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Basically I'm looking at taking the Tauros and making a Predator/Land Speeder hybrid out of it for a bike themed Space Marine army such as the White Scars. I've tried to cost this out based on what's available in the Space Marine codex. Any comments/criticism appreciated.



MONGOOSE ATV..........................................80 points

....................................................................Armor
............................Type....................BS......F.....S.....R
Mongoose..............Fast, Wheeled.........4......10...10...10

Unit Composition
• 1 Mongoose ATV

Unit Type
• Vehicle (Fast)

Wargear
• Twin-linked heavy bolter
• Typhoon missile launcher
...Frag Missiles
...Range___Strength___AP___Type__________________
.......48"..........4...........6.......Heavy 2, Blast
...Krak Missiles
...Range___Strength___AP___Type__________________
.......48"..........8............3.......Heavy 2
• Smoke launchers
• Searchlight

Options
• Replace twin-linked heavy bolters with:
...twin linked assault cannon................................+35 pts
...twin linked lascannon.......................................+35 pts
...twin linked multi-melta.....................................+25 pts
...twin linked plasma gun.....................................+25 pts
• May take any of the following:
...Storm bolter...................................................+10 pts
...Hunter-killer missile...........................................+10 pts

Mongoose ATV? Really? Not even trying, man.

I like though. Kinda like a faster Razorback.

Where would one put the HK Missile or the Storm Bolter? Co-axial with whatever twin-linked weapon you take might work for the storm bolter, but I see the HK being problematic.

The first thing I see when looking at this model, WYSIWYG, is that it IS open topped. IDK the demensions on these things but if you were to drop an armored plate with a viewing slot like the one in the FW kits across the front, and use the other bits as doors then maybe bump the armor to:

F 11 S 11 R 10?

Also I don't know why but I would like to see a dozer blade on this thing...

Hey, if you've got a better name let me know. I entertained the idea of calling it a "Land Rover" for all of about five seconds.

Open Topped: Open topped doesn't count for Space Marines because they're in power armor. It's the nature of the army. Only the scout land speeder transport is open topped, the regular land speeders aren't.

Armor Values: I used 10 armor all around because while it doesn't count as open topped it is very exposed. The thing is meant to be light and fast while moving offroad. A dozer blade on a buggy doesn't suggest fast. I could see the possibility of a ram of some sort, but this isn't Gorkamorka.

Weapon Upgrades: As far as mounting the optional HK/SB, I suppose you could put mounts beside the passenger compartment or put them on the turret opposite the searchlight. Without having the model, it's a little difficult to know what the options are. Also, I didn't take everything exactly from the Razorback because I wanted to distinguish them a little more than one being a troop transport and the other not. This is essentially a guided missile like the land speeder except that it fits better thematically in a bike army than skimmers do. Well, imo that is.

Only two comments? Nobody has a better name?

What about the "Cougar" ATV?

Valkyrie wrote:What about the "Cougar" ATV?

I don't know . . . Kinda looks like a Puma to me.

As for the H/K Missiles it looked like there was one on the side and the storm bolet, how about right in front of the driver, kinda like the Hull mounted M Guns on older tanks.

Shas'O Dorian wrote:What about the "Cougar" ATV?
I don't know . . . Kinda looks like a Puma to me.

Chupathingy?

.... weapons are nice ... models nice ... AV10? to easy to pop ... why not try making it a bike?

========

100-150pts Type:bike WS4 BS4 S4 T4(6) W2 Ld8 Sv2+/3++

special rules (combat tactics, ect) IC, Stubborn & hit and run

===========
ok you lose the option of HK Missile and the Storm Bolter but its able to move 12" fire all gun and join a unit of bike. Thought about giving it a higher Ld but didn't seem right. Also T4(6) to show its bigger then an attack bike and i would say that artificer armour and a storm shield aren't to much to ask ... ok maybe over kill 2+ and T(6)

This is pretty much a Land speeder with different upgrades available, change the base cost to 90 because that's the cost of it with a typhoon.

Your rules has it with Twin Heavy bolters and Typhoon missile launchers. Where do the missiles get mounted?I think this should be seen as serving a role somewhere between the Attack bike and Razorback. Having the missiles as a weapon option is fine but having double the weapons pushes it beyond a razorback or even a Landspeeder. Just because its made by FW doesn't mean we should start throwing an over abundance of weapons on it. With a marine crew and just twinlinked Heavy Bolters, I think it should cost 50pts. Go from their using the Landspeeders and Razorbacks weapons as reference for costs.

I think it should be called the Hyena.

Arheiner wrote:This is pretty much a Land speeder with different upgrades available, change the base cost to 90 because that's the cost of it with a typhoon.

Yes, what you say is true except for the part where a Land Speeder has the Skimmer rule and this does not. The point cost of this vehicle needs to reflect that difference.

aka_mythos wrote:Your rules has it with Twin Heavy bolters and Typhoon missile launchers. Where do the missiles get mounted?

A Typhoon missile launcher is simply a pair of missile launchers that shoot at the same target. Look at the stat line of a missile launcher and then at the stat line of the Typhoon. The only difference is that the Typhoon is "Heavy 2" instead of "Heavy 1". The little red book list them as twin-linked, but they are not (no rerolls involved). That being said, look at the model and you'll see it has two missile launchers on the roof, one on either side. Using the stat line of the Typhoon was simply the obvious choice.

aka_mythos wrote:I think this should be seen as serving a role somewhere between the Attack bike and Razorback. Having the missiles as a weapon option is fine but having double the weapons pushes it beyond a razorback or even a Landspeeder. Just because its made by FW doesn't mean we should start throwing an over abundance of weapons on it. With a marine crew and just twinlinked Heavy Bolters, I think it should cost 50pts. Go from their using the Landspeeders and Razorbacks weapons as reference for costs.

I see it as a cross between a Land Speeder and a Razorback, actually. Those are the vehicles I based this on. I based initial cost on the Land Speeder with a discount for losing "Skimmer" and then pretty much took the Razorback's turret weapons at their listed cost and ported them over.

Still mulling over names. Needs to be Marine-ish and not already used in a xenos list.

what about Thanatos? he was the daemon(not spelling this wrong) personification of Death in Greek mythology.

Doom Buggy.


That is all.

Breotan wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:Your rules has it with Twin Heavy bolters and Typhoon missile launchers. Where do the missiles get mounted?

A Typhoon missile launcher is simply a pair of missile launchers that shoot at the same target. Look at the stat line of a missile launcher and then at the stat line of the Typhoon. The only difference is that the Typhoon is "Heavy 2" instead of "Heavy 1". The little red book list them as twin-linked, but they are not (no rerolls involved). That being said, look at the model and you'll see it has two missile launchers on the roof, one on either side. Using the stat line of the Typhoon was simply the obvious choice.

Forgeworld counts those missiles as two Hunter Killer missiles. Shouldn't you? In that context it just comes off as trying to make a unit better than it is.

Not open topped due to cm power armor?
Those guys aren't wearing power armor.
How bout the minotaur?

The OP wants to convert them to be space marines that are wearing power armor.

Minotaur is interesting but doesn't really fit a fast vehicle designed (visually at least) to roam with bike units. Not ruling it out, though.

aka_mythos wrote:Forgeworld counts those missiles as two Hunter Killer missiles. Shouldn't you? In that context it just comes off as trying to make a unit better than it is.

Making them a HKs would certainly reduce the point cost of the unit so it's certainly worth considering.

I don't think minitour would fit a marine vehicle. Marines don't go too much into the mythological. Marine naming convention is Rhino - Razorback - Land ____. So unless you go with Land Rover... you should probably find some sort of mammal that has the reputation as being kinda wild in a charging sort of way. Something like Bison.

Yeah call it a Bison.

A bison is a big, tough, but slow animal. I thought about calling it a Land Ranger (Land Rover is a copyrighted name) but the "Land" vehicles have a distinctive armor pattern that carries across all the vehicle types. Gonna look at desert/savanna type animals and see if anything looks good. Currently I'm thinking Leopard or Mamba.

I'm thinking dropping the Typhoon ML altogether and just allowing the HK upgrade is the best way to go. The launchers provided by Forgeworld are clearly HK and not a good substitute for the Typhoon. This will also drop the price and make it more desirable.

Te-he, I know Land Rover is copyright, but I was being sarcastic.

Bison aren't slow, they can run 35mph. A rhinoceros runs at 30mph.

Well I don't think Leopard or Mamba fit naming convention. Marine naming convention for vehicles is Land---- or a charging animal. Leopards and Mambas don't evoke an imagery of charging, and a Mamba isn't mammalian. Obviously you can go with whatever name you like, but if you're trying to make it fit you should keep that in mind.

Another appropriate animals... Ram.

Here is where you will get your new name.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIG0OIeRQnI

it's not rick roll

Would have been better if it were a rickroll.

Okay, I've incorporated some of the suggestions that were brought up and have updated the datafax. I'm still a little concerned that the point cost is too high. Compared to a Razorback, it starts with the same base price. It has "Fast" as an advantage which should bump up the cost a little, but loses transport capacity and has a point shaved off both front and side armor which should reduce the cost. Would lowering the base cost to 30 be reasonable or would 35 be a more accurate figure?

As an added note, I'll work up fluff for why it would be used in a Space Marine force once I get the cost/stats finalized. Since you guys don't like Mongoose, I'm going with Leopard because other suggested names identify big, tough creatures and this vehicle just doesn't say "tough" the way a tank does. I'm still open to suggestions so don't think this is fixed in stone.




LEOPARD....................................................40 points

....................................................................Armor
............................Type....................BS......F.....S.....R
Mongoose..............Fast, Wheeled.........4......10...10...10

Unit Composition
• 1 Leopard Strike Vehicle

Unit Type
• Vehicle (Fast)

Wargear
• Twin-linked heavy bolter
• Smoke launchers
• Searchlight

Options
• Replace twin-linked heavy bolters with:
...twin linked assault cannon..............................+35 pts
...twin linked lascannon.....................................+35 pts
...twin linked multi-melta...................................+25 pts
...twin linked plasma gun...................................+25 pts
• May take any of the following:
...Storm bolter.................................................+10 pts
...Up to two Hunter-killer missiles.................+10/+20 pts

You should also have rules for a scout manned version.

As far as a name, what about some sort of quick striking snake, like Cobra or Viper or Mamba? Also, you could change the HK missiles on each side to boxes with a few missiles poking out, kind of like the missile launcher arm of a dreadnought. Also, you should be able to take them in squads of 1-3, just like attack bikes or land speeders. I can already dream of loading up 3 of them with lascannons and two HK/ cyclone missiles and whooping my friend's IG armoured company.

My reason for putting them as a single vehicle was to limit the weapons payload in a single fast attack slot. By removing the Typhoons, making squads of 1-3 is much more reasonable.

Regarding a Scout version, the blocking issue is that the Scout version would necessarily be open-topped which would make it a very expensive non-transport unit that's easy to pop - definately not a selling point. Also, Scouts generally don't have access to this kind of firepower.

I think the scout version would be down to 35 some points and scout rule added. Which isn't that expensive.

As it is, I'm still thinking this unit is over costed. The question is, what are the relative values of "fast", transport of a combat squad, and one point of armor on the front and sides.

At 40pts, I don't think its overcosted. Its the same price as an Attack Bike, trading melee capabilities, toughness and second wound for a twin-linked heavy bolter and vehicle armor. As a fast attack choice it fills the same role as the attack bike. If its cheaper than an attack bike it makes the attack bike a near worthless choice.

I think when it comes to the Razorback it should be considered that with the 6 man squad it transports you sacrifice weapon options. Opportunity of freebies lost. Its a small factor but in comparing a number of units similar in function and capabilities I think it comes into play.