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I have a couple of major questions about the tau in terms of every body saying theyre crap, cause i have had enough of a coupla my mates insisting that theyre armies are crud thn turnin around and nearly kickin my butt.
So: #1: is it not fantastic that theyre BASIC guns are strength 5??? i mean they have no S4 or lower weaponry xcept 4 flamers... thats like saying they wound everyone on 2's and 3's, how is this crap???
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Deep strike, fast transports, 27" charge range Orks all give Tau one turn to shoot before they're in close combat. In close combat, Tau lose.
Additionally, other armies to alpha-strike better. Mech IG, DE, and Space Wolves can all outshoot Tau on turn one, and often have superior close combat to back it up.
Granted, Tau can still compete. Disruption Pods on Devilfish, Kroot bubblewraping, and plenty of Rail Guns all keep Tau alive and kicking, just with less punch compared to new armies.
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sure there are, but they really are terrible. There's about 2 ways to play them and 1 is bad imo, the suit heavy list and the Gunline, D-pods, bubblewrap lists
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Tyranic Marta wrote:I have a couple of major questions about the tau in terms of every body saying theyre crap, cause i have had enough of a coupla my mates insisting that theyre armies are crud thn turnin around and nearly kickin my butt.
So: #1: is it not fantastic that theyre BASIC guns are strength 5??? i mean they have no S4 or lower weaponry xcept 4 flamers... thats like saying they wound everyone on 2's and 3's, how is this crap???
no. it is not fantastic. its a 16% improvement on the to-wound roll vs. a boltgun. its nice but it isnt anything more than marginal. take as many crisis suits and marker lights as possible. those are your codex's strengths.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/02 19:28:21
no. it is not fantastic. its a 16% improvement on the to-wound roll vs. a boltgun. its nice but it isnt anything more than marginal. take as many crisis suits and marker lights as possible. those are your codex's strengths.
+1 Not too mention the Firewarriors have no special weapons. Which are really what does the heavy lifting in 40k.
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Stelek says he uses Tau competitively, and that Tau is actually the top army.
And he beat DashofPepper, who claims to be the top few player (according to some sort of ranking).
So let's say Tau is playable.
The problem with Tau is that there is really only 1 competitive build available. Maxed out Missile Pod Crisis Suits, Broadsides, Piranhas for melta and movement blocking, Kroot to bubble wrap and 1-2 units of Fire Warriors hiding in Devilfish to give you some scoring options. This kind of army is very capable of outshooting Guard or other shooting based armies, they may have less shots but they are nearly as mobile as Eldar so it balances out.
It's not necessarily a problem on the table top. Its just limiting. And its indicative of things to come. the harder the requirements of competitive play press on your codex, the fewer options there are. eventually it will just get pushed off the field all together. More competitive builds means the codex is having an easier time handling the challenges its up against and has, if you will, a longer life span ahead of it.
But my question was "Why is having 1 competitive build a problem? If it can win, it can win."
How is your answer relevant? I wasnt refering to or asking if winning in the future is a problem. And I thought quite obviously, the OP's question was targetted at CURRENT metagame? Doesnt matter if metagame shifts in the future (we don't know how it will shift anyway), the question of one of current competitiveness.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/03 02:48:58
shealyr wrote:I really dislike Stelek's Tau lists, but that generally stems from me disliking everything he puts up.
shealyr wrote:Now I may not have a Tau army myself, but zero markerlights, no railheads, zip on plasma, and only 3 flamers per unit once they get close?
I might not agree that his is the best list. But a couple of things :-
1) At 2k +++ points, Hammerheads are not efficient anymore. You need to pack enough RailGuns. I m not sure if you would be comfortable with 4-5 RailGuns.
2) Essentially, markerlights are personal preference. If you used the points to buying more Crisis Suits, you ll realize you will not be much worse off. In addition, pathfinders compete slots with Piranhas, and I find that I almost always need 3 squads of Piranhas for movement blocking and anti tank.
3) I think you quoted the wrong list. The list you quoted above was something he suggested as a change. His main list consist of fireknife suits (missile/plasma), kroots, less devilfish+FWs.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/12/03 06:07:53
I think the general problem with the tau is the codex tries to completely control 1 phase of the game (Shooting) by completely giving up on another (assault). What results tends to be a poorly balanced army that is either overpowered or underpowered.
In the case of Tau they are underpowered. It's a crap codex, and if a player can win tournaments with them it's a combination of top tier player skill and being matched up against the right armies.
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why do you think everyone owes you an explanation, strider? pretend for a moment that you're just some guy on a computer and no one cares what you think one way or another. just imagine.
AbaddonFidelis wrote:why do you think everyone owes you an explanation, strider? pretend for a moment that you're just some guy on a computer and no one cares what you think one way or another. just imagine.
I didnt say he OWES me an explanation. But I definitely think general comments like that arent very useful for a discussion like this.
But I m sure if you are not interested to participate in the discussion, you can jolly well stay away (not that we are desperate for your inputs - you are indeed that nobody on a computer), instead of trying to stir some flames. I didnt find that very useful either, and stop acting like a kid.
Of course you can choose to remain like a kid and post irrelevant stuff. It's either people are intellectual enough to filter trash from you, or you ll trigger some laughter amongst us.
Also, not sure what you constitute as broken English. But I m guessing your English competency is stucked at Primary school level.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2010/12/03 08:05:13
I think Tau plays best as a gunline, however it doesnt have enough shots to handle an opposing force of any prece dence. I've never seen it do well at a tourney and last I saw Stelek he was pickin on people with space pups.
"If you want a hobby that doesn't cost anything go catch butterflies." swordbrotherjim
Tau do okay... especially at the 1500-1750 range. They can bring the pain the while most armies are only starting to ramp up to full effectiveness. Basically, once your elite and heavy support can be filled, you've reached the effectiveness cap.
I do alright at tournaments with them. they aren't forgiving, they have bad matchups (DoA Angels, Certain Ork builds) and once you get above 1850 you are basically forced to play one way, but they are alright.
Psychic powers are what kills them as much as anything really. fortune, shields of sanguinius, JoTWW are killer.
As for the railgun issue, 5 is minimum at 2000 points. I would take at least 4 once you got to 1500 then at least 5 once you get to 2000. If you don't have 7-9 by 2500 you are going to lose.
