From 'Our Pre-order Schedule’s Changing a Bit – Here’s How' on Warhammer Community:

It’s still a pretty weird time for anyone making physical products and shipping them around the globe. There are loads of fantastic things on the way over the next few months, but we have to make some changes to when the next batch of incredible Warhammer releases come out, and we wanted to keep you up to date with everything that’s going on.

Everyone at Games Workshop is working really hard to get all of your orders to you in good time so you can continue to enjoy your Warhammer hobby, whether that’s via games-workshop.com or forgeworld.co.uk, your Warhammer store, or a friendly local gaming centre. With this in mind, over the next couple of weeks, there will be a short pause where we’ll have no new pre-orders. Have no fear, though – new releases will be coming your way before you know it.

In the meantime, we’ll have loads of great content every day here on Warhammer Community to slake your hobby thirst. Here’s a taste of what you can expect over the next seven days:

* A look at the bold heroes and terrifyingly spiky villains from a forthcoming Warhammer animation
* Big model reveals for Warhammer 40,000 AND Warhammer Age of Sigmar
* Expert advice on dominating the Mortal Realms with aelf armies in Metawatch

You can also order books 31-35 in The Horus Heresy series in hardback next week as part of Black Library’s Print on Demand service – perfect for completing your collection.*e changes to when the next batch of incredible Warhammer releases come out, and we wanted to keep you up to date with everything that’s going on.

New pre-orders are returning in May, and we’ll have all the news about what you can get your hands on soon. Make sure you join us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram to keep up with everything that’s new and to show us the hobby projects you’re working on.

Everyone at Games Workshop is working really hard to get all of your orders to you in good time so you can continue to enjoy your Warhammer hobby, whether that’s via games-workshop.com or forgeworld.co.uk, your Warhammer store, or a friendly local gaming centre. With this in mind, over the next couple of weeks, there will be a short pause where we’ll have no new pre-orders. Have no fear, though – new releases will be coming your way before you know it.

In the meantime, we’ll have loads of great content every day here on Warhammer Community to slake your hobby thirst. Here’s a taste of what you can expect over the next seven days:

A look at the bold heroes and terrifyingly spiky villains from a forthcoming Warhammer animation
Big model reveals for Warhammer 40,000 AND Warhammer Age of Sigmar
Expert advice on dominating the Mortal Realms with aelf armies in Metawatch

Looking forward to more reveals! Not looking forward to yet more "Metawatch"...

Who wants to run the next model reveal thread, assuming there's a preview event on Saturday?

Feel bad for mechanicus players who thought there pre order was going to be next week.

I’m starting to wonder if one of their casting machines went belly up, so they’re taking a breathe to recoup the lost capacity?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I’m starting to wonder if one of their casting machines went belly up, so they’re taking a breathe to recoup the lost capacity?

I think this one is down to the warehouse move as stores have already been told that they wont have any items shipped to them from the warehouse from next week until early May (not sure if they are going to still ship orders from GW webstore directly or if that will also have a shipping freeze for a few weeks).

Doesn't say anything about producing anything but rather that they're trying to get orders out of their warehouses.

well we know the warehouse has problems from the message to independants earlier in the week,

I had suspected covid outbreak, but with escape testing at 5 days that should only have messed up a forghtnight at worst, and we've already passed a weekor more

could be this is the big move to the new warehouse,

could be the hookup of the new power supply to let them run more machines in the factory (don't think that's happened yet), took 3 days to put a new cable into a shop I worked in and that was only a dinky wee thing about 8 foot long

We get a what but not a why.. Could have said "we are currently expending/ moving our manufacturing etc." would have gone a long way to placate some of the most "ardent" fans..

The fact they are responding at all means theres is sufficient stink being blown up their butts on social media/ customer complaints. Yet they miss the mark and not give an actual reason for the "why".

From all of this my hope would be that people will spend money on on GW stuff and expand their horizons.

It certainly seems like their R&D and creative side far outpaced the production capacity.

Aeneades wrote:


I think this one is down to the warehouse move as stores have already been told that they wont have any items shipped to them from the warehouse from next week until early May (not sure if they are going to still ship orders from GW webstore directly or if that will also have a shipping freeze for a few weeks).

Warehouse migrations are an absolute nightmare for any company at the best of times. Pile on all the Covid and Brexit related issues and yeah, I do not envy anyone doing it now.

What I don't get is why GW would be so guarded about the situation. They have a loyal and (for the main)very forgiving customer base. Clear communications and honesty would do wonders.

I'm gonna be honest, even if they told us the why...there'd be no different response than to what is gonna happen without the why.

Though this is the second year that AdMech effectively get "delayed" in a row because of everything going on. Hopefully this won't be a case like Engine War though.

It’s clearly a ploy to generate artificial scarcity and make even more money by a combination of not actually selling anything and devilish FOMO magic.

 Argive wrote:
We get a what but not a why.. Could have said "we are currently expending/ moving our manufacturing etc." would have gone a long way to placate some of the most "ardent" fans..

The fact they are responding at all means theres is sufficient stink being blown up their butts on social media/ customer complaints. Yet they miss the mark and not give an actual reason for the "why".

From all of this my hope would be that people will spend money on on GW stuff and expand their horizons.

It certainly seems like their R&D and creative side far outpaced the production capacity.

GW never says why. For whatever reason, they've taken the same approach all through the last year - no explanations, and only say anything at all if there's no possible way to stay silent.

I always giggle when people say how GW has gotten better at communication. It's like saying a rabbit is a more engaging conversation partner than a rock.

If its warehouse related, which seems likely, my guess is on Brexit being the cause much more then Covid, which is something they have been dealing with for a while now.

Producing in the UK and shipping around the world must be a nightmare right now.
I wonder if they are moving it to mainland EU?
Moving stuff from their factory to a warehouse in the EU and then shipping it around the world may well be easier then shipping to the world directly from the UK.

Removed - BrookM

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 Ordana wrote:
If its warehouse related, which seems likely, my guess is on Brexit being the cause much more then Covid, which is something they have been dealing with for a while now.

Producing in the UK and shipping around the world must be a nightmare right now.
I wonder if they are moving it to mainland EU?
Moving stuff from their factory to a warehouse in the EU and then shipping it around the world may well be easier then shipping to the world directly from the UK.

They are moving it to a warehouse in the UK; I forget where but its been in the plans for a long time now. Plus Brexit only impacts shipments to the EU. Shipments ot China, Asia, USA etc... are all a different kettle of import/export aspects outside of Brexit.

They might well open an EU warehouse once the dust settles, but otherwise this is a move they've had in their shareholder meetings for a while now. It's likely just that Covid has messed things up and they can't stay open and trading new updates whlist also moving things over.

The new Warehouse is only about 15 or so miles away from the existing one, it’s by Nottingham airport.

it's been a cascading problem for GW for awhile now, and it probably just hit critical mass. My local GW have had bare shelves for a long time, would be easier to buy TP there than actual GW models. As long as this whole mess pushes 10th edition way down the line, I'm OK with it. My pile of shame is not small.

 Overread wrote:

They are moving it to a warehouse in the UK; I forget where but its been in the plans for a long time now. Plus Brexit only impacts shipments to the EU. Shipments ot China, Asia, USA etc... are all a different kettle of import/export aspects outside of Brexit.

Local stores got notice that there was going to be no production or preorders for next 2 weeks - also something to do with a stock take of the entire warehouse - so makes sense. Stock take will take a while, relocation as well. Better to do sooner than later.

Kind of a bunch of empty words that don't clarify a damn thing.

Waste of time. If the idea is to calm the clients ( I bet Cursed city generated many complains back to them) they have missed the mark.

Do better, communication is key these days.

Guess that means CSM's second wound is coming in 2024 instead of 2023

Don't know anything about the Cursed City drama as I haven't been following it, but hopefully some of the previews the article mentions that they'll be showing us this week are worth the time!

Honestly, I would even be fine if they stopped trying to hype with "new reveals" and "previews of what to come", and just switch to articles like metawatch, or showing awesome miniatures / armies made by hobbyists around the world, or other special scenarios / battleplans for their currently available games.

The mess with Cursed City was made exactly because they hyped too much, after all. Better to calm down, indeed.

Yeah, but the last thing GW wants to do is stop the hype train.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I’m starting to wonder if one of their casting machines went belly up, so they’re taking a breathe to recoup the lost capacity?

I wonder if US magazine shown such big demand GW was forced to drop everything to start making sprues for it...

GW has been having problems shipping things to various parts of the world for months. How many times have they released a product except for region A or region B just in 2021? Then there was the product storages in late 2020 that resulted in insulting allocation of products to stores. As an importer of goods from overseas into the US, I can assure you the time to get anything anywhere has increased greatly in recent months. Seems to me that GW has decided to pull the plug on new releases while it gets the transportation issues resolved and products into their warehouses around the world to allow for proper releases.

Gives me time to save up for the Cawdor book/new Reds.

Lets the wallet recover from titanicus before the full sized mechanicus arrive.

Well that's a really quiet and low-key way to delay Ad Mech and whatever else.

'Short pause...' 'next couple weeks...' 'articles for the next seven days...' Oh, 'Pre-orders return in May'

Glad they eventually got to the point.

I watched 2+ Tough's video on this and his assumption that their **** is just totally not together and that they desperately need a few weeks to just fix everything sounds very realistic. Hard to believe a company the size of Games Workshop couldn't do a working transfer between warehouse sites, if that's all it was. I mean, the people who run their shipping logistics should do that sort of stuff for a living, by definition.

It's GW, you should never be surprised by them being unable to do something other billion-dollar companies do as a matter of course. GW still operates like five guys in grandma's basement in a surprising percentage of the time when it comes to actually getting things done, even if their outlook now is firmly shareholder focused in terms of higher-level strategy.

That said, everyone's having trouble right now getting products delivered around the world, and if it has to do with that, all they'd have to do is come out and say so explicitly and people would cut them some slack. They could even get some free PR from it by structuring their statement as "we could release new stuff only for our UK customers, but we don't think that's fair to the rest of the world, so we're taking a break from new releases until we're confident that the supply chains are in place to get them to everybody at the same time."

 frankelee wrote:
I watched 2+ Tough's video on this and his assumption that their **** is just totally not together and that they desperately need a few weeks to just fix everything sounds very realistic. Hard to believe a company the size of Games Workshop couldn't do a working transfer between warehouse sites, if that's all it was. I mean, the people who run their shipping logistics should do that sort of stuff for a living, by definition.

Yeah but don't forget this year they can't work their teams close together due to covid. Ontop of that we know that they can't currently meet demand on a global scale; whatever they make is pretty much landing on shelves then going to customers. So chances are the warehouse is running at full capacity already. Trying to facilitate a stock check and stock move and whole setup move at the same time is likely a very challenging thing.

I would say its simply that there's a cascade of problems all at once that makes it impractical to keep things going as normal whilst trying to make drastic changes.


And GW aren't alone. Dropzone Commander just got a big wave of resin models released after they shut down their resin manufacturing and shipping earlier in the year due to covid pressures. I've seen several other firms delay and shift things around, again because of covid. Even if they are trading well during these times there are other problems to consider.


Throw some staff having to self isolate for various reasons; throw Brexit; throw whatever else and its a complicated situation





IT might also be that GW could keep running, but that it would draw out the warehouse move considerably. Creating a long period of instability which might present increased risk to staff or simply an increased risk that they lose control with little warning and suddenly have orders backing up; stuff going to the wrong places etc.... Or a long period which can cope with only modest pressure but any majorly popular release would throw it off. So they make the choice to instead close down some parts and focus on a quicker move all in one go. With GW able to afford it because they've got savings within the firm.



Honestly a big warehouse move and a big change around of the existing facilities use at GW; it makes a lot of sense that it would cause disruption. I don't see any conspiracy or failure or anything. It is just what it is.

 Irbis wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I’m starting to wonder if one of their casting machines went belly up, so they’re taking a breathe to recoup the lost capacity?

I wonder if US magazine shown such big demand GW was forced to drop everything to start making sprues for it...

Not the case. Imperium release in the US has already been delayed to next year! That may well be due to supply issues, but GWs problems aren't related to the US Imperium subscriptions...because there won't be any for quite some time.

 frankelee wrote:
I watched 2+ Tough's video on this and his assumption that their **** is just totally not together and that they desperately need a few weeks to just fix everything sounds very realistic. Hard to believe a company the size of Games Workshop couldn't do a working transfer between warehouse sites, if that's all it was. I mean, the people who run their shipping logistics should do that sort of stuff for a living, by definition.

You'd think but it happens..

There is a very high chance the new warehouse operates on a totally different kind of software/ system(because the project manager decided it was better/ people at the top wanted it coz it was cheaper, without considering the effects on the exiting infrastructure and how it would intergrate) meaning the old warehouse doesn't seamlessly talk with the new warehouse which, in turn doesn't talk to its factory and so on..

This will results in backlogs being created while people try to make the system make sense. Toss in an issue in the actual manufacturing and you have yourself a royal kaffufle of a situation. Issues can be something as dumb as old system having a character limit on a lot number hard capped at say 10 digits, meaning it can only understand 10 numbers for a SKU reference and new warehouse uses 12...

I work for UK distribution arm of a multi billion £ company which has manufacturing sites in UK, EU, US & Latin America. All making the same product. All part of the same distribution chain. And let me tell you that my side of the business uses software which is nearly 20 years old and the newest state of the art facilities do not... And other sites use something in between. Needless to say this can cause huge backlogs because work cant be processed between warehouses when new parts are introduced to the system. Toss in some brexit issues, packaging machines breaking down, and presto. Everyone is working 12 weeks of overtime pulling 12hr shifts in order to sort out issue.

Do we know for sure if the new warehouse GW is transferring to has different operating procedures than the previous one. Some big companies are rather fond of fully automated warehouses these days. I wouldn't be surprised some change or another has resulted in very pissed off staff.

Then again, we can only really speculate at this point huh? Unless someone knows peeps in the company with inside info.

cody.d. wrote:
Do we know for sure if the new warehouse GW is transferring to has different operating procedures than the previous one. Some big companies are rather fond of fully automated warehouses these days. I wouldn't be surprised some change or another has resulted in very pissed off staff.

Then again, we can only really speculate at this point huh? Unless someone knows peeps in the company with inside info.

I think I've heard they are transferring to an automated Warehouse in the US, I'm not sure how true that is though. I would not be shocked if they are doing the same in the UK.

cody.d. wrote:
Do we know for sure if the new warehouse GW is transferring to has different operating procedures than the previous one. Some big companies are rather fond of fully automated warehouses these days. I wouldn't be surprised some change or another has resulted in very pissed off staff.

Then again, we can only really speculate at this point huh? Unless someone knows peeps in the company with inside info.

No, and we're never going to find out.

While I wish the update had been more clear about the why, at least they gave an update. Though as someone else said, spelling out the delays more clearly and giving a reason or two would have probably led to more customers having a positive "Oh no, that sucks! Guess I'll paint some backlog" reaction rather than a negative "Ughhh that sucks!! Why can't I get my codex NOW?" reaction.

Really it could be any number of a dozen or more reasons - warehouse issues, continuing Covid interruptions, Brexit snafus, manufacturing problems, take your pick.

It could be that something in the new warehouse isn't working right/broke and they already moved all the new product over there in anticipation of it beginning operations. It is likely major and they have to move all the product back to the old warehouse while it is fixed.

I believe it will come out, but more through shareholder inquiries. They are a majorly traded stock now. Pretty sure there will be some major holders making calls tomorrow asking WTF.

From what I understand, there were also a lot of issues leftover from the Memphis warehouse after the southern snowstorm. Even well after, there was a massive backlog of orders that got clogged up. I don't know if that left any further lingering issues, but it just seems like there's problem after problem with moving actual physical product globally.

Snowstorms, boats getting clogged in canals, brexit... it's a wild time. I don't blame them for wanting two solid business weeks to just get stuff done.

Don’t forget, if there are genuine problems going on behind the scenes (and I wouldn’t blame them for that in right now), we hobbyists might appreciate an explanation. However, I doubt their shareholders would appreciate the drop in share price that might result.

Saying that there are problems and why would actually help in this situation

this is a company that sells to fans and not some common goods were people change to the next best on the market if you officially say that you have made some big mistakes

 Argive wrote:

I work for UK distribution arm of a multi billion £ company which has manufacturing sites in UK, EU, US & Latin America. All making the same product. All part of the same distribution chain. And let me tell you that my side of the business uses software which is nearly 20 years old and the newest state of the art facilities do not... And other sites use something in between. Needless to say this can cause huge backlogs because work cant be processed between warehouses when new parts are introduced to the system. Toss in some brexit issues, packaging machines breaking down, and presto. Everyone is working 12 weeks of overtime pulling 12hr shifts in order to sort out issue.

If GW is planning those things as well as they plan for their games ("lets just start this with Space Marines and we figure out what we do with the rest later) I am not seeing them solving this problem anytime soon

also because a lot of their sales come from hype and momentum, if this stops for too long they even get into more trouble

Point 1; as good times as any to do it, there was no "public" gaming for the past 6 months and wont be until next winter.
Point 2; wont find better times to jump OFF the GW train and find new and better games when you know there wont be any new toys for months to come.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Don’t forget, if there are genuine problems going on behind the scenes (and I wouldn’t blame them for that in right now), we hobbyists might appreciate an explanation. However, I doubt their shareholders would appreciate the drop in share price that might result.

Good answer. Likely what is happening is 'we are restructuring our logistics for the long term because lockdown culture likely isn't going away long term'.

Aside from all the other potential issues, we in the UK are now opening up non-essential stuff and I get the impression that the same is happening in the US and Australasia at least, so there’s probably been an increase in demand from FLGS (and GW stores) needing to restock. In their shoes I would have put off any expenditure until I could until the situation starts to look more stable (I.e. now).

I for one am happy for the delay. Take a few minutes GW , catch your breath, have a cool drink. I can wait for a bit longer for anything on the horizon, cheers GW.

Agreed, this is a good time to get working on my pile of shame potential. Sure, bad news for those waiting for something that was already "promised", but for me, yeah the pace has been pretty relentless the last couple of years and I'm happy to get a breather. I mean, I've barely had a chance to play a game of 9th yet, please don't start talking about 10th already...

No new releases?! Oh no!

What about the fans who finished painting their backlog?

I mean they could exist. In theory.

It's not the first time in the last few months. It's just first time they've stated that in a separate article.
Maybe they will use this time to fix their fething www so it doesn't crash when pre orders are up... :? :? :?

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Don’t forget, if there are genuine problems going on behind the scenes (and I wouldn’t blame them for that in right now), we hobbyists might appreciate an explanation. However, I doubt their shareholders would appreciate the drop in share price that might result.

GW's lifeblood is new releases. Shutting down new releases for 3 weeks is going to be a big hit on profits regardless of the cause.

My guess... I imagine if it weren't for COVID and other global issues, they probably intended to move factories without shutting down for a few weeks. But given they are already struggling to keep shelves stocked, they maybe don't want to go releasing new stuff while they can't actually have the supply to meet demand. Look at something like Cursed City, it seems that it could have sold way more and made more money. Belakor sold out in Oz before the Warhammer Community article even went up, and now it's also sold out in the US and UK. It's really not ideal for them to be releasing popular big ticket items if they can't meet demand.

 Sasori wrote:

cody.d. wrote:
Do we know for sure if the new warehouse GW is transferring to has different operating procedures than the previous one. Some big companies are rather fond of fully automated warehouses these days. I wouldn't be surprised some change or another has resulted in very pissed off staff.

Then again, we can only really speculate at this point huh? Unless someone knows peeps in the company with inside info.

I think I've heard they are transferring to an automated Warehouse in the US, I'm not sure how true that is though. I would not be shocked if they are doing the same in the UK.

I'm sure their last financial report said they were.

 kodos wrote:
Saying that there are problems and why would actually help in this situation

this is a company that sells to fans and not some common goods were people change to the next best on the market if you officially say that you have made some big mistakes

 Argive wrote:

I work for UK distribution arm of a multi billion £ company which has manufacturing sites in UK, EU, US & Latin America. All making the same product. All part of the same distribution chain. And let me tell you that my side of the business uses software which is nearly 20 years old and the newest state of the art facilities do not... And other sites use something in between. Needless to say this can cause huge backlogs because work cant be processed between warehouses when new parts are introduced to the system. Toss in some brexit issues, packaging machines breaking down, and presto. Everyone is working 12 weeks of overtime pulling 12hr shifts in order to sort out issue.

If GW is planning those things as well as they plan for their games ("lets just start this with Space Marines and we figure out what we do with the rest later) I am not seeing them solving this problem anytime soon

also because a lot of their sales come from hype and momentum, if this stops for too long they even get into more trouble

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Oguhmek wrote:
Agreed, this is a good time to get working on my pile of shame potential. Sure, bad news for those waiting for something that was already "promised", but for me, yeah the pace has been pretty relentless the last couple of years and I'm happy to get a breather. I mean, I've barely had a chance to play a game of 9th yet, please don't start talking about 10th already...

Week won't reduce pile much and 10th is still bit over 2 years ahead

GW might rely on new sales as a big surge in volume, but lets not kid ourselves. They are very unlikely to suffer in the short term if they take a few weeks off. Last year they took a whole two months off and it was one of their most profitable years on record.

Whilst new things sell, the old stuff sells too. GW isn't trapped into the same market system as DVDs, Music or other markets. GW's products don't devalue nor become redundant unless GW wants them to be so.


Yes new things builds hype and helps drive sales, but they get sales even without "shiny new thing hype". They don't have to sell a new thing before it devalues to 75% of its original sale price; they don't have to worry that it doesn't sell out in the first two weeks of being released. Their market is totally different to many others, in many ways its an "older" style of commerce and trade.


Plus as they've had trouble keeping lots of things, not just the new things, in stock; its clear that there's continual healthy demand for other products not just new things. So clearly having no new things for a few weeks won't hurt them in the least.

 frankelee wrote:
I watched 2+ Tough's video on this and his assumption that their **** is just totally not together and that they desperately need a few weeks to just fix everything sounds very realistic. Hard to believe a company the size of Games Workshop couldn't do a working transfer between warehouse sites, if that's all it was. I mean, the people who run their shipping logistics should do that sort of stuff for a living, by definition.

Major universities with Public Health programs had almost no preparation for the Varrus. Even my own small school had to close for a month just to sort out how to handle it when it all went down last year. It's really not that hard to believe a toy company would have similar issues.

 Overread wrote:
GW might rely on new sales as a big surge in volume, but lets not kid ourselves. They are very unlikely to suffer in the short term if they take a few weeks off. Last year they took a whole two months off and it was one of their most profitable years on record.

Last year was an oddball year, hardly a good example in terms of how much GW lose for not having weekly releases.

We know from back in the days when GW released sales figures (was it for the Chapterhouse case I think?) that sales of a particular item dried up very rapidly after release.

I'm sure it's not as bad as video games, where most of the money is made in the first few days then after that it's a trickle, but "new shiny" is a big part of GW's business strategy.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Overread wrote:
GW might rely on new sales as a big surge in volume, but lets not kid ourselves. They are very unlikely to suffer in the short term if they take a few weeks off. Last year they took a whole two months off and it was one of their most profitable years on record.

Last year was an oddball year, hardly a good example in terms of how much GW lose for not having weekly releases.

We know from back in the days when GW released sales figures (was it for the Chapterhouse case I think?) that sales of a particular item dried up very rapidly after release.

I'm sure it's not as bad as video games, where most of the money is made in the first few days then after that it's a trickle, but "new shiny" is a big part of GW's business strategy.

2021 is also another oddball year.

We also have to consider the difference between high profit and steady profit sales levels. Does GW actually rely on big boom sales to maintain its functional income and profiting; or are they the cream on the cake that provides excess which gives them resources to expand and such. Provided GW's operational income remains viable the company isn't in any danger for the short term.

tneva82 wrote:

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.

I assume that they exactly knew what was coming but thought they can solve it on the fly and did not need to do anything in advance

 kodos wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.

I assume that they exactly knew what was coming but thought they can solve it on the fly and did not need to do anything in advance

I'm more thinking about what happens in every big organization in the world : something the management didn't take into account / wasn't aware of and it finally gripes the machine so much they need to do that.

Mantic Games has also big troubles with their production, after all. So it's not just because it's GW.

Funny how a lot of people seem to believe that because you're big, you can't fail at the most stupidest detail and that if that happens, it's a conspiration or done on purpose. Really, no.

Bigger firms essentially have more access to resources which gives them a capacity to resolve some issues easily or more quickly or just muscle through them because they've got capital to invest into staff/equipment etc... Whilst smaller firms will struggle because they don't have as much of a profit and savings build up to work with



At the same time some issues for a small firm are easier to resolve than for a big firm because of the scale of the operation. A 1 person production site changing warehouses is likely a pain but something they can do in the background. A multinational doing the same thing suddenly has a LOT more people involved; has to hire in new staff to help facilitate the move; has to invest in other resources and back end changes etc...



Being bigger can make some things easier, but also make other things harder.

They aren’t saying why because it could affect stock price. Boring but true.

The why is simple. My Drukhari codex says printed in China. I’m not sure if you guys know but there is this big pandemic that originated in that country and we have little to no clue what’s happening there. But the evidence that significantly less stuff is coming out of China tells us that manufacturing and logistics are hooped. It’s not a GW problem, it’s an everybody problem. Every retailer has low to no restocks on many items. The Admech codex—it’s probably been printed, but somewhere on a slow boat. Then it has to be shipped out. It doesn’t matter how good or bad GW is at logistics because right now everything is bad for everyone.

And if GW decided to move their warehouse during the pandemic then that might have been a good thing. Problems were going to arise because of that move at the best of times. Now they can be sorted out under the cloud of uncertainty from lockdowns and expected retail problems.

In short GW doesn’t have the right things to sell so there’s no point in hyping or taking preorders that may take months to fulfill—I’m looking at you Van Saar models and book.

 Overread wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Overread wrote:
GW might rely on new sales as a big surge in volume, but lets not kid ourselves. They are very unlikely to suffer in the short term if they take a few weeks off. Last year they took a whole two months off and it was one of their most profitable years on record.

Last year was an oddball year, hardly a good example in terms of how much GW lose for not having weekly releases.

We know from back in the days when GW released sales figures (was it for the Chapterhouse case I think?) that sales of a particular item dried up very rapidly after release.

I'm sure it's not as bad as video games, where most of the money is made in the first few days then after that it's a trickle, but "new shiny" is a big part of GW's business strategy.

2021 is also another oddball year.

We also have to consider the difference between high profit and steady profit sales levels. Does GW actually rely on big boom sales to maintain its functional income and profiting; or are they the cream on the cake that provides excess which gives them resources to expand and such. Provided GW's operational income remains viable the company isn't in any danger for the short term.

I never suggested they were in danger, just that it's likely to hurt their profits maybe by a few million pounds under normal circumstances, and under normal circumstances I reckon they'd try to not let something as mundane as a warehouse move stop them releasing new kits for a few weeks.

I think there's a good chance the shut down has more to do with being unable to meet demand on new releases, so shutting down for a few weeks to rebuild their inventory potentially loses them less potential revenue than releasing new kits when they can't ship enough out to stock the store shelves.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:
At the same time some issues for a small firm are easier to resolve than for a big firm because of the scale of the operation. A 1 person production site changing warehouses is likely a pain but something they can do in the background. A multinational doing the same thing suddenly has a LOT more people involved; has to hire in new staff to help facilitate the move; has to invest in other resources and back end changes etc...

But a big company can afford to outsource a lot of headaches, and dedicate staff to full time manage the preparation and move to have minimal affect on day to day operations. A small company by comparison might not be able to afford to outsource, and may not have staff to spare to organise the move.

In the end it comes down to management of time and people regardless of the size of the company.

Are they just moving warehouse or their production also? The former doesn't sound like a big deal, the latter would be.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Don’t forget, if there are genuine problems going on behind the scenes (and I wouldn’t blame them for that in right now), we hobbyists might appreciate an explanation. However, I doubt their shareholders would appreciate the drop in share price that might result.

And if whatever has happened was indeed price sensitive information that could affect their share price then they can't make a public announcement until after they've informed the stock market.

 kodos wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.

I assume that they exactly knew what was coming but thought they can solve it on the fly and did not need to do anything in advance

Uuh yeah that's why they publicize it 2 weeks ahead(thus knowing it before that). Yeah right,

tneva82 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.

I assume that they exactly knew what was coming but thought they can solve it on the fly and did not need to do anything in advance

Uuh yeah that's why they publicize it 2 weeks ahead(thus knowing it before that). Yeah right,

why do you assume that whatever causes the delay is going to happen in 2 weeks, and is not something that has already happend?

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Overread wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Overread wrote:
GW might rely on new sales as a big surge in volume, but lets not kid ourselves. They are very unlikely to suffer in the short term if they take a few weeks off. Last year they took a whole two months off and it was one of their most profitable years on record.

Last year was an oddball year, hardly a good example in terms of how much GW lose for not having weekly releases.

We know from back in the days when GW released sales figures (was it for the Chapterhouse case I think?) that sales of a particular item dried up very rapidly after release.

I'm sure it's not as bad as video games, where most of the money is made in the first few days then after that it's a trickle, but "new shiny" is a big part of GW's business strategy.

2021 is also another oddball year.

We also have to consider the difference between high profit and steady profit sales levels. Does GW actually rely on big boom sales to maintain its functional income and profiting; or are they the cream on the cake that provides excess which gives them resources to expand and such. Provided GW's operational income remains viable the company isn't in any danger for the short term.

I never suggested they were in danger, just that it's likely to hurt their profits maybe by a few million pounds under normal circumstances, and under normal circumstances I reckon they'd try to not let something as mundane as a warehouse move stop them releasing new kits for a few weeks.

I think there's a good chance the shut down has more to do with being unable to meet demand on new releases, so shutting down for a few weeks to rebuild their inventory potentially loses them less potential revenue than releasing new kits when they can't ship enough out to stock the store shelves.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:
At the same time some issues for a small firm are easier to resolve than for a big firm because of the scale of the operation. A 1 person production site changing warehouses is likely a pain but something they can do in the background. A multinational doing the same thing suddenly has a LOT more people involved; has to hire in new staff to help facilitate the move; has to invest in other resources and back end changes etc...

But a big company can afford to outsource a lot of headaches, and dedicate staff to full time manage the preparation and move to have minimal affect on day to day operations. A small company by comparison might not be able to afford to outsource, and may not have staff to spare to organise the move.

In the end it comes down to management of time and people regardless of the size of the company.

Are they just moving warehouse or their production also? The former doesn't sound like a big deal, the latter would be.

GW aren't moving production, they only just finished a new factory are Nottingham and its unlikely they'll move their main base of operations. The only factory style moving is that apparently the old warehouse at the GW main site is being remade into a resin production facility/extension of Forgeworld. This might well mean good things for the likes of Specialist games getting more room at GW and thus more resources to produce. It might mean FW gets back to some of its former glory and it might be GW clearing the way to prep for Old World.

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

might be the answer for the "why"

Eh, serves 'em right if they're in trouble. Can't bring myself to have the slightest ounce of sympathy for such a greedy gakky company

Yeah, the ERP issues seem like a pretty likely reason for a 2 week halt in releases, as well as likely being a contributing factor to the ordering/inventory woes many shops have experienced (some shops having orders cut or cancelled while others are receiving inventory in excess of what they should have been allocated based on the information GW has been providing retailers, etc.).

A borked ERP system (whether it be an issue that the new ERP isn't functioning correctly or that it isn't fully implemented/deployed/integrated yet and GW is having to manually manage the data across several databases) would certainly explain all of the problems over the last few months, including seemingly lower than normal production numbers, etc. Depending on the issues and where they are with the implementation and integration, the 2 week pause could be necessary in order to correct whatever issue they are having on the back-end, or it could well be the final integration/deployment window needed to get them over the hump and fully functional again.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Eh, serves 'em right if they're in trouble. Can't bring myself to have the slightest ounce of sympathy for such a greedy gakky company

Yes yes let the hate flow though you. Soon your transformation will be complete, soon you will turn fully to the dark side! Soon it will consume you!

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
No new releases?! Oh no!

What about the fans who finished painting their backlog?

I mean they could exist. In theory.

I just seen some flying pigs. Fo sho.

Sarouan wrote:

 kodos wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

This assumes there's unexpected issue they don't know how to solve. Rather than something they knew in advance and that just takes time. Seeing gw has timeline already for when warehouse this seems more preplanned th#ng.

I assume that they exactly knew what was coming but thought they can solve it on the fly and did not need to do anything in advance

I'm more thinking about what happens in every big organization in the world : something the management didn't take into account / wasn't aware of and it finally gripes the machine so much they need to do that.

Mantic Games has also big troubles with their production, after all. So it's not just because it's GW.

Funny how a lot of people seem to believe that because you're big, you can't fail at the most stupidest detail and that if that happens, it's a conspiration or done on purpose. Really, no.

It always feels to me like everyone works for companies that don't have their gak together and yet assumes every other company has it's gak together. The majority really don't. And there's only so far you can go with throwing money at it.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Yeah, the ERP issues seem like a pretty likely reason for a 2 week halt in releases, as well as likely being a contributing factor to the ordering/inventory woes many shops have experienced (some shops having orders cut or cancelled while others are receiving inventory in excess of what they should have been allocated based on the information GW has been providing retailers, etc.).

A borked ERP system (whether it be an issue that the new ERP isn't functioning correctly or that it isn't fully implemented/deployed/integrated yet and GW is having to manually manage the data across several databases) would certainly explain all of the problems over the last few months, including seemingly lower than normal production numbers, etc. Depending on the issues and where they are with the implementation and integration, the 2 week pause could be necessary in order to correct whatever issue they are having on the back-end, or it could well be the final integration/deployment window needed to get them over the hump and fully functional again.

Yeah, it explains why they haven't just tried to blame it on Covid too, which would be the easy out. Notice the weasel words at the start of the announcement about how "It’s still a pretty weird time for anyone making physical products and shipping them around the globe." - note how this is deliberately worded to make it sound like this is the reason for closing down pre-orders, but that the announcement is extremely careful not to actually come out and say that.

Warehouse crew should stop erotic roleplaying and get back to work

 Argive wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
No new releases?! Oh no!

What about the fans who finished painting their backlog?

I mean they could exist. In theory.

I just seen some flying pigs. Fo sho.

Them being the steeds those same fans ride to GW on to make their next purchase.

From 'Sunday Preview – Prepare for Hive War on Warhammer Community':

Normal pre-order service will resume on Saturday the 8th of May, when, among other new goodies, we’ll be officially launching the new Necromunda starter set, Hive War.

So these are actually AoS



such an odd mix of elements in the silhouette

That's a Sylvaneth, right? It's a bizarre mix of elementa but its gotta be Sylvaneth

Leggy wrote:
That's a Sylvaneth, right? It's a bizarre mix of elementa but its gotta be Sylvaneth

Yep. Nice to see, thought Geedubs completely forgot about 'em.

 DaveC wrote:
So these are actually AoS

Spoiler:

such an odd mix of elements in the silhouette

Spoiler:

Well this is super intriguing. Looks like an Elvish silhouette for the body, with a horn or trumpet on the right and the baby bugs from the rumour engine on top of the head dress. Base could be a lot of things, possibly vines or tentacles? I'm gonna take punt at either new Sylvaneth or Idoneth.

Argh! Whatever that is, it's blowing into a quite large horn, so possibly even some kind of re-born Orion to lead the Kurnothi faction? There's also a shape in the middle that might either be a bow or some kind of blade. Hm.

I'd be shocked if it's Idoneth. It definitely seems to be Sylvaneth, as the base is thorned vines not unlike what the Underworlds warband has.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MobileSuitRandom wrote:
Argh! Whatever that is, it's blowing into a quite large horn, so possibly even some kind of re-born Orion to lead the Kurnothi faction? There's also a shape in the middle that might either be a bow or some kind of blade. Hm.

If it's Orion, it would be a dramatic departure for him.

Better money is on this model being a variation of the "Thornwych" concept that Ylthari is fluffed as.

Yeah I’d go Sylvaneth.
Vines, do they match a rumour engine of something that we thought were tentacles?

Plants, bugs and vials are all Sylvaneth callsigns

Well, after the cock up that was Cursed City, would we be setting ourselves up for disappointment if we start looking forward to the release of Hive Wars?

Hive Wars is just reboxed existing kits so can’t see it being an issue with production or in high demand.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 MobileSuitRandom wrote:
Argh! Whatever that is, it's blowing into a quite large horn, so possibly even some kind of re-born Orion to lead the Kurnothi faction? There's also a shape in the middle that might either be a bow or some kind of blade. Hm.

If it's Orion, it would be a dramatic departure for him.

Better money is on this model being a variation of the "Thornwych" concept that Ylthari is fluffed as.

Yeah I was thinking huge centerpiece hero first but looking closer at the details it might just be that, really very much the same components apart from the horn/blade (?) instead of a staff.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Better money is on this model being a variation of the "Thornwych" concept that Ylthari is fluffed as.

Yep can totally see that. Interesting that they didn't give the name of the book its from just the series. So maybe Broken Realms Alarielle?

I think we are looking at Kragnos, the name of the fourth Broken Realms book. All the others have been named after a specific centerpiece character.

GoatboyBeta wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Better money is on this model being a variation of the "Thornwych" concept that Ylthari is fluffed as.

Yep can totally see that. Interesting that they didn't give the name of the book its from just the series. So maybe Broken Realms Alarielle?

Considering they're revealing the miniature tomorrow we might find out then.

 alextroy wrote:
I think we are looking at Kragnos, the name of the fourth Broken Realms book. All the others have been named after a specific centerpiece character.

Then why in the trailer they showed up a massive centauroid as the main focus?

There is also a bestial face in one of the latest articles from War-Com, so there is no way this is Kragnos.

You may be right. I may be right. We will know tomorrow. It will be interesting if they are introducting two new characters in Broken Realms Kragnos since it doesn't resemble any old model I can think of. Then again, a lot of reintroduced models don't look like the old model in AOS.

Kragnos has 3, so far, mentioned as coming with the book.

The Witch Hunter duo, Lord Kroak Redux, and the Slaanesh thingies.

This one could be something for the book after Kragnos too, if there is more after that.

Still june as bare minimum before aos3. Doubt they leave multi month gap between last br and aos3

If they’re doing third this year.

At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

tneva82 wrote:
At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

Well, everything but the multiple delays in releases since last year. I have a feeling 3rd was supposed to launch this summer, but I can see the delays pushing it to next year.

At the same time GW has been pushing out the campaign books for it super fast. We hardly have one out the door and yet another two previewed.

It's hard to tell what GW's medium term plan is and chances are even GW doesn't fully know due to all the chaos that's around at present. From Corona work restrictions to Brexit trade issues to international shipping delays (not just the stuck boat, there's vast amounts of freight backed up the world over).

 Overread wrote:
At the same time GW has been pushing out the campaign books for it super fast. We hardly have one out the door and yet another two previewed.

It's hard to tell what GW's medium term plan is and chances are even GW doesn't fully know due to all the chaos that's around at present. From Corona work restrictions to Brexit trade issues to international shipping delays (not just the stuck boat, there's vast amounts of freight backed up the world over).

Pushing out campaign books isn't anything weird. Pa was going to end 1 month before 9th as well. As books don"t get invalidated they can release aos3 week after last br for all it matters.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Platuan4th wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

Well, everything but the multiple delays in releases since last year. I have a feeling 3rd was supposed to launch this summer, but I can see the delays pushing it to next year.

Gw doesn't have year worth of backlog. They stop　releases for 9+ months to wait next year they lose out on sales.no releases, no sales. remember what　happened to fb sales when they stopped releases due to design work for aos starting. From top3 selling miniature games to trickle sale. When like 90% kit's lifetime sales are sold in first quarter year they can't just wait next year with zero aos releases. That basically means no aos sales until 2022 summer.

They will rather postpone others rather than postpone edition to next　summer.

Ahh.. how times have changed. It used to be weeks between sporadic releases. Now if there aren't weekly preorders (a relatively recent change in the companies history) people start ringing their doomsday bells.

This is the reality. GW is doing incredibly well. Their new releases are selling out and they are struggling to keep up with demand. A good problem to have for a company that is cash rich.

 Tiberius501 wrote:
01010011 01100001 01100100 00100000 01000001 01100100 01001101 01100101 01100011 01101000 00100000 01001110 01101111 01101001 01110011 01100101 01110011 :(

01001100 01001111 01001100

I think 3rd is set for the end of these Broken Realms books, and given the delays have stopped all of those coming out, I think a new version of AoS isn't on the cards until at least Q4 this year, but more likely sometime in 2022.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I think 3rd is set for the end of these Broken Realms books, and given the delays have stopped all of those coming out, I think a new version of AoS isn't on the cards until at least Q4 this year, but more likely sometime in 2022.

I guess it would depend on how many there are. I think GW would push other stuff around to ensure an edition comes out, not the other way around. I could see AoS 3.0 for July, I don't think it'd get pushed into Q4, and I can't see them pushing an entire edition out a year, as that likely backlogs everything they have planned for the new edition.

They're already backlogged.

And if the Broken Realm books are anything like the Psychic Awakening books, they're designed to update armies for the next edition without necessarily bringing out new army book for each one.

Considering Cursed City appears to have had last moment issues and GW's own warehouse and back end moving and organising appear to be hitting a huge critical meltdown moment; it wouldn't surprise me if a new edition did get moved.

Indomitus was locked in; I think this year GW is being more flexible whilst also trying to push things back on track. In the end they can only push so much and they know that simply releasing stuff super fast might not work out well for them - flooding the market way too much will result in slower uptakes of sales on each item (their market is finite and has finite purchasing power); to say nothing of the fact that GW can't deliver global volume to support a vastly sped up release plan.

So in the end could a new edition slip into Q3 or even Q4 - sure. Heck GW might even change Christmas around - instead of discount bundle boxes for all; do a new edition for AoS and perhaps a few discount boxes for 40K. They'd still make record sales even if they "miss" the mid year traditional "summer holidays" sales boom that they went for with Indomitus.


One bonus is that GW has the financial security of fans already buying up their stock at record speed. GW doesn't actually have to release anything new for months and they can still turn over high sales.

They are　buying stuff because gw is　releasing new stuff. Sisters of battle? Range is now on　trickle mode. Lumineth? What sells in significant numbers is wave2. Wave1 is already not significant in gw scale. It essentially sold out. Slaanesh releases on last moments until it too becomes trickle　sale range.

You forget the period last year where GW shut down fully and we still kept buying? Where we stripped every bit of stock globally from anywhere that was still open and trading?


Yes I agree big releases make big sales waves, but GW still maintains healthy trickles sales across their whole range. If anything a period of just trickle sales might be good for them to catch up their back end and production not just with the big swing sale events.


People are still able to buy stuff without a big release. Sure big release mean attention and energy and focus and lots of marketing. GW can recapture some of that in other ways not just tied to big releases

tneva82 wrote:
They are　buying stuff because gw is　releasing new stuff. Sisters of battle? Range is now on　trickle mode. Lumineth? What sells in significant numbers is wave2. Wave1 is already not significant in gw scale. It essentially sold out. Slaanesh releases on last moments until it too becomes trickle　sale range.

People take the 'trickle' thing way too far. You really believe people buy say all the 60 troops models army needs immediately on release and only then? That DA, SW, BA, and DW (ok, maybe not in that last case, thanks to beyond idiotic SIA changes) players didn't grab a few boxes of intercessors and infiltrators, years old kits, when their supplements dropped and the ranges finally got support for them? That sister players who like new halberd troops and tanks won't buy any regular sisters when they start the army? None of this makes any sense, I bought all of my DW veterans years after the kit was released...

the only official number of sales we ever got were those seen in the Chapterhouse law suit

in those very well showed that sales of "the most selling faction" aka a Box of Standard Marines, was linked to new releases only

Standard Marines sold better as they were sold with every Marine dex, yet Blood Angles or CSM were 0 between their Codex releases

As far we know, GW is selling most of the non-standard Marines only with new releases, may it be a new Codex, new Models or a Campaign book

of course there are people who buy in between, but those are not the massive sales GW aims for and a reason why most of those boxes are Online only

 kodos wrote:
the only official number of sales we ever got were those seen in the Chapterhouse law suit

in those very well showed that sales of "the most selling faction" aka a Box of Standard Marines, was linked to new releases only

Standard Marines sold better as they were sold with every Marine dex, yet Blood Angles or CSM were 0 between their Codex releases

As far we know, GW is selling most of the non-standard Marines only with new releases, may it be a new Codex, new Models or a Campaign book

of course there are people who buy in between, but those are not the massive sales GW aims for and a reason why most of those boxes are Online only

Those Chapterhouse discovery documents are nearly a decade out of date at this point – and a lot has changed over the last ten years and especially the last five.

GW's in-house marketing channels have fundamentally transformed, merging into a daily content production house (WarCom/YT/Twitch).

The IP licensing has exploded (Games galore).

New trade channels are being fostered (Hachette/B&N partnerships).

Even core GW merchandising has gotten savvy (Start Collecting boxes/embrace of online discounters).

Just as people are anchored to old realities about the cost of making injection molds, I think there's a similar tendency to live in the past WRT GW's sales patterns.

if you have an up to date sales numbers please share those

otherwise you just assume things changes because why?
nothing in GW's marketing or sales strategy indicastes that "new release sales" do not make up the vast majority of the sales from a product


nothing you mention indicate that things have changed, actually the opposite, all those new channels are focused on new releases and creating a hype for the new stuff
while even the most valued and hyped box sits on the shelf 6 months later because out of the initial hype the sales are low

 kodos wrote:
if you have an up to date sales numbers please share those

otherwise you just assume things changes because why?
nothing in GW's marketing or sales strategy indicastes that "new release sales" do not make up the vast majority of the sales from a product


nothing you mention indicate that things have changed, actually the opposite, all those new channels are focused on new releases and creating a hype for the new stuff
while even the most valued and hyped box sits on the shelf 6 months later because out of the initial hype the sales are low

You assume things change because... that's what happens over time. Especially when a company does a turnaround like GW seems to have done. And of course all their social channels are hyping new releases. That's... kind of what company social media is there for?

 Platuan4th wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

Well, everything but the multiple delays in releases since last year. I have a feeling 3rd was supposed to launch this summer, but I can see the delays pushing it to next year.

If they delay 3.0 for a year(if this summer was the target date) then everything but Broken Realms will be delayed for a year because they can't release anything designed for AoS 3.0 unless 3.0 gets released first and I really doubt GW will accept that.

If there is a delay it will be a month or two at best.

 Mr. Grey wrote:

You assume things change because... that's what happens over time. Especially when a company does a turnaround like GW seems to have done. And of course all their social channels are hyping new releases. That's... kind of what company social media is there for?

so the main argument why it must be different now is just because their have started to communicate with the community again?

yet people are claiming Indominus is sitting on the shelf because GW overproduced it in the second run, as they have made a turnaround and building sales on hype on release is not a thing any more this should not be a problem

the main argument is "but it must have changed after such a long time"
I agree, it has changed after the turnaround GW have made, but in the other direction to focus much more on release sales and drop support after shorter times in the past
that is why we see more releases in a shorter timeframe, to keep the numbers high while as after the release sales numbers for the old products are irrelevant

I assume that GW must make some meaningful trickle sales because in the past GW left big updates for months between releases. Furthermore if GW were only making money on big releases alone then I'd have expected them to shift their marketing and structure entirely - why have a library of over 800 products if only 20 or so big sellers are ever selling during release month

I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

 ImAGeek wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

If we're lucky, any Stormcast release would be an expansion on the existing Chambers(Vanguard could use an actual bow-wielding unit) and the "unseen" character-esque Chambers(Covenant, Ruination, Logister) that remain to be represented on the tabletop alongside a reorganization of some stuff.

Vanguard, IMO, are the most drastically misused concept in that whole range. Fluffed as rangers, survivalists, vigilantes, and huntsmen...but that sublist does not feel like it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

Not really bothered by AoS "starter" having Stormcast.

Our battleboxes are way, way more varied in terms of contents than 40k sets are so it's not like every single thing coming out has some kind of Stormcast in it.

 kodos wrote:
the only official number of sales we ever got were those seen in the Chapterhouse law suit

in those very well showed that sales of "the most selling faction" aka a Box of Standard Marines, was linked to new releases only

Standard Marines sold better as they were sold with every Marine dex, yet Blood Angles or CSM were 0 between their Codex releases

As far we know, GW is selling most of the non-standard Marines only with new releases, may it be a new Codex, new Models or a Campaign book

of course there are people who buy in between, but those are not the massive sales GW aims for and a reason why most of those boxes are Online only

In a recent investor report they noted that 60% of their sales are new releases.

 Mr. Grey wrote:

 kodos wrote:
if you have an up to date sales numbers please share those

otherwise you just assume things changes because why?
nothing in GW's marketing or sales strategy indicastes that "new release sales" do not make up the vast majority of the sales from a product


nothing you mention indicate that things have changed, actually the opposite, all those new channels are focused on new releases and creating a hype for the new stuff
while even the most valued and hyped box sits on the shelf 6 months later because out of the initial hype the sales are low

You assume things change because... that's what happens over time. Especially when a company does a turnaround like GW seems to have done. And of course all their social channels are hyping new releases. That's... kind of what company social media is there for?

So a company starts sending emails more often, sets up a fancy new website, uses their Facebook more often, and time passes. This means the company has changed dramatically. Despite having no sales figures or metrics of any kind, it's totes safe to assumsies fer shure this literally happened y'all.

Pure coincidence that the ratio of new Space Marine kits to other factions remains unchanged since the late 1980s.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

I just hope that 'When' they do release it, that they produce enough copies to not insta-sell out.. especially if there is a Limited Indomitus style release...

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

Well, everything but the multiple delays in releases since last year. I have a feeling 3rd was supposed to launch this summer, but I can see the delays pushing it to next year.

If they delay 3.0 for a year(if this summer was the target date) then everything but Broken Realms will be delayed for a year because they can't release anything designed for AoS 3.0 unless 3.0 gets released first and I really doubt GW will accept that.

If there is a delay it will be a month or two at best.

I never said "for a year", I said "to next year". That's a 4-6 month push at most.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
At this point pretty optimistic to think they wouldn't. Everything is pointing at it

Well, everything but the multiple delays in releases since last year. I have a feeling 3rd was supposed to launch this summer, but I can see the delays pushing it to next year.

If they delay 3.0 for a year(if this summer was the target date) then everything but Broken Realms will be delayed for a year because they can't release anything designed for AoS 3.0 unless 3.0 gets released first and I really doubt GW will accept that.

If there is a delay it will be a month or two at best.

I never said "for a year", I said "to next year". That's a 4-6 month push at most.

Which is not unreasonable tbh - they were already what 3 months behind when they hit the pre-order freeze? Probably going to lose another month to whatever caused that?

Being even 6 months behind by the end of the year is not beyond the realms of possibility...

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

But also, this being a rumour based on nothing except that both other GA’s have been in a starter.
And we know from Fantasy and 40k that means nothing.

There's a few different rumors right now for new starters. One is Stormcast Vanguard vs Destruction, another is Lumineth vs Daemons, and I believe there's one more rumor floating around that is Kurnothi vs Beastmen.

But where are they from? No solid sources or anything right?
It’s just peoples thoughts/opinions that snowball into rumours..

Some are purportedly from retailers, some are the usual kind of "My uncle works for Nintendo!" fare, etc.

Rarely will we actually have solid stuff too far out.

Oh yeah, and there's another rumor of a Fyreslayers vs Skaven set.

Pretty much. If it's not on those magnificent shipping manifestos or GW website it's just wishlisting. I personally think it'll be SM vs Stormcast in GW's attempt to make both hammer-verses into a shared cinematic universe.

Yeah GW of today doesn't leak very much at all. Honestly I think its because staff working for GW are happier than they were under the Kirby days in terms of community interaction and marketing. I think that during the Kirby era the huge amount of leaks were a direct result of GWs massive silence to the community coupled to the slower (than today) release cycle.

So you had staff making cool things but knowing that fans, who were pained with no info, wouldn't know for months. There was more temptation to leak to the community.


Today we get a rough 3 month cycle of pre-release info plus a few wildcard long term release hints as well. We've got sneak peaks and such as well. Basically there's a lot of communication going on. Sure we always want more, but right now there's a comfortable level of information exchange.


The only time its broken is during corona

 Overread wrote:
Yeah GW of today doesn't leak very much at all. Honestly I think its because staff working for GW are happier than they were under the Kirby days in terms of community interaction and marketing. I think that during the Kirby era the huge amount of leaks were a direct result of GWs massive silence to the community coupled to the slower (than today) release cycle.

So you had staff making cool things but knowing that fans, who were pained with no info, wouldn't know for months. There was more temptation to leak to the community.


Today we get a rough 3 month cycle of pre-release info plus a few wildcard long term release hints as well. We've got sneak peaks and such as well. Basically there's a lot of communication going on. Sure we always want more, but right now there's a comfortable level of information exchange.


The only time its broken is during corona

I think there's a few other things involved as well. They've hunted down quite a few leaks of the past. North America used to be the greatest leaker, then it was France, and all that's been pretty well locked down. GW managers are also discouraged from having YouTube channels or any social media related to GW.

A lot of leaks are also from potato-cams, quick snaps from phones of rulebooks thanks to someone visiting someone else and seeing it on a desk or a table. With fewer people meeting other people (playtesters, staff, etc) due to lockdowns, that sort of stuff naturally would dry up.

Danny76 wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

But also, this being a rumour based on nothing except that both other GA’s have been in a starter.
And we know from Fantasy and 40k that means nothing.

There are still the odd relatively reliable ‘rumour-mongers’ and I think the Stormcast vs Destruction rumours are from one of them, but either way I just meant more, might be worth making peace with the idea so it’s not disappointing when it happens. It’s pretty likely Stormcast will be in the starter, rumours or no.

Danny76 wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

But also, this being a rumour based on nothing except that both other GA’s have been in a starter.
And we know from Fantasy and 40k that means nothing.

Something vs soul blight starts to make sense. Soulblights are more and more looking at early 3e faction and new factions at the start of edition are often enough in starter set.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

drbored wrote:
A lot of leaks are also from potato-cams, quick snaps from phones of rulebooks thanks to someone visiting someone else and seeing it on a desk or a table. With fewer people meeting other people (playtesters, staff, etc) due to lockdowns, that sort of stuff naturally would dry up.

Those potato cams are GW leak department leaking intentionally stuff. That or every single leaker are totally incompetent photo takers who should stay away anything even remotely from resembling camera. Taking that bad photos requires serious dedication at taking bad photos.

 ImAGeek wrote:

Danny76 wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I just hope that when they do release AoS 3, they make a starter box with no Stormcast. Hopefully they’ve realised that AoS players aren’t obsessed with Stormcast in the same way that the 40K crowd love space marines.

Apart from a couple of character models, it’s been like 3 years since the last big Stormcast release. I’d be perfectly fine with them being in the starter. They’re nothing like Space Marines in terms of being release hogs.

It might be worth making peace with the idea either way, I think the rumours are Stormcast vs Destruction.

I was thinking more in terms of every starter having to have marines in it. If a new AoS starter has Stormcast, then I’ll pass.

But also, this being a rumour based on nothing except that both other GA’s have been in a starter.
And we know from Fantasy and 40k that means nothing.

There are still the odd relatively reliable ‘rumour-mongers’ and I think the Stormcast vs Destruction rumours are from one of them, but either way I just meant more, might be worth making peace with the idea so it’s not disappointing when it happens. It’s pretty likely Stormcast will be in the starter, rumours or no.

For sure Stormcast is the bet yeah.

But we don’t see those people posting anymore. No one ever links to the source now it just gets said.
The older days of Harry and Hastings seem to be finished.

That allows everything like the above conspiracy of GW doing all their own leaks to come about.
(Though the terrible photo wualit6 tracks, as nothing should ever be that bad any more)