The crack of gunshots rang through the halls of Parliament Hill’s Centre Block on Wednesday after a gunman fired on soldiers guarding Canada’s main war memorial, sending MPs into hiding and all federal government buildings into lockdown.
Ottawa police confirmed on Twitter that they were investigating several shootings.
Eyewitnesses said an armed man with long black hair emerged at the National War Memorial, fired about four times, and a guard went down. The gunman, who an eyewitness said was carrying what appeared to be a rifle, then ran toward Parliament Hill.
The war-memorial shooting victim was taken to hospital in an ambulance. Police have sealed off the area.
There were also reports of gunfire near the Chateau Laurier hotel, just east of Parliament Hill, shortly before 11 a.m.
One body was visible outside the Library of Parliament, roughly in the middle of Centre Block, but it was unclear if that was a suspect or a law enforcement official.
In an indication that the situation remained tense, the RCMP sent out a warning advising people to stay out of harm’s way in downtown Ottawa shortly before 11 a.m. – more than one hour after the first shots were fired. “Citizens are advised to stay off rooftops and away from windows in the downtown core. Avoid downtown core,” the force said via Twitter.
Ottawa police also warned the public against tweeting the locations of officers investigating the attack.
Prime Minister Stephen Harper “is safe and has left Parliament Hill,” Jason MacDonald, his director of communications, said via Twitter. Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau and NDP Leader Thomas Mulcair were also reported to be safe.
Police officers at the cenotaph, which is cordoned with yellow tape and bordered by cruisers, ordered bystanders and journalists to move farther away from the crime scene, toward the Rideau Centre mall.
Tensions ran high as the officers yelled at journalists to get back around 10:30 a.m. (ET), with one officer shouting: " Move down! There's an active shooter! If you want to die, stay here. If you want to live, keep moving!”
Liberal MP John McKay said he was just taking off his jacket about to go into the caucus room when he heard "Pop! Pop! Pop! Pop!" He assumed the sounds were construction noise, but then security guards rushed down the halls ordering everybody out.
Mr. McKay said the MPs followed security out the back door and then they "huddled out back by the monuments" for a while. "That building is the people's building ... I'd hate to think of us shutting it down because of both paranoia and legitimate fears."
One man watched the scene unfold from a third-floor office that faces the war memorial. “It was unreal,” said the witness, who asked not to be identified. “I heard the shot and looked out the window. . . The shooter came from the west side and aimed right at the young guy that was standing guard and shot him twice. I think he missed with the first shot; it sounded like a shotgun.”
He saw the young soldier fall. No one returned fire. Other guards and police converged on the victim. The scene was “mayhem,” he said.
Bank of Canada Governor Stephen Poloz postponed a planned 11.15 a.m. news conference in Ottawa, due to take place in the National Press theatre, across Wellington Street from Parliament Hill. The news conference was to follow Wednesday’s release of the central bank’s interest rate statement and monetary policy report.
Ottawa mayor Jim Watson released a statement saying he was “shocked and saddened.”
“Our thoughts and prayers are with those injured,” he said.
“Ottawa Paramedics and Fire Services provided first response to those injured and Ottawa Police Services are engaged with other law enforcement agencies at this time in pursuit of the criminal or criminals who have carried out this vicious and unwarranted attack.”
In Toronto, Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne says she and the opposition leaders discussed suspending Question Period in light of the Ottawa shooting, but she says “we refuse to be silenced.”
Automatically Appended Next Post: In response to Ahtman in the other thread, mine has no connection to Islam yet. That could change once shooters are captured. I did find this, however.
ISIS’ call for “lone wolf attacks” has hit North America.
The attack took place while two soldiers were standing in a parking lot in Montreal. One soldier was wearing his uniform. The man behind the wheel, 25-year-old Martin Roulea, intentionally hit the armed forces members and then attempted to make a getaway from police in pursuit.
However, Roulea lost control of his getaway car during the chase and flipped. As Roulea made his exit from the vehicle, police exercised the use of deadly force. One of the soldiers Roulea hit didn’t survive. The other only sustained minor injuries.
According to the Independent:
The Royal Canadian Mounted Police said that Rouleau was known to federal authorities, including counter-terrorism agencies, who “were concerned that he had become radicalised”.
In addition, a textbook weapon of choice for terrorists was recovered at the scene.
While it’s unclear if Roulea planned to use the knife on his victims, the chilling profile picture from his alleged Twitter account reveals whom he supports:
Also, according to an interview from Canada’s The Star with a former friend of Roulea’s, the aspiring ISIS recruit tried to flee the country to fight jihad but was stopped by the authorities. RCMP Commissioner Bob Paulson supported the story, revealing that Roulea’s passport have been revoked.
Adding context to the tragedy, Roulea’s friends explained that he had tried to convert them, that “it was a terrorist attack” and “Martin died like he wanted to.” Not shockingly, Roulea was under surveillance for suspected extremists activities.
Even more disturbing, officials said that close to 80 individuals had linked up with terror groups abroad and now returned home. But they are not able to keep tabs on the jihadists because of strained government resources.
Last month, VICE conducted an exclusive interview with an ISIS terrorist in Mosul who proudly claimed that he knew thousands of people in the West prepared to carry out attacks for the Islamic State. Whether this specific incident was a lone wolf or an orchestrated attack remains up for debate.
However, one thing is vividly clear: From the Oklahoma beheading to this attack on Canadian soldiers, ISIS is finding sympathizers here in the West. And what was once labeled a regional threat is now all too close to home.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
My guess is if someone is willing to shoot at presumably armed soldiers, they would not be deterred by the idea that Joe Citizen might be packing.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
I think the thing is, while Canada has a lot of guns, Canadians tend to see guns more as tools for fending off bears, hunting (bears), sport shooting, and protecting livestock (from bears), than as self defense weapons (except when it comes to bears). As such guns tend to be clustered more in rural areas, and cities have fairly low gun-per-capita ratios.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
My guess is if someone is willing to shoot at presumably armed soldiers, they would not be deterred by the idea that Joe Citizen might be packing.
Fair point.
Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire, I just thought something similar happened in Canada, but as I say, every situation is unique and I wouldn't blame anybody if they ran off or dived for cover, instead of getting involved.
While it's definitely a potential, I think it's still a little early to be calling this one another home-grown moron with wanna-be jihadist ideals...
We've got plenty of other idiot radicals besides just the dumb*** Islamists, some of those eco-terror groups are equally terrifying, and they've got a huge hate-on right now for the Harper Conservs because of oil sands developments for examples.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
My guess is if someone is willing to shoot at presumably armed soldiers, they would not be deterred by the idea that Joe Citizen might be packing.
This is Canada. They only have long guns and severe restrictions on those including required licensing.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
we have lots of guns, they are illegal to carry, and illegal to have in a state where we could reasonably use them to defend ourselves and others (taking a gun out of locked cabinet, removing a 2nd trigger lock, then loading it with ammo that also has to be stored separately, will always take less time then it takes a bad guy to pull the trigger and run away)
so not sure where the surprise is coming from...
only things like concealed carry where citizens already have loaded guns has a fast enough response time to make a difference, in *most* cases.
its sad, but this looks like the fallout from the global jihad, far too much crazy and far too many willing to be lone wolfs.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Troubling news, but I'm surprised this thing happens in Canada, what with the high level of gun ownership, thus acting as a deterrent against.
Doesn't your average Canadian have more guns than your average American?
I'm surprised a citizen didn't return fire, but then, every situation is unique.
My guess is if someone is willing to shoot at presumably armed soldiers, they would not be deterred by the idea that Joe Citizen might be packing.
This is Canada. They only have long guns and severe restrictions on those including required licensing.
Damn you! You're destroying my idealised view of Canada being a friendlier version of America!
I live in ottawa, downtown is all baghdad and gak right now. Everyone is on lockdown, my brother was in centre block 20 minutes before the shooter opened fire. Second shooter apparently opened fire near the chateau laurier then fled into the rideau center. Basically ottawa is a bad episode of 24 right now.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire
Not sure if satire or /fanfiction.
I can get a list for you. A long one.
But I'll just point you to "Google" and let you do it yourself. It doesn't get into the papers much because a stopped robbery isn't as exciting as a murder.
Just last week someone in my local stopped an armed robbery at a convenience store. Didn't even make the local paper.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire
Not sure if satire or /fanfiction.
I can get a list for you. A long one.
I can get a longer list of crimes that weren't stopped by civilians with firearms, which is neither here nor there tbh. My disbelief doesn't stem from the idea that (some) people have used their weapons to foil a criminal, it is in the "many a story" and the idea that is an incredibly common occurrence.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire
Not sure if satire or /fanfiction.
I can get a list for you. A long one.
I can get a longer list of crimes that weren't stopped by civilians with firearms, which is neither here nor there tbh. My disbelief doesn't stem from the idea that (some) people have used their weapons to foil a criminal, it is in the "many a story" and the idea that is an incredibly common occurrence.
Armed citizens stopping crimes is a much more common occurence than people getting murdered with guns. Even the Brady Center admits it.
On the high side the estimate runs around 2.5 million defensive gun uses a year, which dwarfs our approximately 16,000 homicides in any recent year, only 10k of which are with guns. http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/homicide.htm Of those with guns, only a couple hundred are with rifles. So basically, the guns that the anti-gunners are the most spun up about only account for a tiny fraction of all our murders.
But let’s not go with the high estimate. Let’s go with some smaller ones instead. Let’s use the far more conservative 800,000 number which is arrived at in multiple studies. That still dwarfs the number of illegal shootings. Heck, let’s even run with the number once put out by the people who want to ban guns, the Brady Center, which was still around 108,000, which still is an awesome ratio of good vs. bad.
So even if you use the worst number provided by people who are just as biased as me but in the opposite direction, gun use is a huge net positive.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire
Not sure if satire or /fanfiction.
I can get a list for you. A long one.
I can get a longer list of crimes that weren't stopped by civilians with firearms, which is neither here nor there tbh. My disbelief doesn't stem from the idea that (some) people have used their weapons to foil a criminal, it is in the "many a story" and the idea that is an incredibly common occurrence.
You just made the argument for why we shouldn't have police...
CNN reporting multiple gunmen, but that could be jitters.
Prestor Jon wrote: Armed citizens stopping crimes is a much more common occurence than people getting murdered with guns.
But shootings in general still aren't that common, unless you buy into the myth that America is all shooting all the time. Considered the level of political efficacy here I suppose I should have known that saying that shootings in the USA aren't as common as some people seem to think would somehow be taken as an anti-gun stance.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Having read many a story of criminals in the USA being foiled by Joe Public returning fire
Not sure if satire or /fanfiction.
I can get a list for you. A long one.
I can get a longer list of crimes that weren't stopped by civilians with firearms, which is neither here nor there tbh. My disbelief doesn't stem from the idea that (some) people have used their weapons to foil a criminal, it is in the "many a story" and the idea that is an incredibly common occurrence.
You just made the argument for why we shouldn't have police...
CNN reporting multiple gunmen, but that could be jitters.
No. I think it's multiple gunmen from what I've heard. One of them's been spotted near a large mall downtown. One of the gunmen's already been shot down from what I heard though.
Frazzled wrote: You just made the argument for why we shouldn't have police...
I'm not sure how recognizing this isn't a cinematic Western or 80's action movie means that there is also no crime at all or that somehow we don't need any law enforcement.
Frazzled wrote: You just made the argument for why we shouldn't have police...
I'm not sure how recognizing this isn't a cinematic Western or 80's action movie means that there is also no crime at all or that somehow we don't need any law enforcement.
frazz is correct, your claim that shootings are rare, and that armed citizens stopping crime is rare dont back up your anti gun stance, murder is rare, cops solving those rare murders is not insignificant, nor is citizens stopping crimes insignificant.
and its all OT take it to a thread where that is the topic please, sarcasm/satire/ect about how "canadians have guns, why no stop terrorists in this case" are a bit insulting considering people have died from this (probably terrorist) attack, and its the 2nd one within a week.
easysauce wrote: multiple gun men seems to be the most reported that I see too frazz.
unfortunately also just heard that the man who was shot has passed.
Yes. Tragic.
Still debating to myself whether it may be jihadist activity due to killing the soldier (could work as a terror tactic like the beheadings) and the location of the shooting. I could be wrong though.
easysauce wrote: multiple gun men seems to be the most reported that I see too frazz.
unfortunately also just heard that the man who was shot has passed.
Yes. Tragic.
Still debating to myself whether it may be jihadist activity due to killing the soldier (could work as a terror tactic like the beheadings) and the location of the shooting. I could be wrong though.
given that this kind of attack, its target, who carried it out, and where, is exactly what was being called for by the jihadi's, Id bet dollars to donuts they are somehow involved.
I head some accounts of eyewitnesses saying they saw the suspect with a jihadi scarf (shmege *sp*) but nothing confimed yet
easysauce wrote: multiple gun men seems to be the most reported that I see too frazz.
unfortunately also just heard that the man who was shot has passed.
Yes. Tragic.
Still debating to myself whether it may be jihadist activity due to killing the soldier (could work as a terror tactic like the beheadings) and the location of the shooting. I could be wrong though.
given that this kind of attack, its target, who carried it out, and where, is exactly what was being called for by the jihadi's, Id bet dollars to donuts they are somehow involved.
I head some accounts of eyewitnesses saying they saw the suspect with a jihadi scarf (shmege *sp*) but nothing confimed yet
Well, let's cross our fingers. If ISIS sees the lockdown as a weakness, this might lead to problems in the future.
I kind of feel a bit guilty considering I used to live in Ottawa and moved to Quebec a couple of months ago.
You know, sort of like that feeling like you're leaving everyone behind to die in a way.
Civilians shooting criminals is actually fairly rare. Most cops fight crime their entire life and never shoot anyone, and now I'm supposed to pretend that civilians are doing it with enough regularity to be considered a common occurrence?
Blacksails wrote: I was in a briefing about just this sort of activity when this happened.
Certainly a little unnerving wearing the uniform right now.
Hopefully more aren't 'inspired' by these events.
Stay safe to everyone in Ottawa.
Apparently they cancelled the sens game tonight, like this guy can teleport or something.
More like simple standard security procedures in the wake of any kind of serious criminal/suspected terrorist incident... Don't provide any large, 'soft' targets. Keep the majority of people out the area so that police & investigators can both secure and go about their work without hassle.
Cancelling tonight's game is no different than cancelling it if there was giant arse weather storm hitting the region. It's purely a 'better extra safe than sorry' situation.
Besides, tonight really isn't the right time to be playing games. At the very least cancelling the game is a classy sign of respect for the sacrifices made today and to give the city & those involved some time to greave properly.
Anyways, RCMP are saying it's only 2 shooting incidents - the Rideau Center (the large mall), was a false alarm...
Essentially police & security have been getting calls/reports from the public who think they "may have seen something" and they're forced to go in and check it out.
Also, it looks right now like this isn't ISIS related. The shooter was apparently dressed all in black & had long black hair. After shooting the solider standing vigil at the Tomb of the Unkown, he ran into the Peace Tower entrance, and apparently yelled "hey" to on-site RCMP/Parliamentary Security. If he was an Islamist, he would have much more likely yelled out a religious statement, because martyrs want everyone to know who they are & why they're going their stupid gak.
Odds are it's a copycat or other politically motivated attack.
MWHistorian wrote: I'm not up on Canadian laws, but I'm sure the average joe isn't allowed to conceal carry like they are in the US.
Based on previous gun threads, I believe that it's extremely difficult to get a pistol in the first place in Canada. So while they may or may not have more firearms than the US, the number of firearms they DO have is going to be largely in the "long gun" department.
I am following this incident in the OP very closely though. From a cynical, detached point of view, I'm interested to know whether the incidents today are related to the recent ISIS' calls for action against "us", or if this is some extremist Quebecois Separatists, pissed off Leafs/Senators fans or what.
Jihadin wrote: US stepped up secuirty in quite a few locations
Yeah, all the embassies in Ottawa plus the American consulate in Toronto have had their security beefed up since this morning's shooting. Sussex Drive - which is where the PM's residence and the Saudi consulate are located among other buildings is said to be a mini-fortress right now.
Witness: "wearing black, long gun, caucasian, long black hair" that's the description of the shooter. Glad the mayor didn't call it a terror attack.
Experiment 626 wrote: At the very least cancelling the game is a classy sign of respect for the sacrifices made today and to give the city & those involved some time to greave properly.
Jihadin wrote: I'm siding heavily on "Home Grown" terror cell
Almost certainly, but right now it's not even really obvious the motivation...
The Quebec incident 2 days ago, the suspect was clearly yelling religious statements as he came at police before being gunned down.
Today, all the suspect apparently yelled at authorities was "hey". Not exactly the well known MO of a religious extremist...
We also have extremists among home-grown eco-nutts, as well as some very militant Native groups. Or even just some whack job with a mental issue or like the dumb*** from Moncton who just hated authority and wanted to lash out & go out 'in a blaze of glory' as a famous criminal.
Crablezworth wrote: Witness: "wearing black, long gun, caucasian, long black hair" that's the description of the shooter.
I know this isn't really the time for jokes, but: Trench Coat Mafia coming back??
And I've the feeling we're going to hear about the evils of Marylin Manson, and "heavy metal" music all over again
This is sounding more like the moncton thing.
Moncton? Sorry for my ignorance, but I've no idea what that is.... I was commenting on how, after Columbine, we had a whole spate of "news" people decrying the shooters as members of some made up gang, the "trench coat mafia" (or rather, it's what the two guys called themselves apparently), and we were blasted with how bad certain musicians were, certain video games... the usual.
There was a shooting in moncton in whicha crazy white dude shot a and killed some rcmp officers. No ideology other than being sort of a conspiracy weirdo.
Crablezworth wrote: Witness: "wearing black, long gun, caucasian, long black hair" that's the description of the shooter. Glad the mayor didn't call it a terror attack.
Experiment 626 wrote: At the very least cancelling the game is a classy sign of respect for the sacrifices made today and to give the city & those involved some time to greave properly.
I dissagree
is there a quote for that description?
police have the body, so far all they have confirmed is "male", and ive seen the witness say "Suddenly I saw a small guy with long black hair... with a long rifle, and he ran away after the shots, across streets in the direction of Parliament Hill," he said." on CBC
as for cancelling a sports game...
yes its a great idea, and common sense in the days when explosives are a thing, the metro and everything around those places is solid masses of people in tight spaces, on a normal day they have tons of cops there just for crowd control, on a day like this... you might not have the spare manpower as well.
Ottawa is massively over reacting at this point. People's facebook status's are acting like it's the boston bombing. Already we're seeing really trite hashtags. The only thing to worry about is the commute out of the core, that's gonna suck. Today was a bad episode of 24.
Crablezworth wrote: Ottawa is massively over reacting at this point. People's facebook status's are acting like its the boston bombing.
face book is one big over reaction,
24/7
But compared to getting FB bombed by the latest gore-suziki-wereallgonnadie clap trap or harper=hitler or crazy-farm-gem game invites, its probably one of the less insignificant news stories people share.
Crablezworth wrote: Ottawa is massively over reacting at this point. People's facebook status's are acting like its the boston bombing.
face book is one big over reaction,
24/7
But compared to getting FB bombed by the latest gore-suziki-wereallgonnadie clap trap or harper=hitler or crazy-farm-gem game invites, its probably one of the less insignificant news stories people share.
police report
Why is this less a concern than the Boston bombings?
Agreed on facebook though, one of the long list of reasons why I dont bother with it.
Why is this less a concern than the Boston bombings?
Agreed on facebook though, one of the long list of reasons why I dont bother with it.
I've got a facebook feed full of trite hashtags of "ottawastrong", I'm from ottawa, born here and raised and if there's one adjective I'd use to describe this city it certainly isn't strong. There was a tragic shooting and as such we will likely over react again which means no more yoga on the parliament lawn.
I just occaasionaly check my facebook for I do not live and die by the media. Reading other people posts over an incident making statements like they are a Subject Mater Expert is way........wait a minute..
Why is this less a concern than the Boston bombings?
Agreed on facebook though, one of the long list of reasons why I dont bother with it.
I've got a facebook feed full of trite hashtags of "ottawastrong", I'm from ottawa, born here and raised and if there's one adjective I'd use to describe this city it certainly isn't strong. There was a tragic shooting and as such we will likely over react again which means no more yoga on the parliament lawn.
My facebook is just full of people making sure everyone is okay. Nothing about over reacting.
Why is this less a concern than the Boston bombings?
Agreed on facebook though, one of the long list of reasons why I dont bother with it.
I've got a facebook feed full of trite hashtags of "ottawastrong", I'm from ottawa, born here and raised and if there's one adjective I'd use to describe this city it certainly isn't strong. There was a tragic shooting and as such we will likely over react again which means no more yoga on the parliament lawn.
I think its because of the specific location/target?
People get shot in ottawa but its not always this big of a deal, again I think the target/motive/location is factoring in.
oh, and the media circus of course.
you being in ottawa, most of your FB friends would feel more compelled to talk about it as well, I havnt seen much on my feed.
I agree with you though, I hope there are no over reactions and hastily made laws made in the wake of this.
I've got a facebook feed full of trite hashtags of "ottawastrong", I'm from ottawa, born here and raised and if there's one adjective I'd use to describe this city it certainly isn't strong. There was a tragic shooting and as such we will likely over react again which means no more yoga on the parliament lawn.
I can agree with public solidarity that terrorism should not win, this needed because otherwise it can.
My facebook is just full of people making sure everyone is okay. Nothing about over reacting.
Very understandable, though the media was specific about casualties early; the Honour Guard at the War Memorial were fired upon. However a lot of people will be worried about family working nearby.
In Israel a custom has developed that as soon as anyone hears a bomb blast and was not in it, they txt their family to let them know there are alright, many people have a pre-recorded message for that.
It's a solid social system, society has to be stronger than the bombers.
Why is this less a concern than the Boston bombings?
Agreed on facebook though, one of the long list of reasons why I dont bother with it.
I've got a facebook feed full of trite hashtags of "ottawastrong", I'm from ottawa, born here and raised and if there's one adjective I'd use to describe this city it certainly isn't strong. There was a tragic shooting and as such we will likely over react again which means no more yoga on the parliament lawn.
I doubt we'll end up going full-on "Fortress Parliament" mode like the US has gone, at least not long term.
For now and the near future, I'm sure getting tours through the Parliament buildings is going to be full of really sucky 100x extra layered security, and both the on-site RCMP & Parliamentary Security will be breathing down your neck just for trying to have a picnic on the hill...
But eventually things will relax and probably just go more added background techy and the tourist industry will just have to put up with bag scanning & a few dog sniffs.
They've been saying in reports that there's apparently something like 70! hi-def security cameras around the Hill... Here's to betting that'll get up'ed by at least another 70!
Crablezworth wrote: Talking about it is fine, it;'s the slogan bombardment that is too much.
Pretttttty much. I'm hoping that this is not ISIS related like some here have also said. Too many people are jumping the gun, saying that we're at war and need to bomb all the muslims.
Michael Zehaf-Bibeau identified as the dead shooter. A recent convert to Islam, as if anyone reading this is surprised...
The gunman in a fatal shooting that rocked Ottawa on Wendesday has been identified.
Canadian officials told the AP that the shooter, who killed a solider and wounded two others near the Canadian Parliament building, is Michael Zehaf-Bibeau.
Zehaf-Bibeau, 32, was from Quebec and had recently converted to Islam, U.S. sources told Reuters. According to the Globe and Mail, he had been designated a "high-risk traveler" by Canadian officials and was barred from traveling outside the country.
After police chased him inside the Parliament building, Zehaf-Bibeau was killed by Sgt. at Arms Kevin Vickers.
Witnesses told the AP that Zehaf-Bibeau was wearing a scarf over his face when he opened fire in front of the Canadian War Memorial, which is across the street from Parliament.
An Ottawa police spokesman told HuffPost that the police were looking for at least one other suspect. However, in a press conference later on Wednesday, officials declined to say if there were multiple possible shooters.
Wednesday's shooting quickly sparked terrorism fears. Just two days earlier, a Quebec man suspected of ties to radical Islam killed one soldier and wounded another with his car before being killed by police. As Reuters pointed out, Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu, the attacker, was one of 90 people being monitored by Canadian national police over extremist beliefs.
Earlier this month, NBC News reported that the Canadian government was monitoring "hundreds of people" that is suspected could be planning to join ISIS. Anonymous officials told NBC that they were aware of several threats from ISIS supporters, but they said that none were substantial.
Frazzled wrote: In periods of heavy phone usage, the cell lines can get clogged. Do texts get through?
Texts are more likely to get through but not guaranteed. They can/will retry unlike a voice call that will either be allocated a time slot on the tower/repeater or not.
MeanGreenStompa wrote: Michael Zehaf-Bibeau identified as the dead shooter. A recent convert to Islam, as if anyone reading this is surprised...
The gunman in a fatal shooting that rocked Ottawa on Wendesday has been identified.
Canadian officials told the AP that the shooter, who killed a solider and wounded two others near the Canadian Parliament building, is Michael Zehaf-Bibeau.
Zehaf-Bibeau, 32, was from Quebec and had recently converted to Islam, U.S. sources told Reuters. According to the Globe and Mail, he had been designated a "high-risk traveler" by Canadian officials and was barred from traveling outside the country.
After police chased him inside the Parliament building, Zehaf-Bibeau was killed by Sgt. at Arms Kevin Vickers.
Witnesses told the AP that Zehaf-Bibeau was wearing a scarf over his face when he opened fire in front of the Canadian War Memorial, which is across the street from Parliament.
An Ottawa police spokesman told HuffPost that the police were looking for at least one other suspect. However, in a press conference later on Wednesday, officials declined to say if there were multiple possible shooters.
Wednesday's shooting quickly sparked terrorism fears. Just two days earlier, a Quebec man suspected of ties to radical Islam killed one soldier and wounded another with his car before being killed by police. As Reuters pointed out, Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu, the attacker, was one of 90 people being monitored by Canadian national police over extremist beliefs.
Earlier this month, NBC News reported that the Canadian government was monitoring "hundreds of people" that is suspected could be planning to join ISIS. Anonymous officials told NBC that they were aware of several threats from ISIS supporters, but they said that none were substantial.
Experiment 626 wrote: Damn... I'd been hoping it was just a dumb*** idiot like with a hate-on like the Moncton shooter, or else a non-Islamist inspired gakhead.
Mayhaps CSIS should start rounding the known crazies up before this gets out of hand?
Why exactly would one have a preference for the motivations of the attacker?
I think calling this guy a terrorist is a bit hyperbolic, a wannabe terrorist maybe, but I mean this guy was just awful at being a terrorist. To call him a terrorist full on would mean he was effective at instilling terror, I would much rather call him a murderer or a moron or a wannabe because I simply refuse to let a homicidal moronic coward like this win. If yoga on the lawn of parliament is a thing of the past, if security and nationalism is cranked up to 11 we will only legitimize this cowardice and galvanize the radicals and frothing nationalists alike.
Crablezworth wrote: I think calling this guy a terrorist is a bit hyperbolic, wannabe terrorist maybe, but I mean this guy was just awful at being a terrorist.
Someone got killed by them/him. Pretty much North America went on heightening alert because of this action. Which on top of the two soldiers killed two days ago made everyone north of Mexico go "Whoa hold the Hell up now"
Crablezworth wrote: I think calling this guy a terrorist is a bit hyperbolic, wannabe terrorist maybe, but I mean this guy was just awful at being a terrorist.
Someone got killed by them/him. Pretty much North America went on heightening alert because of this action. Which on top of the two soldiers killed two days ago made everyone north of Mexico go "Whoa hold the Hell up now"
The more we let his actions change us, the more he earns his title, and in a sense the greater the victory for this piece of crap.
Crablezworth wrote: I think calling this guy a terrorist is a bit hyperbolic, wannabe terrorist maybe, but I mean this guy was just awful at being a terrorist.
Someone got killed by them/him. Pretty much North America went on heightening alert because of this action. Which on top of the two soldiers killed two days ago made everyone north of Mexico go "Whoa hold the Hell up now"
The more we let his actions change us, the more he earns his title, and in a sense the greater the victory for this piece of crap.
Trust me. Majority of terrorist are not professionals but then professionals are predictable. Your PM called it a terrorist attack for what it is. What some down south of you border view as work place violence. Question remains since the actions that have taken place are pretty much the actions one saw in Iraq and in Afghanistan. that we on the North American continent is having an "insurgency" issue now.
That one key ingredient that needs to happen before we are....
a short, slender, sharp-pointed metal pin with a raised helical thread running around it and a slotted head, used to join things together by being rotated so that it pierces wood or other material and is held tightly in place.
Jihadin wrote: That one key ingredient that needs to happen before we are....
a short, slender, sharp-pointed metal pin with a raised helical thread running around it and a slotted head, used to join things together by being rotated so that it pierces wood or other material and is held tightly in place.
Spoiler:
IED's
Just what I'm thinking. Another Oklahoma City or van in the World Trade Center and we're really off to the races. Question is if we'll go back in after ISIS or whoever in the MI. I think we all know it's just a matter of time.
Jihadin wrote: That one key ingredient that needs to happen before we are....
a short, slender, sharp-pointed metal pin with a raised helical thread running around it and a slotted head, used to join things together by being rotated so that it pierces wood or other material and is held tightly in place.
Spoiler:
IED's
Just what I'm thinking. Another Oklahoma City or van in the World Trade Center and we're really off to the races. Question is if we'll go back in after ISIS or whoever in the MI. I think we all know it's just a matter of time.
Or a pressure cooker bomb.
Or (and a guy was busted in my local area a while ago) a slew of pipe bombs.
And so on.
Big ANFO bombs are less likely at this point due to reporting requirements on purchasing the fertilizer in quantities needed. Smaller (yet clearly still deadly) bombs are more likely.
Jihadin wrote: That one key ingredient that needs to happen before we are....
a short, slender, sharp-pointed metal pin with a raised helical thread running around it and a slotted head, used to join things together by being rotated so that it pierces wood or other material and is held tightly in place.
Spoiler:
IED's
Just what I'm thinking. Another Oklahoma City or van in the World Trade Center and we're really off to the races. Question is if we'll go back in after ISIS or whoever in the MI. I think we all know it's just a matter of time.
Or a pressure cooker bomb.
Or (and a guy was busted in my local area a while ago) a slew of pipe bombs.
And so on.
Big ANFO bombs are less likely at this point due to reporting requirements on purchasing the fertilizer in quantities needed. Smaller (yet clearly still deadly) bombs are more likely.
You don't need to respond to every terrorist attack with an invasion and occupation hopefully. Especially since despite the superior training, weapons and tactics of your armed forces, it doesn't seem the "fix the problem" to kill a whole pile of Jihadists.
Glad they got the guy and glad it was before too many people were hurt.
Da Boss wrote: You don't need to respond to every terrorist attack with an invasion and occupation hopefully. Especially since despite the superior training, weapons and tactics of your armed forces, it doesn't seem the "fix the problem" to kill a whole pile of Jihadists.
Glad they got the guy and glad it was before too many people were hurt.
To tell the truth, the thing that worries me more is a wave of Mosque burnings and attacks on innocent Muslims in retaliation.
Da Boss wrote: You don't need to respond to every terrorist attack with an invasion and occupation hopefully. Especially since despite the superior training, weapons and tactics of your armed forces, it doesn't seem the "fix the problem" to kill a whole pile of Jihadists.
Glad they got the guy and glad it was before too many people were hurt.
True. But there seems to be some grain of truth to the "legend of Gen. Pershing in the Philippines", which would be totally illegal in today's "more tolerant" society.
Frazzled wrote: I'm surprised no one is calling for more gun control. I guess that will be tomorrow.
What more control can Canada have?? They already have registrations.... I guess the only thing left is to use those registrations to take some guns... Wait, that's already been done. So I guess it's time for Canada to take ALL THE GUNZ!!!
Frazzled wrote: I'm surprised no one is calling for more gun control. I guess that will be tomorrow.
wont take long for anti gun types to start dancing on the graves of the dead, screaming for more gun control.
Fact is, the shooter had multiple prior felony convictions, had no license for the firearm he had, and is totally ineligible to apply for a license to buy one due to his criminal record.
If anything needs reform... its the court system that lets unstable, multiple felons, walk in and out of it like its nothing....
I mean FFS, the guy who beheaded someone here 3-5 years ago on a grey hound is now allowed to leave the prison on furlong....
Frazzled wrote: I'm surprised no one is calling for more gun control. I guess that will be tomorrow.
wont take long for anti gun types to start dancing on the graves of the dead, screaming for more gun control.
Fact is, the shooter had multiple prior felony convictions, had no license for the firearm he had, and is totally ineligible to apply for a license to buy one due to his criminal record.
If anything needs reform... its the court system that lets unstable, multiple felons, walk in and out of it like its nothing....
I mean FFS, the guy who beheaded someone here 3-5 years ago on a grey hound is now allowed to leave the prison on furlong....
Sadly, we only have an 'Injustice System' at the moment...
If our system had any kind of teeth, a lifelong loser felon like this idiot would have earned 'dangerous offender' status and thus we could have kept him behind bars where he belonged.
That and we really need to throw out this BS of awarding convicted criminals "time served awaiting trial discounts" upon their actual sentencing...
@Frazzled: While we do have really strict gun control up here, the Conservs did finally turf the expensive & pointless long gun registry a few years back.
Of course, the anti-gun lobby will point to yesterday's tragedy as some kind of "proof" that Harper is evil and if he hadn't done away with the registry it would have of course prevented a career criminal from illegally obtaining his weapon and carrying out his attack.
But then, you're also talking about the country where the anti-gun lobby & their political friends believe the answer to combat urban gun crime is to just ban the sale of bullets within the big city!
As far as this sort of thing goes, I don't think gun control is the answer at all. If someone like that wants to get a gun or a bomb, the only thing that is going to stop them is getting caught by counter intelligence before the event. And that can be kind of a crap shoot.
I think the "solution" (if there even is one) is likely to be pretty complex and long term, and more likely to involve trying to engage with disenfranchised people in society so they don't become potential recruits for these sorts of movements.
I mean, I say that, but to be fair, if history has shown us anything it's that there will always be some angry young men out there willing to use violence to make their point.
Da Boss wrote: As far as this sort of thing goes, I don't think gun control is the answer at all. If someone like that wants to get a gun or a bomb, the only thing that is going to stop them is getting caught by counter intelligence before the event. And that can be kind of a crap shoot.
I think the "solution" (if there even is one) is likely to be pretty complex and long term, and more likely to involve trying to engage with disenfranchised people in society so they don't become potential recruits for these sorts of movements.
I mean, I say that, but to be fair, if history has shown us anything it's that there will always be some angry young men out there willing to use violence to make their point.
Don't get me wrong, I 100% agree with this.
The cynic in me is just waiting, that by next week, the likes of the NDP will turn around and use this as so-called "proof" that things like the moronic and now dead & buried long gun registry would have somehow prevented such an attack, more gun control/national 'assault weapon' ban is needed, etc...
I agree that the only real & viable 'answer' to the current problem of young men being radicalised here at home is going to instead involve much more long term & complex plans. Such as one of the current pilot projects going on up here right now, involving the co-operation of CSIS & RCMP intel identifying potential individuals and then working with both the local Muslim community members & police services to try and de-radicalise impressionable youth.
It won't always be successful, as the Quebec case proved, but hopefully such programs can help in the long term.
But then, I also believe that we need to get much tougher on the known rabble rousers such as Imams who preach hard-line Islamist views & intolerance, arrest them under hate crime laws and toss them into a deep dark cell to rot...
Otherwise any efforts to get to potential radical 'recruits' is pointless since we'll just have one batch (hopefully) de-radicalised, only to have another new crop ready to commit violent acts because we refuse to nip the problem at it's real source.
Frazzled wrote: I'm surprised no one is calling for more gun control. I guess that will be tomorrow.
wont take long for anti gun types to start dancing on the graves of the dead, screaming for more gun control.
Fact is, the shooter had multiple prior felony convictions, had no license for the firearm he had, and is totally ineligible to apply for a license to buy one due to his criminal record.
If anything needs reform... its the court system that lets unstable, multiple felons, walk in and out of it like its nothing....
I mean FFS, the guy who beheaded someone here 3-5 years ago on a grey hound is now allowed to leave the prison on furlong....
Ehh, Canadians don't tend to really debate about gun control because we already have enough (or arguably more than enough).
We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
I don't follow you. Are you suggesting the reason they have power is because they behead others?
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
I don't follow you. Are you suggesting the reason they have power is because they behead others?
That's part of it, yes. They exercise control primarily through fear and violence, not by offering a modicum of stability.
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
I don't follow you. Are you suggesting the reason they have power is because they behead others?
That's part of it, yes. They exercise control primarily through fear and violence, not by offering a modicum of stability.
Might want to look up the rise of ISIS and all that.
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
I don't follow you. Are you suggesting the reason they have power is because they behead others?
That's part of it, yes. They exercise control primarily through fear and violence, not by offering a modicum of stability.
Might want to look up the rise of ISIS and all that.
feeder wrote: We cannot "fight" these radical ideas with bombs and soldiers. The reason ISIS has power is because they are able to offer their people a measure of stability and security in a land that has none. That they are brutal and inhuman to their enemies doesn't matter, people always accept a large injustice against the "others" if it means a small comfort for "ourselves".
The only way we can effectively "fight" ISIS is by stopping the bombing, raise the standard of living of the average citizen over there, encourage universal education. Insane ideas like "let's have a religious holy war" need desperate people to implement them. Starving, uneducated people living in a war zone.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I think you need to do some more research on the subject. The reason ISIS has power doesn't have anything to do with offering stability.
What do you mean? What's so bad about murdering everyone who doesn't agree with you, selling women into forced sex slavery & torturing children for amusement? They've got houses to offer their fighters man, that's some serious stability offering right there! Maybe next we can show them we're not so bad by building an all-girls school for them because, equality is bound to be something they'll set aside their medieval ideology for, right?!
All sarcastic joking aside, just want to throw out that being Friday, if you want to show support, wear red to show your support for our troops!
There's also a movement going on to allow both our lost soldiers to be given an honourary final journey down the Highway of Heroes.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I know the guy who does a lot of the targeteering for this, and I can tell you that our guys are not dropping bombs 'KNOWING they WILL kill children'. In fact the target approval process and targeteering for the targets being hit makes killing kids by our pilots unlikely. Unless of course Da'Ish is strapping innocent kids in the backs of their pickup trucks or chaining them to ammo cache sites.
"I'm a crack addict and at the same time I'm a religious person... I want to sacrifice freedom and good things... so when I come out, I'll appreciate the things of life more and be clean."- Michael Zehaf-Bibeau, Dec. 2011 Any ties to the islamic state yet? Al Qaeda? This guys must obviously part of the elite unit... We're seriously gonna ramp up security and nationalism because a crackhead killed one person then ineffectively stormed parliament?
Clearly SOMETHING changed between Dec 2011 and now. He was trying to get to Syria, he had been associating with a guy on the watch list who had gone to Syria to fight.
It wouldn't be the first time some crap bag loser with lots of issues ended up radicalized.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I know the guy who does a lot of the targeteering for this, and I can tell you that our guys are not dropping bombs 'KNOWING they WILL kill children'. In fact the target approval process and targeteering for the targets being hit makes killing kids by our pilots unlikely. Unless of course Da'Ish is strapping innocent kids in the backs of their pickup trucks or chaining them to ammo cache sites.
Do they really call them targeteers? Please tell me you at least got your friend a tshirt with his name across the chest and that you greet him with Hey there Hi there Ho there as often as possible.
CptJake wrote: Clearly SOMETHING changed between Dec 2011 and now. He was trying to get to Syria, he had been associating with a guy on the watch list who had gone to Syria to fight.
It wouldn't be the first time some crap bag loser with lots of issues ended up radicalized.
Our leader has connected these people's actions to the islamic state. anything that is claimed without evidence can be dismissed without evidence., it's conspiracy horsegak until they have direct evidence.
You know what, let's pretend they had direct evidence of these two separate incidences being linked as part of one terrorist cell that proves to be directly connected to the islamic state, let's say xenophobes and nationalists and frothing joingoists get that much evidence. All it says is their capabilities are laughable and they suck at being terrorists.
This guy was a crackhead staying in an ottawa homeless shelter, if this is the elite unit I think we'll be fine.
My countrymen fly CF-18s and drop bombs KNOWING they WILL kill children over there. I accept this because... my freedom? security? I really don't know anymore.
I know the guy who does a lot of the targeteering for this, and I can tell you that our guys are not dropping bombs 'KNOWING they WILL kill children'. In fact the target approval process and targeteering for the targets being hit makes killing kids by our pilots unlikely. Unless of course Da'Ish is strapping innocent kids in the backs of their pickup trucks or chaining them to ammo cache sites.
Do they really call them targeteers? Please tell me you at least got your friend a tshirt with his name across the chest and that you greet him with Hey there Hi there Ho there as often as possible.
CptJake wrote: Clearly SOMETHING changed between Dec 2011 and now. He was trying to get to Syria, he had been associating with a guy on the watch list who had gone to Syria to fight.
It wouldn't be the first time some crap bag loser with lots of issues ended up radicalized.
Our leader has connected these people's actions to the islamic state. anything that is claimed without evidence can be dismissed without evidence., it's conspiracy horsegak until they have direct evidence.
You know what, let's pretend they had direct evidence of these two separate incidences being linked as part of one terrorist cell that proves to be directly connected to the islamic state, let's say xenophobes and nationalists and frothing joingoists get that much evidence. All it says is their capabilities are laughable and they suck at being terrorists.
This guy was a crackhead staying in an ottawa homeless shelter, if this is the elite unit I think we'll be fine.
The dumb*** was 'inspired by ISIS'. He doesn't have to have any actual ties to the group, just that he ended up believing in a crazy, fethed-up perversion of a religion, was already angry/anti-social/high/whatever, and decided to go and commit a horrible & cowardly act aimed at sowing terror and attacking symbols of our national values.
It's actually not that hard a concept to grasp...
ISIS has on multiple occasions called on those who believe the horsegak ideals they believe to take it upon themselves to kill Canadians, Americans, Brits, French, Aussies - anyone who's "an infidel." (ie: it's like calling out to Loafs fans that this year the cup's coming home so they should go and plan the parade right now )
ISIS isn't giving actual training to these crazy gakkers. It's probable that most of what's already happened, and what sadly will likely continue to happen for the foreseeable future, will be the work of angry, radicalised idiots who haven't gone anywhere overseas to fight/train.
Just because these lone wolf attackers have sucked massively at killing & maiming more than a couple of victims at a time doesn't mean the threat should be ignored as "lolz ISIS terrorists are epic failz!lolzlolzlolz!!!"
CptJake wrote: Clearly SOMETHING changed between Dec 2011 and now. He was trying to get to Syria, he had been associating with a guy on the watch list who had gone to Syria to fight.
It wouldn't be the first time some crap bag loser with lots of issues ended up radicalized.
Our leader has connected these people's actions to the islamic state. anything that is claimed without evidence can be dismissed without evidence., it's conspiracy horsegak until they have direct evidence.
You know what, let's pretend they had direct evidence of these two separate incidences being linked as part of one terrorist cell that proves to be directly connected to the islamic state, let's say xenophobes and nationalists and frothing joingoists get that much evidence. All it says is their capabilities are laughable and they suck at being terrorists.
This guy was a crackhead staying in an ottawa homeless shelter, if this is the elite unit I think we'll be fine.
The dumb*** was 'inspired by ISIS'."
Evidence?
The thing is, without evidence to back up anything you've said I can just as easily say he was inspired by toyata to murder canadians for the rand corporation in conjunction with the reverse vampires. I don't need to prove that mind you, it feels right, there's truthiness there.
I would link a Fox source on a Imam calling on the faithful to to attack western nations being Canada was pretty much (IIRC) singled out for attack. This guy tried to join ISIS and had his passport yanked, Right?
Bear with me being on pain meds and working out sedatives.
Jihadin wrote: I would link a Fox source on a Imam calling on the faithful to to attack western nations being Canada was pretty much (IIRC) singled out for attack. This guy tried to join ISIS and had his passport yanked, Right?
Yes, but as I understand it he was applying to get a passport to go to Syria after converting to Islam to most likely join ISIS. He was having problems getting the passport so he decided to attack parliment instead.
Jihadin wrote: I would link a Fox source on a Imam calling on the faithful to to attack western nations being Canada was pretty much (IIRC) singled out for attack. This guy tried to join ISIS and had his passport yanked, Right?
Yes, but as I understand it he was applying to get a passport to go to Syria after converting to Islam to most likely join ISIS. He was having problems getting the passport so he decided to attack parliment instead.
And again we need direct evidence of his intentions, not inferences. Here's a difference, I could claim he wanted to go to libya because he was part libyan. That's an infrerrence mind you, I can't prove that that was his intent, because to prove that I would need evidence.
So we have a ISIS wannabe who appear to have wanted to join ISIS but could not do it so he carried out a attack possibly in their name. ISIS was quick to pounce on that bit of propaganda.
So why the attack on the war memorial then. Why target the soldier and then go at Parliament.
So we have a ISIS wannabe who appear to have wanted to join ISIS but could not do it so he carried out a attack possibly in their name. ISIS was quick to pounce on that bit of propaganda.
So why the attack on the war memorial then. Why target the soldier and then go at Parliament.
It doesn't appear well planned. It's possible he shot him because he looked like the first good target.
So we have a ISIS wannabe who appear to have wanted to join ISIS but could not do it so he carried out a attack possibly in their name. ISIS was quick to pounce on that bit of propaganda.
So why the attack on the war memorial then. Why target the soldier and then go at Parliament.
It doesn't appear well planned. It's possible he shot him because he looked like the first good target.
Or a target to make a statement.
Canada votes to assist the US in bombing ISIS
Imam from ISIS calls on attack on western nations who also single out Canada to be attacked
Two soldier killed by a vehicle and driver killed by LEO two days before this attack
Then a Soldier killed at the War Memorial
Same individual made a attack on the parliament where he was opted out.
Edit
What's the distance from Memorial to Parliament. He had numerous targets he could have taken out. Mainly LEO but he went for the soldier and then jacked a car(?) and went for Parliament
So we have a ISIS wannabe who appear to have wanted to join ISIS but could not do it so he carried out a attack possibly in their name. ISIS was quick to pounce on that bit of propaganda.
So why the attack on the war memorial then. Why target the soldier and then go at Parliament.
It doesn't appear well planned. It's possible he shot him because he looked like the first good target.
I think it was because he had a gun so he probably saw him as a threat. Later he can be seen running past many other unarmed people. Apparently the soldier's gun wasn't even loaded . It's more of a ceremonial role but I bet that will change from now on.
So that awards me psychic powers, so I can totally infer he wanted to go to libya. I can't actually know the motives of a dead man mind you, but, it just feels right.
So we have a ISIS wannabe who appear to have wanted to join ISIS but could not do it so he carried out a attack possibly in their name. ISIS was quick to pounce on that bit of propaganda.
So why the attack on the war memorial then. Why target the soldier and then go at Parliament.
It doesn't appear well planned. It's possible he shot him because he looked like the first good target.
Or a target to make a statement.
Canada votes to assist the US in bombing ISIS
Imam from ISIS calls on attack on western nations who also single out Canada to be attacked
Two soldier killed by a vehicle and driver killed by LEO two days before this attack
Then a Soldier killed at the War Memorial
Same individual made a attack on the parliament where he was opted out.
Edit
What's the distance from Memorial to Parliament. He had numerous targets he could have taken out. Mainly LEO but he went for the soldier and then jacked a car(?) and went for Parliament
The entire attack was about a minute and 22 seconds I think so not far.
What's the distance from Memorial to Parliament. He had numerous targets he could have taken out. Mainly LEO but he went for the soldier and then jacked a car(?) and went for Parliament
Less than 500 meters, more like 350. In the closed circuit video that's been put out, you see people running away from him but he doesn't fire on any of them.
What's the distance from Memorial to Parliament. He had numerous targets he could have taken out. Mainly LEO but he went for the soldier and then jacked a car(?) and went for Parliament
Less than 500 meters, more like 350. In the closed circuit video that's been put out, you see people running away from him but he doesn't fire on any of them.
Mhmm, I was gonna say that as well. He jacked an MP's car, but didn't shoot the MP himself.
Khornholio wrote: So, did the cops catch the other guys they were looking for?
The "second shooter" was due to mass hysteria more or less, people were claiming there was another shooter in a nearby mall, but there was nothing to that.
Especially with he fact that even in photos from the day it's hard to tell who's a cop, who's a soldier, and everything in between. The reality is if it was a mumbai style thing, the "terrorists" shooters or whatever could just as easily be wearing tac gear/vest and sporting a submachine gun or assault rifle.
At this point we're all waiting for the rcmp to release the video buddy recorded. I'm tired of inferences.
That's true. They almost always report that there are multiple shooters at first (or that there might be), and they're almost always wrong.
Sadly, the actual truth, as it's happening doesn't "sell"... Which, IMHO is the great travesty of the modern media machine.... What happened to the days (that obviously never actually existed) where the News reported the facts as they were known?
That's true. They almost always report that there are multiple shooters at first (or that there might be), and they're almost always wrong.
Sadly, the actual truth, as it's happening doesn't "sell"... Which, IMHO is the great travesty of the modern media machine.... What happened to the days (that obviously never actually existed) where the News reported the facts as they were known?
I wouldn't be surprised if those never existed. Even in the origins of print journalism in the early Renaissance, people sensationalized their stories (for example, I read a Renaissance pamphlet about how a Java native killed some British sailors and the writer was playing it up that the Java man was a barbarian, sub-human, heathen, possessed, etc).
It's just a more pronounced problem now because, instead of waiting for hours (or even a day) for the information to become more solidified, news has to be instant. In the quest to report the news first, there isn't time for fact checking, hence why we end up with news reporting multiple shooters, that the shooter was an ISIS sleeper agent, etc before these are even verified.
I'd only go so far as to say that we're "better" today about combating Yellow Journalism which was a huge problem in the early 20th Century. Further, I think that some news men, like Walter Kronkite tried to bring a respectability into the profession by talking facts as much as possible, even if there was still a bias or playing up of details.
Wait, that's already been done. So I guess it's time for Canada to take ALL THE GUNZ!!! 
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