My name is Stuart Chaifetz, and my son, Akian, is a ten-year old boy who has Autism. Akian has always been a sweet and non-violent child, and that is why it was so distressing when notes started coming home from his school, Horace Mann Elementary in Cherry Hill, New Jersey, saying that he was having violent outbursts, including him hitting his teacher and aide.
I could not understand why this was happening. I had never witnessed Akian hit anyone, nor could I dream of him lashing out as had been described to me. In October, I had a meeting with the IEP team (the teacher, school social worker, occupational therapist and speech teacher) to try to figure out what was going on. From that meeting, a behaviorist was called in who wrote a report. I sat down with the behaviorist on February 8, 2012 to review the findings.
It was pointless; even though the behaviorist was in the classroom a number of times, not only had he never witnessed any violent event, but when he tried to create a scenario that would cause one to happen, he failed.
Something was terribly wrong. I felt I was beginning to lose my son -- that these outbursts were changing his very nature. The teacher and school social worker tried to downplay it, to the point of almost mocking me for my concern. But I knew my son. I knew this wasn't him. And I knew I had to find out what was happening in his class that was having such a dramatic impact on him.
On the morning of Friday, February 17, 2012, I wired my son and sent him to school. That night, when I listened to the audio my life forever changed, for I heard my son being bullied by his teacher and aide.
Not being a parent myself, I have only been through the school system and I never ran in to anything like this.
Curious of what other parents on Dakkadakka take from this and if those parents had run in to any sort of trouble with teachers in this way. How do you feel about the public school system?
"You would never get away with talking about your alcohol abuse the night before, if this was a mainstream class."
Yes, yes you would.
That said, my aunt, my cousin, and a good friend are all special ed instructors (the friend is actually a speech pathologist), and they all gak themselves with rage after I sent this to them a few days ago.
My name is Stuart Chaifetz, and my son, Akian, is a ten-year old boy who has Autism. Akian has always been a sweet and non-violent child, and that is why it was so distressing when notes started coming home from his school, Horace Mann Elementary in Cherry Hill, New Jersey, saying that he was having violent outbursts, including him hitting his teacher and aide.
I could not understand why this was happening. I had never witnessed Akian hit anyone, nor could I dream of him lashing out as had been described to me. In October, I had a meeting with the IEP team (the teacher, school social worker, occupational therapist and speech teacher) to try to figure out what was going on. From that meeting, a behaviorist was called in who wrote a report. I sat down with the behaviorist on February 8, 2012 to review the findings.
It was pointless; even though the behaviorist was in the classroom a number of times, not only had he never witnessed any violent event, but when he tried to create a scenario that would cause one to happen, he failed.
Something was terribly wrong. I felt I was beginning to lose my son -- that these outbursts were changing his very nature. The teacher and school social worker tried to downplay it, to the point of almost mocking me for my concern. But I knew my son. I knew this wasn't him. And I knew I had to find out what was happening in his class that was having such a dramatic impact on him.
On the morning of Friday, February 17, 2012, I wired my son and sent him to school. That night, when I listened to the audio my life forever changed, for I heard my son being bullied by his teacher and aide.
Not being a parent myself, I have only been through the school system and I never ran in to anything like this.
Curious of what other parents on Dakkadakka take from this and if those parents had run in to any sort of trouble with teachers in this way. How do you feel about the public school system?
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent. If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
99% of my teachers were like Cameron Diaz, except they were old and much more mean. I never developed the love of teachers professed by others accordingly. I can count on two fingers the teachers I thought were even merely half decent.
With the kids I found about half are decent. Of that half maybe 10% are excellent. The other half should be fired immediately. Mind you this is one of the top school districts in the nation (and best in state in freaking band booya!)
I remember getting into an argument with an English teacher because she couldn't spell gnat.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Someone has to counterbalance all the hippy free love on this board. That would be me, or alternatively, someone else.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Someone has to counterbalance all the hippy free love on this board. That would be me, or alternatively, someone else.
Of course, you can be on the kid's side and not be a hippy~ "Burn the teacher and the aide."
Not taking sides but many kids act very different between home and school also. Just because a child acts one way at home doesn't mean he/she is a saint at school. Some parents just do not see their kids as the heretics they really are and can't be persuaded even when there is proof. May not be the case here though so .....
Frazzled wrote: Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent. If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Someone has to counterbalance all the hippy free love on this board. That would be me, or alternatively, someone else.
If he didn't want to get bullied, he shouldn't have been autistic. Jerk.
[/blamethevictim]
edit: On a (slightly) more serious note, I find it hard to feel sympathetic for the father. He gave his kid a stupid name. The kid is going to have enough problems without being shackled with a name like Akian.
Pround members of People Against Parents Naming Their Kids Stupid Names (PAPNTKSN).
I pretty much have named my kids shitbasket and ugly. They both know who I mean when I call em. Shitbasket is my daughter, as she had REALLY bad diapers as a babeh. And ugly is my son.....which kindda back fires a bit because he looks quite a bit like me. So I personally think I insult myself more then him
KingCracker wrote:I pretty much have named my kids shitbasket and ugly. They both know who I mean when I call em. Shitbasket is my daughter, as she had REALLY bad diapers as a babeh. And ugly is my son.....which kindda back fires a bit because he looks quite a bit like me. So I personally think I insult myself more then him
Frankly we need a lot more bullying. Back when bullying was a time honored tradition we ruled the world, like the Brits did before they wussed. If it was good enough for the Mongols its good enough for me.
Near here's an example of proper schooling. Notice the low teacher to student ratio. The rigorous mental and physical exercise, and hands on approach by staff. You don't get this kind of education with new math!
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Someone has to counterbalance all the hippy free love on this board. That would be me, or alternatively, someone else.
Hey Ill have a go!
This case the guy has a point, but 99% of the time its "Oh my lovely little child would NEVER be as bad as the teacher said" and the horrible little gak is!
Basically, spineless parents spoil their kids rotten, their tiny mouse like hearts so bursting with love for their ugly fethed up offspring due to our biological programming that they cannot bring themselves to properly discipline them. They act up in class, and then they blame the teacher for it.
Cry me a river. If it was down to me teacher would still be able to beat the kids, and if my son came home from school and said "The teacher hit me" I would give the little gak a slap as well. But 90% of parents arent like me, and that's why the whole world is fethed up anyway.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Someone has to counterbalance all the hippy free love on this board. That would be me, or alternatively, someone else.
Hey Ill have a go!
This case the guy has a point, but 99% of the time its "Oh my lovely little child would NEVER be as bad as the teacher said" and the horrible little gak is!
Basically, spineless parents spoil their kids rotten, their tiny mouse like hearts so bursting with love for their ugly fethed up offspring due to our biological programming that they cannot bring themselves to properly discipline them. They act up in class, and then they blame the teacher for it.
Cry me a river. If it was down to me teacher would still be able to beat the kids, and if my son came home from school and said "The teacher hit me" I would give the little gak a slap as well. But 90% of parents arent like me, and that's why the whole world is fethed up anyway.
How was that?
You mean allowing your children to do whatever the feth they want their entire lives leads to them growing up into psychopathic monsters?
Surely not...
I just sat through the entire video by the way... watched it with the missus.
For those that cant be fethed, it is far less "violent and cruel" than you might expect. The teachers are unprofessional and I would certainly discipline one of them, but feth me. The guy is such a professional victim.
Whine whine whine.. we both laughed out loud when he said "The teacher stabbed him with words!"
Sadly his channel is moderated so I couldn't troll him. But I typed a well punctuated "stop making a mountain out of a mole hill you big girls blouse.. oh and give the poor kid a normal name like Alan or Gary or something. He has enough to deal with being Autistic without you laying the boot in"
So hopefully Ill make the page anyway and will in turn be heavily trolled by his legions of soya milk drinking, tie-dye shirt wearing, holistic-healing, feng-shui practicing supporters.
That is okay. Daddy will get his when he is the latest and most popular fish in the state pen once he is brought up on charges and convicted for illegally recording the conversations he did.
What a great parent he'll be too, when his son is brought up in a single parent household and has to explain where his daddy is to his classmates.
Frazzled wrote:Frankly we need a lot more bullying. Back when bullying was a time honored tradition we ruled the world, like the Brits did before they wussed. If it was good enough for the Mongols its good enough for me.
The Mongols also made a habit of raping little girls.
Frazzled wrote:Frankly we need a lot more bullying. Back when bullying was a time honored tradition we ruled the world, like the Brits did before they wussed. If it was good enough for the Mongols its good enough for me.
The Mongols also made a habit of raping little girls.
Is that good enough for you?
Dogma, Dakka's professional buzzkill specialist.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Manchu wrote:
dogma wrote:The Mongols also made a habit of raping little girls.
I teach physics in a public school system. That said... there are MANY teachers that aren't professional or should be fired. HOWEVER... you get what you pay for. If you pay teachers poorly... you get poor teachers (both meanings meant here).
I may be moving onto another career soon however... as even after 6 years into the job (with a glowing record btw!), I don't make enough to support my wife/child in this state while paying back loans for the bachelors and masters degree.
CptJake wrote:That is okay. Daddy will get his when he is the latest and most popular fish in the state pen once he is brought up on charges and convicted for illegally recording the conversations he did.
As long as the son consented to the wire, then this isn't illegal recording. If you want to have a private conversation you don't do it in front of other people.
biccat wrote:
As long as the son consented to the wire, then this isn't illegal recording. If you want to have a private conversation you don't do it in front of other people.
But can the son consent? He's both underage, and autistic.
CptJake wrote:That is okay. Daddy will get his when he is the latest and most popular fish in the state pen once he is brought up on charges and convicted for illegally recording the conversations he did.
As long as the son consented to the wire, then this isn't illegal recording. If you want to have a private conversation you don't do it in front of other people.
Well that depends on the state's wiretapping laws actually.
dogma wrote:But can the son consent? He's both underage, and autistic.
His legal guardian can consent on his behalf. Oh look, it's his dad!
Although in some cases a court could (assuming there's some suit at issue) determine this absent the father's interest. But I think it's safe to say that this recording was at least in the child's best interest.
Frazzled wrote:Well that depends on the state's wiretapping laws actually.
Jersey is a one-party consent state. But I'm pretty sure there's no expectation of privacy in a public conversation.
NJ is a one party consent state, BUT I seriously doubt the kid can legally give consent, and the conversations recorded were not really all between the kid and the teacher. Lots of incidental collection between the teachers where the kid was not a party in the conversation.
The teachers union will likely lawyer up and crucify this guy even if he evades criminal prosecution.
Disclosing the contents of illegally recorded conversations also violates some laws at state and Fed level.
As I said, its not THAT bad is it? I'm curious to see other opinions, cos me and my missus agree, and I'm concerned we might actually be a bit fethed up.
Thing is, the teacher talks about getting leathered on wine the night before, alright, a bit unprofessional, but she is obviously joshing with the other adults in the room because the kids aren't all there and wont listen that intently to what they are saying to each other. Im not saying they aren't morons, but "Oh man I was trashed last night!" in front of Autistic kids who wont know what the hell you are on about isn't that big a deal is it? Ive said similar in front of my nephew, safe in the knowledge he is playing the Nintendo and doesnt care that much about what Im saying. If every kid was wearing a wire nationwide, I guarantee you would hear way worse than this. I think the Dad was blowing it all out of proportion.
The "Little bastard" bit was also harsh, but seemed more under the breath in frustration more than full on bullying.
As I said, Im not saying they aren't gak teachers, but its nothing like I expected. I hate the whiny girly-man Dad more than the dumb fething teachers anyway! If I was in the same situation I doubt I would have evn done anything. Maybe if the wife taped it I would go have a word and say "Sort your life out, I know the lads fething annoying but your not much of a teacher in my eyes" but I doubt I would have had her fired, and I certainly wouldnt have advocated a custodial sentence like the fether is doing via his youtube page!
As always, YMMV, but I can certainly see both sides to the story. Austic kids would proper piss me off as well, shrieking at me like they are on the tape. Whilst I certainly wouldnt behave as poorly as the teachers do, I dont think they are viscious or "sick in the head" like he described them.
Did I mention I hate the Dad? He looks like he is going to cry, he wires his kid, he gave him a stupid name and he ...well.. he wires his kid and seems to believe the lad can never do any wrong.
Talks like he is reading off cue cards.
Makes a big deal out of *mostly* minor issues
What a feth.
Maybe it's his whiney attitude or the fact that he named his kid Anikin or some other awful gak that makes me not care.
Maybe it's the part where (I assume) public funding got him an all autism class and a behavioralist to boot. Sounds pretty sweet to me. Clear out those EVIL teachers that DARE speak of having a life in front of incommunicado kids and free state sponsored specialist day care: hooray.
Stop being a bitch on YouTube and handle your business with the school.
mattyrm wrote:
As I said, its not THAT bad is it? I'm curious to see other opinions, cos me and my missus agree, and I'm concerned we might actually be a bit fethed up.
Given that the child is autistic, its pretty bad. It would be different with a "normal" kid, but not much.
My aunt flipped her gak when she heard that recording. Granted, it was clearly edited, but I have trouble believing that matters much given what was said. Further, putting myself in the kid's shoes, there's a fight going on if that was said to me.
Ultimately, as I generally default, the teacher was dumb enough to get caught. The rest is irrelevant.
AustonT wrote:Talks like he is reading off cue cards.
Makes a big deal out of *mostly* minor issues
What a feth.
Maybe it's his whiney attitude or the fact that he named his kid Anikin or some other awful gak that makes me not care.
Maybe it's the part where (I assume) public funding got him an all autism class and a behavioralist to boot. Sounds pretty sweet to me. Clear out those EVIL teachers that DARE speak of having a life in front of incommunicado kids and free state sponsored specialist day care: hooray.
Stop being a bitch on YouTube and handle your business with the school.
Sounds like he wants money, but deserves a ball pien hammer.
a lot of you guys are looking at this like adults. Try to put yourself in the shoes of a kid and see how that would affect you.
when youre at the age where your personality and values are heavily affected by rolemodels and people of authority (ie parents and teachers) having your teacher call you a "bastard" even under her breath is pretty devastating.
what more if youre called that in the presence of other adults who dont even make a move to defend you?
Youll feel pretty worthless
and that doesnt even factor in the autism.
when people think of abuse the default is to always think "physical" and we forget that verbal and psychological abuse are very real things. Theyre more common and i sometimes think theyre more dangerous.
yeah i get that "grow up be tough" is how people nowadays think is the way to raise kids to avoid the stereotypical "bad parent" stigma but not all situations need that type of approach
How high was the gain turned up when the teacher said that though - would it have been inaudible to normal hearing but amplified by the pick up? (I cba to watch the video).
Also, autistic people process the world around them differently - they don't see or experience the world the same way a normal child would (depending on the severity and type of autism, obviously).
mattyrm wrote:As I said, its not THAT bad is it? I'm curious to see other opinions, cos me and my missus agree, and I'm concerned we might actually be a bit fethed up.
Nah, if you guys are fethed up, it's for other reasons than this.
I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
He wants money. He would just keep reocrding until he found something juicy. indeed we have noidea of haow many dozens of hundreds of hours of taping he's done to get this one juicy bit.
Frazzled wrote:He wants money. He would just keep reocrding until he found something juicy. indeed we have noidea of haow many dozens of hundreds of hours of taping he's done to get this one juicy bit.
Hammertime.
I'd pretty much go with this. Sure, what the teachers said/did/etc wasn't acceptable, but I have a feeling this guy was going to keep looking to be offended even if he had to sit through hundreds of hours of tapes for something that he could take as being offensive (if he did not find anything genuinely so).
I think the guy shouldn't be working with vulnerable kids if he feels that way about them. I might think stuff like that when a particularly mouthy kid is giving me aggro, but I would never verbalise it- it's really unprofessional.
As for parents wiring their kids, I'd love to wear a wire myself and play back some of the kid's responses about things to the parents sometimes. I think I'd be alright with any kid wearing a wire in my lessons, because while they're not always awesome, I always behave properly.
I agree that it wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be, however it was still inappropriate and cruel in places. The main woman you hear I think deserved to be fired. I was bullied by a teacher when I was younger, blamed for being bullied by other kids and being told I must have deserved being jumped by a group of 5/6 of my 'classmates'.
Da Boss, the argument can be made that all children are vulnerable from a safeguarding view, just by the fact that they are children.
Well, then especially vulnerable children. A normal kid will flip out at anything like that though, in my experience, so there's no way a teacher would say anything like that in their presence.
If the teachers were talking about being hungover on "volunteering for greenpeace" and calling kids 'liberals' as an insult, then some of the folks on here would be more upset
d-usa wrote:If the teachers were talking about being hungover on "volunteering for greenpeace" and calling kids 'liberals' as an insult, then some of the folks on here would be more upset
d-usa wrote:If the teachers were talking about being hungover on "volunteering for greenpeace" and calling kids 'liberals' as an insult, then some of the folks on here would be more upset
On the contrary I get to experience liberal teachers liberaling ingesting libations every friday evening when I go with my wife and her coworkers to happy hour.
I'm not upset because the YouTube poster is a douche who has already gotten justice.
Manchu wrote:I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. The tapes could be destroyed if no evidence came out of them.
In my opinion, though, the father should have taken his concerns to the authorities, rather than YouTube. He has only managed to alienate half of the DakkaDakka OT forum, and that won't help his son at all.
Manchu wrote:I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. The tapes could be destroyed if no evidence came out of them.
In my opinion, though, the father should have taken his concerns to the authorities, rather than YouTube. He has only managed to alienate half of the DakkaDakka OT forum, and that won't help his son at all.
Wrong. If it is determined the collection was illegal (and I strongly suspect it was) it becomes useless as evidence, publishing it exacerbates the situation, and opens Daddy up to criminal and civil lawsuits which won't be good for his family.
There were other, legal, ways to adress the issue.
Or do you believe it is okay to break the law if you think you have a good reason? If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
I remember a science teacher from back when I was 10 that called me into his room and grabbed me, the started slinging me against the wall after I went in.
The issue was that I had forgotten to sign a test I had taken earlier that day and he was totaly offended.
I ended up getting a 95 on the thing and, when handing back the tests, he again made it a big deal that I hadn't signed my name on the thing.
He ended up getting fired later on for slugging another student up the back of the head.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Ah, the joys of the Northern Maine school system in those days!
Manchu wrote:I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. The tapes could be destroyed if no evidence came out of them.
In my opinion, though, the father should have taken his concerns to the authorities, rather than YouTube. He has only managed to alienate half of the DakkaDakka OT forum, and that won't help his son at all.
Wrong. If it is determined the collection was illegal (and I strongly suspect it was) it becomes useless as evidence, publishing it exacerbates the situation, and opens Daddy up to criminal and civil lawsuits which won't be good for his family.
There were other, legal, ways to adress the issue.
Or do you believe it is okay to break the law if you think you have a good reason?
Is it breaking the law if you have a lawful excuse?
If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
I don't see how this is possible. Who exactly would be suing him, and what for?
Furthermore, what kind of damages could be claimed that would bankrupt him?
The 'teachers' in this have obviously lost their interest in actually teaching. They are talking in front of the children in the same manner two workers might discuss matters in a production line. They have forgotten the important task they are being paid to do.
Also, harsh and aggressive behavior as demonstrated in the sound recording, including the name calling, are especially damaging to those affected with autism. I have had little interaction with autistic children but I've had a good deal of time with autistic adults and they can be very susceptible to ambient attitude and hostility.
The people responsible should be struck off from ever teaching again.
They called a 10 year old child with autism a bastard, to his face.
You are seriously wondering why this guy is fethed off? Him venting on youtube is personal catharsis, it's letting off steam on a blog. They've been trying to figure out what's wrong with the child and it turns out it's the people they're handing him over to to take care of him.
Frazzled, mate, if it was Connie, you'd be gunning for bear by now. If your girl had been spoken to like that by teachers, in loco parentis, paid professionals, you'd be slapping them with a lawsuit sooner than you can say 'noone abuses my child and sees the morn'.
frgsinwntr wrote:I teach physics in a public school system. That said... there are MANY teachers that aren't professional or should be fired. HOWEVER... you get what you pay for. If you pay teachers poorly... you get poor teachers (both meanings meant here).
I may be moving onto another career soon however... as even after 6 years into the job (with a glowing record btw!), I don't make enough to support my wife/child in this state while paying back loans for the bachelors and masters degree.
You know what they say frigs...those that can't do....teach.
MeanGreenStompa wrote:The 'teachers' in this have obviously lost their interest in actually teaching. They are talking in front of the children in the same manner two workers might discuss matters in a production line. They have forgotten the important task they are being paid to do.
Also, harsh and aggressive behavior as demonstrated in the sound recording, including the name calling, are especially damaging to those affected with autism. I have had little interaction with autistic children but I've had a good deal of time with autistic adults and they can be very susceptible to ambient attitude and hostility.
The people responsible should be struck off from ever teaching again.
They called a 10 year old child with autism a bastard, to his face.
You are seriously wondering why this guy is fethed off? Him venting on youtube is personal catharsis, it's letting off steam on a blog. They've been trying to figure out what's wrong with the child and it turns out it's the people they're handing him over to to take care of him.
Frazzled, mate, if it was Connie, you'd be gunning for bear by now. If your girl had been spoken to like that by teachers, in loco parentis, paid professionals, you'd be slapping them with a lawsuit sooner than you can say 'noone abuses my child and sees the morn'.
You speak the truth on all points and in truth I agree. You mess with GC and you better have guns drawn and aiming for the door because I'm coming with a shotgun and pliers, and Hell is coming with me.
True tale. Last year, we received a call that some punk had sucker punched the Boy on a band trip. Went up there, promised not to staart anything to the Wife but as soon as I got there I started tearing the place apart looking for the kid. they rushed the kid out the back before I could get to him. I used to break bricks with my head for fun (explains a lot). I was going to eat the skin from his bones. Wife didn'tsay a thing. Psycho attack dog for the family is what she hired me on for.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Sadly yes.
The way I figure Frazz is that he is 50% speaking out of true conviction, the other 50% is pure trolling.
I have yet to be completely certain which is which though
Frazzled wrote:
True tale. Last year, we received a call that some punk had sucker punched the Boy on a band trip. Went up there, promised not to staart anything to the Wife but as soon as I got there I started tearing the place apart looking for the kid. they rushed the kid out the back before I could get to him. I used to break bricks with my head for fun (explains a lot). I was going to eat the skin from his bones. Wife didn'tsay a thing. Psycho attack dog for the family is what she hired me on for.
Frazzled wrote:
Oh jeez another whiny helicopter parent.
If you don't like it, quit your belly aching and take care of your own kid, and quit making me pay for it and wasting the valuable time and incredibly expensive resources on your mouthbreathing waste of skin (after all he's related to you). Loser.
...are you for real?
Sadly yes.
The way I figure Frazz is that he is 50% speaking out of true conviction, the other 50% is pure trolling.
I have yet to be completely certain which is which though
As soon as you figure it out, remind me.
25% making fun of people deserving to be made fun of (not dakkaites), 25% having a good time, 25% advocating the greatness of Texas/wiener dogs, 25% having a point somewhere in my head.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
generalgrog wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
True tale. Last year, we received a call that some punk had sucker punched the Boy on a band trip. Went up there, promised not to staart anything to the Wife but as soon as I got there I started tearing the place apart looking for the kid. they rushed the kid out the back before I could get to him. I used to break bricks with my head for fun (explains a lot). I was going to eat the skin from his bones. Wife didn'tsay a thing. Psycho attack dog for the family is what she hired me on for.
UMMM Yeahhh......
GG
If you understood what the wife had been through before Frazzled's wiener bag of GET OFF MY LAWN you'd understand.
I have to agree with this guy. 2 Hours a day I'm in a room with autistic children (See: I have a severe memory problem and cannot do homework for gak due to emotional trauma and the memory issues, so I need the help) and they can get very depressed at times. When a teacher says something to the class in general that's negative, the students take it hard.
So, imagine a child that has such high emotions that he will cry if you breathe on him wrong. Now introduce an donkey-cave to the equation.
See why I want to throttle this teacher?
And to all those who posted complaints about how he's a whiney donkey-cave; perhaps look at the date the video went up and look at the date when it went viral.
CptJake wrote:
Or do you believe it is okay to break the law if you think you have a good reason? If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
First, I'm fairly certain everyone believes its alright to break the law given good reason.
Second, no, you don't need to be willing to bear the legal consequences of your actions. It might help, but it isn't necessary.
When he said: "She stabbed him...." I thought: Omg, I didn't think they would actually stab him!
When he said: "...With words." I thought: shut the up, and, LOL.
What an overdramatic, illigally-wiring, incredibly-whiny helicopter parent! Beer is for troubles, not a long, whining youtube!
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Frazzled wrote:
True tale. Last year, we received a call that some punk had sucker punched the Boy on a band trip. Went up there, promised not to staart anything to the Wife but as soon as I got there I started tearing the place apart looking for the kid. they rushed the kid out the back before I could get to him. I used to break bricks with my head for fun (explains a lot). I was going to eat the skin from his bones. Wife didn'tsay a thing. Psycho attack dog for the family is what she hired me on for.
Oooh,
Just joking, I would have done the same however in that situation.
Manchu wrote:I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. The tapes could be destroyed if no evidence came out of them.
In my opinion, though, the father should have taken his concerns to the authorities, rather than YouTube. He has only managed to alienate half of the DakkaDakka OT forum, and that won't help his son at all.
Wrong. If it is determined the collection was illegal (and I strongly suspect it was) it becomes useless as evidence, publishing it exacerbates the situation, and opens Daddy up to criminal and civil lawsuits which won't be good for his family.
There were other, legal, ways to adress the issue.
Or do you believe it is okay to break the law if you think you have a good reason? If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
Do you consider that the supposed charge of taping someone without their permission is more serious than the supposed charge of child abuse?
Add in that MUCH of what he transcribed and played on YouTube were not even conversations directed at the kids, let alone his kid, but instead conversations between the teacher and teacher aid and I think he screwed the pooch on this and should be hammered for it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hazardous Harry wrote:
CptJake wrote:
Kilkrazy wrote:
Manchu wrote:I am wondering how violation in fact of a code of conduct can justify the dad wiring his son before knowing of the violation. If the boy's teachers had not in fact "stabbed him with words" would the father's behavior be unjustified?
The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. The tapes could be destroyed if no evidence came out of them.
In my opinion, though, the father should have taken his concerns to the authorities, rather than YouTube. He has only managed to alienate half of the DakkaDakka OT forum, and that won't help his son at all.
Wrong. If it is determined the collection was illegal (and I strongly suspect it was) it becomes useless as evidence, publishing it exacerbates the situation, and opens Daddy up to criminal and civil lawsuits which won't be good for his family.
There were other, legal, ways to adress the issue.
Or do you believe it is okay to break the law if you think you have a good reason?
Is it breaking the law if you have a lawful excuse?
If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
I don't see how this is possible. Who exactly would be suing him, and what for?
Furthermore, what kind of damages could be claimed that would bankrupt him?
He didn't have a 'lawful excuse' and yes it is breaking the law.
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hazardous Harry wrote:
Is it breaking the law if you have a lawful excuse?
If your reasons are that good you need to be willing to accept the consequences of your actions. In this case, that means Daddy must be willing possibly serve time and bankrupt his family because he was suspicious of a teacher.
I don't see how this is possible. Who exactly would be suing him, and what for?
Furthermore, what kind of damages could be claimed that would bankrupt him?
He didn;t have a 'lawful excuse' and yes it is breaking the law.
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
TheRobotLol wrote:When he said: "She stabbed him...." I thought: Omg, I didn't think they would actually stab him!
When he said: "...With words." I thought: shut the up, and, LOL.
What an overdramatic, illigally-wiring, incredibly-whiny helicopter parent! Beer is for troubles, not a long, whining youtube!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Frazzled wrote:
True tale. Last year, we received a call that some punk had sucker punched the Boy on a band trip. Went up there, promised not to staart anything to the Wife but as soon as I got there I started tearing the place apart looking for the kid. they rushed the kid out the back before I could get to him. I used to break bricks with my head for fun (explains a lot). I was going to eat the skin from his bones. Wife didn'tsay a thing. Psycho attack dog for the family is what she hired me on for.
Oooh,
Just joking, I would have done the same however in that situation.
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
Wiretapping. In many states in the US, it is illegal to record someone's conversation/images without their permission.
I ate some questionable fried chicken yesterday. Gave me an upset stomach. One might say that they 'stabbed me with chicken'.
generalgrog wrote:
frgsinwntr wrote:I teach physics in a public school system. That said... there are MANY teachers that aren't professional or should be fired. HOWEVER... you get what you pay for. If you pay teachers poorly... you get poor teachers (both meanings meant here).
I may be moving onto another career soon however... as even after 6 years into the job (with a glowing record btw!), I don't make enough to support my wife/child in this state while paying back loans for the bachelors and masters degree.
You know what they say frigs...those that can't do....teach.
GG
And those that can't teach seem to think it's easy. I've never understood why.
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
Wiretapping. In many states in the US, it is illegal to record someone's conversation/images without their permission.
So is there a Right to Privacy in the US? Or is this some other issue?
In either case, what prosecutor in their right mind would pursue this?
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
Wiretapping. In many states in the US, it is illegal to record someone's conversation/images without their permission.
So is there a Right to Privacy in the US? Or is this some other issue?
In either case, what prosecutor in their right mind would pursue this?
More right to privay (I think). I'm not very informed in this area.
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
Wiretapping. In many states in the US, it is illegal to record someone's conversation/images without their permission.
So is there a Right to Privacy in the US? Or is this some other issue?
In either case, what prosecutor in their right mind would pursue this?
A prosecutor doing his/her job, defending the rights of the citizens of thier state, even the ones you don't like.
The crime is:
NJPS-2A:156A-3.  Interception, disclosure, use of wire, electronic, oral communication; violationÂ
  a.  Purposely intercepts, endeavors to intercept, or procures any other person to intercept or endeavor to intercept any wire, electronic or oral communication; ...
shall be guilty of a crime of the third degree.
Kilkrazy wrote:The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing.
I suppose the question is what makes a suspicion reasonable? I reckon parents and educators might have drastically different ideas about that.
CptJake wrote:More serious has no relevance. Each is illegal.
I take it then that you would not park in a no parking zone in order to prevent a weapon of mass destruction from being released.
I take it you like to troll. Honestly I expect more from a Mod (though I am learning my expectations of Mods may be too high).
Of course I would park in a no parking zone to prevent innocents being killed. I would also not be surprised if I got a ticket for doing so and would pay it.
CptJake wrote:
The teachers could sue, more likely their union or the school board (I would bet the union). Even if almost no damages were awarded a court case would cost tens of thousands of dollars (assuming the family hires a competent lawyer). That is just a civil trial. If he actually got brought up on criminal charges he potentially loses freedom, his family loses his income while he is playing fish, and unless he goes with a public defender he still has legal fees.
What law has he broken?
Also, the school can't sue because they feel like it. There has to be a matter for the court to decide on (like whether to impose an injuction or award damages). He wouldn't even need a decent lawyer to get this thrown out of court, the judge simply wouldn't allow it.
Wiretapping. In many states in the US, it is illegal to record someone's conversation/images without their permission.
So is there a Right to Privacy in the US? Or is this some other issue?
In either case, what prosecutor in their right mind would pursue this?
A prosecutor doing his/her job, defending the rights of the citizens of thier state, even the ones you don't like.
The crime is:
NJPS-2A:156A-3.  Interception, disclosure, use of wire, electronic, oral communication; violationÂ
  a.  Purposely intercepts, endeavors to intercept, or procures any other person to intercept or endeavor to intercept any wire, electronic or oral communication; ...
shall be guilty of a crime of the third degree.
Of course if we want to play "I can Google laws and play pretend-lawyer on the internet" then I present the very next section of the same law that you quoted:
2A:156A-4. Lawful interception activities; exceptions
4. It shall not be unlawful under this act for:
.....
d. A person not acting under color of law to intercept a wire, electronic or oral communication, where such person is a party to the communication or one of the parties to the communication has given prior consent to such interception unless such communication is intercepted or used for the purpose of committing any criminal or tortious act in violation of the Constitution or laws of the United States or of this State or for the purpose of committing any other injurious act......
Look at me, I can google too
Of course there is also the argument that a conversation you have in public in front of a bunch of children does not mean that you have an expectation of privacy. Public conversations are public knowledge. Thinking "these kids are too dumb to be able to tell anybody else what we said" is not going to be a very good privacy defense.
Kilkrazy wrote:The primary concern in an education system is the well-being of the children. I believe that ethically justifies taping if there is reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing.
I suppose the question is what makes a suspicion reasonable? I reckon parents and educators might have drastically different ideas about that.
I find it humorous to think that thats the primary concern of an educational system. I find most organizations' primary concerns are with protecting and/or expanding their power and employee count. Having been to the Texas equivalent of the DMV (also know as THE GATEWAY TO HECK) 3 times in the last two weeks I can vouch that their primary concern definitely was not efficiently meeting the needs of their customers.
I don't think getting a crap wage gives anyone an excuse to abuse a disabled child.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
d-usa wrote:
2A:156A-4. Lawful interception activities; exceptions
4. It shall not be unlawful under this act for:
.....
d. A person not acting under color of law to intercept a wire, electronic or oral communication, where such person is a party to the communication or one of the parties to the communication has given prior consent to such interception unless such communication is intercepted or used for the purpose of committing any criminal or tortious act in violation of the Constitution or laws of the United States or of this State or for the purpose of committing any other injurious act......
Look at me, I can google too
Of course there is also the argument that a conversation you have in public in front of a bunch of children does not mean that you have an expectation of privacy. Public conversations are public knowledge. Thinking "these kids are too dumb to be able to tell anybody else what we said" is not going to be a very good privacy defense.
Well that does seem to clinch it, the father hasn't broken the law here.
It depends on school district. I don't know how it is in Canada East but in the US the public school system is broken into local school districts with different pay standards - just as their locales have different economics standards.
Many studies have show that the US is an excellent lab experiment in proving tacher salaries are almost completely dissasociated with performance. Many of the best paying union strong school districts (NY and Washington DC as an example), have some of the most horrific educational rates. of course, teachers are just the tip of the educational spear as it were, and its like waiters. The problems with the food aren't the waiters, its the crappy kitchen and management.
Of course you don't make 6 figures right away, and you don't make that everywhere.
GG
So you'd accept that most teachers earn in the low 5-figures?
I don't think teachers make a bad living me. I mean, I know your lass IS one, but are you letting that cloud your opinion? How much do you think she should be getting?
Alll of the public sector works the same, it was the same in the military and it was the same working for the city. You start low, and it goes up every year.
They start on £20,000 a year, and it goes up every year, ending on £29,596 or something after five years.
As a young bootneck in Northern Ireland I was earning £14,000, it went up about 2,500 a year until I was capped at level 8, then I got promoted to corporal and was on about £23,000 and I was toppers with cash!
Teachers SHOULD earn more than soldiers due to their educational qualifications. They deserve more than us uneducated thugs (but Policemen and Firemen fething shouldn't however!) but its wings and roundabouts. Being a teacher is an awesome job, something like 128 days off a year?! I think its why so many bloody mates of mine from school do it!
I think the government have it about bang on.
Teachers earn a fair wage considering all the perks and time off, soldiers earn a fair wage considering they volunteer in the first place, firemen and coppers are slightly overpaid but its not too much worth dripping about. Public sector workers in the UK get a fair wage, a fair salary, fair time off and a fair pension, and at the end of the day, this country is full of greedy bastards who whinge too much. My aunt is a Nurse.. Jesus, the woman does nothing but whine. And Snells (I was his best man for those who dont know me and Alby!) wife is a nurse and she certainly feels she does alright out of it.
You don't think its about right how it is? I certainly don't think we should bump up teachers salaries much higher, or everyone in the private sector will start going "feth this! Im off to be a teacher!"
Long story short mate, public sector workers in the UK are treated more than fairly.
Of course you don't make 6 figures right away, and you don't make that everywhere.
GG
So you'd accept that most teachers earn in the low 5-figures?
I don't think teachers make a bad living me. I mean, I know your lass IS one, but are you letting that cloud your opinion? How much do you think she should be getting?
Alll of the public sector works the same, it was the same in the military and it was the same working for the city. You start low, and it goes up every year.
They start on £20,000 a year, and it goes up every year, ending on £29,596 or something after five years.
As a young bootneck in Northern Ireland I was earning £14,000, it went up about 2,500 a year until I was capped at level 8, then I got promoted to corporal and was on about £23,000 and I was toppers with cash!
Teachers SHOULD earn more than soldiers due to their educational qualifications. They deserve more than us uneducated thugs (but Policemen and Firemen fething shouldn't however!) but its wings and roundabouts. Being a teacher is an awesome job, something like 128 days off a year?! I think its why so many bloody mates of mine from school do it!
I think the government have it about bang on.
Teachers earn a fair wage considering all the perks and time off, soldiers earn a fair wage considering they volunteer in the first place, firemen and coppers are slightly overpaid but its not too much worth dripping about. Public sector workers in the UK get a fair wage, a fair salary, fair time off and a fair pension, and at the end of the day, this country is full of greedy bastards who whinge too much. My aunt is a Nurse.. Jesus, the woman does nothing but whine. And Snells (I was his best man for those who dont know me and Alby!) wife is a nurse and she certainly feels she does alright out of it.
You don't think its about right how it is? I certainly don't think we should bump up teachers salaries much higher, or everyone in the private sector will start going "feth this! Im off to be a teacher!"
Long story short mate, public sector workers in the UK are treated more than fairly.
You have heard about this thing called the cost of living right?
each year the cost of living goes up around 3-5%.
That means if you do not get a raise every year, you are actually getting paid less, every year.
You have heard about this thing called the cost of living right?
each year the cost of living goes up around 3-5%.
That means if you do not get a raise every year, you are actually getting paid less, every year.
Yes, and government workers pay scales rise with inflation each and every year. In the armed forces it was always a few percent higher than actual inflation. In 1999 Level 5 was 15,565, In 2000 level 5 was 16,880, etc etc. The levels and bands you are on rise slightly each year.
Needless to say, I have of course heard about it, and so has the government.
You have heard about this thing called the cost of living right?
each year the cost of living goes up around 3-5%.
That means if you do not get a raise every year, you are actually getting paid less, every year.
Yes, and government workers pay scales rise with inflation each and every year. In the armed forces it was always a few percent higher than actual inflation. In 1999 Level 5 was 15,565, In 2000 level 5 was 16,880, etc etc. The levels and bands you are on rise slightly each year.
Needless to say, I have of course heard about it, and so has the government.
well your country must support its military more than the US does. every year the military raise is consistently below the COL.
malfred wrote:Some scales cap and do not include COL.
Not in the UK they don't. There is a cap at a rank for example (Say a level 10 Major or something thats done more than ten years at the same rank) but it always rises with inflation each year.
I agree with Matty, my wages are fair. Most of my complaints are about my working conditions, not my wages and perks (like holidays) which I am happy with.
Main bugbears in teaching:
Lack of respect from students and parents.
Piles of stupid paperwork to fill in for trivial things.
Too much interference from politicians and "Ofsted", which I think damages education in Britain quite a lot.
Lack of support from management.
And generally I guess I am unhappy about the amount of marking I have to do, but I guess no coppers are happy that they have to get shouted and spat at by scum and no soldiers are delighted to have to move through areas that might have been landmined, so I'll shut up and bear it
Da Boss wrote:I agree with Matty, my wages are fair. Most of my complaints are about my working conditions, not my wages and perks (like holidays) which I am happy with.
Main bugbears in teaching:
Lack of respect from students and parents.
Piles of stupid paperwork to fill in for trivial things.
Too much interference from politicians and "Ofsted", which I think damages education in Britain quite a lot.
Lack of support from management.
And generally I guess I am unhappy about the amount of marking I have to do, but I guess no coppers are happy that they have to get shouted and spat at by scum and no soldiers are delighted to have to move through areas that might have been landmined, so I'll shut up and bear it
Lack of respect from students who know the management wont do anything drives me nuts.
We had a student recently, who because he made it past November, the management refused to kick him from the course as it would affect the statistics. Even though all the lecturers/teachers/assistants/canteenstaff said the pupil wouldn't co-operate, doesn't do work, and abuses staff, management was all "Nah, keep him".
So we were forced to keep him (and others like him), and now he's just quit by himself (not officially or anything, he just doesn't turn up and hasn't handed in any work). Management scrambled to try get him a "reduced" qualification from the work he'd already done, but the problem was he hadn't actually done it, just lied about doing it. When they contacted me recently about getting the work he'd done for me I just said "What work? He never submitted". Bugger gets nothing.
I can imagine loads of things being gak about being a teacher. I'm not one for that reason, I can imagine how some of the little gakkers behave safe in the knowledge you cant dragonpunch them.
But as I said, that's life, what's the point in whinging about all the little things, that's like soldiers saying "the pay and holiday is alright but I hate the fething Taliban" or firemen saying "I like all the money and time off but I wish things wouldnt fething light!" or Nurses saying "It was fine till sick people showed up"
Pros vs Cons, its a decent life being a teacher. Plenty of leisure time, and an ample salary.
It beats my last job. (spunk mopper in a Dutch spank booth)
Da Boss wrote:I agree with Matty, my wages are fair. Most of my complaints are about my working conditions, not my wages and perks (like holidays) which I am happy with.
Main bugbears in teaching:
Lack of respect from students and parents.
Piles of stupid paperwork to fill in for trivial things.
Too much interference from politicians and "Ofsted", which I think damages education in Britain quite a lot.
Lack of support from management.
And generally I guess I am unhappy about the amount of marking I have to do, but I guess no coppers are happy that they have to get shouted and spat at by scum and no soldiers are delighted to have to move through areas that might have been landmined, so I'll shut up and bear it
I'm a secondary school student and to be honest I agree with everything you're saying although I don't know much about the paperwork . Quite honestly I'm disgusted at the things that students have done to teachers. Pretty much everyday I hear students shouting/swearing at teachers. Someone I know threw a chair at a teacher. Some parents aren't much better either, also shouting and/or swearing at teachers for something 99% of the time is not the teacher's fault. However a friend of mine got told by a teacher when they were six that one of their parents could not be her real parent as her parents aren't married. Of course there are some things that teachers shouldn't be allowed to do, but most of the things that teachers are blamed for aren't there fault. However what happened in the video is most certainly the teacher's fault.
Da Boss wrote:I agree with Matty, my wages are fair. Most of my complaints are about my working conditions, not my wages and perks (like holidays) which I am happy with.
Main bugbears in teaching:
Lack of respect from students and parents.
Piles of stupid paperwork to fill in for trivial things.
Too much interference from politicians and "Ofsted", which I think damages education in Britain quite a lot.
Lack of support from management.
And generally I guess I am unhappy about the amount of marking I have to do, but I guess no coppers are happy that they have to get shouted and spat at by scum and no soldiers are delighted to have to move through areas that might have been landmined, so I'll shut up and bear it
I'm a secondary school student and to be honest I agree with everything you're saying although I don't know much about the paperwork . Quite honestly I'm disgusted at the things that students have done to teachers. Pretty much everyday I hear students shouting/swearing at teachers. Someone I know threw a chair at a teacher. Some parents aren't much better either, also shouting and/or swearing at teachers for something 99% of the time is not the teacher's fault. However a friend of mine got told by a teacher when they were six that one of their parents could not be her real parent as her parents aren't married. Of course there are some things that teachers shouldn't be allowed to do, but most of the things that teachers are blamed for aren't there fault. However what happened in the video is most certainly the teacher's fault.
Under an enlightened Frazzled adminstration :
*Swear at a teacher. Expelled from school.
*Raise your voice to a teacher. Suspended from school.
*Throw a chair at teacher. 1) teacher and support staff have free reign to Taze Him Bro until the batteries run out; then 2) They are auto expelled; 3) The police come, charge him with Battery to a Teacher (new Felony I), commence a repeat of #1 and then take the delinquent away.
Da Boss wrote:I agree with Matty, my wages are fair. Most of my complaints are about my working conditions, not my wages and perks (like holidays) which I am happy with.
Main bugbears in teaching:
Lack of respect from students and parents.
Piles of stupid paperwork to fill in for trivial things.
Too much interference from politicians and "Ofsted", which I think damages education in Britain quite a lot.
Lack of support from management.
And generally I guess I am unhappy about the amount of marking I have to do, but I guess no coppers are happy that they have to get shouted and spat at by scum and no soldiers are delighted to have to move through areas that might have been landmined, so I'll shut up and bear it
I'm a secondary school student and to be honest I agree with everything you're saying although I don't know much about the paperwork . Quite honestly I'm disgusted at the things that students have done to teachers. Pretty much everyday I hear students shouting/swearing at teachers. Someone I know threw a chair at a teacher. Some parents aren't much better either, also shouting and/or swearing at teachers for something 99% of the time is not the teacher's fault. However a friend of mine got told by a teacher when they were six that one of their parents could not be her real parent as her parents aren't married. Of course there are some things that teachers shouldn't be allowed to do, but most of the things that teachers are blamed for aren't there fault. However what happened in the video is most certainly the teacher's fault.
Under an enlightened Frazzled adminstration :
*Swear at a teacher. Expelled from school.
*Raise your voice to a teacher. Suspended from school.
*Throw a chair at teacher. 1) teacher and support staff have free reign to Taze Him Bro until the batteries run out; then 2) They are auto expelled; 3) The police come, charge him with Battery to a Teacher (new Felony I), commence a repeat of #1 and then take the delinquent away.
Evilledz wrote:Some parents aren't much better either, also shouting and/or swearing at teachers for something 99% of the time is not the teacher's fault. However a friend of mine got told by a teacher when they were six that one of their parents could not be her real parent as her parents aren't married. Of course there are some things that teachers shouldn't be allowed to do, but most of the things that teachers are blamed for aren't there fault. However what happened in the video is most certainly the teacher's fault.
Lol, bad children, bad parents?
Consider me surprised.
And yes, I don't blame any of what down in that video on the parents or the students.
The 'teachers' in this have obviously lost their interest in actually teaching.
It isn't surprising when teachers get paid absolute gak.
Not true..in all cases. Some teachers make 6 figures.
GG
Where are they at? I would like to put in for a transfer! I started out at $26,500 and I believe I can cap out around $50,000 with a Phd.
You all want to some something crazy? I have been teaching a class of six students who have autism for 5 years now. I could not even watch that video in the OP because I am so sick of the whiny parents I see everyday. In my area I am one of like 3 people (out of 10 positions for self contained Autism classrooms in my county) that has stayed in their special needs teacher position. Most of the time these positions have substitutes in them for years at a time or a certified general education teacher working on a permit until they can get a general education class.
Not all of my parents are like this, but I have met quite a few who are itching to find something wrong with the school system.
Any ways I do not want to leave you all with a bunch of negatives comments. I did get some good news today. My grant that will allow me to purchase Ipads for my classroom was approved today!
The 'teachers' in this have obviously lost their interest in actually teaching.
It isn't surprising when teachers get paid absolute gak.
Not true..in all cases. Some teachers make 6 figures.
GG
Where are they at? I would like to put in for a transfer! I started out at $26,500 and I believe I can cap out around $50,000 with a Phd.
You all want to some something crazy? I have been teaching a class of six students who have autism for 5 years now. I could not even watch that video in the OP because I am so sick of the whiny parents I see everyday. In my area I am one of like 3 people (out of 10 positions for self contained Autism classrooms in my county) that has stayed in their special needs teacher position. Most of the time these positions have substitutes in them for years at a time or a certified general education teacher working on a permit until they can get a general education class.
Not all of my parents are like this, but I have met quite a few who are itching to find something wrong with the school system.
Any ways I do not want to leave you all with a bunch of negatives comments. I did get some good news today. My grant that will allow me to purchase Ipads for my classroom was approved today!
In Illinois there are teachers who make 6 figures because they work overtime
in their final years leading up to retirement AND they work in a public school in
wealthier districts of the state.
(New Trier, Rahm Emanuel's alma mater, for example)
My friend quit Chicago Public and went to teach at the Latin School of
Chicago. She took a 10k pay cut but in return she gets almost 0 discipline
problems.
I'm okay with what I make, but only because of where I work. It's not the
best place in the city, but it's a vast cry from the worst. There are people who
teach at the worst schools and have success. They are paid the same as me. If
I were them, I'd be frustrated with that level of pay for what they are tasked to
do.
I hate unprofessional teachers/educational workers. Often it seems like one must demonstrably hate children before you can be hired as a school bus driver.
At the same time, I also hate helicopter parents. I'm in a bit of a dilemma.
Monster Rain wrote:I hate unprofessional teachers/educational workers.
I hate unprofessional fething EVERYTHING! I feel a rant coming on....
Maybe the RM fethed my priorities up since I took the Queens shilling, but I do my job to the very best of my ability, and that would be the case if I worked in Macdonalds or swept streets. I wouldnt go on the sick, I wouldnt be late for work, I wouldn't turn up hungover or stoned and I would be dressed correctly. You get all that done and your 90% of the way there.
At the end of the day a job works both ways, they give you money and vacation time and your part of the bargain is you do your fething job properly. Seriously, mother fethers walking around Macdonalds with their thumbs up their asses piss me off as well, If I worked in there I would be all over that gak. If you dont want to do the job properly you should feth off and do something else. Lack of professionalism disgusts me, I dont care if you work as a spunk mopper in a Dutch porno theatre.
The staggering ineptitude of pretty much half of the world is what made me utterly confident I could leave the military and find gainful employment, and funny thing it took me less than a week. Ive since had 3 other offers, and an extra job I turned down because 1 job pays enough, which I didnt even ask for, they saw my CV, spoke to my manager and then phoned me.
Its why ive got not time for fethers like my missus brother or her best mate. If you regularly complain about "bad luck", say things are "unfair" or you "tried your best" and "nobody cares"
Its not any of that, its because your a pathetic self entitled fething loser. Get a grip and sort your life out.
As John Patrick Mason SAS says, .. well. Ive sigged it.
Monster Rain wrote:I hate unprofessional teachers/educational workers.
I hate unprofessional fething EVERYTHING! I feel a rant coming on....
Maybe the RM fethed my priorities up since I took the Queens shilling, but I do my job to the very best of my ability, and that would be the case if I worked in Macdonalds or swept streets. I wouldnt go on the sick, I wouldnt be late for work, I wouldn't turn up hungover or stoned and I would be dressed correctly. You get all that done and your 90% of the way there.
At the end of the day a job works both ways, they give you money and vacation time and your part of the bargain is you do your fething job properly. Seriously, mother fethers walking around Macdonalds with their thumbs up their asses piss me off as well, If I worked in there I would be all over that gak. If you dont want to do the job properly you should feth off and do something else. Lack of professionalism disgusts me, I dont care if you work as a spunk mopper in a Dutch porno theatre.
The staggering ineptitude of pretty much half of the world is what made me utterly confident I could leave the military and find gainful employment, and funny thing it took me less than a week. Ive since had 3 other offers, and an extra job I turned down because 1 job pays enough, which I didnt even ask for, they saw my CV, spoke to my manager and then phoned me.
Its why ive got not time for fethers like my missus brother or her best mate. If you regularly complain about "bad luck", say things are "unfair" or you "tried your best" and "nobody cares"
Its not any of that, its because your a pathetic self entitled fething loser. Get a grip and sort your life out.
As John Patrick Mason SAS says, .. well. Ive sigged it.
I agree with the orange.. and disagree with the rest
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Frazzled wrote:
Albatross wrote:Some professors, perhaps.
It depends on school district. I don't know how it is in Canada East but in the US the public school system is broken into local school districts with different pay standards - just as their locales have different economics standards.
Many studies have show that the US is an excellent lab experiment in proving tacher salaries are almost completely dissasociated with performance. Many of the best paying union strong school districts (NY and Washington DC as an example), have some of the most horrific educational rates. of course, teachers are just the tip of the educational spear as it were, and its like waiters. The problems with the food aren't the waiters, its the crappy kitchen and management.
you know... as a teacher i 100% agree with Frazzled in almost every post on this topic... I must be feeling sick... or... becoming... old and crotchety.... GEEEEEEEEEEEEET OFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF MYYYY LAWN
Its why ive got not time for fethers like my missus brother or her best mate. If you regularly complain about "bad luck", say things are "unfair" or you "tried your best" and "nobody cares"
Its not any of that, its because your a pathetic self entitled fething loser. Get a grip and sort your life out.
As John Patrick Mason SAS says, .. well. Ive sigged it.
I have to disagree with this. Plenty of people are disadvantaged from the beginning. Here, I'll come up with a quick list.
1. African Americans, Asians, Middle Eastern People and Hispanics.
2. Women and Transgender People.
3. People who grew up very, very, very poor in bad neighborhoods.
4. Physically disabled people.
5. Absolutely hideous people.
6. That guy who was struck by lightning 11 times.
7. Mentally disabled people.
I'm a white male living in a nice neighborhood in a nice city in a 1st world country. My dad is a lawyer and my mom is a psychologist. So I'm not complaining. I'd be a complete doosh if I was. However, there are people that have the right to complain. Life ain't fair and don't try to pretend it is. My extreme privilege is good evidence of this.
Its why ive got not time for fethers like my missus brother or her best mate. If you regularly complain about "bad luck", say things are "unfair" or you "tried your best" and "nobody cares"
Its not any of that, its because your a pathetic self entitled fething loser. Get a grip and sort your life out.
As John Patrick Mason SAS says, .. well. Ive sigged it.
I have to disagree with this. Plenty of people are disadvantaged from the beginning. Here, I'll come up with a quick list.
1. African Americans, Asians, Middle Eastern People and Hispanics.
2. Women and Transgender People.
3. People who grew up very, very, very poor in bad neighborhoods.
4. Physically disabled people.
5. Absolutely hideous people.
6. That guy who was struck by lightning 11 times.
7. Mentally disabled people.
I'm a white male living in a nice neighborhood in a nice city in a 1st world country. My dad is a lawyer and my mom is a psychologist. So I'm not complaining. I'd be a complete doosh if I was. However, there are people that have the right to complain. Life ain't fair and don't try to pretend it is. My extreme privilege is good evidence of this.
Oh come on, Im on about your average Joe clearly, my missus best mate who is spoilt rotten and wont work even though she is 26, or her brother who lives with his mom and doesnt work and is 30. Im quite clearly not on about actually disadvantaged people.. gak, if you want to do that I can add a few hundred more onto your list!
1. Men with their hands on their shoulders
2.Women with three tits
3. Children with a cojoined sibling growing from their ass.
I mean, was there any need to even write your list? Im not gonna shout at someone with Downs syndrome "Go work in a mine!"
I agree with mattyrm
I have some real lazy fethers.
My best mate refuses to get a job because he doesn't want to work in the food industry.
Or someone at my work who always showed up late, or one that never worked properly. Hell my work said i was a god send because i did my work right.
I have always hated those guys. It may just be the way my parents raised me, but I always figured that a job is your job and you should do the best that you can when you do it.
Feth, even when I was still 17 and working at the McD's I would get other teenagers that just did nothing but slack off and never take their job seriously. If you tried to call them out on it the reply would always be "feth it, this is just McD's, it's a crap job so why should I care". It would just tick me off. I would always tell them "You care because it if your fething job. And even if it is a crappy job I am going to do it the best that I can and be proud in my work." Probably didn't carry much weight coming from a 17 year old guy, but at least it made me feel bether.
hotsauceman1 wrote:My best mate refuses to get a job because he doesn't want to work in the food industry.
Ah, yes. The old:
"There's no jobs!"
"You could work at that place, they're hiring."
"I would never work there!"
This is purely anecdotal, obviously, but everyone I know that "just can't find a job" is a complete jackass.
Yeah that chick I'm on about, she is unbelievable. She came to stay with us for a visit last year, and wound up staying for the full 12 weeks allowed on her visa. She is a nice looking lass so, I guess she has just gotten used to special treatment. I mean, if you can afford a 3 month holiday (and she finished school about two years ago) your getting funded. Her mom pays for her apartment in Pasadena, and in CA me and the missus went for dinner with her and her mother, and I said "Hey your place in Pasadena is awesome!" (It is! Its clean and pretty fancy, and right round the corner from Lucky Baldwins and that big ass gaming place on the corner) and right in front of her mom she is basically going "No Matty, its a dump.. I HATE it there.." In front of her bloody mother! And after she got back from England her Mom bought her a new car, but she complained to me about it being second hand even though it was some fancy Toyota that went for about $12,000, its just endless. And then she complains about not being able to find a job, but every single thing we suggest she goes "Ugh! Im not working there!"
I think the fethers just expect to start at the top. I mean she happily applies for a position as editor of a magazine with a 65k salary and when she doesn't get it then its always "Bad luck, unfair, tried my best, nobody cares" repeat till Matty leaves and goes to the pub.
And our lass has a brother thats identical, the blokes 30 and a total fething loser. He has been whinging at her all week about how he is depressed and he is in debt and he never gets any of the awesome jobs he applies for because its all too hard.
Basically I think as always, you need a happy medium. If you spoil a kid rotten the fether will never want to work, and if you give them nothing they will be toothless career doleys with more toes than teeth and 7 kids.
The balance seems to be, love your kids, but make the little bastards work for their allowance and their college fund.
Its why ive got not time for fethers like my missus brother or her best mate. If you regularly complain about "bad luck", say things are "unfair" or you "tried your best" and "nobody cares"
Its not any of that, its because your a pathetic self entitled fething loser. Get a grip and sort your life out.
As John Patrick Mason SAS says, .. well. Ive sigged it.
I have to disagree with this. Plenty of people are disadvantaged from the beginning. Here, I'll come up with a quick list.
1. African Americans, Asians, Middle Eastern People and Hispanics.
2. Women and Transgender People.
3. People who grew up very, very, very poor in bad neighborhoods.
4. Physically disabled people.
5. Absolutely hideous people.
6. That guy who was struck by lightning 11 times.
7. Mentally disabled people.
I'm a white male living in a nice neighborhood in a nice city in a 1st world country. My dad is a lawyer and my mom is a psychologist. So I'm not complaining. I'd be a complete doosh if I was. However, there are people that have the right to complain. Life ain't fair and don't try to pretend it is. My extreme privilege is good evidence of this.
Oh come on, Im on about your average Joe clearly, my missus best mate who is spoilt rotten and wont work even though she is 26, or her brother who lives with his mom and doesnt work and is 30. Im quite clearly not on about actually disadvantaged people.. gak, if you want to do that I can add a few hundred more onto your list!
1. Men with their hands on their shoulders
2.Women with three tits
3. Children with a cojoined sibling growing from their ass.
I mean, was there any need to even write your list? Im not gonna shout at someone with Downs syndrome "Go work in a mine!"
A woman with three tits is in no way disadvantaged. In fact she could readily find work and make six figures annually I would wager...
mattyrm wrote: Oh come on, Im on about your average Joe clearly, my missus best mate who is spoilt rotten and wont work even though she is 26, or her brother who lives with his mom and doesnt work and is 30. Im quite clearly not on about actually disadvantaged people.. gak, if you want to do that I can add a few hundred more onto your list!
1. Men with their hands on their shoulders
2.Women with three tits
3. Children with a cojoined sibling growing from their ass.
I mean, was there any need to even write your list? Im not gonna shout at someone with Downs syndrome "Go work in a mine!"
I apologize, I mistakenly thought you were one of those crazy 'poverty deniers' in the US.
hotsauceman1 wrote:My best mate refuses to get a job because he doesn't want to work in the food industry.
Ah, yes. The old:
"There's no jobs!"
"You could work at that place, they're hiring."
"I would never work there!"
This is purely anecdotal, obviously, but everyone I know that "just can't find a job" is a complete jackass.
Yeah that chick I'm on about, she is unbelievable. She came to stay with us for a visit last year, and wound up staying for the full 12 weeks allowed on her visa. She is a nice looking lass so, I guess she has just gotten used to special treatment. I mean, if you can afford a 3 month holiday (and she finished school about two years ago) your getting funded. Her mom pays for her apartment in Pasadena, and in CA me and the missus went for dinner with her and her mother, and I said "Hey your place in Pasadena is awesome!" (It is! Its clean and pretty fancy, and right round the corner from Lucky Baldwins and that big ass gaming place on the corner) and right in front of her mom she is basically going "No Matty, its a dump.. I HATE it there.." In front of her bloody mother! And after she got back from England her Mom bought her a new car, but she complained to me about it being second hand even though it was some fancy Toyota that went for about $12,000, its just endless. And then she complains about not being able to find a job, but every single thing we suggest she goes "Ugh! Im not working there!"
I think the fethers just expect to start at the top. I mean she happily applies for a position as editor of a magazine with a 65k salary and when she doesn't get it then its always "Bad luck, unfair, tried my best, nobody cares" repeat till Matty leaves and goes to the pub.
And our lass has a brother thats identical, the blokes 30 and a total fething loser. He has been whinging at her all week about how he is depressed and he is in debt and he never gets any of the awesome jobs he applies for because its all too hard.
Basically I think as always, you need a happy medium. If you spoil a kid rotten the fether will never want to work, and if you give them nothing they will be toothless career doleys with more toes than teeth and 7 kids.
The balance seems to be, love your kids, but make the little bastards work for their allowance and their college fund.
Or atleast teach the the value of hard work. Yeah, you shouldnt settle for any job sometimes but having unrealistic standards is just stupid.
then I would have thought. Defintely angling to sue.
