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"Feel No Pain" apparently applies to all "un-saved wounds". Does that mean if the model gets no armour save, it doesn't get Feel no pain? So an AP3 weapon vs power armour, the power armour troops would NOT get a 4+ Feel No Pain roll?

No, you only get your FnP save if you get your normal armour save. So anything such as power weapons or AP3 weapons take that away.

It was the specific mention of AP2 and AP1 that confused me. Anything AP2 wouldn't get an armour save anyway so why mention it?

That is wrong, the rules VERY clearly state that you get your fnp save against everything that IS NOT something that is IDing you, or something that is AP1 or AP2. For the purpose of fnp, all power weapons are AP 1. So, the answer is no, the powered armored troops WOULD GET A FNP SAVE. Otherwise, a painboy would be useless for orks.

I see, cheers.

Ok, now i'm hella confused.

As Config2 said. Instant death, AP1 and AP2 weapons and power weapons negate Feel no pain.

Reading the rules again I don't understand what you're saying. I read them as thus:

This ability cannot be used against wounds from weapons that inflict instant death (by having a high enough Strength or a special rule to that effect; even if the model is an eternal warrior). Neither can it be used against wounds from AP1 and AP2 weapons, power weapons and any other wound aginst which no armour save can ever be taken (like wounds from power fists, Dreadnought close combat weapons, rending weapons that roll a 6, Perils of the Warp, failed dangerous terrain tests, etc).

At the part which says, 'against which no armour save can be taken', says to me that if you cannot take your normal armour save, you therefore cannot take your FnP save. No?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is referring to if you are to be hit with an AP3 weapon, it takes away your normal armour save of power armour, and therefore your feel no pain save.

JaydeeV2 wrote:Reading the rules again I don't understand what you're saying. I read them as thus:

This ability cannoy be used against wounds from weapons that inflict instant death (by having a high enough Strength or a special rule to that effect; even if the model is an eternal warrior). Neither can it be used against wounds from AP1 and AP2 weapons, power weapons and any other wound aginst which no armour save can ever be taken (like wounds from power fists, Dreadnought close combat weapons, rending weapons that roll a 6, Perils of the Warp, failed dangerous terrain tests, etc).

At the part which says, 'against which no armour save can be taken', says to me that if you cannot take your normal armour save, you therefore cannot take your FnP save. No?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is referring to if you are to be hit with an AP3 weapon, it takes away your normal armour save of power armour, and therefore your feel no pain save.

See the bold part of your own quote? "no armour save can ever be taken" that means weapons with special rules that NEVER allow armour saves and such stuff, not normal weapons with AP values (unless they are ap1/ap2)

1) AP1 or AP2 weapons
2) Instant Death
3) Power weapons, MC attacks, anything else which 'ignores armour saves'

These are the ONLY things which ignore FNP. Other AP values do nothing.

I can see your point now, thank you.

If you're confused refer to PG 75 of the BGB FnP

"
It gos to state you do not get FnP to weapons that inflict ID, AP1+AP2 Weapons, Power weapons and any other wounds which no armour save can ever be taken"

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:If you're confused refer to PG 75 of the BGB FnP

"
It gos to state you do not get FnP to weapons that inflict ID, AP1+AP2 Weapons, Power weapons and any other wounds which no armour save can ever be taken"

That's the part that was causing the confusion...

This is one of the most frequently misunderstood rules in the current edition. Hopefully they'll tighten up the wording a little next time around.

insaniak wrote:This is one of the most frequently misunderstood rules in the current edition. Hopefully they'll tighten up the wording a little next time around.

Well that makes me feel a a little better after looking like an idiot being totally in the wrong .

Yeah, you're a looong way from being the first to run afoul of that one.

Basically If it is not Str double Toughness, and a terminator would get to use his 2+ armor save against the wound, then you can use your Feel No Pain against the wound.

Huh, how time flies.

::winds watch::

I agree with everything above in regards to no FNP on ap1,ap2, Power weapons. however lets suppose a nob(T4) gets hit with power fist str8, yet he has a cyborked body. he gets an invuln save correct or wrong? And if he gets invuln save, does that trigger the FNP-since a save was taken?

No, FNP is ignored if you would not normally be able to take an armor save. The power fist ignores your armor save (nothing to do with the fact that it will ID you) so it ignores your armor. Invul saves are not armor saves.

Grots R OP wrote:I agree with everything above in regards to no FNP on ap1,ap2, Power weapons. however lets suppose a nob(T4) gets hit with power fist str8, yet he has a cyborked body. he gets an invuln save correct or wrong? And if he gets invuln save, does that trigger the FNP-since a save was taken?

No, he does not get FNP just because he has an Invulnerable save.

Thanks for replies have a few more points to clear up (noob stuff)

OK so is it "the str8 which is 2XT4 ignores armor, which then allows for no armor save which then leads to ID (no armor save can be taken beacause power weapon just cuts right though armor and explodes your organs and your chest disintegrates).

Or is the following statement more correct?

Str8 which is 2 X T4 causes instant death, no armor save can be taken (power fist smahes your armor, you, and the tree next to you).

In either case would I get invuln save from cybork?

Neither. The armor-save-ignore has absolutely nothing to do with the ID.

The power fist, which is a power weapon, ignores your armor save (and hence FNP). If the weapon wounds, and you fail your invul save, the double strength weapon IDs you instead of causing a wound.

The powerfist's strength is 2 x the user's strength. A powerfist also doesn't allow for armor saves. In your example the nobs toughness of 4 and a SM using a fist will be double toughness, while a guardsmen will not. In either case you do not get FNP because the PF does not allow for amror. Very few weapons ignore invul saves. A powerfist is not one of those. In either of your examples you get the save from the cybork.

Edit... dang ninja

OK so if:

instead I was T5 and not T4 and the power fist at STR8 hits me,

then I get no armor save,

but I get invulnerable save on the wound if I have it,

but I wouldn't be ID'd because of T5 I would just suffer 1 wound(such as a warboss or T5 type character with multiple wounds and higher toughness).

Grots R OP wrote:OK so if:

instead I was T5 and not T4 and the power fist at STR8 hits me,

then I get no armor save,

but I get invulnerable save on the wound if I have it,

but I wouldn't be ID'd because of T5 I would just suffer 1 wound(such as a warboss or T5 type character with multiple wounds and higher toughness).

Correct. And, you wouldn't get FNP as power fists ignore armor.

Cool got it, thanks alot guys.

Config2 wrote:That is wrong, the rules VERY clearly state that you get your fnp save against everything that IS NOT something that is IDing you, or something that is AP1 or AP2. For the purpose of fnp, all power weapons are AP 1. So, the answer is no, the powered armored troops WOULD GET A FNP SAVE. Otherwise, a painboy would be useless for orks.

To true my friend

Ohh, I was confused as well. Cleared up now.

I always assumed since AP3 can cause ID on MEQ that it counted as a condition for no FNP, which now I know is incorrect. Just AP1/2, PW and 2xT Str weps (ID).

Artanis wrote:Ohh, I was confused as well. Cleared up now.

I always assumed since AP3 can cause ID on MEQ that it counted as a condition for no FNP, which now I know is incorrect. Just AP1/2, PW and 2xT Str weps (ID).

Or anything else that always ignores armor saves (Monstrous Creatures in CC, Perils of the Warp, Dangerous Terrain, etc)

AP3 can NEVER cause ID, because ID is based off S vs T, not armour saves.