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Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Read my lips...no new tax, er hold on...

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-02-11/obama-agnostic-on-deficit-cuts-won-t-prejudge-tax-increases.html

Obama ‘Agnostic’ on Deficit Cuts, Won’t Prejudge Tax Increases
February 11, 2010, 08:45 AM EST More From Businessweek

Feb. 11 (Bloomberg) -- President Barack Obama said he is “agnostic” about raising taxes on households making less than $250,000 as part of a broad effort to rein in the budget deficit.

Obama, in a Feb. 9 Oval Office interview, said that a presidential commission on the budget needs to consider all options for reducing the deficit, including tax increases and cuts in spending on entitlement programs such as Social Security and Medicare.

“The whole point of it is to make sure that all ideas are on the table,” the president said in the interview with Bloomberg BusinessWeek, which will appear on newsstands Friday. “So what I want to do is to be completely agnostic, in terms of solutions.”

Obama repeatedly vowed during the 2008 presidential election campaign that he would not raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000 and households earning less than $250,000 a year. When senior White House economic adviser Lawrence H. Summers and Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner suggested in August that the administration might be open to going back on that pledge, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs quickly reiterated the president’s promise.

In the interview, Obama said that putting preconditions on the agenda of a bipartisan advisory commission, which he said he would soon establish, would just undermine its purpose.

“What I can’t do is to set the thing up where a whole bunch of things are off the table,” Obama said. “Some would say we can’t look at entitlements. There are going to be some that say we can’t look at taxes, and pretty soon, you just can’t solve the problem.”



Politically Risky



Many economists, including conservatives such as former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan, argue that tax increases will be necessary as part of a broad package to control the deficit, which the White House projects will hit a record $1.6 trillion in the fiscal year ending on Sept. 30.

Obama said the U.S. was faced with a “structural deficit” that was in place before the recession began and that was only made worse by the deepest drop in the economy since the 1930s.



Revenue ‘Mismatch’



“Our real problem is not the spike in spending last year, or the lost, even the lost revenues last year, as significant as those are,” he said. “The real problem has to do with the fact that there is a just a mismatch between the amount of money coming in and the amount of money going out. And that is going to require some big, tough choices that, so far, the political system has been unable to deal with.”

The administration hopes the bipartisan commission will make it easier to produce a comprehensive plan to reduce the budget gap to a sustainable level, often described as 3 percent of the overall economy, by 2015.

The White House decided to set up the group on its own after the Senate blocked a measure to establish a congressional panel whose recommendations would have been guaranteed a vote by lawmakers. Opponents, including a majority of Senate Republicans, complained that the plan would result in tax increases and that Congress wouldn’t have a chance to amend the panel’s recommendations. Under a presidentially appointed commission, Congress could ignore any panel recommendations.



Republican Skepticism



House Republican leader John Boehner has expressed skepticism about the Obama commission and has sought assurances from the White House that its makeup would be bipartisan and not predisposed to tax increases. The Ohio Republican said he is still considering whether to appoint members from his party to the panel after a Feb. 9 meeting with the president.

The Obama administration’s budget already takes that route with its proposed $970 billion tax increase over the next decade on Americans earning more than $200,000 a year, largely by not extending former President George W. Bush’s tax cuts for the wealthy beyond 2010.

Even with those revenues -- and a proposed three-year freeze on some discretionary spending by the government -- the administration still projects a deficit of $752 billion in 2015, equivalent to 3.9 percent of gross domestic product.

That’s above the 3 percent mark that White House budget director Peter Orszag has said is necessary to stop the rise in government debt as a proportion of the economy.



Budget Gap



Analysts say that middle-class taxes will need to be increased because the government can’t raise enough money from the wealthy alone to close the budget gap. “It’s just not possible to get the revenue you need only from this group,” said Joel Slemrod, director of the Office of Tax Policy Research at the University of Michigan.

Going back on his campaign pledge would be fraught with risks for Obama. Former President George H.W. Bush paid a steep political price when he abandoned his 1988 campaign promise not to raise taxes, losing out in his bid for a second term to Bill Clinton.





--With assistance from Ryan Donmoyer in Washington. Editors: Paula Dwyer, James Tyson



To contact the reporter on this story: Rich Miller in Washington +1-202-624-1937 or rmiller28@bloomberg.net



To contact the editor responsible for this story: Christopher Wellisz at +1-202-624-1862 or cwellisz@bloomberg.net

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/11 15:24:10


-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






You may want to fix yor thread title.....

As for the issue, if he doesn't follow through with his pledge.....good bye 2nd term.

GG
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Thanks GG

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh





Union, Kentucky United States

generalgrog wrote:You may want to fix yor thread title.....

As for the issue, if he doesn't follow through with his pledge.....good bye 2nd term.

GG


he had a chance at a second term wow. Best quote I have heard recently was refering to him saying that he would rather be a great one term president then a mild two term president. Hillman fromt eh hillman mourning show Waafs responce " Ya what you don't realise is great one term presidents get reelected".

Listen, my children, as I pass onto you the truth behind Willy Wonka and his factory. For every wonka bar ever created in existance, Mr. Wonka sacraficed a single Oompa Loompa to the god of chocolate, Hearshys. Then, he drank the blood of the fallen orange men because he fed them a constant supply of sugary chocolate so they all became diabetic and had creamy, sweet-tasting blood that willy could put into each and every Wonka bar. That is the REAL story behind willy wonka's Slaughter House!  
   
Made in us
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Runnin up on ya.

What do you care, Fraz? Texas is going to secede anyway, right?

Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do 
   
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Montgomery, AL

If thats the case Fraz, give me the heads up so I can start looking for a job and a home in Texas.

On Dakka he was Eldanar. In our area, he was Lee. R.I.P., Lee Guthrie.  
   
Made in us
Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh





Union, Kentucky United States

jbunny wrote:If thats the case Fraz, give me the heads up so I can start looking for a job and a home in Texas.


agreed!

Listen, my children, as I pass onto you the truth behind Willy Wonka and his factory. For every wonka bar ever created in existance, Mr. Wonka sacraficed a single Oompa Loompa to the god of chocolate, Hearshys. Then, he drank the blood of the fallen orange men because he fed them a constant supply of sugary chocolate so they all became diabetic and had creamy, sweet-tasting blood that willy could put into each and every Wonka bar. That is the REAL story behind willy wonka's Slaughter House!  
   
Made in au
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





What an odd statement by Obama. A tax increase would be political suicide and a very poor idea given the economic conditions.

“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
Made in gb
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Killer Klaivex







A politician going back on a pledge made during the campaign season? Surely not! *shock, horror*


 
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob






Joplin, Missouri

Yeah with every campaign pledge there should be an automatic disclaimer attached on the end. If we did that though every political speech would sound like car dealership's commercial.

"Just pull it out and play with it" -Big Nasty B @ Life After the Cover Save
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Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

sebster wrote:What an odd statement by Obama. A tax increase would be political suicide and a very poor idea given the economic conditions.

Taxes are already increasing. Bush tax breaks are expiring. Forget any other the dozens of other taxes being proposed -including the taxes on the banks, this is an absolute.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Frazzled wrote:
sebster wrote:What an odd statement by Obama. A tax increase would be political suicide and a very poor idea given the economic conditions.

Taxes are already increasing. Bush tax breaks are expiring. Forget any other the dozens of other taxes being proposed -including the taxes on the banks, this is an absolute.


Lets be fair here. The tax breaks signed into law under Bush were never intended to be permanent. Weren't they only supposed to last 1 year or something? So it's a tad unfair to call that a tax increase.

However the point is well made that him actually admitting that a tax increase on middle class would not be taken "off the table" is a serious sign of imenent hari kari.

GG

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/11 19:00:32


 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

You make a fair point GG.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Know what's awesome about Presidents proposing tax increases? It only hurts their chance at re-election. I'm fairly certain that the Presidents income is not taxed. I don't know that but I know military pay isn't taxed so wouldn't surprise me that the Presidents own coffers aren't taxed.

If that's the case I can see why most Presidents don't see tax increases as a bad thing. If it doesn't hurt you financially to do something you'll do it.

--The whole concept of government granted and government regulated 'permits' and the accompanying government mandate for government approved firearms 'training' prior to being blessed by government with the privilege to carry arms in a government approved and regulated manner, flies directly in the face of the fundamental right to keep and bear arms.

“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.”


 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

Not taking the option off the table is not the same as enacting it. But you guys can go back to patting each other on the backs.

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

ShumaGorath wrote:Not taking the option off the table is not the same as enacting it. But you guys can go back to patting each other on the backs.

means it will happen. Now I know this means nothing to cellege students and others who don't pay taxes, but to working people it does.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

Frazzled wrote:
ShumaGorath wrote:Not taking the option off the table is not the same as enacting it. But you guys can go back to patting each other on the backs.

means it will happen.


Can you pluck lottery numbers out of the air too?

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Yep. Its a talent I have.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges




United States

Empchild wrote:" Ya what you don't realise is great one term presidents get reelected".


Bush Sr. was pretty effective, though his Presidency provides an excellent primer for what happens in the wake of a recanted promise to not raise taxes.

Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Tilter at Windmills






Manchester, NH

Empchild wrote:
generalgrog wrote:You may want to fix yor thread title.....

As for the issue, if he doesn't follow through with his pledge.....good bye 2nd term.

GG


he had a chance at a second term wow. Best quote I have heard recently was refering to him saying that he would rather be a great one term president then a mild two term president. Hillman fromt eh hillman mourning show Waafs responce " Ya what you don't realise is great one term presidents get reelected".


Greg Hill is a political illiterate surrounded by yes men with one token uneducated semi-Liberal they like to laugh at. He’s also never heard of James K Polk. As noted, Bush Sr. was pretty decent too, though I agree with Dogma that he's a cautionary tale.

Perhaps Obama's being smart, leaving the option open, but not intending to actually exercise it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/11 19:34:24


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Made in us
Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges




United States

Frazzled wrote:
means it will happen.


No, it means the probability that it will happen has increased. That doesn't equate to certainty.

Frazzled wrote:
Now I know this means nothing to cellege students and others who don't pay taxes, but to working people it does.


Doesn't mean anything to me, and I pay taxes. Why? Because I know that taxes will have to increase, while spending declines, in order to extricate this country from debt.

Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Even better proof that Americans vote with their pocket books. Bad economy=kiss Presidency by by. Reasons are irrelevant. Turn around right before election irrelevant. We may love you but we'll throw you out on your keister Custer.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Runnin up on ya.

That's it. I'm moving back to Japan where things make sense.

Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

agnosto wrote:That's it. I'm moving back to Japan where things make sense.


Thats uhh.. Yeah. I'm not touching that one.

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in us
Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges




United States

Frazzled wrote:Turn around right before election irrelevant.


Reagan won on a turn around right before an election.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/11 19:36:15


Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






The land of cotton.

If nothing else makes your head spin this statement by PresBO should:

Barack Hussein Obama wrote: Our real problem is not the spike in spending last year, or the lost, even the lost revenues last year, as significant as those are,” he said. “The real problem has to do with the fact that there is a just a mismatch between the amount of money coming in and the amount of money going out.


So... it's not that we are spending more. It's that we are not taking in enough to keep up with our spending.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/11 19:36:45


 
   
Made in us
Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges




United States

He's right, we haven't been taking in enough to keep up with our spending since Reagan. The current spike is due entirely to a spending increase, but the larger national debt is due to a budgetary imbalance.

Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. 
   
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The Great State of Texas

Economy was already substantially improving. The economy has to substantially improve, with strong unemployment improvement, at least six months beforehand. Remember the Republicans were trounced in Congressional elections prior, just as the Democrats are about to be trounced in 2010.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Runnin up on ya.

dogma wrote:He's right, we haven't been taking in enough to keep up with our spending since Reagan. The current spike is due entirely to a spending increase, but the larger national debt is due to a budgetary imbalance.


And the fact that we import too much. The massive trade imbalance due to our insatiable appetite for cheap, Chinese, goods is going to be our downfall.

Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do 
   
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Somewhere in south-central England.

The President pays income tax.

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