I like the Mech and it will be the model that will get me to finally buy an Asterian Strike Team.
Matsudan as Asterian Sub Faction makes it much more intresting as other solutions might have been (Mercs or Rebs)
and now we just need a new Orc plastic box
as Mantic has done a good job with the Forge Fathers and GCPS to upgrade them from the original sculpts, Orcs are the last ones missing that need some love
Rebs are in the same boat as Orcs only they are even more difficult to do in plastic as they have such a variation in races. But yes the Orcs need new plastics as neither the old ones or the PVC ones are particularly good.
There was talk of plastic Plague stage 2s but Mantic seem to be focusing on KoW right now and Warpath has gone very quiet.
It was said that 2020 will be year of KoW as they want to get 3rd Edition running
But in one of the Podcasts Ronnie said that they are going to rework FireFight too, to bring it more in line with the other games
So I am hoping that new Orcs will be coming sooner than later
And Rebs are tricky but Mantic also became a lot better in doing PVC and their Resin is great so maybe a more generic so a re-worked PVC line with some upgrade bits to turn the GCPS Troops into Rebs might be enough
We’ve also been working hard with the Deadzone RC to ensure this isn’t your standard mech. Rather than plodding along like an Iron Ancestor, the Spectra will be super agile… and even has the ability to fly. For interested, it stands around 10cm high, will be made from resin and features a translucent blue energy shield.
Again, the Spectra was originally due for release in July but we’ll have to wait to see if the world returns to normal!
TOSHIYORI
This is the leader of the Matsudan and one of your command options for the Matsudan sub faction. You’ve also got the option of the Marionette Prime too. The Toshiyori can boost nearby Marionettes to help them shoot and survive a bit better.
SEKIWAKE
Ok, this is one model we haven’t shown before! Although some of the Matsudan are armed with massive guns, the Sekiwake has a couple of Shock Mauls. You really don’t want to be on the wrong end of these.
Originally the plan was for the Matsudan to be released in July but obviously plans are a little fluid at the moment. However, if you still want your giant, sumo-wrestling space lizard fix, Ota Sora is included as part of the Terror in the Deep expansion for Star Saga (which also gives you a decent Nameless Strike Team too).
Nostromodamus wrote: Identical pose to the new Ragnar Blackmane but I’m not seeing the same levels of “model jumping off of masonry” hate here
There would be a couple of reasons for that -
- for one, as Polonius mentions, it's meant to fly. So either a flight stick or some sort of 'leaping into the air' is fairly standard.
- for two, not as many people actually care enough to complain, where a lot more people are paying attention to GW releases, and
- for three, Mantic simply don't do it as often.
Think it is a combination of those 3 reasons
it fits the model, it fits the faction, it there is no model with an identical pose (similar ones but not the same) and it looks good with the shield in front
while Ragnar looked out of place with his pose among the other models in the box and his pose is more of running or leaping forward while small piece he is standing on it looks more like he is jumping
if Ragnar would be placed on the ground with the terrain piece he would look much better and it would fit
(add a Pistol in the free hand and use charging models around him and it would be perfect)
For a lot of models released from GW compared to Mantic, I have the feeling that GW has good ideas but the execution is bad because they want to be all at once
while for Mantic the models have a specific design goal and this is kept until the end (for some it works out well while for others not so much)
For the first time in Mantic's 10-year history, we've had to cancel our Open Day. This was a massive disappointment because we love hanging out with all the Mantic fans at HQ, spending the time chatting and playing some games.
However, all is not lost because we are going to host a VIRTUAL MANTIC OPEN DAY on May 9th. Who's excited?
That's right! Now we can hang out with fans around the globe and - even better - it'll be free to attend. We'll be trying to recreate the feel of an Open Day as much as possible and currently the plans involve:
live streams of games
the infamous Ronnie Q&A
Needy Cat Games' seminar on Games Design 101
live sculpting session
special website offers
Those Matsudan are totally my kind of thing. I hope they're a bit bigger than the Dreadball ones.
They look like they should be much larger than they actually are. Hoping for 40mm bases but I'm sure I'll run them if they have a team option regardless.
YEEEES!!! I've been wanting to read the book for quite a while, but couldn't bother picking up the three-pack.
Warpath/Deadzone background is fun, has that dystopian nonchalant vibe similar to early rogue trader.
Is there a good mail order source for Mantic stuff in the US? Most of the ones I use seem to have dropped most of the Mantic lines, including Deadzone.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: That's why somebody needs to do a decent hard plastic, modern scale samurai infantry kit- so we can kitbash together all of our musha mechs.
PW have done a few that might work, tho they're still mostly human and too big for those Mantic bots:
Mini Command Protocol for Deadzone is aimed for 24th August
Matsudan and Spectra rules as well as re-worked rules for Monobike (now its own unit instead of an upgrade) as well as new units for Enforcer and Veer-Myn
The 3 specialists are available separately for £9.99 each direct from Mantic but the full Faction starter is £29.99 and is the only way to get the leader so it's a better deal. It's a pity they didn't do a bundle of the resins only as I already have all the Asterian parts.
On the topic of alternate parts for Warpath bits, I was never a fan of that tiny window in the nose of the Enforcer interceptor / bomber so I made an alternative that can be 3D printed. You can download it from here:
Have there been any rumors of another yearly book for Deadzone this year? I never picked up Escalation, but I don't want to do it now if its going to be replaced in a few months.
Don't miss the September issue of Miniature Wargames because it comes with a FREE sprue of Abyssal Dwarfs - perfect for getting your Vanguard warband started or adding to your Kings of War army.
Is the magazine any good?
I’ve never read one, and don’t even get WD anymore.
Might be worth a one off read (I don’t really do any historical, but like the look of some ww2 stuff, not that this issue seems to have any).
But otherwise it’s just half price abyssals. For £3 I’d just grab it, but as I have no use for the models specifically.. would be good if it’s an ok read too
We’re kicking things (or should that be launching the ball) with DreadBall. We realise it’s been a while since we’ve had any new DB releases, so in 2021 we’re going all out with a brand-new supplement and miniatures. This will all be bundled together as the Galactic Tour: Magnetar Circuit.
Inside this collection of DreadBall awesome sauce, you’ll find a new supplement, cards, tokens, three new support assistants and an MVP/ref. We’ll dive into each of these in more detail below.
The Magnetar Circuit supplement will include:
Rules for three new support assistants
Four new themed pitches on different planets: Cavlax VI (swamp pitch), New Atlantea (underwater pitch), Ovostar-2 (sky pitch) and Memphis Max (casino)
New card deck with special cards for each pitch
Tokens for each pitch
Historic matches on each of the four pitches
Errata for existing teams
The errata for the existing teams is one of the most exciting elements. Since launch the DreadBall RC and Mantic have been keeping a close eye on the performance of teams. Any that we felt were a little bit below the curve have been given a small tweak to help them perform better on the pitch. The lists in the supplement will be considered as the tournament legal teams once released.
Plus there seems to be a new scifi sportsgame in playtesting, rumored to be a wrestling game with Starplayers.
Would be really cool to have something else to use your MVPs for. They are so criminally underused aside a handful obvious ones (buzzcut for example).
If the new book has the same satirical edge as previous Dreadball books, I’m in for that. The miniatures are also fantastic for Sci fi or superhero conversions.
Crazy Bobby has been forced to isolate this year - nothing do with COVID, it's just for everyone's safety - so we're doing something a little different for our Black Friday sale. Use the code BLACKFRIDAY50 to get 50% off ALL digital products. This is a great chance to bolster your digital collection.
Are there any great background books that have come out in the last year? I was waiting in the RPG for Pannithor but I’d be interested in reading more about Deadzone.
DREADBALL – MAGNETAR CIRCUIT 2021 is a BIG year for DreadBall because we’ve got a brand-new supplement – the Magnetar Circuit. This has actually been something we’ve been discussing for a long-time here at Mantic and we’re delighted to finally see the release on the horizon.
Inside you’ll find four new arenas (which we’ll go into in a moment), new Support Specialists, new historic matches and an errata for all the previously published teams… including Renton’s Rejects. First up, let’s reveal a little more about those arenas!
CAVLAX VI (SWAMP PITCH) – this takes place on a dangerous planet where vines can grow across the pitch. What’s more, the bad reputation of the arena means it’s harder to attract the crowds, so it’s going to be tough to rack up the cheers!
NEW ATLANTEA (UNDERWATER PITCH) – ever wondered what it would be like to play DreadBall underwater? Well, New Atlantea is the answer! On this pitch you’ll have to deal with changing currents that can affect the game in different ways each Rush.
OVOSTAR-2 (SKY PITCH) – as if DreadBall wasn’t already dangerous enough, what if you were playing dozens of kilometres in the sky? Oh… and there’s nothing to stop players falling to their death off the edge. Thankfully BrenMed Industries is on-hand to give Players a free cryorevision… and sometimes Players even come back alive (mostly).
MEMPHIS MAX (CASINO PITCH) – teams always need a lot of cash to stay competitive, so the option to earn some extra funds through gambling is always a welcome opportunity. However, you’ll need to watch out for Thoth, a new ref that likes to keep a close eye on illegal plays.
For each of these new arenas, we’ve put together a historic match featuring some classic teams. Therefore, if you want to see how you would have fared in some of the greatest matches ever – make sure you pick up this supplement.
TEAMS ERRATA
One of the most exciting elements of Magnetar Circuit is that ALL the published teams are re-printed in the book. The rules committee and Mantic have also been going through the teams to see which ones needed a bit of love and attention *cough* Veer-myn *cough*
Even if your favourite team hasn’t been changed, having all the stats in a slightly smaller book is going to make it a lot easier to carry around, particularly when attending tournaments – assuming they can ever happen again.
We really want a supplement like Magnetar Circuit to become a regular release – like Clash of Kings for Kings of War or Command Protocols for Deadzone – but for that we really need the support of DreadBall fans! So, please make sure you pre-order from your FLGS or direct from Mantic. In fact, we’re making the pre-orders live today on the Mantic site, so you can order right NOW. Like, literally this second. We’ll be back closer to release with gameplay videos of the arenas and the Support Specialists, so you can see how it shakes up the game!
MAGNETAR MARVELS As well as the new supplement, you can also pre-order the new miniatures.
The Magnetar Marvels set features all three Support Specialists and Thoth the MVP/ref. They’re made in beautiful resin, so those details are going to be CRISP. You can pre-order here. It’s worth it, just for Flurple.
LAST HURRAH MVPS Finally, have you read The Last Hurrah by Robert E. Waters? It’s the new DreadBall novel from Winged Hussar Publishing. Here’s the blurb:
Ex Corporation Striker Leeland Roth teeters on the horns of a dilemma: return to the sport that once defined his life, or continue to drown his sorrows in booze, babes, and back alleys. The choice is not as simple as it may seem, for Roth cannot shake the crippling guilt that plagues him day after day. But a new opportunity has arisen, and the lure of the spotlight, the drama, the fans, and the money, may bring him out of the shadows.
Roth must now cobble together a team of nobodies and coach them to glory in a thirty-two-team tournament that promises big rewards for the winner. Along the way, he will face a battalion of dangers: death, injury, Digby corruption, corporate greed, familial hatreds, bribery, rebellion, and even the limitations of his own abilities as a coach. Can this former DreadBall star rise to the occasion, or will this be his last hurrah?
As a little treat for those that have read it, the DreadBall RC has created stat cards for two of the novels’ stars, which you can use in your games!
So, as you can see, plenty to get excited about for DreadBall in 2021. Have you order the supplement yet? What about now? Now? NOOOOW?
WARPATH UNIVERSE So far during our Christmas Blogs, we’ve covered plenty of details about games set in our Pannithor universe and a number of you are probably asking “BUT WHAT’S HAPPENING WITH SCI-FI?” Ok, wow – you’re actually shouting it, imaginary blog reader. Well, short story is… there’s plenty happening with sci-fi in 2021. Great, we’ll finish there. Thanks for reading today’s blog.
Oh, you want more than that? Ok, we’ll go into a little more detail. The truth is a lot of sci-fi goodness will be coming your way later in the year, so it’s a little too early to talk about too much now. BUT we do have some fun stuff coming up soon. Let’s take a look!
DEADZONE As you may know, it seems like forever that the Deadzone two-player set has been out of stock. Throughout lockdown we had numerous issues keeping the miniatures in supply. Then we got the minis… and ran out of the rulebook. We are putting this down to ‘the 2020 phenomenon’!
However, this did give us an opportunity to take a look at the two-player set and decide what was best to keep it in stock. We decided that we would mostly keep the contents the same, but there will be a small change to the rulebook. To be honest, a large portion of the rulebook is now out of date because of Escalation, which includes the latest faction stats and scenarios.
With that in mind, we decided the rulebook is a little surplus to requirements because a lot of the stuff you’ll be referencing during games is included in Escalation. So the revised two-player set will now include
a digital version of the rulebook
a free physical copy of Escalation
a free digital copy of Escalation too!
We think this is a great way to get into the game, and make sure you have the most up to date army lists!
We’re expecting it to be back in stock VERY soon!
ARTIFICERS During the Open Day, we also teased a new sub faction: Forge Father Artificers. We haven’t got a lot more to announce about the release date, but take a look at their new leader… the Master Artificer!
We are super excited about the Artificers and can’t wait to get them out to you.
NEW MINI COMMAND PROTOCOLS In 2020 we released a mini Command Protocols, which was a PDF that included stats for the Spectra, Matsudan and some amended stats for existing units. In early(ish) 2021 we’re planning another mini Command Protocols that will introduce some of the new Kings of War Ratkin models into Deadzone.
We’re also planning a slight boost to the Mazon Labs with some CYBORGS! Honestly, Mazon Labs is a totally legitimate corporation that just wants to help people… nothing sinister going on there. The revised stats for the Mazon Labs and Veer-myn will be available as a free download in Q2.
FIREFIGHT A while back Ronnie mentioned that we’ve been taking a look at the rules for Firefight to tighten them up a bit and make sure it’s easier to make the transition from Deadzone into Firefight, which is a slightly larger-scale sci-fi wargame.
It’s still being worked on, and we will need lots of folks to help with play testing… sssssssoooooooo you might want to start painting up those awesome sci-fi vehicles. Just sayin’
DREADBALL SPIN-OFF Finally, it’s normally Ronnie that leaks all our new releases, but this time Rob’s loose lips have sunk the spaceship. He mentioned something codenamed: ‘Arena Wars’ – a DreadBall spin-off that’s focused on arena-based, gladiatorial combat.
We’ll have PLENTY more on this later in the year but, until then, you can start drooling over this new miniature… the Tigrax. Hang on, isn’t that a giant base from DreadBall? This is getting curiouser and curiouser.
From the stream today:
last time they took the Warpath rules and scaled them down, which was not the game that people expected
this time they chose the use the Deadzone rules and scale them up, while taking advantage from the other games that were developed in between, hence it uses D8 as well as the same power dice as KoW Vanguard
Game size is aimed at 1000-1500 points with the current Mega Army Sets (130€) played on 4x4 to 6x4 (or 3x3 for smaller games) which fits well to the 2 sizes for Deadzone (2x2 and 2x4)
The public Beta is there to break the game and get as much feedback as possible (FB group for now with Google form following later)
The main concept behind Firefight Second Edition is that we wanted a game that scaled up from Deadzone, rather than scaled down from Warpath. In fact, Firefight Second Edition started as Deadzone XL, which Andy playtested at the Mantic Open Day a few years ago.
- Uses D8s rather than D6s, No exploding 8s
- 1,000 point games (mega army boxset type size 60 models ish) 4x4 table can scale down to 3x3 and up to 6x4
- Unit based game
- Individual model removal
- Firefight orders still in game
- Deadzone commander type orders - Vanguard style command dice
- Measurements not cubes - measure from unit leader
- Competitive and Narrative type games
- Not a Warpath replacement which remains it's own thing
- Initial 4 playtest factions more to be added
You might also need some miniatures too! Well, we’re pleased to say that for the rest of April you can use the code FIREFIGHTPLAYTEST to get 20% off any Warpath Mega Force, Warpath Starter Force or Warpath Reserve Force. The latter, in particular, is a great way to upgrade your Deadzone strike team. One thing to note, the Warpath sets won’t start shipping until April 26th because we need to build them!
Having followed the development closely over the last two years, this is the 28mm game sci-fi game I want to be playing.
It's a complete rewrite from a different rules base, going for fast games with small model counts roughly equal to 2nd edition 40k, 30-40 minis and a few vehicles on average.
Heavy focus on tactics with assault reactions, going to ground and just lots of different possible things for a unit to do. Command dice completely different to deadzone or warpath, instead uses a command point spending system like in vanguard.
In terms of 40k comparisons, 3rd edition is probably the closest to it in overall style, but with d8's instead of d6 for greater stat ranges, command dice system, alternate activations and a greater variety of meaningful choices to make with a unit.
In terms of 40k comparisons, 3rd edition is probably the closest to it in overall style, but with d8's instead of d6 for greater stat ranges, command dice system, alternate activations and a greater variety of meaningful choices to make with a unit.
this sound really promising, not the 40k reference in general but that there is a variety of meaningful choices
Very interesting. I backed the Warpath Kickstarter mainly interested in Firefight, but 40K 8th edition dropped right before a received my box. Alas, most of my gaming group mistook a better 40K for a good game and I never got to try Firefight 1e.
Quite interested in a Firefight that's based more on Deadzone, as I love Deadzone.
Psychopomp wrote: Very interesting. I backed the Warpath Kickstarter mainly interested in Firefight, but 40K 8th edition dropped right before a received my box. Alas, most of my gaming group mistook a better 40K for a good game and I never got to try Firefight 1e.
Quite interested in a Firefight that's based more on Deadzone, as I love Deadzone.
Yeah I was the same.
Though by now, most of the stuff I got for a larger list has been sold off (bright side it paid off the KS cost, so now everything left was free).
Most of what I have is 2-3 DZ sized factions, but too small Warpath/Firefight.
yeah the original Firefight had some bad timing and decisions on the rules (being made to be a better 40k on players request at the end of 7th and released around when 8th hit so most players went for the original better 40k)
for me Firefight has a lot of potential as the other game that fills the same spot is Star Wars Legion and I am not a big Star Wars fan (enough to play X-Wing as I like space fighter combat, but not enough to go down that rabbit hole)
and the 1000 point/platoon sized game is the right spot for me to get everything I would like to have in an army without needing too much of it (building/converting 1 tank is fun, knowing that you need to make 4 more to get a good army list is not)
I have been involved with Mantic in lots of ways for the last five years. I was involved in the development Kings of War: Vanguard and a number of other bits for Star Saga. However, the main thing I have been involved with is Deadzone – and I have been the rules committee chairperson for the last three years. During this time I think it’s fair to say the game has been rejuvenated by the release of Command Protocols: Outbreak, which was then quickly followed up by Escalation. Some of you may already have heard rumours that there is a lot of new stuff coming for Deadzone soon as well… although that’s for another time.
I am also one of the people behind the Weight of Fire YouTube channel and podcast, so you will see content coming out on there about Firefight too!
Why a second edition?
I think it’s fair to say that while the first edition of Firefight was a really good game, it didn’t quite have the impact of a new launch. Although the Kickstarter managed to fund a lot of good hard plastic troops and, most importantly, vehicles – the game itself never really gained a large player base.
Therefore, Mantic felt that a new edition of the game, which built on the growth and success of Deadzone would be a better approach than the first edition format of a new dice and style mechanic, which may have worked well for the larger scale Warpath game. To this end they asked me as an experienced Deadzone player and RC chair to lead the development of the new Firefight.
What are the main differences?
I think it’s important to be clear though that Firefight is not Deadzone and, likewise, it is not Firefight: First Edition. It is, to some extent, a hybrid of the two with a lot of aspects of other Mantic games and other non-Mantic games I play thrown in for good measure. So if you see something and think ‘that’s not how it plays in Deadzone or Firefight’ then it’s quite probable that it’s been done intentionally but, of course, please feedback in the playtest group in case something hasn’t been considered!
My original approach to this game was to make it fun, fast and streamlined. So you’re able to play in a reasonably short time, without taking up a huge space – but with the ability to scale up to larger games, if people want. A lot of the simplicity of play comes from some aspects of Deadzone but there are a number of new features in here too.
This is why you may have noticed there are fundamental differences between Firefight: First Edition and Second Edition. The most obvious being the use of D8s and the change of command dice to Power Dice from Vanguard. In a similar way the leader being the sole point for movement and shooting is a big deviation from First Edition. That, along with movement being standard and keywords describing changes to how a unit works, are all ways of simplifying the time at the table. In a similar vein keeping similar terminology between multiple Mantic systems was decided upon to keep people feeling that they’re in familiar territory. The use of Nerve was also in this style to be somewhat like how it works in KoW, where when a unit is severely damaged it may disappear completely so there are less units of 1-2 models hanging around the table- which visually, sometimes look a bit sad.
Overall though I feel these changes make for a fun and interactive game, which should keep both players engaged throughout the round and have to make multiple decisions about which units they activate, along with how to use their rare Command Points – which I’ll cover in a future blog.
Has the game been available to playtest before?
The alpha group has been running for over a year and includes members who were sworn to secrecy or Rob would send his murder goblins to their house. The members of this group were principally people I knew would be able to contribute fair and balanced feedback during early development. It was intentionally a small group and has been essential to getting the game to where it is now.
Where are my minis and where is the cool new stuff?
You will notice when all the beta lists are released that some profiles or game styles have been removed or changed. There is a good reason for this, which is to make the game more streamlined or to replicate more closely how units work in Deadzone. Finally, it might be because the models are no longer available or are hard to get hold of.
Of course, I’m sure that Mantic will have some surprises up its sleeve for new models… but these have to remain top secret for now. But let me say the [REDACTED REDACTED] is great and I love the [REDACTED REDACTED] and the upcoming [REDACTED REDACTED] are just superb!
What’s the purpose of the beta?
The beta is principally to refine the rules as they are to make the game as enjoyable as possible. I envisage this will mostly be around wording or keywords and rules, as well as refining the cost and profiles of units in the game. All feedback is welcome and even if it’s not the direction we feel the game should take it doesn’t devalue your contribution at all.
For example, there’s a been a lot of talk in the playtest group about climbing buildings or shooting from on top of buildings. Because we had been playing a lot of alpha games in Universal Battle it was hard to recreate this sense of space, so it didn’t really come up. However, I really appreciate the suggestions that have been made by people so far and it’s ensured I take another look at the building rules for Second Edition.
To this end I keep a running doc of all the changes I have made based on feedback received and this will be released at regular intervals to control the number of versions we have floating around. The next version of the rules and profiles along with a new faction release (Asterians) will be on the first weekend of May.
This beta is likely to run for quite a long time and so there will be plenty of opportunities to get games in as the world situation continues to evolve. We are planning a playtest day at Mantic HQ in the summer for those who can make it (dates to follow in due course).
What else can you do? Well, just carry on doing what you’re doing really; engaging and encouraging the development of the game by talking about the rules, playing games and showing off the minis you are working on, not just in this playtest group but in any other Facebook and club groups you are in. This will encourage others to dig out their minis or even start a new army!
Autumn 2021 - retail release - up to 6 players - reuses existing DB Giants in core box
- Dreadball half time Gladiatorial game between Giant players
- No ball
- King of the hill type game - 1 active scoring zone get your player into it - extreme musical chairs
- Ultimate game modes - Pass the bomb, Capture the flag, Invade, Killstreak, Dodge Brawl
originally a halftime show for Dreadball, now it is a game of its own
each arena has a fixed set of players from whom the trainers select from (alternating)
in a league game (or tournament) each coach has his fixed team of 6 players, from whom he chooses 3, again alternating with the opponent and no player can occur twice (i.e. if the 1st trainer chooses Dozer and the 2nd trainer also has Dozer in his team, he can no longer use it)
alternating activation of the players, 4 activations per trainer per rush, each player can be activated up to 2 times, OverDrive ability 1 time per rush, and there are 8 rush per game, scoring zone randomly changes each rush
playtime about 60-90 minutes (they played a League in 1 day in HQ during playtesting)
additional players will be released in packs of 2 players (and will also receive MVP rules for Dreadball)
Pre-order starts in July / August, release in September (pre-order exclusive score markers)
Automatically Appended Next Post: End of Stream Teaser:
old sculpsts, but not sure of they pack the old models in the box or make new ones
it was mentioned that Giraldez got the old PVC ones because they were to ones available by the time for the promo pics, which hints that there are new ones in the box (and the promo pics only use the real minis, the other stuff is rendered so I guess it is currently in production and they don't have something real to show yet)
Mantic uses the softer and coloured boardgame plastic for their boxed games so I hope they keep this and make new models for the game
I had just got the last of the giants off eBay! Although, probably a lot cheaper than getting them with overdrive.
Can't say I'm that interested. In it though. Dreadball is great, and I think I'd rather just play more dreadball than overdrive. Although, I've got an extreme pitch, which this looks identical too, so I might already have everything but the rules...
Ronnie had previously said that deadzone 3.0 was on the cards... Command protocols 3.0 goes against this!
Deadzone 3 with rats again? Would have been a nice opportunity to start working on a proper bug people army, weren't they supposed to be one of the big baddies of the setting?
lord_blackfang wrote: Deadzone 3 with rats again? Would have been a nice opportunity to start working on a proper bug people army, weren't they supposed to be one of the big baddies of the setting?
v3 already?
Sigh... we started with cards, multiple expansion books, then moved to command dice instead of cards, and more expansion books. I wonder what will change for the sake of it this time? I'm all for improving editions by incorporating errata, but I feel like I'm on the GW merry-go-round with Mantic now.
Does it need another version? As far as I can tell it just needs the rulebook updating with the latest model stats and errata.
the last interview with Ronnie said exactly that, to re-do the starter set and update the core book
and it was also said that some of the new KoW units for Ratkin will make their way to Veer-Myn
I just expect a new Core Book with updated rules to have everything in one place and a new Starter Set
kodos wrote: the last interview with Ronnie said exactly that, to re-do the starter set and update the core book
and it was also said that some of the new KoW units for Ratkin will make their way to Veer-Myn
I just expect a new Core Book with updated rules to have everything in one place and a new Starter Set
Which would be a good choice.
Hyping "a new edition" is all the thing these days thanks to GW. It may draw some new people in. But I'm sure there's many people that when it gets a year into an edition, not bother because they worry their stuff will be out of date, because it will soon be time for another new edition. Not to mention all the current players who would rather spend hobby money on models (or a new faction) than replacing books.
I guess GW have set the bar for other games companies (and hobbyists) into thinking a churn and burn cycle means "supported".
As said above, mantic have stated the next edition of deadzone would just be a clean up, merging the errata into the core book.
Hopefully they'll fix the minefield of typos as well. And the campaign system needs an overhaul. There's also scope for newer artificial stupidity rules, but probably best left for an expansion.
Given the size of the last command protocols book, the campaign system could probably come out of the core book and be a separate book. That would allow it a broader scope, adding loads of custom scenarios and solo rules (incorporating the stupidity rules).
Do they have any great typos? Dropfleet, for example, made a special edition miniature of their most famous typo, Traffic James. I’d love to see Mantic embrace their silliness in a similar manner.
Sadly not. The core book just reads like it wasn't proof read. From what I remember, there was a mistake on roughly half of the pages. It's been a while since I've done anything but double check a rule from it though.
Back in the day White Wolf was infamous for this. They'd constantly forget to update their placeholder references so you'd have 'See page XX' all over the place.
Later at the end of a book they put in a full page with the text "This is Page XX, we know you've been looking for it".
It looks interesting, but it will all be down to price - my guess would be £50, which is a lot for me given my backlog of stuff, but is probably about right for most people. Ill probably wait for a sale, although I don't need any of the old giants.
If it ends up being £75 or more I think I'll flop hard.
Great to see loads of promotion for the game - shame the rest of the universe doesn't get this much attention! Dreadball itself could do with some advertising, as well as finally releasing the ultimate expansion. Deadzone is an awesome game that hasn't been tried by nearly enough people, and could be used to promote Firefight and Warpath.
they searched for a new/additional social media guy some weeks agao
so we should see a more/better marketing in that regard soon
for Overdrive, I like what I have seen so far, it more less now depends on how often we get new expansions for the game as I can see people waiting for more options before they want to try it
I must admit it's growing on me, but I've got 8 giants already, 5 of which are in the core box, so it feels a bit of a waste to buy. We'll see if the rules get released separately (mantic normally do release them, although it often takes time, and normally it's a reduced set first, then the full set when the games older).
Who knows, I might be able to use the dreadball extreme pitch, free rules and my existing giants!
for now they have planned 16 Characters and some of them will get rules for Deadzone as well to continue the story line (like Tigrex were some of the background was already mentioned in Magnetar Circuit)
They cleaned up some stuff. Been a long time since I played first though. Been trying to get our smaller group to try dz2 since new kill team is a non starter for most of us due to the $100-$135 buy in. Really impressed with the campaign leveling system. You get new options without going overboard on record keeping.
So is this a DZ v3? I stopped following Mantic scifi and it doesn't matter how often I email subscribe to the newsletter, nothing seems to get sent.
My wife and I played DZ v1 every Friday night for months. I couldn't get her to enjoy v2. Changing from playing cards from her hand to the dice roll thing killed it for her. I did buy into v2 with a couple of the hardback rulebooks, the update paperbacks, dice, etc, which are all barely used. Played a few v1 games over the year or so but that's it.
I doubt I'll buy into another version if that's what this is. I must admit, my Mantic interest has dropped off with the realisation they're on a GW churn and burn style sales strategy.
I also had truoble getting into DZ2. DZ1 had its issues, but the mechanic that allowed you to pin enemies with covering fire and flank with other troops to get clear shots was great. That effectively went away in DZ2.
yeah, the change was not well received for those that really were into DZ1, while a lot of other people liked the DZ2 more because there were no cards
For now we don't know if this is DZ3 or just an update to DZ2 with a new Core Box and Rulebook (as while the core is still up to date, faction lists and other rules are not)
Could also be that we see a different mechanic for orders again as not everyone is happy with the Splash mechanic
I don't have any illusions they're rolling back to the superior 1st edition rules. I guess I'm mostly hoping for a new sprue or two. Albeit the teaser seems to say it's just the rats again. Should have made a Nameless or locust-man sprue for this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So by pure coincidence Mantic announces hard plastic Ork Kommandos.
.Mikes. wrote: I also had truoble getting into DZ2. DZ1 had its issues, but the mechanic that allowed you to pin enemies with covering fire and flank with other troops to get clear shots was great. That effectively went away in DZ2.
.Mikes. wrote: I also had truoble getting into DZ2. DZ1 had its issues, but the mechanic that allowed you to pin enemies with covering fire and flank with other troops to get clear shots was great. That effectively went away in DZ2.
They got rid of pinning?!
No. You can still pin. You have to use a rapid fire weapon and purposely try to pin as your result.
If you are successful, the target is pinned, requiring an action to stand first thing on its next activation.
Pinning also gives a bonus to anyone who fights you while you're in that state (but you stand up automatically---just with them gettting a bonus to sock you).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
VBS wrote: Looking good. Like the new layout and separating rules/lists.
New models too. Brood Guards are impressive, and plastic Marauders is great news!
Separating the rules from army lists is a negative for me. I like that DZ2 essentially has the core armies covered in the rule book.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Psychopomp wrote: Dammit, Mantic. The guy with most of the information shouldn't be leaning way back from the microphone in an echo chamber.
We've all been doing Zoom and Teams meetings for almost two years now. Get your sound together.
Separating the rules from army lists is a negative for me. I like that DZ2 essentially has the core armies covered in the rule book.
I also liked the rules and stats all in one nice small hardback book, but then the expansion books come out with extra stats and corrections.
I think having a fixed rulebook and a single yearly (or longer) updatable stats book would actually be good.
I just hope it never becomes individual faction codex style like GW's awful churn and burn system.
Until now, the new Supplements replaced the old ones, in Deadzone as well as in KoW.
Some rules were not carried over for different reasons, but you always only needed the latest book and not all of them
wich was kind of a problem because you needed the Hardcover for the rules, but the force lists inside were replaced with those in the Escalation book
For similar reasons, Studio Tomahawk split the SAGA rules into core rules and force lists with 2nd Edition as it is easier to keep them up to date
I saw the announcement and thought "this might be when I give mantic a go, they're usually far cheaper than gw and while the quality isn't as high, I'll give it a whirl" but at 90 smackers, not a chance.
So the super bundle just has double terrain and not the PVC objectives, neoprene mat or acrylic tokens (which seem to be only available in the Veteran Bundle for some reason).
Amazing! I had not been following this at all and was complaining this past Saturday night (game night) to a buddy about Mantic not doing much with DZ. Well, here we are! I pre-ordered the starter bundle and the two new neoprene mats. I really like the GCPS Urban guys but will wait for discount retail on them.
NAVARRO wrote: The minis are a bit ruined by the large heads.
Head looks about right for a person in armor, there needs to be space for nose and ears and well..head in those buckets that is usually ignored by sculptors.
2nd Edi for 70€
10+10 models
Paper Mat
tokens, dice
Ruine Set
3rd Edi for 105€
10+12 models
2 heroes
Paper Mat
tokens, dice
Terrain Booster Set
it looks like double the amount of terrain (+ ~35€), 2 full starter armies (the same as you can buy stand alone instead of just 2 plastic frames each) including 2 heroes (+ ~15-20€), so it is more expensive than the old one but you also get more (comparing to the 1st Edition set which was also more expensive but had the neoprene mat inside)
and still save money as the terrain and models are worth 140€
Dudeface wrote: I saw the announcement and thought "this might be when I give mantic a go, they're usually far cheaper than gw and while the quality isn't as high, I'll give it a whirl" but at 90 smackers, not a chance.
To be fair, that is £35 cheaper than GW's equivalent.
I do wonder how much a "bag" of terrain is, I have a feeling it means 1 sprue, so 4 wall panels, and the new speak is mean to obfuscate that you get less than before...
Dudeface wrote: I saw the announcement and thought "this might be when I give mantic a go, they're usually far cheaper than gw and while the quality isn't as high, I'll give it a whirl" but at 90 smackers, not a chance.
To be fair, that is £35 cheaper than GW's equivalent.
Yeah but look at the two units in the gw box with all their options, the vastly chunkier and nicer terrain and the solid card play area instead of a paper sheet.
For once the gw offering feels like it's worth the difference I think is my problem. If mantic came out around the £70 mark, that would have made a statement and I'd have bought in. Instead I'd rather find the extra for kill team.
Dudeface wrote: I saw the announcement and thought "this might be when I give mantic a go, they're usually far cheaper than gw and while the quality isn't as high, I'll give it a whirl" but at 90 smackers, not a chance.
To be fair, that is £35 cheaper than GW's equivalent.
Yeah but look at the two units in the gw box with all their options, the vastly chunkier and nicer terrain and the solid card play area instead of a paper sheet.
For once the gw offering feels like it's worth the difference I think is my problem. If mantic came out around the £70 mark, that would have made a statement and I'd have bought in. Instead I'd rather find the extra for kill team.
Well it's unfortunately a strained world and they did have a price rise recently. So as much as I can't blame you for voting with your wallet, I can't blame them for trying to cover their costs (presumably).
Dudeface wrote: I saw the announcement and thought "this might be when I give mantic a go, they're usually far cheaper than gw and while the quality isn't as high, I'll give it a whirl" but at 90 smackers, not a chance.
To be fair, that is £35 cheaper than GW's equivalent.
Yeah but look at the two units in the gw box with all their options, the vastly chunkier and nicer terrain and the solid card play area instead of a paper sheet.
For once the gw offering feels like it's worth the difference I think is my problem. If mantic came out around the £70 mark, that would have made a statement and I'd have bought in. Instead I'd rather find the extra for kill team.
Well it's unfortunately a strained world and they did have a price rise recently. So as much as I can't blame you for voting with your wallet, I can't blame them for trying to cover their costs (presumably).
Ahh I don't follow them that closely, but I do still want them to do well. My concern is other outsiders like myself will make that direct like for like comparison and make the same call. I also regret not getting in at the launch of 2nd Ed.
The new KT box has the better terrain (if you like Orc terrain) and board, while I see the model advantage on Deadzone as those are multi-pose plastic models with options
I'd rate Deadzone terrain as having better in-game functionality tho, even if it looks like a pre-fab paintball course. Or maybe because of that. There's probably a reason why paintball courses are laid out that way.
I'd like to give this a go but the Veermyn just look terrible to me, whilst the GCPS are just so so. But I think for 90 quid, plus the inevitable FLGS discount if you shop around it is not too bad. The main negative to me, beyond my dislike of the look of the 2 factions in the starter, is the paper gaming mat. That just seems incredibly old fashioned in 2021.
But best of luck to Mantic on this release. I was there from the start with their KOW Elves and Undead and it is good to have them still around.
lord_blackfang wrote:I do wonder how much a "bag" of terrain is, I have a feeling it means 1 sprue, so 4 wall panels, and the new speak is mean to obfuscate that you get less than before...
at least from the pictures it looks like the same amount as in the other 70€ sets and it is definitely more terrain than in the 2nd Edi 2 Player Set
lord_blackfang wrote:So the super bundle just has double terrain and not the PVC objectives, neoprene mat or acrylic tokens (which seem to be only available in the Veteran Bundle for some reason).
Weird release.
KTO has better minis, better terrain, and a better play area. However, IMO, it is a pretty bad game compared to DZ. And that’s what really matters, to me anyway.
I don't really have a feeling how much terrain was where and when... I must have sunk 500€ into Deadzone terrain at Kickstarter prices so I can probably cover a living room floor and my perception of price and content is pretty skewed. But I have a feeling there was a time when 70€ was more than 12 "bags" (sprues?) which probably amounts to 30-40 panels plus bitz so I'd really like to see a real breakdown, like there is on the old terrain packs in the web shop.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Well, I might be wrong on the value, this old 70€ retail pack has 12 sprues of panels plus bitz, so about the same if 1 bag is 1 sprue.
I think they will have a hard time with the inevitable comparison shopping. Spend $200 for a game you won’t have to beg someone to play (regardless of whether dead zone is a more solid design) OR $125 for kinda meh models, paper mat and having to song and dance every time you want to get someone to try it.
Throw in buying from 20% off discount sites and it’s comparing a $160 popular set to $100 of off brand.
I agree that DZ is even the better game and seems easier to play/teach. But GW’s market saturation gives them a big head start on convincing people that they will be able to play with more people regularly than just the demo monkey. I don’t like it but it’s just the state of things
if someone already decided to only go with GW games, they won't consider it anyway no matter the price
and also KT games are not that easy to find as it had a hard start with the compedium and being very different from the previous versions (so one might need some dancing to convince people to play the new version over the old one as well)
but doing a more detailed comparision (and personal rating)
KT VS DZ
Box:
- terrain: bulkier, Ork themed VS generic human, modular - equal (both have advantages/disadvantages, similar amount)
- board: cardboard VS paper - 1:0
- models:
design is personal taste , Orks VS Rats and World War 1 VS Modern themed humans - equal
quality is tricky but the mold lines on the Orks are just bad were the Mantic models have softer edges - equal
Monopose with weapon options VS Multipose with options for weapons and alternate builds (different troop types for both) - 0:1 = 0:1/3
- Rules: full Core Rules + lists for the teams in the box VS full Core Rules and all faction lists - 0:1
- Gaming Aids: everything needed VS everything needed - equal
- Price: 155€ VS 105€ - 0:1
starting without Box:
- stand alone boards: cardboard (40€) VS neopren (35€) - 0:1
- rules: Core Rules + Compendium + Cards + Gaming Aids = 111€ VS Rules (include faction lists and marker) + Command Dice + D8 = 60€ - 0:1
terrain: box terrain not available VS Terrain Booster 70€
Mechanicus terrain, including board 120€ VS Industrial Zone, without board
- models: box models not available, no dedicated KT boxes (any more) VS Faction Starter/Booster (35€) - 0:1
My conclusion:
Start with the core box is equal, you get everything you need although the written rules are much easier to understand for DZ than with KT and DZ is slightly cheaper
If one does not like the core box models and want to play/start with a different faction or is the 3rd person in a group that wants to start, the options for KT are very limited and going without the box is not really possible.
It also looks like the game is focused on boxed game releases and we won't see the dedicated Kill Teams as stand alone releases for some time.
Also DZ has the advantage of long term support here as it is a "main" game for Mantic were previous versions of KT were not really in focus for GW after the initial hype and if the boxes sold out there was no re-print
also the game changed a lot over time and it is more like the same name for different game than an ongoing game development
so hard to guess what happens with KT and if it is still there in 2023 were DZ will be around for while
It's a really straightforward upgrade if you've got 1st or 2nd edition, rulebooks come bundled with counters and that's all you really need.
The veteran bundle for £50 is pretty good, two books, counters, acrylic loot counters, selection of 3d objectives for use in the scenarios. As someone overflowing with DZ minis and terrain, that works nicely and is all I need.
3rd edition at this point is more about a refresh and consolidation of the rules with a lot of clean-up done and points values tightened up as much as possible (a lot of work goes into making sure there aren't any trash-tier or broken units).
Quite similar to the process of KoW 3rd edition.
It's also a lead-in to Firefight which will be the next big thing (complete rules overhaul with more in common with deadzone, all the bloat stripped out, going for a genuine 40k competitor with rules simplicity and fast gameplay as the draw).
If you've followed Mantic's sci-fi offerings for a while but never bought in, this is probably the best time for it, there's a lot planned, a lot of the factions have multiple hard plastic kits and vehicles, with a lot more to come (Orc Marauders!) now that Mantic is churning out quality sprues regularly without the need to kickstart them.
One advantage of not having any other miniatures enthusiasts within 500km or so is that I get to decide what games get played. I will absolutely get the new rules, and probably a new neoprene mat, as well. Having gone all in on the first DZ Kickstarter, I don't really need anything else to play.
Miguelsan wrote:From your place to mine there are less than 500km on a straight line!
M.
500km is from here to Tokyo. Where are you located?
.Mikes. wrote:I suppose that means he gets to say what games you play.
That sounds fair to me!
Kobe. About 800 km but that's following the roads.
M.
That's on the other side of the JR East/JR West divide, which is almost the same as being in another country Someday, when Covid finally goes away, we'll have to get together for a game or three.
Current los rules are one of the things I brag about dz rules. Can I see any part of the target? Yes or no. No fractions. No wondering if the rifle would be invisible if only the model were holding it down at a slightly lower angle.
no but I am gonna paint one yellow and call it "beardy Ripley"
PS: for the simply reason that the Mech is designed to have an optional closed front makes it look less like a Baby Carrier as the Pilot is inside and not hanging on the front
for the same reason the Matrix Mechs looks cool
PPS: while thinking about it, I guess I need two of them, a "beardy Ripley" melee version and "beardy Mifune" with 2 guns
Is this a new FF faction, or the artificers are just extra for them?
They already had the armoured guys, then the more like mechanic plain guys whose names escape me, right?
Is the new FF subfaction, although we don't know yet how the subfaction are going to work in 3rd Edition (if you can mix and match like you want or not)
they have the standard FF Clan Warriors, the Brokkrs (the one Clan that tried to be friends with the humans, in the progress lost everything and is now a nomadic tribe within the human sphere) and now the technical/mining guys
I like the look of all them to be fair.
Especially Doc Oc forge father.
My only issue are Mantic's paint schemes. They're painted very well, but they just seem to be missing a colour to make them pop.
A few tufts or bits on the plain bases would help too. I've been noticing that on KoW stuff recently. Even a green tuft would add that extra bit of colour to the model.
the small little details in design make the difference between a baby carrier and a suitable/working mech
Article about Keywords, nothing special just the obvious clean up like re-naming abbilities, rules, equipment (that there is a difference between a Fight Action and Fight stat, so now it is an Assault Action, that not all Heavy Weapons used the Heavy special rules etc.)
No, because he's actually enclosed, not like a Baby Carrier. The er, popular definition of a Baby Carrier mech is that you have the pilot strapped to the front of a mech, with their limbs hanging out.
I will say that I don't think people have looked at the "baby carrier" from GW lately that are ok with this and hate that. The current GW models is standing on platforms not legs dangling. And slapping armored plates over his legs is the same as the enclosed version of this.
That said I don't like these design though they aren't terrible. I do love the Doc Oc dude and may just get him for some conversions
the Sister Mechs already look better than the original GK Baby Carrier, but there Raging Heroes had already made Mechs in that style for SoB and those look better
This is the new Intro/Beginner Scenario which is now very different from what it was in 2nd Edition.
in 2nd it took several pages from the rulebook with full pre-made teams on the main board
this time it is on the backside of paper board, halved size with all the rules needed being there for both players
this looks a lot better than the old version, and of course is not useful for anyone who already is into wargames in general while very good for first time players (X-Wing had something similar)
Before we head into 2022, we have recently released a brand-new Rivals Pack: Alpha Simian versus Gnaw. These are two of the most agile players in the game and are perfect for coaches that prefer speed over slamming. You can read a little more about how Gnaw and Alpha Simian play in our previous locker room blogs.
In 2022, we’ve got three more Rivals Packs to release, as you can see in the roadmap above. First on the schedule is The Bug versus Big Mech. This is a really interesting Rivals Pack, as both players have very different styles. The Bug is more defensive, with unusual bursts of speed that can catch your opponent off guard. Meanwhile, Big Mech is one of the only players in the game that can have an extra activation played immediately after its first activation. Again, this is a really interesting way to mess with your opposing coach.
OVERDRIVE ORGANISED PLAY
OverDrive is the perfect game for organised play. You don’t need any terrain, it hardly takes up any space on the gaming table, and you can easily fit four (or more) games into a single day. To help support organised play in 2022, we’ll be producing a special organised play pack that stores can purchase to run their own events. Inside the pack, you’ll find exclusive, alternate artwork cards for each of the core six players, along with a new game mode that doesn’t appear in the rulebook!
Your first opportunity to win some of these alternate cards is the upcoming Bulk Grogan Memorial Trophy Tournament here at Mantic HQ on January 29th. We’ve only got one ticket left and – assuming COVID restrictions allow it – we’d love to see you there.
So, as you can see, 2022 promises to be another action-packed year for OverDrive and will bring the total number of players to a lip-smacking 16. Who are you most looking forward to?
I feel like the enforcer captain needs a thicker waist. It won't allow a normal human's proportions to fit in there still but it'll be closer. The detail is quite nice though but I miss the cape!
The marauders also seem more detailed and more high tech this time around. Am I just misremembering that and/or conflating them with orks?
warboss wrote: I feel like the enforcer captain needs a thicker waist. It won't allow a normal human's proportions to fit in there still but it'll be closer. The detail is quite nice though but I miss the cape!
The marauders also seem more detailed and more high tech this time around. Am I just misremembering that and/or conflating them with orks?
Marauders are your basic Orcs and Goblins but the GCPS took them, trained them and used them as expendable troops until the Mandrake Rebellion which was largely a manufactured rebellion so that the GCPS could justify wiping them out and replacing them with the Enforcers. They were largely wiped out and what remained were allowed to exist as mercenaries as they could still serve a purpose and didn’t pose a threat. The GCPS still keeps their numbers in check to prevent further uprisings. They largely buy their weapons and tech on the black market.
Ok and thanks. Is that fluff new to justify the possibly more high tech look or did they always look like that tech level? They seemed more primitive/scavanged before but I may be confusing them with the GW orks or even in universe with the rat faction.
warboss wrote: Ok and thanks. Is that fluff new to justify the possibly more high tech look or did they always look like that tech level? They seemed more primitive/scavanged before but I may be confusing them with the GW orks or even in universe with the rat faction.
I like the higher tech look of the marauders; it seems to me to encourage alternative (cleaner) paint schemes and allows for use in other scifi settings with different background ...
Kind of a strange question I suppose, but can anyone who has played a few games of Deadzone 3rd edition give me an estimate how long a game takes?
I like the Kill Team from GW pretty well, but I was really hoping it would be a 45-60 minute long game to fill that sort of gaming roll, but It takes about an hour and 45 minutes for myself and the people I play with. Looking for a skirmish game that plays a bit faster and that has a few less rules.
Sabotage! wrote: Kind of a strange question I suppose, but can anyone who has played a few games of Deadzone 3rd edition give me an estimate how long a game takes?
I like the Kill Team from GW pretty well, but I was really hoping it would be a 45-60 minute long game to fill that sort of gaming roll, but It takes about an hour and 45 minutes for myself and the people I play with. Looking for a skirmish game that plays a bit faster and that has a few less rules.
We can finish a 200 point game in about 90 minutes, which includes setting up and clearing away the board. I've built most of my terrain in smaller, stackable pieces, so that takes a little bit longer.
It also doesn't exist in the Force Lists, so within 6 months of release the book is out of date.
In the meantime, there are a ton of models in the Force List book that are either a) Unavailable, b) Trapped behind paywalls of other game box sets or c) In desperate need of a model that isn't a melted pile of pvc. Why not resin those before inventing new non Force List models?
Because Marauders are a Firefight release that can be used in Deadzone
Plague release is to replace the PVC models with Resin, and I guess Mantic learned from the past, with updating too many models at the beginning people call it a dead game because of no new model releases 6 months later (so now they do it slowly, I assume Plague and Marauders in Q2, next 2 factions in Q4)
I had the same thought Better faces and tighter sculpts than GG, and I'm sure Mantic's supports look better than mine do (I really struggle to print my GG stuff, tho I'm also bad at supporting stuff) ...
New Firefight starter set, £90 RRP, looks like 73 minis, books counters and dice.
The rules for this are significantly different to the previous edition, it's a rewrite based on the core Deadzone mechanics (started life as Deadzone XL a number of years ago) rather than an adaptation of Warpath. Having followed the development closely, I'm really excited for it, it's exactly the sort of game I wanted from the original Warpath release, faster gameplay with a simpler ruleset, alternate activation, very accessible.
the old Ripper Suits are possible the worst models Mantic ever made
I hope this is just a promo pic and there are other models with the new plastic Orcs
kodos wrote: the old Ripper Suits are possible the worst models Mantic ever made
I hope this is just a promo pic and there are other models with the new plastic Orcs
They haven't dropped the Ripper Suit design the new Warlord has a similar suit
Very much liking the straightforward rulebook / faction book split.
Two books, then re-releasing the faction book if it needs new factions and/or a balance update is perfect.
New £75 army boxes are looking good, lots of variety and smaller units makes buying multiple sets worthwhile. Liking the "vehicle in every box" approach.
I think they may have looked at what people were complaining about for a certain other system's faction starter sets and gone - "Yep, lets give everyone a vehicle, an HQ, and a ton of cannon fodder!"
kodos wrote: not sure about that any more, there are different pictures around of the starter, some showing the Goblin Snipers while others do not
and there are no leader models listed, which would be odd, so there is still hope until friday that this are not the awful gen1 models
Good spot. I have the Marauders set from DZ 1.0 so I'm good for a couple of gobbos but yes, interesting to see two different starter set content images.
If you were to buy all of the above separately it would come to £200, so that means you’re getting everything for less than half price at £90. Seriously, Crazy Bobby must have come up with this starter set price. Oh, and that price doesn’t include the Ripper Suits because we don’t currently sell them separately… so it’s actually even more :p
Launch bundle looks good, ordering that direct from Mantic is actually quite appealing at the moment:
- Launch bundle is 20% discount from RRP, with free shipping. (same as wayland and many other sites)
- Mantic site gives 5% cashback with their loyalty points scheme.
- Mantic site currently gives a free £5 (10k loyalty points) to new signups or existing accounts.
All of that stacks up quite nicely.
I'll do some pricing breakdowns of the strike forces too, since some of those are looking pretty good.
Forgefathers Strike Force: £75, has £128 in minis (41% discount)
- 30x Steel Warriors (£54)
- Sturnhammer Battle Tank (£30)
- 6x Forge Guard (£18)
- Iron Ancestor (£18)
- Resin Huscarl (unavailable, but let's say £8)
GCPS Strike Force: £75, £111 in minis. (32% discount)
Asterian Strike Force: £75, £108.20 in minis (31% discount)
30 Plastic Marionettes (£54)
6 PVC Support Drones (probably an error, the drones are hips and are on the marionette sprue)
4 PVC Cyphers (£6.40)
3 PVC Cyper Wardens (£4.80)
1 Plastic and PVC Chroma Force Platform (£35)
1 Resin Overseer (£8 est.)
Plague Strike Force: £75, ~£135 in minis (44% discount)
So, quite a mixed bag overall, the Plague, Veermyn and Forgefathers boxes are the standouts.
With Enforcers and Marauders, better off with either multiple starter boxes, and with Marauders to give some variety the deadzone faction booster is something I'd recommend since it gives you bits to convert a commando captain or two, 4 more rippers, goblin sniper team, hulk and guntrack. Overall a much more varied expansion to the starter than the strike force.
It’s a pity Mantic still doesn’t offer Delivery Duty Paid DDP and only ships DDU as any saving is negated by VAT and handling charges, and AFAIK they don’t remove UK VAT either to compensate . It leaves Wayland Games as my only viable option for Mantic purchases.
this is without options and possible conversions out of the plastic sprues (as the 6 model Forge Guard spure makes 5 Troops and 1 HQ, or Veer-Myn could be Stalker, Crawlers or the Volt Runner version of it)
also Beta-Tests points were subject of change
but it looks like you get at least a playable 750 points army out of each box
Last week we asked you for any questions you had about Firefight: Second Edition… and you certainly responded! Although we’ll be answering many of your questions in the upcoming rules blogs and videos, below you’ll find some that we can answer straight away, plus a few that we’ll sort of answer :p
What’s a standard game size, in terms of points and table size? We recommend when starting to learn the game to aim for 1,000pts and that should comfortably fit on a 4ft by 4ft table. In terms of model count, that depends up the army you’re playing but it’s around 30-50 miniatures. However, it’s very easy to scale up your games and once you get over 1,500pts it’s best to move to a 6ft by 4ft table. If you’re playing a 1,000pt game, then it takes around 90 minutes to play.
Is the game ‘you go, I go’ or alternating activations? The game features alternating activations – like Deadzone. Although, just like Deadzone, during your turn you can spend a Command Point to activate a second unit. This ensures gameplay is very dynamic, as you can respond to the actions of your opponent.
Are you planning on doing some rules overview videos? Yes! Gameplay videos and battle reports will be coming out from April 1st. We’ll be breaking down each of the main mechanics, such as movement, shooting, etc.
Is there a structure planned for campaign books, balance updates and expansions? Yes! Just like Deadzone we’ve split the rules across two books – the rules and the force lists book. The reason for this is that in the future we’re likely to add new units (or even entirely new armies), which means we’ll need to update the Force Lists. When this happens we’ll release a new Force List book. This ensures you won’t be carrying a wheelbarrow full of books to your local club or a tournament when we update the game.
Any new terrain kits on the way? (The item pick up crates for 1st DZ making a return would be cool, or sculpted pieces linked to objectives in the scenarios) Not at launch… he answered cryptically.
Will there be an EasyArmy force builder released alongside Firefight or will it be something that comes after everything is out? We are planning to have EasyArmy ready for launch and it’s currently in testing with our top secret group of testers.
Will we be able to field units in 5s to move up from Deadzone, or will minimum sizes be 10s? Unit size is actually pretty adaptable! Most units have the option to additional miniatures for a set amount of points. For example, on the unit entry below, although a Stalker squad is five miniatures by default, you can pay to add up to five additional Stalkers. This is a great way, not only to expand your attacking power, but also to round-up your points when creating an army list.
Will the game have the potential to devolve into “buildings” shooting at each other, or is there something to be done about making sure the minis remain the showcase? Buildings are an important part of play – and you can use them as defensible fortifications. However, there are some missions in which you are unable to enter the buildings and, instead, they become scenario pieces, which may be searchable to intel for scoring VPs, and so your minis are always present on the tabletop! Plus, when units can enter larger buildings, they are split up into zones, so there is the option to move between levels or onto the roof of a building, in which case you’ll place all your miniatures on top of the terrain. In cases were you do have a unit inside a structure, we recommended placing your leader next to it, so you’re able to see what’s inside (as you would with a unit in a transport vehicle)Units in builds certainly get some defensive bonuses, but they can still be attacked and ousted!
Just looking at the command dice is there anything stopping me from using my Vanguard dice? If you have Vanguard dice, you can use those. The Firefight ones are a different colour, but just remember the following:
Red (Vanguard) = Black (Firefight)
White (Vanguard) = Orange (Firefight)
Blue (Vanguard) = Green (Firefight)
How will allying armies work in the new edition? You can’t ally armies in Firefight. Unlike Kings of War, where factions are united by their alliance, i.e. good, evil or neutral, the motives of the disparate factions in Firefight are much harder to align.
Ok, now we come to the slightly more difficult questions to answer! Strap in folks, for lots of ‘maybes’ and ‘hmm… we’ll have to see’.
Any chance of a Nameless/Rebs/Z’zor army in the future? We got asked this question – in its various forms – quite a lot. Of course, we absolutely have plans to support Firefight beyond 2022 and new armies/new miniatures are certainly a part of that. The reason for not having Nameless and Rebs in the current Force List book is that we don’t have the hard plastic troops required to really flesh out the army list… yet! But we’re certainly keen to see those ranges expand in the future.
Any plans for a plastic Lancer tank? Never before has a piece of artwork inspired so many people. Again, the answer for this is a little like the new armies. We’d absolutely love to have a hard plastic Lancer tank and, if Firefight does well at retail, then there’s more chance of that happening!
Is there going to be an ‘Uncharted Empires’ for this game to use other popular futuristic armies? Nope! Firefight actually already has one of our most fleshed out ranges of hard plastic miniatures, plus resin and PVC minis too, so we don’t really think there’s any need for additional armies. Particularly as we’d like to add to the Warpath Universe with our own factions that all have their own lore and appearance. Also, suddenly dumping a bunch of extra armies into a book could lead to new players becoming overwhelmed with options… and we’d have to playtest them all too! It’s much better to go at our own pace and add new Mantic armies when we feel the time is right.
Thanks very much for sending in your questions and we may actually do a live Q&A session with studio manager Matt Gilbert in the future (don’t tell him!)… so stay tuned for more details on that. In the meantime, don’t forget that Firefight: Second Edition is now available to pre-order direct from Mantic or your FLGS.
That's a good Q&A, although the main thing I'd add is that it's a game which has finally managed to offer a modern 40k alternative, easy to learn, fast to play, with a fully supported miniatures line with lots of hard plastic and reasonable pricing.
You can learn the game in half an hour, and play a full-size game in 2 hours, with lots of action and both players fully involved thanks to the alternate activations.
The background and setting is good too, the general concept is that late-stage capitalism and colonialism didn't collapse with the exhaustion of Earth, but instead spread out across the galaxy with corporations replacing the old powers of religion and democracy.
The minis have been there for a long time, with this release they got the rules absolutely perfect and I'm far more excited for it than the original Warpath release which looks a little redundant at current unless it gets a serious overhaul (just play a huge game of firefight 2nd edition, it's fast so a massive game can be played without the need for a second set of mass-battle rules to exist).
scarletsquig wrote: and I'm far more excited for it than the original Warpath release which looks a little redundant at current unless it gets a serious overhaul (just play a huge game of firefight 2nd edition, it's fast so a massive game can be played without the need for a second set of mass-battle rules to exist).
yeah, with Warpath you only get the full experience if you are going to multi-base your teams, otherwise playing <2k FF is the better option
that said I still think it was a missed opportunity not doing WP in 10mm
The main thing to remember is that these hard plastics can be used to build your Deadzone or Firefight factions, so we’ve made sure they’ve got all the necessary options to kit out your mean and green fighters for either game
The hard plastics are actually split over two separate frames. One contains the bodies, along with some weapons, while the second frame has weapons galore! Starting from the top, this frame contains:
Rifles
Ripper Talons
Pistols
Claws
10 bodies (two of each type)
A great big axe
The sprues do have small letters on, so you can tell which arms need to be paired together, which should make building easier! Also, if you’re getting the two-player set, it comes with a guide on how to build the hard plastics
It’s also worth noting that the Marauder kit is fully compatible with the new Riftforged Orc frame. So, if you wanted to mix in some different heads or wanted to arm your Marauder Brawler leader with a massive hammer, you can kitbash away
Some good options on there, quite a few different units and unit options to be made from the kit, it's nice to see 100% of the weapon options on the sprue, even a full unit armed with phase claws.
Also, there's a couple of rifles on there that could be cut short, drilled out and turned into double-barrel shotguns, combined with spare jump packs from the GCPS sprue, I can probably kitbash some skyscrapers, going to end up with over a hundred of the commandos so will definitely want to make the kit go further in terms of unit variety.
lord_blackfang wrote: But again this weird approach of tooling two sprues with nearly all the bitz doubled up.
Yeah, it seems really weird and counterproductive, they're tooling a larger sprue, with all the bits variety of a single smaller sprue doubled up.
Also oof ouch owie my detail.
2 Podcasts were Rob is talking about FF, the information I took from it:
- along the 7 factions, there was one more during play testing, neither Nameless nor Rebs
- army composition works by choosing an HQ, which defines your Troops and those unlock specialists and support
- vehicles will be less powerful but also less limited (as transports being troops)
- the amount of terrain needed is similar to Kings of War (so all those who have a Deadzone table might already have enough)
- around 1000 points and 4x4 was Robs preferred setup
- if FF is doing well, more plastic models/tanks coming next year
^ The army comp is very open, unless there have been last-minute changes to the beta.
4 types of unit - Command, Troop, Specialist, Support.
- First command is a free unlock.
- You can have as many troops as you like.
- Each troop unlocks one specialist or one command.
- Two picks from either troop or specialist unlock a support choice.
That's all there is to it, the troop unlocking Rob mentioned just refers to the fact that command models can bring along a small bodyguard (3-5 minis usually) and sometimes the bodyguard is a unique choice (e.g. goblin sniper unit can only be fielded as a bodyguard for the marauder commando captain). It isn't the case that you need, for example, a peacekeeper captain to get peacekeepers as troops.
Of course, using the minis however you like is also encouraged, I'll be using one of the goblin snipers (the fleeing one) as a 'leader' for my mawbeast pack.
I knew I have seen it before, are they still in business?
They've been out and in of business for probably the last 10 years. Last post on their FB profile is 2 years old and the webshop is currently down with a note that it's coming back soon.
I had plans to buy some of their stuff for a long time but I never seem to find them in their "in business" stage. Also, now, Brexit makes it too much of a chore and 3d printing makes them redundant (for me)
warboss wrote: Is there no commander for the Enforcers in the box? That's a bit disappointing. I like their chonky caped guy.
there are no specific commanders for both factions in the 2 player set (the new resin models are exclusive to the army sets for now)
but you can build one out of the plastic frames
krijthebold wrote: Certainly curious about how the Plague box is going to measure up.
I can help with that, here's a list using the plague strike force contents which comes to 1215 points, focuses on melee and a lot of pinning/ indirect fire weapons, classic plague playstyle.
Lord - 150
9x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 125
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
30x zombie - 125
Plague Mule (laser cannon) - 65
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
Aberration - 90
Aberration - 90
Not even completely maxed out, if you build two plague 3As as generals from the plastics you can get to 1300, but that's probably pushing it.
There are numerous builds possible with the box (3a's alone have 5 special weapon options, leader weapons and dog) and they are all going to come in at over 1000 points.
You can even pop three dogs on a 40mm base and call it a plague swarm if you're not keen on the unit attachment option, kinda like the rippers that come with tyranid sets.
The plague really lucked out with their strike force, it's better value than the older army sets from Mantic and a 44% discount compared to buying seperately, only the starter set beats it in value.
Strike Force + a few extras gets you a complete 1500 point army for most of the factions. Starter set + Strike Force works perfectly for Enforcers and Marauders.
krijthebold wrote: Certainly curious about how the Plague box is going to measure up.
I can help with that, here's a list using the plague strike force contents which comes to 1215 points, focuses on melee and a lot of pinning/ indirect fire weapons, classic plague playstyle.
Lord - 150
9x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 125
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
30x zombie - 125
Plague Mule (laser cannon) - 65
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
Aberration - 90
Aberration - 90
Not even completely maxed out, if you build two plague 3As as generals from the plastics you can get to 1300, but that's probably pushing it.
There are numerous builds possible with the box (3a's alone have 5 special weapon options, leader weapons and dog) and they are all going to come in at over 1000 points.
You can even pop three dogs on a 40mm base and call it a plague swarm if you're not keen on the unit attachment option, kinda like the rippers that come with tyranid sets.
The plague really lucked out with their strike force, it's better value than the older army sets from Mantic and a 44% discount compared to buying seperately, only the starter set beats it in value.
Strike Force + a few extras gets you a complete 1500 point army for most of the factions. Starter set + Strike Force works perfectly for Enforcers and Marauders.
Controlling buildings seemly give a huge advantage to controlling the battlefield. I like how Firefight is back to the old "imagine your troops are here" way of dealing with buildings rather than the way Infinity, or 40k deal with it.
I'm curious to know what people think - could this be the game that gets mantic a bit more credibility in the Sci Fi squad level arena? I haven't been this excited for a game for a long time, and I will certainly be pushing it locally even if it means 'trading' demo games for other systems...
Due to a bit of a mis-communication with Mantic, my review copy was a bit late getting to me. I'm getting some videos out this coming week, but I just want to drop in here and say that the book quality is *excellent*. If you have the softcover KoW 3rd edition, or Armada book, you'll know what I mean. The layout, full colour images, great quality stock... they are very well produced items.
Tabletop_Magpie wrote: I'm curious to know what people think - could this be the game that gets mantic a bit more credibility in the Sci Fi squad level arena? I haven't been this excited for a game for a long time, and I will certainly be pushing it locally even if it means 'trading' demo games for other systems..
hope so,
for now the game feels very much like the best of the past years of gaming (or like a good mix of Warhammer 3rd/4th, SW Legion, Deadzone/Warpath and Vanguard), with a good setting and fleshed out armies and at the right time
but a big point here is the request for a translation, not because no one can read it otherwise but people see it as a sign that the company cares and supports the community and therefore are more likely to invest into the game
with KoW now being finally released in other languages and the hint in the FAQ that they try with FF, this might be enough goodwill to get things going
PS: most items on the Mantic Shop for FF are already on backorder, so could be that they already sold more than they expected
Automatically Appended Next Post: Unboxing by Ronnie himself (might be biased)
hope so,
for now the game feels very much like the best of the past years of gaming (or like a good mix of Warhammer 3rd/4th, SW Legion, Deadzone/Warpath and Vanguard), with a good setting and fleshed out armies and at the right time
but a big point here is the request for a translation, not because no one can read it otherwise but people see it as a sign that the company cares and supports the community and therefore are more likely to invest into the game
with KoW now being finally released in other languages and the hint in the FAQ that they try with FF, this might be enough goodwill to get things going
PS: most items on the Mantic Shop for FF are already on backorder, so could be that they already sold more than they expected
Agreed with your overall summary. There is something quite nostalgic about the game while it also feels new. And yes, having 7 full factions on release should provide something for pretty much everybody.
Interesting point about translation, Kodos. With the rules being so streamlined, hopefully it won't be too much of a task to translate and get our international fellow nerds playing too!
the current problem why it took so long for KoW was that they got the text translated but needed an editior who spoke both languages and understood enough of the game to get the text into the right layout (so that page numbers for rules matches in all versions)
and I am curious on how good the translation is (my book should come in the next 2 weeks) and if they make the same mistakes as GW in the past (there are some tricky false-friend translations in the old warhammer books)
that said, now that the books are done Mantic should now how to get things done and follow ups should be faster
krijthebold wrote: Certainly curious about how the Plague box is going to measure up.
I can help with that, here's a list using the plague strike force contents which comes to 1215 points, focuses on melee and a lot of pinning/ indirect fire weapons, classic plague playstyle.
Lord - 150
9x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 125
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
5x Stage 3A - HMG, Dog - 85
30x zombie - 1258
Plague Mule (laser cannon) - 65
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
2x Weapon Team (mortar) - 105
Aberration - 90
Aberration - 90
Not even completely maxed out, if you build two plague 3As as generals from the plastics you can get to 1300, but that's probably pushing it.
There are numerous builds possible with the box (3a's alone have 5 special weapon options, leader weapons and dog) and they are all going to come in at over 1000 points.
You can even pop three dogs on a 40mm base and call it a plague swarm if you're not keen on the unit attachment option, kinda like the rippers that come with tyranid sets.
The plague really lucked out with their strike force, it's better value than the older army sets from Mantic and a 44% discount compared to buying seperately, only the starter set beats it in value.
Strike Force + a few extras gets you a complete 1500 point army for most of the factions. Starter set + Strike Force works perfectly for Enforcers and Marauders.
That is a great idea to make swarms, I think I have enough dogs spare for that.
Where are these points from? Can I make a list online or is that from book or some such?
I wanted the Corruption and Sentient to complete my Plague Deadzone faction.
The Corruption, much like the Vanguard equivalent, looks like the base is too big for it. The Sentient is not available on its own, but I've been reassured on fb that it will be eventually after the initial release.
#waitingabitlonger
Well I’ve signed up to the list builder thing.
I both really like it and don’t.
Really like that it has the pictures and all the easy tick box bits etc.
Now the task of punching in all the totals to see where I’m at.
There is the ongoing replacement of metal/pvc with resin, so Deadzone will be the first to see upgraded/new boxes (which can be used to upgrade FF with specialists/HQ as well)
(Marauder Deadzone Sets should be next)
army boxes for Warpath are still around, so there are small, medium and large box sets and I guess if the game is doing well the larger sets will be updated too
what I took away from all the podcasts and interviews is that the first 1st year is covered and for the 2nd years "it depends"
With the unit entries in the faction book almost entirely covered by minis that Mantic sells, there isn't too much more that urgently needs releasing for the existing factions, a lot of it will be resculpts to move away from restic and reboxing to make things available (Plague are next in line for this with their new releases next month, followed by Marauders).
I notice easy army has a pic of the new resin marauder commando captain.
Enforcers with phase claws are likely, as that's a unit entry without a mini set.
The mini line has had a lot of work out into it over the years, lots of factions, lots of hard plastic kits, it just needed a good ruleset to go with it and Firefight really delivers on that.
So, the next large release is probably more likely to be a new army release (possibly two at once to make a new starter set), which would probably be next year at the earliest since there's a big lead time on plastics and Mantic will be seeing if the launch goes well or not first.
Current rumours suggest not Nameless or Rebs, I'm hoping for Zz'or.
Mazon Labs have also been mentioned in passing, which could be a really simple release.
I’m not talking about new sculpts, I’m talking about boxed sets of miniatures to expand your starter force. These used to be called, for example, Reserve Forces. As it stands, you basically need to buy DZ boxes to expand your FF army.
those are already available, there are the single troop/specialist/support boxes, there are the mixed formations (Deadzone Starter/Booster), and vehicle formations
Incorrect. I’m not sure what is making this so hard to follow. Maybe you don’t recall or never saw how Warpath/Firefight was sold in the past. There were three army boxes: Starter, Reserve, and Mega. The Starter armies were pretty much what the 2E launch bundles are: infantry and some lighter vehicles. The Reserve boxes had more/heavier vehicles and some support or specialist choices. The Mega boxes were both together and then some.
so you are asking of there will be other army boxes in a similar size as the Strike Force boxes but with a different composition?
we don't know, and I doubt it because you don't need 2 army boxes to get a full army
the Strike force boxes are already close or above 1k points, which is the standard size of the game
so in case of the boxes that are short, another vehicle or infantry box will be enough (and the vehicle bundle boxes are there)
2 army boxes would be overkill for Firefight, and the reason there were 3 different boxes for Warpath was simply because you needed them to get an army in the right size for it
Okay, that makes sense. If FF has a smaller army size then I suppose we will just be expected to build armies from DZ boxes and Mantic direct orders. This will probably end up being an obstacle to FF succeeding.
Ordered a starter, extra rule book and some extra units for Mauraders and Enforcers. Everything I've seen about this game's rules looks immensely refreshing, and I want to support.
I still have seceral dozen plague zombies to build and paint, but wouldn't mind some big boys to keep them company. Also Rebs, very useful for FF, and Stargrave.
Wow. They really need to get their new marauder sculptor to immediately roll our some replacement heads for the old models as a stopgap. That's just jarring, having the old stuff right below the new stuff like that.