Switch Theme:

Railgun test  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in ie
Implacable Black Templar Initiate







The Navy’s futuristic railgun is one step closer to becoming a reality.
Navy officials told FoxNews.com this week that the railgun, which relies on magnets rather than explosives to fire bullets at several times the speed of sound, had blasted through budget constraints that are leaving federal research programs in Washington at the drawing board.
“I think it is a great example of how our naval science and technology -- in these tough fiscal times -- can be responsive to the military’s emerging needs,” said Adm. Matthew Klunder, Chief of Naval Research for the Office of Naval Research (ONR), which has been developing the electromagnetic railgun since 2005.
He insisted that not only will the railgun fire projectiles faster and farther than any weapon now known to man, but “in these fiscal times of belt tightening … [it’s] a more cost-effective system.”
How so? For one, because the gun and the storage of its projectiles (which are not incendiary, and weigh about 40 pounds each -- smaller and less expensive than today’s missiles) ultimately will take up less space than traditional weapons systems.
In addition, rather than relying on chemical propellants like gunpowder, the railgun uses an electromagnetic pulse to create strong magnetic fields that propel the conductive bullet on a sliding metal sled and out of the barrel -- at 4,500 to 5,000 miles per hour and as far as 100 nautical miles away in about 5 minutes, with possible future expansion to 220 miles, according to ONR.
The Navy’s most advanced shipboard gun in operation today, the 5-inch,54-caliber lightweight gun, has a range of about 13 nautical miles, Klunder said. The Advanced Gun System (AGS), which is currently being developed for the Navy’s Zumwalt-class destroyer, is expected to have a range of nearly 60 nautical miles.
“We’re still talking about four times the range,” said Klunder, calling it “leap-ahead technology.”
“This is the stuff you saw in movies a couple of years ago -- cutting edge, taking out the Transformers -- and now it’s reality,” he added.
Well, almost.
On Feb. 26, ONR announced that it was getting ready to test the gun’s first prototype, built by private defense contractor BAE Systems, at the Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC) in Dahlgren, Va. Another prototype built by General Atomics is expected to arrive at Dahlgren in the coming weeks.
ONR began firing railgun slugs in its laboratories in 2008, but this is the first time the Navy has tested the gun from a launcher that resembles what the final weapon system will look like, Roger Ellis, the EM Railgun program officer, said in an interview.
It will also indicate what the weapon can do. According to ONR, BAE initiated its tests in February, firing at 20-megajoules and planning for a 32-megajoule test soon after. (A megajoule of energy is equivalent to a one-ton car traveling at 100 miles per hour.)
“We’ve made a lot of progress, to say the least,” Ellis said. “It’s a significant step beyond previous laboratory-based launchers. [The lab models] were nothing you could put on a Navy ship ... this is closer to the fit and form of what we could put on a ship someday.”
The clear advantage to a long-range gun, of course, is to provide cover for soldiers and Marines operating in coastal areas from a safe distance at sea, and for anti-missile/aircraft capabilities. The longer the range the technology offers, the more strategic it becomes, offering the Navy new abilities to hit other targets on water and land, ONR officials said.
But there are potential obstacles, too. So far, Congress has been supportive of the railgun program, though it barely survived a snag last June. In passing its version of the FY2012 defense authorization bill, the Senate Armed Services Committee eliminated funding for the project, citing technical challenges related “to the power required and the barrel of the gun having limited life.”
Though these concerns did not stop the program from getting funding, thanks to the railgun’s friends on Capitol Hill, they highlight a number of unresolved issues, not the least of which is how the barrel will withstand repeated, massive explosions -- and creating a projectile with a guidance system that will be able to endure the ensuing heat and velocity.
Ellis told reporters in a Feb. 28 press conference that Phase II of the program, which begins now, will concentrate on improving the barrel’s lifespan and developing the repetition rate -- how many times in a row the railgun can be fired successfully. The goal is 10 rounds per minute. That means having enough energy stored to fire it up to “pulsed power” that quickly, for multiple rounds.
The energy question is a big one, as experts have said the amount of electricity necessary to operate the railgun at 32 megajoules would require a ship that that can generate enough power, one that doesn’t yet exist. It may be the massive Zumwalt class DDG-1000 destroyer, which is now being designed as a multi-mission ship at a price tag of $3.3 billion per ship.
Ellis said ONR is working on a battery system that would mitigate the problem by storing up energy much like the batteries used in hybrid vehicles, allowing the Navy to position the guns on both “new and existing platforms” and still get the pulsed power necessary to operate at optimum levels.
Phase II is expected to end in 2017, at which time the railgun, if complete, would go into a funding and acquisition phase that will take the project to full deployment on Navy ships by 2025, though there are hopes for a slightly shorter timeline, Ellis said.
So far, the railgun has cost taxpayers $240 million in research and design costs, according to ONR. Ellis said the project has been “adequately funded” for Phase II and should come in at a similar price tag.
“(Congress) did ask for a better understanding of the future of the railgun, and we are comfortable that the information we have provided will help them understand the benefits of the program,” Klunder said. "The prototype railgun is now functioning and successful and we hope this helps to increase overall confidence in the significance of the program"


Sorry for the wall of text.

So could the up grade and development of newer tech , be the way forward for a more cost effective armed forces?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/02/29 14:51:57


Eventus facti excusat - The outcome justifies the deed
 
   
Made in gb
Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander





Ramsden Heath, Essex

Railguns are supposed to be on floating tanks, not ships. Durrrr!

How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website " 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

Did they get it to stop destroying itself every time it was fired?

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in gb
Bane Knight




Inverness, Scotland.

A return to heavily armored big-gun warships would be very interesting; I envisage a cross between a WWII era BB and the Russian Kirov class missile ship.
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

RossDas wrote:A return to heavily armored big-gun warships would be very interesting; I envisage a cross between a WWII era BB and the Russian Kirov class missile ship.


That would require that someone else have them.

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






On a boat, Trying not to die.



Every Normal Man Must Be Tempted At Times To Spit On His Hands, Hoist That Black Flag, And Begin Slitting Throats. 
   
Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

inquisitive inquistor wrote:So could the up grade and development of newer tech , be the way forward for a more cost effective armed forces?


No, and in my opinion, this program should be cut for now. We stopped making battleships for a reason.

I'd fund development until they were small enough to put on destroyers.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.

 Flinty wrote:
The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
 
   
Made in ie
Implacable Black Templar Initiate







Ouze wrote:
No, and in my opinion, this program should be cut for now. We stopped making battleships for a reason.

I'd fund development until they were small enough to put on destroyers.


I see your point, but development can only do so far before full size testing becomes a must.
I'm not saying it should be put into mass production and usher in a new era of big gun warships but a limited trial run (to me it looks like it could be fitted on a destroyer) to see the potential for
large scale/further deployment or if it should be shelved.

Eventus facti excusat - The outcome justifies the deed
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Burtucky, Michigan

Or tanks or some type of artillery platform. But I agree, we got rid of battleships because our Airforce was and is far superior to a battle ship.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So wait a second......we are going to become the Tau? Not Space Marines?......thats saddening

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/02/29 18:52:07


 
   
Made in se
Ferocious Black Templar Castellan






Sweden

KingCracker wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
So wait a second......we are going to become the Tau? Not Space Marines?......thats saddening


Battle-Barges have railguns, the Nova Cannon is basically a giant railgun. Don't worry, everything's going according to plan.

For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back. 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

KingCracker wrote:Or tanks or some type of artillery platform. But I agree, we got rid of battleships because our Airforce was and is far superior to a battle ship.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So wait a second......we are going to become the Tau? Not Space Marines?......thats saddening


At least we're not the IG anymore.

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in us
Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau




USA

The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.

   
Made in us
Master Tormentor





St. Louis

From the article, looks like they still haven't solved the issue of the rails fusing after every second shot. Haven't figured out how to pack a payload or guidance package into the shell either, which is important as big blocks of metal went out of style for naval combat a century ago. From the sound of it, it's still just a money pit.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Burtucky, Michigan

In all seriousness, I hope they keep on running with Railguns. They have tons of potential
   
Made in gb
Bane Knight




Inverness, Scotland.

LordofHats wrote:The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.


Presumably a railgun shot would also be much much harder to shoot out of the sky than a missile - if even possible at all?
   
Made in us
Master Tormentor





St. Louis

RossDas wrote:
LordofHats wrote:The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.


Presumably a railgun shot would also be much much harder to shoot out of the sky than a missile - if even possible at all?

Not really. It moves about as quickly as modern missiles, and doesn't dodge. If anything, it's easier for a point defense system to knock out of the air.
   
Made in gb
Bane Knight




Inverness, Scotland.

Laughing Man wrote:
RossDas wrote:
LordofHats wrote:The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.


Presumably a railgun shot would also be much much harder to shoot out of the sky than a missile - if even possible at all?

Not really. It moves about as quickly as modern missiles, and doesn't dodge. If anything, it's easier for a point defense system to knock out of the air.


Ah, that's interesting - and raises the question of how detectable is an airborne railgun round to a point defense system, compared to a self-propelled missile?
   
Made in gb
Renegade Inquisitor de Marche






Elephant Graveyard

RossDas wrote:
Laughing Man wrote:
RossDas wrote:
LordofHats wrote:The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.


Presumably a railgun shot would also be much much harder to shoot out of the sky than a missile - if even possible at all?

Not really. It moves about as quickly as modern missiles, and doesn't dodge. If anything, it's easier for a point defense system to knock out of the air.


Ah, that's interesting - and raises the question of how detectable is an airborne railgun round to a point defense system, compared to a self-propelled missile?

Probably the same...
If anything it'd be easier to make a missile less detectable... stealth coatings and such.
A railgun round is a large piece of metal... i mean... that's it...
Basically a cannonball shot out of a space cannon...

Dakka Bingo! By Ouze
"You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry. 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Burtucky, Michigan

I think it would depend on the type of anti missile we are talking about. One type is using spray and pray basically, where they use an auto guided gatling gun to shoot down missiles. Im pretty sure a solid lump of steel (or whatever they actually use) would be much harder to shoot out of the sky with your average bullet, regardless of how many you throw at it.
   
Made in gb
Renegade Inquisitor de Marche






Elephant Graveyard

Easier to detect, harder to shoot down...

Dakka Bingo! By Ouze
"You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry. 
   
Made in gb
Bane Knight




Inverness, Scotland.

Have the boys in the military given any hints as to these sort of performance questions, or is it all just too early in development for them to say?
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Burtucky, Michigan

I just want to see a fething heavy tank, WW2 German style heavy, with a big ass rail gun on it. Call me crazy, but thats what I want folks
   
Made in us
Master Tormentor





St. Louis

KingCracker wrote:I think it would depend on the type of anti missile we are talking about. One type is using spray and pray basically, where they use an auto guided gatling gun to shoot down missiles. Im pretty sure a solid lump of steel (or whatever they actually use) would be much harder to shoot out of the sky with your average bullet, regardless of how many you throw at it.

You don't have to shoot it out of the sky. You need to make it tumble, in which case it'll miss wildly. It gets even easier once they perfect the warhead and guidance systems for the shell, which is neccessary for them to actually do anything in the first place.

Probably the same...
If anything it'd be easier to make a missile less detectable... stealth coatings and such.
A railgun round is a large piece of metal... i mean... that's it...
Basically a cannonball shot out of a space cannon...

We already use ground-based Phalanx systems for shooting down mortar shells in Afganistan. The railgun they're testing fires shells far larger than anything insurgents can lob at us, and at far higher speeds, meaning they're much easier for a radar system to pick out from, say, a flock of seagulls.
   
Made in gb
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God






Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways

KingCracker wrote:I think it would depend on the type of anti missile we are talking about. One type is using spray and pray basically, where they use an auto guided gatling gun to shoot down missiles. Im pretty sure a solid lump of steel (or whatever they actually use) would be much harder to shoot out of the sky with your average bullet, regardless of how many you throw at it.


Missiles are packed with fuel and delicate electronics and explosives wrapped in a thin shell of metal. Railgun slugs are (at the moment) solid chunks of metal. Missiles are a lot easier to destroy with near hit than a railgun slug would be with a direct hit, I would imagine.

   
Made in gb
Renegade Inquisitor de Marche






Elephant Graveyard

KingCracker wrote:I just want to see a ferreting heavy tank, WW2 German style heavy, with a big ass rail gun on it. Call me crazy, but thats what I want folks

Edited by Purplefood...
I'd love to see it on a jeep...
Damn that would make me giggle...

Dakka Bingo! By Ouze
"You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry. 
   
Made in gb
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot





Southampton, Hampshire, England, British Isles, Europe, Earth, Sol, Sector 001

Against all those nay sayers of the railgun, read the wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railgun
"Railguns have long existed as experimental technology. However, in recent years, some are moving towards becoming feasible military technology. For example, in the late 2000s, the U.S. Navy tested a railgun that accelerates a 3.2 kg (7 pound) projectile to approximately 2.4 kilometres per second (5,400 mph).[2] They gave the project the Latin motto "Velocitas Eradico", which they translate as "Speed Destroys"."
Yeah lets se a missile do that kind of speed...Me thinks not

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/02/29 19:55:58


<--- Yes that is me
Take a look at my gallery, see some thing you like the vote
http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/gallery-search.jsp?dq=&paintjoblow=0&paintjobhigh=10&coolnesslow=0&coolnesshigh=10&auction=0&skip=90&ll=3&s=mb&sort1=8&sort2=0&u=26523
Bloodfever wrote: Ribon Fox, systematically making DakkaDakka members gay, 1 by 1.
 
   
Made in gb
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God






Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways

Laughing Man wrote:We already use ground-based Phalanx systems for shooting down mortar shells in Afganistan. The railgun they're testing fires shells far larger than anything insurgents can lob at us, and at far higher speeds, meaning they're much easier for a radar system to pick out from, say, a flock of seagulls.


Although railgun slugs are solid, are moving significantly faster and have more mass, thus more inertia, and thus are harder to destroy or deflect.

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Burtucky, Michigan

Thats how I was looking at it. The momentum alone, would make it incredibly hard to just, knock off course
   
Made in ie
Implacable Black Templar Initiate






I would say it is near impossible to shoot down as it is travelling at 4,500 to 5,000 miles per hour compared to a Tomahawk that only has a top speed of 550 mph.
Though we can see in the video that Chowderhead kindly put up that the slug needs refinement as it starts to tumble near the end of the film.

Eventus facti excusat - The outcome justifies the deed
 
   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

Laughing Man wrote:
RossDas wrote:
LordofHats wrote:The interest in railguns is not to bring back the age of the gunboat. The interest is monetary. The hope is that a Railgun will be able to supplement missiles as a means of striking targets at ranged at a drastically smaller cost (cause a slug of metal fired from a reusable platform will ultimately be cheaper than a 1 shot multi-million dollar smart bomb). Railguns have comparable range and lethality to missiles but will be much cheaper as a practical weapon allowing the navy to bring down costs without severely impacting combat capabilities.


Presumably a railgun shot would also be much much harder to shoot out of the sky than a missile - if even possible at all?

Not really. It moves about as quickly as modern missiles, and doesn't dodge. If anything, it's easier for a point defense system to knock out of the air.


A railgun round moves at a significantly higher velocity than a cruise missile. It would have to if it wanted to do any damage at all. The speeds of the rounds from this weapon were published last time they released a video and they were not missile speeds. If I remember right the round traveled at about 5,500 miles per hour.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/02/29 20:25:26


----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
 
Forum Index » Off-Topic Forum
Go to: