What are your favorite army's least to greatest

Daemons is my favourite, the randomness just throws a spanner in any pre-made plans so its full of surprises each game

Tau is least favourite, its so run of the mill and least interesting playstyle that also requires the least amout of thought and adaption, each game its the same strategy for me so I dont enjoy playing with them as my army or against them due to predictability.

If my profile didn't give it away, Orks are my favourite, given their uniqueness in the 40K setting as one of the few races being happy in their lot in life in the galaxy, not to mention their awesome ramshackle tech and grim but humorous mindset.

Least Favourite is probably Space Wolves or Tyranids, one for being one of the weirdest marine factions in terms of being marines +1 and having plot armour thick even for SM, the other mainly because Nids as a faction never really interested me.

My favourite faction is definitely the Orks, and this is coming from a guard player. I love their sense of humor and the overall aesthetics of the army. And I love the randomness of everything although it has been toned down.

I've really only played as a few armies but my least favourite to battle against is definitely the tau. And this is mostly due to the jump shoot jump mechanic on EVERYTHING. Or the ignores cover on EVERYTHING. Of course I'm exaggerating. But man that is a frustrating army to play against!

My favorite faction?

Probably a three way tie between Chaos Space Marines, Orks, and IG. I really like a lot of the concepts and art around the CSM's, particularly the older stuff, while IG does it for the treadhead in me, and Orks have some really great background and attract a certain class of easy going player typically.

Least favorite?

Space Wolves in terms of fluff/background. It's...seriously beyond even internet fanfic bad at this point, seriously goofy, contradictory, and poorly written, they make Tau look interesting and fitting to the 40k background.

In terms of gaming? Probably Necrons and Eldar (and I say this as someone who owns probably 5kpts of Eldar). Neither are particularly fun to play against or with, and unless they're playing each other or a gimmick'd up Daemon/AdMech/SM army, they pretty much auto-pilot themselves to victory. This however is less of an issue than the problem with Space Wolves

I myself like the imperial guard, orks, and chaos space marines and i hate the tau and necrons

Fav: IG/Scions

Standard human standing up to bigger stuff and generally holding the line, Scions especially, because they're usually to most things they fight.


Least Fav: Orks

I have yet to find a single good thing to say about them, except for the fact that they die by the thousands in books featuring them.

I think don't think I have ever seen some one who had Orks there least favorite

Ork is da best! There is nothing quite like screaming Waaagh! at the top of your lungs, having great close fought games, seeing your opponent smile as he blows apart a hand full of boyz with every shot (and knowing that he can't kill enough to survive another turn of Waaagh!).

Ork don't lose. Ever.
Kit bashing!
Looting!
Waaagh!
Looting!
Converting!
Green!
Waaagh!

Least favorite I'd have to say is termi heavy army's or gunlines. Both just don't make for a fun game to me.

Did I mention looting? I am about to field 30 lobbas in an 1850 double CAD list! That's 30 str 5 ap5 rerolls once eah large blasts at 48 inches!!! Waaagh!

 Lord Inquisitor Nathandar wrote:
I think don't think I have ever seen some one who had Orks there least favorite

First thing for everything I guess

Favorite: Chaos Space Marines. Fun fluff, most interesting backstory and motivations imo (Harlequins run a close second with their plots to kill Slaanesh), and Kharn is a pretty cool guy. I like their model line, at least the updated ones, especially Raptors and Warp Talons. Heldrakes are pretty cool, too. Only thing I dislike is their table top performance.

Least favorite: Necrons. While Newcrons have more interesting fluff, they're kinda boring, a lot of the paint schemes I've seen are uninspired, and they're not a lot of fun to play against because of Reanimation and the ability to hurt any unit in the game with their basic weapons.

 Lord Inquisitor Nathandar wrote:
What are your favorite army's least to greatest

Favorite: Tau Empire. I started 40K with them at the very end of 3rd and have loved them ever since.

Least: Imperial Knights. They don't belong in normal 40K.

Favorite Dark Angels

Least Favorite Ad Mech just annoying and no matter what I do I cannot figure out a list to go against them and live

Yeah first time for everything

Favorite: Khorne Daemonkin

Least Favorite: Tau

Favorite is Eldar since third edition.

Least favorite is Tyranids.

Favorites
1. CSM
2. Necrons
3. DA

Least: Officio Assassinorum, Imperial Knights (Knight as LoW is good in other armies, but not in standalone)

Favorites:

1. CSM
2. Sisters of Battle
3. Imperial Guard

Least Favorites:

1. Grey Knights
2. Necrons
3. Ultramarines

Fluffy

Waacah

From top to bottom
Orks
Space Wolves
Tau
Grey Knights
(Bunch of other stuff I don't play but are still cool)
.
.
.
.
.
.
Doing Taxes
Public Speaking
Root Canal
Eldar

My favourites are Harlequins, Exodites (who doesn't want to ride a dinosaur?) and the Guard (mainly the underdog factor).

My least favourite are Space Marines in general. I find them boring and bland.

Favorites: It's a joint first place for Eldar and Harliquins, the fluff and the aesthetic are amazing.
I really do enjoy my flyers and the Crimson hunter has got to be one of the most smexy in the game (and anything with vector dancer is fun to use), the codex is quite frankly amazing in that I can create valid armies for any theme I want...
Harlequins have some of the most fun psykers in the game and can do absurd things in CC, maybe when the game makes the assault more viable I'll be able to use them a little more.


Most Hated: Tau... gameplay wise I find them a bit dull and for someone who loves their planes, interceptor and skyfire kinda puts a dampener on that...

...That said, the real reason is fluff wise I hate kroot with a fiery passion

Fave is probably IG followed closely by SW and Orks.

I don't teally have a least favourite. Least interesting to me would be perhaps Necrons? They don't ring my bell aesthetically and their fluff isn't something I know.
Followed by 40K era space marines. Snooze...

Favourite: Dark Angels. I love the variable play styles and Gav Thorpe's books.

Least Favourite:Game mechanics wise Tau. Stylewise Space Wolves. Just don't understand the appeal tbh.

Favourite is Tau. Picked them up in 3rd Ed when assault reigned supreme so having a shooting army that wasn't Imperial Guard (My first army and the one I played at the time) was a novelty. I grew up in the 80's with Transformers and Voltron so I have a nostalgic soft spot for mech's and battlesuits.

Least favourite highly depends on the player. I have had great games against every army and I have had bad games. If I had to pick one army though I guess I would say space marines because they are by far the most common. I like variety so playing against space marines almost 50% of the time does get a tad stale.

For me I'm gonna have to divide this by fluff and gaming:

Most favorite:

Fluff: Mood shifts between Night Lords and Orks. Atm I would say NL because I love the NL Omnibus (ADB is love, ADB is life) and the concept of Space Punisher with a Batman aesthetic and being wronged by the Imperium and therefore only want to tear it down appeals to me the most.

Orks because I love how tough they appear to be and how much of a threat they really establish with Ghazkull looming over the Tau Empire supposedly making Farsight crap himself a new one (or so I've been told) with Ghazzy handing a new one to the bugs, all the while almost prefecting the Tellyporta technology so you can have Ghazkulls WAAAGH!!! spilling over from one end of the galaxy to another like an ork-only eye of terra. Thats scary stuff.

Gaming: with IA: 13 My Night lords, Now I play Dreadclaw Spam with Contemptors and Decimators. Life is good

Least favorite:

Fluff: The Inquisition: These guys spill for the SS Vibes to me combined with organized religious zealot-ism that whilst I love that for the dark grittyness of 40k, I don't personally like. Plus I don't really like the fanbase for people who like 'em because they always seem top want to pull that +1 over Chaos, even though there are many ways that Chaos play and can outwit and do to the Inquisition adding to the intriguing political darkness to the 41st Millenium, the fanbase just doesn't seem to want to hear that and blindly happy-press the Extermainatus Button, even though that subject is A) more dark than I think the fanbase realizes and B) There are ways that Chaos can prevent Exterminatus by cutting off the black ships by warp storms or their target in warp storms.

Rules-wise: Eldar. Do I really need to say anything more?

Controversial opinions, yes I know but hey add more to discuss I suppose

Favorite: A tie between 30k Thousand Sons and 30k Death Guard, then come all forms of Imperial Fists, then all forms of IG, Daemons (nurgle), Tau
Least: Dark Angels (team killing bums), Daemons (Tzeentch), Knights (mainly for being the spearhead of 'actual' model inflation)

Orks first and foremost as they were my first army when I started at the tail end of 3rd and I always seem to have the most fun when putting together/painting their kits. A close second favorite and my third army started is Dark Angels. I love their fluff LOVE it and dark green is my favorite color irl so when I went looking for a Space Marine army it was a no brainer, though I do wish I had access to things like Thunderfire Cannons and Centurions. Third would be my Tau. I have always liked the Tau, I liked the fluff surrounding the ethereals, the mecha bot aesthetics of their warsuits and mastery of plasma weapons plus the new kits have been a blast to put together and pose. Fourth favorite and second started is my chaos force. I love the models all the skulls, horns, spikes, bronze arrows and demonic iconography hit my pubescent metal loving gland just right. They are in various stages of completion as a combined warband of The Cleaved and Alpha Legion. I intend on adding to that force drastically when CSM gets updated. The rest of the factions are in various levels of disinterest though if I had to pick a least favorite it would probably be tyranids but even that is changing as I'm considering starting a Genestealer cult army, but I want to see the standalone kits first.

Favorites: Tyranids and Eldar, I find their models fantastic and their stories compelling.

Least: Space Wolves. Codex Thundercalv and it's bizarre happenings at the vet.

I have a love for all things gothic and ornate. Hence why I got into Warhammer to begin with.

Chaos Marines
Space Marines (specifically Black Templars or Dark Angels, anything super gothic)
Grey Knights
Sisters of Battle
Dark Eldar
Tyranids
Necrons
Orks
Eldar
Guard
Tau (who don't even belong in the 40K universe)
Daemons (they used to look cool back in 6th ed. Now the new plastic models look pants)

Favourite: Chaos daemons, followed closely by CSM, then craft world eldar. This holds for both fluff and game play.

Least favourite: fluff wise, orks. Their "anything happens if we believe it enough" is absurdly stupid and so is every ork that ever existed. None of their machines would actually be effective, their society wouldn't work, their "limitless in number" plot armour seems so lazy even compared to space wolves plot armour, they have worse technology than we did 100 years ago and that simply would never ever translate to any sort of capability vs. The rest of the factions, in real life. In my opinion, they don't belong in the setting and I can't take anything written about them or any game I play against them seriously in a narrative sense. That being said I've always had fun in a game sense playing against them, I've never felt hopelessly outclassed or as if I was hopelessly outclassing them, and it's fun to drop so many bodies during a game.

Gamewise, I dislike playing against tau and also BA. Tau is just boring and has too many things that require no effort or thought to subvert whatever tactics I might have. BA because it isn't really their fault, I just always feel like their units are so expensive that they can't put much on the table in a game, and the units they have hemorrhage points like crazy vs my daemons, it's basically just a game of target priority... i have too much that ignores their expensive armour and my units can often roll over many of theirs. I feel like they need a massive boost. I really like BA fluff wise and model wise but any game I play against them feels like punching a bag full of infant puppies.

Favorite: Dark Angels, Orks, or Daemons

Least Favorite: Tau, Eldar, or any all bike SM armies. Their power levels over shadow a lot of fun that could be had with the armies

 Vankraken wrote:
From top to bottom
Orks
Space Wolves
Tau
Grey Knights
(Bunch of other stuff I don't play but are still cool)
.
.
.
.
.
.
Doing Taxes
Public Speaking
Root Canal
Eldar

Gonna have to disagree with you here mate.

I'd rather speak in public than do my taxes.

Favorite:

1. Necrons
2. Tyranids
3. Eldar
4. Tzeentch Daemons
4. Blood Angels
5. Raven Guard (C:SM)

Least Favorite:

1. Dark Eldar
3. Chaos Space Marines
4. Any other Daemons
5. Grey Knights


Anything I didn't mention is something I don't care for, but don't particularly hate.

This seems to be my best thread so far thank you everyone

 Lord Inquisitor Nathandar wrote:
This seems to be my best thread so far thank you everyone

10/10 would thread again.
But favorite, CSM, my first and favorite army. Second off is the tau, mainly because I love robots I have a small collection of them that I actually converted heavily to ally with my chaos band. Third off is orks, never played them but I like the fluff.

Least favorite would probably be space wolves, but I don't really hate them either, they just don't intrest me as much as the other armies.

If you like my posts please Exalt thank you

Fav: Flesh Tearers due to the fluff. Seth realizes they're a dying chapter and wants then to go out the best way they can: by answering calls for help and helping whoever needs it.
And IG. I like the normal Humana holding the line against all the nastiness out there.

Least: what the SW have become. They were my first army but riding around on wolves and that Stormfang? What a joke. Besides SW: tau and crons. Super boring fluff and play.

Favorite would be Chaos Space Marines. They are so metal. Khorne is a close second, for being so macabre (he collects tithes of blood and skulls, how metal). If only CSM's rules would reflect that they are one of the greatest threats to the imperium, or even on equal footing with vanilla SM...

Least favorite would probably be Tau. Not for gameplay reasons, a highly-technologically advanced opponent that is few in number but high in firepower is not such a big deal. It is what it is. I just don't like the whole "bushido" thing they pretty much blatantly ripped off of Japanese culture, if the Mecha suits weren't ripping it off enough. Just seems like an obvious ploy to pull in anime fans, which I am not... just my opinion.

2nd least favorite would probably be eldar. That is for gameplay reasons. They got a stupidly good codex while us CSM players are stuck using Khorne Daemonkin rules to have the merest possibility of having competitive games.

My favorite race is Eldar, all Eldar. Craftworlders, the Dark kin of Commoragh, Harlequins, Corsairs, Exodites, you name it. I love that the primary difference between them is simply their reaction to Slaanesh.

"Oh crap, our deviant behavior and use of psychic energy created a chaos god that killed most of us"
Craftworlders: "Let's form a strict disciplinarian society to prevent this from happening again."
Dark Eldar: "Screw that! We'll keep doing what we want, we'll just leave psychic powers out of it.'
Corsairs: "We think we might try a little of both those ideas"
Exodites: "All of you are crazy, we're going to return to a simpler lo-tech way of live over here on these agricultural planets"
Harlequins: "Laughing god's got our back! We are all the same people, let's get along!"
------

My least favorite army is by far Imperial Guard.
GW: "In this game of high sci-fi fantasy, you can choose a variety of super humans soldiers in armour, diverse alien races, evil from another dimension,....or human, plain ordinary humans."
Me:"Are they technologically advanced?"
GW:"Not really, imagine WW2 with laser pointers"
Me:"Oh, sorry, I don't play Flames of War. Can you tell me more about the sci-fi armies?"

--

 Galef wrote:

My least favorite army is by far Imperial Guard.
GW: "In this game of high sci-fi fantasy, you can choose a variety of super humans soldiers in armour, diverse alien races, evil from another dimension,....or human, plain ordinary humans."
Me:"Are they technologically advanced?"
GW:"Not really, imagine WW2 with laser pointers"
Me:"Oh, sorry, I don't play Flames of War. Can you tell me more about the sci-fi armies?"

--

This all plays into the whole retro-futue dystopian vibe that 40k is built on. It's a big part of what makes 40k well...40k.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Galef wrote:

My least favorite army is by far Imperial Guard.
GW: "In this game of high sci-fi fantasy, you can choose a variety of super humans soldiers in armour, diverse alien races, evil from another dimension,....or human, plain ordinary humans."
Me:"Are they technologically advanced?"
GW:"Not really, imagine WW2 with laser pointers"
Me:"Oh, sorry, I don't play Flames of War. Can you tell me more about the sci-fi armies?"

--

This all plays into the whole retro-futue dystopian vibe that 40k is built on. It's a big part of what makes 40k well...40k.

I know, and GW does a surprisingly good job of showing human society in a galactic "dark age". I just like stuff that is farther from reality in my sci-fi. I am human (I think) so I find humans boring in a fantasy setting.

My other favorite armies from a fluff standpoint are Daemons, Necrons and Tau. So that should say a bite about where I am coming from. I like Space Marines, but mostly from a "Heroic, better than Human, but still flawed" standpoint.

Complete opposite for me, can't enjoy games where I can't play humans

I love CSM and, to a degree, Eldar. I like most factions.

I partially dislike IG (an interpretation of them) and I am disliking Orks more and more. They are so horribly inconsistent - they can't decide if they want to be an infighting slapstick army with machinery that blows up if you look at it harshly or a mighty, organised and effective army.

No, I do not believe they can be both at the same time. There's limits to how much impossibility even 40k can handle.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Complete opposite for me, can't enjoy games where I can't play humans

Humans are fine as long as you emphasise that you are ONLY HUMAN. You are less than cannon fodder to the countless hilariously lethal supersoldiers and alien races to the galaxy, and you get sent in human wave attacks where your primary way to inflict casualties is to trample the enemy to death.

'Humanity feth yeah' doesn't feel like it has a place in 40k beyond one-in-a-billion cases like Ollanius Pius). This is a grimdark setting, not Halo or Crysis. If you want a setting where your average joe and his rifle will get the job done, and both Joe and his civilisation can feel genuine hope for tomorrow, you should look elsewhere than the setting that's the origin of the 'grimdark' term!

The only crazy alien race is probably the Eldars and the Necrons, the rest will usually die rather quickly to a lasgun shot.

Marines aren't really super duper, either. Just oyu know, better.

 Bobthehero wrote:
The only crazy alien race is probably the Eldars and the Necrons, the rest will usually die rather quickly to a lasgun shot.

Tyranids, as well - Gaunts are perfectly evolved for their battlefield role and very adaptable, unlike humans who really are incredibly inefficient, weak and fragile when you think about it. For an example, consider chimpanzees, who are by no means as optimised yet are still much stronger than humans even though they are smaller!

And a case can be made for the very resilient Orks, though we both know what we think of those. And Tau who just have a big technology advantage (though the IG CAN compensate for that with raw numbers)

Marines aren't really super duper, either. Just oyu know, better.

Again, this is not Halo. Space Marines are not ODSTs like people believe, they are Spartans +10. As average joe with a lasgun, if you decide to join in the battle of the big boys, you are going to achieve little more than being a very shiny red stain.

An Ork boy, a Nid gaunt and a Tau FW aren't that much of an issue for a guardsman, the Tau being the worse of it.

As for Marines, meh, get a good weapon, get civilians (or other guardsmen) to play the distraction and laugh the night away.

 Bobthehero wrote:
An Ork boy, a Nid gaunt and a Tau FW aren't that much of an issue for a guardsman, the Tau being the worse of it.

Even in the game mechanics, the Guardsman will statistically lose most of those fights, and the tabletop buffs the IG models to truly obscene levels.

As for Marines, meh, get a good weapon, get civilians (or other guardsmen) to play the distraction and laugh the night away.

Which only means both you and the civilians die...

 Ashiraya wrote:
I love CSM and, to a degree, Eldar. I like most factions.

I partially dislike IG (an interpretation of them) and I am disliking Orks more and more. They are so horribly inconsistent - they can't decide if they want to be an infighting slapstick army with machinery that blows up if you look at it harshly or a mighty, organised and effective army.

No, I do not believe they can be both at the same time. There's limits to how much impossibility even 40k can handle.

Well...they usually arent both at the same time. Their natural state is one of in fighting and absurdity. It's only very rarely that a powerful enough warlord can tame enough of the sillyness to be an organized and effective army, and even when they are, it's usually a couple cunning Orka doing thr heavy mental lifting while the rest mostly just die in droves so the sneaky thing has a chance to work, and then inevitably always falls apart at some point later. Not even Thraka could totally prevent that

That's what keeps them from suffering the problems SW's have in my mind, the SW's almost always win, or at least win the moral victory, the Orks slapstickness usually bites them in the ass and dooms them to failure. They don't often pull out the win. They kill and break and demolish lots of stuff, but almost always ultimately lose because of their inherent goofiness.

Favorite: Space Marines (Ultramarines) and Chaos Space Marines. I like the fluff of both, especially Chaos, but they're both intertwined with each other. I loved the models and paint schemes when I first started playing.

Least Favorite: Tyranids and Necrons. Neither army was cery interesting to me. In terms of performance, I don't really like the playstyle of either. I dislike them mostly for their looks, though.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
An Ork boy, a Nid gaunt and a Tau FW aren't that much of an issue for a guardsman, the Tau being the worse of it.

Even in the game mechanics, the Guardsman will statistically lose most of those fights, and the tabletop buffs the IG models to truly obscene levels.

They'll win vs the Gaunt depending on range and biomorphs, equal the Orks and lose to the Tau. And no, the TT doesn't buff the Guard to obscene levels, you're just so far up the whole SM fangirl you can warp your head around the fact that they're not the main army of the Imperium or Chaos and that they're not OP, i don't know what the feth is wrong with you but your utter refusal to admit that the IG might be fething able to do more than die pathetically so that the SM's would be put on another goddamn pedestal is getting fething ridiculous. And feth if its not annoying seeing you constantly pop up '' But nooooooooooo your faction sucks and never does anything anything in the fluff waah wahh '' every goddamn tiem there's a discussion about fluff.

 Bobthehero wrote:
And no, the TT doesn't buff the Guard to obscene levels, you're just so far up the whole SM fangirl you can warp your head around the fact that they're not the main army of the Imperium or Chaos

On a galactic scale, they are absolutely the main army, though at key battlepoints the SM can play a more important role.

i don't know what the feth is wrong with you but your utter refusal to admit that the IG might be fething able to do more than die pathetically so that the SM's would be put on another goddamn pedestal is getting fething ridiculous.

SMs are grimdark too, just in a different way. They fare much better individually against the dangers of the galaxy, but they are by far too few to make a strategic impact on a galactic scene, and the Imperium crumbles around them which they are powerless to stop.

And feth if its not annoying seeing you constantly pop up '' But nooooooooooo your faction sucks and never does anything anything in the fluff waah wahh '' every goddamn tiem there's a discussion about fluff.

Stop for a moment and consider what the Ork players feel about the posts you usually make about them.

The IG definitely has an impact, but it is through numbers, not quality.

The tabletop buffs Guard models because even the most dedicated Guard player would struggle with painting the hundreds of infantry minis required to match a Space Marine force in the fluff.

Anyway, favorite is Guard. Getting stuff done with none of the glory. Though I do hate the view of IG that GW seems to have, where seemingly no officer has heard of flanking maneuvers, securing positions, or anything really (see: Mont'ka.)

Least favorite: Necrons. Boring to fight, silly over-the-top power in the fluff.

 Ashiraya wrote:


Stop for a moment and consider what the Ork players feel about the posts you usually make about them.

The IG definitely has an impact, but it is through numbers, not quality.

Except I don't pop in random thread and starting railing on the ORks, I stick to the '' Least favorite factions '' threads. I avoid the Ork related stuff and don't comment in them

 Bobthehero wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:


Stop for a moment and consider what the Ork players feel about the posts you usually make about them.

The IG definitely has an impact, but it is through numbers, not quality.

Except I don't pop in random thread and starting railing on the ORks, I stick to the '' Least favorite factions '' threads. I avoid the Ork related stuff and don't comment in them

You will find I do not post in IG threads much either.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Lukash_ wrote:
The tabletop buffs Guard models because even the most dedicated Guard player would struggle with painting the hundreds of infantry minis required to match a Space Marine force in the fluff.

Agreed, and it's fine for a game, though it's important to remember that it is just that: a game.

Anyway, favorite is Guard. Getting stuff done with none of the glory. Though I do hate the view of IG that GW seems to have, where seemingly no officer has heard of flanking maneuvers, securing positions, or anything really (see: Mont'ka.)

I didn't hear that about Mont'ka. As much as human wave attacks are fun, their officers should at least be squeezing in as much tactics as they can. That is sad.

It should be noted that I do not hate IG in and of themselves. I am considering collecting Scions and I WILL collect Chaos IG, in fact I have already started. I just heavily dislike one interpretation of the faction.

The one where they're not incompetent monkeys, apparently.

 Bobthehero wrote:
The one where they're not incompetent monkeys, apparently.

Implying that 'incompetent monkeys' and what we see on the tabletop are the only possibilities is just not true.

I prefer them doing a good job considering the circumstances - most of them anyway, IG are very diverse - but just not individually being on par with most other factions, compensating with numbers.

The guard aren't the worst fighters I think there better than the normal Tyranid hormaguant and termaguant and the ork boy the ork sluggas better than a las gun and the ork is tougher and are MUCH MUCH MUCH better in melee so I would give it to the ork boy and it will probably take a couple shots in the head to be killed by a lasgun to kill a boy so I'll give that to the ork boy tau fire warrior is better in every way but melee

Orks might be more skilled but they're slow and that means its not a completely one sided fight in melee.

Not that melee should matter, but heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey that's another subject.

Also: Lasguns might not be better than Ork guns, but the shooters are more accurate and guardsmen are better armored.

 Bobthehero wrote:
Complete opposite for me, can't enjoy games where I can't play humans

Don't you find that somewhat stifling and unimaginative in a sci-fi game? Whilst I don't mind guard, I'd find it quite boring to just play people, not even interesting ones, apart from the abhumans of course.
Being able to play as a completely different alien species, with wildly differing motivations and cultures is one of the charms of 40k.
Guard are OK, I kind of appreciate the look of krieg, but cadians? Boring as paste to look at and role play with surely.

Different tastes, I guess.

I'd much rather play Humans than anything else.

An Ork boy in melee with a guardsmen is VERY one sided it would probably take stabbing the Ork boy in the eye 4 times

Favourite? Absolutely Necrons; I started with the 'Oldcrons' way back when but I LOVE the 'Newcrons'. Fluff, playstyle (though I'm more of a Mephrit Cohort player with a tiny Decurion allied in and a Conclave of the Burning One) and more Fluff.

Least favourite? I like playing against all of the factions so long as I'm not facing 2 WKs, fluff-wise though... Ehh I guess I never liked the Eldar, but that's probably just because they remind me of elves, just even more stuck up hahaha.

Favorite army: Orks. For a long time i was a World Eaters player but they've been mothballed since 5th edition. I have brought them out recently for Kharn's Butcher Hoarde formation and Deamonkin, but right now its still Orks. Been playing Orks since 3rd too mainly Speed Freeks.

Least favorite: Eldar. I like their background stuff, especially Iyandan, but all that stuff they have to prevent bad things happening, I just seem to shake my head the most playing against them...and to come out with an even better codex to replace the last good one they had makes them not fun to play against at all.

Favorite army:
Chaos - The whole shebang as a whole, be it Chaos Marines or Chaos Daemons (whom I see as two sides of the same coin). The whole eternal war within the pantheon and their minions intrigue me, as they are at war with the Imperium but as much themselves - Oddly enough, I also find them more human than the Space Marines, and can relate more to their wins and failings.

Least favorite army:
Space Wolves - My god, what a joke. The fluff is toe-cringingly bad and the aesthetics are laughable. Every time I encounter them in books, I feel a bit of my Scandinavian pride being chipped away by a hammer, as I imagine that people think these guys are "what vikings should be like in the future".

In terms of fluff and on the table I prefer CSM and IG, Chaos because of the whole fallen angels thing, and guard because regular humans vs the grimdark etc. Third place goes to Tyranids, always loved the xenomorph/zerg type menace.

On the other end of the scale I despise Necrons and Tau, Necrons in particular their fluff is just god-awful (Oldcron stuff was IMO even worse) and on the tabletop they're ridiculously boring to play against. Tau just shouldn't even be a thing. Third place would be SW, the fluff and aesthetics could have been totally awesome, but GW decided to WOLFWOLFWOLFMURDERAXE

Orks are my favourite. Love the fluff, love the aesthetics, love their ramshackle tech that allows an almost conventional style of combined arms tactics, love their numbers and redundancy.
Imperium will be my next army for mostly the same reasons as above. Fluff, aesthetics, conventional tech, sheer numbers.

I like seeing my opponent have fun blasting my troops and vehicles even if I pull a win. I'm tactically minded enough to give a solid fight and can pull some valiant losses so I'm still having fun win or lose. Both players having fun is a victory IMHO.

I suppose if I have a least favourite it'll be the necron decurion. I'll just take obsec and minimize my interaction as much as possible to get the win from vps. Not much else to do. Ignore enemy, claim victory. Sumfing is broken.

Favorite is Sisters of Battle. Least favorite is Dark Eldar, simply because those sissy emo space rapists(victims), got plastic kits and new models and sisters didn't. I take solace in the fact that they're codex is way weaker.

Favorite easily the harlequins. Everyone thinks they are garbage, until they get ripped a new one!
Least favourite are the spess mureenz. I personally find them generic and plain. IG, Scions, most spess mureen flavours like DA or BA are fine to me however.

Favorite :

1: Blood Angels (favorite models and fluff)
2: Khorne Demonkin (favorite to play, favorite theme)


Least Favorite :

1. Tau/ Space Wolves (least favorite to play, play against, least favorite fluff)
2: Orks: (least favorite models)

Grey Knights for their lore, gene seed of the emperor the rest of the space marines are plebs, and highly detailed models. Plus psyker everything and never having even one guy turned to chaos.

Dark angels for their looks. Love the robes, not so much their lore.

Skitarii I really like. Their alpha Roman concept and basically being the tech priests IG.

I actually like the necrons lore much more than when I last played (10+ years ago) where they looked bamf and still do but wet basically terminators in space.

Least favorites would be the tyrnids, eldar, and orcs. The most blaise sci fi troupes there are. Epitome of evolution, space elves, and orcs are orcs are orcs.

 r_squared wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Complete opposite for me, can't enjoy games where I can't play humans

Don't you find that somewhat stifling and unimaginative in a sci-fi game?
...

Being able to play as a completely different alien species, with wildly differing motivations and cultures is one of the charms of 40k.

Yeah, that's what I used to like about it, too. One of 40k's biggest appeals to me was the diversity in armies, to the point where there's almost something for everyone. But apparently we're alone in thinking that.

People hate, haaaate anything that isn't a Space Marine, and would rather that it didn't exist at all so that GW would have more money and time to devote to putting out even more Space Marines. As you can see in this thread: Tau, Tyranids, Eldar of all flavors, Necrons (pre or post new fluff), sometimes Orks...if some of these people had their way they'd nuke half the armies in the game, all the interesting ones, and leave just the human armies and maybe Chaos/daemons to be their punching bags (because people hate the other armies so much they don't even want to play against them). Space Marine players wouldn't even give a feth if there were literally no other armies at all, they're perfectly happy just playing against other Space Marine armies all day, every day, as the popularity of the Horus Heresy has shown. And they truly believe that Games Workshop can survive entirely on their custom, if all they ever did was churn out a new Space Marine kit every week that would be more than enough to keep them going, apparently.

Hell, in my opinion 40k still feels like it could be more diverse, because when you go and look on GW's website you can see there's like a crazy number of factions in the game, but more than half of them are the same damn gak. Multiple Space Marine chapters, Grey Knights, Inquisition, Imperial Knights, Assassins, etc. Pretty fething boring in my opinion, but according to the vocal minority on the internet, apparently not boring enough for their horrid tastes.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 r_squared wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Complete opposite for me, can't enjoy games where I can't play humans

Don't you find that somewhat stifling and unimaginative in a sci-fi game?
...

Being able to play as a completely different alien species, with wildly differing motivations and cultures is one of the charms of 40k.

Yeah, that's what I used to like about it, too. One of 40k's biggest appeals to me was the diversity in armies, to the point where there's almost something for everyone. But apparently we're alone in thinking that.

People hate, haaaate anything that isn't a Space Marine, and would rather that it didn't exist at all so that GW would have more money and time to devote to putting out even more Space Marines.

Clearly you haven't seen the gobs of threads through the ages about the array of things people hate about Space Marines of various flavors.

As you can see in this thread: Tau, Tyranids, Eldar of all flavors, Necrons (pre or post new fluff), sometimes Orks...if some of these people had their way they'd nuke half the armies in the game, all the interesting ones, and leave just the human armies and maybe Chaos/daemons to be their punching bags (because people hate the other armies so much they don't even want to play against them).

If you'd read a lot of that, most of it's due to in-game meta issues, like Eldar & Necrons being absurdly overpowered, rather than just hating Xeno's on general principle.

Space Marine players wouldn't even give a feth if there were literally no other armies at all, they're perfectly happy just playing against other Space Marine armies all day, every day, as the popularity of the Horus Heresy has shown.

Perhaps this has more to do with the difference in ruleset and what is effectively a different setting than the fact that there's no Xenos? Is that possible?

I mean, I'm half tempted to do a 30k army just to have a thin veneer of a balanced game at this point.

Hell, in my opinion 40k still feels like it could be more diverse, because when you go and look on GW's website you can see there's like a crazy number of factions in the game, but more than half of them are the same damn gak. Multiple Space Marine chapters, Grey Knights, Inquisition, Imperial Knights, Assassins, etc. Pretty fething boring in my opinion, but according to the vocal minority on the internet, apparently not boring enough for their horrid tastes.

Show me on the doll where the Space Marine touched you...

I like xenos armies but i don't like Necrons for there fluff and there overpowerdness and I don't like the Space Wolves either

I play orks... so instead of auto listing orks as my fav, I'll go with 2nd fav.
Tau....while often criticized for being just anime in 40k, I aplaud them for what they are. A society trying to be perfect in the most screwed up setting, they try, but will fail, but they are noble in the attempt....also I like robots, and besides admek (who I also like) no other faction has robots that actualy are good in the actual game (not including knights, an apocalypse faction in non apoc 40k, it's just a git move)

While least fav would be spacemarines. Dont get me wrong, I actualy like fighting them, but man do I despise them for being the poster child that gw and FW just fawn over. They constantly come up with different varieties of armour but I mostly see similar lists no matter what the army is painted as (white scare bikes painted as dark angels is one example off the top of my head). I personally blame game balance for my dislike of sm. If all their codex options were equally useful then you would see each faction played with the units that fluff supports...and not just every chapter uses bikes. I guess what I'm saying is I will like sm if the game help support the different chapters to be pretty different from each other...and not just one army that claims its actualy many armies with different colors.

Favorite: Anything but Tau.

Least favorite: Tau.

Tau are a Star Wars army, NOT a 40K army.

Favourite:
1.Khorne Daemonkin
2.Orks
3.Chaos Daemons (Khorne)

Least:
1.Tau
2.Eldar
3.Taudar

 Gobbla wrote:


Tau are a Star Wars army, NOT a 40K army.

every time someone says an army doesn't belong in the fluff I'm always left scratching my head "why?".
Each faction is pretty different from each other.
And of your argument is "its not grim dark enough" then Ill just point to a different faction and say "and that is?".
If your argument is that they aren't common enough to be an actual faction then I'll do the same thing "and this other faction that's just as small if not smaller does belong in the game?"
My biggest example I'll bring up is craft world eldar, they have pretty clean tech, alien designs...not reAly that grimdark. And from what I understand they are possibly less common then tau.

geargutz wrote:

 Gobbla wrote:


Tau are a Star Wars army, NOT a 40K army.

every time someone says an army doesn't belong in the fluff I'm always left scratching my head "why?".
Each faction is pretty different from each other.
And of your argument is "its not grim dark enough" then Ill just point to a different faction and say "and that is?".
If your argument is that they aren't common enough to be an actual faction then I'll do the same thing "and this other faction that's just as small if not smaller does belong in the game?"
My biggest example I'll bring up is craft world eldar, they have pretty clean tech, alien designs...not reAly that grimdark. And from what I understand they are possibly less common then tau.

The Eldar fluff is oretty oepn about them considering everyone else vermin, that theyll gladly sacrifice or kill by the tens of billions if it means saving a literal handful of their own, or retaining a world they havent inhabited in thousands of years.

The Tau fluff has some grjmdark elements, but theyre very thin and increasingly downplayed, often actively so by Tau enthusiasts. I dont mond the Tau when they're portrayed as the 1984-esque manipulative guys that will try to bribe you with their cool stuff to join them and bomb you into submission until you give up if that doesnt work, but too often its the "naieve do gooders" angle that is pushed.

I personslly dont mind thr Tau all that much, but I can see where people do have problrms with them. Also, their visual is starkly different from most 40k stuff, deriving from an entirely different source material than the rest of the 40k universe, making them stick out like a sore thumb in many respects.

 Sidstyler wrote:

Hell, in my opinion 40k still feels like it could be more diverse, because when you go and look on GW's website you can see there's like a crazy number of factions in the game, but more than half of them are the same damn gak. Multiple Space Marine chapters, Grey Knights, Inquisition, Imperial Knights, Assassins, etc. Pretty fething boring in my opinion, but according to the vocal minority on the internet, apparently not boring enough for their horrid tastes

My thoughts exactly. In a made up scifi UNIVERSE or solar system where imagination should be limitless i feel though AoS has more variety than 40k

Anyhow, favourite is Nids. Dinosaur, dragon, monster, lizards from space that spit venom and work on telepathy. With amazings models to boot!
I feel without them, Orks and Daemons 40k would be an incredibly boring place.

Hate Tau. Fluff they seem cool. Models are full on horrible. I feel like they came straight out of the robot isle of toy'r'us. Kroot are cool though. Play wise they're boring.

 eskimo wrote:


Hate Tau. Fluff they seem cool. Models are full on horrible. I feel like they came straight out of the robot isle of toy'r'us. Kroot are cool though. Play wise they're boring.

What robot toys are you talking about? If there was stuff that looked anything like tau I would've bought them and converted a tau army for myself. Are you talking about transformers...not even comparable.
Granted the crisis suit was kinda goofy but the new version is a whole lot better. The closest thing to tau are Gundam Models, but the legs reAly do set the 2 apart.
The tau have an atractive design, in my own subjective opinion.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
The only crazy alien race is probably the Eldars and the Necrons, the rest will usually die rather quickly to a lasgun shot.

Tyranids, as well - Gaunts are perfectly evolved for their battlefield role and very adaptable, unlike humans who really are incredibly inefficient, weak and fragile when you think about it. For an example, consider chimpanzees, who are by no means as optimised yet are still much stronger than humans even though they are smaller!

And a case can be made for the very resilient Orks, though we both know what we think of those. And Tau who just have a big technology advantage (though the IG CAN compensate for that with raw numbers)

Marines aren't really super duper, either. Just oyu know, better.

Again, this is not Halo. Space Marines are not ODSTs like people believe, they are Spartans +10. As average joe with a lasgun, if you decide to join in the battle of the big boys, you are going to achieve little more than being a very shiny red stain.

Marines die to shotguns and stubbers. At a pretty significant rate, too. Space marines are not that great and downright meaningless in the numbers that gw have given as canonical.

Martel732 wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
The only crazy alien race is probably the Eldars and the Necrons, the rest will usually die rather quickly to a lasgun shot.

Tyranids, as well - Gaunts are perfectly evolved for their battlefield role and very adaptable, unlike humans who really are incredibly inefficient, weak and fragile when you think about it. For an example, consider chimpanzees, who are by no means as optimised yet are still much stronger than humans even though they are smaller!

And a case can be made for the very resilient Orks, though we both know what we think of those. And Tau who just have a big technology advantage (though the IG CAN compensate for that with raw numbers)

Marines aren't really super duper, either. Just oyu know, better.

Again, this is not Halo. Space Marines are not ODSTs like people believe, they are Spartans +10. As average joe with a lasgun, if you decide to join in the battle of the big boys, you are going to achieve little more than being a very shiny red stain.

Marines die to shotguns and stubbers. At a pretty significant rate, too. Space marines are not that great and downright meaningless in the numbers that gw have given as canonical.

If we go by FFG for how Space marines work, they are almost immortal to small arms fire. Unfortunately, the fluff and the crunch hates that rendition of Space Marines

FFG is clearly in error based off the actual game.

Martel732 wrote:
FFG is clearly in error based off the actual game.

Or they like the GW poster boys as near immortal super soldiers

The point being that normal humans armed with plasma or melta can do just fine vs marines. They are only 25% less effective at shooting those weapons.

To be fair, the way accuracy works in 40k is really wonky and highly unrepresentative of how accuracy really works. Flames of War's interpretation really is a whole lot better, where it's assumed that weapons are to the point where any conscript with a couple of hours training can hit a target with an almost 100% success rate within optimal range, but that the opposing side's experience and training will mean that they know how to make themselves much harder targets to hit (e.g. knowing when to move from cover to cover, knowing when an enemy is reloading a machinegun to burst out of a trench, knowing when to duck when artillery is falling, knowing how best to hide, etc).

The way accuracy is presented in 40k is really far more of a fantasy based paradigm where you're talking stuff like bows or catapults and where there will be a vast gulf in the accuracy potential based off of the experience of the user.

Yes, but flames of war has the stormtrooper rule, which is perhaps the dumbest "historical" rule i've ever seen.

At any rate, humans are fine because movie marines are only in fluff.

Flamrs of war is far from perfect, I just really liked the way they handled accuracy.

Personally, I like starcraft accuracy, which is 100%

From favourite to least.

1. Farsight Enclaves
2. Tau
3. Dark Eldar
4. Necrons (New Lore Sucks or would be #1)
5. Tyranids
6. Orks (mostly like the fluff and how funny they are)
7. Deathwatch
8. Blood Ravens
9. Imperial Fists
10. Adeptus Mechanicus/Skitarrii
11. Chaos Marines/Deamons
12. Imperial Guard
13. Harlequins
14. Corsairs
15. Assorted Imperial Factions
16. Most other Space Marines
17. Grey Knights
18. Ultramarines
-10. Eldar (Stupid Fluff, don't like their weird contrasting paint schemes, and don't like their style. Doesn't help they are so over powered either and no one seems to want to reign them in.)

 Gamgee wrote:
From favourite to least.

1. Farsight Enclaves
2. Tau
3. Dark Eldar
4. Necrons (New Lore Sucks or would be #1)
5. Tyranids
6. Orks (mostly like the fluff and how funny they are)
7. Deathwatch
8. Blood Ravens
9. Imperial Fists
10. Adeptus Mechanicus/Skitarrii
11. Chaos Marines/Deamons
12. Imperial Guard
13. Harlequins
14. Corsairs
15. Assorted Imperial Factions
16. Most other Space Marines
17. Grey Knights
18. Ultramarines
-10. Eldar (Stupid Fluff, don't like their weird contrasting paint schemes, and don't like their style. Doesn't help they are so over powered either and no one seems to want to reign them in.)

Huh, seems exactly like my list only inverted... and perhaps its not a good idea to throw stones and live in a glass house when it comes to power level

Tau are top of mid tier in the ITC. Not as powerful as the big 4 Eldar by a mile, then Marines, Necrons, and Chaos Deamons. They all have access to far better armies and cheese than any Tau could hope to throw together right now.

In all the years of data I have to support this no one has ever refuted me and I doubt they ever will. Outside the ITC the Tau can be more powerful depending on how some rules are interpreted but even then that would only raise them up to the upper tier. I doubt they equal Eldar or Necrons even then.

Just so we're clear I've done a lot of research on this. Can check my old posts and look in the tournament forum it was a huge debate at one point. I don't want to get back into it.

Edit
The problem about Tau being top of Mid tier is they stomp anything lower than it but when it comes to the upper tier armies struggle a lot. Back last edition the power gap wasn't so enormous but its growing in the ITC and in GW rules at all tiers. The strongest factions are getting more powerful and the weak aren't being buffed enough by a longshot.

"Tau are top of mid tier in the ITC."

ITC is the operative word - we all know of the rampant and absurd house rulings to nerf Tau into the ground, outside of that I propose we agree to disagree in that regard.

Gameplay wise I always wanted Tau to be this fast and strategic force that promoted interlocking tactics (outside of moar markerlights) but in reality they come across as just a gunline army with a hefty alpha strike.

Aesthetic wise I wish their suits were less 'boxy' and more sleek if that makes sense, same with the tanks.

Finally really not a fan of the fluff but hey this is all just subjective

 Gamgee wrote:
Tau are top of mid tier in the ITC. Not as powerful as the big 4 Eldar by a mile, then Marines, Necrons, and Chaos Deamons. They all have access to far better armies and cheese than any Tau could hope to throw together right now.

In all the years of data I have to support this no one has ever refuted me and I doubt they ever will. Outside the ITC the Tau can be more powerful depending on how some rules are interpreted but even then that would only raise them up to the upper tier. I doubt they equal Eldar or Necrons even then.

Just so we're clear I've done a lot of research on this. Can check my old posts and look in the tournament forum it was a huge debate at one point. I don't want to get back into it.

Edit
The problem about Tau being top of Mid tier is they stomp anything lower than it but when it comes to the upper tier armies struggle a lot. Back last edition the power gap wasn't so enormous but its growing in the ITC and in GW rules at all tiers. The strongest factions are getting more powerful and the weak aren't being buffed enough by a longshot.

Umm the new Tau codex is murdering people, especially with the Stormsurge which is a beast at range and in melee (against non super heavies). Only army I think that truly outclasses the Tau in the ITC is Eldar but I think given enough time we will see Tau really step into their own and dominate hard. Eldar got their update basically a year ago but it wasn't until the past few months that we saw Eldar completely smashing face in the ITC. Tau are absolutely in the top 4 and a strong contender for #1, it just needs time for the good players to refine their builds and get past the gimmick builds.

1. They are fast and mobile, but they shoot more while being a mobile suit army.

2. There are plenty of tactics around shooting better as the Tau. However if you don't like that it's okay. It's a common misconception Tau only do gunline armies when all the better armies tend to be more mobile.

3. Personal preferences about are looks. I love the aesthetic it blends a sort of simple elegance with a boxy look to it. I also like the Tau asymmetrical designs.

4. I like most of the fluff. They use their brains and science to overcome obstacles instead of moping in a corner of the galaxy causing trouble. Anyways clearly have different tastes.

Edit
Tau haven't won a any major tournaments since their new update in the ITC. They haven't and they didn't even place in the top 10 at the LVO. It's a big misconception how "powerful" they are. I work to show people how silly they are. Anyways there are two locked topics on the matter that cover it in more detail if you want to hunt them down and one in the tournament discussions area.

Years of data, amazing figuring they have only been out for less than a year.

 Gamgee wrote:

Tau haven't won a any major tournaments since their new update in the ITC. They haven't and they didn't even place in the top 10 at the LVO. It's a big misconception how "powerful" they are. I work to show people how silly they are. Anyways there are two locked topics on the matter that cover it in more detail if you want to hunt them down and one in the tournament discussions area.

Ah, thanks to Gamgee for clearing up that confusion! Glad to see you're the only one telling truths here and everyone who disagrees is a dirty liar. Thanks for dispelling the misconception. Tau aren't that powerful, I just need to L2P. Problem solved.

Favourites...IG - sorry, AM. There is so much to choose from it's impossible not to find a favourite from there.

Dark Angels - they're uncompromising and live a double life. People who ask too much have tendency to disappear. What's not to like?

Former favourites...Blood Angels. I liked their old backstory as a tragic, dying chapter, former greats in terminal decline. But since 5th edition they have been written as unbeatable flying Space Jesuses. Booooring.

Tyranids...I liked them really a lot before they became "Gimmick Monster of the Week" -army.

Former favourites & currently least favourite: Tau. I loved their old codex and never would have believed I would eventually hate the army, but Vetock managed to pull it off. 6th edition Codex paid absolutely no respect whatsoever to the feel, lore or style of the army. Subsesquent releases have only made it worse and like Nids, they are now all about Gimmick Monsters.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gobbla wrote:
Favorite: Anything but Tau.

Least favorite: Tau.

Tau are a Star Wars army, NOT a 40K army.

Tau lore is more subtle than most other factions. They are basically what Humans were when they were young and expansionistic race - and presumably Eldar before them. A new talent coming to blow away decayed, crumbling empires, before eventually doomed to become one themselves.

40k universe is somewhat exceptional in the respect that there, it's the Humans who are ancient rulers of the Galaxy now in decline, and some young upstart alien race is the dynamic, adaptable and idealistic. This is one reason why people find Tau annoying. Likely it's meant to be like that.

But as said, current Tau lore is mostly a step down from old.

The data includes the information I could find of about.... 6 or so ITC tournaments with the new Tau codex. Also I have watched batreps, read battle reports, and just talked to players to get this data. The biggest piece of evidence is the LVO where a supposed "top tier army" got creamed and didn't have a single army place in the top 10 and only two armies in the top 25 at all. Not to mention the second best Tau army was nerfed days before the guy showed up to the tournament and he wasn't told about it early enough so his army he brought was nerfed during his travel to the LVO.

The Tau are mid tier. The years of data goes back even further into its 6e codex where again it was the top of the mid tier but not upper tier. There was a brief surge of Tau tournament victories with the FSE first dropped but that was ages ago at this point and very brief.

This indicates a big Tau bias in the general public and even ITC player base.

Edit
However depending on how your local group rules them if it doesn't use the ITC then the Tau could be much stronger. Especially with coordinated firepower working as is and not nerfed like it is in the ITC and the Firestream Wing as well.

Reavas wrote:
Daemons is my favourite, the randomness just throws a spanner in any pre-made plans so its full of surprises each game

Tau is least favourite, its so run of the mill and least interesting playstyle that also requires the least amout of thought and adaption, each game its the same strategy for me so I dont enjoy playing with them as my army or against them due to predictability.

Man, the first guy responding has the same response that I do! Well said!!
Daemons rock, hate Tau (except battlesuits look epic). Hate all other aspects of Tau.

So much Tau hate. I can't decide if this is because modern Tau lore is mouseshit or if Tau lore in general is mouseshit.

Tau are kind of annoying but i like some of the models

Fluff wise best to worst

1. Imperial Guard
2. Daemons
3. Chaos Space Marines
4. Newcons
5. Orks
6. Dark Angels
7. Tyranids
8. Space Marines
9. Tau
10. Eldar
11. Blood Angels
12. AdMech
13. Dark Eldar
14. Sisters of Battle
15. Grey Knights

 dusara217 wrote:
So much Tau hate. I can't decide if this is because modern Tau lore is mouseshit or if Tau lore in general is mouseshit.

The first.
And it is less about the lore, and more about the rules, boring and unchallenging way the army is structured nowadays.

People seem to be anti-shooting, too, doesn't help.

Backfire wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:
So much Tau hate. I can't decide if this is because modern Tau lore is mouseshit or if Tau lore in general is mouseshit.

The first.
And it is less about the lore, and more about the rules, boring and unchallenging way the army is structured nowadays.

Aye, though Lore being gak isn't unique to Tau, GW's fluff has been abysmal for years now, the quality of the writing and immersive feel of stories between something from say, 2E/3E/4E and something from say, 5E/6E/7E is gigantic.

However, I think the biggest thing with Tau, lore and visuals aside, they kinda get to do "everything" when it comes to shooting. They can shoot with high BS that ignores armor and cover saves and wounds on 2's while other armies, even shooting oriented ones, usually only get to pick two, or they can't be anywhere near as versatile with it. Also, supporting fire really is an absurd "gotcha" in many instances.

 Bobthehero wrote:
People seem to be anti-shooting, too, doesn't help.

Tau basically tell other lists that they don't get to play. Can't imagine why that might get hate.

Martel732 wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
People seem to be anti-shooting, too, doesn't help.

Tau basically tell other lists that they don't get to play. Can't imagine why that might get hate.

That's how I feel more about Necrons and Eldar. Tau, to me at least, don't have the insane defensive capabilities these armies have (barring a couple of the new formations that people got hissy about getting nerfed in the ITC, despite them being broken as balls).

Last time I played Necrons, I think I killed a grand total of 1 Wraith, 11 Warriors, and an Ark before being tabled, and that was getting first turn to alpha strike. It's gotten to the point where I pretty much will just pass on games against Necron opponents, there's just no point in setting up and having them auto-pilot themselves to victory because you can't actually hurt anything. Eldar sometimes too depending on what they're running.

Ah did anyone see the Nova FAQ? They have sane rulings of Tau. Sane! A man can dream the ITC would adopt them.

Martel732 wrote:
Personally, I like starcraft accuracy, which is 100%

No, it's just accounted for in their DPS. Marines in SC still spray'n'pray.

But who is surprised that SC2 is more granular and realistic when the Stormtrooper equivalent has 55 wounds?

45 before the shield upgrade. SC marines are definitely power armor units in a scenario where weapons are treated more realistically. No one fields guardsmen because there is no point. And the stims are way more effective than any astartes upgrades.

Modern: Space Marines are my favourite. Dark Eldar least favourite. Bad fluff, bad minis.

Olde fashioned Rogue Trader armies: Orks are the my favourite. Then Chaos. None are bad factions, though Eldar are least interesting.

 Vaktathi wrote:

Aye, though Lore being gak isn't unique to Tau, GW's fluff has been abysmal for years now, the quality of the writing and immersive feel of stories between something from say, 2E/3E/4E and something from say, 5E/6E/7E is gigantic.

Hmmm...don't fully agree, sure there is quite a bit of bad lore around nowadays, but it's not like everything was gold back in the day. When I read 3rd Ed codices, oftentimes I feel embarrassed for the writers, most of the fluff pieces are pretty bad.
IMO chief problem nowadays is the Codex bloat, they have so many pages to fill that they get way too wordy and explain everything in very detailed fashion. It was better when they were sparser and left more for imagination.

 Vaktathi wrote:

However, I think the biggest thing with Tau, lore and visuals aside, they kinda get to do "everything" when it comes to shooting. They can shoot with high BS that ignores armor and cover saves and wounds on 2's while other armies, even shooting oriented ones, usually only get to pick two, or they can't be anywhere near as versatile with it. Also, supporting fire really is an absurd "gotcha" in many instances.

Yes, old Tau was much more interesting in this sense. They were strong shooters but they were strong short/medium range shooters with only few (though powerful) long range weapons. Also, they were less about volume of fire and more about making your shots count by flexibility and various technical gimmicks not available for other armies. Nowadays it's buckets of Markerlights followed by larger buckets of Pulse fire. It's so boring.

I actually only use about.... 4-6 ML in one army. I wouldn't call that bucket loads haha. I find anymore to be wasteful in points.