https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/hjx3bwqb/celebrate-the-30th-anniversary-of-warhammer-quest-on-warhammer-tv/

I still have the Witchhunter, the Noble, and the Wardancer. I wish I kept the Elf Ranger and the Warrior Priest.

Fingers crossed for an MTO for the expansion heroes? We know the Elf Ranger is coming in the next HE MTO.

They could literally just reprint this as is and it would sell like crazy.

Still got those original heroes on sprue. Was saving them for when nostalgia kicks in.

30th Anniversary of WHQ. "WHFB" has returned.

Okay, I'll be positive and give them the benefit of the doubt. Maybe this is a sign that WHQ:TOW is going to be announced soon, maybe revised for a new era.

The only thing they really need to add to the more recent Quest games is character customisation.

It’s fine to offer Sir Henry Cholmondley-Warner, Imperial Noble as a character. But never at the cost of my option to instead tell the tale of Sir Bernard Chumley’s unique misadventures.

Ahh but that's what the new up coming Old World RPG game system is for

https://cubicle7games.com/blog/introducing-the-old-world-roleplaying-game

I hope they remember to hug the walls and to never split the party.

Also, if none of the players die on the way back to town and/or while staying in town, then I will assume something was rigged.

Just Re-release Warhammer Quest GW. You know you want too....Give us the original box set and you will get all of the money.

Considering how many so-so knock-offs I have Kickstarted over the years chasing the high of this game, I just know a true remake over even reprint would make me scream.

Modern GW loves games they can drip content for, so I am shocked this game never really came back. A small expansion every three months... a new quest book yearly... I would buy EVERYTHING they put out.

And no... IMO Silver Tower was a pathetic, thimble-deep attempt.

They KIND of did it - Warhammer Quest had Black Fortress and Cursed City. The Former did great even if expansions were short lived products whilst the latter had a cluster of disasters and stocking issues.

I'd love to see the format returned - it would be great to see Warhammer Quest and similar games back from GW (the genestealre+terminator one is escaping my mind as to its name)

Honestly I dont really like the newer Quest games as I dont like the dice mechanic.

The thing about Warhammer Quest that the newer quest games cant seem too, or dont want too, replicate are the progression and randomness. Which is why I would much rather a straight reprint of the Original than whatever modern game design choices they would make with a new one.

Feels like Underworlds is the modern stress version of a quest game concept.

(I mean no negativity to underworlds, I love the concept and buy lots of boxes just for the nice models)

 Overread wrote:

I'd love to see the format returned - it would be great to see Warhammer Quest and similar games back from GW (the genestealre+terminator one is escaping my mind as to its name)

They had Avanced Space Crusade and Tyranid Attack as more complex versions of Space Crusade in the same way as Advanced Heroquest and Warhammer Quest (both 'Advanced' versions needed to be replaced when the cooperation with MB ended), but both were just 'fighty' boardgames without much RP elements.

SPACE HULK that was the name!

 Overread wrote:
SPACE HULK that was the name!

You forgot the name of Space Hulk?

You forgot the name of Space Hulk?

That’s a “hand in your nerd card” offence, I’m afraid.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Overread wrote:
SPACE HULK that was the name!

You forgot the name of Space Hulk?

You forgot the name of Space Hulk?

That’s a “hand in your nerd card” offence, I’m afraid.

HEY! I posted the Spaceballs 2 thread - I've got a free pass on forgetting SpaceHulk for a few moments

Well, as possibly the only Dakkanaut to hold a genuine, professional Inquisitorial Mandate*…..you’re going in the book of Naughtyish Blokes for now.

*No. Seriously. I do. And it’s fun!

I must say that Blackstone has become my favourite GW game. Only problem is that it doesn't offer an awesome monster, if one missed The Dreaded Ambull.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:


HEY! I posted the Spaceballs 2 thread - I've got a free pass on forgetting SpaceHulk for a few moments

Dark Helmet will hear of your failure and you know what THAT means!

 Overread wrote:
SPACE HULK that was the name!

Well, Space Hulk has almost nothing to do with any 'Quest' game at all, though.

My local second hand store had a Warhammer quest box last year

I should have bought it but I know they’d have asked way too much

 Dryaktylus wrote:

 Overread wrote:
SPACE HULK that was the name!

Well, Space Hulk has almost nothing to do with any 'Quest' game at all, though.

Space Crusade was Star Quest in mainland Europe, wasn't it? There's the 40k Quest game!

Also?

AoS deserves a proper, proper Warhammer Quest game. One with a complete Bestiary, and accompany monster/beastie models.

See, before Sigmar emerged from hiding in Azyr? We had the Age of Chaos. And before that, the Age of Myth. Which means the Mortal Realms must surely be absolutely riddled with lost cairns, dungeons, abandoned cities, fallen keeps and that.

Keep it proper Quest scaled. Give us adventurers of different stripes and species. Give us Bestiary Expansion books/boxed sets covering different Realms.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
One with a complete Bestiary, and accompany monster/beastie models.

https://cubicle7games.com/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-soulbound-bestiary

THIS is what I want to see again (blatantly copied from the Warhammer Quest Runboard):

Warhammer Quest
Lair of the Orc Lord
Catacombs of Terror
Pits and Traps
Treasure Pack 1
Treasure Pack 2
Treasure Pack 3
Blank Event Cards

Warrior Packs:
Imperial Noble
Elf Wardancer
Troll Slayer
Witch Hunter
Pit Fighter
Elf Ranger
Chaos Warrior
Warrior Priest
Bretonnian Knight
Halfling Thief
Kislev Shaman
The Ogre (Citadel Journal)

And all of the White Dwarf, Deathblow and Journal articles in another box set.

Some of the warrior miniatures popped up in the MTO order bundles for TOW, wonder if GW would get a brainwave and do WHQ 30th anniversary MTO bundle.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
AoS deserves a proper, proper Warhammer Quest game. One with a complete Bestiary, and accompany monster/beastie models.

No, being treated that well is about the opposite of what AoS deserves.

What AoS deserves is... Dreadfleet.

 Dysartes wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
AoS deserves a proper, proper Warhammer Quest game. One with a complete Bestiary, and accompany monster/beastie models.

No, being treated that well is about the opposite of what AoS deserves.

What AoS deserves is... Dreadfleet.

You mean a fun little game with awesome ship models? Hell yeah that would be cool.

Honestly Dreadfleet or Warmaster would be fantastic for AoS considering how many "God Beasts" and other utterly stupidly huge things there are in the setting that you simply can't have at its current scale

I enjoyed old WHQ quite a lot, but it did have a very repetitive game experience.

Within a few levels you'd be getting a whole room full of rats that meant you couldn't move and then each hero would just slaughter everything near them. so you'd be putting all these models on and then just removing them. Leveling up still had this happen, just with goblins or skaven instead.

And then the wizard got bonkers very quickly.

If they could make the game more interesting in those areas I'd be up for a new edition. Never really liked the current design style of the Quest games.

 Dryaktylus wrote:


They had Avanced Space Crusade and Tyranid Attack as more complex versions of Space Crusade in the same way as Advanced Heroquest and Warhammer Quest (both 'Advanced' versions needed to be replaced when the cooperation with MB ended), but both were just 'fighty' boardgames without much RP elements.

Oh disagree with Advanced Heroquest.

It was the perfect distillation of the setting into a boardgame.

It clearly illustrated that the only people desperate enough to do this dangerous work were the nutters on the edge of society. If you got a magical item it was so rare their wasn't a trade in value as to you it was effectively priceless. You needed lackeys to carry your gear. the wizard had to contend with not only difficult spells but their expensive components. Yes he could cast it, but the goblin scalps are near worthless and these ingredients cost over 50 gold...

And combat was deadly. You frequently would just run from common monsters as their were few bounties on them and they had a good chance to kill you.

Though combat had a (doorway) flaw that you felt you had to exploit to survive the vicious combat.

Five years ago I'd have said a re-release was pointless as game design has moved on and an updated ruleset but with the same scope would do much better.

But then they re-released Hero Quest with the exact same rules and it seems to be doing exceptionally well, so clearly I know nothing.

The_Real_Chris wrote:

 Dryaktylus wrote:


They had Avanced Space Crusade and Tyranid Attack as more complex versions of Space Crusade in the same way as Advanced Heroquest and Warhammer Quest (both 'Advanced' versions needed to be replaced when the cooperation with MB ended), but both were just 'fighty' boardgames without much RP elements.

Oh disagree with Advanced Heroquest.

It was the perfect distillation of the setting into a boardgame.

Spoiler:

It clearly illustrated that the only people desperate enough to do this dangerous work were the nutters on the edge of society. If you got a magical item it was so rare their wasn't a trade in value as to you it was effectively priceless. You needed lackeys to carry your gear. the wizard had to contend with not only difficult spells but their expensive components. Yes he could cast it, but the goblin scalps are near worthless and these ingredients cost over 50 gold...

And combat was deadly. You frequently would just run from common monsters as their were few bounties on them and they had a good chance to kill you.

Though combat had a (doorway) flaw that you felt you had to exploit to survive the vicious combat.

With 'both were just 'fighty' boardgames without much RP elements' I meant Avanced Space Crusade and Tyranid Attack.

deano2099 wrote:
Five years ago I'd have said a re-release was pointless as game design has moved on and an updated ruleset but with the same scope would do much better.

But then they re-released Hero Quest with the exact same rules and it seems to be doing exceptionally well, so clearly I know nothing.

People keep saying game design has moved on - whilst at the same time chess, drafts, checkers, poker, the list goes on like crazy are ALL old games with some being hundreds of years old.
Meanwhile in the Video Game world old games - with all their pixel, slow response goodness - have been brought back onto modern systems with some even getting full remasters


What was fun 10 years ago can still be fun today.
Meanwhile most "games have advanced" isn't really advance but rather just different approaches and ideas - some of which are good and some of which are not so good.

The_Real_Chris wrote:
Oh disagree with Advanced Heroquest.

It was the perfect distillation of the setting into a boardgame.

It clearly illustrated that the only people desperate enough to do this dangerous work were the nutters on the edge of society. If you got a magical item it was so rare their wasn't a trade in value as to you it was effectively priceless. You needed lackeys to carry your gear. the wizard had to contend with not only difficult spells but their expensive components. Yes he could cast it, but the goblin scalps are near worthless and these ingredients cost over 50 gold...

And combat was deadly. You frequently would just run from common monsters as their were few bounties on them and they had a good chance to kill you.

Though combat had a (doorway) flaw that you felt you had to exploit to survive the vicious combat.

Exalted, Advanced Heroquest was amazing

Young ULM spent way too many hours playing it, even the single player version.

It felt like a massive step up from the OG Heroquest. Creating individual heroes and their henchmen, rolling for starting stats, the board tiles, all helped to create a great atmosphere.

 Hellebore wrote:
I enjoyed old WHQ quite a lot, but it did have a very repetitive game experience.

Within a few levels you'd be getting a whole room full of rats that meant you couldn't move and then each hero would just slaughter everything near them. so you'd be putting all these models on and then just removing them. Leveling up still had this happen, just with goblins or skaven instead.

And then the wizard got bonkers very quickly.

If they could make the game more interesting in those areas I'd be up for a new edition. Never really liked the current design style of the Quest games.

My experience with WHQ has all been in the last few years. I slooowly pieced together a complete set over more than a decade by gradually getting hold of the various bits and pieces, and using proxies when necessary. My Lair of the Orc Lord boyz are made from an old plastic Blood Bowl team.

I love the game ... which puzzles me, because on paper it doesn't look like fun. It's mostly a mindless, repetitive exercise in rolling dice. There's very little real exploration (unlike original HeroQuest), and not much in the way of tactical decision-making, at least when you're starting out and lack items or abilities.

Yet somehow it's consistently entertaining and keeps generating memorable emergent stories from all the random nonsense. Especially once you add the extra variety offered by the expansions, White Dwarf add-ons, the Roleplay Book extra monsters and events, etc.

One of my favourites was the time we met all three expansion mini-bosses (Skabnoze the shaman, Gunther the necromancer and the assassin rat from the White Dwarf Skaven mini-expansion) in neighbouring rooms of the same dungeon. It was as if we'd stumbled onto some kind of nefarious G20 summit. And just when we thought we'd licked them, it turned out the Chaos Warrior had stolen something from a pack of MInotaurs, and they finally caught up to him and killed us all. What precious item had the Warrior stolen? Three gold coins.

Plus, because it's cooperative and not too brain-straining, it's simultaneously tense and relaxing. You can chat about life/politics/what's wrong with the latest Star Wars movie while playing it, without fear of losing track of what's going on.

Our main problem is surviving more than two quests in a row with the same heroes ...


Regarding the 30th anniversary, I'm a bit surprised they mentioned it at all. For a long time GW seemed reluctant to mention the original WHQ. I got the impression some kind of drama happened behind the scenes, similar to Gorkamorka--another game GW spent a while pretending never existed, unlike Necromunda, Epic, etc. But that's just my vague impression from cryptic hints on various forums. I could be completely wrong.

 Hellebore wrote:
I enjoyed old WHQ quite a lot, but it did have a very repetitive game experience.

Within a few levels you'd be getting a whole room full of rats that meant you couldn't move and then each hero would just slaughter everything near them. so you'd be putting all these models on and then just removing them. Leveling up still had this happen, just with goblins or skaven instead.

And then the wizard got bonkers very quickly.

If they could make the game more interesting in those areas I'd be up for a new edition. Never really liked the current design style of the Quest games.

And when you got to high levels, you were just rolling to see how many greater daemons or Chaos lords were in the next room, since there were so few monsters of an appropriate challenge.

And then you’d get casually murdered to death when visiting the toilet afterwards.

> But then they re-released Hero Quest with the exact same rules and it seems to be doing exceptionally well, so clearly I know nothing.

Familiarity and Nostalgia.

For children's games, researchers found out that the most popular titles were selling because the parents were already familiar with the rules, and because they already knew about the game. Not hard to find a better children's game than Life or Hi Ho, but your average parent isn't going to pick up these better games because they're not familiar with it (and because they're *way* more expensive).

So, for HQ, I'm sure if the game was sold only on the design, it wouldn't have sold well. But it was the only game of its kind a generation ago, was OOP (and many backers owned it as a kid, played the **** out of it, and either lost their copy or wore it out) and had "free" advertising by GameZone as well, so was immensely popular. Compare this to how the HeroScape crowdfunding failed, though HS without prepainted figures (and different factions?) made it even less popular.

I'm waiting for Dungeon Command, myself, but that ain't gonna happen.

HeroQuest is a really nice system though.

For those well versed in the genre, it’s a bit low on crunchy detail, sure. But the hallmarks are all there, and sloppy Hero positioning can and will see them overwhelmed. And you can typically wrap up an adventure in half and hour from getting the box out of the cupboard to the last dice roll.

And it’s very accessible for newcomers young and old.

On this 30th Anniversary thing, it does feel like an odd effort with no re-release. Why show us the gameplay of a game we can’t now buy?

Yeah I've never minded the original HQ rules.

I've always liked the combined attack rules on the same dice - giving you two different success chances for PCs and NPCs without using numbers or profiles to compare to, just rolling the dice and the faces take care of it.


I actually think if you combined the GMless aspect of WHQ with the set up of HQ you'd get an even more fun game. HQ doesn't really give the GM enough to do, so allowing htem to be a hero instead vs the game would be good.

My secret hope is at the culmination of this season they announce that we'll be able to relive the cast's adventures with a copy of the game on a MTO basis.

Or just a fancied up version like the last Space Hulk anniversary. I'd be fine with either. I thought Silver Tower and Cursed City were neat, but a bit too removed from the original concept.

All the games I've kickstarted over the years were in an attempt to chase the highs that this game offered. Never owned my own copy either, sadly. A few have come really close in various ways. Darklight Memento Mori I thought came the closest, whereas stuff like Brimstone has taken the basic formula and let it run wild and mutate.

Honestly it would be odd for GW to do multiple articles and a video on a classic game format that's over 20 years old that even oldies can't play because they lost/sold/never bought it at the time and all the new customers don't even have a hope of playing.

That is unless its one of those cases where lower level staff are pushing for it and management say there's no interest; so lower level staff do a bunch of stuff like this to generate talk, hype and see if they get enough "engagement scores" and such to use as a justification to the management to say "here people were interested; they were talking; they do want the product - lets do it"


Even if that means a reprint will be over a year away.

Leave the King rest in peace.

 Overread wrote:
Honestly it would be odd for GW to do multiple articles and a video on a classic game format that's over 20 years old that even oldies can't play because they lost/sold/never bought it at the time and all the new customers don't even have a hope of playing.

They've done a non-zero amount of Blackstone Fortress playthroughs despite all the expansions being long out of print and going for a fortune on eBay but without it materialising into more availability, sadly.

>"they rereleased HeroQuest with the exact same rules"

Just a note for anyone unaware: The current rerelease of HeroQuest has the exact same rules as the old North American edition. The rules were different in original original HeroQuest, the UK edition. And that had two editions itself. (I believe Australia only got the revised 2nd edition of the UK version. Non-English-speaking countries often got a translation of the UK 1st edition, but not the revised version.)

If your evil wizard / GM was called Morcar and the first quest in your questbook was 'The Maze', you had the UK 1st edition.

If your evil wizard was called Morcar and the first quest in your questbook was 'The Trial', you had the UK 2nd edition.

If your evil wizard was called Zargon, you had the North American edition, which fiddled with quite a lot of rules and quests. Mostly unnecessary overcomplication in my opinion ... but they did add some nifty Chaos Spells.

 Hellebore wrote:


I actually think if you combined the GMless aspect of WHQ with the set up of HQ you'd get an even more fun game. HQ doesn't really give the GM enough to do, so allowing htem to be a hero instead vs the game would be good.

I think there's a companion app for the modern rerelease of HQ that does a passable job of automating the monsters and telling you what's in the next room, but I play boardgames to get away from screens ...

I remember reading back in the day in WD a Chaos Dwarf and a Dark Elf set adventures were were planned, wonder why they weren't released.

Ancient Otter wrote:
I remember reading back in the day in WD a Chaos Dwarf and a Dark Elf set adventures were were planned, wonder why they weren't released.

Lack of sales, I imagine. I picked up most of the hero packs for cheap in the big white metal switch, evidence that gamers back then didn't know how good they had it!

 Overread wrote:
Honestly it would be odd for GW to do multiple articles and a video on a classic game format that's over 20 years old that even oldies can't play because they lost/sold/never bought it at the time and all the new customers don't even have a hope of playing.

That is unless its one of those cases where lower level staff are pushing for it and management say there's no interest; so lower level staff do a bunch of stuff like this to generate talk, hype and see if they get enough "engagement scores" and such to use as a justification to the management to say "here people were interested; they were talking; they do want the product - lets do it"


Even if that means a reprint will be over a year away.

Honestly the game sucks and it’s all nostalgia. It’s a basic dungeon crawler that took more to set up than to play. Game design has moved on.

Zenithfleet wrote:
>"they rereleased HeroQuest with the exact same rules"

Just a note for anyone unaware: The current rerelease of HeroQuest has the exact same rules as the old North American edition. The rules were different in original original HeroQuest, the UK edition. And that had two editions itself. (I believe Australia only got the revised 2nd edition of the UK version. Non-English-speaking countries often got a translation of the UK 1st edition, but not the revised version.)

If your evil wizard / GM was called Morcar and the first quest in your questbook was 'The Maze', you had the UK 1st edition.

If your evil wizard was called Morcar and the first quest in your questbook was 'The Trial', you had the UK 2nd edition.

If your evil wizard was called Zargon, you had the North American edition, which fiddled with quite a lot of rules and quests. Mostly unnecessary overcomplication in my opinion ... but they did add some nifty Chaos Spells.

 Hellebore wrote:


I actually think if you combined the GMless aspect of WHQ with the set up of HQ you'd get an even more fun game. HQ doesn't really give the GM enough to do, so allowing htem to be a hero instead vs the game would be good.

I think there's a companion app for the modern rerelease of HQ that does a passable job of automating the monsters and telling you what's in the next room, but I play boardgames to get away from screens ...

Ah, all the copies I have are Morcar/Trial ones. Good times.

The WHQ system of using card decks as the GM works really well and in a way makes the game feel very PvE sandboxy despite the actual gameplay, because there's no meta intelligence competing against you. It's really interesting the psychology difference between the two.

The core mechanics of HQ were pretty solid, it's more the campaign and GM mechanics that they needed to improve, as it's limited to a single board set up with limited configurations. They also needed to bring Mind Points into the game a lot more so that the Wizard's skewed stats were not as much of a handicap. And for more depth in general.

But those dice allowed so many interesting rules ideas and options. The gear system was easy. All in all, a nice breezy system that could have easily had a more satisfying campaign and layout system applied over the top without needing to change the core mechanics.

Ancient Otter wrote:I remember reading back in the day in WD a Chaos Dwarf and a Dark Elf set adventures were were planned [for Warhammer Quest], wonder why they weren't released.

As I recall, the promised but never released WHQ expansions were for Skaven and Chaos Dwarfs, not Dark Elves.

They did publish a kind of mini-expansion for the Skaven in White Dwarf. It's more in-depth than usual for a WD article and appears to have been salvaged from the unfinished expansion. It even came with cards for three special characters and an objective room.

The only thing that ever surfaced from the Chaos Dwarf expansion was a mysterious cardboard floor tile of an anvil/forge room, with no dungeon card or explanation to go with it, making it useless unless you homebrewed something.

Some of the random bonus rooms published in White Dwarf might have been originally intended for those expansions (like the Sewer, which feels very Skavenesque).

Hellebore wrote:
The WHQ system of using card decks as the GM works really well and in a way makes the game feel very PvE sandboxy despite the actual gameplay, because there's no meta intelligence competing against you. It's really interesting the psychology difference between the two.

The core mechanics of HQ were pretty solid, it's more the campaign and GM mechanics that they needed to improve, as it's limited to a single board set up with limited configurations. They also needed to bring Mind Points into the game a lot more so that the Wizard's skewed stats were not as much of a handicap. And for more depth in general.

But those dice allowed so many interesting rules ideas and options. The gear system was easy. All in all, a nice breezy system that could have easily had a more satisfying campaign and layout system applied over the top without needing to change the core mechanics.

I agree about the WHQ card system (in fact I've made heaps of custom cards so we don't have to roll on those tables in the Roleplay Book). It often feels like the game is conspiring against us even though it's pure randomness. We had one adventure where we found nothing but empty corridor after empty corridor for miles, reached a dead end, awkwardly turned around ... and suddenly set off a trap and a horde of Beastmen jumped us while we were still rearranging our formation. Obviously a well-planned ambush.

I'm not so sure about HQ's single board being a problem, though. Actually, I think it offers more possibilities than the separate floor tiles of WHQ and other games like it. A huge amount of setups are possible just by changing the doors and the blocked squares, without sprawling everywhere and going off the edges of the table. You can also use overlay tiles to cover up the lines on the board to change the shape of the rooms. More importantly, because each quest is pre-planned, the paths can interconnect to offer multiple routes to the objective. A well-made HQ map feels like a real place that exists for its own sake and that you're exploring, rather than a theme park ride that has been summoned into being just so the players can go through it. (A bit like the levels in N64 Goldeneye.)

WHQ tends to generate fairly linear dungeons. It's more of a dungeon bash than a dungeon exploration. You might run into the occasional T-junction with different rooms in either direction, but you know that whichever way you go you'll draw the next Event card from the deck. If you go left and meet an Ogre, you would have met him if you went right too, which feels a bit weird.

Interestingly, I think Stephen Baker's original design for HeroQuest had separate dungeon tiles that you connected together ... but the playtest audience (preteen boys mostly) found that too confusing, what with the need to find the correct tiles that matched the map from a jumble of tiles, plus the sheer strangeness of not having a conventional board like other board games.

A lot of things that seem like flaws were actually refinements to suit the target mass-market audience. I recall Baker saying in an interview that they knew they'd hit the right level of simplicity vs complexity when they could simply leave the prototype HeroQuest box in a roomful of kids without telling them anything about how to play the game, leave for an hour, and come back to find the kids engrossed in playing it.

The North American edition was revamped by a different team (though they kept in touch with Baker) and seems to have aimed at a slightly older, slightly geekier demographic.

Mind Points should definitely have seen more use. I don't really find the Wizard to be handicapped, though. In fact I find him to be the most fun of all the heroes to use, since you're always on the edge of death and have to think carefully about when to use your spells. Unfortunately if your first experience of UK HeroQuest is 'The Trial', the Wizard can earn himself a bad reputation, since that's the 'introductory game' that doesn't use the spell rules ...

In terms of the campaign, UK HeroQuest had the awkward problem of initially assuming that the hero players would compete with each other for gold and equipment rewards. The quests in the base game were designed with this in mind. If the Elf goes racing off on his own looking for treasure, he'll have a dangerous and thrilling time. It's especially obvious in the 1st edition, where 'The Maze' encourages the heroes to compete. But if all four heroes stick together, the UK base game quests are a bit too easy. By the time the expansions came out it was clear that a lot of players were cooperating like well-drilled soldiers. That's probably why the expansions are harder and throw scads of monsters at you.

The North American edition enforced cooperation from the get-go, removing rules that let heroes attack each other and so on, but it had to bump up the difficulty of the base game quests to balance it out.

The biggest issue I had with HQ was the 'doorway problem'. Every time you opened the door to a new room, you'd lay out all this interesting furniture and all these monsters, ready for an exciting battle ... and then the heroes would inevitably stand outside the door with the Barbarian at the front, and fight the monsters one at a time instead of actually charging in for a multiplayer brawl like the game assumed they would. Tactically sound, but boring for both sides.

Whoops, there I go again ...

I am sort of amazed that GW haven't properly managed a continuing line of co-op dungeon crawler. Blackstone Fortress was the closest they got - and even though that seemed to do really well they gave up on it, no new edition or such.

These sort of games clearly sell and expansions could just be repackaging exiting minis with new rules and cards. I guess while for most board game companies such a game would a golden goose, for GW the opportunity cost of not focusing instead on the core lines is greater.

I'm finding this all fascinating, as my own dungeon crawler is ideally co-op or solo play, but all the playtest sessions involve me controlling the baddies.

deano2099 wrote:
I am sort of amazed that GW haven't properly managed a continuing line of co-op dungeon crawler.

I don't know why GW doesn't re-release one of their older games every year.

As for Blackstone Fortress: without searching, find it for sale on Warhammer.com. They've buried it. Same for Cursed City.

Cursed City is still under AOS on the website, but Blackstone has to be searched...hmmm.

Zenithfleet wrote:


As I recall, the promised but never released WHQ expansions were for Skaven and Chaos Dwarfs, not Dark Elves.

They did publish a kind of mini-expansion for the Skaven in White Dwarf. It's more in-depth than usual for a WD article and appears to have been salvaged from the unfinished expansion. It even came with cards for three special characters and an objective room.

The only thing that ever surfaced from the Chaos Dwarf expansion was a mysterious cardboard floor tile of an anvil/forge room, with no dungeon card or explanation to go with it, making it useless unless you homebrewed something.

Some of the random bonus rooms published in White Dwarf might have been originally intended for those expansions (like the Sewer, which feels very Skavenesque).

Cheers, I could hazily remember them mentioned at the end of a WHQ designers notes article on WD, not sure why I had it in my head about the Dark Elves. Andy Chambers was mentioned as working on the CD one, not sure about the Skaven.

I doubt they will, but I'd love it if they reissued those plastics.

Flying Frog Productions' Shadows of Brimstone is the nearest thing to a modern Warhammer Quest, with cards equating to floor tiles, encounter and treasure cards and random events on the journey back to town. Weird Western theming is the cherry on top!

Not Dungeon Saga Origins by Mantic or even the Hero Quest re-release?

 mattl wrote:
Not Dungeon Saga Origins by Mantic or even the Hero Quest re-release?

Not even close. Shadows of Brimstone is a reskin, but otherwise 95% WHQ mechanically. Dungeon Saga is a barely modernized Heroquest and like HQ it is very fun, but stupidly light and dull.

And with the prices and number of products for Shadows of Brimstone it's why I'm surprised GW aren't doing it. £30-£40 for 3-5 enemy minis and a few cards to make them playable. And we're up to what maybe 40 enemy packs now (including the XL enemies that are larger) and that's in addition to the big box expansions and standalone expansions which also work as a new base game...

The current version of dungeon saga is a massive disappointment, but the previous version was an excellent space hulk like tactical dungeon crawl.

Had no idea shadows was a WHQ clone as I have never found anything like it personally.

Dungeon Saga Origins is pretty good, but not WHQ good. More like a half-step up from Heroquest with a decent enemy AI built into the system, no DM needed. League of Dungeoneers is probably even closer than Shadows of Brimstone to the WHQ experience. Phenominal game, but the author only does limited printruns through KS/Gamefound.

As for actual WHQ, Littlemonk has been adding new content for quite a few years, both remastering the old scans for people to print n play and also creating a boatload of custom content that rivals GW in quality. His Hall of the Hag Queen dark elf questbook is widely considered better than the GW questbooks. He's in the same boat as Warhammer Armies Project was where GW is clearly aware of him and happy to let him continue doing his thing since the game is OOP so long as it's clearly marked as not official GW. WAP got their C&D right before The Old World was about to finally release. Littlemonk hasn't gotten a C&D so I'd guess there's nothing official on the horizon for WHQ, sadly.

Also, Advanced Heroquest has seen a bit of a fan resurgence in the last couple years, there's an active Facebook Group remastering that content too. Graeme Davis found out and dug out a bunch of old content that was cut from Terror in the Dark, and some fans went through and edited that into a fully illustrated Undead expansion. That just came out a couple weeks ago.

So I don't expect anything official from GW, but it's still a fantastic time to be a dungeoncrawl fan

I am a fan of both League of Dungeoneers and Shadows of Brimstone.

League is a great entry due to the price (cardboard standees rather than minis) but I prefer the overall setting variation from Brimstone.

I have never played it but the fan made Hexcrawl expansions for Brimstone are meant to make it fully an original WHQ experience with land travel, etc.

Final part has aired. Feels like this was an enormous tease to do it without organising a reprint.

I don't understand the giant gap between episodes for this and the Kill Lupercal finale. What the heck is happening over at WH+?

It dropped once a month, guess that was the content creation schedule.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see a reprint of this as a limited release thing still.

I watched episode 1 last night and it was maybe the second time I’ve actually watched anything longer than a few minutes on Warhammer+ despite being a day 1 subscriber.

They really need to add subtitles to their Apple TV app.

I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

HidaO-Win wrote:
I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

Yeah, the problem will be making the dungeon tiles just thick enough to fit into the door arches tightly. Trying to find that level when gluing the WD tiles to cardboard was very difficult!

It definitely feels weird to offer a multipart
video playthrough to celebrate a long, long out of print game and then do….nowt.

It’s like MST3K only airing the commentary, and not showing the film itself.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:


It’s like MST3K only airing the commentary, and not showing the film itself.

You mean like when the various cast became Cinematic Titanic and RiffTrax?

Erm…ummm..I dunno!

Even a reprint of the models alone - no game just the models on made-to-order would have been interesting.

It is strange to see GW do a multi-part video of their own and not have anything to sell us after.

A better example would be Bethesda Game Studios partnering with Amazon to make a full season of a Fallout TV show, but when it the show came out and was a massive hit, Bethesda turned out to have not prepped any sort of new Fallout game - or even a remaster/reissue - to drop alongside the show.

 Psychopomp wrote:
A better example would be Bethesda Game Studios partnering with Amazon to make a full season of a Fallout TV show, but when it the show came out and was a massive hit, Bethesda turned out to have not prepped any sort of new Fallout game - or even a remaster/reissue - to drop alongside the show.

But we all know Bethesda only makes Skyrim remasters!

I suspect it is partly to maintain the trademark (to show that it is still in use even if the product is not currently on the shelves) and perhaps to gauge interest ahead of a potential reboot.

We've not had a decent board game in years.

GW needs to do the decent thing this Christmas and double whammy us with Space Hulk and Classic Warhammer Quest. No more mucking about.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:


It’s like MST3K only airing the commentary, and not showing the film itself.

You mean like when the various cast became Cinematic Titanic and RiffTrax?

I appreciate this is a tongue in cheek remark but [adjusts glasses] your analogy is missing a bit of key context that makes it not really work.
Cinematic Titanic and Rifftrax both released snark tracks without the films to avoid licensing headaches, yes, but they are/were always 100% intended to be watched alongside the movie and included sync-up marks to that end. RT even had its own player for a while. You were never meant to consume one without the other.

HidaO-Win wrote:
I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

Not really. The game is old enough that the print files for the rulebooks were unlikely to be fully digital. Page layout would have been done digitally by the mid-90s, but photography would have been done on film. Artwork would also have been physical and would then have been photographed. GW may have had the facility to scan those images themselves but it's also quite likely that the final images were compiled with the layout files by the printers, who then would have produced sheets of film for checking, before these were turned into printing plates. That's a lot different from the modern situation, with all layout and image files being digital, and the print files being PDFs. I imagine GW must have some version of all these images and files, but they're unlikely to be complete and ready to go, and there could well be issues with opening the files given the age of the software that would have been used to produce the original layouts. I don't think any kind of reprint was ever likely; no idea why they chose to make it such a big feature of Warhammer+ for the past few months.

HidaO-Win wrote:
I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

Sprues should be easy indeed - they sold them some years after the game in 'Toy Boxes' together with Talisman plastics - I bought the Adventurers box and converted the Barbarian and the Dark Elf assassine for Necromunda. Though my main target was the Tyranid box with 4 Genestealers and 4 Termagants - guess I bought about ten. Those boxes were dirty cheap.

 Psychopomp wrote:
A better example would be Bethesda Game Studios partnering with Amazon to make a full season of a Fallout TV show, but when it the show came out and was a massive hit, Bethesda turned out to have not prepped any sort of new Fallout game - or even a remaster/reissue - to drop alongside the show.

What, you weren't amazed by the 'you get to play a ghoul now' expansion for Fallout 76 that released after the series?

 Tastyfish wrote:
I suspect it is partly to maintain the trademark (to show that it is still in use even if the product is not currently on the shelves) and perhaps to gauge interest ahead of a potential reboot.

Cursed City is still on sale and is called Warhammer Quest, so I don't think there's any trademark issue.

But I would imagine the interest is there. Looking at eBay right when this first got announced, used copies have been listed for $400-800. No idea if anyone is buying them at that price.

Between the many modern Hero Quest expansions and Kickstarter all-in version of Dungeon Saga Origins, I must have enough dungeon tiles and miniatures for many of the miniatures. I have a pile of em4 Orcs on the Hero Quest style flat bases somewhere too.

Giant bats and giant spiders in plastic at a decent price are alluding me somewhat.

I can't see GW re-releasing the original WQ without updating the miniatures, that would seem to only appeal to the nostalgia market.

However, if they re-released it with modern, more detailed versions of the miniatures then it could be very successful indeed!

Old vintage plastic miniatures maybe belong to Wargames Foundry. If I'm not wrong, Heroquest old heroes (with many other old Citadel miniatures) are exposed at Foundry shop.

Greenfield wrote:

HidaO-Win wrote:
I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

Not really. The game is old enough that the print files for the rulebooks were unlikely to be fully digital. Page layout would have been done digitally by the mid-90s, but photography would have been done on film. Artwork would also have been physical and would then have been photographed. GW may have had the facility to scan those images themselves but it's also quite likely that the final images were compiled with the layout files by the printers, who then would have produced sheets of film for checking, before these were turned into printing plates. That's a lot different from the modern situation, with all layout and image files being digital, and the print files being PDFs. I imagine GW must have some version of all these images and files, but they're unlikely to be complete and ready to go, and there could well be issues with opening the files given the age of the software that would have been used to produce the original layouts. I don't think any kind of reprint was ever likely; no idea why they chose to make it such a big feature of Warhammer+ for the past few months.

Internet is full of people that literally remade the game on they own, from board section to books, and GW is incapable of doing that?

Budget and man hours. And doing it all to a standard they feel is reflective of the rest of GW’s offerings.

When Louise Sugden did the worky bits to get Rogue Trader back in print, she was by her own description a one woman band. Not simply scanning the pages of a pristine copy of the original Rogue Trader, but page by page digital clean ups and converting to whatever file format the printer needed, without loss of resolution.

And that took her months.

To get WHQ back in print, you need to find and update or recreate the original floor tile masters. And ensure they can be printed on cardstock of Just The Right Thickness. And then scan in and tidy up an existing rulebook, roleplay book and that. Then of course you need to find the original moulds, make sure they’re still compatible with the modern machinery*, and still in working order (accidents of usage and storage will happen).

Then you’ll have something ready to go into production. And before you press the Go Switch? You need to have ensured underlying costs aren’t just likely to be met by likely sales volumes, but that whatever it is you’re rearranging to free up the time need to cast the Sprues, print the cards and dungeon tiles and rulebooks and boxes and that isn’t likely to provide a greater level of profit.

*Pure speculation on my behalf. I’ve absolutely no idea whether modern plastic injection moulding machines owned by GW are significantly different in size settings from those around when WHQ was first in production. But if they are, and the original moulds are now in an obsolete size? That’s further costs to sort out one way or another.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

Then of course you need to find the original moulds, make sure they’re still compatible with the modern machinery*, and still in working order (accidents of usage and storage will happen).

*Pure speculation on my behalf. I’ve absolutely no idea whether modern plastic injection moulding machines owned by GW are significantly different in size settings from those around when WHQ was first in production. But if they are, and the original moulds are now in an obsolete size? That’s further costs to sort out one way or another.

I can assure you that this is not a problem. I work in the industry in a rather small company and we can still produce with decades old moulds on newer machines. I guess the oldest is from 1956... - Regarding the size: of course you use different machines to produce large or smaller sprues. But that's why you have a diverse machine park. And GW has it, that's for sure.

Oh nice! Thank you for the clarification

I think the killer might be having to print the card in China, does GW have a local partner that will do high quality card for them. That was what was rumoured happened to the two Cursed City expansions, right? Them doing HH tokens as plastic sprues felt like a sign.

Johanxp wrote:

Greenfield wrote:

HidaO-Win wrote:
I think what my hold up a reprint is having difficulty finding somewhere to print high quality cardboard tiles or having the original files somewhere.

The sprues and rulebooks "should" be simple.

Not really. The game is old enough that the print files for the rulebooks were unlikely to be fully digital. Page layout would have been done digitally by the mid-90s, but photography would have been done on film. Artwork would also have been physical and would then have been photographed. GW may have had the facility to scan those images themselves but it's also quite likely that the final images were compiled with the layout files by the printers, who then would have produced sheets of film for checking, before these were turned into printing plates. That's a lot different from the modern situation, with all layout and image files being digital, and the print files being PDFs. I imagine GW must have some version of all these images and files, but they're unlikely to be complete and ready to go, and there could well be issues with opening the files given the age of the software that would have been used to produce the original layouts. I don't think any kind of reprint was ever likely; no idea why they chose to make it such a big feature of Warhammer+ for the past few months.

Internet is full of people that literally remade the game on they own, from board section to books, and GW is incapable of doing that?

They're perfectly capable of it but it would be complex and time-consuming. The prior poster said the rulebooks would be 'simple'; I'm merely explaining why that's not the case. Anything is possible, including scanning, cleaning up and reprinting copies of old books (as was done for the Rogue Trader reprint, because it would have been too old to have ever existed digitally). All of these things take time, potentially quite a lot of time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 1984Phantom wrote:
Old vintage plastic miniatures maybe belong to Wargames Foundry. If I'm not wrong, Heroquest old heroes (with many other old Citadel miniatures) are exposed at Foundry shop.

This isn't correct. A few early Citadel ranges, which were largely historical in nature, including some ninjas and some vikings, were passed from Citadel to Foundry decades ago, but that was all long before Warhammer Quest. All the ranges in question were metal, from Warhammer 3rd edition or earlier; no plastics, nothing from the big boxed games like HeroQuest or Warhammer Quest.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:


To get WHQ back in print, you need to find and update or recreate the original floor tile masters. And ensure they can be printed on cardstock of Just The Right Thickness. And then scan in and tidy up an existing rulebook, roleplay book and that. Then of course you need to find the original moulds, make sure they’re still compatible with the modern machinery*, and still in working order (accidents of usage and storage will happen).

The floor tiles are what's known as punchboard (i.e. it's all printed on a big sheet of cardboard, which is partially cut through so you can 'punch' it out). There's no 'masters' for these. There's the original artwork, and then scans or photographs of these, which are then laid out on a sheet to be printed, and the printed sheet is then adhered to the top of said cardboard sheet before the whole thing gets stamped out. There seems to be a perception on this thread that these floor tiles are especially complex, but that's not the case – they're just a print item. Good quality images is all that's required, and from memory all the card in the box probably filled less than a dozen sheets of punchboard, so it'd actually be a lot less work overall than the rulebooks and associated elements.

Punchboard has seen quite big price increases of late, but there's no 'master' and there's no additional technical complexity in restoring and reprinting something like that. I just, again, very much doubt GW would ever see it as worth it.

 Overread wrote:

 Psychopomp wrote:
A better example would be Bethesda Game Studios partnering with Amazon to make a full season of a Fallout TV show, but when it the show came out and was a massive hit, Bethesda turned out to have not prepped any sort of new Fallout game - or even a remaster/reissue - to drop alongside the show.

But we all know Bethesda only makes Skyrim remasters!

Why only yesterday they re-released Hexen and Heretic


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anything for Warhammer Quest circa 1995 would be at least 3-4 years after Tom Kirby took over, so there should be no Wargames Foundry involvement by then.

Is it also possible GW doesn't fully own all the rights to this as we saw with the Chapter House legal shenanigans?

There was a rumour years ago that they’d physically lost the stuff to reprint the floor tiles.

No idea if I’m remembering correctly, or even if I am it was true in the first place.

The tiles from Dungeon Bowl was the key motivation for my picking up a couple of copies - one for the game itself, and another for use with WQ: Hammerhal ^_^ they are such good modern interpretations of the vast majority of the originals - and I am sure the superfluous elements could be easily removed if needs be.

 Clockpunk wrote:
The tiles from Dungeon Bowl was the key motivation for my picking up a couple of copies - one for the game itself, and another for use with WQ: Hammerhal ^_^ they are such good modern interpretations of the vast majority of the originals - and I am sure the superfluous elements could be easily removed if needs be.

Is there an official Shadows over hammerhal ruleset for these? (If so I'll have to find and pick this up)

 laam999 wrote:

 Clockpunk wrote:
The tiles from Dungeon Bowl was the key motivation for my picking up a couple of copies - one for the game itself, and another for use with WQ: Hammerhal ^_^ they are such good modern interpretations of the vast majority of the originals - and I am sure the superfluous elements could be easily removed if needs be.

Is there an official Shadows over hammerhal ruleset for these? (If so I'll have to find and pick this up)

Oh, not that I am aware of, sorry - my uses were entirely homebrew. But as the original WHQ was what got me into the hobby back in the day, I couldn't resist. Along with picking up a couple of door packs from WarCry Catacombs to bling out Hammerhal long before the DB release, just to add to the old school feel.

 Clockpunk wrote:

 laam999 wrote:

 Clockpunk wrote:
The tiles from Dungeon Bowl was the key motivation for my picking up a couple of copies - one for the game itself, and another for use with WQ: Hammerhal ^_^ they are such good modern interpretations of the vast majority of the originals - and I am sure the superfluous elements could be easily removed if needs be.

Is there an official Shadows over hammerhal ruleset for these? (If so I'll have to find and pick this up)

Oh, not that I am aware of, sorry - my uses were entirely homebrew. But as the original WHQ was what got me into the hobby back in the day, I couldn't resist. Along with picking up a couple of door packs from WarCry Catacombs to bling out Hammerhal long before the DB release, just to add to the old school feel.

That's fair, I really like the WHQ stuff and thought I had all the stuff since silver tower so Ty for that.