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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:08:01
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/09/16/draw-muhammad-cartoonist-goes-hiding/
'Draw Muhammad' Cartoonist Goes Into Hiding at FBI's Insistence After Assassination Threat
Published September 16, 2010 | FoxNews.com
advertisement
The Seattle cartoonist whose artwork sparked the controversial "Everybody Draw Muhammad Day!" has gone into hiding at the advice of the FBI after being targeted by a radical Muslim cleric, according to the newspaper that published her comics.
Molly Norris has moved and changed her name, the Seattle Weekly said Wednesday, after U.S.-born Yemeni cleric Anwar al-Awlaki placed her on an execution hit list. Awlaki -- who has been linked to the botched Times Square bombing and cited as inspiration for the Fort Hood massacre and a plot by two New Jersey men to kill U.S. soldiers -- reportedly called Norris a "prime target" for assassination and that her "proper abode is hellfire."
"You may have noticed that Molly Norris' comic is not in the paper this week," Seattle Weekly Editor in Chief Mark Fefer wrote Wednesday. "That's because there is no more Molly."
"The gifted artist is alive and well, thankfully. But on the insistence of top security specialists at the FBI, she is, as they put it, 'going ghost': moving, changing her name, and essentially wiping away her identity. She is, in effect, being put into a witness-protection program -- except, as she notes, without the government picking up the tab," Fefer wrote.
Norris ignited a firestorm in April after drawing a satirical cartoon to protest the decision by cable television channel Comedy Central to cancel an episode of "South Park" over its depiction of the Prophet Muhammad in a bear suit.
In her cartoon, Norris mockingly proposed making May 20 "Everybody Draw Muhammad Day!"
Soon after, a fan page popped up on Facebook, but Norris wrote on her since-shuttered website that she had nothing to do with it.
"I did NOT 'declare' May 20 to be 'Everybody Draw Muhammad Day,'" she said, adding that her idea was satire that was "taken seriously, hijacked and made viral."
"I apologize to people of Muslim faith and ask that this 'day' be called off," she said.
The 27-year-old Facebook page creator -- a Canadian woman who asked not to be identified due to fears of reprisal -- told FoxNews.com in July that she was visited at her home by Royal Canadian Mounted Police officials who advised her to remove her page and not to talk to reporters.
"I'm scared," she said. "I'm scared that somebody might kill me."
Islam strictly prohibits the depiction of any prophet as blasphemous and the "Draw Muhammad" page led to Facebook being temporarily blocked in Pakistan and sparked angry street protests.
In July, English-language Al Qaeda magazine "Inspire" attributed an article to Awlaki, saying Norris "should be taken as a prime target of assassination."
"The large number of participants makes it easier for us because there are more targets to choose from in addition to the difficulty of the government offering all of them special protection," wrote Awlaki. "But even then our campaign should not be limited to only those who are active participants."
He warned that "assassinations, bombings and acts of arson" are all legitimate forms of revenge against the creators of blasphemous depictions of Muhammad.
"Now, with the defamation of Muhammad reaching the shores of America, I wonder whether the patriotic American Muslim will still have the audacity to claim that he enjoys the right to be a Muslim in America?" Awlaki wrote. "Does he understand that this right includes his duty to fight against those who blaspheme his Prophet?"
Awlaki invited Muslims worldwide to "stand up in defense" of Muhammad and for their efforts to "manifest in all appropriate" means.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:16:20
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Fixture of Dakka
Manchester UK
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Muslims overreact hysterically to a percieved slight.
In other news: Dog bites man.
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Cheesecat wrote:
I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:23:57
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God
Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways
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Albatross wrote:Muslims overreact hysterically to a percieved slight.
In other news: Dog bites man.
It will be interesting to see whether man eventually puts down dog though...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:27:22
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Lady of the Lake
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Nah man likes his variety of dogs way too much to see that it isn't essential.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:28:29
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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Albatross wrote:Muslims overreact hysterically to a percieved slight.
+1 to the max
also,
Thank you for posting this thread.
These kind of responses from Islamic Clerics bother me. How is it anyway not hypocritical of them to burn the US flag, tell the West (other religions) we're infidels, and demand that we follow their religious practice of not drawing their prophets?
Hold your horses before you all try and flame me for being a bigot.
If I am not a Muslim and my beliefs do not require me to NOT draw prophets, I shouldn't be practically forced to comply with Islamic standards by having my life endangered. I am a Christian. My church has artist depictions of Moses, Noah, and lots of other biblical prophets. They are used in Sunday school classes as visual aids. So, should my entire church be afraid of some Islamic cleric issuing a fatwa against us? Should we be forced into the witness protection agency and have to change our names?
I don't think so. I think it's extremely bigoted for an Islamic cleric to issue a fatwa against someone for drawing a picture of Mohammed. I believe there was a Swedish cartoonist who suffered the same ill will from an Islamic cleric. So, this isn't an isolated incident.
The point is, if I'm not a Muslim, I am not bound by Islamic religious rules. It's that simple.
An open letter to Islamic Clerics:
Dear Islamic clerics,
Please stop issuing fatwas against people who are not of your religion for breaking your religious standards. That is insane and doesn't even make sense. Furthermore, you're putting the life of an individual in danger when you do that, also not good.
Sincerely,
DarkAngelHopeful
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/16 13:41:17
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:36:48
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Beast of Nurgle
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Saw this earlier, pretty crazy. Still think "Draw Muhammad Day" was stupid though.
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By the clack-smack cracking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes... |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:41:13
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Lady of the Lake
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Yeh it's basically just trolling the extremists.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:43:12
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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Gorgeous Gary Golden wrote:Saw this earlier, pretty crazy. Still think "Draw Muhammad Day" was stupid though.
I'll agree that it probably wasn't the smartest move, however, she should still have been allowed to do it without fear of reprisal in the form of death.
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"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:48:04
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God
Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways
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DarkAngelHopeful wrote:she should still have been allowed to do it without fear of reprisal in the form of death.
She didn't actually organise the day. However, I agree that you should be free to mock and satarise without fear of reprisal (other than perhaps mocking, satire or displeasure in return).
While I can understand it, going into hiding after such threats is essentially a victory for the extremists. The world needs to unite to stamp out extremists of all flavours and show then that they can't get their way through violence and intimidation.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:50:18
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Fixture of Dakka
Manchester UK
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Also, the title of this thread should read 'her' instead of 'him', Frazzled. The cartoonist's name is 'Molly'.
It's almost as if you didn't read the article before posting it, but I know that that couldn't possibly be the case.
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Cheesecat wrote:
I almost always agree with Albatross, I can't see why anyone wouldn't.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 13:55:52
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Its all part of our plan to keep His identity secret! Ixnay on the Shesay!
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 17:11:22
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer
Somewhere in south-central England.
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It is all a crappy mess.
All Muslims didn't overreact hastily, only the most traditional extremists.
Stop tarring them all with the same brush, it is thoughtless and bigoted.
It strikes blows against the moderate majority and drives them out of western society into the hands of extremists.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 17:13:09
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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This thread is throwing off bad vibes.
That being said, it is a bit of an overreaction. Well, a massive overreaction. I think a crusade in retaliation should sort things out.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/09/16 17:15:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 17:16:53
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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As long as there's donuts.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 17:17:34
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Frazzled wrote:As long as there's donuts.
GOD WILLS IT!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 19:09:50
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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Kilkrazy wrote:It is all a crappy mess.
All Muslims didn't overreact hastily, only the most traditional extremists.
Stop tarring them all with the same brush, it is thoughtless and bigoted.
It strikes blows against the moderate majority and drives them out of western society into the hands of extremists.
Killkrazy, obviously not all Muslims over react. However, this is a story about one that did over react. No one who is not a Muslim should be held to Islamic religious standards. Period.
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"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/16 19:13:19
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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Once again. South Park is proven right
Now if only comedy central would  ing un  that darn episode!
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/16 19:13:50
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 03:44:25
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
Australia (Recently ravaged by the Hive Fleet Ginger Overlord)
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DarkAngelHopeful wrote:Kilkrazy wrote:It is all a crappy mess.
All Muslims didn't overreact hastily, only the most traditional extremists.
Stop tarring them all with the same brush, it is thoughtless and bigoted.
It strikes blows against the moderate majority and drives them out of western society into the hands of extremists.
Killkrazy, obviously not all Muslims over react. However, this is a story about one that did over react. No one who is not a Muslim should be held to Islamic religious standards. Period.
This is kind of funny, given the 'Stoning Woman' argument in a previous thread. Should Non-Westerners be held to Western Standards?
I might also point out that going into the Witness Protection program, changing your name and relocating ect, seems to be a big reaction to a threat like this. I don't know how credible the threats posed by Fatwas are in Seattle, I would imagine Seattle would be a much harder place for Assassinations than most. Do they actually have the means to carry out these promises?
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Smacks wrote:
After the game, pack up all your miniatures, then slap the guy next to you on the ass and say.
"Good game guys, now lets hit the showers" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 03:55:29
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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Emperors Faithful wrote:DarkAngelHopeful wrote:Kilkrazy wrote:It is all a crappy mess.
All Muslims didn't overreact hastily, only the most traditional extremists.
Stop tarring them all with the same brush, it is thoughtless and bigoted.
It strikes blows against the moderate majority and drives them out of western society into the hands of extremists.
Killkrazy, obviously not all Muslims over react. However, this is a story about one that did over react. No one who is not a Muslim should be held to Islamic religious standards. Period.
This is kind of funny, given the 'Stoning Woman' argument in a previous thread. Should Non-Westerners be held to Western Standards?
I might also point out that going into the Witness Protection program, changing your name and relocating ect, seems to be a big reaction to a threat like this. I don't know how credible the threats posed by Fatwas are in Seattle, I would imagine Seattle would be a much harder place for Assassinations than most. Do they actually have the means to carry out these promises?
First, Islamic standards and Western standards are different. One's religious and one's cultural. So, regardless of where I live or my culture, if I'm not a Muslim, I shouldn't be condemned by their clerics for not following Islamic standards.
Second, if someone is going into the witness protection program, then yes, the threats are probably real and can be carried out.
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"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:01:20
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
Australia (Recently ravaged by the Hive Fleet Ginger Overlord)
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DarkAngelHopeful wrote:
First, Islamic standards and Western standards are different. One's religious and one's cultural. So, regardless of where I live or my culture, if I'm not a Muslim, I shouldn't be condemned by their clerics for not following Islamic standards.
While I would sincerely like to agree with you, Reality speaks differently. Religion and Culture often go hand-in-hand and it would be foolish to discredit the links so swiftly.
EDIT: What I mean to say is that, IMHO, Relgion should be an entirely seperate matter from other aspects of our lives, but this is highly unfeasible.
Second, if someone is going into the witness protection program, then yes, the threats are probably real and can be carried out.
You mean to say that Al-Qaeda has the capacity to hunt down and kill US citizens on US soil at their leisure, in addition to waging a war spanning several countries against the combined might of the Western Worlds forces?
Or is this more likely to be another Angry, Angry Imam or somesuch spouting the same tired rhetoric?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/17 04:02:45
Smacks wrote:
After the game, pack up all your miniatures, then slap the guy next to you on the ass and say.
"Good game guys, now lets hit the showers" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:04:05
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
Mesopotamia. The Kingdom Where we Secretly Reign.
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Emperors Faithful wrote:DarkAngelHopeful wrote:Kilkrazy wrote:It is all a crappy mess.
All Muslims didn't overreact hastily, only the most traditional extremists.
Stop tarring them all with the same brush, it is thoughtless and bigoted.
It strikes blows against the moderate majority and drives them out of western society into the hands of extremists.
Killkrazy, obviously not all Muslims over react. However, this is a story about one that did over react. No one who is not a Muslim should be held to Islamic religious standards. Period.
This is kind of funny, given the 'Stoning Woman' argument in a previous thread. Should Non-Westerners be held to Western Standards?
When it comes to human rights?
I think so.
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Drink deeply and lustily from the foamy draught of evil.
W: 1.756 Quadrillion L: 0 D: 2
Haters gon' hate. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:16:31
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
Australia (Recently ravaged by the Hive Fleet Ginger Overlord)
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Monster Rain wrote:
When it comes to human rights?
I think so.
Interesting. Is there a reason behind this assessment?
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Smacks wrote:
After the game, pack up all your miniatures, then slap the guy next to you on the ass and say.
"Good game guys, now lets hit the showers" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:17:09
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Moustache-twirling Princeps
About to eat your Avatar...
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Monster Rain wrote:When it comes to human rights?
I think so.
What is the plan to stop that from happening?
I'm not sure I follow where this argument leads, all thoughts of moral relativism aside.
Sucks for that cartoonist though, but it's odd that she would be so shocked at the possibility her cartoons would be wielded as political weapons. Who woulda thunk it?
Emperors Faithful wrote:Interesting. Is there a reason behind this assessment?
Oh man, this will be drawn out for pages. I prefer to hear his response on what exactly is to be done about it. I'm a busy man, I need answers in a timely fashion.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/17 04:18:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:24:34
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
Australia (Recently ravaged by the Hive Fleet Ginger Overlord)
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Wrexasaur wrote:
Emperors Faithful wrote:Interesting. Is there a reason behind this assessment?
Oh man, this will be drawn out for pages. I prefer to hear his response on what exactly is to be done about it. I'm a busy man, I need answers in a timely fashion.
Come on, lad. Answer the easy questions now. Chop chop.
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Smacks wrote:
After the game, pack up all your miniatures, then slap the guy next to you on the ass and say.
"Good game guys, now lets hit the showers" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:25:08
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God
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Ppl get worked up over up over racist jokes.
Now people getting worked up when their god is made fun of = extreme?
I dont think so.
More like " our cultures value things differently , because i dont share the same view as you Muslims , har har ( Nelson laugher) "
In other words , some people really need to start respecting others.
Just because we personally dont believe or care about others believes , doesnt mean we cant give them some common decency /respect.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/17 04:27:58
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ʳʷ ᵖˡᵃʸ ᵖᵃᵘˢᵉ ˢᵗᵒᵖ ᶠᶠ |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:26:58
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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Emperors Faithful wrote:DarkAngelHopeful wrote:
First, Islamic standards and Western standards are different. One's religious and one's cultural. So, regardless of where I live or my culture, if I'm not a Muslim, I shouldn't be condemned by their clerics for not following Islamic standards.
While I would sincerely like to agree with you, Reality speaks differently. Religion and Culture often go hand-in-hand and it would be foolish to discredit the links so swiftly.
EDIT: What I mean to say is that, IMHO, Relgion should be an entirely seperate matter from other aspects of our lives, but this is highly unfeasible.
Second, if someone is going into the witness protection program, then yes, the threats are probably real and can be carried out.
You mean to say that Al-Qaeda has the capacity to hunt down and kill US citizens on US soil at their leisure, in addition to waging a war spanning several countries against the combined might of the Western Worlds forces?
Or is this more likely to be another Angry, Angry Imam or somesuch spouting the same tired rhetoric?
Never the less, should a Christian be held accountable for breaking Islamic laws? The answer is no.
It doesn't have to be Al-Qaeda that attacks the cartoonist. IIRC, the Swedish cartoonist with a similar situation was attacked and his house was attacked several times. I'm sure the people who attacked him weren't Al-Qaeda.
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"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:27:02
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
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DarkAngelHopeful wrote:If I am not a Muslim and my beliefs do not require me to NOT draw prophets, I shouldn't be practically forced to comply with Islamic standards by having my life endangered. I am a Christian. My church has artist depictions of Moses, Noah, and lots of other biblical prophets. They are used in Sunday school classes as visual aids. So, should my entire church be afraid of some Islamic cleric issuing a fatwa against us? Should we be forced into the witness protection agency and have to change our names?
There's two thing here. Yes, you're right that someone's faith shouldn't prevent a person chasing their own artistic vision. But there's also an obligation to not be a dick. Seriously, just because you have the freedom to draw Mohammed it doesn't mean you shouldn't also accept that doing so might offend other people, and therefore you should have a reason to draw him.
I think Salman Rushdie was exploring his faith and the faith of his people, albeit in a highly controversial way, I think what he did was certainly offensive (he wrote of Mohammed and the arch-angle Gabriel in a homosexual relationship) but it was done for genuinely artistic reasons. As such the only criticism to draw there is on the fanatics who declared the fatwa against him.
On the other hand, the only point to 'draw Mohammed day' is to piss of the fanatics. So it isn't good that the cartoonist has suffered a reaction like this, but it's hard to draw much sympathy.
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“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:32:52
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot
Provo, UT
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sebster wrote:DarkAngelHopeful wrote:If I am not a Muslim and my beliefs do not require me to NOT draw prophets, I shouldn't be practically forced to comply with Islamic standards by having my life endangered. I am a Christian. My church has artist depictions of Moses, Noah, and lots of other biblical prophets. They are used in Sunday school classes as visual aids. So, should my entire church be afraid of some Islamic cleric issuing a fatwa against us? Should we be forced into the witness protection agency and have to change our names?
There's two thing here. Yes, you're right that someone's faith shouldn't prevent a person chasing their own artistic vision. But there's also an obligation to not be a dick. Seriously, just because you have the freedom to draw Mohammed it doesn't mean you shouldn't also accept that doing so might offend other people, and therefore you should have a reason to draw him.
I think Salman Rushdie was exploring his faith and the faith of his people, albeit in a highly controversial way, I think what he did was certainly offensive (he wrote of Mohammed and the arch-angle Gabriel in a homosexual relationship) but it was done for genuinely artistic reasons. As such the only criticism to draw there is on the fanatics who declared the fatwa against him.
On the other hand, the only point to 'draw Mohammed day' is to piss of the fanatics. So it isn't good that the cartoonist has suffered a reaction like this, but it's hard to draw much sympathy.
I agree with you. It wasn't a smart thing to do on the cartoonist part by any means, but it didn't a necessitate a fatwa endangering her life.
EDIT: I'm off to work so I won't be around to respond for a bit. Hopefully I won't get a fatwa issued against me while I'm here lol, oh wait...
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/09/17 04:34:30
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever." -1984, pg.267
I think George Orwell was unknowingly describing 40K.
Armies - Highelves, Dwarves |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:36:26
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
Mesopotamia. The Kingdom Where we Secretly Reign.
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Emperors Faithful wrote:Monster Rain wrote:
When it comes to human rights?
I think so.
Interesting. Is there a reason behind this assessment?
This might come off as slightly condescending, but I think that we have a better way of doing things over here.
Based solely on the difference in the way women are treated in the West compared to the region in which Fatwas are generally issued I would draw the conclusion that they should behave in a more civilized manner. I'm not saying that we should bomb them or anything, but we're well within our rights to look down upon savagery when confronted with it.
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Drink deeply and lustily from the foamy draught of evil.
W: 1.756 Quadrillion L: 0 D: 2
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/09/17 04:38:54
Subject: Seattle Cartoonist goes into hiding after Fatwa issued against him
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Moustache-twirling Princeps
About to eat your Avatar...
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sebster wrote:Yes, you're right that someone's faith shouldn't prevent a person chasing their own artistic vision. But there's also an obligation to not be a dick.
Obligation is not the word I would use there.
Seriously, just because you have the freedom to draw Mohammed it doesn't mean you shouldn't also accept that doing so might offend other people, and therefore you should have a reason to draw him.
I think there is a very interesting question in all of this. What does 'drawing Mohammed' mean? Is it a literal drawing? What formats are considered the most offensive? Is there any distinction there?
I think Salman Rushdie was exploring his faith and the faith of his people, albeit in a highly controversial way, I think what he did was certainly offensive (he wrote of Mohammed and the arch-angle Gabriel in a homosexual relationship) but it was done for genuinely artistic reasons. As such the only criticism to draw there is on the fanatics who declared the fatwa against him.
The best controversy is highly artistic controversy. Agreed.
On the other hand, the only point to 'draw Mohammed day' is to piss of the fanatics. So it isn't good that the cartoonist has suffered a reaction like this, but it's hard to draw much sympathy.
Supposedly, she didn't coin the term, but I never followed this story all that closely.
Monster Rain wrote:This might come off as slightly condescending, but I think that we have a better way of doing things over here.
For me at least, it is a matter of broad generalizations. You say that you are against some of the more despicable parts of these cultures, but that stands to offer a tool against all cultures that are in any way similar. I don't think that burying someone in the ground and stoning them to death is a tolerable action, but without specifics as to who has done that and what actions can be taken to stop it; it's relatively meaningless.
Stuff happened in the desert today. There were camels.
Based solely on the difference in the way women are treated in the West compared to the region in which Fatwas are generally issued I would draw the conclusion that they should behave in a more civilized manner. I'm not saying that we should bomb them or anything, but we're well within our rights to look down upon savagery when confronted with it.
No one is stopping you from doing so. It is not unreasonable to ask reasoning from you, on that same note.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/09/17 04:51:11
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