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NNNNOOOOO!!!! Me no like these findings! Just kidding but interesting findings if found to be true as it could pertain to other parts of the game and not just the evil Tervigon.

You have to be seriously lame if you are trying to cheat at toy soldiers.

Gwar! wrote:You have to be seriously lame if you are trying to cheat at toy soldiers.

Have you seen the flattened Genestealer and rigged die videos?

The technique you are trying to figure out is called "setting", its an old craps trick. It is also a form of cheating.

If you have to cheat to win just GTFO now. I've seen an opponent try this crap and told him to roll normally or I'd pick up and leave. It's not so much about the extra 10% he might get on his to-whatever, but the fact that he is TRYING to get it.

Yeah i see now after reading a little more about what clithomps described and have to agree it is a form of cheating and didnt realize at first. Just me being ingnorant and i apologize.

Wow... you really thought you would get anything but a negative response from this?

I can see people being upset about someone trying to tip the odds in their favor. I have to ask, however, if through trial and error (which is how i found out about this, honestly) a person learns that their chances to double out are lower if they grab a certain three dice, am i supposed to take three dice that i instead will know have a higher chance to roll doubles? Either way then I am screwed because i am 'influencing the outcome of dice' which is 'cheating'.

tetrisphreak wrote:I can see people being upset about someone trying to tip the odds in their favor. I have to ask, however, if through trial and error (which is how i found out about this, honestly) a person learns that their chances to double out are lower if they grab a certain three dice, am i supposed to take three dice that i instead will know have a higher chance to roll doubles? Either way then I am screwed because i am 'influencing the outcome of dice' which is 'cheating'.

No. Taking dice you know not to be fair is cheating. Knowingly taking fair dice is not cheating.

All i use are standard GW or Chessex 12mm d6's, the same dice most other wargamers use.

Am i supposed to play blindfolded, or avoid looking at which dice i pick up to make rolls? Is anybody who looks at their dice pile before grabbing a few to make saves/psychic tests/etc trying to cheat?

It sounds like trolling but honestly knowing what i do now about this 'setting' technique how can i (or anyone else) look at their dice ever pre-roll? Should dice cups be mandatory for all competitive play?

*edit* the upper facings on the dice when you select them are what i am going by with this "technique".

tetrisphreak wrote:All i use are standard GW or Chessex 12mm d6's, the same dice most other wargamers use.

Am i supposed to play blindfolded, or avoid looking at which dice i pick up to make rolls? Is anybody who looks at their dice pile before grabbing a few to make saves/psychic tests/etc trying to cheat?

It sounds like trolling but honestly knowing what i do now about this 'setting' technique how can i (or anyone else) look at their dice ever pre-roll? Should dice cups be mandatory for all competitive play?

*edit* the upper facings on the dice when you select them are what i am going by with this "technique".

How do the upper facings matter if you roll them in a manner that produces a Random result? Just hold them loosely in cupped hands and roll them.

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Trying to influence the fall of the dice is cheating even if the attempt fails due to faulty technique.

This technique works because when you roll dice around in your hand, more often then not, you're just shaking them around without changing up the facing a whole lot. This can change varying on the size and shape of your hand. The problem is that once they hit the table, dice can do any number of things if rolled properly. When just casually tossed, they will tend to behave as shown in the video.

the technique is "natural rolling" - you ability to roll dice consistently such that the go through a fairly consistent number of rotations etc and produce predicatble, not random, results.

And its cheating.

Use a dice cup, rolling tower, or simply just rattle them round your loosely cupped hands for a bit longer, and actually roll them a fair distance across the table. All of these reduce the influence you can have.

...I find taking the time to get the picture is a waste but:
/facepalm.

As to:

Nightwatch wrote:

Gwar! wrote:You have to be seriously lame if you are trying to cheat at toy soldiers.

Have you seen the flattened Genestealer and rigged die videos?

It was funny as it was made as a joke IIRC. Protip, lolz.

Just make sure to shake them in your cupped hands in such a way that they actually tumble in your hands, and then be sure to roll them on the table such that they actually roll. If you just roll them properly, the facing they had before you picked them up is totally irrelevant.

Professional magicans and tricksters know several techniques to make "random dice rolls" very much less random. All of them are considered cheating in tabletop games.

Nightwatch wrote:Have you seen the flattened Genestealer and rigged die videos?

Link?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/289219.page

Mannahnin wrote:http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/289219.page

I just died a little inside.

I think he's pretty funny. Didn't do it for you?

This is one reason I've given up using dice and just use the randomizer on a business calculator. Another reason is that even dice rolled in a cup or via a tower don't follow the ideal distribution. Plus it's easier when rolling in bulk.

Video is funny. Come back with statistical significance and n=10000 and I'll take more notice.

Kilkrazy wrote:Trying to influence the fall of the dice is cheating even if the attempt fails due to faulty technique.

Thinks *Come on 5+, Come on 5+ COME ON 5+!* -> Disqualified for cheating.

Nurglitch wrote:This is one reason I've given up using dice and just use the randomizer on a business calculator. Another reason is that even dice rolled in a cup or via a tower don't follow the ideal distribution. Plus it's easier when rolling in bulk.

You know.. Those are called pseudorandom number generators

And if you are not joking I'm shocked. Nothing more fun than rolling so many dice you can't get all of them in your hand..

EDIT: Oh yeah.. And the Pro tips were made of win.

Macok:

Yes, it is pseudo-random. The difference it makes is irrelevant to table-top board gaming.

Incidentally, I personally don't like rolling dice, particularly stupid amounts of dice; so you can take your own personal preference about nothing being more fun that rolling lots of dice and shove it.

+1 to rolling dice is fun.

Nurglitch has bucket-hand envy due to his cephalopoidal appendages.

I love threads like this.

lol.... I have played this guy, and he takes his games very seriously. He took personal offense when I argued a rule with him ( which I was wrong on).
I dont agree with this technique though.... I will probably see him at ard boyz

LOL also him and his partner stated it was cool that they werent playing against two cheesy armies.
LOL His partner had Lash DP, 4 OBLITS, Defiler, and Nurgle Marines.
He had Tervigon Spam (as did I) and trygons

I just found that ironic