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So I'm trying to come up with an Ork list that I like, and I've come up with two different lists, one with a unit of Nobz and one without them. Reading up on things, it seems that most Ork lists I come across run a unit of Nobz. That said, in game terms I've got a few preconceived notions on them:

1.) Nobz want to come with a Warboss to make them Troops and to give them better LD
2.) Nobz want to come in larger numbers, go big or go home.
3.) Diversification of Nobz is important so they stay alive as long as possible.
4.) Nobz either ride in a Battlewagon or ride on Bikes.

Eventually I will build a list with a full unit of Nob Bikers, but that'll require 4 boxes of Bikes, so it'll have to wait a bit. I've got more than enough bitz/models to make a full unit on foot, so I'm very tempted to build them.

So I've got a basic 1850 list w/ Nobz:

Warboss, pk, cybork, etc
KFF Mek

22 Lootas

10 Nobz, Cybork, FNP, 3 Klaws, 3 Choppas, Poles, etc.
Battlewagon w/ Rolla
2 units of 20 Boyz in Battlewagons w/ Rollaz
(3 Wagons total)

Deffkopta w/ Rokkits + Klaw

3 Kannonz

Now, I'm actually pretty happy trying this list out, I think it actually has enough support fire and should meet my goal of 3 Wagons rushing forward.

But, now that I look at it, I figured that if I downgraded the 10 Nobz into another unit of 20 Boyz, and dropped the Warboss & Kannonz, I could then add 2 units of Boyz in Trukks and a unit of 16 Storm Boyz, netting me more PK's, more bodies, and more targets to get shot down.

As much as I like the idea of a Nob unit, I can't help but think that the second list w/o the Nobz is probably stronger, but I don't have enough experience w/ Orks in 5th Ed to really make that call. I will likely play test both lists, but I'd love to hear the opinions of Dakka.

I had the same preconceived notions about nobz for a long time, and in my list that runs mostly boyz as infantry, I was finding that, while the boyz were good value for points, I just wasnt hitting hard enough in CC.

The boyz were largely ineffective against even mildly specialised CC units, & something like Khorne Berzerkers could chew through half my army before being stopped by attrition.

Ive recently started including units of 5 - 7 nobz (at the 1000 - 1500 pts level) , in a trukk & I've found them to be excellent.

They're very resilient with wound allocation & all the survivability wargear, and they pack enough of a punch to reliably win combats on wounds and actually do some damage to tougher or better armoured squads.

I wouldnt advocate stormboyz either. A unit of 15 was what I dropped to get the nobz in. They're extremely fast, but they hit things & break like water against rock. The only thing Ive found them useful for is getting into the back of gunlines, & that doesnt come up often enough to justify taking them every time. They just dont have the punch to make their speed useful.

Voodoo Boyz wrote:So I'm trying to come up with an Ork list that I like, and I've come up with two different lists, one with a unit of Nobz and one without them. Reading up on things, it seems that most Ork lists I come across run a unit of Nobz. That said, in game terms I've got a few preconceived notions on them:

1.) Nobz want to come with a Warboss to make them Troops and to give them better LD
2.) Nobz want to come in larger numbers, go big or go home.
3.) Diversification of Nobz is important so they stay alive as long as possible.
4.) Nobz either ride in a Battlewagon or ride on Bikes.

1) Remember they don't have to be with the boss to be troops. they just both have to be in the list.

2)True to an extent. 10 Nobz is almost always overkill. Back when I ran 10, half the time they had essentially already won combat before Power Klaws even attacked. I've personally found 8 to be my happy number, but it is merely my preference and opinion.

3) This is true. Model for model, they are the most expensive *competetive* unit in the codex, so keeping them alive as long as possible is important to help them earn their keep. a 10 man squad on foot can run you 400 points or more, which is assault terminator territory in a points-per-model sense. Putting them on bikes adds another 250 points to the cost.

4) this is absolutely true. Again, they are an expensive unit. They are also quite vulnerable to high strength shooting, and they are meant to be stuck in the enemy. Bikes or a wagon helps to assure they get to assault quickly and safely, so that they can be allowed to do their job (which of course is pulverizing dirty 'umie 'eads.)

I love my nob squad, but no means do I swear by them. They're tons of fun, but I don't feel they have a place in every list. I would say model up a squad (or proxy one) and play around and see how you feel about the unit.

Go for the nobz! Last battle my 10 420p(!) overkill nobs killed
- a wraithlod
- eldrad plus bodyguard
- some scorpions
- 10 Dire Avengers
- and my brothers other farseer into the bargain

As usually, they were worth their points, and I only lost 2 in that battle, and got most woundet.

Voodoo Boyz wrote:1.) Nobz want to come with a Warboss to make them Troops and to give them better LD

Actually, you don't want your warboss with your non-biker nobz. They have a boss pole on their own and the shouldn't be losing combat anyways, so any extra combat power the warboss adds is wasted. Pinning and tank shocks shouldn't be a big issue either, as they are supposed to be inside their transport or assaulting. The warboss is much better at supporting burnaz or boyz. That said, biker nobz profit much more from the warboss as he can take rocket and lascannon shots for them.

2.) Nobz want to come in larger numbers, go big or go home.

Not really. Nobz charging something tend to kill anything they can handle, or get killed. Anything above six or seven is a waste of points, as those seven nobz will already obliterate anything they touch, and any additional nobz will only add more Wounds to the unit, at a cost usually not worth it. I even go with less for nob bikers, as they are harder to kill anyway and accompanied by a warboss. They don't gain enough from an additional model to justify 50+ points.

Nobz are great at killing stuff that boyz can't kill and boyz are great at killing stuff that troubles nobz. Thus having both is never bad. Nobz are simply missing from most footslogging lists, because of their big weakness to anti-tank weapons and ordinance.

equiping nobz with unique gear is great and being a troop choice with ghaz or warboss is awesome. i agree with the 7 or 8 model squads. i would like to try out a full squad of just big choppas however with waaagh banner, bosspole and painboy.

My 5 nobz in a trukk plus warboss made it all the way through a tau fire line and hammerhead as well as some battle suits, and they slaughtered all 20 fire warriors and blew up the tank, As well as took out a battlesuit with nothing but one pk.
So yeh, i say nobz.

Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

tkrettler91 wrote:equiping nobz with unique gear is great and being a troop choice with ghaz or warboss is awesome. i agree with the 7 or 8 model squads. i would like to try out a full squad of just big choppas however with waaagh banner, bosspole and painboy.

I actually tried that for quite some time, and one of my friend always fields such a unit. For your points you basically get 'ard slugga boyz with +1 to WS, S and I at the cost of 70(!) attacks, 10 less wounds, a weakness to ID and not being fearless. And we all now how often we take big mobs of 'ard boyz. If they'd at least strike at I5 they would be great, but as they are? Not worth it.

Yea, the only time Id bring Ard Boyz is if the game was HUGE. Then Id take 29 Ard Boyz + ard Nob pk, then take Mad Dok and stick him in that unit, AND give them all cybork bodies. Its a boat load of points, but 34 wounds, 4+/5++/4+ FNP and rage? Yea that would be fun as hell throwing around

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

Im just stating a point.

Jollydevil wrote:

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

Im just stating a point.

So is he. My plague marines have done worse to a guardsmen line, and no one goes on about how good plague-o's are in CC- bit of the opposite in fact...

Jihallah wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

Im just stating a point.

So is he. My plague marines have done worse to a guardsmen line, and no one goes on about how good plague-o's are in CC- bit of the opposite in fact...

This thread aint about whether or not youre impressed that my nobz did well against Tau, its about whether you would take nobz over boyz. And as my evidence that id rather have nobz than boyz, i used that. I had no intention of bragging about how good nobz are aginst tau in close combat.

Paper bags are good in CC against tau.

I like running my nobs in bike mobs of 4-5, all with PK. They fit the role of anti tank very nicely and rarely have a problem getting into CC because of the cover/armor/toughness/ballerness that comes with being a big ork.

On foot, I diversify the wargear a bit so they can still deliver pain once they arrive at the combat. Throw 3-4 more in there and you have a useful unit.

-cgmckenzie

True. A hand full of boyz still has a good chance of slaughtering an entire tau gunline, there no point in using the worst close combat army as reference to find out how good nobz are.

Agreed. Id bet a boyz mob would do pretty much what your Nobz did as well. Now if you really want to compare the two, send them after a big unit of CSM or Berserkers. Compare the 2 then and figure out which one you like more. If your going to compare then in CC standards, then you actually have to put them to the test, not say, well this one time, I caused 57 wounds in 1 turn......against a ripper swarm

A unit of 30 boyz cant take a trukk, which is a major downfall, so while they may be able to kill the tau, they wont be able to get there.

Well sure, if you were dumb enough to send, one, lowly boyz unit against an entire Tau force, it wouldnt make it. But thats really not a problem for Orks, theres gunna be 2+ other mobs of boyz coming in along side the 1 that had a hamburger party made from their chests. Not to mention the rest of the army on top of that.

Again this is take another mob of boyz, vs taking a mob of Nobz. And you have to compare them correctly, saying "well Nobz are better because 1 mob of boyz would get shot to hell and back before they got there" Well so would a SINGLE unit of nobz in any type of vehicle. 1 Single vehicle vs an entire Tau gunline? Ya, good luck there


*spelling

KingCracker wrote:Well sure, if you were dumb enough to send, one, lowly boyz unit against an entire Tau force, it wouldnt make it. But thats really not a problem for Orks, theres gunna be 2+ other mobs of boyz coming in along side the 1 that had a hamburger party made from their chests. Not to mention the rest of the army on top of that.

Again this is take another mob of boyz, vs taking a mob of Nobz. And you have to compare them correctly, saying "well Nobz are better because 1 mob of boyz would get shot to hell and back before they got there" Well so would a SINGLE unit of nobz in any type of vehicle. 1 Single vehicle vs an entire Tau gunline? Ya, good luck there


*spelling

5 nobz, 1 warboss with PK, 1 trukk, all eavy armor- 250 points
29 boyz, 1 nob w/ pk- 215 points.
Nobz are 35 points more, however will get to the enemy second or third turn. My nobz took 2 cassualties, warboss two wounds. Trukk is blown up once they get there. Now, they tied up both squads of 10 tau firewarriors, as well as a hammerhead. That means they cant shoot at anything else that turn, allowing my entire other part of my army to move up taking minimal cassualties. Not only that, but over the next few turns the two fire warrior sqauds are taken out, as well as the hammerhead unitl they finally fell to battlesuits, inflicting one kill. By this time, the rest of my entire army is at the front.
Because the nobz were able to make it to combat within the first couple turns, i like them better than boyz, who move up slowly and get moed down before they can reach their target.
Asa side note, no, one vehicle isnt going up against an entire tau army, obviously other units are shooting at various mobz/ vehicles elsewhere.

I usually go with 10 nobs. I just think go hard, go home. I usually use 3 claws and a painboy, and the rest diversified weapons.

I might try a smaller unit in the future and take more lootas to soften up the enemy. A friend of mine takes but 1 claw in his nob squad. His whole squad is just over 300 points. Mine usually runs 420 or so, but that's steep.

Nonetheless, a nob squad is a match for any squad save Grey Knights. Your opponent will commit alot of resources and firepower into killing them. It allows your deadly trukk squads to get closer and pick off enemy squads one by one as lootas crack light vehicles and chew up weaker units.

Putting in some real input to this, i usually field my sqaud with all big choppas, one pain boy, a waaaaagh banner and a trukk. Theres not much you can do with 50 strength 7 attacks coming at you ( on the charge).
They tally up to 330 points, which isnt half bad considering the damage they can do.

bucheonman wrote:I usually go with 10 nobs. I just think go hard, go home. I usually use 3 claws and a painboy, and the rest diversified weapons.

I might try a smaller unit in the future and take more lootas to soften up the enemy. A friend of mine takes but 1 claw in his nob squad. His whole squad is just over 300 points. Mine usually runs 420 or so, but that's steep.

Nonetheless, a nob squad is a match for any squad save Grey Knights. Your opponent will commit alot of resources and firepower into killing them. It allows your deadly trukk squads to get closer and pick off enemy squads one by one as lootas crack light vehicles and chew up weaker units.

Hey! I run my nobs exactly like that!! 3pks, 1 painboy, diversed weapon, 420....

Jollydevil wrote:

Jihallah wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

Im just stating a point.

So is he. My plague marines have done worse to a guardsmen line, and no one goes on about how good plague-o's are in CC- bit of the opposite in fact...

This thread aint about whether or not youre impressed that my nobz did well against Tau, its about whether you would take nobz over boyz. And as my evidence that id rather have nobz than boyz, i used that. I had no intention of bragging about how good nobz are aginst tau in close combat.

Your point is well and fine, but your example is quite frankly not a very good one. A full boyz squad costs less points and is capable of destroying a fire warrior squad (2 of them really) even moreso than a squad of nobz.

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

Jihallah wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well, yea tooled up Nobz + Warboss would trounce most things in a Tau army, once they hit that line. But you still have to use them correctly other wise they are just a gak load of points being put back in the box you brought them in.


And really it depends, there are alot of things Id rather send my boyz at then my Nobz.

Dont get me wrong, they took cassualties ( two dead, warboss 2 wounds) but what matters is that they not only tied up 20 tau, a squad of battlesuits and a hammerhead, AND they inflicted some heavy cassualties.

No offense, but nobody that plays Orks OR Tau is impressed to hear about nobz beating up fire warriors in CC.

Im just stating a point.

So is he. My plague marines have done worse to a guardsmen line, and no one goes on about how good plague-o's are in CC- bit of the opposite in fact...

This thread aint about whether or not youre impressed that my nobz did well against Tau, its about whether you would take nobz over boyz. And as my evidence that id rather have nobz than boyz, i used that. I had no intention of bragging about how good nobz are aginst tau in close combat.

Your point is well and fine, but your example is quite frankly not a very good one. A full boyz squad costs less points and is capable of destroying a fire warrior squad (2 of them really) even moreso than a squad of nobz.

i already went over this; go back and read my next two or three posts bro.

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well sure, if you were dumb enough to send, one, lowly boyz unit against an entire Tau force, it wouldnt make it. But thats really not a problem for Orks, theres gunna be 2+ other mobs of boyz coming in along side the 1 that had a hamburger party made from their chests. Not to mention the rest of the army on top of that.

Again this is take another mob of boyz, vs taking a mob of Nobz. And you have to compare them correctly, saying "well Nobz are better because 1 mob of boyz would get shot to hell and back before they got there" Well so would a SINGLE unit of nobz in any type of vehicle. 1 Single vehicle vs an entire Tau gunline? Ya, good luck there


*spelling

5 nobz, 1 warboss with PK, 1 trukk, all eavy armor- 250 points
29 boyz, 1 nob w/ pk- 215 points.
Nobz are 35 points more, however will get to the enemy second or third turn. My nobz took 2 cassualties, warboss two wounds. Trukk is blown up once they get there. Now, they tied up both squads of 10 tau firewarriors, as well as a hammerhead. That means they cant shoot at anything else that turn, allowing my entire other part of my army to move up taking minimal cassualties. Not only that, but over the next few turns the two fire warrior sqauds are taken out, as well as the hammerhead unitl they finally fell to battlesuits, inflicting one kill. By this time, the rest of my entire army is at the front.
Because the nobz were able to make it to combat within the first couple turns, i like them better than boyz, who move up slowly and get moed down before they can reach their target.
Asa side note, no, one vehicle isnt going up against an entire tau army, obviously other units are shooting at various mobz/ vehicles elsewhere.

In your above example unit 1 (the nobs) have 20 normal attacks on the charge and 5 PK attacks on the charge for 250 points.

One could put 20 slugga boys in a cheap battlewagon for 260 points, and get 76 normal attacks and 4 PK attacks on the charge, while offering more wounds, less kill points and the inability to single out the guy with the PK in close combat.

Nob squads are for cracking vehicles, beating up IC's and other multi-wound t4 models, and generally killing things that would tie up boyz squads for more than a full game turn (due to higher armor saves, FNP or whatever). And by the time they are equipped well enough to do that and survive long enough, their points costs are not comparative to a boyz squad, and can in some cases cost as much as two boyz squad if one goes a bit over the top.

Also, please don't call me 'bro'.

ork_smash wrote:

Jollydevil wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Well sure, if you were dumb enough to send, one, lowly boyz unit against an entire Tau force, it wouldnt make it. But thats really not a problem for Orks, theres gunna be 2+ other mobs of boyz coming in along side the 1 that had a hamburger party made from their chests. Not to mention the rest of the army on top of that.

Again this is take another mob of boyz, vs taking a mob of Nobz. And you have to compare them correctly, saying "well Nobz are better because 1 mob of boyz would get shot to hell and back before they got there" Well so would a SINGLE unit of nobz in any type of vehicle. 1 Single vehicle vs an entire Tau gunline? Ya, good luck there


*spelling

5 nobz, 1 warboss with PK, 1 trukk, all eavy armor- 250 points
29 boyz, 1 nob w/ pk- 215 points.
Nobz are 35 points more, however will get to the enemy second or third turn. My nobz took 2 cassualties, warboss two wounds. Trukk is blown up once they get there. Now, they tied up both squads of 10 tau firewarriors, as well as a hammerhead. That means they cant shoot at anything else that turn, allowing my entire other part of my army to move up taking minimal cassualties. Not only that, but over the next few turns the two fire warrior sqauds are taken out, as well as the hammerhead unitl they finally fell to battlesuits, inflicting one kill. By this time, the rest of my entire army is at the front.
Because the nobz were able to make it to combat within the first couple turns, i like them better than boyz, who move up slowly and get moed down before they can reach their target.
Asa side note, no, one vehicle isnt going up against an entire tau army, obviously other units are shooting at various mobz/ vehicles elsewhere.

In your above example unit 1 (the nobs) have 20 normal attacks on the charge and 5 PK attacks on the charge for 250 points.
One could put 20 slugga boys in a cheap battlewagon for 260 points, and get 76 normal attacks and 4 PK attacks on the charge, while offering more wounds, less kill points and the inability to single out the guy with the PK in close combat.
Nob squads are for cracking vehicles, beating up IC's and other multi-wound t4 models, and generally killing things that would tie up boyz squads for more than a full game turn (due to higher armor saves, FNP or whatever). And by the time they are equipped well enough to do that and survive long enough, their points costs are not comparative to a boyz squad, and can in some cases cost as much as two boyz squad if one goes a bit over the top.
Also, please don't call me 'bro'.

30 boyz cant take a trukk though. With a sqaud of nobz and the trukk, youre able to run in rel quick and (hopefully) eliminate targets early on, whereas boyz will not only take a long time to reachtheir target, but are also getting hammered all the way there by guys that wouldve been taken out earlier by truckin' nobz.

Your correct, you cant put 30 boyz in a trukk, but you CAN put 20 boyz in a BW, which is what he already said.
Also your putting ALOT of faith in that 1 trukk. If your saying that a mob of boyz is going to get "mowed down" by the Tau, then your flimsy trukk with nobz is going to be target priority #1 for any Tau player. Not to mention your saying that a boyz mob would be focused on by the Tau army, but YOUR trukk wont be? Thats how your argument is coming across anyways. If the Tau player is shooting at my blob of boyz, that same Tau player is certainly shooting at your Trukk+Nobz, and it would be worse for you then it would be for me. That trukk has a really good chance of going bye bye against Tau, and when it blows it has a decent chance of wounding some Nobz.

Boyz can use cover MUCH easier then the trukk zipping around, and can be spread out to take the sting out of templates. What can a trukk do to minimize its damage intake?


One more thing, Im guessing it was a typeO but how did you get 50 attacks with your Nobz?

I appreciate all the replies. I will be trying out some Nobz + BW once I can get the time to build the models.