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Hey guys, was thinking of looking into getting some FoW maybe, but I'm a bit confused on how to set up an army (German Panzer Company), So I had a look at some of the briefings on PDF, and I saw the the Panzerdivisions Ost, and I showed me how to set up an army, but I'm not sure if that army list is for specific armies, or can I build an army off that, if anyone could help me on this that would be fantastic

Cheers

The briefings on battlefront's website are official. So, yes you can build a company using Panzerdivisions Ost and not have any trouble. The briefing itself is pretty solid and has all the tools you need for a playable Panzerkompanie.

If you're new to FoW just be aware that the game is separated into 3 eras: EW, MW and LW. Panzerdivisions Ost is a late war briefing and so it won't be compatible with mid-war or early-war forces.

If you have several players switching over make sure you all build a company from the same era. Or, if you're planning on joining an existing group of players find out which eras they play.

O yea i know about the EW, MW, and LW stuff, I got to a wargaming club where ancients and FoW are the main things, you pick up a few rules here there after a while , but thanks for the help

And on another note does 10 Panzer 4's (2 for HQ and two platoons of 4) and a King tiger sound like a good army ?

That army sounds really easy to play against. Smoke the KT and then pretty much anything can out duel that few Panzers. If that's late war it comes to about 1,290 for four platoons, then you toss in a 2 squad panzergrenadier squad with command panzerfaust and you reach 1,500 points.

So your list would be:

HQ - 2 x Panzer IV H [190]
Combat - 4 x Panzer IV H [380]
Combat - 4 x Panzer IV H [380]
Support - 1x King Tiger [340]
Support - 1x Panzer Grenadiers (2 squads + Panzerfaust) [210]

My list at 1,500 points:

So 1,500 would be Italian campaign British Armor:

HQ - 2 x Sherman [175]
Combat - 3 x Sherman [260]
Combat - 3 x Sherman [260]
Weapons - 3 x Stuarts [150]
Support - 4 x M10 3" SP [310]
Support - 3 x Scout Carriers w/ Extra MGs [105]
Support - 4 x 25 pdr guns [215]
Aerial Observation Post [25]

Unlike you I can dig out infantry, with two separate scout teams I have enough MG's to start to deal with hordes and I have a decent amount of armor.

Your list suffers from trying to go super elite at low points and it really doesn't work that well. Skilled players know what to shoot and what to ignore and with only 3 units on the table for some missions you'll get hurt at the start.

Canadian's got it. You'll be swarmed quickly, either in assault or by sheer amount of AT fire.

First, I'll recommend Easy Army to you - it's an internet-based list builder that is actually supported by Battlefront! Now, you'll have to purchase the lists from Earth & Steel for LW German Panerkompanies.

http://www.easyarmy.com/

Now, going past that. Some things you'll want in your list - artillery, for smoke and pinning, and Infantry, for holding objectives.

forgot to include 2 Stug tanks as well

That's even worse, unless you have an overwhelming reason for wanting this force i would suggest changing it. With a pair of Stugs you would be at 1,480 points and have a total of 13 models on the table. Panzer IV's are okay, Stugs are solid choices, but the KT and the points it eats are harsh.

I would suggest something like:

HQ - 2 x Panzer IV H [190]
Combat - 5 x Panzer IV H [475]
Combat - 4 x Panzer IV H [380]
Support - 3 x Pumas [150]
Support - 1 x NW41 Section [95]
Support - 1x Panzer Grenadiers (2 squads + Panzerfaust) [210]

This is at least a slightly more viable list with some infantry to hold points, arty for smoke, Pumas for removing gone to ground, and nearly the same overall numbers of tanks.

Such historically accurate lists!

LOL!

Sorry... FOW lists make the anal-WW2 player in me giggle for their ahistorical nature.

You certainly can build something more historically accurate if you like. I was simply giving some advice on lists that work within the system.

Of course I would really like to see a scanned copy of GW's new rules pop up. I'd love to spend the money on it, but I'd much rather read the rules at my leisure and then decide if it's worth my money.

Why would you want to support piracy of copyrighted material?

Thats a bit scummy.

Regardless of who puts out a product, the author is entitled to some degree of protection from piracy. It is their work after all.

All piracy does is raise costs for those of us who can be bothered to spend the money... So thanks for that.

oh well,

every new game I check out, I snag the PDF first to see if it is worth buying and playing. especially when this stuff is costing at least 50.00 a pop.

If I like it, then I buy it. Always. If I dont like it, then I dont buy it and the author should have done a better job.

Big P wrote:Why would you want to support piracy of copyrighted material?

Thats a bit scummy.

Regardless of who puts out a product, the author is entitled to some degree of protection from piracy. It is their work after all.

All piracy does is raise costs for those of us who can be bothered to spend the money... So thanks for that.

People will still write game rules even if they don't get a cent. Movies will still be made and music will still sound as good for free. I'm not taking anything from them given that with no preview I'm not buying the rules anyway so they can only gain a sale from me at this stage.

Nice to see you dont give a sod about supporting your hobby.

You carry on thieving and convince yourself its all alright...

Having written a gaming supplement, a pirated PDF copy does indeed take away the profits of writers... But you wouldnt care about that would you?

Big P wrote:Such historically accurate lists!

LOL!

Sorry... FOW lists make the anal-WW2 player in me giggle for their ahistorical nature.

What's so ahistorical about them, besides the inclusion of rare units like Pumas (something that is easily remedied)? The cool thing about FOW is that historical lists tend to do just as well (or in some cases, better) than ahistorical "power" lists.

Whats ahistorical about this?

"And on another note does 10 Panzer 4's (2 for HQ and two platoons of 4) and a King tiger sound like a good army?"

Do you really need an answer to that?

From what I've read and seen, I tend to assume that FoW battles, much like 40k, are the key moments of a larger battle. They're the daring move or final assault on a strong point.

This helps me ignore a lot of logistical questions that might other rise, and historical questions in the case of FoW... "Historical Accuracy" being lost to me if you're not fighting with identical forces to historical records on a historical board anyway.

Big P wrote:Whats ahistorical about this?

"And on another note does 10 Panzer 4's (2 for HQ and two platoons of 4) and a King tiger sound like a good army?"

Do you really need an answer to that?

The King Tiger part? Or just having 10 Panzer IVs in an army? You do know that it's a Panzerkompanie list though? So it ought to have Panzers, right? In FOW (which is, at its base, a company-level game), before you pick your units, you pick which kind of company you want to play. There are a lot of different variations, but the primary types are infantry companies, mechanized (or motorized) infantry companies, and tank companies. It's usually better to play to your strengths (if you take an infantry company, you want a lot of infantry, if you're going to take a tank company, you'll want a decent number of tanks), but (as we often see in history) combined arms forces tend to perform better, so you'll usually want some balanced weapons and support platoons as well.

I must ask though, if you were trying to make a historical Panzerkompanie, what would you take?

Show me a Panzerkompanie with ten MKIVs and a King Tiger?

I must have missed that one.

But they would have grenadiers to support them.

Tanks didnt charge about alone... But hey if that floats your boat, go for it.

Big P wrote:Show me a Panzerkompanie with ten MKIVs and a King Tiger?

I must have missed that one.

But they would have grenadiers to support them.

Tanks didnt charge about alone... But hey if that floats your boat, go for it.

Oh, I agree with you about the King Tiger. But the thing is, in the FOW organization, the King Tiger isn't part of the actual company. If you have one, it's division-level support (or coming from another formation like an independent heavy tank battalion, but they're limited in the same way as "support" in FOW).
As for the grenadiers to support them, I agree with you totally as well. And in LW, with 10 Panzer IVs you should have enough points to bring some grenadiers along for the ride. Just like in history, if you take a bunch of tanks in FOW with no infantry support, you are going to suffer, big time.

Tanks don't charge about alone in FOW either, if you want them to last long.

Big P wrote:Nice to see you dont give a sod about supporting your hobby.

You carry on thieving and convince yourself its all alright...

Having written a gaming supplement, a pirated PDF copy does indeed take away the profits of writers... But you wouldnt care about that would you?

Self important much. I'm not going to buy your rules anyway, I'll find free ones or won't play. You can't take money that would never have been given now can you? All the not company sponsored research on piracy shows this is true.

I dont mind what you do or play. You cant buy 'my rules' as I have never written any... Just a supplement.

So you just dont want to pay for things. If you have a pirate copy of a gaming book, then you will not buy the original, therefore you have taken away from the publisher by definition.

You can dress it up how you want, still copyright theft regardless.

I happen to think I have a hobby worth supporting and contributing too. I dont believe that those who pirate gaming materials - whether its books or recast figures - feel the same.

They just want a cheap ride off the backs of the rest of us.

Thats all... We have different moral values.

Big P wrote:I dont mind what you do or play. You cant buy 'my rules' as I have never written any... Just a supplement.

So you just dont want to pay for things. If you have a pirate copy of a gaming book, then you will not buy the original, therefore you have taken away from the publisher by definition.

You can dress it up how you want, still copyright theft regardless.

I happen to think I have a hobby worth supporting and contributing too. I dont believe that those who pirate gaming materials - whether its books or recast figures - feel the same.

They just want a cheap ride off the backs of the rest of us.

Thats all... We have different moral values.

Actually,
I have both.

FoW - Every source book I have the PDF on, I have turned around and bought the physical Copy of. Same with the Rule Book. I have a PDF + the real book.

BlackPowder - Same thing, got the PDF, reviewed it, tested it. Then got the Real thing!

Warhammer Fantasy - same practice.

I have been looking for a copy of Blitzkrieg Commander, cause the game looks good as well. Once I see, Ill probably get the book.

After a life time of playing Video games and dropping 50 bucks for ASS games. I look before I drop a large sum of change for anything. However! I do support the hobby, I have bought the books.

Is it Piracy? Yes it is, but I still support my local store and support the hobby.
You tellin me that you have bought everything for everything? Not just gaming, I mean PC games, Music, Books? all of it!

Comintern wrote:
You tellin me that you have bought everything for everything? Not just gaming, I mean PC games, Music, Books? all of it!

Er... Yes. You make it sound like thats wrong.

I dont play PC games (I have a 360), dont really listen to music (never have) and I doubt you could find the books I buy on PDF.

I dont have the time to watch TV or movies, let alone download them, with a busy job, kids and a hobby.

So yup... I do pay for the stuff I buy rather than utilise pirated copies.

truly a feat in the world of the Digital Now!

Im just old and crumbly...

Big P wrote:I dont mind what you do or play. You cant buy 'my rules' as I have never written any... Just a supplement.

So you just dont want to pay for things. If you have a pirate copy of a gaming book, then you will not buy the original, therefore you have taken away from the publisher by definition.

You can dress it up how you want, still copyright theft regardless.

I happen to think I have a hobby worth supporting and contributing too. I dont believe that those who pirate gaming materials - whether its books or recast figures - feel the same.

They just want a cheap ride off the backs of the rest of us.

Thats all... We have different moral values.

Given that I have paid for books that I've downloaded that's a total load.

You carry on trying to justify it to yourself old Chap...

If one is going to purchase based upon a test review of a dloaded PDF, then where exactly is the cost to anyone? Its about the same as borrowing your mates "codex" or studying the "shop copy". Far too much these days relies on us putting money up for something even though we have no idea if it is functional or even any good. Its hardly surprising that when a rulebook can cost up to fifty quid (I'm looking at you, GW Historical) then its hardly surprising that people would want to check what they are getting before they get it.

Big P wrote:You carry on trying to justify it to yourself old Chap...

You carry on with your outdated system of morals that says we should pay full price for garbage and be glad for the chance to do so. I can listen to music for free legally on any number of radio stations, so why not download it? Downloading hurts studios more than artists, going to shows and buying merch helps artists. Actors are overpaid anyway so why support their lifestyles when free content can be just as entertaining? You haven't given me a reason not to download something you've worked on. I don't personally feel a need to support you when you are likely more than able to work and likely would have still wanted your rules out there even if it was for free.

Alright, the main post was about "how to se tup an army" and an IDEA! of an army, to even start that panzer ost army, i have to have at least 8 or 10 panzers t even play that army, and that was just an idea, Ive also had a look a other panzer lists, I love the look of the "Pantherdivison", and It says I MUST HAVE at (LEAST) 7 Panthers

1 Panther-HQ

3 Panthers-platoon

3 Panthers-platoon

And thats just to play the army, and if I had another Panther in the HQ slot I get a 1500 pt army on the dot, and if an army with no inf is bad, why has BF come out with army lists that mainly focus on tanks, and to even start some tank companys you got to have like 8 somthing tanks before even thinking about inf?