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So I know someone that wants to get into the game but they don't have allot to spend. Without use of E-bay / discount stores what kind of semi-competitive army can they make for the least cost? And what would that cost be? 1999pts - 2000pts I will let them use my paint and supplies so don't worry about that.

Grey knights, also dark angels. Anything terminator heavy.
There are other armies that are also kind of cheap, but anything terminator based is cheap AND competative.

Testify wrote:Grey knights, also dark angels. Anything terminator heavy.
There are other armies that are also kind of cheap, but anything terminator based is cheap AND competative.

Chaos?

Grey Knights are quite competitive, and don't need too many models. They'd be a good bet.

Most flavours of Space Marines are fairly low cost, as they don't need a large force to be competitive.

Ensign_Kirk wrote:

Testify wrote:Grey knights, also dark angels. Anything terminator heavy.
There are other armies that are also kind of cheap, but anything terminator based is cheap AND competative.

Chaos?

Cheaper than most but noticibly more expensive than termie builds.
If you're thinking of going chaos, they have a new codex coming out in a couple of months so I'd hold off.

I know you said no eBay, but swap shop might be a better plan. Also, if you don't have disposable income this is the wrong game for you.

Grey Knights are the Lowest cost $ wise

Daemons are a close second if built the rite way.

Also some BA builds can run about 200-250$



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pretre wrote:I know you said no eBay, but swap shop might be a better plan. Also, if you don't have disposable income this is the wrong game for you.

Not true.... If your willing to add to your army over time it's not as expensive as one would think compared to other hobbies.

Buying 2K to start is a big up front investment and it makes me mad that a lot of game clubs require it as a starting point for new players.

I would tell your friend to start with about 1,000 points to get a hold of the game if he/she is truly interested then add 500 and so on.

Let your friend know this game is an Investment and just like any investment you should never just jump in as cheap as you can. Have them look over the armies and build the army of their choice VS whats the cheapest. Also encourage them to build it over time buy a piece a week or something instead of buying in bulk.

What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Testify wrote:
I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

I've bought entire armies off The Warstore for 20% off, both in person with them at Historicon and online. Been shopping there for years. I don't know much about UK stores, but I've always saved 20% off there. I'll agree you can get stuff cheaper on eBay though, you just have to work for it more usually, either before or after you get the models in question.

Honestly if your trying to get a friend involved ebay, swaping or discount stores are your best buddy.

The only reason to pay full upfront cost+tax is to either support a FLGS (excellent and only reason that makes sense) or to dump it at GW's website or hobby center (not an intelligent move).

You can even use discount dealers to slowly build up a list, or simply have him save his money for a few weeks/months and hes set.

To specifically answer his question the cheapest army is GK paladins lead by Draigo. You can make a competitive army that is going to wreck faces in 6ed for less that $200 tax and all full retail.

If your paying full ride with no discount $300-$400 is the lowest range where you can reliably make any army at the 2k level. Though IG will probably be base $500-$600 minimum.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brother SRM wrote:

Testify wrote:
I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

I've bought entire armies off The Warstore for 20% off, both in person with them at Historicon and online. Been shopping there for years. I don't know much about UK stores, but I've always saved 20% off there. I'll agree you can get stuff cheaper on eBay though, you just have to work for it more usually, either before or after you get the models in question.

I will also plug Warstore as well. You can usually sweet talk free shipping out of them as well, especially after a large enough order. Many ebay stores can also be directly contacted for savings.

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

You haven't tried looking hard enough.



If I need something a box at a time, I try to get it from a LGS, but when I'm doing $100+ at a time I go online.

adamsouza wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

You haven't tried looking hard enough.



If I need something a box at a time, I try to get it from a LGS, but when I'm doing $100+ at a time I go online.

Yeah...I'm not from the USA

Testify wrote:
Yeah...I'm not from the USA

Well can help you unless your American

He said never saw savings above 5%. Country of origin wasn't mentioned.

adamsouza wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

You haven't tried looking hard enough.



If I need something a box at a time, I try to get it from a LGS, but when I'm doing $100+ at a time I go online.

Wow that is awesome. Ya so after deliberating we picked Necrons because they are relatively easy to paint. 2 starter sets - 2 C'tan - 1 Monolith - A command Barge - and 1 or 2 more HQ and boom we got it.

I think without discounts that's about 375 -25% we're at 280$. I also had 2 boxes of basic Necron Troops already too. And they are cheese.

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Seriously? Where are you looking or not looking as the case may be?

Seriously look on total wargamer currently they have a huge 25% off sale. I just bought a load of ravenwing for next to nothing.

try triple helix wargames as well again a good discount

Motograter wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Seriously? Where are you looking or not looking as the case may be?

Seriously look on total wargamer currently they have a huge 25% off sale. I just bought a load of ravenwing for next to nothing.

try triple helix wargames as well again a good discount

Wow they have a load of stuff I don't need, that's amazing.
I'm sure my Tzeentch army would appreciate those bloodletters

Where are you looking and what for. Both stores have all the daemons range as well as the chaos marine range......

Oh no! No arguing about cheap stores, swap shops. craigs list, or back alley trading. That's why I mentioned it in the first post. If there is a deal we will find it. We just google with froogle =).

In one search

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&tbm=shop&q=necron+battleforce&oq=necron+battle&gs_l=products-cc.1.0.0j0i5.5447.12392.0.14881.13.12.0.1.1.0.105.717.11j1.12.0...0.0...1ac.leIHuHyBxFU

Still that 25% is nifty and am going to call them come monday. I may even pick something up for me self.

Anything Space Marine.

lazarian wrote:
The only reason to pay full upfront cost+tax is [. . .] to dump it at GW's website or hobby center (not an intelligent move).

Sorry, but I just had to log in to reply to this.

I've been seeing a lot of comments like this, and it's really starting to tick me off. Having my intelligence insulted because I choose to shop directly from GW.

Yes, I know I can get it cheaper on the Internet. I don't care. I choose to shop at GW because I've never had a problem there. The staff are nice and helpful, it's close enough to not be inconvenient, they have a good selection, the store is rarely, if ever, crowded, and I don't have to deal with weird and random shipping costs.

My non-GW local store has a "No returns or exchanges" policy, which seriously makes me wonder how they'd respond if I were to discover an issue with miniatures I buy there. While my dad has informed me that provincial law is on the side of the customer for messed up products, I prefer dealing with GW, where I know for an absolute fact that if there's an issue with a product I buy there, they will take a relevant product down from the shelf, open it, and either hand me the sprue or part that was missing or hand me the whole box, depending on what was missing. I don't like arguing with people in real life or raising a stink, even if I'm right.

The staff are always happy to help me find something I'm looking for. And because I don't normally go into GW just to browse and look around, it works. If I just wanted to look for something I might want to buy, I'd probably just sit at home and look at their website. I go to the store because I want to buy something.

Their selection is vastly improved over my local non-GW store, which has a small wall section dedicated to WH40k stuff and that's it. Also, I ran into a nasty surprise last time I went in there looking for a Devastator boxed set. I was looking for the new one with the huge variety of plastic weapons, but the one my non-GW store stocked was the old one, with only 4 heavy weapons, all metal. I nearly burst into tears when I realized it after opening the box at home, and now I don't shop there.

The local non-GW store is usually empty of people, but it's cramped as hell. Its other location has gaming tables, but last time I was there, they were more crowded than a clown car at the circus. Gave me anxiety just seeing it and imagining trying to play a game there. My local GW normally has about 2-5 people in it most of the time I go there, including staff members, but it's a lot more open than the local store. I like that it's uncrowded, because crowds are completely unpleasant for me - to the point where I do not even try to take advantage of Boxing Day sales, or shop at any point in the month and a half prior to Christmas.

Ordering stuff from GW is also better for my anxiety, because I don't have to deal with customs duties or anything like that - GW takes care of it all. Every 3rd party dealer I see online has the same disclaimer about how random customs duties are, and I just don't like worrying about that. Same with shipping costs; I don't have to worry about a bulky load from GW, because anything that big tends to come with free shipping anyways, or I could just have it shipped to the store that's 20 minutes away by car.

So yeah, please stop calling me a gak-brained moron for preferring to buy from GW directly.

Testify wrote:

Motograter wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Seriously? Where are you looking or not looking as the case may be?

Seriously look on total wargamer currently they have a huge 25% off sale. I just bought a load of ravenwing for next to nothing.

try triple helix wargames as well again a good discount

Wow they have a load of stuff I don't need, that's amazing.
I'm sure my Tzeentch army would appreciate those bloodletters

Ehm, Wayland Games got 20% off UK retail. Usually ship fast, often even got free shipping (even now until the 28th).

Seriously, you simply lied and have never looked for a store because there are a lot out there...

Also: +5 kudos for the post above.

We all know that GW products come at a huge extra price, but I still buy from them directly at our local GW. The guy who runs the store is friendly, he hosts a lot of special events including tournaments, always offers help considering painting, playing, etc. and when asked for a reasonable addititon to your army, he really gives good advice and does not say stuff like "Yeah son, get 2 Monoliths, they are awesome!" ($$$).

Not to mention that you get awesome looking tables to play on.

Sure, I'd have spent a good amount of money considering everything I bought, but then again, I only buy ~1-2 boxes / month anyway and with the average discount of 20% from online retailers, I'd save about 10-15€...which translates to 1 working hour. And if your local store isn't worth spending 20€ max on, you'd really ask yourself why you think so...

BA can do a decently cheap army, it won't have much variety though.

Dante + Sanguinary Guard as troops is low $$ cost, heavy point cost and you have great mobility, a 2+ save and a mix of power weapons. Throw a few jump pack sanguinary priest converted from Sang Guard for the FNP. You could then add in a couple of AoBR Dreads as Mech/Anti Vehicle, I picked some up for $12 each.

Then you have a decently competitive army for 6th ed.

Testify wrote:

adamsouza wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

You haven't tried looking hard enough.



If I need something a box at a time, I try to get it from a LGS, but when I'm doing $100+ at a time I go online.

Yeah...I'm not from the USA

http://www.waylandgames.co.uk/

http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/

I was under the impression that we couldn't buy games workshop product from independent retailers online anymore. Only from GW themselves. I use the war store as well. Is this no longer the case?

wowsmash wrote:I was under the impression that we couldn't buy games workshop product from independent retailers online anymore. Only from GW themselves. I use the war store as well. Is this no longer the case?

Independent online retailers from across different countries.
i.e., I used to order from Maelstrom Games all the time, since I could buy GW products at UK pricing, plus Maelstrom's usual discounts. I saved something like 40% off retail here in Australia. Now since the embargo, that option has been barred to me, though Im still able to get 20-ish% discounts from online retailers based in Australia.

Sigvatr wrote:

Testify wrote:

Motograter wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Seriously? Where are you looking or not looking as the case may be?

Seriously look on total wargamer currently they have a huge 25% off sale. I just bought a load of ravenwing for next to nothing.

try triple helix wargames as well again a good discount

Wow they have a load of stuff I don't need, that's amazing.
I'm sure my Tzeentch army would appreciate those bloodletters

Ehm, Wayland Games got 20% off UK retail. Usually ship fast, often even got free shipping (even now until the 28th).

Seriously, you simply lied and have never looked for a store because there are a lot out there...

Also: +5 kudos for the post above.

We all know that GW products come at a huge extra price, but I still buy from them directly at our local GW. The guy who runs the store is friendly, he hosts a lot of special events including tournaments, always offers help considering painting, playing, etc. and when asked for a reasonable addititon to your army, he really gives good advice and does not say stuff like "Yeah son, get 2 Monoliths, they are awesome!" ($$$).

Not to mention that you get awesome looking tables to play on.

Sure, I'd have spent a good amount of money considering everything I bought, but then again, I only buy ~1-2 boxes / month anyway and with the average discount of 20% from online retailers, I'd save about 10-15€...which translates to 1 working hour. And if your local store isn't worth spending 20€ max on, you'd really ask yourself why you think so...

I agree i know I pay a bit more at the GW store than I have to. But we have a great environment people i want to hang out with, hobbying areas and gaming tables why would i not want to go there.

captain collius wrote:

Sigvatr wrote:

Testify wrote:

Motograter wrote:

Testify wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:What's wrong with discount stores? There are a number of very reputable online retailers who sell for 20% off, and aren't shady by any stretch.

I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

Seriously? Where are you looking or not looking as the case may be?

Seriously look on total wargamer currently they have a huge 25% off sale. I just bought a load of ravenwing for next to nothing.

try triple helix wargames as well again a good discount

Wow they have a load of stuff I don't need, that's amazing.
I'm sure my Tzeentch army would appreciate those bloodletters

Ehm, Wayland Games got 20% off UK retail. Usually ship fast, often even got free shipping (even now until the 28th).

Seriously, you simply lied and have never looked for a store because there are a lot out there...

Also: +5 kudos for the post above.

We all know that GW products come at a huge extra price, but I still buy from them directly at our local GW. The guy who runs the store is friendly, he hosts a lot of special events including tournaments, always offers help considering painting, playing, etc. and when asked for a reasonable addititon to your army, he really gives good advice and does not say stuff like "Yeah son, get 2 Monoliths, they are awesome!" ($$$).

Not to mention that you get awesome looking tables to play on.

Sure, I'd have spent a good amount of money considering everything I bought, but then again, I only buy ~1-2 boxes / month anyway and with the average discount of 20% from online retailers, I'd save about 10-15€...which translates to 1 working hour. And if your local store isn't worth spending 20€ max on, you'd really ask yourself why you think so...

I agree i know I pay a bit more at the GW store than I have to. But we have a great environment people i want to hang out with, hobbying areas and gaming tables why would i not want to go there.

I agree with you guys GW has a great staff all around!!! However I do like to support the places that I play. If you ever have a problem with a model from a LFGS call GW they will either replace it or send you whats missing at no cost to you!!!

Testify wrote:Grey knights, also dark angels. Anything terminator heavy.
There are other armies that are also kind of cheap, but anything terminator based is cheap AND competative.

This^

I started Grey Knights because I could start off cheap. Draigo and Paladins are a good start. Not to mention under 6th they're not too cheesy anymore. Order from an online store for a discount as well. Draigo and ten paladins will be about half the army at about 1000pts.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brother SRM wrote:

Testify wrote:
I've seen people always say things like that, but it's usually bs. I've never seen savings of more than 5%, and then it's on a VERY limitted range.
Ebay is a little better, popular things like tac squads, imperial guard squads/tanks are pretty cheap. But less popular armies are much more hit and miss.

I've bought entire armies off The Warstore for 20% off, both in person with them at Historicon and online. Been shopping there for years. I don't know much about UK stores, but I've always saved 20% off there. I'll agree you can get stuff cheaper on eBay though, you just have to work for it more usually, either before or after you get the models in question.

Total Wargamer, Dark Sphere and Wayland Games do some good discounts in the UK about 20-25%. Just bought some GK stuff from Wayland and I'm waiting on it arriving. Also not to mention they have a discount code at the moment for free shipping if that interests anyone.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Testify wrote:Yeah...I'm not from the USA

Well look at my post above for a good treat

Enjoy your shopping.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Pouncey wrote:

lazarian wrote:
The only reason to pay full upfront cost+tax is [. . .] to dump it at GW's website or hobby center (not an intelligent move).

Sorry, but I just had to log in to reply to this.

I've been seeing a lot of comments like this, and it's really starting to tick me off. Having my intelligence insulted because I choose to shop directly from GW.

Yes, I know I can get it cheaper on the Internet. I don't care. I choose to shop at GW because I've never had a problem there. The staff are nice and helpful, it's close enough to not be inconvenient, they have a good selection, the store is rarely, if ever, crowded, and I don't have to deal with weird and random shipping costs.

My non-GW local store has a "No returns or exchanges" policy, which seriously makes me wonder how they'd respond if I were to discover an issue with miniatures I buy there. While my dad has informed me that provincial law is on the side of the customer for messed up products, I prefer dealing with GW, where I know for an absolute fact that if there's an issue with a product I buy there, they will take a relevant product down from the shelf, open it, and either hand me the sprue or part that was missing or hand me the whole box, depending on what was missing. I don't like arguing with people in real life or raising a stink, even if I'm right.

The staff are always happy to help me find something I'm looking for. And because I don't normally go into GW just to browse and look around, it works. If I just wanted to look for something I might want to buy, I'd probably just sit at home and look at their website. I go to the store because I want to buy something.

Their selection is vastly improved over my local non-GW store, which has a small wall section dedicated to WH40k stuff and that's it. Also, I ran into a nasty surprise last time I went in there looking for a Devastator boxed set. I was looking for the new one with the huge variety of plastic weapons, but the one my non-GW store stocked was the old one, with only 4 heavy weapons, all metal. I nearly burst into tears when I realized it after opening the box at home, and now I don't shop there.

The local non-GW store is usually empty of people, but it's cramped as hell. Its other location has gaming tables, but last time I was there, they were more crowded than a clown car at the circus. Gave me anxiety just seeing it and imagining trying to play a game there. My local GW normally has about 2-5 people in it most of the time I go there, including staff members, but it's a lot more open than the local store. I like that it's uncrowded, because crowds are completely unpleasant for me - to the point where I do not even try to take advantage of Boxing Day sales, or shop at any point in the month and a half prior to Christmas.

Ordering stuff from GW is also better for my anxiety, because I don't have to deal with customs duties or anything like that - GW takes care of it all. Every 3rd party dealer I see online has the same disclaimer about how random customs duties are, and I just don't like worrying about that. Same with shipping costs; I don't have to worry about a bulky load from GW, because anything that big tends to come with free shipping anyways, or I could just have it shipped to the store that's 20 minutes away by car.

So yeah, please stop calling me a gak-brained moron for preferring to buy from GW directly.

Good post.

Also wanted to say that I buy some things from GW because I normally game within in the store. SO its only common custosy to buy some things from them sometimes. If I'm buying lots of stuff though, a big order, then I'll buy online because the discount racks up better that way.