way. What the quote is saying is that science is something we can have faith in. It plugs the whole that religion will leave behind, people need faith, have faith in science. The amazing things is, Huygens said that before the 1700. The fact that people still believe in religion, in the western world at the very least, is an insult to those of us who use our brains for the good of humanity.


I'd also like to point out that anyone calling themselves an atheist has hopefully done so in error. Atheists are just as mind-locked and blind as those who follow any religion. I am an agnostic, maybe a militant agnostic, yes. I am a militant agnostic and religion is a danger to humanity. Religion has had it's day, your faith should be in science.

That's all i have to say on the internet. I stuck around for a second post because Chowder is young and clearly worth taking the time to explain things to.

If anyone would like to discuss things further you'll have to take a pilgrimage to my house where i will present you with tea and guidance. Goodnight.

Could you please name some of the titles of the Her Majesty, and why do sessions in the house of commons open in prayer?

Damn. My bad. I thought i'd just post a reminder. Also, Chicken Nuggets are not part of the fruit/vegetable family!

fire4effekt wrote:Damn. My bad. I thought i'd just post a reminder. Also, Chicken Nuggets are not part of the fruit/vegetable family!

Not sure if trolling...

Or just trolling...

Science is also very much a religion, most people dont understand the basis of science, and simply accept scientific sounding statements as a belief.

I am sorry but Science is VERY MUCH a religion to most people who follow it.

a tangible, delicious religion

fire4effekt wrote:a tangible, delicious religion

I dont get it, you lost me?

Poppabear wrote:Hypocrisy-Hypocrisy is the state of pretending to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that one does not actually have. Hypocrisy involves the deception of others and is thus a kind of lie. You fail to relies what the word means, I suggest looking the up the entire meaning before you go spouting this type of a word. You also fail to relies that your silly and ignorant argument (if one can even call it that any more) is unjust and without merit. You are now at a point where you are just spouting big words in the hopes of actually make some effect. Glad to know I won this argument

You're right on that account, I did misuse the word hypocrisy. However, you are wrong that you won the argument because I misused one word. You've made plenty of spelling and grammar errors, but that doesn't mean I've won. And here's what I meant by hypocrisy.

1. You tell people not to insult your beliefs.
2. You insult other people for their beliefs.

Poppabear wrote:You now also fail to relies what I mean by "Little problem with atheism". People have many quarrels with lots of different subjects, but it doesn't mean they despise it all together. Out of all my friends, I am the only religious one, two gay, four atheist, and the rest, well they're not sure. But the thing is with my atheist friends, is that they do not have the same "chip on their shoulder" like you do, and they also do not walk around thinking they know better then every other person that isn't.

I have a great Catholic friend I've known for 9 years, and he isn't nearly as rude as you. I don't have a problem with Catholics. However, I do have a problem with people like you. I never said I was better than you or Catholics (you can go back through the thread and look if you want). All I said was that the top figure of the Catholic Church are horrible people and that its become deeply corrupt. It is a fact that they hid pedophiles and it is a fact that the Pope told the Nuns to focus less on helping people.

Poopybear wrote:You directly attack the heart of my faith, and so I asked, "Please stop saying these things for they are upsetting and offending me and possibly others". I on the other hand, simply made a referral to some atheists that they are "smug" which we all now know is very very true. I never attacked any person, smug isn't even considered an insult. I never attack atheism as a whole nor did I make any hint towards it.

You didn't say "some". You implied that all atheists are smug jerks. It seems like you don't mean that now, but that's what your post implied.

Poopybear wrote:How dare you all me Hypocrite, without even knowing what it fully means. To some people, saying that they are hypocrite is worse then calling them any other thing in the book. You are the most rudest and most selfish person I have ever spoken (typed to).

Daaaaayuuuum, someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed. This is just a conversation over the Internet, no need to get mad. Oh boo hoo, I misused the word hypocrite, so what? That doesn't change the fact that the Catholic Church is run by corrupt ppls and that you're post earlier was very jerky (saying its okay for you to not like other beliefs but its not okay for people to not like your beliefs).

[quote=PopetheBearUntil you truly know what Hypocrisy means, you simply cant make any more comments on the Catholic Church.

Cheers ;D.

Mad?... HA! I have haven't truly been mad for 11 years, and thats when my older brother broke my favorite toy race car at the age of 9.

And it does seem you have a problem with Catholics, if you have a problem with the Church, you pretty much have a problem with me/others who follow the ideology and the belief system of the Catholic faith. So stop trying to hide the fact that you dislike Catholics under your "clever" wording (even though half it you hardly understand).

I also could go on and on and on and on about the problems with the American Baptist Church and the whole Bible belt. If you wanna talk about Conservative beliefs, why dont you just try and sit through a Sunday morning with these guys eh? You wanna talk about fundy Catholics, why don't you have an argument with one of these folks. Hell I'd rather sit through an hours seminar of Jehovah Witnesses then talk with these guys.

Oh and just to point out-Have I made any attacks against this church, no, have I discriminated against any of its followers, no. The worst I have done is called them fundamentalists, which we all know is fact, well, most of them. But where as you have done everything in the book just to piss people off, even if you did not relies it at the time. Bam.

Now I know Americans don't take to kindly to Catholics in general, I would give you the reason why, but it would be bigger then this whole damn topic put together...... Bam.

Poppabear wrote:Science is also very much a religion, most people dont understand the basis of science, and simply accept scientific sounding statements as a belief.

I am sorry but Science is VERY MUCH a religion to most people who follow it.

well if its a religion, its the right one, convert now.

Jesus just got a few rich guys drunk, Tezla and his THEORY of Alternating Current lit up the world and made this web site possible.

Lets see when religion ruled europe what was that period called? Oh ya the Dark Ages. As the religion of science is taking over we get the AGE OF ENLIGHTENMENT.

so you can either believe in talking snakes, magic, boggy men watching you pee, and ghosts, or you can believe in testable, repeatable, provable, theories on how the real world works. And here's the fun part, if you don't believe in the conclusions of certain theories, you, yes you yourself can repeat the test.

If anyone would want a free doctorate in any biological science here's how you do it. Post on every christian site you can find that you are going to college to learn the theory of evolution so you can prove it wrong once and for all. Take all the money they give you, go to college, study your ass off and graduate top of your class, buy a nice car and a nice house to go with it. For your final thesis write your paper on how evolution is wrong.

Isn't it funny the people who claim science is a religion or evolution is just a theory, are the ones who don't understand even the basics of either?

The current pope is a piece of human garbage. He disgraces the very title he holds and is as out of touch as he is mentally unstable...

Poppabear wrote:Mad?... HA! I have haven't truly been mad for 11 years, and thats when my older brother broke my favorite toy race car at the age of 9.

And it does seem you have a problem with Catholics, if you have a problem with the Church, you pretty much have a problem with me/others who follow the ideology and the belief system of the Catholic faith .

I'm sorry but that is just idiotic. It's like saying, "I hate a country's government, therefor I hate all people who agree with them. False. People can just hate the higher ups (such as da pope) for being the face of something they hate, and the one that gets listened to the most and gives out the orders.

@CT GAMER: The current pope is a piece of human garbage. He disgraces the very title he holds and is as out of touch as he is mentally unstable...

I completly agree. He should get kicked off his fancy chair all the way down the hill.

sirlynchmob:
Did you have that whole paragraph ready for when I person comes to post that "science is a religion because" and gives a valid reason why?

Anyways, there are so many holes in scientific belief that I could cover my eyes and stick my hand in one of these said holes.

Big bang, really? Get a grip. Even if, that could still be backed up by creation, I'm not saying it was, but it could.

And all I'm seeing now a days is that "DEEERRRRRP Science=Win, religion sucks, DUM DE DUM DE DUM! No one is giving me logical backing upon why science is more practical then religion. Because at the moment you guys are just helping me solidify the reasons why I think most of what science teach is a joke. You guys aren't helping your cause very much.

And what we have to remember is that the majority of the population of the EARTH follows some sort of religion (not just Christianity, but Christianity has the biggest following. And going back to an earlier comment "I'll just mark that part of the population unsalvageable"). Good to know your marking off more then 60% of the population of the earth.

Scientific believers are the minority and will be for some time to come.

Anyways, there are so many holes in RELIGIOUS belief that I could cover my eyes and stick my hand in one of these said holes.

GOD, really? Get a grip.

And all I'm seeing now a days is that "DEEERRRRRP RELIGION=Win, ATHIESIM sucks, DUM DE DUM DE DUM! No one is giving me logical backing upon why RELIGION is more practical then ATHIESM. Because at the moment you guys are just helping me solidify the reasons why I think most of what RELIGIOUS PEOPLE teach is a joke. You guys aren't helping your cause very much.

Poppabear wrote:Did you have that whole paragraph ready for when I person comes to post that "science is a religion because" and gives a valid reason why?

Anyways, there are so many holes in scientific belief that I could cover my eyes and stick my hand in one of these said holes.

Big bang, really? Get a grip. Even if, that could still be backed up by creation, I'm not saying it was, but it could.

And all I'm seeing now a days is that "DEEERRRRRP Science=Win, religion sucks, DUM DE DUM DE DUM! No one is giving me logical backing upon why science is more practical then religion. Because at the moment you guys are just helping me solidify the reasons why I think most of what science teach is a joke. You guys aren't helping your cause very much.

And what we have to remember is that the majority of the population of the EARTH follows some sort of religion (not just Christianity, but Christianity has the biggest following. And going back to an earlier comment "I'll just mark that part of the population unsalvageable"). Good to know your marking off more then 60% of the population of the earth.

Scientific believers are the minority and will be for some time to come.

ya because the bible has the answer for everything right?

God tells the jews, go get lost in the desert for 40 years. Science says "you are here, Turn left now"

God says you're sick because your possessed by demons, Science says "we can cure that"

what exactly does your bible have to offer anyone? You have no logic to back up your belief in god, so you make ignorant claims about science to help you believe you are right.

This thread has been locked for being too stupid.