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I havent played Orks at all but I like the 4 battlewagon idea. Im wondering what to put in them. I know one has to be 10 nobs, so maybe 20 shoota boys with big shootas in the other three.

What about lootas? Would they harmonize with the army at all or are they easy pickings? I was thinking thy would be good anti tank and horde, maybe three units of ten or two of 15?

For upgrades, I know red paint is a must for the movement, as well as the roller. Anything else, what about guns?

Any suggestions would be appreciated really.

How many points are we talking about here? I would start the army by taking 3 Heavy Support Battlewagons with Killkannon, 'Ard Case, Red Paint Job, Deffrolla. Load three minimum Troops choices in those. As a HQ choice you are going to want a Big Mek with a KFF so all your vehicles within range of him will get cover saves (either 4+ or 5+, that's a YMDC thing).

For any Nob units you are going to take, you will have to decide if you want them to become close combat units, or cheap throw-away Skorcha units. Obviously, their Battlewagons can't take a Killkannon, 'Ard Case is a good choice if you are going for the cheap throw-away Skorcha version. However if you are going for the close combat Nob unit, than I'd just take Red Paint Job and a Deffrolla. Also, don't forget to give your non-Killkannon Battlewagons a cheap weapon (Big Shoota) so a Weapon Destroyed result won't immediately Immobilize you.

I think the only real way lootas work in this army is if you put them in battlewagons.

Thanks guys

I suppose 1750-1850, but 2000 if that is the only way to get everything in.

Does the kit that was released come with a deffrolla?

airmaniac wrote:I would start the army by taking 3 Heavy Support Battlewagons with Killkannon, 'Ard Case, Red Paint Job, Deffrolla.

I'm not sure I'd give them both a Killkannon and a Deffrolla. For transport wagons, Deffrolla all the way. Kannon wagons are more interested in moving 7" or less and blowing something up, not entirely what you'd use a Deffrolla for.

Lootas in Battlewagons *can* by yummy, but there's a couple of things you need to remember:

1. The battlewagon has to stay open-topped so that all your Lootas can fire, otherwise you get firing ports, which means 2 orks per port, and with your front to the enemy, that's 2-4 Orks shooting total out of a unit of 15.

2. Lootas carry heavy weapons (Deffguns). If you move their battlewagon (or trukk) or the models, they can't shoot. So the Battlewagons you stick them in are going to have to be stationary. No need for Deff Rollas. Instead, give those battlewagons a Kannon(10 points), and either Rokkit Launchas or Big Shootas.

3. Orks can make a fearsome gunline that would make Tau cry in envy, and Orks can make a fearsome assault army that makes Tyranids cry in envy. However, you can't really do both in one army list effectively. You could put 4 Battlewagons across the back of your table edge, load 3 of them up with 3 units of Lootas, a Mek with a KFF to give them all 4+ Obscured saves, and you have a firebase of absolute carnage. Fill in whatever remaining points you have with Shoota Boyz, and in the 4th battlewagon - 3 nobs with bare complement to make the 4th battlewagon a dedicated transport.

OR...you can make an assault army, but don't try doing both. If you have room for it, stick a mek with a Shokk Attack gun into the battlewagon with the 3 nobs. Now you've got some truly terrifying firepower.

Anyway, if you wanna use Lootas, give the Battlewagon a Killkanon and maybe nothing else but a Big Shoota. You need it open topped so they can all fire, and you won't be moving except the first turn probably to get in killkannon range.

Transport wagons all need to remain open topped too. If the orks inside can't assault then honestly what's the point? Take em the cheapest possible to keep them disposable, just deffrolla, 1 or 2 big shootas, maybe a kannon.

If you aren't using the wagons as a transport then ok, give them a killkannon and 'ard case, but don't use points on a deffrolla, your transports are the ones doing the rushing.

The other alternative to a 'ard Case wagon is to give them a deffrolla but taking a min squad of Nobs in it, 3 Nobs, and give them kombi-skorchas. That's only 75 Pts for the unit, which won't be doing much but being fodder to take an extra wagon, but 3 S5 flamers at a time hurts any troop.

TBH I don't like killkannon wagons. They're just too expensive and for what? An anti MEQ shot? Light Vehicles? You got units that can do that job better for 150 Pts (minimum!) anyway.

As for a list, if you want to use 4 wagons I recommend you to take 2 units of Nobs with Battlewagon transports so you can have 1 free Heavy slot, in case you wanna use Killa Kans.

Let's see how many wagons I can fit:

Warboss @ 85 Pts
Power Klaw

Warboss @ 85 Pts
Power Klaw

12 Lootas @ 180 Pts
Mek w/ Big Shoota

10 Nobs @ 425 Pts
Power Klaw (x2); Bosspole; Waaagh! Banner; Painboy; Battlewagon
Battlewagon @ [125] Pts
Deff Rolla; Big Shoota; Kannon

10 Nobs @ 425 Pts
Power Klaw (x2); Bosspole; Waaagh! Banner; Painboy; Battlewagon
Battlewagon @ [125] Pts
Deff Rolla; Big Shoota; Kannon

20 Sluggas @ 160 Pts
Nob; Power Klaw; Bosspole

20 Sluggas @ 160 Pts
Nob; Power Klaw; Bosspole

19 Gretchin + 1 Runtherd @ 67 Pts

Battlewagon @ 160 Pts
Killkannon; 2 Big Shoota

Battlewagon @ 125 Pts
Deff Rolla; Big Shoota; Kannon

Battlewagon @ 125 Pts
Deff Rolla; Big Shoota; Kannon

Total: 1997

And I don't like it, I predict the wagons with the nobs are gonna get blown up first and then they'll obliterate them, making me lose like a thousand points.

Take the gloves off and put burnas in there. It's so stupidly game breaking that you may as well just do it. You're playing orks anyways, why stop half-way?

Bigmek, KFF
3 x 12 Burnas
6 x 12 Trukkboyz, nob, klaw, bosspole, trukk
3 x battlewagon, rolla, redpaint

1850

Everything rushes forward, yawn. Burnas occupy trukks if their wagons are knocked out (hence the 12 burnas per unit). Choppy orks hit whatever wouldn't die to 36 flamer templates overlapping them (basically vehicles, everything else is fodder).

It is 19 KPs, so the trukks are a bit of a hinderance in Annihilation missions.

Killakannons aren't generally worth sticking onto a battlewagon.


And remember...if you stick a Killakannon on a battlewagon, its no longer open-topped. That means your Lootas aren't going to be shooting out of it. Making Lootas have to fire out of a couple of ports defeats the purpose of 15 Lootas with a potential of 45 shots.

Dashofpepper wrote:And remember...if you stick a Killakannon on a battlewagon, its no longer open-topped. That means your Lootas aren't going to be shooting out of it. Making Lootas have to fire out of a couple of ports defeats the purpose of 15 Lootas with a potential of 45 shots.

Could you provide a page reference for this? I don't believe it's true.

I like big shoota's...three shots - strength 5

and you can keep your wagons cheap by just giving them 4 big shootas

and if you have two big shoota's in a mob of 20 orks then you can shoot them too because the wagon is open topped

so that means you potentially have 18 big shoota shots as well as moving 12" (is that right cos its a fast vehicle?)

even if not, thats still a lot of shooting potentially and all those boys will make a mess of the enemy!

Xyphoid, my codex is out in the car, but look in the Ork codex under the Battlewagon entry, where it describes the Killakannon. It tells you that if you add it to the Battlewagon, its no longer open-topped.

I like big shoota's...three shots - strength 5

and you can keep your wagons cheap by just giving them 4 big shootas

and if you have two big shoota's in a mob of 20 orks then you can shoot them too because the wagon is open topped

so that means you potentially have 18 big shoota shots as well as moving 12" (is that right cos its a fast vehicle?)

even if not, thats still a lot of shooting potentially and all those boys will make a mess of the enemy!

Not necessarily cheap, that's still 100 points, and you don't get much for the extra points. If you move at all (or beyond 1" if you have RPJ and think that's legal), you can only fire one wagon-based Big Shoota. You can still fire the two others if your 20-ork mob has them, but since they are S5 they do not count as defensive weapons. At most, 9 shots, not that awesome.

Battlewagon is not a fast vehicle, it can only move 6(7) inches and still be able to fire its main weapon. Believe me, I wish they were Fast vehicles... moving my 20 Orks 19" a turn... Mmmm....

No, if you add a 'ard Case, it's no longer open topped. If you take a Killkannon it can only transport 12 models.

s.j.mccartney wrote:I like big shoota's...three shots - strength 5

and you can keep your wagons cheap by just giving them 4 big shootas

and if you have two big shoota's in a mob of 20 orks then you can shoot them too because the wagon is open topped

so that means you potentially have 18 big shoota shots as well as moving 12" (is that right cos its a fast vehicle?)

even if not, thats still a lot of shooting potentially and all those boys will make a mess of the enemy!

No, Battlewagons aren't Fast Vehicles. So if you move 6''(/''), the Battlewagon can only fire 1 weapon but the passengers can fire (count as moving, no prob for boys but it is for lootas). Also, no model can fire if the vehicles moves at cruising speed, the fast vehicles rules say nothing about allowing it.

Moz put up a pretty good list... heres another one like it. I like mine at least as much

kff mek 85

kff mek 85

10 nobs 10 kombi skorchas 250
battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120? (no codex at work)

10 nobs 10 kombi skorchas 250
battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

15 burna boys 225

20 boys nob power klaw bosspole 2x big shootas 170

20 boys nob power klaw bosspole 2x big shootas 170

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120


If those wagons are only 120. This list is only 1840. That leaves 10 for fun. Add buggies to go from here out to 2500.

If the faction that says you can't deff roll vehicles is found correct, the list would need a serious revision. But until then, thats a scary "rolla" list.

Personally, I like this configuration:

Kannon
'ard case
red paint job
grabbin' klaw
2 big shootas
Either grot riggers or a boarding plank

Oh, that reminds me, do you have to pay 5 points PER boarding plank, or 5 points total.

Either way, my 2000 pt army is gonna have 3 of these.

Shep wrote:Moz put up a pretty good list... heres another one like it. I like mine at least as much

kff mek 85

kff mek 85

10 nobs 10 kombi skorchas 250
battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120? (no codex at work)

10 nobs 10 kombi skorchas 250
battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

15 burna boys 225

20 boys nob power klaw bosspole 2x big shootas 170

20 boys nob power klaw bosspole 2x big shootas 170

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120

battlewagon deffrolla red paint big shoota 120


If those wagons are only 120. This list is only 1840. That leaves 10 for fun. Add buggies to go from here out to 2500.

If the faction that says you can't deff roll vehicles is found correct, the list would need a serious revision. But until then, thats a scary "rolla" list.

Now that I like. Not mind numbingly high in models, but effective.

Im still curious, has anyone popped open a battlewagon kit? Does it come with a roller?

Thanks for the help guys it is appreciated!

I just got a wagon, and there is no roller. They will be released seperate in a kit with the killcannon. I guess all that win couldn't fit in one box?

Well thats crap. When will it be released?

No word yet. You'll probably have to do some conversions.

Masaioh wrote:I just got a wagon, and there is no roller. They will be released separate in a kit with the killcannon. I guess all that win couldn't fit in one box?

Oh, I'm sure it could fit. Now whether or not GW felt it as cost effective as say... making you shell out another $30 for them... well, that's a different story entirely.

If you really want to go all out with Battlewagons this I think would be a fun list

-HQ-
Warboss PK Cybork Attack Squig- 110

Warboss PK Cybork Attack Squig- 110

-Elite-
5xNobs- 100
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas- 125

5xNobs- 100
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

5xNobs- 100
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

-Troops-
5xNobs- 100
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

5xNobs- 100
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

Grotsx10 1x Runthurd- 40


Grotsx10 1x Runthurd- 40


Grotsx10 1x Runthurd- 40

-Heavy-
Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

Battlewagon Deffrolla, Big Shoota, Kannon or Grot Riggers and Stikkbomb Chukkas 125

I Think thats 1840 Total

PS Just throw the grots in the three heavy wagons and ta-da three scoring battle wagons

GMM,

Heard they are coming out with a separate Deffrolla kit pretty soon here. You can also search a lot of different ways to do it on the-waaagh.com in the 'Mek's Garage'.

One configuration I haven't notice yet is little mobz of 3-4 Meganoz, all with combi-skorchas with a dedicated Battlewaagon. I would also suggest using a foot-slogging Boss that rides with one of the Mobz. Lootas would also be a good firebase for the army.

Something like:

Boss - powerklaw and stuff
Big Mek - KFF

two or three groups of
Meganobz x 4 - all with combi-skorchas
Battlewagon with Deffrolla, red paint, grot riggas, 1 x big shoota (to postpone destroyed results from immobilized/weapon destroyed results)

Two 20-ork units of shootas or sluggas with powerklaw Nob

Battlewagon with Deffrolla, red paint, grot riggas, 1 x big shoota (maybe throw some rokkits for some extra anti-armor)

15 x Lootas


- Blackbone

If you don't care about money, or you build them yourself, you can have 8 battle wagons. Might be too many points though. Just a thought.

Erm....the Battlewagon comes with a Killakannon. When you put a killakannon onto a battlewagon, it stops being open-topped, and the assembly that goes onto the back of the wagon to fit the huge cannon on IS the Killakannon.

The small kannon with a grot is the "kannon" and there are extra weapons if you wanted to use a zap gun instead. If that huge gun isn't a killakannon....then what is?

15 burnas in a wagon is among the nastiest things ive ever seen.

tankshock ure opponents unit in to a big pile and put 15 templates over them.

Dashofpepper, just because the model needs to be closed topped for the killkannon (which is actually just a kannon on the kit) doesn't mean that you must have a closed topped wagon to carry the gun. I could argue that there is no model for a mek on a bike, therefore it is an illegal upgrade, by that reasoning.

Dashofpepper wrote:Erm....the Battlewagon comes with a Killakannon. When you put a killakannon onto a battlewagon, it stops being open-topped, and the assembly that goes onto the back of the wagon to fit the huge cannon on IS the Killakannon.

The small kannon with a grot is the "kannon" and there are extra weapons if you wanted to use a zap gun instead. If that huge gun isn't a killakannon....then what is?

There is nothing in the codex that suggests that taking a killcannon gives you a 'ard case upgrade for free. If the model looks closed-topped, maybe you should buy 'ard case if you're worried about wysiwyg or something.

Help me understand this, since I may have been reading the Codex wrong:

I know this: If a Battlewagon takes a Killakannon, its transport capacity is reduced to 12.

Here's the question: Putting a killakannon on top of the battlewagon closes off the entire "open-topped" section of the battlewagon with a big gun. Does the Killakannon still count as open-topped?