20774
Post by: pretre
TastyTaste on Blood of Kittens wrote:
With all the rumors flying around about Dark Angels and the bogus ones concerning Orks, I find it amazing that no one has mentioned anything about one codex that is in need of the most love. Before I talk about that, I want to add to the chorus that Dark Angels are heading our way Jan or Feb.
Now back to why you are reading this in the first place, the Black Templars, well I got some news for you!
And sadly, you’re probably not going to like it.
Earlier this year I was told that Black Templars would be getting the White Dwarf treatment aka like Sisters of Battle. Then earlier this month Robin Cruddace teased everyone a little bit by not confirming or denying they would get folded into the next Space Marine codex.
So after doing a bit of investigating I want to confirm that Black Templars are still on track for the White Dwarf treatment by summer 2013 at the latest. Now I do have one caveat: it could very well mean they are getting an “update” not a White Dwarf codex, but all I am hearing is a two issue White Dwarf codex to bring them in-line with 6th edition.
More importantly what changes are we are looking at?
While detailed specifics are hard to come by this is what I got so far.
Vows are gone, but are now folded into specific Black Templar Warlord Traits and have changed dramatically. Unique characters including the Emperor’s Champion will get specific ones.
The Emperors Champion is not required taking.
“No Pity, No Remorse, No Fear” & “Righteous Zeal” are Crusader & Zealot with various conditions. Expect various additional rules to kick in when Black Templars start dying.
“Abhor the Witch” is staying
Neophytes have their own unit lead by an Initiate (flip of Fluff and rules here a bit, but makes sense)
Rumored to be gone.
“They Shall know no Fear” Zealot to fill the gap my guess.
“Tank Hunters”
That is all I have for now, this one is still a bit away so will be interesting to see if anything changes as we get closer.
56307
Post by: unmercifulconker
Although I liked the idea that an initiate took on a neophyte as sort of a student, I dont mind the fluff change, makes sense to throw all recruits together and be 'taught' by an intiate or two to baptise them in war.
SOOOO happy we arent getting merged but whatever happens, the Templars will still and always will be the true messengers of the Emperor 
41664
Post by: ShatteredBlade
A white dwarf treatment for the templars? I'm glad that I decide to go with Dark Angels instead. I feel sorry for the Templars players.
20774
Post by: pretre
Better to get a WD treatment now and a codex later than nothing.
41664
Post by: ShatteredBlade
 pretre wrote:Better to get a WD treatment now and a codex later than nothing.
True though, I mean Blood Angels had their WD for a while before they recieved their latest codex. So it isn't all bad I guess.
14698
Post by: Lansirill
pretre wrote:Better to get a WD treatment now and a codex later than nothing.
As long as you find out about the WD treatment early enough to get the issues you need. Otherwise you're taking it up the ole' brown eye from Cap'n GW's coke nail.
20774
Post by: pretre
Well, now you know and knowing is half the battle!
8049
Post by: ArbitorIan
 ShatteredBlade wrote: pretre wrote:Better to get a WD treatment now and a codex later than nothing.
True though, I mean Blood Angels had their WD for a while before they recieved their latest codex. So it isn't all bad I guess.
True. And the Sisters WD codex isn't all that bad
20774
Post by: pretre
I imagine that the BT one will receive much the same degree of change as the Sisters one as well. More competitive, less variety and background.
56307
Post by: unmercifulconker
Clearly this WD treatment is a test of faith and only the true shall remain.
23695
Post by: J99Pwrangler
Humm, getting rid of tank hunters? Thats sad... But more people rely on that, and use Templars as a shooty army because of it.
Getting rid of our VOWs and going with Black Templar Warlord traits will be interesting as well. I wonder what they will have for traits then, and if we have to roll for them, or just chose to pick one.
All very interesting, but I will wait for the proof to come out.
7433
Post by: plastictrees
About time those johnny-come-lately's lost their codex privileges. Barely been around 15 years...think they need their own book...grumble grumble.
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
Tastytaste, always the bringer of bad news that people want to disbelieve but that turn out true.
pretre wrote:Better to get a WD treatment now and a codex later than nothing.
Splash release Codices are always a bad idea, esp. when they are used as an excuse to not update an army like with Sororitas.
20774
Post by: pretre
I respectively disagree. I think the SoB codex update was really important and helped out the army. I wish it was more widely available, but other than that it has been great.
51858
Post by: ArmageddonBorn
ShatteredBlade wrote:A white dwarf treatment for the templars? I'm glad that I decide to go with Dark Angels instead. I feel sorry for the Templars players.
Meh. I started playing templars when all we had was the Armageddon codex. I'm not complaining. I'd be pissed if we got rolled into the SM Codex, but this doesn't bother me. Just make my BTs playable again.
25703
Post by: juraigamer
WD only release? Well well looks like yet again people who want it later down the road will be mostly out of luck,
29784
Post by: timetowaste85
I'll pick it up, I'm willing to give it a try. But a lot of these rumors sound horrendous. Still, good things could come out of it, and BT are pretty awful right now. I've pretty much stopped 40k, but I'll play again if these guys have a decent update. I guess I'll be watching the career of this thread with great interest.
37470
Post by: tomjoad
 juraigamer wrote:WD only release? Well well looks like yet again people who want it later down the road will be mostly out of luck,
WD updates seems great, but this issue is too huge to ignore. If I want to play SoB I need to hunt down an old WD? There isn't a free PDF download like a sensible company that wants to sell off those old unwanted pewter models would have? Not even an option to buy it for those of you with iPads? I am genuinely curious how GW justifies this to themselves.
29784
Post by: timetowaste85
 tomjoad wrote: juraigamer wrote:WD only release? Well well looks like yet again people who want it later down the road will be mostly out of luck,
WD updates seems great, but this issue is too huge to ignore. If I want to play SoB I need to hunt down an old WD? There isn't a free PDF download like a sensible company that wants to sell off those old unwanted pewter models would have? Not even an option to buy it for those of you with iPads? I am genuinely curious how GW justifies this to themselves.
Mark Wells, Tom Kirby and Mat Ward buy up multiple WD codexes and sell them on eBay for massive profit after they are off the shelves. Come on, why else would they do it? 
17901
Post by: Vhalyar
tomjoad wrote: juraigamer wrote:WD only release? Well well looks like yet again people who want it later down the road will be mostly out of luck,
WD updates seems great, but this issue is too huge to ignore. If I want to play SoB I need to hunt down an old WD? There isn't a free PDF download like a sensible company that wants to sell off those old unwanted pewter models would have? Not even an option to buy it for those of you with iPads? I am genuinely curious how GW justifies this to themselves.
The new White Dwarf is available digitally with the ability to buy previous issues.
1464
Post by: Breotan
I'm wondering if the decision to do a WD update isn't due to both a lack of new sculpts and a desire to make WD more desirable as a product?
14698
Post by: Lansirill
 Vhalyar wrote: tomjoad wrote: juraigamer wrote:WD only release? Well well looks like yet again people who want it later down the road will be mostly out of luck,
WD updates seems great, but this issue is too huge to ignore. If I want to play SoB I need to hunt down an old WD? There isn't a free PDF download like a sensible company that wants to sell off those old unwanted pewter models would have? Not even an option to buy it for those of you with iPads? I am genuinely curious how GW justifies this to themselves.
The new White Dwarf is available digitally with the ability to buy previous issues.
And at the low low price of $300 + $10/issue.
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
pretre wrote:I respectively disagree. I think the SoB codex update was really important and helped out the army. I wish it was more widely available, but other than that it has been great.
1.) It just took away half the units of the already meager choices, without adding anything.
2.) "MORE WIDELY AVAILABLE"??? That Codex was OOP after a week! And rendered the old one not tournament legal!
Vhalyar wrote:The new White Dwarf is available digitally with the ability to buy previous issues.
And silly me thought you need a 400$ Ipad to read it 
59491
Post by: d3m01iti0n
plastictrees wrote:About time those johnny-come-lately's lost theiIr codex privileges. Barely been around 15 years...think they need their own book...grumble grumble.
Im sure there are several other threads on this forum you will fit into if you have nothing productive or intelligent to say. Try them out.
Now this is just a rumor for now, Im completely baffled at GWs inability to get its gak together and release an updated full length codex for the oldest army out there. People are buying your product and keeping you guys fed, clothed, and a roof over your head. I can understand suprise releases and dragging out releases for a few years, but for gods sakes keep your gak updated!!! Im unable to see why they update in the order they do, and just ignore paying customers who can barely play their hard earned and worked upon armies anymore. Thats us, SoB, Tau, and whoever else got left in the dust.
Hey GW, pull your heads out of your asses and do your fething job right like every other succesful entertainment company seems able to do. Ive only been in this hobby going on a year now and Im seriously starting to scratch my head at wtf Im wasting my time on. I should just get back into modding my car; at least car manufacturers keep their models updated.
7433
Post by: plastictrees
 d3m01iti0n wrote: Im sure there are several other threads on this forum you will fit into if you have nothing productive or intelligent to say. Try them out.
Now this is just a rumor for now, Im completely baffled at GWs inability to get its gak together and release an updated full length codex for the oldest army out there. People are buying your product and keeping you guys fed, clothed, and a roof over your head. I can understand suprise releases and dragging out releases for a few years, but for gods sakes keep your gak updated!!! Im unable to see why they update in the order they do, and just ignore paying customers who can barely play their hard earned and worked upon armies anymore. Thats us, SoB, Tau, and whoever else got left in the dust.
Hey GW, pull your heads out of your asses and do your fething job right like every other succesful entertainment company seems able to do. Ive only been in this hobby going on a year now and Im seriously starting to scratch my head at wtf Im wasting my time on. I should just get back into modding my car; at least car manufacturers keep their models updated.
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. I'm good.
If you've only been playing 40k for a year you might be in for a bit of a shock when it comes to GWs codex release cycle. Getting anything at all this close to a new edition release is a bonus.
Rumours of a more aggresive release schedule seem to have been debunked.
20774
Post by: pretre
 Kroothawk wrote:pretre wrote:I respectively disagree. I think the SoB codex update was really important and helped out the army. I wish it was more widely available, but other than that it has been great.
1.) It just took away half the units of the already meager choices, without adding anything.
2.) "MORE WIDELY AVAILABLE"??? That Codex was OOP after a week! And rendered the old one not tournament legal!
#1 is incorrect. No SOB units were lost and the inq units went to codex gk or were converted into the EBC. The thing we lost was wargear for the can and vehicles.
#2 is true but it is still pretty easy to get a hold of. I rrallu wish there was a legit way though. Hint hint GW.
59491
Post by: d3m01iti0n
plastictrees wrote: d3m01iti0n wrote: Im sure there are several other threads on this forum you will fit into if you have nothing productive or intelligent to say. Try them out.
Now this is just a rumor for now, Im completely baffled at GWs inability to get its gak together and release an updated full length codex for the oldest army out there. People are buying your product and keeping you guys fed, clothed, and a roof over your head. I can understand suprise releases and dragging out releases for a few years, but for gods sakes keep your gak updated!!! Im unable to see why they update in the order they do, and just ignore paying customers who can barely play their hard earned and worked upon armies anymore. Thats us, SoB, Tau, and whoever else got left in the dust.
Hey GW, pull your heads out of your asses and do your fething job right like every other succesful entertainment company seems able to do. Ive only been in this hobby going on a year now and Im seriously starting to scratch my head at wtf Im wasting my time on. I should just get back into modding my car; at least car manufacturers keep their models updated.
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. I'm good.
If you've only been playing 40k for a year you might be in for a bit of a shock when it comes to GWs codex release cycle. Getting anything at all this close to a new edition release is a bonus.
Rumours of a more aggresive release schedule seem to have been debunked.
Its not the wait itself Im complaining about, its the update order. Old armies should be top priority. There doesnt seem to be any reason that CSM and DA required an update before BT or SoB. Dark Vengence was playable with their old codecies but they want to blow out $100 box sets, two $60 codecies, and all the new models to go with them. I know this is old news but they simply dont give a crap about their customers.
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Post by: Vladamyr
While I would be extremely unhappy with a WD release, at this point I would be happy with any update. Right now the person I play most often is CSM, and my battle stradegy for objective games is to delay him as much as possible and pray that the dice gods end the game ASAP or my army is likely to be wiped off the board the next turn.
34242
Post by: -Loki-
d3m01iti0n wrote:There doesnt seem to be any reason that CSM and DA required an update before BT or SoB. Dark Vengence was playable with their old codecies but they want to blow out $100 box sets, two $60 codecies, and all the new models to go with them. I know this is old news but they simply dont give a crap about their customers.
You mean aside from each side not having the requisite troops choices? Chaos had no legal troop choices using the old codex, as cultists didn't yet exist, and Dark Angels only have 1, a tactical squad, as Deathwing terminators currently need a special character to unlock as troops.
GW have no release order. New codices are done when a studio member has a good pitch for a book. According to GW, older books are fine as they do still work in that they are playable, even if requiring a little house ruling. They'll get to them when they get to them.
Regarding the rumour, didn't one source say back last yeat all the plastics were done for the Templars release, and they were waiting on the book? Seems odd for GW to tool all those molds then not use them.
4713
Post by: efarrer
pretre wrote:I respectively disagree. I think the SoB codex update was really important and helped out the army. I wish it was more widely available, but other than that it has been great.
I would love to know what you consider a bad update.
It's a piece of crud. That's the most polite way I can describe,
59491
Post by: d3m01iti0n
Im done with my Zeal. Read some promising hush hush stuff elsewhere. If the new model rumors are true then the WD update will be good for us. I just think a lack of codex is lame, but we will get it down the road. Hopefully the Neo squad is a seperate option and not a loss of Black Tide mechanics. I would like to see Whirlwhinds with Skyfire and some Orbital Bombardments. Free Frags. Buffs to Sword Bretheren. We will see how this goes down.
49827
Post by: MajorWesJanson
d3m01iti0n wrote:
Now this is just a rumor for now, Im completely baffled at GWs inability to get its gak together and release an updated full length codex for the oldest army out there. People are buying your product and keeping you guys fed, clothed, and a roof over your head. I can understand suprise releases and dragging out releases for a few years, but for gods sakes keep your gak updated!!! Im unable to see why they update in the order they do, and just ignore paying customers who can barely play their hard earned and worked upon armies anymore. Thats us, SoB, Tau, and whoever else got left in the dust.
Hey GW, pull your heads out of your asses and do your fething job right like every other succesful entertainment company seems able to do. Ive only been in this hobby going on a year now and Im seriously starting to scratch my head at wtf Im wasting my time on. I should just get back into modding my car; at least car manufacturers keep their models updated.
d3m01iti0n wrote:Im sure there are several other threads on this forum you will fit into if you have nothing productive or intelligent to say. Try them out.
Was the irony there intentional?
As for a BT WD dex, it works as DA and Tau are getting updates next, and that leaves the BT dex as the sole holdout from mid 4th edition that needs new rules. Unless they are coming after Eldar, they will still be aroundwithout an update for a while, and BT are well enough model range wise that they can get by with just new rules and no new models. Just give them access to say the Storm Talon and they are OK with no model range change.
Or simply add Grimaldus and Helbrecht as HQ choices and the Emperor's Champion as an elite SC in the next Codex: SM. Have Grimaldus be an alternative to Cassius for a PA Chaplain, the Emperor's champion good in challenges and act like a Chapter banner (+1 to combat results and +1 attack) to all uits within say 12") And have Helbrect have a rule: Master of the Crusade- for each model in power armor in a Tactical squad, you may add up to one space marine scout (from the scout unit entry) for x points to that unit, who may choose bolter, bolt pistol/ ccw, or shotgun as their weapon option.
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Post by: Temujin
I think the more onerous thing about the SoB White Dwarf update was the lack of minis. If that's going to be the case again here then it will be rightly considered a bad release no matter how good the rules are.
17901
Post by: Vhalyar
If the iPad existed only for GW products, you might have an excellent point. Fortunately it's a multi-purpose device, so all I'm seeing here is two babies going abloo bloo bloo.
The point is, unlike in the past, it will be possible to obtain a back issue of WD through legal digital means. On top of that it's easier than ever to make copies and screenshots of it.
This means a WD update for Black Templars is much, much better off than it was for Sisters, Daemons, and so on.
494
Post by: H.B.M.C.
I look forward to this issue selling out in a couple of days and loads of BT players being without their updated Codices unless they can get their hands in an iOS platform.
21940
Post by: nels1031
What bizarro world did I wake up in that people are complaining about not having copies of White Dwarf?
And not even that, but complaining about a White Dwarf thats only been rumored to be coming.
I hear the Twilight Zone music in my head as I ponder this baffling reversal.
41203
Post by: Insurgency Walker
Actually, it's the preemptive whining of people that may have invested a good deal of money in an army they will not be able to legally play. From a consumer point of view GWs actions reminds me of conversations I had with Russian economists back in the 80's. I imagine most people who play BT will have no idea that new rules are coming out (if rules do come out in WD) When they do try to track them down they will be sold out.
Silly really.
60720
Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
This puzzles me
either White Dwarf will be widely available,so BT players will get hold of it and then use the new list
or
White dwarf will not be widely available, most BT players will not get hold of it and will not end up using the new rules, instead sticking to the old set
so where is the problem ? It's not as if GW runs tornaments anymore and play in GW shops shouldn't be impacted
25208
Post by: AlmightyWalrus
I worry that the shooting options we currently have will be neutered while the melee stuff will get a small but inadequate buff. The rumours of the Emperor's Champion becoming non-mandatory doesn't amuse me either.
16175
Post by: Stormfather
Dwarf Codex: Sisters of Battle was an improvement over Codex: Witch Hunters in almost every way- the exceptions being the loss of a second Troops option (and a good one at that!), the nerf to Immolators (losing Fast, but remaining at 65 points for what is, essentially, a Razorback), and the general uncompetitiveness of the vanilla Canoness and Sororitas Command Squad. Two missed opportunities were the Repressor and the Militia; though Witch Hunters didn't have either of these units, either.
Everything else was an improvement. Across the board, prices dropped. Repentia, Seraphim, and Retributors, previously bad by virtue of cost, became solid choices. Dominions, who once played second fiddle to Celestians, became the pre-eminent unit in their role (even if the Immolator took a knock). The Exorcist remains a beast. Battle Conclaves, although enjoying less options than the Henchman squad they replaced, are much, much better.
Do I expect great things from the Dwarf Codex: Black Templars? No. But I do expect it to give us an armylist that's more competitive than the current Codex: Black Templars. I hope it honors some of the Black Templar mainstays from the current codex in some form (Whirlwinds, Tankhunting Dreads, upgunned terminator squads, Bikers with powerweapons) while bringing the entire army up to speed. If there are no new models, I'm going to be unhappy if I have to remodel and repaint large parts of the army (like the Chaos players who had to redo all their Termies with the new codex, then when the FAQ dropped had to go back and restore them all to their original configuration!) I also hope that it's available in digital format, so it won't become as hard to procure as the Sisters codex.
41203
Post by: Insurgency Walker
 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:This puzzles me
either White Dwarf will be widely available,so BT players will get hold of it and then use the new list
or
White dwarf will not be widely available, most BT players will not get hold of it and will not end up using the new rules, instead sticking to the old set
so where is the problem ? It's not as if GW runs tornaments anymore and play in GW shops shouldn't be impacted
For me the problem is that it encourages behavior GW is trying to prevent. Piracy. Black market behavior. Little covens of illicit game material passed around by teenagers in the dark corners of game stores.
Hell in the UK some safety spanker was talking about banning pointy knives. Pretty soon it will be GW turned Johnny into an Internet pirate!
Ok, that's over the top sarcasm ....
17901
Post by: Vhalyar
 Stormfather wrote:If there are no new models, I'm going to be unhappy if I have to remodel and repaint large parts of the army (like the Chaos players who had to redo all their Termies with the new codex, then when the FAQ dropped had to go back and restore them all to their original configuration!)
There will be new models, without a doubt. Months ago Harry commented on seeing the models and seemed quite pleased. Even back then it seemed like the models had been sitting around unused for some time, so if this is not the right time to release (some or all of) them, then it seems monumentally stupid.
16175
Post by: Stormfather
Vhalyar wrote: Stormfather wrote:If there are no new models, I'm going to be unhappy if I have to remodel and repaint large parts of the army (like the Chaos players who had to redo all their Termies with the new codex, then when the FAQ dropped had to go back and restore them all to their original configuration!)
There will be new models, without a doubt. Months ago Harry commented on seeing the models and seemed quite pleased. Even back then it seemed like the models had been sitting around unused for some time, so if this is not the right time to release (some or all of) them, then it seems monumentally stupid.
The same was said of Sisters of Battle plastics, though. I hope the BT's get some new toys, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were withheld until a proper Codex was released.
17901
Post by: Vhalyar
Stormfather wrote: Vhalyar wrote: Stormfather wrote:If there are no new models, I'm going to be unhappy if I have to remodel and repaint large parts of the army (like the Chaos players who had to redo all their Termies with the new codex, then when the FAQ dropped had to go back and restore them all to their original configuration!)
There will be new models, without a doubt. Months ago Harry commented on seeing the models and seemed quite pleased. Even back then it seemed like the models had been sitting around unused for some time, so if this is not the right time to release (some or all of) them, then it seems monumentally stupid.
The same was said of Sisters of Battle plastics, though. I hope the BT's get some new toys, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were withheld until a proper Codex was released.
Went back to review the Sisters rumors, and there's two things:
1) Stickmonkey's comments regarding Sisters models. It was heavily implied that he had seen test sculpts.
2) StraightSilver's discussion with Jes Goodwin. Jes explained the difficulties/design issues in getting the models looking right. If anything, it meant we would not see anything for a while.
Basically, nothing was particularly implied about actual SoB boxes. Meanwhile, Harry's said that the models he saw were basically good to go & sell at any moment.
35006
Post by: Medium of Death
On the 40k tab on GW's page I noticed the background image had changed, or at least appears to.
Maybe a sign that this WD codex isn't that far away after all?
/clutching at straws
51043
Post by: Lucre
I really liked how the edition changes turned them into such a shooting MSU army. It was one of those mechanical things with a lot of character that tickles you.
Looking forward to seeing what they come out with. Would love to see lots of chaff guys and IC's to add and units with a landraider built into their cost.
21954
Post by: EmperorsChampion
All I can say, least it is somthing rather than nothing. Just as long as BT do not get rolled into C:SM I will be happy. I just wonder what sort of goodies they will get and changes that will happen. I hope they at least change up the weapon options for the crusader squads and sword brethren.
18698
Post by: kronk
That's all I ask for. I can deal with a WD update if I have to, so long as the codex is competitive.  H.B.M.C. wrote:I look forward to this issue selling out in a couple of days and loads of BT players being without their updated Codices unless they can get their hands in an iOS platform.
Sadly, this is exactly what will happen. *rolls an 18 on a d20* There, I successfully saved versus making another long rant about them not putting out PDFs of White Dwarf material. I don't own, want, or need an iPad, nor should I have to buy one to play this fething game. Grr...
37728
Post by: IdentifyZero
Stormfather wrote:Dwarf Codex: Sisters of Battle was an improvement over Codex: Witch Hunters in almost every way- the exceptions being the loss of a second Troops option (and a good one at that!), the nerf to Immolators (losing Fast, but remaining at 65 points for what is, essentially, a Razorback), and the general uncompetitiveness of the vanilla Canoness and Sororitas Command Squad. Two missed opportunities were the Repressor and the Militia; though Witch Hunters didn't have either of these units, either.
Everything else was an improvement. Across the board, prices dropped. Repentia, Seraphim, and Retributors, previously bad by virtue of cost, became solid choices. Dominions, who once played second fiddle to Celestians, became the pre-eminent unit in their role (even if the Immolator took a knock). The Exorcist remains a beast. Battle Conclaves, although enjoying less options than the Henchman squad they replaced, are much, much better.
Do I expect great things from the Dwarf Codex: Black Templars? No. But I do expect it to give us an armylist that's more competitive than the current Codex: Black Templars. I hope it honors some of the Black Templar mainstays from the current codex in some form (Whirlwinds, Tankhunting Dreads, upgunned terminator squads, Bikers with powerweapons) while bringing the entire army up to speed. If there are no new models, I'm going to be unhappy if I have to remodel and repaint large parts of the army (like the Chaos players who had to redo all their Termies with the new codex, then when the FAQ dropped had to go back and restore them all to their original configuration!) I also hope that it's available in digital format, so it won't become as hard to procure as the Sisters codex.
The WD codex was better than the third? I don't think so, give me back the third edition Codex: Witch Hunters any day.
29784
Post by: timetowaste85
I expect BT crusader squads will cost around 13-14 points each, cheap to ring true to the 'horde' aspect of BT, Sword brethren will have an increased WS with access to better toys, Chaplains will keep their current abilities while moving to a 1-3 elite choice, everyone will get Frag Grenades and they will have some kind of serious bonus against psykers. I also expect the fluff to be changed and that more than a few people will be pissed at the update.
18698
Post by: kronk
Sword Brethren, being elite veterans, should have A2 like Sternguard. I can deal with WS4 instead of WS5 so long as it's A2.
Chaplains as an elite choice would eat into our Dreadnought and Terminator slots, unless you're saying we can take 1-3 Chaplains with a single Elite slot and split them into other units.
29784
Post by: timetowaste85
 kronk wrote:
Chaplains as an elite choice would eat into our Dreadnought and Terminator slots, unless you're saying we can take 1-3 Chaplains with a single Elite slot and split them into other units.
Of course. I thought it was generally accepted as a 1-3 choice meant they fit in a single unit slot, once the BA priests started this up.
If SW's did this with lone wolves, I'd probably actually play them...It would be a losing army, but an entire army of "heroes" that are immune to ID? Yes, it would be fun.
56307
Post by: unmercifulconker
As long as I get my dreadknight sized crusader, complete with badass helmet, sword and shield, I will be beyond happy. No one and I mean NO ONE is gonna  with a 20 foot mechanical knight who will stop at nothing to squash its pathetic enemies deep into the wretched soil that it has tainted.
Oh hello trygon, KASLICE
Whats that tau, you wanna shoot it? Aww too bad it has a big ass shield KABLOCK
Oh cool dreadknight, too bad it aint as manly as this guy KATAUNT
You have that OP chaos guy? LOLZ KASTOMP
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Post by: kronk
Uh. I don't recall that from any of the fluff...
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Post by: Alpharius
Me neither.
And while GW does love them some new, weird big kits for every new release, you might just want to play Grey Knights if that's what you're after.
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Post by: timetowaste85
Yeah...that sounds like Fanwank. Please, no. God, no.
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Post by: Tyranid Horde
No, I don't want Grey Knights invading my crusaders thank you... I hope we do get at least a WD codex, getting rolled into SM would be awful. As a side note, I was flicking through my rulebook and BT didn't get a page dedicated to themselves like DA or BA or GK. I hope this is just me being paranoid and not something telling the future of BT.
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Post by: timetowaste85
 Tyranid Horde wrote:No, I don't want Grey Knights invading my crusaders thank you... I hope we do get at least a WD codex, getting rolled into SM would be awful. As a side note, I was flicking through my rulebook and BT didn't get a page dedicated to themselves like DA or BA or GK. I hope this is just me being paranoid and not something telling the future of BT.
The 'no separate page' thing was hashed to death in a false rumor thread. Don't worry about it being a 'future' telling. Instead, look at the page that shows alliances, as BTs clearly have a place in the alliance page.
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Post by: Alpharius
Well, GK's are the only Psykers BT will ally with, right?
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Post by: Tyranid Horde
According to the codex that's all, but in the allies matrix thingy, you can ally with Eldar, which is contradicting so much with the fluff.
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Post by: Alpharius
Tyranid Horde wrote:According to the codex that's all, but in the allies matrix thingy, you can ally with Eldar, which is contradicting so much with the fluff.
No kidding - that's just... wrong!
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
 Alpharius wrote: Tyranid Horde wrote:According to the codex that's all, but in the allies matrix thingy, you can ally with Eldar, which is contradicting so much with the fluff.
No kidding - that's just... wrong!
What makes it even more wrong is that the Templars are better friends with Eldar than with Sisters... And that the Space Wolves like the Sisters better (and vice versa!) than the Templars...
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Post by: Quintinus
Is this the thread where we get to post a snarky, ironic comment about how "other armies make more money and have a larger fanbase than the Black Templars so the other armies deserve to get a new Codex first"?
Because if so, that's all I'm gonna say. I wouldn't mind if Black Templars got rolled into the main SM dex or if they got a WD dex. They'd be lucky that they even get that much support.
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Post by: Tyranid Horde
 Vladsimpaler wrote:Is this the thread where we get to post a snarky, ironic comment about how "other armies make more money and have a larger fanbase than the Black Templars so the other armies deserve to get a new Codex first"?
Because if so, that's all I'm gonna say. I wouldn't mind if Black Templars got rolled into the main SM dex or if they got a WD dex. They'd be lucky that they even get that much support.
I think you'd find everyone else would be pretty annoyed to see their unique army getting rolled into SM, I for one, would definitely be angry.
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Post by: Alpharius
Vladsimpaler wrote:Is this the thread where we get to post a snarky, ironic comment about how "other armies make more money and have a larger fanbase than the Black Templars so the other armies deserve to get a new Codex first"?
Short answer?
No.
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Post by: ZebioLizard2
Everything else was an improvement. Across the board, prices dropped. Repentia, Seraphim, and Retributors, previously bad by virtue of cost, became solid choices. Dominions, who once played second fiddle to Celestians, became the pre-eminent unit in their role (even if the Immolator took a knock). The Exorcist remains a beast. Battle Conclaves, although enjoying less options than the Henchman squad they replaced, are much, much better.
Yeah, considering Battle sisters got worse as the only troop choice, as well as celestians who are now worthless. Not everything improved, powers got worse for most, though a few are better. Heavy flamers took a price hit and got more expensive, troop choice being forced to take 10 models and yet still can take an immolator, not to mention a bunch of the unique wargear was taken away (Book of St. Lucius) while the rest remained either overpriced (Rerolls to faith) or just plain worthless at both its effect and cost (Gain one faith back)
Its got issues, it got slightly better in some area's, worse in others, and feels a bit less unique since it seems almost reliant upon standard wargear now.
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Post by: unmercifulconker
Haha, I got a bit wishful there 
Ally grey knights with the Templars? Yuck
I just really hope we get something that really embodies the righteous crusader who will literally walk towards the enemy lines, with holy vengeance emitting from his eyes, smiting the unworthy until he drops. I guess you could say I just want a beefed up Emperors Champion
What new toys do you reckon we will get? I do expect GW to give us a large 'knight' kit, seems like everyone has to have a big kit now, mind you I am not saying this is a bad thing.
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
Vladsimpaler wrote:Is this the thread where we get to post a snarky, ironic comment about how "other armies make more money and have a larger fanbase than the Black Templars so the other armies deserve to get a new Codex first"?
Because if so, that's all I'm gonna say. I wouldn't mind if Black Templars got rolled into the main SM dex or if they got a WD dex. They'd be lucky that they even get that much support.
Nope this here is a pro- BT thread. If anybody needs to complain about them there are other threads available to them. They can be identified by the unmistakable odor of baby gak and the puddles of hater tears.
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Post by: heartserenade
Maybe GW will do a Cavalry set? Kinda like Thunderwolves but, you know, more knight-y. Imagine charging those against Xenos ranks.
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Post by: jonolikespie
I'd love to see BT bikers with lances done well. It has the potential to be awesome but it would have to be pulled off right.
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Post by: timetowaste85
 jonolikespie wrote:I'd love to see BT bikers with lances done well. It has the potential to be awesome but it would have to be pulled off right.
I just use Empire lances. Using the Knight arms as a matched set would look pretty good, and would distinguish them from other SM models.
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
Anybody have a link to the rumored model releases? Would likdle to take another peek at the supposed new BT units...
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Post by: heartserenade
I was thinking of something like this, if done properly, would be cool.
And I dunno about a BT Dreadknight, but a BT specific dreadnought would be nice. Or just a knight-y sword for a contemptor dreadnought. But this is just me wishlisting.
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Post by: jonolikespie
A dreadnought with a sword and shield would be insane.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
Oh please no more Marines riding X. There was enough of that in the Wolf Codex, and as much as I like the Thunderwolf minis, it's still a terrible concept.
No super-strong backed horsies with bald Templars screaming on their backs waving their arms about. They have bikes! Let them use bikes!
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Post by: Cyrax
Maybe they're trying to be more Eco-friendly?
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Post by: Alpharius
H.B.M.C. wrote:Oh please no more Marines riding X. There was enough of that in the Wolf Codex, and as much as I like the Thunderwolf minis, it's still a terrible concept.
No super-strong backed horsies with bald Templars screaming on their backs waving their arms about. They have bikes! Let them use bikes!
Agreed!
Bike please, not horses!
I'm just glad we made it through C: BA without having Marines on bats...
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
NO HORSES. We will probably get BT bikes if the releaae list is accurate.
I would take a Dreadknight however. Or TANKRED. But I will take whatever they give me at this point. Already have a BT-painted Storm Talon awaiting CoF!
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Post by: J99Pwrangler
From what I understand for the psykers, We only can ally with a grey knight army that has a psyker in it. We can still ally with any other army, just as long as they dont field a psyker.
So we can roll out with Crimson fists, as long as there is no Libby in there list.
Did I miss understand this? I know we dont like any psykers (except GK).
Oh, aslo.... Lets get caestus assault ram in our codex!! After all, we are a fleet baised crusade
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
J99Pwrangler wrote:From what I understand for the psykers, We only can ally with a grey knight army that has a psyker in it. We can still ally with any other army, just as long as they dont field a psyker.
So we can roll out with Crimson fists, as long as there is no Libby in there list.
Did I miss understand this? I know we dont like any psykers (except GK).
Oh, aslo.... Lets get caestus assault ram in our codex!! After all, we are a fleet baised crusade
Although I do plan on buying an Assault Ram sometime soon, Im sure we will only get the Storm Talon or Storm Raven.
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Post by: J99Pwrangler
d3m01iti0n wrote:
Although I do plan on buying an Assault Ram sometime soon, Im sure we will only get the Storm Talon or Storm Raven.
I fear you are right with that too. Still, a flyer would be better then nothing right now.....
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
J99Pwrangler wrote:From what I understand for the psykers, We only can ally with a grey knight army that has a psyker in it.
Almost correct. The psyker(s) must be a Grey Knight(s), so no psychic Inquisitors.
On that note, what happens if an Inquisitor with a Daemonblade rolls a 12 and becomes a psyker? o,0
59491
Post by: d3m01iti0n
Just going to leave this here...........
20774
Post by: pretre
So you painted a BT stormtalon? Is that N&R?
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
Yeah I picked it up the day it came out. What is N&R?
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Post by: pretre
News and Rumors. Like, why would you post it in a Rumor thread about Black Templars?
Especially since they phrase 'I'm just going to leave this here...' usually is used to indicate leaked pics in this forum.
Oh well, I guess this thread is off to wish-listing anyways, so it doesn't matter.
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Post by: J99Pwrangler
Worst case scenario, just say its a Space Marine ally and you can use it.
59491
Post by: d3m01iti0n
pretre wrote:News and Rumors. Like, why would you post it in a Rumor thread about Black Templars?
Especially since they phrase 'I'm just going to leave this here...' usually is used to indicate leaked pics in this forum.
Oh well, I guess this thread is off to wish-listing anyways, so it doesn't matter.
Meh. Nobody said a word to the Chaos horsie. Just letting you know Ive prepared for the rumors!
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Post by: J99Pwrangler
Forums get diverted quickly to an off topic subject, or so I have noticed. These things happen, just like my question about psykers. Nothing to do with rumors about the BT coming out. Its just what happens with a blog like this.
Still a pretty sweet flyer, nice paint job too.
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
We will have more to talk about when CoF drops for sure.
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Post by: Lucre
I really hope there are some cost shared landraider + squad units. I'm also really hoping for more upgrade characters with religious or mentor sorta bent that stiffen the crusader rabble.
I wouldn't be too worried about new sculpts. I kinda like the upgrade packs and the new DA bitz will surely have neat stuff to play with
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Post by: J99Pwrangler
Fluff wise, yes, I think it would be nice if they enrichened it a little bit more. I am not too fond of the idea of having a Iniate leading a pack of Neophytes around... that doesnt seem right to me.
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Post by: d3m01iti0n
J99Pwrangler wrote:Fluff wise, yes, I think it would be nice if they enrichened it a little bit more. I am not too fond of the idea of having a Iniate leading a pack of Neophytes around... that doesnt seem right to me.
Hopefully its just a new troop option (with Bolter or Las Neos), rather than a fluff-raping rule change.
Of course with the rumored Neophyte plastic kit it could be anything.
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Post by: optometris
Chatting to my local gw manager, who is a massive Templars fan, he kept hinting very strongly at a new codex in either q3 or q4 next year, he said it was mentioned at a managers gaming/meeting weekend recently. Don't know how solid that is though.
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Post by: jonolikespie
Where to managers stand on the totem pole? I know that we are quite often more well informed than red/black/insert local colour here shirts but do managers usually know what's coming?
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Post by: pretre
Managers are right below me on the accuracy scale.
I'm sitting at one false btw.
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Post by: Tyranid Horde
GW managers love to hint things that are wrong, that way, you buy more of that army in prep for a new codex that will never happen.
EDIT: Just from my personal experience with certain managers.
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Post by: htj
Tyranid Horde wrote:GW managers love to hint things that are wrong, that way, you buy more of that army in prep for a new codex that will never happen.
EDIT: Just from my personal experience with certain managers.
My experience of the number of 'a manager said this (TOTAL LIE)' threads that I've seen seems to back you up.
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Post by: PredaKhaine
How many people have had a conversation in GW (with staff) along the lines of
"Buy the Storm Raven - all the marines will soon be able to take it"
And when it came out, the same was said of the the Storm Talon.
I've been told GW books weren't available yet. Then gone and bought said book from waterstones round the corner...
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Yes, there was a definite lack of Tau anything in all local stores in my area 12 months ago, and supposedly GW was just on the verge of releasing a Tau codex.
That turned out to be very accurate. Apparently it was just supply chain problems.
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