Why? Because Stone Cold said so, obviously. And because I've often though that it's a thread that's been missing from Dakka. I know there's a few of us geeks who like a grapple.
Now, I'm not the biggest wrestling fan. I watched a fair bit of WWF between 97-2002ish, but very little otherwise. However, over the last couple of years I've found myself getting back to watching it again. And watching more. WWF/E sure has changed a lot since the Attitude Era, some things are worse, some things have gotten better, but I'm actually quite enjoying it.... for the most part.
I've been enjoying it all at least enough for me to have just purchased tickets to attend my first live pro wrestling show (ICW: Fear and Loathing IX).
I'm enjoying my WWE Network subscription. I'm enjoying how the Internet has allowed so much insight into this utterly fascinating world like I'd have never believed back in the day (hello Whatculture et al).
I'm enjoying it all. It's fun... again, for the most part.
So Dakka, let's talk WRASSLIN'...
Is WWE heading in the right direction? How has the success of NXT, the women's division, the new cruiserweights, and the recent decisions to put big titles on guys like Finn Ballor and KO affected your optimism for the future?
How is the recent brand split working out? (Smackdown certainly seems much better for it)
Have they made Lesnar completely unplayable? What's his WWE future like? (I know I look forward to his appearances less and less, and was disappointed in his Summerslam match)
What's working for WWE and what isn't? What changes would you like to see? (an hour shaved off Raw for starters?)
Any predictions for the rest of the year?
Who do you like?
Also, while WWE will usually dominate any pro wrestling discussion, they are not the only promotion out there.
Can the more knowledgeable Dakkites educate me?
What other promotions should be getting our attention at the moment? NJPW, Lucha Underground, PWG, RoH, TNA? I'm thoroughly unversed here. Who should we be looking out for, what matches should we be googling?
What's happening out there in the less televised world?
Eh, haven't been a big fan of wrestling since the Attitude Era. That being said, I have great memories of Stone Cold, The Rock, Kane, Undertaker, and Mankind.
Do you know, I am more embarrassed about liking wrestling than I ever was about playing with army manz.
Anyway.
AJ Styles is a huge talent for the WWE at the minute and I am surprised he hasn't been booked (yet) the way of many other not so huge rasslers.
He has had wins against Johnny Cena!!! Who would have thought it!
Finn Balor is another surprise, not to fans really, but surprising the way he has been given a push towards the new heavy weight title. Shame he got injured. Hope he is still in the mix when he is fit again. At 35 time is pressing and he deserves a few years at least earning mega bucks.
Kevin Owens is okay-ish. his Universal Title victory could be tarnished by HHH intervention but we can hope he has a decent run.
NJPW is always on my radar. They have had some tremendous contests recently. Kenny Omega winning the G1 Climax was pure wrestling gold.
And I have to say I have been LOVING Broken Matt Hardy over on TNA. His accent, his look, his OTT promos are fething brilliant. Jeff Hardy is also broken now, but his promos are poor and he plays for the crowd. Not a patch on His brother.
When I was in Afghanistan last year, I watched a ton of it. The Brigade CSM wouldn't let us have volume on in the TOC though, so we came down to inventing names for all of the wrestlers, and the like, cause none of us knew who was who. Was one of those past times that helped speed it all up.
My unit back home, we provide security for a number of public events in Nashville, such as hockey games, football, concerts, etc... I got to work at a WWE event held in Bridgestone Arena last winter. It was pretty cool.
djones520 wrote: I got to work at a WWE event held in Bridgestone Arena last winter. It was pretty cool.
I haven't followed wrestling in a long long time, but I've been to a few live WWE shows throughout the years.
It's amazing just how much more fake everything looks in person, but it's definitely one of those "go for the experience" kind of events. You know they are selling you a story, but the athletic stuff is still real. The atmosphere is great as well, and it's fun to be part of a 10,000+ crowd yelling at the bad guy.
djones520 wrote: I got to work at a WWE event held in Bridgestone Arena last winter. It was pretty cool.
I haven't followed wrestling in a long long time, but I've been to a few live WWE shows throughout the years.
It's amazing just how much more fake everything looks in person, but it's definitely one of those "go for the experience" kind of events. You know they are selling you a story, but the athletic stuff is still real. The atmosphere is great as well, and it's fun to be part of a 10,000+ crowd yelling at the bad guy.
I went to Capital Punishment in DC several years ago. Yeah, seeing it live, the fakeness of it comes through, the loss of announcers is a big loss, but still a great time because all the kids around you are having so much fun, how could you not join in? Plus they had some really cool pyro for the wrestler intros from backstage to the ring.
I'm glad I went at least once...always wanted to go since I was a big fan as a little kid (Hulk Hogan/Andres the Giant era...back then, wrestling was non-sexy and marketed to children mostly)
Mr. Burning wrote:Do you know, I am more embarrassed about liking wrestling than I ever was about playing with army manz.
Anyway.
AJ Styles is a huge talent for the WWE at the minute and I am surprised he hasn't been booked (yet) the way of many other not so huge rasslers.
He has had wins against Johnny Cena!!! Who would have thought it!
He's had some great matches since coming to WWE. Definitely a talent. This weird new persona they've given him on Smackdown this weeks could be fun. I think he'll have the belt off ambrose before too long.
Finn Balor is another surprise, not to fans really, but surprising the way he has been given a push towards the new heavy weight title. Shame he got injured. Hope he is still in the mix when he is fit again. At 35 time is pressing and he deserves a few years at least earning mega bucks.
His big push was a surprise. Would have been interesting to see how they booked his title run. I'm not his biggest fan but I could watch that entrance all day long. Easily the best WWE have had for a good long while (stand fast Taker). If they manage to keep his return under wraps and surprise people with it, it'll be off the charts.
Kevin Owens is okay-ish. his Universal Title victory could be tarnished by HHH intervention but we can hope he has a decent run.
See, I love Kevin Owens. I think he has a good repertoire of moves, he's strong, good finisher, can take a good bump (see what Sami Zayn has done to him with ladders recently) and his chat is fantastic. On the mic he's great, but even off the mic and in and around the ring, he's always talking, taking the piss, just generally playing his character really, really well. His small mannerisms all contribute as well. The very start of the fatal four way on Raw this week is a perfect example - instantly rolling out the ring, leans on the barrier next to Stephanie and just kinda shrugs at her.
Really like the guy. His photo from the side of Enzo's hospital bed makes it seem like he might be quite a good dude as well. Perhaps shaking Kayfabe a little, but it was nice to see.
Spoiler:
Hope his title reign doesn't change him too much, but I think he'll do OK playing that kinda cowardly heel Champ. Not too unlike Rollins actually. Hopefully he'll still manage a couple of big clean wins though.
NJPW is always on my radar. They have had some tremendous contests recently. Kenny Omega winning the G1 Climax was pure wrestling gold.
Do you manage to watch their events live (on TV)? How easy do you find it is to follow? Is the language barrier fairly easy to get passed? Do they have English speaking announcers? The little I've heard about it, it's always appeared very highly regarded.
And I have to say I have been LOVING Broken Matt Hardy over on TNA. His accent, his look, his OTT promos are fething brilliant. Jeff Hardy is also broken now, but his promos are poor and he plays for the crowd. Not a patch on His brother.
I don't watch TNA but I did see the Final Deletion thing.... Bonkers
And I have started getting into WCPW.
How are you finding it? I do like those chaps (Blampied is a bit of a boardgamer too I think), but I've not caught any of their WCPW shows.
NJPW have english speaking commentators - think for international broadcasts. I usually catch up on youtube but I do have a buddy who sends me PPVs and events.
It's generally pretty easy to follow though, you'll just shout 'wow' 'ouch' and 'jesus' a lot as you see a heck of a lot of stiff, strong wrestling.
WCPW is a mixed bag, Blampied was born a heel! The wrestling is very good they havea good mix of wrestler types. I'll probably be heading to a taped event when I can get my buddies together.
Raw is a 3 hour show show so I am not sure how these midgets will put on a five star classic in between 30 minute promos from Steph and Mick, Cesaro and Shamus talking up their best of 7 series (shudder) and Rollins breaking another superstar!
Seriously though the cruiserweights are fething great but I'm not sure how the wwe will properly handle them. They tell their stories in the ring and really need time to deliver.
I'm hoping that they just get a 30-40 minute slot every Monday night, 2 or 3 matches.
Taking 30 minutes of gak out (cesaro uppercuts, Roman talking and the like) and replacing with 30 minutes of Cruiserweight will help the overall quality heaps.
You're right though, as long as they're handled well.... i.e. hardly handled at all.
I've been watching wrestling for...WAY too many years - waxing and waning through the...decades!
I'm a big fan of Finn Balor and was disappointed that he ended up getting injured and had to relinquish the title... but yes, KO will make a fine Champion...for now!
Loving AJ's run over on Smackdown too, and hope he keeps that winning streak over Cena going.
TNA is hard to get through most days, but the over the top bat gak crazy Hardy stuff is hilarious to watch.
ROH and NJPW are only on sporadically for me, and seem to be showing stuff quite a bit 'behind the times' at that.
Still, lots to watch these days, lots of variety - good times, I think?
I think good times ahead. Again, a lot of this is all very new to me but I'm enjoying it all thoroughly and there's a lot of encouraging things going on, and it's all so accessible now. Outside of WWE there seems to be a bit of nice cross promotional support going on and the scene in the UK is exciting.
Like you say, lots to watch. And lots of quality. There seems to be a lot more emphasis on technical ability these days, which I like... always room for the monsters mind you.
Jehan-reznor wrote: I watch WWE and went to a few NJPW and Dragon's gate shows, not a fan of the current "product" too many finishers
Totally agree with this. So many finishers just don't have the impact they should because people keep kicking out of them. Don't get me wrong, when Kane kicked out of the tombstone I lost my gak. It was incredible. But now it's to be expected at all times. I think it's a shame.
I wonder how much control wrestlers (particularly in WWE) have over the protection of their finishers.
Apparently Scott Hall once said something along the lines of "if it's not the finish, I'm not using my finisher."
Mr Burning, did you get to see Refuse to Lose? I didn't order it but it seems a lot of people had issues with the live stream?
I'm keen to know how Kurt Angle looked.
Presumably because of his appearance on RtL, whatculture have been doing a few wee articles on him recently....
I went back and watched his match with Benoit at RR 2003 again. It truly was a thing of beauty. Kurt Angle might just be my favourite ever. Certainly very close. Awesome music helps too.
Also watched his KotR Street fight with Shane McMahon last night.
Also, anyone particularly looking forward to No Mercy this weekend? Can't say that I am. The Championship triple threat could be very good. Outside of that, I'm not too excited by the rest of the card. Interested to see if Miz and Dolph can put on a decent match.
Miz/Dolph should be really good - and I'm hoping the Miz wins and 'retires' (i.e., make Dolph go away for a bit until he shows up on RAW in a few months time) Dolph.
And AJ has been killing it since signing with the WWE, so that match should be great too - provided he retains/Cena does NOT win!
I don't think anything can compare to the 80's style wrestling promos where guys like Hulk or Macho Man are shouting and flexing like mad while frothing at the mouth from a coke induced mania.
You just don't get those type of moments anymore. Love the Rock and always happy when he still makes the rare guest appearance.
Old school wrestling fans should check out "The Sheik" awesome film although a bit sad. The Resurrection of Jake the Snake also shares a lot of common ground.
alanmckenzie wrote: Mr Burning, did you get to see Refuse to Lose? I didn't order it but it seems a lot of people had issues with the live stream?
I'm keen to know how Kurt Angle looked.
Presumably because of his appearance on RtL, whatculture have been doing a few wee articles on him recently....
I went back and watched his match with Benoit at RR 2003 again. It truly was a thing of beauty. Kurt Angle might just be my favourite ever. Certainly very close. Awesome music helps too.
Also watched his KotR Street fight with Shane McMahon last night.
Also, anyone particularly looking forward to No Mercy this weekend? Can't say that I am. The Championship triple threat could be very good. Outside of that, I'm not too excited by the rest of the card. Interested to see if Miz and Dolph can put on a decent match.
Thoughts?
Kurt Angle is one of the very best to ever grace a wrestling ring. The WCPW top 10 shows exactly why. Angle vs Benoit RR 2003 is one of my favourite WWE/WWF matches. Joining TNA could have been a death sentence for him but he continued to shine and have awesome matches. Awesomes matches inspite of some shoddy booking and creative writing.
I did not get Refuse to Loose. To be honest I thought I had ordered it, I got ahead of myself there....I'll blame my blank screen on the technical difficulties rather than my mistake.
And since videos are the theme du jour of this thread heres Corporate Austin and Vince McMahon...The start of some beautiful money making.
Is there anyway that Cena wins tonight, tying Flair's record and then, eventually, beating it before he retires, or...do they resist that temptation, 'saving' it for Wrestlemania, or beyond?
Is there anyway that Cena wins tonight, tying Flair's record and then, eventually, beating it before he retires, or...do they resist that temptation, 'saving' it for Wrestlemania, or beyond?
Big match John doesn't need the belt at the minute. They may wait break that record, build it up a bit in the fans minds over the course of the next few PPV's. If they go that route you can pretty much see Ambrose as a bit player since it would make sense for a cocky AJ to keep the belt with Cena grabbing a title tilt at WM at the Rumble.
I see Cena in the mix only because of a lack of competition for him and the lack of star power coming off of Ambrose.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Alpharius wrote: But wasn't it this angle - or right around it - that also gave us the forever to be cursed 'What?' shtick that's never gone away?
No, that was post Invasion. (aka the money burning angle)
Is there anyway that Cena wins tonight, tying Flair's record and then, eventually, beating it before he retires, or...do they resist that temptation, 'saving' it for Wrestlemania, or beyond?
Big match John doesn't need the belt at the minute. They may wait break that record, build it up a bit in the fans minds over the course of the next few PPV's. If they go that route you can pretty much see Ambrose as a bit player since it would make sense for a cocky AJ to keep the belt with Cena grabbing a title tilt at WM at the Rumble.
I see Cena in the mix only because of a lack of competition for him and the lack of star power coming off of Ambrose.
I agree. I think they will have him tie with Flair (maybe not beat him) but it should really be at one of the big 4 ppvs. And I think they'd be wise to build that up for a while until the crowd can get right behind it. At least as much as possible.
Really can't see anything other than AJ retaining tonight.
Possibly Ambrose could win?? If only to build a big angle between him and cena on the back of cena's excellent promo on Talking Smack the other week.
So, a recap of the last couple weeks? Although I've only caught bits of it.
No Mercy happened.
Few surprises (other than the card order), but a decent show?
The tag title match was good. The world title match was pretty good.
Miz - Dolph was very good.
It would've been nice to see that match close the show rather than Orton - Wyatt, if only to give the IC title a bit of a lift.
Since then Smackdown continued on with those same fueds. The Wyatt Orton fued hasn't grabbed me. I like Wyatt (and I think he's been unfortunate with injuries), but he just seems to be running the same storylines over and over - pick a strong face, mess with their heads for a few weeks, pick up a few wins with the help of the lighting director, then eventually lose to said face at PPV. Can't see this fued going anywhere different.
Cena is off on holiday it seems, which is fine. Ambrose and Styles are continuing their story with the help of James Elsworth which has been kinda fun (despite Elsworth nearly dying to the styles clash last week ). Still get the feeling that Ambrose's character isn't quite right yet, but Styles is doing a great job.
Over on RAW...
Goldberg is back!
I enjoyed his appearance. Feels like this Lesnar match could be exciting (where the last few really haven't). It'll be nice to see (and hear) the whole crowd behind him during that match, rather than them being split as in his previous few matches.
Rollins, Owens and Y2J are still doing their thing. Still entertaining. It would've been reall interesting to see that triple threat championship match at HiaC come to fruition, but I don't mind that they're continuing the JeriKO thing for a bit longer. I like them together.
And Hell in a Cell is next week.
Any thoughts? Any excitement? Does that type of match really carry the same appeal in the PG area, particularly when used fairly regularly now? I remember back in the day feeling genuine trepidation before some of these matches.
Does the women's title match have any chance of being special? (Seems like the talent want it to be....http://whatculture.com/wwe/vince-mcmahon-rejects-charlottes-request-to-moonsault-off-hell-in-a-cell)
The burning question though.... Is anyone else liking the new Bo Dallas? Because I am! Get him on Smackdown with his brother.
In personal news, I've had to give up my ticket for ICW Fear and Loathing, I'm travelling away for work the day that it's on. Very disappointed that I'm missing my chance to see Kurt Angle in the flesh. To cheer myself up, I've bought Smackdown live tickets (it was a close toss up between SD and RAW). Still not sure how good it's going to be. Hoping against hope that American Alpha will appear. The only confirmed appearance at the moment is the Becky Lynch Alexa Bliss title match. I've a funny feeling it will headline. Can't say that I'm excited by Bliss but I think Becky will be able to make a decent match of it. I think she'll be up for it.
And finally... because I really like linking these weekly WC articles.... this.....
I really enjoyed the event, but Christ, didn’t it start poorly? That American title match was awful, felt long too. Was it just me?
I’ve tried not to get too down on Reigns, I don’t like hearing someone get booed as relentlessly as he does. I understand that a lot of what fans don’t like about him is out of his control. WWE’s awful booking of this feud for instance - here was this really unlikable, uncharismatic thug (and current champion) spending weeks bullying a man and his wife… and he’s supposed to be the super babyface for us all to rally around? WWE’s insistence on having him be some sort of unstoppable superman doesn’t help either. Watching him power out of that chain assisted camel clutch? My eyes rolled so hard that I thought I might never see again. And the body armour? Why? Why is it allowed, and why did Rusev think that beating an armoured man in the chest with a stick would achieve anything?
It’s all just a bit gak. And silliness aside, there really was very little technical ability or even strength on show. Easy for an armchair fan to say, I know, but if Rollins can suplex Owens (on the apron) and Sasha Banks can suplex Charlotte (thrice), why can’t either Rusev or Reigns manage one big power move between them? I think there was one Samoan drop? It was an awful match to watch. Some serious changes need to happen with both of these guys I think.
Fortunately however, things then picked up. There were the filler matches (Brook – Bayley, E&C – A&G, which were what they were. The remaining title matches though, I enjoyed them all.
Tag Title match was good. I think we knew that New Day would retain, but it was an entertaining match. Hopefully the Seamus, Cesaro bus continues to roll on for a while yet.
Universal Title Personally, I thought this was one of the best matches I’d seen for a good while. Owens and Rollins are both just terrific performers, in every way, and they’ve produced a cracker here. The tempo was great, there were some great spots - the little quick routine with the alternate kicks and ending with the big clothesline was fantastic, Owens hit an AWESOME DDT, the running powerbomb into the cage, the tables and chairs spots. Honestly, I thought the match was great. Sometimes interruptions can really sour a match, but I thought this one worked even if the sequence leading to the opening of the cage was all a bit obvious. I’m OK with that. Owens retained, which was the right outcome, and Rollins looked the strong underdog. Everyone wins....
Cruiserweight Title Well, except TJ Perkins and Brian Kendrick who had to follow it. They did all right though. It was a decent enough match. Bit of a silly finish, but I’m glad Kendrick won. It’s been a decent little storyline, and it should continue OK for a while. I like both guys, and TJ’s 16bit entrance music always brings a smile.
Women’s Title First women’s Hell in a Cell match. First women’s match to headline a PPV.
I think it lived up to, even surpassing, most expectations. There was a lot of action, both women worked very, very hard. There were a few big, well executed spots and the whole match was pretty captivating. Perhaps the ending was a bit abrupt? And I don’t think the crowd expected the title to change hands. I don’t mind Charlotte as champ though. I think she’s very good at it. She should be holing it until at least Wrestlemania I reckon.
A really good match, but goodness, Sasha took some mad bumps again. That powerbomb through the announce table was stiff as all feth. Poor Sasha, she’s so light that you have to throw her really hard to break furniture, as evidenced at the end where that table refused to go on two occasions. I imagine both performers were rather tired by then. According to Ric Flair, they removed two other big spots from the match (http://www.cagesideseats.com/2016/11/2/13504688/ric-flair-wwe-changed-charlotte-hell-in-a-cell-match-avoid-sasha-banks-injury). I think I’m probably quite happy that they were. That was just about as physical (brutal) as I like my wrestling matches these days.
A good PPV in my opinion. Thoughts?
Also in WWE this week…
Dolph Ziggler threw out an open challenge to the RAW roster for his IC Championship. I like this. Who’s is throwing their hat in the ring? Sami Zayn? He has a hat. Anyone else?
Miz and DB had another fine tête-à-tête.
American Alpha squashed the Spirit Squad (Yay!). Please, please, please let AA be on the card for Smackdown Glasgow.
Strowman squashed lots of people to get on the RAW team for Survivor Series.
Anything else?
Anything interesting happening outside of WWE? I’ve not really managed to see or read anything other than ICW and WCPW’s twitter feeds. And I’m struggling to keep up with the TNA stuff, although I see that they lost their UK TV deal though. Shame, though it was very rare that I tuned in.
On that note, can anyone recommend a favourite wrestling news site to check out? One covering all the main promotions? I’d be interested to know.
I agree with pretty much everything you've written!
1) Reigns is tired, and won't get over as long as he's getting booked back into his Superman persona, ala John Cena.
2) Owens/Rollins was good - but I can't wait for one more run with Jericho as Champ!
3) Cruiserweights - was OK, but they continue to not wow me as much as I thought they would.
4) Women's Title - was fun, but yes, please, STOP having Sasha take so many insane bumps in matches with Charlotte. Yikes! I didn't like taking the title off her here either. A bit too much back and forth between this two in terms of title 'runs', though Sasha never seems to get much of a 'run'.
5) The Club - wish WWE would stop dicking around with them. I'm more than ready for someone else other then The New Day get to have a go at the titles too...
As for news sites, Bleacher Report does an OK job with WWE stuff, and a very poor job of 'everything else'.
I'd like to know of one that does them all justice/good/ok too, please!
Alpharius wrote: I agree with pretty much everything you've written!
1) Reigns is tired, and won't get over as long as he's getting booked back into his Superman persona, ala John Cena.
Agreed. As I said, I don't like hearing him getting booed like he has been (even in Glasgow last night apparently), so hopefully WWE come to their senses and change something. Is there any chance of that happening?
What I'd like to see is have him disappear for a good long while (Maybe off the back of a sound thrashing, play it like a serious injury), have him spend ~6 months in training, learning some actual wrestling moves, then have have him (with an outfit change) run in at Summerslam helping the Usos screw American Alpha out of the tag titles. I dunno, something like that. Won't happen though.
2) Owens/Rollins was good - but I can't wait for one more run with Jericho as Champ!
Maybe. I fething love Owens. Whether Jericho wins or not (and I'm not too fussed either way), the inevitable break up of their friendship and subsequent title match is going to be great.
There's great footage on twitter of the dark segment from Glasgow with those two, Seth and Enzo and Cass. It looked brilliant. Really fun. Sorta regretting my decision to buy Smackdown tickets rather than RAW . Although, it seems like the show itself wasn't too great with little actual wrestling (haven't watched it yet), so maybe not such a bad decision. Smackdown will be good, but it would've been awesome to have been there for that bit last night.
3) Cruiserweights - was OK, but they continue to not wow me as much as I thought they would.
Yeah, they've definitely been toned down from the Cruiserweight Classic. Which is a real, real shame. The lack of storylines and mic time is also hurting the interest in them I think. But there is this the new "205 Live" show starting, so we'll see what that's like. It does indicate investment in the division though, so somewhat encouraging.
4) Women's Title - was fun, but yes, please, STOP having Sasha take so many insane bumps in matches with Charlotte. Yikes! I didn't like taking the title off her here either. A bit too much back and forth between this two in terms of title 'runs', though Sasha never seems to get much of a 'run'.
As well as the women's division is doing, it is pretty thin. Particularly since the brand split. So as much as I like heel champ charlotte, and Sasha Banks I am worried about it all getting a bit stale. They seem to be pushing Bayley into the picture though, and Nia Jax is now getting beyond squash matches, so hopefully a four-way title picture can develope and keep us going for a while before this happens..... https://whatculture.com/wwe/10-women-wwe-must-sign-in-2017
There's plenty of talent out there it seems.
5) The Club - wish WWE would stop dicking around with them. I'm more than ready for someone else other then The New Day get to have a go at the titles too...
Yeah, I'd be ready for that too. The Club though? Not while WWE are treating them the way they are. Sadly, they aren't aanywhere near as credible as the should be. I'd actually quite like to see Cesaro and Seamus do it.
So yeah, ~10 hours until I hit up my first live wrestling show (I have no excuse for not even managing an ICW show before now). Super excited
Oh man! Why did I not see this thread sooner. Haven't been back into wrestling too long (just under a year), but I tend to stick with mostly American indies and NJPW. Watch a bit of WWE when it's something big like Wrestlemania.
How was the ICW show? Wasn't Matt Cross at that promotion recently?
Alfndrate wrote: Oh man! Why did I not see this thread sooner. Haven't been back into wrestling too long (just under a year), but I tend to stick with mostly American indies and NJPW. Watch a bit of WWE when it's something big like Wrestlemania.
How was the ICW show? Wasn't Matt Cross at that promotion recently?
Hey Alf,
Yeah, he was on their mini UK tour last week.
It wasn’t the ICW show I was at. Their big show is on the 20th, but I’m being sent away with work so I had to get rid of my ticket. To console myself I bought tickets for Smackdown on Tuesday night there.
It was fun. A good night. Not as much pure wrestling as I’d like, but still very enjoyable. Got to see both American Alpha and AJ Styles in dark matches which was great (even if the AA match was over in about 5 minutes).
However, I didn’t realise how obvious it would be that you’re simply in the live audience for a television show, rather than in the crowd for a live wrestling show. There’s a distinction there, know what I mean?
They do a regular Friday night show in Glasgow though, 20 minutes from my house. I need to be going to that. It’s to my shame that I haven’t bothered yet.
But if you’re interested in ICW, for the next day or two they’re offering a free 7 day trial on their ondemand service. Definitely worth checking out. Link below….
https:icwondemand.pivotshare.com
If you’re wanting a taste of the kind of crowds/atmosphere they can generate, this is a lovely moment from one of their big shows last year.
Dude, I love Grado he's been to my local independent promotion a few times. They had him up against Colt Cabana back in September (night before UFC 203). Was a good, lighthearted match.
Alpharius, isn't TNA up for sale?
Edit: Any of you seen BOLA 2016? Picked up the blurays a few weeks ago, gonna start digging into that tonight.
NJPW World, their streaming service, is feast or famine, May/June and late July/August was a lot of NJPW wrestling to take in with Best of the Super Juniors and G1 Climax and then like September was basically nothing but road to shows. Also it's only about 9/10 bucks a month. I did stop ity subscription because I didn't watch it all of October, I'll probably re-up it in time for Wrestle Kingdom.
TNA Wrestling has been experiencing a lot of craziness, but they might have just officially lost it. We know at this point that Anthem Entertainment, the people responsible for the Fight Network and helping TNA get out of debt, is sort of taking over. This is knowledge we have already. However, it seems that TNA is not eyeing any ideas to help their company presently and may be trying to focus on their future a bit too much.
According to PWInsider, TNA held a conference call yesterday to talk about the issues going on in the business. This is where they confirmed Anthem being a huge part of the business by introducing Eric Nordholm to the TNA board of managers. Eric has been with Anthem for a while, and the board will apparently be directing the company moving forward.
Dixie Carter would go on to praise Anthem for helping the company financially, as she obviously should considering the massive amount of debt TNA continues to rack up. Carter claims Anthem will help bring TNA to the next level. Of course, Nordholm didn’t want to miss the chance to praise the roster, and he did so. He claimed that the new agreement with TNA — which tells us there is something bigger in the planning — will help both TNA and The Fight Network moving forward.
There were a lot of questions about the creative staff, which Dixie Carter put to the rest. Of course, we know by now that Dave Lagana resigned from TNA Wrestling last week, which meant that creative was a worry for the company. She would claim that Billy Corgan was no longer part of the business yet again. Of course, Corgan is still fighting to get his money and claimed if he didn’t get it, he would turn his owed money into TNA ownership. So the fight should still be interesting, with both TNA and Corgan going forward as they attempt to move away from the Smashing Pumpkins frontman.
Dixie Carter claimed creative would be a bit of a collaborative effort between John Gaburick, Matt Conway, and former TNA Knockouts Champion Madison Rayne. Carter claimed that TNA was probably going to hire more people to help out in creative for the business moving forward.
The big thing that got people talking was an idea about an OTT streaming network using TNA content. That said, TNA may be trying to move down the same path as WWE and eventually have their own network. Obviously, unlike WWE, it may not be helpful for them to do so. They have very little money, and WWE lost money when they first tried this out. Vince McMahon, however, was a billionaire, and he still profited on a lot of things despite the initial financial loss. Now it has worked out for them, but it took a while for people to go with it.
If TNA went with this idea, they would need a lot of backup profit to help out with the initial loss that the network would cause them exactly as WWE had. TNA also mentioned that they were looking to get back into touring soon, which is good to see since they very rarely do live events these days. They also mentioned that they would like to strengthen their relationship with their Indian TV partner, Sony Six. TNA seems to do relatively well in India, so it makes sense that they would want to keep that relationship pretty tight.
Interestingly, the conference call came to what PWI claimed “an abrupt end” the moment an automated message said the call was being recorded. Of course, TNA never claimed there should be no recording. However, it is quite interesting that they wanted to keep all of this under wraps, considering TNA has claimed to be open about everything going on with the business. Did they plan to talk about more private information regarding the business, or was the conference call going to come to an end soon anyway?
Anthem.
Maybe Anthem can right the ship?
Anthem Statement on Investment in TNA Impact Wrestling
Toronto – Anthem Sports & Entertainment Corp. ("Anthem"), the parent company of Fight Network, today confirmed that it recently made a working capital loan to fund the operations of TNA Impact Wrestling. Fight Network is a licensee of TNA programming for broadcast in the U.S., Canada and other international markets, and is also the exclusive licensee of TNA for streaming Internet-delivered TV.
Fight Network has also offered to provide TNA Impact Wrestling with funding to repay the loans made by Mr. Billy Corgan and is positioned to provide additional transitional assistance to the company.
"TNA is a strong property for Fight Network and as a licensee and global distribution partner we have a keen interest in seeing the company not only survive but continue to grow and thrive, alongside our own growth," said Leonard Asper, CEO of Anthem. "We are hopeful that the company can soon get back to doing what it does best, which is to produce great wrestling content."
Also, Chris Jericho on The List!
The current run, creation of “The List”:
“I think when I turned heel and it seems like such a long time ago, it might almost seem that I’m not telling the truth but go back and watch when I turned on AJ Styles and I talked about giving him the Gift of Jericho, drink it in man, that got huge boos. Big, big boos. The scarf, when I started wearing the scarf before I turned heel, people were hating it, that’s so stupid, what is he doing? He looks ridiculous. The stupid idiot, when I said stupid idiot, that used to get major heat but what happens is those things become so entertaining that people start embracing it to where now stupid idiot is a term of endearment. The gift of Jericho, drink it in man, gets a huge response.
“So what happened was the gift of Jericho and I wish I could take credit for saying I came up with it but Jimmy Jacobs, who has become a writer in WWE, his name is Chris Scobille but his wrestler name is Jimmy Jacobs, no stranger to anybody who is a fan of Ring of Honor or any of those big independent companies. He said I’ve got this idea of the List of Jericho and you put a couple names on it. Oh yeah, that’s a great idea and we did it. Of course you do it once and it was kind of funny, that’s pretty funny, let’s do it again. So we do it again the next week, it gets a little bit of a buzz and then I go to the props truck and say can you make me big, thick list in case I want to use it to hit somebody over the head with and engrave something on. Then, they just put a red piece of paper on it that said the List of Jericho. Meanwhile, this thing is growing. Then, the one week where I said you just made the list and people cheered, it’s like holy (expletive) this is not what we expected. Then, the week we were in there with New Day and I put all three of them on the list, I said the secret is when I put you on the list, you have to sell it like it’s a horrible thing and Woods was great. If people are laughing at it, then it doesn’t get over but because it’s a serious thing, to be on the list is horrible then suddenly we have this whole new world of stuff to deal with.
“I was talking to Vince the other day and I said the list is more over than half the roster and he said yeah, I wish the list could work. The entity of this thing that doesn’t even exist and is now a character on the show. The best gimmicks and best things that work always happen organically. You can’t shove something down people’s throats. It just happens and it becomes a thing. The only thing I can compare this to is the angle I had with Shawn Michaels back in 2008. That was supposed to be just a one night thing that turned into a 7 month angle, culminating in a battle for the world heavyweight championship. That was not supposed to happen, that was never the plan. It was nothing more than a drop of the bucket sort of thing and that’s kind of what this whole character has been, especially the list. Now, the other day when I came out with the list, it’s like people are going nuts for it. Just a quick story, I was in Edmonton and Calgary the other day. I was in Edmonton, still a heel so I’ve got to be a heel, I don’t want to be a cool heel and I don’t want to embrace it because then I’m a baby face so I’m still doing what I can to stay a heel and I’m doing good. I’m threatening to fight Wayne Gretzky, I’m doing all this stuff in Edmonton, I go are you going to boo me, you know what happens when you boo me, you just made the list and suddenly, people just pop huge. So what do I do? The next night in Calgary, I start insulting the Harts, I’m going to beat up every Hart family member, girls, guys, kids included. Big boos. You know what happens when you boo me? People are starting to build. Oh, you thought you were going to be on the list? No, I’m sorry, you’re not worthy of being on the list. The fine people of Edmonton last night, they belong on the list. Calgary, no chance and that got boos so now not being on the list is the new being on the list and I did that last night on Raw for the first time where I refused to put Roman on the list and I refused to put anyone in Hartford on the list. That made me a heel for the night so you just never really know what’s going to get over but you have to take advantage of it when it does.”
I like how now not being on The List is the new being on The List!
The main heels in WWE at the moment (y2j, owens, styles) are just far too loveable to be effective in their roles. The poor faces have absolutely no chance.
Anyone looking forward to survivor series? Can't say that I've really enjoyed the build up (I did enjoy the 16 man tag match on SD, but that might just be an American Alpha thing). Although I quite like the format, can't say that I could really give a gak whether raw or sd come out on top. And the build up has done some weird things to regular storyline fueds which we're supposed to be invested in.
Just hoping for entertaining matches I guess. Could be OK.
Definitely more looking forward to the CW and IC matches. They should both be good matches, and they make much more sense, while carrying genuine repercussions.
Not sure what to expect from the lesnar/goldberg match.... Lesnar will win. Hopefully the match bares no resemblance to his last match.
NXT Takeover on the other hand, looks interesting. The tag match and joe/nakamura could both be excellent.
I'll be travelling all day on Monday and have plans on Tuesday then back to work on Wednesday, so it might be a while before I manage to get caught up on everything WWE this week.
I will, however, manage to see the ICW show (on a 7" tablet sadly). Paid for their on demand services, so I've been watching some of the build up to that this week.
Random Survivor Series thoughts, in no particular order!
* Will they really move the Intercontinental Title over to RAW? I...don't think so? Miz retains!
* I have no interest in the giant Brand vs. Brand Tag matches, male or female or tag teams. I suppose the only interesting thing to come out of any of them will be 'who will screw over who on their own team' in terms of moving stories forward. Because right now, the ridiculous 'Brand Loyalty' they're having people show is, well... ridiculous!
* Cruiserweight match - I actually DO see them moving it to Smackdown! as, for me, it has been a letdown to date on RAW. So, Kalisto wins!
Lesnar v Goldberg - I've long since grown tired of the Invincible Part time Indestructible Warrior and so I'd really rather have Goldberg win this one. But, since this seems to be a "One and Done" for him, I guess Lesnar wins here? But...who knows how? Or if? I can see a stupid schmozed up DQ finish. Not a beatdown ala Orton v Lesnar but...Orton gets involved, gets 'revenge' and Lesnar gets the DQ win?
I think Miz will retain. And I like the title on Smackdown. Think they might need to inject someone else into the picture though. I liked the ziggler/miz fued, but I don't think they can just keep repeating it. Not sure who though.
It'd be a shame for Sami Zayn though, he's struggled to find a place after the Owens fued. Pity.
I think the Cruiserweights will go to Smackdown. Ties in too well with the new "205 live" thing on Tuesday nights. Although they weren't as exciting as I'd hoped on RAW, they were still worth watching. Worried how they'd now fill that extra ~30minutes.
I'd like Goldberg to win as well. Just can't see it. Can't see anything other than a clean lesnar win, but hope I'm wrong. Goldberg's appearance does very much seem like a one off though. As long as it's not a rerun of the Orton match.
Like you, I'm also pretty tired of lesnar. Unbeatable, unlikeable, part timer. They've built him to a point where he weakens the actual Champ. It just wouldn't seem credible for the likes of Owens, Styles, Rollins, Orton, etc to be beating him. This can't be a good thing.
I don't like his style (as much as I love a good suplex). I really disliked the finish to the Orton match. When I want to watch MMA, I'll watch MMA. I don't need it in my wrestling.
I'd rather 'taker went back to his purple gauntlets as well.
As I said after he beat Orton, I've no idea where they can go with him.
@Alpharius: I see no decisive finish to Lesnar vs Goldberg unless there is a very screwy finish with run ins/a DQ/ or shenanigans. It is a no win situation really as neither man should be losing. If the venture has re-gained any of the lost WCW audience then they will be immediately turned away by a Goldberg defeat whilst so much strong booking has been invested in Brock (ending the streak, destroying Cena/Orton et al) that it makes no sense for him to lose.
I just hope that Goldberg's body can stand up to the task and that they put up a good match.
As for the battle for brand supremacy... meh. It just feels like nothing is on the line.
I probably am looking forward to Takeover more in spite of the recent call ups having depleted the roster somewhat.
If anyone lives near St. Louis or Alton, Illinois, ROH/NJPW wrestler Michael Elgin has been sidelined from wrestling until he's medically cleared.
While he's out of wrestling, he's setting up the ground work for his own indie promotion. They've got their first show on February 19th, 2017 in Alton. If you're close, can't hurt to check it out.
Also I've heard the tag team matches at last night's NXT Take Over in Toronto were some awesome matches, anyone confirm?
Not heard anything. It's 13:00 on Monday and I'm trying to avoid Takeover and Survivor Series spoilers.... until about Thursday hopefully
Managed so far. Staying away from Twitter.
I did stream the ICW show. It was pretty good. The women's match particularly. Looks like one of them, Carmel Jacob might be off to bigger and better things as well.
I'm nowhere near ohio I'm afraid, but hopefully this guys show goes well. How is it looking?
His show is very barebones at the moment. Only official announcement is Ethan Page, who's a pretty good wrestler and I can see him getting into the pros in the next five years or so.
Hands up, who did not see that coming in the Survivor Series main event...but I liked it. The main Raw vs Smackdown match was excellent, some brutal spots and a fair bit of intrigue as well. Overall a highly enjoyable event, so now onto January and the Rumble and the road to Wrestlemania.
The Takeover tag title match was excellent, I am really glad that the Revival are helping to bring tag team wrestling back to where it should be. The main event and Ride and Nakamura entrances were epic as well.
Went to a local wrestling show here in Cleveland on Friday. Took a few pics, got one with The Swolverine Brian Cage, MDogg Matt Cross (Son of Havoc on Lucha Underground), and a few pics from the hardcore match for the AIW Absolute Championship belt between Josh Prohibition and Tim Donst. http://imgur.com/a/RGWyA
Alfndrate wrote:Went to a local wrestling show here in Cleveland on Friday. Took a few pics, got one with The Swolverine Brian Cage, MDogg Matt Cross (Son of Havoc on Lucha Underground), and a few pics from the hardcore match for the AIW Absolute Championship belt between Josh Prohibition and Tim Donst. http://imgur.com/a/RGWyA
Great photos Alf, really good. Looks like lots of fun. And well done on getting out and supporting
Thraxas Of Turai wrote:Hands up, who did not see that coming in the Survivor Series main event...but I liked it. The main Raw vs Smackdown match was excellent, some brutal spots and a fair bit of intrigue as well. Overall a highly enjoyable event, so now onto January and the Rumble and the road to Wrestlemania.
The Takeover tag title match was excellent, I am really glad that the Revival are helping to bring tag team wrestling back to where it should be. The main event and Ride and Nakamura entrances were epic as well.
Yeah… I didn’t see that coming… not a bit.
Pleasantly surprised though. Not because I expect terribly much from Goldberg going forward, but mostly because it heralds a slight change of direction for Lesnar. I don’t expect it’ll be too long before normal service is resumed, but for now the change is welcome.
So it looks like both will feature (and likely dominate) the Royal Rumble match, Does that mean that one of them is about to enter the Championship picture? Can’t see a way for a part-timer to hold (or even believably compete for) a title.
What are your predictions for the Rumble? Seems likely that either Lesnar or Goldberg will win it, but what sort of title challenge does that lead to? Is there any space for a plucky underdog Rumble win? The last couple of RAWs suggest they may be beginning to build something with Sami Zayn, or am I just reading too much into it? I know I’d like to see a big title match between him and Owens. Their last run together produced some excellent stuff.
The rest of Survivor Series I enjoyed.
I thought all the elimination matches were very good (even if I thought that some of the orders of elimination were odd).
I thought it was a good show.
Not sure what to make of RAW holding on to the Cruiserweights, but we’ll see how it goes.
I also managed to what the NXT Takeover show. That tag match really was absolutely tremendous. Very, very, very good. And I agree with you Thraxas, those entrances were awesome.
Other news…
TLC is this weekend. Any excitement? I think it actually looks quite promising (Corbin-Kalisto aside).
And what’s going to happen with the Universal Title now that Reigns has a shot? Surely not, eh?
Finally, a wee catch up on some recent “Insane Spots” lists from Whatculture…. Because wrestling GIFs are cool
I have never been as unsure about the main Wrestlemania matches 4\5 months out for a long time apart from Brock and Goldberg seeming like a lock. It could be for a title (Universal one assumes) but I doubt it as they are both part timers and they do not need it. Balor vs Owens would be great, but depends upon his fitness. It almost seems as if they were positioning for Owens vs Styles but they would be nuts to try and unite the titles already. I would love it if both men run with the titles until April.
Maybe we get Rollins vs HHH and Taker vs Cena but really who knows? With the brand specific ppvs and possible injuries, suspensions and X-Factors (an awful team) there are so many twists in the road before the WWE rolls into Orlando.
TLC has a lot of potential to end a lot of feuds before we roll into the new year. I am pretty sure that the main event will deliver.
Alpharius wrote: I'm still holding out hope that Finn returns and wins the Rumble!
And do we think Sasha will hold the title for longer than 30 days now?
Who konws?? That was quite a match again, wasn't it?
I don't mind the title flip-flopping, I just wonder where its going to end. If it wasn't Hell in a Cell, I'm not too sure where else they can go.
As for Balor, I think there's every chance (depending on his recovery). For the same reason I fancy Sami Zayn as an outsider, and which Thraxas mentions... can't see them having a part-timer winning it. Maybe Lesnar might be stepping his work rate up a bit in the lead up to 'Mania? Could happen I suppose. Again, as Thraxas says, it's getting quite hard to predict. There's Undertaker's return too. What does that hold?
In terms of the Universal belt, Rollins should still be well in the title hunt as well over the next few months. I'm not sure what the thinking is behind giving Reigns the title shot at Roadblock rather than Rollins.
The WWE have just announced that they are holding a 16 man UK Championship tournament in Blackpool on the 14th and 15th of January, with the winner becoming the inaugural holder of this little beauty....
The entants are as follows....
•Trent Seven
•Jack Starz
•Pete Dunne
•Wolfgang
•Roy Johnson
•Sam Gradwell
•James Drake,
•Joseph Conners
•Tyson T. Bone
•HC Dyer
•Dan Moloney
•Chris Tyler
•Saxon Huxley
•Ringo Ryan
•Tiger Ali
•Tucker
I can admit to not knowing many of them. I've seen a bit of Trent Seven (super nice guy), Wolfgang, Joseph Conners and Pete Dunne. All very talented.
This should be a blast. I was close to buying tickets there (£27 each), Blackpool is around 3 and a half hours from where I live. However, being right after an expensive time of year, I'm now thinking that it might be quite nice just to sit in and watch on TV. It's a rare novelty when WWE events are shown live at a sociable hour here.
Post tournament, it'll be interesting to see how the division will be handled. I guess it'll be separate from the main roster? Something like how the cruiserweight are being shown? Will they have their own show (205 live like), and will it be permanently based in the UK? That'd be kinda cool, but I'd also like there to be a possibility of some of the guys crossing over into RAW or Smackdown.
Any thoughts?
Also, I just noticed this thread has been moved to Geek Media..... GEEK MEDIA?!?
I would expect that any nationality could compete for the title, but that the talent will be pulled from the UK indy scene? Not sure.
At launch Finn Balor (who isn't from the UK) described it as a bridging the gap between the independents and the WWE.
Could see it being a sort of developmental tier based here permanently, kinda like how NXT is predomiinately based in Florida. In fact, I could see it being run very similarly to NXT. There would definitly be an appetite for that here. I think they'd build a real strong fanbase pretty quickly.
Any potential Takeover like event would be awesome by the way.
I'm quite excited by this prospect. And quietly optimistic.
Triple H says...
"The tournament is the next step in our ongoing strategy to create localized content for our global WWE Network, develop another brand that engages our passionate fans, and add a new dimension to our on-going storylines."
Few things to catch up over the last couple of weeks. Any thoughts? I’ll have missed a few things.
Three cheers for Sheamus and Cesaro!!! Didn’t expect that, but please that it happened. They’re a good, entertaining team.
The RAW women’s title flipped again. It wasn’t particularly a surprise. I just hope Sasha Banks can take a little break now. It feels like she’s been getting the gak caned out of her for months and months now. Give the girl a rest.
And Neville’s back as a horrible ol’ heel. Love it. Suits him. Hopefully he’ll inject some welcome excitement in the CW division. Speaking of which, why did they have to make Noam Dar so very, very creepy? Why? Can wrestlers ever recover from that gimmick? It’s always the Scot.....
Decent week for spots this. Kenny Omega finishing Okada through a table, a Vertibreaker onto a chair in LU and there are some absolute gems from Delete or Decay.
There’s a wrestler being fired out of an erupting volcano.... And Matt Hardy’s boat breaks up a pinfall.....
........
There is a wrestler being fired out of an erupting volcano and Matt Hardy’s boat breaks up a pinfall.
I never saw the whole show but I need to find it. Bonkers!
For completeness, here are the big spots from Roadblock: End of the Line…. Meh….
Looking forward to Smackdown on the 27th. Cena’s return might be worth watching, particularly if the Undertaker shows up again. A few title matches on the show. Can’t see any title changes coming (rightly probably), but the matches should all be pretty strong. Think it’ll be a good show.
Anyone planning on watching Wrestle Kingdom in the new year? Should I (having never watch NJPW before)?
Automatically Appended Next Post: And Happy Christmas everyone
Someone on r/squaredcircle went through and tallied up how many times Ric Flair would have been champion if he won titles at the same rate Charlotte was winning and re-winning the Women's title. There was a point where he would have been a 49 time champion in a single promotion.
I think it might be time to legitimize the Women's belt and place it on someone for a good long time and just stop throwing it back and forth between Charlotte and whatever poor girl has to deal with the mini-feuds.
Alfndrate wrote: Someone on r/squaredcircle went through and tallied up how many times Ric Flair would have been champion if he won titles at the same rate Charlotte was winning and re-winning the Women's title. There was a point where he would have been a 49 time champion in a single promotion.
I think it might be time to legitimize the Women's belt and place it on someone for a good long time and just stop throwing it back and forth between Charlotte and whatever poor girl has to deal with the mini-feuds.
Yes, please!
I could not agree more!
I still haven't quite figured out what WWE Creative is up to, or even if I think they're actually 'up' to anything at all with this!
The churn and burn with the title changes and feud is just indicative of the amount of wrestling we see now. 2016 has had a daft amount of ppvs/special events and a feud that could have easily lasted 12-18 months has been burned out in less than half a year, never mind the RAW matches. During his heyday Rice Flair would have had 3 to 4 championship matches on ppv or a Clash of the Champions equivalent in that same timespan, Charlotte vs Sasha did that in about four months.
Had a lot of wrestling in the past week. I've been traveling down Pro-wrestling's history. I read Squared Circle, a history of wrestling in the US, as told through the lives of dead wrestlers. I also found a copy of Wrestlemania 3 on DVD and watched that (for the Hulk vs Andre the Giant match and Macho Man vs Ricky Steamboat), and then saw a Japanese women's wrestler named Dynamite Kansai's last match, which prompted me to go find her best match which was a tag team bout from 1993.
And then NJPW's WrestleKingdom 11 is Wednesday.
Friday I went to the final show of 2016 for my local promotion, saw Matt Cross (Son of Havoc from Lucha Underground) challenge for the "Intense Title" and his Grandmother interfered (Matt's from my hometown). Then Raymond Rowe (of Ring of Honor's War Machine tag team) was supposed to challenge Josh Prohibition for the "Absolute Title" but that was cancelled when Josh was attacked with chair by Tim Donst. Suffice to say Donst got what was coming to him.
And for you WWE fans, someone on Reddit made a video of all of the title changes of 2016 https://streamable.com/3psqx
Love the pictures you're posting Alf, looks like a fun little night at those shows.
Did you watch Wrestle Kingdom? I didn't, but it seems it was quite the show. Meltzer gave the (47min) main event 6 stars?! I've yet to watch it, but I believe it's on YouTube somewhere.
Was it really that good?
I haven't watched terribly much over the past couple of weeks. I've only really made time for Smackdown. Delighted to see my American Alpha win the tag titles. It would've been cool to have it happen at a big PPV after maybe being screwed out of it a couple of times, but hey, still great to see them on top. Their performances over the last few weeks have been really excellent. Particularly in their title winning match. Wee Chad Gable is quickly becoming my hero. Two minutes into that match he picks the biggest guy in it and delivers the most perfect Northern Lights Suplex. Hits another on Luke Harper (the 2nd biggest guy) later on too. Really really like this guy.
Other than that I've mostly been getting excited for this UK Championship this weekend. Anyone else planning on tuning in? They've released the first round draw. My early pick is for a Pete Dunne, Trent Seven final. Perhaps simply because they are two of the guys I'm more familiar with. Both are good. Trent maybe a bit old for the WWE though? Mid thirties he is. Similarly Tyler Bate is also good, but I think at 19, they may think him a bit young... who knows.
Quite stylish, this trio is....
Spoiler:
Also look out for Joe Conners, Mark Andrews and Wolfgang.
Alpharius, the Irish guy Jordan Devlin, could be Finn Balor's twin.... in fact he could be Finn Balor.
Any word on his return yet? The Rumble is close.
And in completely unrelated news, I seen this Jedi Chokeslam....
No idea who it is or where.... but it's truly awesome.
Edit:
Also, I really agree with this...
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: The churn and burn with the title changes and feud is just indicative of the amount of wrestling we see now. 2016 has had a daft amount of ppvs/special events and a feud that could have easily lasted 12-18 months has been burned out in less than half a year, never mind the RAW matches. During his heyday Rice Flair would have had 3 to 4 championship matches on ppv or a Clash of the Champions equivalent in that same timespan, Charlotte vs Sasha did that in about four months.
The oversaturation of WWE PPVs (and WWE programming generally) is definitely a problem. When PPV's start becoming missable, how can they keep expecting people to sit through 3 hours of RAW every week. The point about potential 18 month fued being burned through in less than 6, is super-valid. We are seeing the same matches 5 times a month.
Whatever happens do not show Jim Cornette the Jedi chokeslam, he would go ballistic.
I am looking forward to the UK tournament this weekend, it is nice to have wrestling during primetime rather than waiting up until 1am. I am also coming in with no idea about any of the wrestlers ask know nothing about the UK independent scene bars few bigger stars such as Ospreay and ZSJ.
I just hope that Vince still believes in Finn post injury, the past of wwf\wwe is littered with people destined for the big time only to suffer injuries and then fall down the card. This man beat 2\3 of the Shield on his way to the title, perhaps he would not have beaten Roman were it not for his wellness policy failure, but that is another matter. With Taker, Goldberg, Brock alone there is enough star power in the Rumble, I see no real point in Balor coming back early unless they plan for him to win it and challenge for the Universal title at Mania.
He, his opinions and probably his accent, are the very definition of Marmite. Personally I love the show and most other things on the MLW podcast network. I am especially keen on anything hat covers old school (for me pre Rock n Wrestling era) and outsider wrestling, that means the 605 Super Podcast is my favourite. It led me to the discovery of one of my favourite outsider wrestling characters Mark Gullen:
It's not so much his opinions, or his accent. It's kinda more that his general manner grates on me a bit. And the (apparent) lack of structure you the show bothers me probably more than it should. Which is a shame as he'd undoubtedly have some interesting stories. I'll probably try again at some point.
I do listen to Bruce Prichard's show every week. I like that one a great deal. I've listened to a few of Flair's (which has finished now) but I didn't always find them very easy to listen to.
Any others you'd particularly recommend? Most of the shows on MLW don't give you any sort of synopsis on the episodes which would usually attract me to download.
How about wrestle soup? Ever listen to that?
Jim Ross is another which I sometimes listen to while waiting for the next Prichard episode.
Something To Wrestle with is great, you just have to have your BS alarm on for some of Prichard's bias but the co-host Conrad does a good job of that.
What do you want from a podcast? I tend to steer clear of most modern based podcasts and prefer historical based ones.
I tend to like specific genre podcasts, my personal favourite is the Lapsed Fan which reviews old ppvs with the relevant historical background and associated book quotes. This month is AWA month which I know little about. Again you may hate it, especially if you are not a fan of bad language. Probably the best place to start is their Wrestlemania review series.
Stone cold is usually great if he has a wrestling based guest, I ignore all others. I have kind of gone off the podcast one podcasts(Austin, Jericho, JR) due to all of the adverts.
I enjoy the LAW Live audio wrestling reviews of modern ppvs and see/Japanese shows.
That said there is so much out there maybe just give everything a go and see whatsticks. If you want any more details just shoot me a pm.
Not sure how much we'll see about him 'officially' tonight though, given the cloud of the murder charge hanging over him that was more or less dismissed due to him being found incompetent to stand trial...
So, I haven't seen it, but it seems they gave him the full gushing death of a legend bit on RAW last night.
Not how I'd have went with it, to be honest.
Onwards and upwards however, to happier events.... The WWE UK Championship Tournament happened!
How did everyone find it?
Personally, I thoroughly enjoyed it. The first night was alright, but the second was great.
*SPOILERS AHEAD*
Spoiler:
The action was pretty good, characters were built well, and there were some really strong matches (Dunne-Andrews particularly). I thought that from the quarters on, the talent were showcased really well, all getting the chance show what they were about. Trent Seven might be a little disappointed but it worked well for the show I thought, particularly with him being built as the early favourite.
The simple in-ring storytelling was great, particularly in the later rounds. Pete Dunne and Tyler Bate both getting over massively (Dunne with the assistance of a scary William Regal). At least that's how it appeared in the hall. I don't know how the wider WWE audience felt about it all, but I loved it. I let myself get totally invested in it too, I was 10 years old again on Sunday night I think I actually yelped when Bate got that pin on Wolfgang.
I'm probably a little biased, I've been watching a few of these guys quite a bit this year, and I'm loving where the UK scene is at the moment, but I really enjoyed the whole event.
I'd love to hear the opinions of you folks?
Here are Whatculture's handy "Insane Spots" gifs...
I think they were in a tough spot given that Tamina works for them and all of the closeness of the Anoa'i family (Roman, Uso's etc) and the Maivia's that they had to acknowledge it or there would have been a lot of ill feeling. They also have the technicality that although the evidence points to him having been a murderer he was never actually charged.
UK Tournament wise I agree, the first night was good but the second night really put it over the top. I knew nothing of the 16 wrestlers but came out a fan of Bate, Dunne, Mandrews et al. As you say simple story telling with well executed wrestling. I am looking forward to see where they go with the scene now.
Not your 'typical' Champion build on Bate, but I love that they did go with him.
And Dunne looks good to go too.
Overall, the whole thing did seem to have more of a 'crusierwieght' feel to it, but I prefer when WWE let's, for lack of a better term, the more 'regular looking' guys have a run with it.
It's been a good year for the more regular looking guys, Owens, Balor, AJ, even Rollins. WWE certainly seem to be moving away from Vince's typical vision of the ideal man.
I presume we're using the term "regular looking" in relative terms.
You're right. As unpredictable and exciting as the Rumble is looking at the moment, it's still likely to be won by one of about 6 big, old guys... well, at least Strowman isn't that old. And Roman isn't going away for that hiatus that I wished for any time soon.
Come on Finn!
Still think of they'd had played it right a month or two ago, they could've worked Sami Zayn into a believable underdog contender.... that's been shot to gak now though.
Oh, and nice to see Angle getting into the HoF. Who will be inducting him?
In interviews Angle has said that he wants Stone Cold to induct him, it makes sense as their partnership and then rivalry around the 9/11 atrocity was immense. I am glad to see him back, do we get some more matches or is his destiny the Performance Centre?
So possible rumble winners?
Undertaker
Goldberg
Lesnar
Jericho
Strowman
Finn Balor?
Seems like Raw has it covered. What is certain is that the main event and title matches for Wrestlemania are anybody's guess. Which is a good thing. I do have a sinking feeling that Kevin Owen's days as champ are numbered, but we will see.
Finally Omega vs Okada was great, but personally it fell short of my two favourite matches of all time Bret vs Austin at Wrestlemania 13 and Bret vs Bulldog at Summerslam 1992.
And Rusev would be a very natural rivalry for Kurt. He should be a special attraction though, 2/3 matches a year at most. A lot depends upon how his neck and body in general is and if he is off the booze/painkillers.
I just cannot see Strowman in a title programme yet though, maybe him and Taker eliminate each other leading to a match or he eliminates his old Wyatt brethren and goes that way? However, I could see Strowman vs Reigns, oddly turning him face by default.
As for Angle, I don't think he'd be NXT-bound at all.
WWE main roster or bust.
He's 48, so could/should have a match or two left in him...
He's been fairly active in the UK independents recently.
I would expect him to get back in the ring.
Automatically Appended Next Post: "On a recent episode of former WWE ring announcer Lilian Garcia's podcast, "Making Their Way to the Ring," Angle admitted that he'd like to have one more match with longtime TNA adversary - and current WWE Champion - AJ Styles. In the interview, Angle raved about Styles, calling him "a special individual" who "only comes around once in a lifetime.""
It's just a quick highlight package, probably doing a favour for his old employers, but it features him, Tyler Bate and Mark Andrews in a mixed tag team with Nixon Newell.
If you enjoy women's wrestling, she's well worth a watch.
• #1 Entrant – Miz
• Longest Run – Corbin
• Shortest Run - Ziggler
• Most Eliminations - Strowman
• NXT Call-up or Surprise Entrant – Samoa Joe
• #30 Entrant – Samoa Joe
• Final Four – Goldberg, Lesnar, Strowman (or Rollins, can’t decide), Joe
• FINISH – Goldberg and Lesnar eliminated at the same time (either eliminating each other, or Goldberg is bundled out by Joe immediately after eliminating Lesnar). Joe eliminates Strowman…. (or Rollins)
I would love to have Zayn as Longest Run and in place of Strowman (or Rollins) in my final four and finish scenario, but it seems he is kinda out of favour at the moment, think he might get destroyed here.
Other Predictions –
• Strowman eliminates ‘Taker
• Harper eliminates Bray Wyatt
• Mojo Rawley isn’t a squash and does alright for a while
• Cena beats AJ
• Reigns beats Owens
• Charlotte beats Bayley
• Neville beats Swann
Finn Bálor When he was drafted to Raw during the brand split in July, Bálor was pushed as the top prospect in pro wrestling. When he became the first Universal champion at SummerSlam, the anointing was complete. When it was revealed that he injured his shoulder during that match to the point of having to give up the belt and get surgery, his career (and WWE’s long-term plan) was thrown into disarray. If he is cleared to wrestle on Sunday, WWE can pick up right where it left off. It wouldn’t take much to reboot the character — just have him come out with his full PPV entrance midway through the match and have him tear it up, eliminating a few major players along the way. Reigns beats Owens, Owens enters the Rumble at no. 30, and Bálor ends up in the final two with him. They go back and forth, the once and future face of the company against his stopgap replacement. Owens goes for the pop-up powerbomb, but Bálor reverses it into a hurricanrana, tossing Owens to the floor. Finn goes on to face Reigns at Mania, finally allowing Roman to turn heel, and reestablishing Bálor atop the company.
WWE would be right where it planned to be six months ago. But Triple H would be right — nobody would expect it. They might predict a Bálor return, but nobody would expect long-term plans to come to fruition. This is pro wrestling after all. Anything can happen, and sometimes the obvious thing is the last thing you expect.
I hope no one in here was hoping for a surprise Kenny Omega entrance at the Rumble. Kenny said on Dave Melzter's show today that he will renegotiate with NJPW in mid-February and should be with them for at least once more year.
I need to catch up on NJPW, I think I've missed at least New Year's Dash, and maybe one other show.
Alpharius wrote: I'm shocked that a Wrestling Fan such as yourself is not well versed in the Art of the Swerve!
All kidding aside, I think most people were of the opinion that Omega would re-sign.
He's very, very much all about Japan, so really the more shocking outcome would be if he left.
I expected a swerve, but doing so would go against his statement about wanting to be the biggest wrestler to never step foot into the WWE, but that'd be part of the swerve! So much potential swerving! Honestly I'm choosing to believe in kayfabe, no matter how dead it may be
After Shinsuke and AJ left abruptly last year, Omega knows he's probably got almost any contract he wants from NJPW, and it excites me because the current story in NJPW is pretty exciting.
Wrestling fans can eliminate one potential surprise entrant for the Royal Rumble match. In an interview Thursday on Wrestling Observer Radio (via Ringside News' Steve Carrier), Kenny Omega confirmed he won't be wrestling at Sunday's pay-per-view.
Omega added that he hasn't signed a new deal with New Japan Pro-Wrestling but plans to work out the details with the company in February.
Omega is considered the hottest free agent in wrestling. He's one of the best wrestlers in the world, further bolstering his case in an instant classic against Kazuchika Okada at Wrestle Kingdom 11 on Jan. 4.
Omega's entrance alone—in which he mimicked The Terminator—had fans buzzing:
A move to the WWE would be a natural career progression for the 33-year-old. He has arguably accomplished everything he can in Japan, and if the WWE is willing to make AJ Styles one of its biggest stars, it's fair to speculate Omega would get the same treatment.
In an interview with Sports Illustrated's Justin Barrasso, though, Omega criticized wrestlers who have signed with the WWE and grown content with their place in the company:
Kenny Omega wrote:I'm eating, breathing, and s--tting wrestling right now. When I'm waking up in bed in the morning and my bones and my joints are aching—and I know that I'm not 'old' old, but I know there is a lot of younger talent floating around their roster—I'm wondering, 'Why in the hell are these guys not rising up? Why are they not doing what it takes to be better? Are they so happy to be a cog in the WWE machine that they're just happy to be where they are? Are they just satisfied to see WWE as the name on their paycheck every week? Why can I keep getting better and pushing the envelope to have these 'Matches of the Year,' but no one else can even come close?' AJ Styles has been great, but he's been great forever. Why is there no one else?
While Styles has been a massive success in the WWE, two of his former NJPW brethren, Karl Anderson and Luke Gallows, haven't fared as well. Finn Balor's shoulder injury may have altered the WWE's plans for Anderson and Gallows, but their run with the company has been disappointing nonetheless.
It's easy to see why their struggles would give Omega pause about making the jump.
In addition, the 2017 Rumble match is already full of star attractions as well as potential surprise returns. Goldberg, Brock Lesnar and The Undertaker are among those taking part, while Balor, Shinsuke Nakamura and Samoa Joe could be unexpected entrants. Omega would likely get lost in the shuffle if he were one of the 30 competitors.
While Omega shut the door to WWE for the time being, the speculation may heat up again whenever his new deal with NJPW is set to expire.
I was genuinely expecting Samoa Joe, I was even excitied just in case your Balor dream came true. It was late, I was tired, anyone would have been better.
It was just an unfathomable decision.
At least he didn't win the thing (there might have been an actual riot), but then why even put him in if he's not going to win it. Setting up a fued with the Undertaker? Having Taker lay down for him at Wrestlemania is not going to endear him to the fans any more than having him take a big gak in the middle of the ring would.
As far as Orton winning goes, I'm probably OK with it. Quite enjoying his work with the Wyatts. Although Cena - Orton at mania doesn't particularly excite. Looking forward to seeing how Luke Harper is booked in the next few months.
I'm glad it wasn't Lesnar, Goldberg or Taker though. I imagine Lesnar and Goldberg will just continue their part-time fued until their inevitable mania match. And did anyone else think Undertaker looked pretty terrible? (accounting for age/style/legendary status, etc)
A Reigns - Undertaker match at wrestlemania this year has the potential to be really awful.
Jericho had a really good performance, wouldn't have minded him winning it to set up a clash with Owens.
So, I thought the RR match was OK, not great, but that #30 entrant just soured it a bit for me.
The rest of the PPV I thought was good. I enjoyed all the other matches, Styles - Cena particularly (and predictably). I just hope Styles is booked well from here (ie not made to look like an idiot.
Maybe have him try pick a fight with Orton for his title shot?
We'll see what the scene looks like after Elimination Chamber.
I feel like it's probably legit. Which would be a real shame. The HHH, Rollins fued looked like it could've been good. Joe acting as HHH's proxy would've been interesting, and a good use of Joe.
Hopefully Rollins can heal soon enough to pick that program back up without losing too much momentum.
Samoa Joe kinda hanging now though.
By the way, did anyone see Cody Rhodes' chair shot on some poor bastard in ROH this week?
fething vicious, not really comfortable viewing for me
I hope it's a work. It would just seem a strange one. Unless they're trying to pad it out til mania, avoid having too many coming togethers on RAW? Hope so.
Forgot there was a smack down ppv Sunday. Watched the main event last night. Pretty good match, but the Miz is practically an auto channel change for me.
He is the perfect heel and I cannot stand watching him wrestle. There is no redeeming quality about his character the heel mentality permeates every fiber of his slimy being he has so much heat with me it'll burn the perogies his beloved hometown of Parma Ohio to a crisp.
At this point I don't think I could like him if he turned face.
Alpharius wrote: Doesn't that mean that, for you, he is the quintessential heel?!?
Was gonna say. The company's other supposed top heels (KO, Jericho, Styles) are just far too loveable to be effective. That's why Miz is so necessary right now. He did breath a bit of life into Dolph Ziggler for a while there.
Not sure where his next fued is coming from though. Probably Ambrose? Could be OK, but I'm not a huge fan of Ambrose either.
I thought Bailey's win was a strange choice. I really thought Charlotte was going on a long run this time (I had no basis for that feeling), and I would've thought that Bailey's first win would've been saved for a bigger PPV in the future. So yeah, it seems odd to me. At least it wasn't a clean win, and I'm sure Charlotte will regain at Fastlane. Could even be a bit of a squash.
I'm delighted in the Elimination Chamber result though. I'm also pleased with the way they finished the match. Clean pins on both Cena and Styles? That bodes well for Wyatt. He needs to be a strong Champ. None of this cowardly heel stuff.
Smackdown is intruiging at the moment. If they can keep Wyatt and Orton away from eachother for the next 6 weeks, it'll help make their Mania collision really interesting.
Does Orton put Wyatt over here?
Back in the UK, that Fight Club: Pro card I mentioned above is getting a bit ridiculous....
And on Sunday I went to the ICW FightClub TV taping. Headlined by Trent Seven vs Jimmy Havoc, with Wolfgang doing a little run-in at the end, it was a really good show. Lots of fun, lots of talent.... and a balcony leap through a table
Am I the only one utterly bored by Bray 'seriously looks like my mate Fat Paul' Wyatt?
I mean the whole 'inbred hick family' shpiel got quite old, quite quickly. And given he's rarely won a match without outrageous cheating has made it repetitive.
Any time he's there on his todd, he tends to get his head kicked in off The Face.
There's rarely any closure to his nonsense. Continually pick fights and 'harass' Daniel Bryan - get head kicked in. Switch to continually picking on John Cena - get head kicked in. Switch to Roman Reigns - get head kicked in. Switch to someone else.
That's a problem that "WWE CREATIVE" definitely had with him - and has had with him for quite some time.
So he can be an effective heel - when booked correctly.
The Elimination Chamber main event result and last night's Smackdown main event result show that, possibly, WWE CREATIVE has removed their heads from their butts in terms of booking him....'better'.
There's rarely any closure to his nonsense. Continually pick fights and 'harass' Daniel Bryan - get head kicked in. Switch to continually picking on John Cena - get head kicked in. Switch to Roman Reigns - get head kicked in. Switch to someone else.
I agree. That's a fair summary of his last couple of years. I think I said the same thing earlier in the thread.
I just think, as Alph points out, his booking in Elimination Chamber and this weeks Smackdown are at least... encouraging? (He said hopefully).
Did any of you guys catch the Tyler Bate - Trent Seven match on NXT this week?
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it from across the pond.
What did you make of the pace, style, manner, etc?
Bray Wyatt, is one of the more interesting gimmicks that the WWE has had in awhile I think he's solid. That being said I'm excited for Samoa Joe he's a great talent.
I think WWE need to really think about there heels.
They can be fun, but when they all repeatedly get out of a loss because their goon squad shows up, it's predictable and dull - and the second their goon squad is stripped away (by one means or another) boom, time to eat some mat.
Would it kill them to have a heel that isn't surrounded by goons, but is instead just a really, really awesome wrestler - someone for the Face to have to train against.
I mean, you can't be a hero if you don't have a montage, no?
And while I'm OK with 'guest appearances' all over the place, I do hope he makes his 'official medically cleared return' up on the main roster, challenging for the title he never officially lost!!!
So the current Faces gain too much power, and go a bit 'mad in the head' - setting up unfair matches to punish heels etc.
Wouldn't have to be a long term thing, and you could even keep John 'ultimate Face, can never turn Heel for reasons of munneh' Cena out of that - perhaps rallying the fallen Heels in the name of sportsmanship and not bring Sports Entertainment into disrepute?
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Sadly, the weekly shows are one of the reasons I ditched my Network sub.
Here in the UK, we're a month behind on weekly shows, but up to date on PPV - all thanks to Sky being difficult, it would seem.
Means I can't follow the plot lines!
Don't worry, The Network is a month behind in the US with Smackdown and RAW as well... Its broadcasting rights with USA Network, part of the reason I canceled my free trial. I like the NXT stuff I've seen online but only after I hear from people that it's worth watching.
Reddit's SquaredCircle keeps me up to date on most.of what's going on with the WWE.
I found out I'm going to the NXT show in Cleveland Friday, hopefully Johnny Gargano will get to show off in front of the hometown crowd.
Also, Lucha Underground seasons 1 and 2 are coming to Netflix March 15th.
Alpharius wrote:Man, that Orton/Wyatt storyline from last night?
Ouch.
Channeling the worst parts of 90's Wrestling?
Not good.
The Hardy's are getting away with it just because they seem to really be enjoying it.
And now, the Hardy's are free agents again too...
Worryingly... I quite liked it?
Not sure why. It was obviously pretty silly and OTT but I didn't mind it. One of those ones where I would've been cringed up like an accordian if there were any non-wrestling fans in the room with me watching it, but one that I quite guiltily enjoyed alone.
Randy Orton is a dispicable character. I really don't like him. He's my quintessential heel as the Miz is to Alfndrate (he looks a bit like the dude who bullied me when I was a boy too, that helps)
And Wyatt is destined to be a big "every-man/Jake the Snake" babyface. This is the turn we all knew was coming. Although Orton's betrayal came sooner than expected, I thought Bray sold it pretty well. If they build it well over the next few weeks, have Orton get really, really nasty, make Wyatt look powerless without Sister Abigail, then have Wyatt fething DESTROY Orton at 'Mania? I'll be delighted. I think that'd have to be they way to go?
Surely Orton puts Wyatt over at 'Mania? Can't see it going any other way.
Maybe Harper could get involved and join back up with Wyatt? That'd be a hugely popular face team as well.
Alpharius wrote:NXT can be just as hit or miss, but benefits from a bit more frenetic pace as well as being a shorter overall show.
For me, that's usually why SMACKDOWN beats RAW most days too.
For me it's the sole reason why I watch Smackdown most weeks, and rarely watch RAW. I generally just catch up with what happens on RAW on Whatculture.com. Which is a shame, because I'll miss big moments/surprises (Samoa Joe's debut for eg), but it's just too difficult a show to sit through for me, and 3 hours a week is quite a big chunk of my limited free time.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Debating reactivating my WWE Network memebership.
I mean, £9.99 a month, and you get £15 PPVs thrown in?
But I ditched it because plots were being repetitive (not helped by repeated injuries to the top card)
I'm really happy with my subscription.
Obviously you get the current PPV's which I look forward to watching on the Monday evening usually. I watch and enjoy NXT for most of the reasons mentioned above. The one hour format helps a great deal. It's also more atractive to me now that the UK guys are appearing on it (Trent Seven, Bate, Dunne and Mandrews in recent weeks).
But outside the current stuff, there's the archive which is just bottomless - as you know if you were a previous subscriber.
I started off just rewatching the stuff I remember (a span of only about 5 years) for the nostalgia, but now I find myself going back in for much older stuff. I listen to the Bruce Prichard podcast religously, really enjoy it, and it's nice to go back and what some of the events and wrestlers which they discuss. Conrad Thompson also has just started doing a podcast with Tony Schiavone too, which means I'm watching old WCW stuff, which I never watched in my youth.
I even watched Starrcade '83 the other day. An event held 4 days before my birth.
I'm also encouraged by the rumours of the Network picking up some Independent shows too.
That is, for better or worse, a well establish 'Heel Gimmick' and probably isn't going to go away anytime soon as it is an easy psychological trick for audience manipulation.
It doesn't always work, and 'smart' fans tire of it too, but cheating to win will always be the Hallmark of the Heel!
As we previously discussed though, just having Heels straight up win via beatdowns is OK too, and should be used more.
Interestingly enough, that gets old too - see: Braun Strowman, a wrestler that bores me to death, but who clearly fits the Vince McMahon 'This Guy's A Star!!!!" mode...
Depends on the heel. Guys like HHH, Orton, the Miz are really unlikable natural heels. As I've said before, a lot of WWE's current heels are too likeable to be effective (Styles, Owens, etc).
And Alpharius is right, there is a place for the cowradly/cheating gimmick, but the best heels were also strong in their own right.
HHH (one of the best) often had his goons on hand, but you knew that when it came to it he could really wreck face (Cactus Jack's face for example).
This Tuesday on Smackdown LIVE, Randy Orton will face AJ Styles to decide the WWE Title No. 1 Contender at Wrestlemania.
Didn't we just have:
The Royal Rumble to decide that?
Didn't Orton then give up his title shot?
Which led to a 10-Man Over the Top match on Smackdown to decide that?
Which then led to a Lucker Harper vs. Styles on Smackdown to decide that?
I can see Orton winning, Styles blaming Shane (rightfully or not) for it, and then we get the match that ONLY WWE want to see at Wrestlemania - Shane vs. AJ?
Ugh.
Having the #1 Contender tag apparently...doesn't mean what it used to mean (mostly)?
Moving right along in our continued discussion over the scripted form of entertainment known as Professional Wrestling...
I get WHY the WWE U-Title match was a squash:
1) Goldberg needs to be 'protected' as his match with Lesnar at Wrestlemania will be a huge draw, and at his age, injury in the ring is a very real possibility!
2) Even in his prime, did Goldberg matches last more than 3 or 4 minutes anyway?
3) Adding the WWE U-Title to the match makes it EVEN BIGGAH!
I still don't like either one of them with the title though...
Rumors of Undertaker and possibly Finn Bálor showing up on tonight's RAW!
Edit: Alph, let me know if Finn shows up. I never really got to experience him as Prince Devitt..
Side note: Went to an NXT show on Friday. It friggin awesome to see Bobby Roode, Johnny Gargano (local Cleveland kid), Tommy End again (though Aleister Black now), and Chris Hero and Shinsuke Nakamura live. I may dislike most of the WWE, but man seeing those dudes put on a great show was well worth my 20 dollars of admission.
Is there any, any, way that Shane finds himself a proxy from NXT or somewhere?
I doubt it.
At least, if anyone can carry Shane to a decent 'mania match, it's AJ Styles. In fact, sadly, the way 'mania is shaping up, its probably going to be the 3rd or 4th best match on the card.
I've not got a lot of confidence in this event. Particularly after FastLane.
Can we try find some potential positives though? How many can we get?
1. Jericho - Owens match will be good.
2. RAW Women's match should be good if they can work the triple threat well.
3. Wyatt should be tuning face and going over Orton in a big way.
3.5. Lesnar Goldberg may be interesting if only to see what they might do with the title going forward... presumably with Lesnar.
4. American Alpha should be wrestling
5. Ummmm.... Finn Balor and/or Rollins might show up? Maybe?
Any more?
As an aside...
On Monday night, away for work and sitting in a hotel room, I watched WCPW's Exit Wounds event which was streamed live on YouTube. Drew Galloway, Will Ospreay, Cody Rhodes, Marty Scurll, David Starr, and more put on a good show. Some real good matches in there.
It's still on Youtube, so perhaps worth a watch if you fancy rinsing the WWE out of your eyes for a while.
On WCPW, have any of you been looking at this World Cup thing they've organised? 64 man tournament, various dates, various venues. It's quite the ambitious venture and there are a few big names signed up. All free on YouTube as well.
It's a small indie RPG where the players are wrestlers in a TV promotion where the GM is the creative team. The players all have a class (Jobber, veteran, monster, manager, etc...) And they create their gimmick. Moves are more vague like Work the Audience or Off the Top Rope and you roll 2d6 and add your associated stat. 10+ is a critical success, 7-9 is a success, 4-6 is a minor failure and 1-3 is a botch. The objective of each player is to get the biggest audience they can and of course win a championship belt or three.
Matches are predetermined and the players describe what their wrestlers do, and a player not involved in the match plays the role of announcer and can put over one of the wrestlers if they like what the player is doing.
Book is only 20 dollars, and the PDF is 8 bucks on drive thru RPGatm.
WWE Women's Division is where it's at for me at the moment
*runs off to cleanse following two uses of 'where it's at'*
Right. Back.
For me, there's more of a hunger for it in the Wrestlers - they know they've got to impress, because there'll be a slice of the crowd still wanting mud matches or bra and panties matches, reducing the female stable to mere titillation.
But when you actually watch the ladies in the ring - their athleticism is frankly stunning, and for my money far more interesting to watch than many of the male heavyweight matches (apart from Neville, who is technically superb). When they can't rely on the brute strength angle, you get a much, much better match.
Sure, it is in a somewhat 'protected' role (6-man tag match) - but that's definitely the best way to ease him back into the process.
And that match *might* be a preview of what he'll be up to at Wrestlemania, especially if Rollins can't go.
Bálor/Zayn vs. HHH/Joe - or even a Bálor/Joe match?
I can't open that link at work, but I think I seen the photo. Jericho and KO were the other two in the match?
Caveat - I haven't watched last night's RAW yet, but...
Bálor/Zayn vs. HHH/Joe seems likely. However, I think it depends on how fit Rollins is.... or rather who is more fit from Rollins and Balor.
I think whoever doesn't start the match is definitely a potential run-in.
How does this sound?
Rollins/Zayn vs. HHH/Joe.... Balor (Demon King) runs in to attack Rollins (revenge for the injury), then joins HHH's badass new Authority stable.
As to women's wrestling Doc, can't disagree with what you're saying. And outside WWE it's even more interesting.
For me, it just adds variety to a card. There's room on any wrestling event for half a dosen different styles of wrestler and match. Each, when executed well, are an equal joy to watch. I like the big guys, but also thoroughly enjoy the women's game. I just like good wrestling, I suppose.
Local promotion put on their annual Battle Royale last night. Lots of awesome wrestling including a pretty long brawl between Bad Boy Joey Janela and Scott Norton (yes that Scott Norton) in which Scott put Joey through a concession table and then dragged Joey back into the ring for the pin.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Signed up to WWE Network again.
Fast lane was fun, if short on surprises/upsets - and now exploring the Cruiser Weight division.
Good stuff. There's a lot of gems on there. I listen to Bruce Prichard's podcast every week, so a lot of my Network time is spent watching a lot of the events, wrestlers which they are covering at the time.
They done an episode on Beyond the Mat (which isn't on the network sadly, but can be found on youtube) recently. It was really interesting watching that again with adult eyes, particularly with the podcast commentary.
Alfndrate wrote:Local promotion put on their annual Battle Royale last night. Lots of awesome wrestling including a pretty long brawl between Bad Boy Joey Janela and Scott Norton (yes that Scott Norton) in which Scott put Joey through a concession table and then dragged Joey back into the ring for the pin.
Who is your local promotion Alf? I'll give them a follow on twitter so that I've a better idea of what you're watching.
In my local scene, I went to ICW's Fight Club in Glasgow again last Sunday. Seen Tyler Bate in action for the first time. ICW are currently building to their first big show of the year, Barramania III. One of the angles going into it is a really well done worky-shooty set-up between Joe Hendry and Lionheart. I honestly have no idea how much of this is a work. I believe it started at the ICW show I was at in January, Lionheart was cutting an in-ring promo and flippantly called Joe's girlfriend a dog or something. It was in response to a crowd chant poking fun a Lionheart posting selfies with his dog on twitter. "Selfies wi' yer dug, Wi' yer dug, Seeelllfies wi' yer dug.
Anyway, it developed into them having into an actual fight during a match at a show in Manchester. The fight was broken up and the match was cancelled. The footage has been cut from their ondemand service but you can find it on twitter if you search "Joe Hendry Lionheart Manchester". Not much happened really (except one pretty nice double leg take-down).
They were then in the ring together again in Glasgow last Sunday where they announced the match for Barramania... and where Lionheart threatened to stab Hendry.... it's all heating up
ICW can be really good at this kind of thing. See this promo below from Drew Galloway (aka Drew McIntyre). The guy wants an Oscar for this. Fights were breaking out in the crowd, people were being kicked out, it was crazy.
The Scottish qualifiers for WCPW's world cup took place in Motherwell (just outside Glasgow) on Thursday night. Grown-up woes meant I couldn't make it, but it was a really, really strong card. I don't know what the results were but it's being broadcast on youtube on the 31st of March. I suggest that'll be well worth a watch
Also, on the 28th of April, Pete Dunne is wrestling Joe Coffey (Local lad who I really like) in the hall where I'm getting married and which is around 200 meters from where I live....can't make it, again. Gutted.
And... I seen Grado just along the road at an indoor food festival on Saturday. I believe he's wrestling in Manchester tonight in the first tapings of the new episodes of ITV's World of Sport. For those not in the UK, wikipedia says "World of Sport is a British television sport programme which ran on ITV between 2 January 1965 and 28 September 1985 in competition with the BBC's Grandstand. Like Grandstand, the programme ran for several hours every Saturday afternoon." Our parents can all remember the days when millions in Britain watched pro-wrestling every Saturday afternoon, and the wrestlers were legit superstars.
The local promotion I attend is called Absolute Intense Wrestling (aiwrestling on most social media). I just started going last year, but the shows are always pretty good. They do monthly shows for the most part with their "WrestleMania" taking place in July at their annual show called Absolution. They have a pretty good stable of wrestlers, some home grown talent like WWE's Johnny Gargano, half of RoH's Tag team War Machine Raymond Rowe, and Lucha Underground's Son of Havoc. The promoters are also huge old school wrestling fans, so they've brought in some.old guys like Terry Funk, the late Dennis Stamp, Tracy Smothers, and dudes like Scott Norton.
They're not like one of the big Super Indies like AAW in Chicago, Evolve, or PWG in California, but they're good.
Alfndrate wrote: The local promotion I attend is called Absolute Intense Wrestling (aiwrestling on most social media). I just started going last year, but the shows are always pretty good. They do monthly shows for the most part with their "WrestleMania" taking place in July at their annual show called Absolution. They have a pretty good stable of wrestlers, some home grown talent like WWE's Johnny Gargano, half of RoH's Tag team War Machine Raymond Rowe, and Lucha Underground's Son of Havoc. The promoters are also huge old school wrestling fans, so they've brought in some.old guys like Terry Funk, the late Dennis Stamp, Tracy Smothers, and dudes like Scott Norton.
They're not like one of the big Super Indies like AAW in Chicago, Evolve, or PWG in California, but they're good.
I'll keep an eye on it.
War Machine are on the card for ICW's Barramania. Can't say that I know much about them though.
______________________________________
OK.
WRESTLEMANIA 33 PREDICTION TIME!!!
Let’s do it….
ATGBR - Got to be Strowman. Not that the match means much. Bit of a shame that Zayn will be thrown under the bus again. And I’m disappointed that this where American Alpha have ended up. Their match where they lost the titles to the Usos was really good. I find it strange that WWE don’t think that a rematch (which would be another fine match,) where AA get a feelgood win, is a worthwhile way to spend 15 minutes of ‘Mania.
Neville vs Aries – Hopefully Neville. I’d like to see him kept strong until a really talented, popular babyface can emerge from somewhere.
Bellena vs Mizryse – John and Nicki
AJ Styles vs Shane McMahon – Styles. Can’t be anything but Styles clean.
HHH vs Rollins – Rollins. Although if there are any shenanigans on Sunday night, they’ll be here. I notice Samoa Joe isn’t on the card anywhere, so I expect him here. And if, if, Balor shows up, it’ll be here. So, hopefully Rollins picks up the win, but I do not think it’ll be a clean one.
Undertaker vs Reigns – Reigns. On RAW this week, I really thought they were teasing a Buried Alive match. Either way, I think ‘Taker goes down.
Smackdown Women’s Title – Maybe Naomi? Or Becky Lynch.
RAW Women’s Title – Sasha Banks
RAW Tag Team Titles – I’m unsure about this, but I’ll go for Gallows and Anderson. Enzo and Cass could get it because they seem to be popular. I’d like Sheamus and Cesaro to win. But I’m predicting Anderson and Gallows.
US Title - Owens. Jericho does the job. Owens looks strong and gets even… heelier?
IC Title – Ambrose. Not particularly keen on him, but I think Ambrose will come away with it. Probably deserves a triumphant WM moment.
Smackdown Title – Surely has to be Wyatt. Needs to be Wyatt. This storyline had been going really well, but it’s tailed off a bit I think. People should be booing Orton to the moon by now, but they aren’t.
RAW Title – Lesnar. No Doubt about it.
Match of the Night – Owens vs Jericho. Special mention to Cena/Bella vs Miz/Maryse which I actually think will be really good.
Outside Bet Shock of the Night 1. Balor run-in, attacks Rollins, aligns with HHH/Joe.
Outside Bet Shock of the Night 2. Kurt Angle interrupts someone’s promo or celebration. Maybe Lesnar's?
Disappointment of the Night – New Day’s “Comedy”
You know, looking over that list, it’s not a bad card at all. I think some of the fueds could have been built and timed a little better to peak here, but overall I’m fairly optimistic for a decent show. As long as there isn’t too much filler, not too much New Day, and not too much Rock squashing current promising young wrestlers.
ATGBR - Got to be Strowman. Not that the match means much. Bit of a shame that Zayn will be thrown under the bus again. And I’m disappointed that this where American Alpha have ended up. Their match where they lost the titles to the Usos was really good. I find it strange that WWE don’t think that a rematch (which would be another fine match,) where AA get a feelgood win, is a worthwhile way to spend 15 minutes of ‘Mania.
I couldn't care less about this one either - it really does exist just to stuff people into Wrestlemania that otherwise wouldn't have a match...
But yes, the Strow-boner continues, and he 'wins'.
Neville vs Aries – Hopefully Neville. I’d like to see him kept strong until a really talented, popular babyface can emerge from somewhere.
I actually think this one goes to Aries, and The Greatest Man That Ever Lives wins it here!
Bellena vs Mizryse – John and Nicki
I would LOVE for the Miz to crush Cena and Nikki, but, yeah, Cena gets the win - AND proposes to Nikki.
AJ Styles vs Shane McMahon – Styles. Can’t be anything but Styles clean.
Agreed! It HAS to be Styles CLEAN.
HHH vs Rollins – Rollins. Although if there are any shenanigans on Sunday night, they’ll be here. I notice Samoa Joe isn’t on the card anywhere, so I expect him here. And if, if, Balor shows up, it’ll be here. So, hopefully Rollins picks up the win, but I do not think it’ll be a clean one.
Agreed again - and yes, Joe defintiely shows up and this is also the best (Only?) place for a Balor 'surprise' appearance too.
I think you MIGHT be on to something with your Balor Heel Turn here, but it is REALLY hard to have a returning Babyface instantly go heel - especially at Wrestlemania, so I'm hoping/thinking it is a straight up Babyface save IF he shows at all.
Undertaker vs Reigns – Reigns. On RAW this week, I really thought they were teasing a Buried Alive match. Either way, I think ‘Taker goes down.
Tradition is you always lose your last match - are they going to let Reigns 'retire' The Undertaker - at Wrestlemania?
Maybe.
It would be a great time to FINALLY turn Reigns heel...
Smackdown Women’s Title – Maybe Naomi? Or Becky Lynch.
It is Naomi's hometown, so it will be hard for her to NOT win, but I hope she doesn't. I'm a big Alexa Bliss fan, so I hope she somehow gets the miracle win here and retains.
RAW Women’s Title – Sasha Banks
They'll restore Flair's lost PPV luster here and she'll get the win.
Unless Dana Brooke costs her the title somehow?!?
RAW Tag Team Titles – I’m unsure about this, but I’ll go for Gallows and Anderson. Enzo and Cass could get it because they seem to be popular. I’d like Sheamus and Cesaro to win. But I’m predicting Anderson and Gallows.
Unfortunately, I think this is where Enzo and Cass finally cash in.
WWE has criminally mismanaged Gallows and Anderson from the start - look for that to continue.
US Title - Owens. Jericho does the job. Owens looks strong and gets even… heelier?
Maybe... I think you're right, Ownes wins and Jericho chases for a bit, than goes off on tour with Fozzy for a bit?
IC Title – Ambrose. Not particularly keen on him, but I think Ambrose will come away with it. Probably deserves a triumphant WM moment.
Dean's kinda lost right now - I think Baron gets the win here and Dean...er...I dunno...
Smackdown Title – Surely has to be Wyatt. Needs to be Wyatt. This storyline had been going really well, but it’s tailed off a bit I think. People should be booing Orton to the moon by now, but they aren’t.
Agreed!
This storyline has gone from bad to ultra-stupid quickly.
Can't stand ORton though, so yes, I'm biased there.
RAW Title – Lesnar. No Doubt about it.
It HAS to be Lesnar, but is that why it won't be?
Can't stand Lesnar either, and having a part-timer as champ again - ugh.
But he is less of a part-timer than Goldberg, so...hurrah?
As for Best Match...I can't believe I'm saying this but...Styles/McMahon? Maybe!
Or HHH/Rollins - IF Rollins can move around - but he might need to be protected, so expect a lot of run ins there...
Worst match - Smackdown Women's Championship
I'll be away on vacation though, so I won't be able to watch!
I won't get a chance to watch it until Tuesday at the very earliest (difficult to find an uninterupted 217hours in which to watch the whole show in one sitting), so I'll be trying to avoid spoilers til then. Then I'll have to catch up with RAW late as well.
I'll log back in here after I've seen it to discuss and reap acclaim for my 100% prediction hit rate.
There must be somewhere streaming live updates for you though?
Not tempted to try avoid spoilers and watch it later?
Worst match - Smackdown Women's Championship
Yup. Although I'm not excited about the IC Title match.
Right, Walking Dead tonight, then Big Si is coming round Thursday to help jump start my car (the perils of not driving for a couple of months...), and to watch Wrestlemania. Probably with Pizza and Crisps and Fizzy Pop*
*But not Dizzyade, for it is a school night.
Automatically Appended Next Post: The Deadman has walked.
Thank you Undertaker for 27 years of top notch wrasslin' nonsense.
I shall throw myself through a steel cage, through a folding table and onto some thumbtacks in your honour.
ATGBR - Got to be Strowman. Not that the match means much. Bit of a shame that Zayn will be thrown under the bus again. And I’m disappointed that this where American Alpha have ended up. Their match where they lost the titles to the Usos was really good. I find it strange that WWE don’t think that a rematch (which would be another fine match,) where AA get a feelgood win, is a worthwhile way to spend 15 minutes of ‘Mania.
I couldn't care less about this one either - it really does exist just to stuff people into Wrestlemania that otherwise wouldn't have a match...
But yes, the Strow-boner continues, and he 'wins'.
Mojo wins with Gronk interference?
I was WRONG!
0-1
Neville vs Aries – Hopefully Neville. I’d like to see him kept strong until a really talented, popular babyface can emerge from somewhere.
I actually think this one goes to Aries, and The Greatest Man That Ever Lives wins it here!
WRONG again!
0-2
Bellena vs Mizryse – John and Nicki
I would LOVE for the Miz to crush Cena and Nikki, but, yeah, Cena gets the win - AND proposes to Nikki.
I was right - on both counts!
Tempted to give myself +2 here, but it was all too easy to predict.
1-2
AJ Styles vs Shane McMahon – Styles. Can’t be anything but Styles clean.
Agreed! It HAS to be Styles CLEAN.
RIGHT again!
2-2
HHH vs Rollins – Rollins. Although if there are any shenanigans on Sunday night, they’ll be here. I notice Samoa Joe isn’t on the card anywhere, so I expect him here. And if, if, Balor shows up, it’ll be here. So, hopefully Rollins picks up the win, but I do not think it’ll be a clean one.
Agreed again - and yes, Joe defintiely shows up and this is also the best (Only?) place for a Balor 'surprise' appearance too.
I think you MIGHT be on to something with your Balor Heel Turn here, but it is REALLY hard to have a returning Babyface instantly go heel - especially at Wrestlemania, so I'm hoping/thinking it is a straight up Babyface save IF he shows at all.
I was RIGHT enough here!
3-2
Undertaker vs Reigns – Reigns. On RAW this week, I really thought they were teasing a Buried Alive match. Either way, I think ‘Taker goes down.
Tradition is you always lose your last match - are they going to let Reigns 'retire' The Undertaker - at Wrestlemania?
Maybe.
It would be a great time to FINALLY turn Reigns heel...
RIGHT again!
4-2
Smackdown Women’s Title – Maybe Naomi? Or Becky Lynch.
It is Naomi's hometown, so it will be hard for her to NOT win, but I hope she doesn't. I'm a big Alexa Bliss fan, so I hope she somehow gets the miracle win here and retains.
Should picked with the brain and not the heart - WRONG here!
4-3
RAW Women’s Title – Sasha Banks
They'll restore Flair's lost PPV luster here and she'll get the win.
Unless Dana Brooke costs her the title somehow?!?
Surprised they stuck with Bailey, and no hints of a Banks heel turn either!
I was WRONG!
4-4
RAW Tag Team Titles – I’m unsure about this, but I’ll go for Gallows and Anderson. Enzo and Cass could get it because they seem to be popular. I’d like Sheamus and Cesaro to win. But I’m predicting Anderson and Gallows.
Unfortunately, I think this is where Enzo and Cass finally cash in.
WWE has criminally mismanaged Gallows and Anderson from the start - look for that to continue.
Glad to see Enzo and Cash didn't win it - surprised by the Hardys showing up, and winning!
I was WRONG!
4-5
US Title - Owens. Jericho does the job. Owens looks strong and gets even… heelier?
Maybe... I think you're right, Ownes wins and Jericho chases for a bit, than goes off on tour with Fozzy for a bit?
I was RIGHT!
5-5
IC Title – Ambrose. Not particularly keen on him, but I think Ambrose will come away with it. Probably deserves a triumphant WM moment.
Dean's kinda lost right now - I think Baron gets the win here and Dean...er...I dunno...
I was WRONG!
And...no one cares about Dean and the IC title right now, do they?
5-6
Smackdown Title – Surely has to be Wyatt. Needs to be Wyatt. This storyline had been going really well, but it’s tailed off a bit I think. People should be booing Orton to the moon by now, but they aren’t.
Agreed!
This storyline has gone from bad to ultra-stupid quickly.
Can't stand ORton though, so yes, I'm biased there.
Ugh.
Orton.
5-7
RAW Title – Lesnar. No Doubt about it.
It HAS to be Lesnar, but is that why it won't be?
Can't stand Lesnar either, and having a part-timer as champ again - ugh.
But he is less of a part-timer than Goldberg, so...hurrah?
Easy to predict, and I how Lesnar isn't champ for long.
Lesnar will probably lose to Reigns and Reigns will end up with the belt, again...
The only reason why I said that is, if you ignore the fact that Undertaker retired and you usually get your butt kicked on the way out the door, Roman Reigns has done something only 1 other man in the WWE has done, and that's beat the Undertaker at Wrestlemania, and we all know that it was the Beast Incarnate Brock Lesnar that broke the streak. Which means, if we're going all shoenen anime on this then Roman is equal in power to Lesnar, and Lesnar is the next step for Roman.
Which means we're going to see yet another Roman Reigns push no one cares about. oh boy...
Although I should probably lose points for not spotting that proposal coming.
I was actually really enjoing that match until they decided to end it. Miz was doing brilliantly with the crowd. I hope he can find some success now on RAW. Sadly it looks like they’re just going to rerun the Ambrose feud from a few months ago.
Overall I enjoyed the show. I think the matches were all fairly serviceable.
KO Jericho wasn’t as great as I’d expected, but it was alright.
Rollins HHH was good.
Styles/Shane was pretty good. As expected. Styles needs to headline next year though.
RAW Women’s match was good, I thought. Although I wonder why they didn’t just wait until ‘mania to have Bayley win the title initially.
Lesnar/Goldberg was better than I expected, quite enjoy it. The Lesnar/Part-time/Universal Title situation is a bit of a conundrum though.
Undertaker/Reigns was probably about as good a match as it’s possible for Taker to have these days. Shame to see him go, but it was handled reasonably well…. Even if it was Reigns.
However, Orton/Wyatt was weird and disappointing. Not sure of the thinking behind having Orton win. I’m worried for Wyatt now.
Hardy’s were a great surprise, helped by New Day’s tease.
New Day were mercifully subdued throughout the show too. Which was nice.
RAW after mania was pretty good too.
Your Balor came back finally, then preceded to get battered by mad Jinder Mihal for 10 minutes…. He wouldn’t have liked that. Not exactly easing back into things.
Kurt Angle is GM… should be much better value than Foley. And I do love to hear that music.
And Strowman just destroyed Reigns in what has to be one of the best backstage beatdowns for years. The cheers that would go up every time Brawn reappeared were awesome. And the dude flipped an Ambulance! Brilliant!
That ambulance spot is in this week’s “Insane Spots compilation. So is Jinder Mihal’s brutal forearm smash on Balor.
And Katsuyori Shibata’s nasty headbutt is the type of thing that make me less inclined to watch more Japanese stuff.
What do you guys make of the “Superstar Shakeup” tm?
For me, it’s just made Smackdown even more preferable to RAW. I think.
I’ll still keep an eye on RAW for Rollins, Joe, Balor and Strowman. And out of morbid curiosity over the future of the Universal title.
Smackdown with Naka, KO, Zayn, Styles, Corbin, American Alpha just seem to promise better entertainment…. I think. I haven’t watched last night’s SD yet, by the way. So, we’ll see.
The rumours of Orton wanting to go part-time are also feeding my optimism here.
How is it looking to you guys?
Outside of WWE, I went to ICW’s Barrowlands show on Sunday night.
I took my brother-in-law along. He had never been to a wrestling show, and had no real knowledge or interest in wrestling prior to Sunday. However, he’s a pretty enthusiastic dude and had an absolute whale of a time. Really enjoyed it. We ended up pretty smashed (as we often do when we get together ), so details of the actual show are a little fuzzy, but fun was had.
Drew Galloway wrestled what looks like his last ICW match for a while since his recent WWE call-up. Barbed wire rope match vs Jack Jester)
Grado turned heel after his match with Wolfgang. The most shocking turn since Hogan (in Glasgow anyway)
Trent Seven dropped the ICW Title to Joe Coffey. A right good wrestler who faced Kurt Angle at ICW Fear & Loathing IX last year.
War Machine were there and performed well.
Matt Cross was there despite a recent leg break. He wasn’t showing any ill effects in a well worked 6-man scramble.
A really good night.
Below are a couple of pics of a drunk and happy brother-in-law with his new friends…
The match just didn't flow - and I think even the crowd were a bit 'Whaaaaa?' with the projection nonsense. It just broke up the fight too much.
Agreed.
By the time of the show the fued had totally stalled and there was no clear heel/face dynamic when they had ample opportunity to create one. The projections were just odd and only added bewilderment to an already uninspiring match.
It was a shame. Like I say, I'm worried about Wyatt's immediate future.
Alpharius wrote: They're currently teasing a feud between Finn and Wyatt because...reasons?!?
Well, at least Wyatt won't try kill him like Mahal did.
But yeah, it's a weird one because I like them both, and I think they're both really good workers and should have good matches together but it's just very hard to see WWE doing anything other than rerun every feud Wyatt has ever had.
It's been done to death, no-one ever comes out of it looking good - least of all Wyatt who just a couple of months ago was pinning Cena and Styles clean and looking great.
Seems to serve no other purpose than to keep a couple of guys busy but out of title contention for a few months.
Is there any other way this could go?
Makes it fairly obvious that Wyatt's not beating Orton.
The worst thing about the whole affair.
Who does take the title off Orton, and is it happening anytime soon?
May be a tad late, but I wanted to jump in on this thread. My wife never grew up with wrestling, but seeing Undertaker retire was truly a great and heartbreaking moment. Few are still doing what he did at his age, most are dead or disabled. Glad to see him be able retire and hopefully live out a well deserved retirement.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Alpharius wrote: He's about as natural born a Heel as we'll ever get.
Just a thoroughly unlikable individual, by most accounts.
Debatable. Eddie Guerrero and Triple H were always pretty great Heels.
Alpharius wrote: I probably wasn't clear enough - my point was, by most accounts, he's a real asshat in 'Real Life' too, and doesn't ever make a good Babyface.
He's a natural Heel - for many reasons!
Even HHH and Eddie pulled off VERY good Babyface runs.
Orton hasn't, doesn't and, I'd posit, can't!
Yeah, Orton, even as removed as I am from modern wrestling, is just a massive tool. Even his special move is just a ripoff of Diamond Dallas Page's Diamond Cutter.
Basically, it almost doesn't matter WHO it was, WHOEVER was going up against Reigns was guaranteed to have a huge, positive reaction from the fanbase.
I...actually agree.
Roman and his corporate mandated push have rubbed fans the wrong way for quite some time now.
Strowman just isn't a wrestler I'm a fan of, for the most part, but there's no denying that he's done a lot with the opportunity he's been presented with.
Well, looks like it is going to be a Finn Bálor vs. Bray Wyatt feud now...
They must fight because...
....
...Because...they both have spooky/supernatural aspects to their characters?
I still think it is a waste of what will be the eventual return of his 'Demon' aspect.
If I was booking this, I'd eventually have Finn work his way up to a title shot with Lesnar (invoking his rematch clause, as he never really 'lost' the title?), and then lose a somewhat hard fought battle.
Maybe then he has to fight his way back up to #1 contender status again - and then maybe he loses again - maybe this time he gets beat a little easier, and take a more savage beating in the process.
Lesnar then dismisses him - until Bálor somehow goads him into one more match.
Lesnar does the usual bluster and then grants him the match, saying 'this is it, you lose and no more title shots for you!'.
Which plays right into Finn's hands as NOW he chooses to unleash the Demon - maybe we're now at one of the 'big' PPV's, maybe ever Summerslam?
To me, the Demon aspect shouldn't ever really lose - kinda like the Undertaker's Wrestlemania streak...
Instead, the Demon will be unleashed on...Bray Wyatt.
With...not that much at stake?
We'll see though - I'd like to be pleasantly surprised here.
I did like that Alexa beat Baley.
And I still look forward to the Broken Hardy's showing up - soon, I hope!
I’ll probably need to track it down. The last one was very good.
It’ll do well to top my current match of the year though….
Anyone see the UK Title match at NXT Takeover?
What did you think?
And what else has been drawing your attention?
Any excitement for Joe - Lesnar?
Alpharius, you're man Balor is holding his own alright isn't he? He's looked pretty good since returning (if we discount the time Jinder tried to kill him) and was booked quite strong during that Fatal 5-Way. Can't imagine he's tooo far away from another title shot. Depends what happens with Brock, Reigns, Strowman I suppose, but he'd be a super popular Rumble winner if they can time it all right.
I'm actually excited about that match - and I really do hope Lesnar loses too.
His allure, for me anyway, is limited. The sooner he fades away, the better. Though I gather he's still quite popular and still has the 'special attraction' feel and drawing power.
I just don't like the belt on a part time champ.
I let my WWE sub lapse so I haven't been keeping up with NXT, but I'll probably be signing up again soon - especially for that hopefully soon to occur PPV where Finn gets his title shot.
Alpharius, you're man Balor is holding his own alright isn't he? He's looked pretty good since returning (if we discount the time Jinder tried to kill him) and was booked quite strong during that Fatal 5-Way. Can't imagine he's tooo far away from another title shot. Depends what happens with Brock, Reigns, Strowman I suppose, but he'd be a super popular Rumble winner if they can time it all right.
Bálor has been booked...OK since his return.
I'm actually OK with The Demon NOT showing up yet too.
From a storyline perspective, The Demon should be just about unstoppable - but Finn should be reluctant to summon it, like it costs him too much, or something similar. Make it into a Big Deal. Don't use it for stuff like, oh, I don't know, just to confront someone in ring *BEFORE* a bit title match!
Strowman's back sooner than expected though, and word on the street is that Vince still has a huge Strowboner, so, who knows...
RAW's been pretty good lately though, seems to have overtaken Smackdown in terms of overall quality as that show's a bit of a mess currently.
I'm actually excited about that match - and I really do hope Lesnar loses too.
His allure, for me anyway, is limited. The sooner he fades away, the better. Though I gather he's still quite popular and still has the 'special attraction' feel and drawing power.
I just don't like the belt on a part time champ.
You need to find a way to watch that UK Title match.
But yeah, Agreed. Don't like a part-time champ. Not mad keen on Lesnar either, much preferred him in his youth. I don't particularly like the MMA style/imagery in the wrestling ring. I'd prefer the two worlds were kept apart. I do like the Lesnar - Heyman combo though. And he is still definitely a draw.
All that said, I am quite looking forward to the match. It shouldn't be a squash and it does seem like a long time since Lesnar has wrestled a real match. I think it could be good.
Do we know how the rest of the card looks yet? I've hardly seen any RAW last couple of weeks, only Extreme rules which was pretty meh.
Alpharius, you're man Balor is holding his own alright isn't he? He's looked pretty good since returning (if we discount the time Jinder tried to kill him) and was booked quite strong during that Fatal 5-Way. Can't imagine he's tooo far away from another title shot. Depends what happens with Brock, Reigns, Strowman I suppose, but he'd be a super popular Rumble winner if they can time it all right.
Bálor has been booked...OK since his return.
I'm actually OK with The Demon NOT showing up yet too.
From a storyline perspective, The Demon should be just about unstoppable - but Finn should be reluctant to summon it, like it costs him too much, or something similar. Make it into a Big Deal. Don't use it for stuff like, oh, I don't know, just to confront someone in ring *BEFORE* a bit title match!
Truth!
They bust out that Demon entrance faaar too early and far too easily that last time. And it's not like his normal entrance isn't fething awesome anyway.
His finisher is the only thing I'd changeabout Balor at the moment.
RAW's been pretty good lately though, seems to have overtaken Smackdown in terms of overall quality as that show's a bit of a mess currently.
I've hardly seen either recently, just little bits..... have my beloved American Alpha just fallen off the edge of the earth though? Where are they?
I actually don't mind belts being on part timers that way when they show up it's a special event, also saw the UK match between Pete Dunn and Tyler Bates really great airplane spin and commentary.
Roman Reigns declares HIMSELF the #1 Contender, and given HIMSELF a title shot at whoever wins from Samoa/Lesnar at Great Balls of Fire (LOLWUT) at Summerslam in August?
Meanwhile, Finn Bálor now finds himself in a feud with...Elias "The Drifter" Samson?!?
Imagine how better the world would be if they actually let Roman go full heel.
Strowman came back though, didn't he? Where does he fit into the picture?
I managed to watch MitB this week.
Despite the absolute tragedy of the women's match finish, the show was alright.
I dislike Orton and often find his matches tough to sit through, but, and it's weird, I'm finding Jinder Mahal totally compeling to watch in the ring. I don't know why, he's not that good. He just seems dangerous and unpredictable or something, and I like his face... or maybe its all the viens. Feth knows.
I don't like the heel foreigner schtick, I always feel for the guy who has to try work with it. And when Orton is the American supposed babyface on the other side of it, it's even harder to accept.
I think I'm turning into a Mahal fan. Thanks Randy
The men's ladder match was pretty good, although I'm not sure about the winner. I'd have really liked to see Styles carrying the briefcase all year. He'd be brilliant with it.
The match itself was good though. A lot of talent on show (Zayn, Owens, Styles, Naka, Ziggler and Corbin.... I suppose) which whetted the appetite for some of the potential match-ups we have on Smackdown now (there's a little bit of talent further down the roster too). The Styles, Nakamura bit was genius. It was so subtley well done.
Watching the show seemed to confirm my suspsions about American Alpha falling down a deep hole somewhere...
However....
Smackdown Live... Who appears???
Only my man Chad Gable (OUTTA NOWHERE) to give Owens a tremendous wee match...
Awesome!
That Open Challenge has the potential to be great if Owens keeps it up.
Yes, Strowman is back and, following in the footsteps of Roman, has booked himself his own match at the next PPV, and yes, its an Ambulance Match vs. Reigns.
And I do completely agree with you - just have Roman go full Heel already - the fan base already treats him as such!
Combine that with the hatred most fans have for him due to his perceived (right or wrong as that perception may be!) undeserved push, he'd be the most over heel in a long, ling time!
Chad Gable again being put into a match with a top guy and being allowed to look good.
Nice little rub from Styles at the end too.
Hoping they can build something with him. Didn't seem to be getting much of a reaction from the crowd (although Styles is a big favourite), but I'm hopeful.
It does beg the question of where JJ is, but either way, it's good to see talent being pushed.
In local news, I've bought tickets for ICW's Shug's Hoose Party 4.
It's a two day event they put on over a weekend at a decent sized venue in Glasgow.
I only bought tickets for the first night. Noar Dar will be there and there's to be a good ol' wrestling wedding taking place but the real reason for going will be Pete Dunne.
I've not managed to catch Dunne live yet but at this event (29th July) he's defending the WWE UK Championship... in an ICW event which is kinda cool.
His opponent will be decided this Sunday at ICW's regular Fight Club. There's a #1 contenders match between Wolfgang and BT Gunn. You'd expect Wolfgang to be winning that given he's already connected to WWE but it'd be nice to see BT getting a big moment.
BT Gunn is one of those guys who's been around ICW forever, always been great by all accounts, very hard working but seems to have just missed the recent wave currently carrying a few UK guys onto international recognition.
There must be hundreds like him mind you. There's at least 3 or 4 in ICW alone.
Talking of the UK Championship, I went back and rewatched the title match from NXT Takeover Chicago. It really was a tremendous match. If you haven't seen it yet, you should try make time for it.
Still not happy about the Universal Championship Belt being on a 'part timer'. Also not happy that Lesnar got dominated, but still won with a 'luck' F5.
Still REALLY not happy that it was yet another PPV with NO Finn Bálor.
And we're still having to 'look forward' to Finn Bálor vs. Samson the Drifter?
OK.
In quick order:
OK with the Tag Titles staying on the heels - IF it leads to the Broken Hardy Revival!
Hopefully this is the LAST chapter in Miz v. Ambrose.
Bliss retaining 'by any means necessary' is OK, but I'd like her to just win a few of these things too.
Strowman v. Reigns. Meh. Strowman wins, but then Reigns kinda still wins. In an 'evil' way. And he's the Babyface here?
In other news:
I'll be at the RAW taping the Monday before Summerslam (wish it was the Monday after Summerslam, but that's the schedule for you!).
Pretty good tickets too.
I just hope Finn Bálor is on the card.
Even if it is just vs. Samson, and not setting up a triumphant return to the Main Event at Summerslam for a shot at the title again...
I, for one, didn't mind the Reigns vs Strowman match. Plenty of big spots, albeit nothing we haven't seen before. The finish was decent too, but only as long as we FINALLY get a proper Reigns heel turn. Match of the night is easily the Iron Man tag match, probably my favourite Shesaro vs Hardy match (that I can remember anyway). A little something that will probably never happen but would be great is a Finn Balor vs Cesaro match - they certainly carried last week's RAW matchup and a singles match would be fantastic. Everything else on the Card was pretty lackluster that I remember, though Bliss gave a good performance. Can't stand Sasha being back in the title picture again, but that's not her fault so I'll let it slide.
The match may have brought the rivalry between Balor and Samson to an end, and it may have been well-wrestled, but Sunday's Great Balls of Fire lost nothing by not having the bout on the card.
Balor won decisively, as he should have, but he still appears directionless on the red brand.
At what point will he re-enter championship contention? When will he seek the title he never lost?
More importantly, when will he do something that actually matters?
These are questions that need answering before Balor descends too far into a state of irrelevance.
By the time I go to see the RAW taping live in Boston on August 14th, I really, really hope we're all done with the Finn Bálor vs. Elias Samson program...
...but why do I have the feeling that *this* is what Finn will be up to at Summerslam?
Ugh.
EDIT!
Er, so - wait - Bray (yawn) Wyatt is now all up in Finn face now because...reasons?
THIS is what we're going to (eventually) waste the Demon King's reappearance on?
And not on his rightful WWE Universal Championship match?
I feel like Finn Balor is going to turn into the Miz - a fuctionally great wrestler that can only feud with like 2 people (Dean Ambrose and Dolph). That will get boring real fast.
And now feuding with Bray, which Wyatt will totally lose the feud to (though he did win his last one to be fair to him), just because they're "spooky dudes". Now I know there's some real die hard Wyatt fans out there, but I can't stand the whole cult leader crap, it has no weight behind it at all so you can't take him seriously.
I'm a bit sad about ANOTHER tag team breakup (I won't say who it is just in case, but if you've watched the most recent RAW you'll understand what I'm going on about), and the worst part of it was how necessary it was. There wasn't heat behind it, and it even seemed like the other half of the duo stranded on Smackdown didn't even know it was happening! Please WWE, no more breakups. I've had enough of that this year. I will honestly flip if they break up The Revival, those guys are great heels, and I bet with a good feud could easily become RAW's Usos as champions.
In other news, New Japan's G1 has kicked off and while it has been great wrestling - as expected - it hasn't been as amazing as the G1 in the US.That's probably a result of Naito Vs Omega, but it is pretty hard to top that - maybe apart from Omega vs The Rainmaker V2.0 of course.
But for whatever reason, WWE seems to be very reluctant to go full heel with Roman.
They pulled him back from the brink of heel again on Monday... and there was such an opportuniy.
All he had to do was run away from Strowman, that's all. Do that and he's a heel.
They fethed it.
Alpharius wrote:
THIS is what we're going to (eventually) waste the Demon King's reappearance on?
And not on his rightful WWE Universal Championship match?
No!!!
I'm afraid that's how it looks. I actually thought his matches with Samson were... ok but the "fued" stunk. (and that guitar shot, man)
And you know this one is going to stink too.
I like Wyatt but he carries no threat now. And his gimmick totally jumped the shark during the Orton feud.
That week where he looked great winning, then defending the title seem so long ago now.
They don't have a clue what to do with Balor.... or Wyatt. Although, to be fair, neither do I at this stage.
WarbossDakka wrote: I'm a bit sad about ANOTHER tag team breakup (I won't say who it is just in case, but if you've watched the most recent RAW you'll understand what I'm going on about), and the worst part of it was how necessary it was. There wasn't heat behind it, and it even seemed like the other half of the duo stranded on Smackdown didn't even know it was happening! Please WWE, no more breakups. I've had enough of that this year. I will honestly flip if they break up The Revival, those guys are great heels, and I bet with a good feud could easily become RAW's Usos as champions.
I'm going to assume people have heard about Kurt Angle's happy news by now.
I'm conflicted. I agree that it's a shame about American Alpha (I was a huge fan). I think these types of angles (get it?) are a bit silly. Actually, really silly.
However, I'm excited for each guy's upcoming singles career. Well, excited and worried. Jordan's push will have to be handled very delicately if he's to get over big with the fans. I think he's likeable though? And he's super talented. I dunno. Nervous but I hope it goes well. Interested to see how slowly they build him. Hopefully glacially slow.
Gable though.... As I've mentioned before, his last two singles matches against top guys have been really good. And he looked great in the matches. Which is very encouraging. He's also somewhat protected on Smackdown, it feels like. He could do well. I genuinely think he's got the right stuff. As a smaller guys he could be a great underdog babyface. I wouldn't mind seeing him perform great, and just fall short against the bigger guys for a good while. Be a Daniel Bryan. Just please, please, please WWE.... don't drop him to 205. He's far to good. Again, I'm worried.
Anyone interested in Battleground?
No?
Nah?
Owens, Styles will be great obviously. That's probably it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In other news. Looks like Shane has been warming up for his next match....
I can't even be bothered with Battleground. I was so bored, incredibly disappointed with Smackdown. Even the Styles/Owens match which would have been good any other week, was pretty run-of-the-mill. Also, why did they give the title back to Owens? WWE Creative get more delusional every week.
Which is a shame, as there are some great wrestlers on there...
There are times when wrestling is just too damn predictable.
I mean, how long have we been hearing about Summerslam's main event becoming a 'Fatal 4-Way'?
And after you heard that Bálor/Samson was a "NO DQ Match", who here didn't 100% KNOW that Bray Wyatt was going to interfere last night and cost Bálor the match?
It is when wrestling surprises us that the best moments happen. The most memorable moments.
WWE "Creative" seems to have forgotten that, and they look like they've really lost their way, and as a result, they're giving us some really boring, unmemorable stuff.
To be honest, I thought RAW was pretty great, though it doesn't make up for Sunday. Also, why can't we just have a Summerslam Main Event which is a singles matchup? I don't even care if its Roman vs Lesnar again! Given that Roman is main eventing Wrestlemania again, I can't imagine he'll win the title at Summerslam, so there's that at least. There's one good thing about this whole thing though, Brock is finally dropping the title at Summerslam - well overdue.
I'll be at the 'go home' edition of RAW tonight, live in Boston!
I REALLY want to see Finn Bálor's entrance live...
I predict that somehow, someway, Bray will interfere with Finn, get the better of him, and then Finn will announce that he'll see Bray at Summerslam - as the DEMON KING!!!
And that return will be wasted on this no build up feud with no titles at stake!
Glad you enjoyed it. And glad you got to see Balor's entrance live.
It looked like a good show. I think I'm reasonably optimistic about Summerslam
The ICW show I was at a few weeks ago was great.
Glad I finally got to see Pete Dunne wrestle.
And ICW have just put the full main event from that evening up on you tube
Fatal Four Way for the WWE UK Championship....
Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'll be seeing him again next month too. A decent wee card this.....
Spoiler:
Automatically Appended Next Post: And.......
PREDICTIONS
Universal Championship -- Lesnar vs. Reigns vs. Joe vs. Strowman:
Lesnar. I think the “walking away” stipulation from Heyman is a bit of a red herring. And if Lesnar really is going to fight Jon Jones, I’d imagine the WWE (confident that he’ll win) will want him to be their champion going into that fight.
WWE Championship -- Mahal vs. Nakamura:
Mahal. Seems like there hasn’t been much of a build-up (although I have missed a lot of TV). I just can’t see Nak winning here.
United States Championship -- Styles vs. Owens:
Match of the Night and a Styles win. I’m actually not to fussed who wins here. They’re both great.
Balor vs. Wyatt:
Balor. Because Wyatt always loses these things. The only way I see a Wyatt win is if they’re planning on padding the feud out until Hell in a Cell.
Raw Women's Championship -- Bliss vs. Banks:
Bliss.
Naomi vs. Natalya:
Naomi.
Sheamus & Cesaro vs. Ambrose & Rollins:
Sheamus and Cesaro… I hope.
The New Day vs. The Usos
New Day.
Cena vs. Corbin:
Cena. Why would they make a total arse of Corbin, then have him beat Cena at Summerslam. Cena is building up to another title push. Mahal – Cena at Survivor Series.
Orton vs. Rusev:
Orton…. Ugh.
Big Show vs. Big Cass:
Big Cass 100%.
Cruiserweight Championship -- Tozawa vs. Neville:
Neville… Come On Neville!
Jason Jordan & The Hardy Boyz vs. The Miz & The Miztourage:
The Faces I guess… meh. Actually, this could be a good match, but I doubt they’ll get much time.
Mahal. Seems like there hasn’t been much of a build-up (although I have missed a lot of TV). I just can’t see Nak winning here.
Agreed!
Nakamura allegedly is getting heat for his strong/dangerous/reckless style - especially over the Cena Suplex Issue from a few weeks back.
United States Championship -- Styles vs. Owens:
Match of the Night and a Styles win. I’m actually not to fussed who wins here. They’re both great.
Agreed again, on all counts!
Owens gets 'screwed' here, somehow, even if it is in his own mind.
Plus it sets up a TEAM SHANE vs. TEAM OWENS for Survivor Series (?)...
Balor vs. Wyatt:
Balor. Because Wyatt always loses these things. The only way I see a Wyatt win is if they’re planning on padding the feud out until Hell in a Cell.
No way - agreed again!
But, for different reasons. Because, outside of RARE occasions, The Demon should *never* lose!
And hopefully that is the end of this feud. But that's probably not going to be the case, and both will continue on in this battle with no championships at stake, because WWE "Creative" doesn't quite know what to do with either of them right now.
Raw Women's Championship -- Bliss vs. Banks:
Bliss.
I *think* this is the outcome too, possibly with Jax interference costing Sasha the match setting up...something?
Naomi vs. Natalya:
Naomi.
Yup. And *yawn* too.
Sheamus & Cesaro vs. Ambrose & Rollins:
Sheamus and Cesaro… I hope.
A-ha!
Our first disagreement.
I think the mini-shield (buckler?) win here.
What I would LOVE to happen is for Roman Reigns to FINALLY go full heel, interfere here and cost them the match, telling them they are "nothing with me!!!"
Probably not though. Instead...(see later on for my prediction!)
The New Day vs. The Usos
New Day.
Sure, yes, I think so too.
Cena vs. Corbin:
Cena. Why would they make a total arse of Corbin, then have him beat Cena at Summerslam. Cena is building up to another title push. Mahal – Cena at Survivor Series.
I think you're right here as well. WHAT A WASTE of Corbin's MITB shot.
Weird...
Orton vs. Rusev:
Orton…. Ugh.
Again, yes.
Is SUMMERSLAM this predictable?
Big Show vs. Big Cass:
Big Cass 100%.
Unsure, but I'm going to go BIG SHOW here, with Enzo somehow managing to still make a difference even though he's 'trapped' in the shark cage.
Cruiserweight Championship -- Tozawa vs. Neville:
Neville… Come On Neville!
Nope!
Tozawa maintains!
If only because rapid title changes are lame.
Jason Jordan & The Hardy Boyz vs. The Miz & The Miztourage:
The Faces I guess… meh. Actually, this could be a good match, but I doubt they’ll get much time.
Didn't we just see this match?
Would be great if the heels win, and Jordan decides to go heel here and sign up for a spot with the Miz!
Universal Championship -- Lesnar vs. Reigns vs. Joe vs. Strowman:
Lesnar. I think the “walking away” stipulation from Heyman is a bit of a red herring. And if Lesnar really is going to fight Jon Jones, I’d imagine the WWE (confident that he’ll win) will want him to be their champion going into that fight.
Maybe?
Unfortunately, I think LESNAR retains, and the Part-Time Champ continues to be just that.
HOWEVER - what might also happen?
Rollins and Ambrose show up, and help Reigns triple power bomb Lesnar and REIGNS IS YOUR WWE UNIVERSAL CHAMPION!
I'd say 75% Lesnar wins, 25% the above happens and Reigns wins.
So as to now weasel here, I'll enter this in as a Lesnar win!
SO...even though it feels like a VERY predictable show, I'm also feeling like it will be a good show, and that the WWE team will actually manage to make it even better than that and surprise us too.
Well, Summerslam is right around the corner and once again it is shaping up to be worse than NXT Takeover. I remember the exact thing happening last year, except 2017's card is much, much worse. You know something is wrong when the US Title is WAY better than the Championship, but whatever. I'm rooting for Shinsky Naks, but I can't see him winning at all. Wasted Balor entrance, The Revival on the shelf again (if you remember one of my previous comments, I expected them to be in the title picture. I guess not 'till December now), and the Hardy Boys on the Kick Off Show, this is looking to be a pretty naff Summerslam. At least the Main Event is looking good.
Oh yeah, I think Alpharius has it bang on for predictions, but I'm slightly leaning toward Roman winning the main event. I don't mind Roman, so as loud as the boos will be, I'll be quite happy.
As long as the Demon goes over tonight, I suppose I'll be...as OK as I was going to be with him showing up for this mediocre feud...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Jason Jordan & The Hardy Boyz vs. The Miz & The Miztourage:
Miz
I was right? Sort of? I only kind of made a pick but in true wrestling heel fashion, I’m gonna count this as a win for me!
1-0
Cruiserweight Championship -- Tozawa vs. Neville:
Tozawa
I was wrong!
And yes, rapid title changes are still lame.
1-1
The New Day vs. The Usos
New Day
I was wrong here! The New Day lost – and it was a pretty decent match. The finish was pretty brutal with all those super-kicks to the Big E’s face, and then the double frog-splash…
1-2
Cena vs. Corbin:
Cena
I was right!
And the inexplicable burying of Corbin..continues? Rumor has it that WWE Creative ‘lost confidence’ with Corbin recently due to…reasons…including a social media feud he was involved in with another wrestler? Huh?
2-2
Naomi vs. Natalya:
Naomi
I was wrong!
And Naomi lost by submission too…
Huh. And I totally forgot that Carmella could have been looming here too…
2-3
Big Show vs. Big Cass:
Big Cass
I was right!
Not sure what the point of Enzo ‘escaping’ from the cage was in order to do…nothing?
Lame match, really.
But now I’m:
3-3
Orton vs. Rusev:
Orton
Wow.
We were right – and not only that, but they outright embarrassed Rusev here.
How long was that match?
6 secconds?
What was the point here?
More political punishment?
Ugh.
4-3
And there’s still 3 hours left in the show at this point…
Raw Women's Championship -- Bliss vs. Banks:
Bliss
(Ha! Sasha gets heel heat from being from Boston!)
Oddly paced semi-OK match…with a lame finish. Wasted psychology, not enough build up.
Can a match be slow and rushed at the same time?
Yes.
And I was wrong again!
4-4
5 matches left, and probably 2 ½ hours too?
30 minutes for each match left? OK…
OK - Here’s the one we’ve I’ve been waiting for!!!
Balor vs. Wyatt:
Balor
Did Finn just steal one of Bray’s songs?!?
And…no Eye of Bálor on Finn’s back?
I don’t like this…
…but apparently all is well, as the Demon King is able to out-freak-out Wyatt for the win!
And he’s now the new…
…er…
….winner of this match.
At least the Demon King is still undefeated in the WWE – and can show up to win the title from Lesnar at the next Wrestlemania!
(I can dream, right?!?)
5-4
Sheamus & Cesaro vs. Ambrose & Rollins:
Ambrose & Rollins
No revival or remix of the S.H.I.E.L.D. theme – and we’re off!
And after a frantic finish – Ambrose and Rollins are new champs!
And I was right!
6-4
United States Championship -- Styles vs. Owens:
Styles
A little sloppy, with lots of ref bumps (of course!), but Styles retains, and Owens has enough ‘cause’ to be upset at Shane-O’Mac too…
7-4
And I’m now guaranteed a winning record here!
WWE Championship -- Mahal vs. Nakamura:
Mahal
Mahal REALLY slows things down. Do not like Mahal. And they NEVER let him win ‘clean’ – and that’s what happens here again.
I’m now 8-4!
Universal Championship -- Lesnar vs. Reigns vs. Joe vs. Strowman:
Lesnar
And Lesnar retains, in a chaotic spot-fest!
Pinning Reigns no less, after doing a mid-match stretcher job too!
(And keeps that dream Lesnar-Bálor Wrestlemania Match alive!)
Right, I'm watching Summerslam right now and I honest to god confused why Jinder still has the title. Like why. This is just a quick post seperate to my full opinion of the event, but Sasha and Jinder have left me completely dumbfounded.
So, it’s taken most of the week, but I’ve finally managed to watch NXT Takeover and Summerslam.
SUMMERSLAM PREDICTIONS
Mahal. Seems like there hasn’t been much of a build-up (although I have missed a lot of TV). I just can’t see Nak winning here.
1-0
Match of the Night and a Styles win. I’m actually not to fussed who wins here. They’re both great.
2-0 Although, not sure about the MotN thing. It was decent. Good actually, but too many ref bumps harmed the flow. I think you were right about them setting up something Owens Vs McMahon.
Balor. Because Wyatt always loses these things. The only way I see a Wyatt win is if they’re planning on padding the feud out until Hell in a Cell.
3-0 Early lead! A nothing match this. As expected. A waste of the Demon, and I still really dislike the criminal misuse of Wyatt.
Bliss.
3-1 Surprised by this. I had been really enjoying Bliss’ work. Not sure where they’re going to go with the title now. Jax soon and hanging on until ‘mania? Not sure at all. Not sure WWE know either.
Naomi.
3-2 Another surprise. Can’t say I particularly care though. I like Natalya though. Hopefully a program between her and Charlotte could be (sort of) entertaining?
Sheamus and Cesaro… I hope.
3-3 That lead didn’t last long. Bahh…. Disappointed by this. I have no real attachment to the Shield, and I’m not a fan of Ambrose. I really like the S+C team. Hoping they reclaim the titles soon. Cesaro’s run into the crowd to burst that ball was great. The commentary team dealt with it well to. A good match, I thought.
New Day.
3-4 As I say, have’t watched the KO show. A good match though by all accounts. Didn’t think they’d take the titles off New Day so quickly. I can see a few switches over the next wee while.
Cena. Why would they make a total arse of Corbin, then have him beat Cena at Summerslam. Cena is building up to another title push. Mahal – Cena at Survivor Series.
4-4
And the inexplicable burying of Corbin..continues? Rumor has it that WWE Creative ‘lost confidence’ with Corbin recently due to…reasons…including a social media feud he was involved in with another wrestler? Huh?
They were saying something on the MLW podcast about racist undertones to one of his T-Shirts.
Orton…. Ugh.
5-4. At least it was short. Merciful. Terrible for Rusev though. Wasted again.
Big Cass 100%.
6-4
Neville… Come On Neville!
7-4
Jason Jordan & The Hardy Boyz I guess… meh. Actually, this could be a good match, but I doubt they’ll get much time.
7-5
Lesnar. I think the “walking away” stipulation from Heyman is a bit of a red herring. And if Lesnar really is going to fight Jon Jones, I’d imagine the WWE (confident that he’ll win) will want him to be their champion going into that fight.
8-5... Although that JJ fight sure isn't happening now
You win with 9-4….
Or….. wait…..
Alpharius wrote: Big Show vs. Big Cass:
Big Cass
I was right!
But….
Alpharius wrote: I'm going to go BIG SHOW here
Ha! Tied with 8-5
So, I thought the show was alright. Ignoring the Kick Off show and watching the event over two evenings definitely helped.
There were a couple of fun matches and the bad ones were, at least, fairly short. The main event was genuinely awesome… Really fun and it felt like a big deal. Reasonably happy with the outcome, although I’d rather they saved Lesnar – Strowman for Survivor Series or the Rumble. Feels like it’s big enough for those shows. They should be keeping them apart and teasing the match for months.
As entertaining as I thought some (4?) of the matches were though, I thought some of the booking was odd; Orton burying Rusev, Sasha Banks, Nakamura losing (not that I think he should’ve won, I just don’t think he should’ve been in that match).
As the Warboss predicted though, Takeover was way better. Yes, it’s a different show, less of spectacle (as it should be), but the standard of match was soo consistently good, that it really should shame WWE Prime. OK there were only 5 matches but each one of them was far better worked and engrossing than anything on the main show (perhaps the main event excepted). I didn’t think the Woman’s match was fantastic but it was better than anything in the RAW or SD title matches.
Did you guys watch it? The first 3 matches particularly were great.
Also, did you watch that UK Championship Match I linked to earlier? I’d be interested to hear your thoughts.
And in other news; I’m excited to see Chad Gable and Shelton Benjamin working together
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, will any of you be watching the Mae Young classic?
The way WWE is mishandling the women's and tag divisions, it doesn't seem worth it.
See, I was in favour of the brand split. I still like the idea, but I don't think they done it right.
I like the split… but I wouldn't have introduced the new titles. Having two Women's champs, 2 (4?) tag champs totally devalues both titles.
The new Universal Title was an awful idea. No heritage, no history, no prestige, and it's existence really hurts the existing Title.
Lose - lose.
I think it would've been much better to keep only one set of titles.
My vision….
Assuming the Title still went to SD with Dean Ambrose at the split....
• RAW would have gotten the IC Title. Instant elevation to 80’s level prestige for that title.
• The storylines on RAW, culminating at brand specific PPVs, would have revolved around the IC Title (elevating guys like Owens, Zayn, Rusev and Balor to legit Main Eventers) and….
• No.1 contendership for the WWE Championship at the next of the big 5 PPVs (they bring back KotR). Imagine the main event on the go-home show before Summerslam for example.
• Over on Smackdown, the WWE Championship is fought over, obviously. The current Champion has the honour of defending the title at one of the big 5 PPVs.
• That big PPV main event will be huge because, unlike now, it’ll be contested between guys who have been mostly kept apart for the last few months while anticipation builds. At the moment we’ve usually already seen the Wrestlemania main event 100 times before the actual show.
• At the big show, there’ll also be huge pressure on the contestants from their respective GMs to bring the title home. Lots of storyline potential there.
• If these opportunities for the title to switch between shows are limited to only 5 times per year, it makes those title matches really important. Although…..
• Money in the Bank will still be a thing. Imagine the RAW after Wrestlemania where Roman Reigns has just won the Title, bringing the belt back to Monday nights. He comes out to gloat and issue an open challenge arrogantly (because he’s most definitely a heel). The equally arrogant IC Title holder Kevin Owens accepts. Just as Reigns finally pins Owens…. AJ Styles invades RAW, cashes in and feths off back to Smackdown with WWE Championship. Awesome.
• Similar No.1 Contendership storylines would run for the Women’s, IC, US and Tag Titles on whichever show didn’t hold them. (We need more tag teams for this to work)
• We could have situations where Vince is looking at firing Daniel Bryan because all the titles end up on RAW leading to a HUGE survivor series 10-man tag with DB’s job on the line.
• Under this model, all titles gain prestige and those big PPVs all become must watch… rather than a 6 hour long procession of RAW matches and Smackdown matches (which we’ve already all been watching for the past few weeks)
I like the idea of the brand split, and I’m still quite liking it. I think the roster is generally deep enough to support it (tag teams notwithstanding). I just think it could’ve been handled much, much better…..
But what do I know?
Automatically Appended Next Post: And fun fact...
In the 2016 Draft (19 July 2016), Braun Strowman was the #48 pick.
Mostly because WWE "Creative" has pretty much shown that they don't know how to manage it, we'll never get your version/vision and yes, the new titles are, essentially, 'worthless' in terms of history, prestige, etc.
I can *almost* get by pretending SMACKDOWN doesn't exist, but then I'd miss out on AJ and Owens...
Balor would have really benefitted from a Miz feud.
Hopefully we'll still get it, but you've got to worry about how the rest of the Wyatt program is going to work out... It hasn't exactly been stellar up to now.
I never watched RAW, but just been catching up with it on Wrestlinginc.com ( I find it difficult to find time during the week to watch all 3 hours on catch-up. It's on too late for me to watch it live).
How did this Cena - Reigns exchange go down? It sounds pretty... real? Similar to the promos Cena and Miz were cutting on eachother back on Smackdown.
Wrestlinginc.com summarises....
Angle calls out John Cena to the ring.
Cena says this match is WrestleMania worthy but Angle is ready to get it done now. Cena says this is why he came to RAW, to step in the ring with The Big Dog. Cena says Reigns hasn't been just the blue chip prospect, he's been the blue chip prospect that's been protected against anyone in his path. Cena talks about himself and how there's no protection there. Cena says he wants to fight Reigns because he knows Reigns doesn't want to fight him. The music interrupts and out comes Reigns to some boos.
Reigns wants to get this straight - he's scared to fight Cena? Reigns wonders if that's what is in Cena's head. Reigns says Cena probably won't understand this because no one has ever said this to him but Cena is not as big of a deal as he thinks he is. Reigns says he's done something Cena will never be able to do - he retired The Undertaker at WrestleMania. Reigns says maybe he just doesn't need to fight Cena. Cena ends up calling Reigns a corporate Cena bootleg. Cena says Reigns isn't the guy, he's just a guy... a guy trying desperately to fill shoes he never will. Cena says listen carefully young man... he's not The Undertaker, he's not a battered veteran with a bad hip at the end of his career. Cena is the fastest and strongest he's ever been. Cena says Reigns knows if he signs that contract, his Roman Empire... can't see me. Reigns comes back and says fans don't boo Cena because they want him to be a bad guy, they boo him because he sucks. Cena makes a joke about Angle getting the "you suck" chants and Reigns tells him to shut up. Reigns looks to be searching for words and Cena disses him. Reigns tells him to shut up again. Reigns ends up calling Cena a fake b---h. A part timing, fake b---h.
Reigns goes on about Cena being a part-timer and how he buries younger talents. Reigns says that's how Cena stays on top of the mountain. Reigns calls him a backstabbing shark. Reigns says what bothers Cena is that he can't bury Reigns, he can't touch him. Reigns says he's the one guy in WWE who Cena can't see. Reigns asks why he would want to lessen himself, his bloodline and his legacy to be the next John Cena when he could be the one and only Roman Reigns.
Cena says Reigns is a fool, a damn fool. Cena says Reigns of all people comes down to the ring and uses the same poor excuse that the others in front of him have done. Reigns, with all his abilities, has the gall to blame Cena. Cena congratulates Reigns, saying it took him 5 years to cut a half-decent promo but now Cena is about to cut him down to size. Cena says everyone thinks he has a magical golden shovel. Cena can't tell if Reigns is blind or stupid. Cena says the fans have always held the keys and always will. Cena goes on, mentioning how he won the United States Title and used it to help guys like AJ Styles and Kevin Owens. He says Reigns took the US Title as a demotion. Cena says he's still here because Reigns can't do his job.
Cena goes on and says Reigns should be ashamed because he can do this better part time than Reigns could ever do it full time. Cena drops the mic and the crowd gets riled up with him. Cena has signed the contract. Reigns signs the contract and Cena loves it. Reigns flips the table over and they face off. The music interrupts and out comes Luke Gallows and Karl Anderson. They talk about the egos in the ring, calling both men "not a good brother." They believe Cena and Reigns need to be taught a lesson by a couple of good brothers. They're headed to the ring to beat up a few nerds. Angle makes a tag match for right now. We go to commercial
They could have a good match or two, and it keeps Reigns out of the immediate title picture which is nice.
Also, Sasha dropped again?
Why did they even bother with the switch at SS? How many title reigns has Sasha Banks had now?
The Cena/Reigns exchange was...somewhat real, except Reigns flubbed it a bit in places - which Cena then called him on - making it...more real than real?!?
It was odd...
It felt a bit forced - not at all like how the Miz can do his promos, which, while clearly being a work, come across as...real?
And yes, Banks dropped the title - again.
WWE seems to really enjoy short title 'reigns' for its Women's Divisions.
And...yeah, the Wyatt/Bálor Feud lives on....hurrah?
I hope this does NOT mean Wyatt gets a win back vs. The Demon at No Mercy.
Ugh.
Hard to believe how lame WWE Creative is at times.
Alpharius wrote: And...yeah, the Wyatt/Bálor Feud lives on....hurrah?
I hope this does NOT mean Wyatt gets a win back vs. The Demon at No Mercy.
Ugh.
Hard to believe how lame WWE Creative is at times.
The rumours I've heard were that the WWE want to protect the Demon character, so they'll only use it at the big PPV's and when they do, it's likely Baylor will win the match
Alpharius wrote: And...yeah, the Wyatt/Bálor Feud lives on....hurrah?
I hope this does NOT mean Wyatt gets a win back vs. The Demon at No Mercy.
Ugh.
Hard to believe how lame WWE Creative is at times.
The rumours I've heard were that the WWE want to protect the Demon character, so they'll only use it at the big PPV's and when they do, it's likely Baylor will win the match
That's the way it should be - though it still seemed like a 'waste' to have him show up for the first time since Summeslam 2016 (and winning the first ever Universal Championship!) to fight Bray Wyatt at Summerslam 2017 over...reasons.
Sometimes I really wonder what goes on in Creative. It is like they take the best idea, and do the complete opposite. Like having Bliss lose at Summerslam, and then win it back in her rematch just to get dropped by Nia makes Banks and Bliss look weak. Can WWE not book a good dominant heel? Most of the non-champion wrestlers in the company are heels at the moment, and not one of them are seen as dominant (maybe apart from Strowman, but it can be argued he is a face!), and even some of the champions are total wimps!
As for the Mae Young Classic, it is a definite must watch. Candice and Kairi Sane/Hojo totally made the show, and some wrestlers from British wrestling were there too (Vyper is/was on one of the British shows, forgotten its name). I recommend it!
As for the Mae Young Classic, it is a definite must watch. Candice and Kairi Sane/Hojo totally made the show, and some wrestlers from British wrestling were there too (Vyper is/was on one of the British shows, forgotten its name). I recommend it!
Viper is in ICW. She's really good. Seen her a couple of times.
I've only watch the first episode of the Mae Young Classic so far. Wanted to see Kay Lee Ray (also ICW) perform. Unfortunately she didn't really get to show much before being pinned, but I'm looking forward to the rest of the tournament.
Pro Wrestling Illustrated has named their Top 10 Wrestlers of 2017. They are
1. Kazuchika Okada
2. AJ Styles
3. Kevin Owens
4. Roman Reigns
5. Kenny Omega
6. Shinsuke Nakamura
7. Samoa Joe
8. Dean Ambrose
9. Bobby Roode
10. The Miz
Was it based on how well they've done in the year, or who are the best wrestlers functionally? I think it is the former, so why isn't Braun Strowman on there? I'd say he's done pretty well for himself. And that number 1 pick just feels like a "I swear I watch more than WWE, just look!". I feel like there should be a few more NJPW wrestlers on there anyway.
I just thought of this while listening to 'Simon Miller's pro wrestling podcast', and wanted some opinions on this. Would there be any legs in the Cena/Reigns feud becoming a three event thing? If they were kept from having a match on Raw, you could have Reigns lose the match at No Mercy, with Cena being 'injured' in the match, bring Cena back around December for a second PPV match with Reigns, which Reigns wins. Following this you could have the blow off match at the Royal Rumble, which again Reigns wins.
To me this is how you could get to the Lesnar/Reigns match at Wrestlemania, as if Reigns wins that feud you could argue he deserves a title shot. This then leaves the rumble free, which could be won by Styles, setting up Styles/Nakamura for 'Mania. As I see it there's no reason not to put the belt on Nakamura, which I see happening at Hell in a Cell, in a Hell in a Cell match
Alpharius wrote: But...does anyone really want Lesnar/Reigns at Wrestlemania 2018?
And...does anyone really want Lesnar the Part-Timer to hold on to the title that long?
Outside the WWE, I don't think anyone wants it. I know I didn't want him to win it in the first place. It seems though that the WWE are quite happy with him as the champion though and given how long the rumours have been going on that they're planning on that match as "Reigns' coronation" it seems like they might just stick with it
Well done WWE, Asuka didn't need a surprise entrance to start kicking ass out of nowhere anyway. Just announce it for a few weeks time. And to top it off, she's going to RAW instead of Smackdown, where she'll undoubtedly be booked poorly 3-6 months after her debut. But hey, we have Kairi Hojo to look forward to as a replacement in NXT. She's good.
As for the Lesnar Reigns scenario, I'm not too bothered if Reigns wins it or not. His promos with Cena have been very good recently, whether that's down to Roman or not. Brock being the champion till then I'm... not so hot with. I'll be rooting for Strowman at No Mercy, but it will be another Samoa Joe scenario - challenger looks strong before fighting Lesnar, promptly loses at the PPV.
So Reigns and Wyatt have been replaced with Angle and Styles at TLC. What do you all think of that? Styles v Balor should be a much better match than Balor v Wyatt, but I have this feeling Angle was not the right person to replace Reigns
Big yawn for me unfortunately, like the first 2 aren't seen like ever, and Emma was always just... ok. Like nothing she did was ever impressive, but she wasn't necessarily bad.
This was the show I had to miss last year because of work (And so missed my chance to see Kurt Angle wrestle live), so I'm super looking forward to it.
The only one I have is that I think someone from Smackdown will win the Men's Royal Rumble.
Why, you ask?
For whatever reason, WWE seems dead set on having Reigns v. Lesnar at Wrestlemania.
In order for that to happen, and in order for the boos to not...rain down in Philly, Reigns can't win.
If a Smackdown guy wins, well they'll be on the way to a match vs. AJ, and WWE can still have their Reigns v. Lesnar Wrestlemania moment that no one really wants.
BUT, if it means an end to the Part-Time Champ crap we've had with Lesnar forever now, OK, so be it.
Which means, unfortunately, that Finn Bálor will not be winning, and that the Bullet Bálor Club will most likely be thwarted by someone in the Rumble, leading to yet another time wasting placeholder feud for Finn.
Maybe The Revival, given what happened on the rather lackluster RAW 25th Anniversary show?
Anwyay, Shinsuke wins it (darkhorse candidate being Orton).
As for the Women's Rumble...easy answer is Asuka, as she hasn't lost EVER in the WWE, and even a 'loss' in the Rumble match could 'tarnish' her rep...so...yeah, I'll say Asuka wins it.
RAW 25th anniversary was disappointing, like the opener with Vince and Stone Cold was great but after that it got tiresome really fast, bring in legend(s) and get a bit of a pop also don't do anything interesting with them. I feel the wrestling suffered because of it, for example, the tag team
match between Gallows and Anderson and The Revival didn't make much sense to me, The Revival taking bumps from old men made them look like chumps and does nothing for their momentum especially since they only recently recovered from injuries, plus the match was too short. The
Triple-Threat match was just okay but I am so tired of matches involving a monster slamming another wrestler into the announcer's table with the recipient knocked out for a long time, they do that spot way too much and it kills it effectiveness in doing so. Just use that spot maybe a few times
every few years (not every few months), then it will be way more meaningful there's got to be other ways to make a monster look strong and powerful. The Manhattan Centre looks amazing (the building itself not the event) and the ICOPRO banner was a nice touch.
The only one I have is that I think someone from Smackdown will win the Men's Royal Rumble.
Why, you ask?
For whatever reason, WWE seems dead set on having Reigns v. Lesnar at Wrestlemania.
In order for that to happen, and in order for the boos to not...rain down in Philly, Reigns can't win.
If a Smackdown guy wins, well they'll be on the way to a match vs. AJ, and WWE can still have their Reigns v. Lesnar Wrestlemania moment that no one really wants.
BUT, if it means an end to the Part-Time Champ crap we've had with Lesnar forever now, OK, so be it.
Which means, unfortunately, that Finn Bálor will not be winning, and that the Bullet Bálor Club will most likely be thwarted by someone in the Rumble, leading to yet another time wasting placeholder feud for Finn.
Maybe The Revival, given what happened on the rather lackluster RAW 25th Anniversary show?
Anwyay, Shinsuke wins it (darkhorse candidate being Orton).
I was right!
1-0
REALLY lame that Cena eliminates Finn.
If Cena wasn't going to win it - thankfully! - he could/should have been eliminated by Finn.
Then Finn gets eliminated by Shinsuke, etc. etc.
As for the Women's Rumble...easy answer is Asuka, as she hasn't lost EVER in the WWE, and even a 'loss' in the Rumble match could 'tarnish' her rep...so...yeah, I'll say Asuka wins it.
I was right!
2-0
Lesnar retains.
I was right!
3-0
The Bar get the tag titles back.
I was right!
4-0
Gable and Benjamin win.
I was wrong!
4-1
AJ retains.
I was right!
5-1.
Not too shabby!
ELIMINATION CHAMBER qualifying matches announced for tonight!
Winner there goes on to challenge Lesnar at...Wrestlemania!
Tonight!
Matt Hardy vs. Elias
Elias wins here, after Bray interferes!
Braun vs. Kane - Last Man Standing Match
Braun wins, and Kane thankfully fades away...
CENA V. FINN!
OK, maybe this is why Cena eliminated him yesterday?
So Finn gets revenge tonight?
I REALLY hope so!
(But I doubt it...)
Still - Finn wins!!!
But does it matter?
We've been hearing for a year that it is going to be Reigns vs. Lesnar at Wrestlemania...
It’s beginning to bug me that all the best Woken Matt stuff is happening at house shows and on Matt’s YouTube account. I get a large part of the Broken character was his online presence, but if he’s at house shows doing it all, why can’t he do it on TV? Give the man tv time to do as he wishes and he will make money
Looks like we're heading towards that Miz v. Finn Bálor match at Wrestlemania, aren't we?
Mixed feelings there, as I'd rather he challenge for the Universal Championship, but I suppose it is better than not being on the card at Wrestlemania.
Roman Reigns won the Elimination Chamber match and will now headline Wrestlemania for the FOURTH YEAR IN A ROW, wrestling Lesnar for the Universal Championship.
And...
...I hope he wins.
Because the 'part time champ' era needs to end!
Strowman looked like an absolute monster in the match too though, so it wouldn't be too shocking if the Wrestlemania Main Event becomes a triple threat match, and Reigns, Lesnar and Strowman meet - again.
But this time, I'm not sure I'd be surprised if Strowman wins it!
Cena - as of now - has no match at Wrestlemania.
But the tease seems to be that he'll call out the Undertaker?!?
But perhaps the MOST egresious thing right now is that Finn Bálor has no Wrestlemania match!!!
Can I see WWE 'Creative' getting super-lazy and giving Rollins a new Tag Team partner and having that new partner be Finn and have them challenge The Bar?
Yes, yes I can.
At this point, I think Finn is going to have to move over to...ugh...Smackdown if he wants to get back into serious title contention...
Well, at least New Day are taking a well earned backseat.
I absolutely love those guys, but for a long time they felt like the Only Horse In The Show when it came to tag team stuff. And the usual 'third man interferes, then they win' wore thin after the third such instance, let alone the 30th....
But the tease seems to be that he'll call out the Undertaker?!?
WWE is probably trying to pass the heat off Roman Reigns. Whoever retired the Undertaker was going to get serious heat (unless they managed to pull off a Shawn Michaels/Ric Flair kinda thing), so WWE probably want that on Cena, who is on his way out, rather than Reigns, who they want to be the next big babyface (despite how obviously badly that is going so far).
I actually like having a part-time champ, as it makes their appearances feel more special if they aren't on TV all the time "How can I miss you if you're never gone?".
Roman Reigns wins Universal title, boos all round the arena then bam! Flight of the Valkyries rings out. Bryan beats Reigns for the championship (just make something up about a clause in his contract which said that if he ever was found fit to enter the ring again he could have a title shot of his choosing in compensation for having to drop his title when his injuries sidelined him).
Then afterwards Daniel Bryan vs Finn Balor feud for the universal championship as Finn wants his shot at the title he lost without actually losing it, he's fed up of waiting for his shot and seeing Bryan get it on his immediate return really pisses him off when he's been waiting for his chance.
A Town Called Malus wrote: Roman Reigns wins Universal title, boos all round the arena then bam! Flight of the Valkyries rings out. Bryan beats Reigns for the championship.
Then afterwards Daniel Bryan vs Finn Balor feud for the universal championship
I like that - I'm giving you the book!
That would mean that Balor would have to play the heel, but he's good at that, so...sure, why not?
There's never been a Demon Heel though, and the crowd loves to pop for Finn, so maybe he'll just have to walk the line between Heel and Babyface?
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: I would love to see a Bryan v Balor match. Both are mightily impressive in terms of technical skill. And Bryan certainly knows how to work a crowd!
Still hoping Paige makes a full recovery. She could do with some good fortune now.
Agreed about Paige.
Ask and ye shall receive :
Just think of how much they've improved since then and wonder....
There's never been a Demon Heel though, and the crowd loves to pop for Finn, so maybe he'll just have to walk the line between Heel and Babyface?
True, but who else could potentially facilitate a heel turn better than him going after a returning Daniel Bryan, the living embodiment of fan support?
There's never been a Demon Heel though, and the crowd loves to pop for Finn, so maybe he'll just have to walk the line between Heel and Babyface?
True, but who else could potentially facilitate a heel turn better than him going after a returning Daniel Bryan, the living embodiment of fan support?
Oh, that would definitely do it - at least for a while.
But Finn's too good at what he does to stay heel for too long.
I had to laugh at the cheers that came out of the crowd when it was initially announced by Angle that Roman wouldn't be in attendance due to his suspension - funny stuff!
There's never been a Demon Heel though, and the crowd loves to pop for Finn, so maybe he'll just have to walk the line between Heel and Babyface?
True, but who else could potentially facilitate a heel turn better than him going after a returning Daniel Bryan, the living embodiment of fan support?
Oh, that would definitely do it - at least for a while.
But Finn's too good at what he does to stay heel for too long.
Could tilt into that, have them gain respect for each other by the end of the feud, maybe even resulting in a Dragon and Demon tag team.
Finally watched it all (Monday was busy. Work, Walking Dead and The Last Jedi also vying for attention!), and I've got to say I really enjoyed it.
Women's Matches again managed to leave many of the male wrestlers in the dust. Ronda's debut was predictably and enjoyably silly. Braun Strowman remains a favourite. The power of Brock Lesnar, but with greater personality than a cabbage.
Brock vs Reigns was quite dull - but then it always is with Brock. Suplex, Suplex, Suplex, F5 herp-de-derp I are wrassle. I really, really wish they'd ditch him as a wrestler. He's got no charisma at all.
Definitely an improvement over last year's, which I found underwhelming. Culprit for me there was the Orton vs Wyatt match. Stupid maggot and gross projections just killed any momentum, and not just in their match. It wasn't spooky, it wasn't atmospheric. It was just lame.
I liked his match against Brock a lot and just AJ's matches in general, his matches against Nakamura are disappointing though.
Automatically Appended Next Post: The only thing I dislike about AJ is his politics, but as far as a talent goes I think he's one of the best in ring workers of his generation.
There's just something about him I find inherently yawn inducing.
I get that he's a skilled wrestler, but I just don't feel his matches. Could be that WWE just don't know how to bill him. Could also be his hair and beard, and gloves, remind me of Rio Blast out of He-Man....
I actually think that might be it. Which is weird, because I had that toy, and it was ace! Full of dakka too.
Well, Vinnie Mac is apparently enraged over fan reactions Backlash PPV.
Apart from a couple of matches. Rollins VS the Miz (A cracker on a sub par card) and AJ vs Nakamura Fans were pretty vocal and in a lot of cases voted with their feet and walked out of the arena!
Being in the New York area means a lot to McMahon and by all accounts hes darned upset. Its taken him around 4 years to get to that stage mind.
I wonder if hes upset enough to change and, hats on, look at providing a wrestling product thats entertaining rather than the entertainment product with some guys in a ring that WWE currently produce?
Honestly I prefer NXT, the booking makes a lot more sense, doesn't seem as overproduced and the matches on average are better.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also does anyone get the impression that Nakamura is phoning it in, like he's supposed to be this great Japanese worker (at least in NJPW) but almost all his WWE are just okay nothing special, whereas with AJ he's worked all sort of promotions and styles of wrestling but at least it feels
like he's giving it his all and has had great matches with several guys in the WWE already, where I feel like it's safe to say he's one of the best workers of his generation. Even in some of his more lackluster matches it doesn't really feel like his fault so much as bad booking or not having a
NXT is a superior product for Wrestling. And I've always felt it's a shame that people highly competent in the ring soon get too caught up in the (admittedly fun) pantomime of the main roster.
My suggestion for fixes?
1. Get rid of Brock Lesnar. He's boring. Even Paul Heyman can't save him from being boring.
2. Much as I like him, stop push push pushing Roman Reigns. Let him turn heel, mid-card him, let him work his way up. He's a good wrassler, just needs to better earn it. Mebbes back into Tag Team?
3. Get original with your heels. The whole 'OH NOES THEY R CHEATEDS!' is dull and repetitive.
4. It's time for some of the Old Guard to go. Sheamus and Cesaro just aren't entertaining.
5. More. Wimmins. Wrasslin. That is where WWE is absolutely killing it. The matches are faster paced. The action is more athletic, less 'blimbo blambo, me Brock'.
6. Stop tinkering with characters when people come over from NXT! Seriously! Just knock it off.
Cheesecat wrote: Honestly I prefer NXT, the booking makes a lot more sense, doesn't seem as overproduced and the matches on average are better.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also does anyone get the impression that Nakamura is phoning it in, like he's supposed to be this great Japanese worker (at least in NJPW) but almost all his WWE are just okay nothing special, whereas with AJ he's worked all sort of promotions and styles of wrestling but at least it feels
like he's giving it his all and has had great matches with several guys in the WWE already, where I feel like it's safe to say he's one of the best workers of his generation. Even in some of his more lackluster matches it doesn't really feel like his fault so much as bad booking or not having a
great opponent.
Guys like Nakamura phone it in because WWE main brand doesn't know what to do with them. He was great in NJPW and a real character,however western audiences are fed specific types of match, and WWE have a specific style to go with that. The main problem is that wrestling matches should evolve over their duration to tell a specific story. WWE main brand don't.
Even the promos in WWE suck now, all the wrestlers are scripted and are almost back in the bad old days of guys being one dimensional parodies. They may as well be dentists or ex cons, or evil sheikhs again.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: NXT is a superior product for Wrestling. And I've always felt it's a shame that people highly competent in the ring soon get too caught up in the (admittedly fun) pantomime of the main roster.
My suggestion for fixes?
1. Get rid of Brock Lesnar. He's boring. Even Paul Heyman can't save him from being boring.
2. Much as I like him, stop push push pushing Roman Reigns. Let him turn heel, mid-card him, let him work his way up. He's a good wrassler, just needs to better earn it. Mebbes back into Tag Team?
3. Get original with your heels. The whole 'OH NOES THEY R CHEATEDS!' is dull and repetitive.
4. It's time for some of the Old Guard to go. Sheamus and Cesaro just aren't entertaining.
5. More. Wimmins. Wrasslin. That is where WWE is absolutely killing it. The matches are faster paced. The action is more athletic, less 'blimbo blambo, me Brock'.
6. Stop tinkering with characters when people come over from NXT! Seriously! Just knock it off.
Brocks an okay wrestler and does will with his 1D gimmick, not worth putting the strap on him though.
Reigns is a dead duck and the reason fans aren't tuning in. You can't push a guy to the moon - with the fans against it - and claim hatred of the idea as heat. Story line turn him and have him be against the fans who already hate him. Get him to beat opponents to a pulp and laugh while doing it . Funnily enough Samoa Joe got over in TNA doing this Christopher Daniels, wearing his towel with Daniels blood on it to the ring.
Heels, need to lie cheat and steal and be blatant with it, they also need their comeuppance.
Cesaro is due a main event singles push. WWE will botch it though.
Deffo need more women in action and some positive storylines to carry feuds.
Impact (TNA) shifting TV channels, again. This time to "Pursuit", a channel that has even less viewership than "Pop!", but they somehow still manage to limp along. I haven't watched in a while because I didn't get "Pop!" and, strangely enough, I don't get "Pursuit" either.
Ring of Honor chugs along, and it looks like the rising star that is New Japan (gaining traction in the USA!) will continue their working relationship with them - or will they?
Because all of a sudden, ALL ELITE WRESTLING is a thing? And they look to be where Kenny Omega will land, once his NJPW contract is up at the end of the month?
But, on to WWE!
Where it looks like Finn Bálor is FINALLY getting the push he warrants and deserves!
Trouble is...will WWE pull the trigger on him winning it all?
I hope so - especially after RAW's rating were the worst ever, and WWE broke the glass for this particular emergency and trotted out ALL of the McMahon family - who promised us that this time is different, and they'll change things up, do things differently, etc.
Finn's and Vince's promo was...pretty interesting and certainly injected some 'real life' stuff in there too.
Ironically enough, Finn 'lost' the Universal Championship due to injury, and he's now in the title match due to Storwman's injury.
Finn HAS to go Demon King mode here - but so far, for the most part, the Demon King does NOT lose - except when he's leaving a promotion (last NXT match type stuff).
So...does WWE do the stupid thing, and sacrifice the Demon King to the Beast Lesnar OR, do they do the right thing, and have Finn beat Lesnar at the Royal Rumble?
Was just thinking of asking whether I should necro this thread or start a new one!
Been catching up on NXT UK. Fell way behind when I was writing my masters thesis. Currently watching Takeover.
The tag title match between Moustache Mountain and Gibson/Drake was pretty phenomenal, loads of great spots and near falls, the suicide dive doomsday device was a thing of beauty and then it was followed up by a dropkick interception of a suicide dive. Can't wait to see these two teams go at it again as they work phenomenally well together.
I marked out a little bit when Finn came out as the replacement against Devlin, though as soon as Devlin said he was the "best irish wrestler in the world" it was pretty obvious what way it was going to go down.
Allegedly the crowd's reaction to Finn, and the overall quality of that match, may have been what FINALLY convinced Vince to give Finn the main event title shot?
Sheesh!
Way to pay attention to your own product for the last year!
Despite being a victim of awful 50/50 booking, Finn consistently gets awesome crowd reactions and is in the top 3 or 4 in terms of merchandise sales - which is apparently an important metric in the world of wrestling and who does and does not get a push!
Really, the only reason it is happening is his pet project is out battling leukemia and the other alternative that was getting built up is out of the picture.
If Finn does beat Brock, he hopefully won't just be a stepping stone to pass the belt off to Strowman or Roman when they return.
I think Roman will get a huge pop when he comes back. Nobody wants Joe Anoa'i to be ill after all and him beating cancer again will get a great reaction (fingers crossed here, I hope he makes it). Hopefully WWE will understand that the reaction he will get is a response to that real-life situation and will alter their booking strategy of him on his return. This is the best chance they have of getting the crowd onto his side and properly getting him over as a face but it won't work if they just revert back to their previous booking strategy of him main eventing every wrestlemania etc. If the crowd gets a Roman with more of Joe, the person we saw when he made his cancer announcement, then they will cheer him. If they instead get more of the fist cocking, wedding ruining, takes more finishers to put away than the Undertaker, "suffering succotash" person, then that goodwill will not last.
As much as I want Finn to win - and what a win it would be, reclaiming his Universal Title by beating Lesnar! - I don't think WWE will do this.
Probably, though that will provoke backlash at the title remaining on a part time wrestler. Lesnar would be ideal to fill the role of a transitional champion for when you need to move the title around and don't want to have two people face off directly (either they are both faces/heels or you want to build one of them up a bit more beforehand). He has the legitimacy to win the title from pretty much anybody without it making the loser seem weak, and that legitimacy also makes anyone beating him look strong (so long as it is booked correctly, of course).
So say you had the Universal title on Seth (face) and wanted to move it over onto Finn (face) without switching either heel. If you don't have a heel who you consider up to the main event standard quite yet (say, Rollins has just beat your top heel decisively to end a feud but you have someone who is gonna be moving up out of the midcard in the coming months), you can bring in Lesnar to beat Rollins. Lesnar holds the title for a short while (maybe a couple of months) and meanwhile Finn cements himself as the number one contender and then wins the title from Lesnar. During that you can also be building up a heel to challenge Finn (Finn beat them to gain the number one contender spot, for example).
Just need to feed some people who won't be affected by the losses to Lesnar but are still believable as contenders for the title in the months you want him to hold the title (established wrestlers are ideal here, someone like Chris Jericho, just for an example, wouldn't lose anything by losing to Lesnar).
And even worse - they'll probably end up sacrificing the Demon King to Lesnar too.
That will be a huge shame. Because of how well the Demon King persona is protected, each loss has the potential to quite badly damage the impact of it. Too many and you risk Bray Wyatt'ing the gimmick.
I think we'll have an indication of whether or not Finn has a shot by who wins the men's Royal Rumble match too...
It's been way, way too long. Fingers crossed here!
Indeed. Thoughts on who you think will win the rumbles? Not sure about the mens rumble, but for the women I can see Becky Lynch being a surprise entrant who wins to set her up for a Raw womens title against Rousey at Mania. If that is the case then she should lose to Asuka in the smackdown title match. That gives Asuka a strong title defence (which she needs to help build her back up as a strong dominant force after her misbooking over the past year) and leaves Becky free to head over to Raw and take it to Rousey.
in the Cruiserweight Classic this week.
). Still get the feeling that Ambrose's character isn't quite right yet, but Styles is doing a great job.
am! Get him on Smackdown with his brother.
. Although, it seems like the show itself wasn't too great with little actual wrestling (haven't watched it yet), so maybe not such a bad decision. Smackdown will be good, but it would've been awesome to have been there for that bit last night.
ro have just announced this match for April....
), so details of the actual show are a little fuzzy, but fun was had.
