Have you ever watched a movie or tv show that just made you want to scream "Nonsense!!!"?
I was watching "NCIS: LA" and they had an ep called "Full throttle" that involved a stolen experimental naval car lithium ion battery used in a street racer with a combustion engine supercharged with NO2.
Ok, so the battery was supposed to be super advanced lithium ion, never needed changing (At this point my BS meter was twitching) and mostly supposedly made the combustion process in the fuel chamber far more efficient and powerful.
Nonsense!!!
The efficiency and power of the detonation of a fuel air mix in a piston is determined by the fuel composition, the air mix and the quality of the pistol design in avoiding any of the explosion leaking out when the spark detonated the mix.
The source of the electricity used to create the spark is pretty much meaningless as long as the spark ignites the fuel mix. A more powerful spark wouldn't increase the yield of the fuel air nix reaction, and lithium ion batteries are known for endurance and efficiency, not high power levels anyway.
Now an electronic ignition system with a microchip controlling timing and adapting to changing circumstances could increase performance and efficiency slightly I admit, not by increasing the force yield of the detonation of the fuel air mix in the pistons though. But again the source of the electricity running things is irrelevant as long as it supplies the proper current.
I was just amazed that a series would have an episode focusing on automotive mechanics and make such an ignorant mistake that even a non expert on automotive engineering and internal combustion engine mechanics would spot in in a nanosecond.
So what moments made you want to shout "Nonsense!!!" at the screen and why?
Not sure what you expected of NCIS? It's the series that is famous for a lot of bs moments (when they are getting hacked for example and, get this, they both get on the same keyboard to type simultaneously - not that anything else they are portaying or saying in this scene makes any sense).
Mostly, I just accept that the movie or series is just fiction and don't bother that much.
But a scene from Butterfly Effect stuck with me since I saw it as a teenager because it just doesn't make sense, even in its own movie reality:
When Ashton Kutcher is in prision, he travels to his kindergarden time and rams the metal spike thingies through his palms and then returns. His cellmate now thinks he's Jesus or something because he suddenly has scars. But all the time it is portrayed that he travels back in time, changes something and then lives with these changes through this new timeline. But now suddenly he goes back and "jumps" back into the present, without the change creating a new timeline? If he has scars since he was a kid, he would already have them when going to prison.
Hans, it's just that they made a mistake someone who knows very little about auto mechanics could spot. I've never changed a tire and can barely fill a gas tank, but even i spotted that one in an instant.
Heh, that's nothing. Watch GI Joe - specifically the bit where they're all fleeing from the underwater base because the ice cap above them has been blown up and all the chunks are sinking towards them.
The *ice*. Is *sinking*.
Never mind your 'anyone who knows auto mechanics'. Anyone who's had a bloody cold drink should know that gak is wrong.
Oh man, there was a slew of these movies that took the Indiana Jones formula, but then made artistic analysis and research look instantaneous and unequivocal. National Treasure was pretty outrageous, but the DaVinci code was far, far less believable. So this one guy uncovers all of the secrets of these intentionally obscure master artists, without ever getting one wrong, in the course of a few days? There would have been hundreds of possible explanations and connections, steps along the way would have been destroyed, defaced, or simply unknown to the researcher.
Futurama did a great episode about how ridiculous it was. Very fun movies, don't get me wrong, but the sort that makes you go bs.
I mean this is NCIS you're talking about. You don't watch it for the science or logic, you watch it for the characters (which is somewhat why I've never liked the spin-off versions all that much).
Despite the fact that almost every crime is solved either by indigestion in a lead character or lightning fast iron clad forensics; the forensics is rarely accurate.
That said apparently David Keith McCallum (Ducky) has put a significant amount of research into his role and autopsy science in general.
But yeah half the time we are in the realm of "quick use the enhance button on the the reflection of the reflection of the reflection on the hubcap on the 3.1mp snapshot from an old mobile phone - we've got the killer!"
Well to be fair i was thinking of stuff supposedly set in a realistic world. Worlds with magic and such in them are not exactly what i had in mind.
And do not get me started on indiana jones, you'll regret it. My god, gun powder being pulled towards a magnet and flowing around crates instead of sticking to the sides. How about someone in the warehouse just having a compass on their keychain?
And temple of doom...ugh. How does that stuff get into movies?
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Overread wrote: I mean this is NCIS you're talking about. You don't watch it for the science or logic, you watch it for the characters (which is somewhat why I've never liked the spin-off versions all that much).
Despite the fact that almost every crime is solved either by indigestion in a lead character or lightning fast iron clad forensics; the forensics is rarely accurate.
That said apparently David Keith McCallum (Ducky) has put a significant amount of research into his role and autopsy science in general.
But yeah half the time we are in the realm of "quick use the enhance button on the the reflection of the reflection of the reflection on the hubcap on the 3.1mp snapshot from an old mobile phone - we've got the killer!"
I kinda like Hetty in NCIS LA. For a woman like her to wield such power in a society obsessed with youth and beauty is a testament to her competence.
Said it before, will say it again - Die Hard 2. If you know anything about aircraft it's a laugh a minute mine of gibberish bobbins. In fact most representations of aircraft in films are. I think there was a film Lawnmower Man 2 (haven't got a clue how I ended up watching it) where a guy managed to control an aircraft's autopilot remotely (load of crap, but we can forgive this because of the film) and the crew are all "the autopilot has taken control, there's nothing we can do!"
Maybe pull the circuit breaker for the autopilot?
The sad thing is most movies, books or TV shows will have you shouting at it if you have the smallest amount of knowledge on the subject. Who on this forum hasn't watched Game of Thrones attack on Winter fell and laughed at the comically bad basket case of supposed military tactics?
Bones. I remember one episode where the bad guy carved intricate detail onto the ends of the victim’s ribs. When they scanned his skeleton into their 3D computer simulation, they found out that detail was actually a highly advanced computer code that promptly infected their systems with a virus. I don’t care how good your virus is, typing a bunch of 1s and 0s into mspaint isn’t going to corrupt my pc.
AduroT wrote: Bones. I remember one episode where the bad guy carved intricate detail onto the ends of the victim’s ribs. When they scanned his skeleton into their 3D computer simulation, they found out that detail was actually a highly advanced computer code that promptly infected their systems with a virus. I don’t care how good your virus is, typing a bunch of 1s and 0s into mspaint isn’t going to corrupt my pc.
On a similar front, it was bloody lucky that the virus they wrote in Independence Day was compatible with the alien fleet's operating system. And that they were able to connect to upload it. Hey, I guess USB literally is a *universal* serial bus...
There's a lot of bad "zoom/enhance" sequences out there, but none bother me as much as Jack Black in Enemy of the State, partially because the entire plot hinges on it:
"Okay, bring up the store security cam footage. Freeze there. Zoom... enhance..... now rotate 180 degrees.... and... there it is!"
Why didn’t the ancient Egyptians just meltdown the bracelet?|
Would’ve saved a lot of bother!
Ah. One of my least favorite tropes.
Never, ever 'curse' your worst enemy with immortality and/or untold magical power. It's just really stupid.
Have a 'Weekend at Bernie's' with his corpse instead. Humiliate his name and legacy.
All the time unfortunately! A few that spring to mind
King Arthur: Legend of the Sword. Building-size Oliphants with sorcerors on their backs shooting fireballs - fine. The King using his horse to ramp off the edge of a building and jump onto the backs of those Oliphants? Nope. No such thing as suicide horses.
Marvel Avengers series - Bruce Banner's line, after being asked how he controls his rage? "I'm always angry". Sorry not quite as bad as suicide horses but it doesn't make any sense in the context of the Hulk and what triggers his transformation.
Crispy78 wrote: On a similar front, it was bloody lucky that the virus they wrote in Independence Day was compatible with the alien fleet's operating system. And that they were able to connect to upload it. Hey, I guess USB literally is a *universal* serial bus...
IIRC that's 'explained' in the novelization - our computer tech is based / reverse engineered from theirs.
Crispy78 wrote: On a similar front, it was bloody lucky that the virus they wrote in Independence Day was compatible with the alien fleet's operating system. And that they were able to connect to upload it. Hey, I guess USB literally is a *universal* serial bus...
IIRC that's 'explained' in the novelization - our computer tech is based / reverse engineered from theirs.
I thought that was obvious considering that in the film they had an alien spaceship and that it its systems came online when the fleet arrived. Ergo they did have access to the aliens systems. The amazing part is more that they cracked the code and then were able to design a system to let them on board and were able to penetrate the aliens military system to disable the shields. If anything its odd that the aliens had such a connection system in place, then again perhaps it was simply a sign of how they had, for generations, picked on weaker species. So having had no major opponent to fight they'd basically got "lazy" with their own security.
There was the supervirus in the prison arc of TWD (yeah, another virus after the zombie bug) that was killing people in a couple days. But no worries...they cured it with ANTIBIOTICS.
Crispy78 wrote: On a similar front, it was bloody lucky that the virus they wrote in Independence Day was compatible with the alien fleet's operating system. And that they were able to connect to upload it. Hey, I guess USB literally is a *universal* serial bus...
IIRC that's 'explained' in the novelization - our computer tech is based / reverse engineered from theirs.
I thought that was obvious considering that in the film they had an alien spaceship and that it its systems came online when the fleet arrived. Ergo they did have access to the aliens systems. The amazing part is more that they cracked the code and then were able to design a system to let them on board and were able to penetrate the aliens military system to disable the shields. If anything its odd that the aliens had such a connection system in place, then again perhaps it was simply a sign of how they had, for generations, picked on weaker species. So having had no major opponent to fight they'd basically got "lazy" with their own security.
The timeframe is pretty damn tight. Aliens first pitch up on the 2nd July. They go to area 51 on the 3rd July and see the hardware for the first time then. Matey is then able to write the virus to disable an alien fleet's shields in less than a day, and deploys it on the 4th.
Which is undone by anyone who has ever worked in IT, and knows of the 'I' word (integrations), where quite often systems often have massive problems communicating with each other (even when they have been designed and built by the same company!)
Overread wrote: Well they'd had the ship itself since Roswell.
Not powered up though - I thought it only came online once the ships showed up. So they still had 2 days max to reverse engineer an alien OS / language and write a virus to target specific functionality within it. Dubious.
Currently greatly enjoying an ooooold British cop show called “The Professionals”.
Overall, it’s aged very well. Except I’m on the 4th episode of series 1, and it involves a customised sniper rifle.
Now that in itself is fine and dandy. Except? We see the as yet unidentified by name sniper, who owns the rifle, setting it up for some practice.
We see him tripod mount it. Which is fine. We see him fiddle with the settings and that. Which is fine. He feels it’s all about nice. Which is fine.
Then.......he hand loads the bolt action mechanism, clearly and visibly wobbling the gun on its mount!
Now, this is from 1978, so the bolt action bit (the receiver? Chamber? I dunno) is understandable. But setting your sights then loading just feels daft.
Pretty much anything involving a computer virus and /or hacking is guaranteed to be nonsense.
I also wince at most depictions of CPR, although that one supposedly was originally somewhat deliberate. Read a thing years ago that suggested that aside from the logistics of showing proper CPR in the days before dummies were particularly realistic, it was often portrayed incorrectly to prevent kids from killing each other trying to duplicate it after seeing it on TV. No idea if that's actually true, though.
How about the opposite of nonsense? Back in the day McGuyver taught his show’s audience that if you poured salt water into the coin slot of a vending machine it would short it out and cause it to jackpot it’s change and inventory. He needed to make a call and didn’t have money for the pay phone you see. It’s a thing that actually worked, and which people then went on a spree of doing. Don’t bother trying it now though, a number of changes were made to machine to thwart that.
The sniper in The Admiral: Roaring Currents. Yay "hide from the evil sniper" tropes, but the smoothbore matchlock fired from a moving boat at another moving boat is pretty silly. (I'm only familiar with the timeline of rifling in Europe, so if someone wants to tell me about the advanced Japanese gunsmithing of 1597 I'm prepared to download it to "slightly silly".)
Batman Begins and the nonsense with the giant microwave. How did it know to only boil the city's water supply, and not all the other things around, such as... All the people?
insaniak wrote: Pretty much anything involving a computer virus and /or hacking is guaranteed to be nonsense.
I also wince at most depictions of CPR, although that one supposedly was originally somewhat deliberate. Read a thing years ago that suggested that aside from the logistics of showing proper CPR in the days before dummies were particularly realistic, it was often portrayed incorrectly to prevent kids from killing each other trying to duplicate or after seeing it on TV. No idea if that's actually true, though.
I think I that is the case. The lass I’m sort of seeing is a Paramedic, and has pulled muscles doing CPR due to the force needed.
And of course, doing CPR on a beating heart? Not good. So show the gist, not the full thing.
For me, I think the thing that's worse than the dodgy compression technique is how often the person doing the CPR does three or four pumps, gives up in frustration and resorts to punching and /or screaming at the body until they miraculously and spontaneously come back to life.
We also have the issue that films create their own sense of fake that we then come to expect to see. For example we expect sound in space in a pew-pew film. We are also willing to accept spaceships with engines on the back; and we are also willing to accept that when characters look through binoculars it looks like two ovals linked together even though that is not what you see through binoculars.
The whole "stop kids doing it at home" is one of those odd things that sort of makes sense, but then again so much happens in films that they can still dangerously emulate. Anyone remember the stories of kids jumping off roofs and out of windows trying to fly like Superman?
One thing with CPR I've noticed is that a lot of depictions get the order wrong, they don't do enough compressions etc... That said they get away with it because (as yet) life saving isn't a key-skill we are taught from a young age.
insaniak wrote: Pretty much anything involving a computer virus and /or hacking is guaranteed to be nonsense.
This. Fiction's computers are just running on magic. More specifically, on plot magic! Does whatever is convenient for the plot.
Currently playing the first Watch Dog that I got for free on the EGS, it's a particularly egregious example.
I just did a prison mission which really took the cake though.
You want to intimidate a guy in prison so you show up at the prison with your gun, instantly surrender, get a mugshot taken, and then are put in your cell. There you put out your phone and bang you change your name on the prison's database, and everyone who saw your face, took your mugshot, wrote your name down on the database etc instantly forget you exist and do not recognize you during the high profile breakout where you kill several warden and are spotted by multiple policemen.
The most realistic hacking scene I've seen in films is ironically in Hackers. It's just not the weird, videogame flight sim, 3D database dive at the end of the movie. It's in the first couple minutes, when the guy calls a company after hours pretending to work there and convinces a janitor to read him some port numbers off a modem. It's pretty much been downhill from there.
Oh god, last weekend’s episode of Sword Art Online. Android gets shot to crap. It has visible damage. The power supply overloads and blows and the cables are visibly hanging loose and disconnected. The thing shuts down. Another character yells an emotional and inspirational plea at it, and it posers back up and saves the day.
AduroT wrote: Oh god, last weekend’s episode of Sword Art Online. Android gets shot to crap. It has visible damage. The power supply overloads and blows and the cables are visibly hanging loose and disconnected. The thing shuts down. Another character yells an emotional and inspirational plea at it, and it posers back up and saves the day.
I dunno. Thats a show about people being stuck (somehow) in a video game. If they're still in the game when that happens, I kind of give that a pass, since the entire premise of the show is non-functional if taken seriously.
AduroT wrote: Oh god, last weekend’s episode of Sword Art Online. Android gets shot to crap. It has visible damage. The power supply overloads and blows and the cables are visibly hanging loose and disconnected. The thing shuts down. Another character yells an emotional and inspirational plea at it, and it posers back up and saves the day.
I dunno. Thats a show about people being stuck (somehow) in a video game. If they're still in the game when that happens, I kind of give that a pass, since the entire premise of the show is non-functional if taken seriously.
Nope, that didn’t happen in the game. That was in real life.
AduroT wrote: Bones. I remember one episode where the bad guy carved intricate detail onto the ends of the victim’s ribs. When they scanned his skeleton into their 3D computer simulation, they found out that detail was actually a highly advanced computer code that promptly infected their systems with a virus. I don’t care how good your virus is, typing a bunch of 1s and 0s into mspaint isn’t going to corrupt my pc.
Bones also had a crossover with Sleepy Hollow, which means it canonically has demons and magic in-universe, so on that basis...
LunarSol wrote: There's a lot of bad "zoom/enhance" sequences out there, but none bother me as much as Jack Black in Enemy of the State, partially because the entire plot hinges on it:
"Okay, bring up the store security cam footage. Freeze there. Zoom... enhance..... now rotate 180 degrees.... and... there it is!"
I haven't enjoyed CinemaSins in years, but last night they roasted this and it was SOOOOO satisfying.
In terms of CSI etc, outside of artistic license and expedience of story telling?
I often wonder if the techniques shown are partially to put people off crimes?
Sure, stuff like the hacking and CCTV is laughable. Especially the CCTV, I sometimes have to review such things, and even getting it sent in a format I can watch is a pain in the balls.
But a lot of the forensic stuff is more rooted in realism, and genuine existing tech. Will your local Plod have that at their fingertips? Probs not! But, to know it is possible to find the merest shred of evidence linking you back to whatever heinous crime you committed? Surely it’s got to have some people thinking twice?
And for the “not as clever as dumb they are” that might fancy a bit of crime? Do they offer deliberate whoppers of fibs on how to circumvent such things?
I often wonder if the techniques shown are partially to put people off crimes?
I recall seeing a clip on a show a few years ago talking to police about the issue of crime dramas and how it affects juries. The thing is crime dramas, whilst being fake, often have a lot of correlating information. Fingerprints and DNA are perfect answers and proof, for example. This can influence a jury to think that some methods of forensics are more reliable than they actually are. Similarly other elements might be underestimated in their importance. Because they are going off the TV world as their first contact point for this kind of information.
AduroT wrote: Oh god, last weekend’s episode of Sword Art Online. Android gets shot to crap. It has visible damage. The power supply overloads and blows and the cables are visibly hanging loose and disconnected. The thing shuts down. Another character yells an emotional and inspirational plea at it, and it posers back up and saves the day.
I dunno. Thats a show about people being stuck (somehow) in a video game. If they're still in the game when that happens, I kind of give that a pass, since the entire premise of the show is non-functional if taken seriously.
Nope, that didn’t happen in the game. That was in real life.
Point of order, AduroT - anime =/= real life. If you're getting the two confused (or watching anime in the first place), seek help.
bbb wrote: One time when watching an episode of The Sopranos I stood up, pointed to the screen and said loudly, "You can't pump your own gas in New Jersey!"
“Sir, Sir. You can’t pump your own...Oh, sorry, Mr. Soprano. I didn’t recognize you. Please have a pleasant day. “
AduroT wrote: Oh god, last weekend’s episode of Sword Art Online. Android gets shot to crap. It has visible damage. The power supply overloads and blows and the cables are visibly hanging loose and disconnected. The thing shuts down. Another character yells an emotional and inspirational plea at it, and it posers back up and saves the day.
I dunno. Thats a show about people being stuck (somehow) in a video game. If they're still in the game when that happens, I kind of give that a pass, since the entire premise of the show is non-functional if taken seriously.
Nope, that didn’t happen in the game. That was in real life.
Point of order, AduroT - anime =/= real life. If you're getting the two confused (or watching anime in the first place), seek help.
That would apply to every single show and movie mentioned in this thread.
bbb wrote: One time when watching an episode of The Sopranos I stood up, pointed to the screen and said loudly, "You can't pump your own gas in New Jersey!"
bbb wrote: One time when watching an episode of The Sopranos I stood up, pointed to the screen and said loudly, "You can't pump your own gas in New Jersey!"
bbb wrote: One time when watching an episode of The Sopranos I stood up, pointed to the screen and said loudly, "You can't pump your own gas in New Jersey!"
Is this for real?
I googled it and yeah it's true.
IIRC Oregon has a similar law?
Oregon law prevents self service except sometimes during pandemics.
AduroT wrote: Bones. I remember one episode where the bad guy carved intricate detail onto the ends of the victim’s ribs. When they scanned his skeleton into their 3D computer simulation, they found out that detail was actually a highly advanced computer code that promptly infected their systems with a virus. I don’t care how good your virus is, typing a bunch of 1s and 0s into mspaint isn’t going to corrupt my pc.
Well, it could have been a supernatural computer virus. Bones had a cross over episode with Sleepy Hollow so technically the universe of Bones includes the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse and all kinds of other nonsense.
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Attendant Service just seems weird to me as a Brit, as it’s not really a thing here.
I am from NJ but have lived in other states. It's annoying that self service is not allowed in NJ.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Attendant Service just seems weird to me as a Brit, as it’s not really a thing here.
Most states don’t do it so it’s virtually not done here either.
On the plus side, it does essentially legislate some jobs into existence.
Do the people performing said service expect a tip? (As a Brit, getting that sort of thing wrong is one of the things that prevents me going back to the US at some point.)
Also there is a (small but maybe growing?) idea that tip service is just inherently wrong. Like... why don't servers just get paid a decent wage and not rely on tips?
Lance845 wrote: Also there is a (small but maybe growing?) idea that tip service is just inherently wrong. Like... why don't servers just get paid a decent wage and not rely on tips?
That and the way that some major US retailers will show prices on products without tax are two things that have always baffled me that people in the USA put up with. UK side serving staff get a wage, a tip is purely optional and generally only given for good service if you want; the staff don't have to rely on it for their income; meanwhile prices are always shown with tax, its not like the tax is optional. The only stores that don't are those where they expect people to have tax rebates, and typically you've got to be "in trade" to be shopping in those stores anyway.
Lance845 wrote: Also there is a (small but maybe growing?) idea that tip service is just inherently wrong. Like... why don't servers just get paid a decent wage and not rely on tips?
That and the way that some major US retailers will show prices on products without tax are two things that have always baffled me that people in the USA put up with. UK side serving staff get a wage, a tip is purely optional and generally only given for good service if you want; the staff don't have to rely on it for their income; meanwhile prices are always shown with tax, its not like the tax is optional. The only stores that don't are those where they expect people to have tax rebates, and typically you've got to be "in trade" to be shopping in those stores anyway.
Well, in america the way the government taxes cigarettes it's kind of understandable that the tax isn't showed on the price. On average state and fed taxes make up 44% of the cost of a pack of cigarettes in america. some states have higher taxes and some localities add their own.
Well, in america the way the government taxes cigarettes it's kind of understandable that the tax isn't showed on the price. On average state and fed taxes make up 44% of the cost of a pack of cigarettes in america. some states have higher taxes and some localities add their own.
But what makes it understandable to not show that tax on the price? Most countries tax cigarettes at a particularly high rate, but still display the price that you actually pay on the price tag.
Well, in america the way the government taxes cigarettes it's kind of understandable that the tax isn't showed on the price. On average state and fed taxes make up 44% of the cost of a pack of cigarettes in america. some states have higher taxes and some localities add their own.
That doesn't really explain anything though. Pretty sure the UK and most other countries charge significant tax on cigarettes too. I understand different states set their own sales tax rates so what you pay for an item in one state may be different to what you pay in another. There's still a final price you'll end up paying before you leave the store. It's genuinely baffling to me why that price isn't the one displayed to the customer on the shelf.
The only reason I can imagine that businesses in the USA don't want to include tax in the price on products on regular retail shelves is to make their prices appear cheaper. Thus hoping that customers will not do the mental arithmetic correctly or at all and will end up putting more in their basket/trolley. Then at the till will decide to overspend.
Considering that many people often only shop with a rough idea of budget it likely does work in tricking people to overspend, esp on some high tax goods.
Especially when you consider that many products have different tax bands. Before you even get to variation in states, you've got to consider that some products are going to be taxed differently.
Overread wrote: The only reason I can imagine that businesses in the USA don't want to include tax in the price on products on regular retail shelves is to make their prices appear cheaper. Thus hoping that customers will not do the mental arithmetic correctly or at all and will end up putting more in their basket/trolley. Then at the till will decide to overspend.
Considering that many people often only shop with a rough idea of budget it likely does work in tricking people to overspend, esp on some high tax goods.
Especially when you consider that many products have different tax bands. Before you even get to variation in states, you've got to consider that some products are going to be taxed differently.
Not many tax bands here, mostly alcohol, gasoline (petrol) and cigarettes when it comes to higher tax rates. And usually cigarettes, gas & alcohol prices do include taxes (mostly because they don't want to itemize the layers of taxes on those products, and make them obvious, because that just upsets people). Beer is often exempt from alcohol taxes and falls under the general sales tax.
In general, sales tax is a state thing, usually somewhere in the realm of 5 to 8 percent, depending on state. Most states (43 of 50) exempt grocery items from sales tax... often (but not always) including candy, but rarely soft drinks (the latter may also have a recycling fee attached, depending on the state, which used to be you could get back if you returned cans). My current state exempts clothing (and drugs) from sales tax, mostly to encourage people in neighboring states to shop here, to the point that manufacturers set up shop in 'outlet malls' in the first town along the highway from the state border (think a bunch of branded shops like GW stores, except for specific clothing brands).
A few states have no sales taxes at all. Local taxes happen, but they're largely tied to big cities
State income tax is where things get really weird.
----
But yes, pricing here is very psychologically driven. Most products are labelled at $X.99 so you're definitely paying one less whole dollar, because that actually works on people. Never mind that you're paying only 1 cent less on paper, and 5 to 8 cents more (per dollar) after taxes.
It also, you understand, has to do with the American attitude toward taxes, which, based on the founding of the country is considered inherently wrong, but an unfortunate necessity (at best). So the business owner is widely considered to be 'in the right' for just displaying the cost of the item, and the government is doing you (and the business owner) wrong by adding the tax on top of the _real_ price. So its clear who's 'really' sticking you when it comes to checkout.
Or at least that's what businesses want people to conclude.
AduroT wrote: I’m imaging the horror that would be changing the price tags on every single item in the store when the city increases the sales tax by $.01.
Unless there was some specific need to show the tax amount on the price tag, and assuming that scenario was a thing that might actually happen, I would expect that most stores would just absorb the cent, as it would generally be cheaper than relabelling everything.
AduroT wrote: I’m imaging the horror that would be changing the price tags on every single item in the store when the city increases the sales tax by $.01.
Unless there was some specific need to show the tax amount on the price tag, and assuming that scenario was a thing that might actually happen, I would expect that most stores would just absorb the cent, as it would generally be cheaper than relabelling everything.
Well, it wouldn't be one cent. Phildelphia, for example, instituted a local tax of 1% a decade or so ago, and that's going to add up across purchases surprisingly fast (If 500 people spend $100 a day in your store, you're out $500 each day at 1%). State sales tax changes come up for voting every decade or so, and while they don't often pass, a 0.5% change isn't unknown. Its easier not to deal with that at all, beyond a sign at the register blaming the state/city. Neither absorb the tax nor spend money changing labels. Just keep on with the show that it has nothing to do with them, log the amounts in receipts (and software) and carry on.
AduroT wrote: I’m imaging the horror that would be changing the price tags on every single item in the store when the city increases the sales tax by $.01.
Unless there was some specific need to show the tax amount on the price tag, and assuming that scenario was a thing that might actually happen, I would expect that most stores would just absorb the cent, as it would generally be cheaper than relabelling everything.
Well, it wouldn't be one cent. Phildelphia, for example, instituted a local tax of 1% a decade or so ago, and that's going to add up across purchases surprisingly fast (If 500 people spend $100 a day in your store, you're out $500 each day at 1%). State sales tax changes come up for voting every decade or so, and while they don't often pass, a 0.5% change isn't unknown. Its easier not to deal with that at all, beyond a sign at the register blaming the state/city. Neither absorb the tax nor spend money changing labels. Just keep on with the show that it has nothing to do with them, log the amounts in receipts (and software) and carry on.
It's not as simple as "always absorb the loss" and "always update the prices" - insaniak's point was there's a tipping point where spending the resources required to update all the price tags outweighs how much you lose by absorbing the loss, and that's when you make the effort. If the change is $0.01 per item, then you're probably a way off that being worth updating. If it's 1% on big ticket items - cars, for example - then it is probably worth doing.
Frequency of change is another factor as well - if, as you say, you're looking at changes once a decade or so, then updating makes more sense, as the cost of doing so is spread over a longer period. If you see changes yearly, on the other hand, then maybe it isn't as worthwhile, especially if the change is small.
This is a case where I wonder if tech could be used to make this more efficient/transparent - rather than having the paper ticket at the front of the shelf confirming the price, why not have a digital board along there, where you can show the item & price, and update it from off the shop floor? At that point you can probably avoid putting a price sticker on individual items, and you're good to go. I'm probably missing something here, but there you go...
Honestly I've not seen any shop pricing every single product in a long time. Most are now using a simple price label on a shelf/rack/strip/block of the same product. So instead of updating a little yellow price tag on a hundred of a product you just swap the little card slip in the sheath once and its done for every single one of those products.
Not to mention big businesses are changing prices all the time on products. Supermarkets do it all the time, prices shift up and down alongside deals and offers that also shift up and down. It's all part of destabilising the concept of how much an item is worth and on making some products appear cheaper so you feel empowered at making that choice of supermarket; even if by the end you've paid about the same price or more than normal because other products have slipped up in price or aren't on offer this week etc....
Plus how often do the states change tax rates? I'd imagine they aren't changing them every week nor even every month. So again its not going to be a continual nightmare of price changes every 5 seconds.
As for the cost of relabelling; an efficient store would just change the price tags at the same time as they check stock, restock and tidy up the racks before opening.
AduroT wrote: I’m imaging the horror that would be changing the price tags on every single item in the store when the city increases the sales tax by $.01.
Unless there was some specific need to show the tax amount on the price tag, and assuming that scenario was a thing that might actually happen, I would expect that most stores would just absorb the cent, as it would generally be cheaper than relabelling everything.
Well, it wouldn't be one cent. Phildelphia, for example, instituted a local tax of 1% a decade or so ago, and that's going to add up across purchases surprisingly fast (If 500 people spend $100 a day in your store, you're out $500 each day at 1%). State sales tax changes come up for voting every decade or so, and while they don't often pass, a 0.5% change isn't unknown. Its easier not to deal with that at all, beyond a sign at the register blaming the state/city. Neither absorb the tax nor spend money changing labels. Just keep on with the show that it has nothing to do with them, log the amounts in receipts (and software) and carry on.
It's not as simple as "always absorb the loss" and "always update the prices" - insaniak's point was there's a tipping point where spending the resources required to update all the price tags outweighs how much you lose by absorbing the loss, and that's when you make the effort. If the change is $0.01 per item, then you're probably a way off that being worth updating. If it's 1% on big ticket items - cars, for example - then it is probably worth doing.
Frequency of change is another factor as well - if, as you say, you're looking at changes once a decade or so, then updating makes more sense, as the cost of doing so is spread over a longer period. If you see changes yearly, on the other hand, then maybe it isn't as worthwhile, especially if the change is small.
This is a case where I wonder if tech could be used to make this more efficient/transparent - rather than having the paper ticket at the front of the shelf confirming the price, why not have a digital board along there, where you can show the item & price, and update it from off the shop floor? At that point you can probably avoid putting a price sticker on individual items, and you're good to go. I'm probably missing something here, but there you go...
I was in a French supermarket about 15 years ago where all the prices on the shelf were displayed on LCD screens. It still amazes me this is the only place I've seen that in all the time since. Even taking the analogue way of working into account, Overread's point is correct. No large shops around here price every individual item. It's always done on the shelf. When I worked part-time in retail I used to have to change prices every Tuesday morning. It was annoying and laborious but didn't take that much time to do.
Here in Europe, meanwhile, many supermarkets have LCD price tags on the shelves that can be updated automatically.
If the store wants to increase the price of every product by 1%, it's just a matter of pressing a button and every price tag in the store updates. The tags link to the same database as the checkouts and stock control system.
EDIT: Didn't see Slipspace's post before I posted. It's not just French supermarkets (although I think they are most common here), these LCD tags are widely used all over Europe now. I've even seen them in the UK (can't remember which supermarket it was, though).
Sales tax here is expressed as $.01 per dollar. Every dollar of the price is taxed an extra X cents, which currently is 6 or 7 Iirc depending on which city in the metro you’re in. So that $.01 tax increase isn’t just $.01. So yeah, basically 1%.
LunarSol wrote: Stores adjust the price on all their inventory all the time. This is not a real problem.
Exactly, sales change weekly and the store employees go around taking down and putting up new tags without it being the end of the world.
I remember watching the front of the shop employees go through that routine all the time when I was working in the pharmacy.
Also generally speaking when laws change there's a deadline to implement them and they kind of phase in over time. Something not all dissimilar happened when calorie counts were being added to menus along with the price.
Hate to say it - because I love the film to bits, but hands down it would have to be most of ALIENS.
Where to begin? Leaving a military vessel completely unmanned by taking everyone planet side? An untested and incompetent officer given charge of both a navy warship and a platoon of marines? Ripley having any trust in a company she knows - the hard way - for its deceit, "we don't know what you're talking about", bribey and murder, and also has its hand in bioweapons? Why the need for a queen when there is a derelict ship containing thousands of eggs? Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
Jurassic Park also comes in for a kicking!
Sam Jackson( bless'im! ) switches off the power to the whole park and needs to go and switch it back on at the utility shed, at the end of the compound...
"Yeah, sure. Go ahead mate."
Laura Dern( bless'er ) thinks Sam has been gone a while and wants to just check up on him and see how he's doing...
"Whoa, whoa - hang on there! Its not just a walk in the park, y'know! Let me grab a gun!"
Why didn’t the ancient Egyptians just meltdown the bracelet?|
Would’ve saved a lot of bother!
Ah. One of my least favorite tropes.
Never, ever 'curse' your worst enemy with immortality and/or untold magical power. It's just really stupid.
Have a 'Weekend at Bernie's' with his corpse instead. Humiliate his name and legacy.
Kind of adjacent, in the first Frasier Mummy they use a forbidden spell that had never been cast before - so how did they know how to do it? In a literate society like the Egyptians I guess there could be a lost papyrus somewhere, but if it's never been used, how do you even know it works?
Of course now as I write this up it seems a lot more plausible than it did at the time.
Oh, speaking of Jurassic Park, in Juarassic World when they stumble upon a garage with a jeep from the original park that's been sitting there for 20 years and they're able to start it up... So it was in a tropical setting and didn't rust solid? And the fuel didn't turn to gel? And all the gaskets and tubing wasn't disintegrated?
bbb wrote: Oh, speaking of Jurassic Park, in Juarassic World when they stumble upon a garage with a jeep from the original park that's been sitting there for 20 years and they're able to start it up... So it was in a tropical setting and didn't rust solid? And the fuel didn't turn to gel? And all the gaskets and tubing wasn't disintegrated?
NONSENSE!!!
Oh my god, sorry if this was brought up before, but in Jurassic World 2 they transfuse blood from a T-Rex to a velociraptor. Their justification was that "they were both therapods." That's like successfully transfusing blood from a lemur to a human because "they're both primates." I yelled these things out loud. Nonsense!
Hmm...this one is an internal consistency thing and not a 'that wouldn't work' thing.
But how is Superman (1978) able to fly so fast that he can circle the Earth many times a second and 'break the time barrier', but not fly fast enough to divert two ICBMs heading in opposite directions? The writing is actually kind of a mess at the end of that film.
AduroT wrote: I’m imaging the horror that would be changing the price tags on every single item in the store when the city increases the sales tax by $.01.
Most big retail companies change hundreds of prices every day. Generally tax rate changes are a lot more rare than that.
Where to begin? Leaving a military vessel completely unmanned by taking everyone planet side? An untested and incompetent officer given charge of both a navy warship and a platoon of marines? Ripley having any trust in a company she knows - the hard way - for its deceit, "we don't know what you're talking about", bribey and murder, and also has its hand in bioweapons? Why the need for a queen when there is a derelict ship containing thousands of eggs? Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
Where to begin? Leaving a military vessel completely unmanned by taking everyone planet side?
Seemed like a SOP to me. The ship is automated. This was not a combat operation, but a scouting force to check on the colony. Also, the Company made sure that as few people as possible were on the mission, to contain any info leaking out. Burke wanted this find to be his.
An untested and incompetent officer given charge of both a navy warship and a platoon of marines?
- Ripley: How many drops is this for you, Lieutenant?
- Gorman: Thirty eight... simulated.
- Vasquez: How many *combat* drops?
- Gorman: Uh, two. Including this one.
Gorman is not totally untested. He has one combat drop under his belt at least…
Ripley having any trust in a company she knows - the hard way - for its deceit, "we don't know what you're talking about", bribey and murder, and also has its hand in bioweapons?
Ripley did not trust the company at all. She decided to go along with the team only after days/weeks/months of nightmares… She did not trust the Company at all, but she did have some trust on the Colonial Marines. At least she hoped that they were going to kill the aliens instead of studying them. And since Burke had to try to “impregnate” Ripley and Newt in secret, obviously the Company did not have a full control of the Colonial Marines.
Why the need for a queen when there is a derelict ship containing thousands of eggs?
Because the Alien life cycle centers around a queen establishing a hive?
Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
From wiki: “The Alien (also known as a Xenomorph XX121 or Internecivus raptus)
The term xenomorph (lit. "alien form"—from Greek xeno-, which translates as either "other" or "strange", and -morph, which denotes shape) was first used by the character Lieutenant Gorman in Aliens with reference to generic extraterrestrial life. The term was erroneously assumed by some fans to refer specifically to this creature, and the word was used by the producers of some merchandise.”
So, yes, the humans have encountered xenomorphs before and gone even on “bug hunts”. They might have been literally bugs, i.e, insects or just resembled insects, so they are called “bugs” because of that.
But the bug hunts the marines talked about did not reference the species in the Aliens movie. The marines had not encountered that species before. That is why they were so nonchalant and confident about it. They literally did not know what they were going up against. They obviously did not put much weight on a civilian “truckers” explanation on what the creature was capable of.
They did not think Ripley was a fruit cake for seeing “alien life form”, but just thought that she was exaggerating what the creature was capable of. (As Hudson put it; “How can they do that, they are just animals?”.)
It is obvious that humanity has encountered “alien life forms” before as they even had a generic term for them (xenomorphs).
Col Hammer wrote: Because the Alien life cycle centers around a queen establishing a hive?
Well in all fairness that wasn't true until that film. In the first film the discussed life cycle from the designers was different but Cameron and company changed it up a bit. It was a nice addition but it wasn't that way from the outset.
What is nonsense to me is the idea that some dude is holding up the world. Such a goofy, crazy idea when we know that no such being is really performing such a task.
Those were dummy wires. The real wires are all internal!
Y'know, that'd be a nice twist to see at some point - though maybe on a secondary device before the finale.
There's also the Castle approach - when in doubt, rip all the wires out with 1 second to go. If it all goes wrong, you've not really made matters any worse
Don't forget a core element of Aliens is overconfidence of the Marines. They are used to "bug hunts" against less intelligent xenos and likely less capable/violent creatures. Don't forget most of what Riply claims sounds nuts - acid for blood etc...
So chances are they think she's a scared person who got way out of her depth and over-exaggerated most of the claims. Plus the parent company hiring the marines is also agreeing with that, its a scouting mission that expects to find a few troublesome alien dogs if anything; rather than an organised hive that has infested and killed off colonising population etc...
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: When Mr Stereotype Evil Terrorist builds a bomb, why don’t they paint the wires the same colour upon completion?
Or, if really taking their time, just use the same coloured wires from the get go.
Go on. Last second your way out of that one, Mr Clever Clogs Hero!
Have you ever wired up anything? While, yes you can use the same color wires, if you don't label them you stand a risk of messing something up and not being able to figure out how to fix it.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: When Mr Stereotype Evil Terrorist builds a bomb, why don’t they paint the wires the same colour upon completion?
Or, if really taking their time, just use the same coloured wires from the get go.
Go on. Last second your way out of that one, Mr Clever Clogs Hero!
Have you ever wired up anything? While, yes you can use the same color wires, if you don't label them you stand a risk of messing something up and not being able to figure out how to fix it.
Wire it up and then spray paint the whole thing? Ooooo, encase the wires in a block of resin.
In the real world I'm sure many of those things have been done. It's why you often don't hear of them disarming a device, but doing a controlled explosion instead. It's generally far safer to let a standard bomb blow up safe and away from people than it is to disarm it.
Of course against an organised military force it can be different, the UK used to disarm bombs dropped by Nazi planes, but then they were dealing with mass produced munitions built to the same standards so once you had a process you could repeat it. And even then they had false triggers, traps and even bombs that were designed not to blow up upon impact, but to specifically sit there for the bomb disposal to come and try to disarm it and then blow up.
Overread wrote: Honestly I've not seen any shop pricing every single product in a long time. Most are now using a simple price label on a shelf/rack/strip/block of the same product. So instead of updating a little yellow price tag on a hundred of a product you just swap the little card slip in the sheath once and its done for every single one of those products.
Not to mention big businesses are changing prices all the time on products. Supermarkets do it all the time, prices shift up and down alongside deals and offers that also shift up and down. It's all part of destabilising the concept of how much an item is worth and on making some products appear cheaper so you feel empowered at making that choice of supermarket; even if by the end you've paid about the same price or more than normal because other products have slipped up in price or aren't on offer this week etc....
Plus how often do the states change tax rates? I'd imagine they aren't changing them every week nor even every month. So again its not going to be a continual nightmare of price changes every 5 seconds.
As for the cost of relabelling; an efficient store would just change the price tags at the same time as they check stock, restock and tidy up the racks before opening.
Well, FMR....
It's damn weird you said this about not seeing prices on items for a long time, because i felt the same way until literally yesterday. I was in a small hardware store called dewalt toolco and most, not all, but most items in it had actual paper prices on them. I was in these looking for a good stap blade cutter for foamcore and i thought it was a real blast from the past to see actual paper prices on stuff.
Just watched the latest Terminator and I quite enjoyed it. However... I can watch time travelling fluidic metal robot assassins with no problem, but one bit stuck out at that upset the flow for a bit, which was a shame as what followed was a rather lengthy segment and it was pretty obvious that what made me shout Nonsense!! was only crammed in as a way to chivvy the plot to the big set piece.
Spoiler:
Just over half way through the film Sarah says she has a contact who can get her an EMP - I'm cool with this film logic. They are then attacked by the Terminator and flee towards an airbase - here's where things get bs. The contact is a major. In the commissioned world that means he's a nobody. Just about qualified to lead his section but possessing no real power. And somehow he manages to call the guard post to tell them to let a non-military white van through security unchecked (Nonsense!!) and tells the C5 crew chief to go away when they board his plane (Nonsense!!), and then claims that he (a lowly unimportant major) will somehow buy them some time to take off (utter gibberish). And then somehow they get a fast jet escort?
Sci-fi time travelling killer robots and wannabe iron-woman I can accept. But a major being able to coordinate all that? Give me a break.
Henry wrote: Just watched the latest Terminator and I quite enjoyed it. However... I can watch time travelling fluidic metal robot assassins with no problem, but one bit stuck out at that upset the flow for a bit, which was a shame as what followed was a rather lengthy segment and it was pretty obvious that what made me shout Nonsense!! was only crammed in as a way to chivvy the plot to the big set piece.
Spoiler:
Just over half way through the film Sarah says she has a contact who can get her an EMP - I'm cool with this film logic. They are then attacked by the Terminator and flee towards an airbase - here's where things get bs. The contact is a major. In the commissioned world that means he's a nobody. Just about qualified to lead his section but possessing no real power. And somehow he manages to call the guard post to tell them to let a non-military white van through security unchecked (Nonsense!!) and tells the C5 crew chief to go away when they board his plane (Nonsense!!), and then claims that he (a lowly unimportant major) will somehow buy them some time to take off (utter gibberish). And then somehow they get a fast jet escort?
Sci-fi time travelling killer robots and wannabe iron-woman I can accept. But a major being able to coordinate all that? Give me a break.
You're thinking like a Brit but in the USAF that Major could be running the security forces squadron, he could be the DO (#2) of the C5 squadron or he could be the exec for the General who commands the base so people assume he's speaking for the general which would make coordinating that in the realm of standard suspension of disbelief, even if the repercussions would be rather significant
If you want more time travelling killer robots, try a weird little movie called A.P.E.X., which was a low budget scifi apocalypse time travel movie with some damn cool killer robots.
The plot's a head scratcher, but damn those killer robots are cool.
Henry wrote: Just watched the latest Terminator and I quite enjoyed it. However... I can watch time travelling fluidic metal robot assassins with no problem, but one bit stuck out at that upset the flow for a bit, which was a shame as what followed was a rather lengthy segment and it was pretty obvious that what made me shout Nonsense!! was only crammed in as a way to chivvy the plot to the big set piece.
Spoiler:
Just over half way through the film Sarah says she has a contact who can get her an EMP - I'm cool with this film logic. They are then attacked by the Terminator and flee towards an airbase - here's where things get bs. The contact is a major. In the commissioned world that means he's a nobody. Just about qualified to lead his section but possessing no real power. And somehow he manages to call the guard post to tell them to let a non-military white van through security unchecked (Nonsense!!) and tells the C5 crew chief to go away when they board his plane (Nonsense!!), and then claims that he (a lowly unimportant major) will somehow buy them some time to take off (utter gibberish). And then somehow they get a fast jet escort?
Sci-fi time travelling killer robots and wannabe iron-woman I can accept. But a major being able to coordinate all that? Give me a break.
You're thinking like a Brit but in the USAF that Major could be running the security forces squadron, he could be the DO (#2) of the C5 squadron or he could be the exec for the General who commands the base so people assume he's speaking for the general which would make coordinating that in the realm of standard suspension of disbelief, even if the repercussions would be rather significant
Seriously. A Major in the US Military is by no means lowly.
Matt Swain wrote: If you want more time travelling killer robots, try a weird little movie called A.P.E.X., which was a low budget scifi apocalypse time travel movie with some damn cool killer robots.
The plot's a head scratcher, but damn those killer robots are cool.
Now that is a blast from the past. Quite entertaining if memory serves correcly.
Those were dummy wires. The real wires are all internal!
I remember some movie or another with several bombs having been planted on a cruise liner. Crack bomb squad is flown onto the ship and spot what appears to be a booby trap - two contacts close to one another but not touching - assumption: don't let them touch! Sidekick puts a block between them so they don't set off but BOOOM! A very, very thin wire between the contacts meant keeping them apart was the wrong thing to do.
So there are crafty bomb makers out there in fictionland.
Those were dummy wires. The real wires are all internal!
I remember some movie or another with several bombs having been planted on a cruise liner. Crack bomb squad is flown onto the ship and spot what appears to be a booby trap - two contacts close to one another but not touching - assumption: don't let them touch! Sidekick puts a block between them so they don't set off but BOOOM! A very, very thin wire between the contacts meant keeping them apart was the wrong thing to do.
So there are crafty bomb makers out there in fictionland.
An excellent technothriller/crime drama with film noir elements that, if any move needs to be redone, certainly is one.
Another movie so nice I'll mention it twice is 1990's "hardware".
Scifi? Check. Killer robot? Check. Post apocalypse? Check. Time travel? Well, 3 out of 4 ain't bad. Long unavailable due to legal problems you may have missed it. If so you might want to correct that regrettable situation.
gorgon wrote: Hmm...this one is an internal consistency thing and not a 'that wouldn't work' thing.
But how is Superman (1978) able to fly so fast that he can circle the Earth many times a second and 'break the time barrier', but not fly fast enough to divert two ICBMs heading in opposite directions? The writing is actually kind of a mess at the end of that film.
gorgon wrote: Hmm...this one is an internal consistency thing and not a 'that wouldn't work' thing.
But how is Superman (1978) able to fly so fast that he can circle the Earth many times a second and 'break the time barrier', but not fly fast enough to divert two ICBMs heading in opposite directions? The writing is actually kind of a mess at the end of that film.
gorgon wrote: Hmm...this one is an internal consistency thing and not a 'that wouldn't work' thing.
But how is Superman (1978) able to fly so fast that he can circle the Earth many times a second and 'break the time barrier', but not fly fast enough to divert two ICBMs heading in opposite directions? The writing is actually kind of a mess at the end of that film.
When they find the Prison in season 3 is a decent plot device, what with it being naturally fortified.
But, I just can’t buy that Hershell wouldn’t have known about it? Not only is he local, but one imagines farmers, with all their outbuildings an escapee might hole up in, would have a vested interest in knowing what correctional facilities might be in their area?
When they find the Prison in season 3 is a decent plot device, what with it being naturally fortified.
But, I just can’t buy that Hershell wouldn’t have known about it? Not only is he local, but one imagines farmers, with all their outbuildings an escapee might hole up in, would have a vested interest in knowing what correctional facilities might be in their area?
I know of two prisons in my area because I've regularly driven by them for work, but before that I had no idea they existed.
There's a prison within a 40min drive from where I am and until I had to work near there I had never seen it nor had reason to go near it. Thing is even knowing there's a prison there it doesn't tell you what kind of prison it is or what facilities it has which are practical or serviceable.
Honestly it might not be the first place I'd think of to go hide. I'd more likely think of the army base near to the prison as a better option.
Then again if all social order has broken down and most people are hostile you might avoid natural fortifications under the thinking that others will already have armed themsleves there and could be even more dangerous
When they find the Prison in season 3 is a decent plot device, what with it being naturally fortified.
But, I just can’t buy that Hershell wouldn’t have known about it? Not only is he local, but one imagines farmers, with all their outbuildings an escapee might hole up in, would have a vested interest in knowing what correctional facilities might be in their area?
Not really- as others have mentioned, small prisons don't really get advertised. You'll see signs very near it, but states and counties don't make a big deal of letting people know where they are.
For the farming aspect... out west, maybe. East coast farming is pretty contained. Our three barns are within 50' of the house, and we're pretty spread out by local standards. The guy down the road, his main barn is just on the other side of his driveway, and you'll probably kick a chicken going from one to the other. His sheep pen is admittedly across the road, but anyone trying to hide in there is going to have to deal with a tidal wave of sheep. It won't go unnoticed.
If someone were to try to hide in one of our barns during the winter... good luck. In the smaller one they'd only have about 10 tons of startled, panicked animals to deal with. In the main barn with the mothers (who've got young calves)? We'll clean up the mess in the morning. We once had a vulture land too near the herd when they were out in the field, shortly after calving time (I suspect it was after a shed placenta). The resulting smear looked like it had a blast radius- the whole herd just... converged, and the problem was rather permanently solved.
In TWD I'm thinking zombies would overwhelm and consume the animals, or they would die without humans to care for them.
Speaking of BS in my favorite movies, I gotta admit that Aliens served up a double helping of total BS scenes.
One was the 'fusion reactor out of control" bit. Honestly, today it's really hellish to get a fusion reaction to start outside of a brief one in a nuclear warhead. If we did get fusion reactors i have a verrrry hard time imagine one running out of control and building up to a huge explosion. More likely the reactor would shut down the fuel feed to the reactor and the reaction would stop. And the reactor's safeties were working well enough to 'vent' so again I really can't see a fusion reactor building up to a massive nebraska sized explosion.
As to the alien queen hiding in the dropship lading gear, yeah, BS. On a military vessel space is at a premium. The idea of the queen finding enough empty (wasted) space to hide in in pretty BS to me. Hell, the wheelwells on a 747 are barely large enough to hide a man in. You think a milspec craft is going to waste enough space to hide a SUV in?
To be fair the Alien nest was built within the reactor building and it was clear that the colonists had engaged the Aliens before being overrun. There is every chance that the reactors safeties were damaged during those events. Either during the battles; as part of the colonists final attempt at defiance in blowing it all up to kill the aliens; or as part of the Alien's expansion of their own nest and hive causing damage/blocking off vents etc...
Whilst the Aliens are intelligent, they are all very young and clearly have not mastered their prey environment. Interestingly the comics always keep the aliens as being quite feral in nature even with their intelligence. Personally I've always held the view that, if left alone for long enough, they would master the technologies of their hosts.
Overread wrote: To be fair the Alien nest was built within the reactor building and it was clear that the colonists had engaged the Aliens before being overrun. There is every chance that the reactors safeties were damaged during those events. Either during the battles; as part of the colonists final attempt at defiance in blowing it all up to kill the aliens; or as part of the Alien's expansion of their own nest and hive causing damage/blocking off vents etc...
Whilst the Aliens are intelligent, they are all very young and clearly have not mastered their prey environment. Interestingly the comics always keep the aliens as being quite feral in nature even with their intelligence. Personally I've always held the view that, if left alone for long enough, they would master the technologies of their hosts.
So we can just sit back and wait for them to addicted to Candy Crush? I'm getting images of the end of Young Frankenstein where 'the monster' ends up married and reading The Wall Street Journal in bed......
Overread wrote: To be fair the Alien nest was built within the reactor building and it was clear that the colonists had engaged the Aliens before being overrun. There is every chance that the reactors safeties were damaged during those events. Either during the battles; as part of the colonists final attempt at defiance in blowing it all up to kill the aliens; or as part of the Alien's expansion of their own nest and hive causing damage/blocking off vents etc...
Whilst the Aliens are intelligent, they are all very young and clearly have not mastered their prey environment. Interestingly the comics always keep the aliens as being quite feral in nature even with their intelligence. Personally I've always held the view that, if left alone for long enough, they would master the technologies of their hosts.
So we can just sit back and wait for them to addicted to Candy Crush? I'm getting images of the end of Young Frankenstein where 'the monster' ends up married and reading The Wall Street Journal in bed......
Hey it could happen. Movie wise we've never really seen a settled matured hive infest a world and remain in power for a prolonged period of time. Xenos have high dexterity and clearly have very capable fing...claws. That they can work out even basic things within hours of being birthed suggests a high level of adaptability and data processing going on in their heads. Whilst one might presume that Queens and other higher-order Xenos might well be the only ones that develop higher functions; its potential within the creature.
Like I said before, the comics at least tend to lean toward Xenos being smart but ultimately very feral in nature; so even the few mature hives and the hive world are shown as more feral and wild. That said I think when you look at them as a species they have potential to develop technologies or at least to rise to a point where they can adapt and use those of hteir foes.
Its been a long time since I saw it, but there was some film that might have been Live Free or Die Hard where a hacker character...hacked the street lamps to turn them all off at one point, which just made me laugh out loud for like 2 minutes.
Was that Die Hard 4? Isn't that the one he drives a car into dividing bollard which somehow launches it into the air to take out a helicopter? That film is nonsense from start to finish.
In the battle in the forest scene when the lines are trading volleys of fire, the 54th doesn't have bayonets on their rifles, but during the transition when the charge is ordered and the camera switch back to the troops all of their bayonets are equipped.
In the battle in the forest scene when the lines are trading volleys of fire, the 54th doesn't have bayonets on their rifles, but during the transition when the charge is ordered and the camera switch back to the troops all of their bayonets are equipped.
Clearly they forgot that WYSIWYG
You'd want to leave the bayonets off while firing repeated volleys, and only fix bayonets for making or repelling charges.
Just imagine trying to reload a muzzle-loader while there's a bayonet there to poke holes in your hands if you're not EXTREMELY careful. This dramatically slows down reloading, and therefore rate-of-fire.
SamusDrake wrote: Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
We are not actually shown any examples of any other form of extra-terrestrial life in the Alien franchise apart from the dead space jockey and the alien itself. Also, considering the sheer scale of the galaxy and the fact that they are terraforming planets rather than finding naturally habitable worlds, it is actually reasonably likely that they have not encountered any alien life, or at least alien life beyond microbial or flora. The colonisation is being carried out by corporations, they are only colonising worlds they can make a profit from, likely from resource extraction seeing as the Nostromo was hauling ore back to Earth.
As for xenomorph, that is a catch all term for any alien life form and the way they use the term bug hunt doesn't seem to me to suggest that they have encountered any alien life, but rather that it is a term which indicates it is a waste of time, akin to the phrase wild goose chase.
In the battle in the forest scene when the lines are trading volleys of fire, the 54th doesn't have bayonets on their rifles, but during the transition when the charge is ordered and the camera switch back to the troops all of their bayonets are equipped.
Clearly they forgot that WYSIWYG
You'd want to leave the bayonets off while firing repeated volleys, and only fix bayonets for making or repelling charges.
Just imagine trying to reload a muzzle-loader while there's a bayonet there to poke holes in your hands if you're not EXTREMELY careful. This dramatically slows down reloading, and therefore rate-of-fire.
Yeah, won't be managing 3 rounds a minute in any weather if you're having to avoid stabbing your own hand as you do so!
In the battle in the forest scene when the lines are trading volleys of fire, the 54th doesn't have bayonets on their rifles, but during the transition when the charge is ordered and the camera switch back to the troops all of their bayonets are equipped.
Clearly they forgot that WYSIWYG
You'd want to leave the bayonets off while firing repeated volleys, and only fix bayonets for making or repelling charges.
Just imagine trying to reload a muzzle-loader while there's a bayonet there to poke holes in your hands if you're not EXTREMELY careful. This dramatically slows down reloading, and therefore rate-of-fire.
No.
I'm saying that in the course of like 3 seconds, they go from having no bayonets to have all their bayonets and at no point are any of them shown putting them on. In fact, the time between the last volley and the order to charge is so short the sudden appearance of bayonets can only be explained by a cut where they fitted the bayonets before resuming the scene. It's almost a blink and you'll miss it moment.
My personal most hated film for Nonsense!!! is 2012.
Literally within the first ten minutes or so we get neutrinos, a form of matter which likes to basically ignore that matter exists and fly straight through as it only interacts via the weak force, decide to suddenly start boiling heavy water and heating up the Earth's core.
SamusDrake wrote: Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
We are not actually shown any examples of any other form of extra-terrestrial life in the Alien franchise apart from the dead space jockey and the alien itself. Also, considering the sheer scale of the galaxy and the fact that they are terraforming planets rather than finding naturally habitable worlds, it is actually reasonably likely that they have not encountered any alien life, or at least alien life beyond microbial or flora. The colonisation is being carried out by corporations, they are only colonising worlds they can make a profit from, likely from resource extraction seeing as the Nostromo was hauling ore back to Earth.
As for xenomorph, that is a catch all term for any alien life form and the way they use the term bug hunt doesn't seem to me to suggest that they have encountered any alien life, but rather that it is a term which indicates it is a waste of time, akin to the phrase wild goose chase.
Also don't forget its not just an alien. It's an alien that infested and hatched from one of the crew and within less than a few days was fully grown, mature and hunting them; it has acid for blood, appears to have no eyes but has no sensory weakness; is stealthy as heck; killed a whole crew including a robot and, by virtue of the ship being blown up (and the company cover up) there's not a single CCTV or record of it save for the one crew member who escaped and who admitted to blowing up the ship.
Basically in a universe where they've clearly not encountered any higher-life-form xenos at all this sounds like a nightmare monster. More likely to be someone going space-mad than an actual fact. The fact that any physical or digital evidence is being hidden by the company means there really is very little for others to believe.
Basically on the ship sent in Aliens there's only two people who know there's a real alien. The rest are likely expecting a colony where something has gone amiss; perhaps space pirates; uprising/unrest within the colony or even just a breakdown of equipment following freak weather/accidents.
SamusDrake wrote: Colonising planets for the last 57 years - and long before that - but everyone treats Ripley as a fruit cake for claimed to have seen an alien lifeform...yet the marines are aware of "xenomorphs" and have even gone on "bug hunts".
We are not actually shown any examples of any other form of extra-terrestrial life in the Alien franchise apart from the dead space jockey and the alien itself. Also, considering the sheer scale of the galaxy and the fact that they are terraforming planets rather than finding naturally habitable worlds, it is actually reasonably likely that they have not encountered any alien life, or at least alien life beyond microbial or flora. The colonisation is being carried out by corporations, they are only colonising worlds they can make a profit from, likely from resource extraction seeing as the Nostromo was hauling ore back to Earth.
As for xenomorph, that is a catch all term for any alien life form and the way they use the term bug hunt doesn't seem to me to suggest that they have encountered any alien life, but rather that it is a term which indicates it is a waste of time, akin to the phrase wild goose chase.
Also don't forget its not just an alien. It's an alien that infested and hatched from one of the crew and within less than a few days was fully grown, mature and hunting them; it has acid for blood, appears to have no eyes but has no sensory weakness; is stealthy as heck; killed a whole crew including a robot and, by virtue of the ship being blown up (and the company cover up) there's not a single CCTV or record of it save for the one crew member who escaped and who admitted to blowing up the ship.
Basically in a universe where they've clearly not encountered any higher-life-form xenos at all this sounds like a nightmare monster. More likely to be someone going space-mad than an actual fact. The fact that any physical or digital evidence is being hidden by the company means there really is very little for others to believe.
Basically on the ship sent in Aliens there's only two people who know there's a real alien. The rest are likely expecting a colony where something has gone amiss; perhaps space pirates; uprising/unrest within the colony or even just a breakdown of equipment following freak weather/accidents.
"Hey, I sure wouldn't mind getting some more of that Arcturian poontang, remember that time?"
"Yeah, Frost, but the one that you had was male."
"It doesn't matter when it's Arcturian, baby."
―Pvt. Frost and Pvt. Spunkmeyer
The Arcturians are a humanoid, mammal-like extraterrestrial species native to the planet Arcturus.[1] They were the first sentient alien species encountered by mankind[2] and humanity has since established interspecies trade with them.[3]
Alien wiki says that humanity have already encountered other alien species. And even if we ignore wiki and just focus on the movie, that conversation between Frost and Spunkmeyer Still indicates they are talking about something other than humans.
Also, why name the Dropship "Bug Stomper" if they never have "stomped any bugs"? The marines talk about "bug hunts" as if it was something real. The Bugs don't need to have human level intelligence though. They could be just a local equivalent of rats/wolves/bears that some colonists needed help to fight against. The marines did not seem to think the "Bug Hunts" were that big of a deal.
It's not that they have never encountered ANY alien life in the alien universe. It's that they have never encountered anything that was SO alien.
Arcturians are as they say humanoid and mammalian. Bug hunts is because they have found other insectoid species that amount to threatening pests that needed to be put down.
The titular alien is a level of lethal that has not been encountered before, and as others have pointed out, such a mish-mash of nightmare features that it sounds like a ghost story with no evidence.
Xenomorph is a catch all phrase not the name of the specific species. The specific species is actually called Xenomorph xx121 with it's scientific name most often given as "Internecivus raptus" meaning murderous thief.
There was nothing in the canon that states Arctirians were not simply an ethnic group of humans on a world called Arcturus. Casual racism fits better with the themes and style of Aliens than experience with an actual sapient species (which would lend credence to Ripley’s claims).
There’s a lot of baggage from the Vietnam War in the movie, and the Arcturian poon tang line is evocative of that.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: There was nothing in the canon that states Arctirians were not simply an ethnic group of humans on a world called Arcturus. Casual racism fits better with the themes and style of Aliens than experience with an actual sapient species (which would lend credence to Ripley’s claims).
There’s a lot of baggage from the Vietnam War in the movie, and the Arcturian poon tang line is evocative of that.
The movie definitely doesn't imply that that Acturian's were aliens. It's pretty obvious that whole bit was a throw back to Vietnam era gak shooting, and the rampant prostitution and sex trade the US military personnel (albeit, mostly in a way that was casual rather than explicitly) was party too during the war.
Arcturians being aliens comes from a non-canon book published in 2014 (it's even cited by the wiki). I also think that's clearly not what the movie itself was trying to imply. The word 'bug hunt' is used in a sense that feels like its meant to be 'wild goose chase' and no one at any point takes Ripley's story seriously, which would be weird if humanity had extensive knowledge that advanced alien lifeforms existed. It's possible the marines have encountered some alien life but it was probably just pests and such and nothing that actually mattered. The Colonial Marines spent most of their time dealing with rebellions and chasing shadows based on frivolous complaints from colonists (and this is reaching for their technical manual, which isn't really anymore canon than the book people are referencing but at least comes from some of the same people who made the movie).
But really, the Alien canon is an utter mess, so it may not be worth quibbling over. There's never really been any attempt at keeping the franchise coherent across entries.
The Colonial Marines Technical Manual had a lot of thought out into it and clearly fits the setting. The “Arcturians are space mammals” comes from the same school of low-effort cash ins as the Ghostbusters comics that show the large and moving Torb and the Giant Sloar are both pretty much just space dinosaurs.
Well, I think everybody were acting pretty blasé if this was indeed the humanitys (possible) first contact with any extra-terrestrial species (sapient or not).
Also, why was there a term Xenomorph thrown around in the briefing if humanity had never encountered any extra-terrestrial lifeforms (sapient or not) while they were gallivanting around the galaxy...
Col Hammer wrote: Well, I think everybody were acting pretty blasé if this was indeed the humanitys (possible) first contact with any extra-terrestrial species (sapient or not).
Also, why was there a term Xenomorph thrown around in the briefing if humanity had never encountered any extra-terrestrial lifeforms (sapient or not) while they were gallivanting around the galaxy...
A generic phrase with Greek roots? They could have just invented it, or they might have theorized it long before the encounter as a possibility. IDK. Because the plot called for a name.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: We have the word xenomorph right now. And everyone understands what it means without us having met any aliens.
"All we know is that there’s still no contact with the colony," replies the lieutenant, Gorman, "and that a xenomorph may be involved."
"Excuse me, sir," interjects PFC Frost from the back row, "—a what?"
"A xenomorph," repeats Gorman, emphasizing the syllables.
It seems that not everyone understands what it means…
BobtheInquisitor wrote: We have the word xenomorph right now. And everyone understands what it means without us having met any aliens.
While the word obviously existed before Aliens II it's only in wider use (I would posit) due to the Alien franchise. Which begs the idea that the marines in a movie use a term made common because of the same movie! The movie Aliens II exists in the fictional world of Aliens II.
Suffice it to say that I'm sure their world setting has words for aliens including Xenomorph. Soldiers and those used to dealing with people and fighting and such likely dont' have any need to know the term because, there just aren't Xenomorphs out there for them to have encountered and used it in common parlance.
It's much like when things change in the world we live in and once uncommon terms become common. I'm sure electric cars are introducing new terms and concepts to even mechanics even though there's nothing new in the electrical systems as concepts. It's just something they've never had to learn/use/interact with before.
Broadly speaking most people learn what they need of the world to function - what they need for their job; life and interests. Anything outside can be interesting, but unless it affects them they are less likely to devote time to learning it.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: We have the word xenomorph right now. And everyone understands what it means without us having met any aliens.
"All we know is that there’s still no contact with the colony," replies the lieutenant, Gorman, "and that a xenomorph may be involved."
"Excuse me, sir," interjects PFC Frost from the back row, "—a what?"
"A xenomorph," repeats Gorman, emphasizing the syllables.
It seems that not everyone understands what it means…
If anything, that just strengthens my point that “xenomorph” the word existing does not mean humanity has met salient aliens. It’s being used how more like how someone today would use it, and getting the kind of response that wouldn’t make sense if humanity had made the ultimate discovery, a shift in our understanding of life in the universe so profound it would be unavoidable even for ....grunts.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: We have the word xenomorph right now. And everyone understands what it means without us having met any aliens.
"All we know is that there’s still no contact with the colony," replies the lieutenant, Gorman, "and that a xenomorph may be involved."
"Excuse me, sir," interjects PFC Frost from the back row, "—a what?"
"A xenomorph," repeats Gorman, emphasizing the syllables.
It seems that not everyone understands what it means…
If anything, that just strengthens my point that “xenomorph” the word existing does not mean humanity has met salient aliens. It’s being used how more like how someone today would use it, and getting the kind of response that wouldn’t make sense if humanity had made the ultimate discovery, a shift in our understanding of life in the universe so profound it would be unavoidable even for ....grunts.
Unless the first contact has happened, like, 80 years ago and the current crop of humanity has grown with the knowledge that we are not alone in the universe... And marines assigned in the colonies would have come across with alien lifeforms already ("bug hunts"...)
I think you're shoving in a context the movie clearly doesn't support.
The literal question that gets asked:
"Is this going to be a stand up fight, sir, or another bug hunt?"
I don't think Hudson was talking about literal bugs. He was asking if they were actually going to be doing anything or just snipe hunting. The context is clearly more like 'wild goose chase' than 'are we going to be hunting alien bugs again.'
If the marines believed that there really were Xenomorphs then their training and regime would be far more serious.
The company would be sending staff beyond one manager and their advice/brief would likely come through formal channels and intense study of Ripley's comments and details. Rather than the rather jovial attitude they take which is that she's rather insane and that chances are it was some big scary dog or something.
I mean she's describing a creature with acid for blood that matures in hours; that grows within your chest and explodes out within hours. It's the stuff of horror and sci-fi films rather than sound tactics.
Heck if the company was being serious (remember they don't believe her - they've had a colony there for years already without any alien space ship being seen or any alien contact). They'd have likely sent several teams and maintained and orbital command post instead of a ground command post.
LordofHats wrote: I think you're shoving in a context the movie clearly doesn't support.
The literal question that gets asked:
"Is this going to be a stand up fight, sir, or another bug hunt?"
I don't think Hudson was talking about literal bugs. He was asking if they were actually going to be doing anything or just snipe hunting. The context is clearly more like 'wild goose chase' than 'are we going to be hunting alien bugs again.'
The drop ships name was "Bug Stomper" with a motto "We Endanger Species"
I wonder what species it is referring to?
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Overread wrote: If the marines believed that there really were Xenomorphs then their training and regime would be far more serious.
The company would be sending staff beyond one manager and their advice/brief would likely come through formal channels and intense study of Ripley's comments and details. Rather than the rather jovial attitude they take which is that she's rather insane and that chances are it was some big scary dog or something.
I mean she's describing a creature with acid for blood that matures in hours; that grows within your chest and explodes out within hours. It's the stuff of horror and sci-fi films rather than sound tactics.
Heck if the company was being serious (remember they don't believe her - they've had a colony there for years already without any alien space ship being seen or any alien contact). They'd have likely sent several teams and maintained and orbital command post instead of a ground command post.
The mission was Burkes private affair more or less. Unlike the company in general, he thought there were some merit in Ripleys story. He sent the colonists from Hadley's Hope searching for the alien ship. They brought the eggs/facehuggers into the colony for study. Burke, acting on behalf of the company, kept the lid on the news from getting out. Then the colony went silent. Burke put together a small team to check it out without informing his superiors about the situation (had they known, there would have been a proper investigation team).
Basically, Burke wanted all of the glory from this find for himself. You'll notice that the marines get briefed only after they arrive at the destination (Lt. Gorman knew more beforehand thought).
The whole movie happened basically because Burke was greedy and wanted to control the find without his superiors getting involved and taking away the the find from him.
The drop ships name was "Bug Stomper" with a motto "We Endanger Species"
I wonder what species it is referring to?
And we paint shark mouths and pin-up women on our aircraft and call them stuff like Enola Gay and Memphis Belle but that doesn't make them sharks or women. If that dropship had any confirmed kills of bugs it would 100% be shown in a tally next to said nose art, just as successful missions and kills were displayed on WW2 aircraft.
Consider how gung ho the marines were and Hudson bragging about the level of firepower they had access to on the drop down. Doesn't mean they ever actually used any of it in combat.
I'm pretty sure that the dakka members who have served in the armed forces of their respective countries will probably all agree that they talked an immense amount of gak with their squad mates, or had comrades who did, with regards to how badass they were and the level of firepower their respective country has access to (and doubly so if they were talking to people from a different branch of the military). That motto is just an extension of this chest beating.
The drop ships name was "Bug Stomper" with a motto "We Endanger Species"
I wonder what species it is referring to?
And we paint shark mouths and pin-up women on our aircraft and call them stuff like Enola Gay and Memphis Belle but that doesn't make them sharks or women. If that dropship had any confirmed kills of bugs it would 100% be shown in a tally next to said nose art, just as successful missions and kills were displayed on WW2 aircraft.
Consider how gung ho the marines were and Hudson bragging about the level of firepower they had access to on the drop down. Doesn't mean they ever actually used any of it in combat.
I'm pretty sure that the dakka members who have served in the armed forces of their respective countries will probably all agree that they talked an immense amount of gak with their squad mates, or had comrades who did, with regards to how badass they were and the level of firepower their respective country has access to (and doubly so if they were talking to people from a different branch of the military). That motto is just an extension of this chest beating.
Again, "We Endanger Species".
Which species are they referring to? If there is no life in the universe beyond that found on earth, are they referring to human species?
Killing badly armed colonists does not endager the human species, no matter which way you look at it.
Are they calling the colonists they gun down bugs? Why?
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BobtheInquisitor wrote: It would contradict the rest of this movie to insist these particular marines were hardened alien-killers who have killed lots of aliens.
It’s like suggesting the Ghostbusters makes themselves that because they already had experience busting ghosts before the hotel.
Why?
If the "Bug Hunt" actually refers to killing alien species, it is obvious that the marines superior firepower makes the "bug stomping" easy for the marines. Easy enough that they are very nonchalant about the thought of killing even more alien species. ("She thought they were illegal aliens…" ).
They just haven't encountered any extra terrestrial life forms they couldn't handle before.
There are obviously 100% proof that planet earth is not the only Place in the galaxy with life in it. The Jockey species had to come from somewhere else. So why is it so hard to think that humanity could have met other extra terrestrial life before this? Arcturians?
To me, the marines obvious nonchalant attitude towards the thought of meeting a new alien species indicates that meeting alien species is not something new and unique thing. They just thought that Ripleys aliens were animals, nothing more ("How could they cut the power man, they're animals!"). They didn't expect to meet something so intelligent.
If the "Bug Hunt" actually refers to killing alien species, it is obvious that the marines superior firepower makes the "bug stomping" easy for the marines. Easy enough that they are very nonchalant about the thought of killing even more alien species. ("She thought they were illegal aliens…" ).
As an interesting aside, the actress that played Vasquez (Jenette Goldstein) apparently turned up to the audition for Aliens thinking it was a film about illegal aliens! But she decided to still go for it and was cast for the role. Probably glad she did as she went on to do other films with James Cameron (Terminator 2 and Titanic).
Still one of my favourite quips in a film, her response to Hudson when he say "Has anyone ever mistaken you for a man.. ?"
And is still the undisputed queen of "ruined for tv" dubbing when her potty mouth solution for dealing with the hive takes an inexplicable swerve into very posh English RP, fun you dubbing earholes fun you
