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Anyone else notice that Dakka Dakka cycles through a few general topics, especially in the 40k section? I.e How do we like 6th Edition. How do we not like (any) edition? How will "lore" progression work/what will the races be doing in the future/what will they look like in x amount of time? How OP are the Grey Knights? The Grey Knights are this ---> (x) OP. Tyrannids suck. Matt Ward sucks for reasons x,y,z (z being GK's, and y being Draigo). Orks are awesome, GW is too flakking expensive, why is the Emperor such a pansy? Why are the Ultramarines such Mary Sues? What are Mary Sues? (no seriously what are they herp derp?) Why is it bad to be a Mary Sue? Is it actually bad to be a Mary Sue? Why do Space Marines suck? Why does everyone play SM's? Why does everyone care that everyone plays SM's when clearly not everyone does? Who are the Space Marines (seriously if you don't know that question you need to spend 5 mins here:http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Portal:Space_Marines#.UDAwm91lSjM. ) What happens when the Emperor dies? Failabaddon is fail, isn't he?

Why don't novels take a more alien approach? Where's the love for the Eldar, the Ork, the heretic, the mutant? Why isn't there a playable Mechanicus army?

Will any of these topics and more reach a definitive resolution? If they do, can we at least pin them so we don't have roughly 70 pages of the nearly the same questions in the background section? Don't get me wrong, I love when Dakka Dakka explores the realm of difficult questions, I believe that's a major reason why this forum is interesting, but what is more interesting are diverse and creative takes on topics people rarely, if ever, discuss. If you have an idea, a comment, or suggestion for something new to break the cycle, I completely support you.

Thoughts? Perhaps the cycle can be broken here? Maybe contained?

I for one disagree that Orks are awesome I shall break the circle and make a thread about it.

But but but... Orks ARE awesome!!!

Go my children of strife, wreck havoc upon the sleeping flock that is Dakka Dakka.

dakka doesn't believe in stickies. It would be pretty easy to have sticky threads with the things that people keep on talking about, but it has been decided by someone that "your army's theme song" and "I hate Matt Ward" and "I hate GW's prices" need to have new threads made over and over again, rather than to just have single threads that people who didn't want to participate could just ignore without having to filter through them.

I don't know why, though. Perhaps ask a mod?

This is no different than in the non-internet life.

For example, let's say a national news station ran a story about a 3 year old that disappeared in the middle of the night. Everyone who heard about that story would express shock to their friends. There would be conversations on the child's upbringing (or lack thereof), questions about where the parents were, even speculation that the parent's were involved somehow, etc... duplicated in the hundreds of thousands, or potentially millions.

The difference being that the vast majority of those conversations wouldn't be recorded and stored on a medium accessible to the entire planet.

Heck, anyone that has worked in an industry that puts them in contact with large numbers of people can tell you that there are a set of recurring themes to conversations they have... to the point of knowing exactly what someone they've never met before will say before they even open their mouths.

Of course, even though our dakka conversations are recorded locating the nuggets you are interested in is a very time consuming process. And even if you do put the time in, there is a huge backlash against "resurrecting" old threads for no other reason than the date of the last posting in that thread.

So, we have three problems. First, locating previous discussions is hard: search still sucks monkey balls and is probably the wrong way of doing it anyway. Second, even if you do locate something of interest you can't contribute to that old discussion without retribution. Now combine that with the third problem where new people are constantly coming in and have no idea what the recurring topics are but have the exact same questions...

As much as people like to think they are different than everyone else, our minds still work remarkably similar and will lead most people to ask the same questions or make the same statements given similar starting points.

One way to stop this is for site owners to focus and steer the conversation, much like how news agencies work in selecting the news they are willing to publish. For example, the belloflostsouls.net combines articles with forums. An author posts a topic and people discuss. Sometimes the author is a moron and people call them out. Sometimes the article is pretty good and inspires further discussion. Regardless, rehashing is at a minimum and, when it occurs, is a direct consequence of the topic being presented.

Something to think about anyway. Then again, my 17 year says that I put too much thought into things. Maybe he's right; so how about a change of topic to something new: Why is it everyone hates Matt Ward anyway?

It's because most of those threads turn into a heated debate between two users before anything can get definitively resolved.

It's because a vast number of the topics created on Dakka are created by lazy users that have zero desire to use a search bar to answer their question/see Dakka's view on a particular subject, so instead they feel the need to create entirely new threads where the same users rehash the same repeatedly heart opinions over and over.

Sucks.

Yep, and it happens more or less the same all the time.

[whatever] vs [whatever]
[army] is op
What army should I play next
[panic about new codex/rule book release]
[thread about hating the codex/rule book release]
[counter thread against the haters]

Just have to get used to it and after a while you can tell how the thread will go by the title. Somewhat ironically this thread is also in that same rotation.

to be fair, though, the "what army should I play?" threads usually have different people with different inputs looking for different things.

It's the pointlessly open-ended questions that repeat over and over again that bother me. A 40k humor thread? Great, now everybody can re-link to the exact same stuff they linked to last time...

I don't mind them if they've at least got a little bit of an idea so you have somewhere to start off from. Saying stuff like they want a small elite force, a horde, a melee army, shooty or just fast. But, the ones that are just "which army should I play next" then offer no more input are a little dull.

I think I may ask a mod to pin popular threads to give focus to things that are discussed repeatedly. I think most if not all of you are right when we say that the internet is fairly lazy (not to mention incompetent considering how easy it would make people's lives if things were pinned -alphabetically preferably.)

Stickies are barely read on any forum, nevermind Dakka. The 'Tenets of You Make Da Call' sticky in the 40k YMDC has had 6769 registered views. Since views are not 1 per person (tested myself whilst being impatient for replies a few times) any number of those could be the same person checking up on the tenets, but even if we assume that they are 6769 independent views, comparing that to the 62,055 registered users reveals that just over 10% of the registered users have bothered to look at it if we don't count any repeat visits to the thread by the same person.

Considering the traffic that YMDC recieves, that figure is terribly low, and far too low to expect people to read any new stickies that are put up. On other forums I've frequented, even stickies with bold text and flashing icons failed to lure people in. In the Dakka's minecraft server thread, people are asked to read the FAQ for the server as soon as they are whitelisted, but it's clear from the amount of people who have been warned and/or banned from the server that a good amount are neglecting to read it.

It's the same with the search bar; that has been there for ages and serves almost exactly the same purpose as a sticky would: being a quick way of accessing what you're looking for, but the very fact that this thread has been posted shows that it is not utilised nearly enough.

If people cannot use what they currently have, what makes you think that they'd use something new (something that hasn't itself been shown to really impact on the issue) that provides the exact same function? Why would it not just be ignored like the rest of it?

Well, but it's possible to create a culture of sticky reading. If the 10 most popular recurring threads were stickied and mods shut down any new thread about them, people would eventually get the point.

WHO WOULD WIN: MAT WARD OR THE MOST OVERPOWERED CODEX IN 40k OR THE CHARACTER/RULE YOU HATE MOST AND HOW DO I STRIP PAINT OFF IT????

Yeah, I sure love seeing permutations of the above every other day. A lot of people can't be bothered to scroll down one page, and the folks who do that are the same types who start threads like that. To be fair the search function here isn't great, but there are so many things you could Google to get the result. I think Painting and Modeling should be renamed to "Simple Green Discussion Zone" because a dozen threads about how to strip minis come up every week.

 Ailaros wrote:
Well, but it's possible to create a culture of sticky reading. If the 10 most popular recurring threads were stickied and mods shut down any new thread about them, people would eventually get the point.

Would they? If you're new to the board, as most of the posters of these threads are, will you know about the culture of locking these threads before your own is locked? Not likely. It'll only be after you post and have it locked that you'll know where to go, but then that's exactly the same as posting and having your questions answered for you then and there; no time or effort has been saved at all.

There's also the fact that it would create a lot more work for the volunteers that mod these boards. Few enough people utilise the Report Post button, we don't need yet more threads that need reporting but won't be. It'd require mods to practically babysit the offending forums in order to enforce, and even then, as I said above, it won't have any effect on threads posted by new members who are not aware of the policy.

Just wait until a new novel/new codex comes out. Then we get fresh topics. Mostly people bitching about new fluff or how OP Chaos Spawns are now with their 2+ rerollable invuls and 15 wounds at t6, 13 wounds at t5 and 14 s10 armorbane attacks in cc for 17 points a model. Oh and they can be taken in squads of 47.

 Iur_tae_mont wrote:
Just wait until a new novel/new codex comes out. Then we get fresh topics. Mostly people bitching about new fluff or how OP Chaos Spawns are now with their 2+ rerollable invuls and 15 wounds at t6, 13 wounds at t5 and 14 s10 armorbane attacks in cc for 17 points a model. Oh and they can be taken in squads of 47.

They're not fresh topics, they're the same topics with different words subbed out. They're practically Mad Libs.

Yeah, but one day it'll be about how OP tau are and that day I'm going to gloat like it was on sale.

 Ailaros wrote:
Well, but it's possible to create a culture of sticky reading. If the 10 most popular recurring threads were stickied and mods shut down any new thread about them, people would eventually get the point.

The sticky at the top of the 40K General page explaining that rules questions go in YMDC instead of 40K general has been there since February 2010. I still move rules questios from 40K General to YMDC daily.

Have a look at the News and Rumours forum any time something particularly new and exciting happens... You'll see 3 threads all started within several hours of each other, and then another posted 3 days later... because people just jump on and post without taking the time to check if there is already a post on that subject.



We'll lock down anything that gets too repetitive, but beyond that there is no real reason for people to not start new threads when there is no current ongoing discussion about whatever they want to discuss. Yes, if you spend any extended time on the forum (or on any forum) you will see the same topics pop up again and again. You'll find the same thing happen at family get-togethers, or pretty much any large gathering of people, particularly when it's a gathering of people with similar interests that continually has new folk cycling through.

It's not a problem, just the way social interaction functions on a large scale.

Stabbing brain... searching to change paradigm....

 Brother SRM wrote:
WHO WOULD WIN: MAT WARD OR THE MOST OVERPOWERED CODEX IN 40k OR THE CHARACTER/RULE YOU HATE MOST AND HOW DO I STRIP PAINT OFF IT????

Yeah, I sure love seeing permutations of the above every other day. A lot of people can't be bothered to scroll down one page, and the folks who do that are the same types who start threads like that. To be fair the search function here isn't great, but there are so many things you could Google to get the result. I think Painting and Modeling should be renamed to "Simple Green Discussion Zone" because a dozen threads about how to strip minis come up every week.

You forgot the part where they then ask how to paint them white.

insaniak wrote:The sticky at the top of the 40K General page explaining that rules questions go in YMDC instead of 40K general has been there since February 2010. I still move rules questios from 40K General to YMDC daily.

Yes, but it's possible to create a culture, even if the culture currently doesn't exist.

insaniak wrote:there is no real reason for people to not start new threads when there is no current ongoing discussion about whatever they want to discuss.

Sure, there's no reason there HAS to be a change. It's just that how its set up currently is imperfect.

... and we're a community that really likes to tinker with things. A lot.

 Ailaros wrote:
Yes, but it's possible to create a culture, even if the culture currently doesn't exist.

Sure. But about the only way to do that is lock the forum to all new accounts, and start suspending people who don't read the stickies. Eventually we'll have a community of people who read stickies... and a very quiet forum.

No amount of us jumping up and down is going to stop the new guy from deciding that it is easier to start a new thread than to go looking for previous discussions on the same topic.

Sure, there's no reason there HAS to be a change. It's just that how its set up currently is imperfect.

The thing is, what you're seeing as a flaw, we see as an unavoidable side-effect of growth. More posters mean more discussion. Yes, that will also mean that the same topics come up more often... But why should that be a problem? If you're not interested in discussing the colour of the Emperor's left pinky toenail again, you just close the thread (or don't open it in the first place) and move on.

This perception that you have to 'wade through' all of the repetitive topics to get to something interesting is a little odd, to be honest. It's not like you have to fight your way through a swarm of spandex-clad gymnasts to get to the next topic... You just scroll down the page and select the threads that you're interested in checking out. And if you're not seeing enough interesting discussion, and feel that there should be more threads of a particular type... well, there's an easy solution to that...

I vote that we start making new players recite the forum rules and stickies, to the tune of "Don't Stop Believing" while balancing a pony on their forehead as a requirement for joining.

That will teach them to go and make duplicate topics!

Mwhahahahahaha.

insaniak wrote:This perception that you have to 'wade through' all of the repetitive topics to get to something interesting is a little odd, to be honest. It's not like you have to fight your way through a swarm of spandex-clad gymnasts to get to the next topic...

No, it's totally like that.



Seriously, though, it's just a nuisance. Not like an armed revolt, more like an inconvenience I think we'd all agree we'd be better off if we could find a solution.

I love this post.^

clively wrote:

Of course, even though our dakka conversations are recorded locating the nuggets you are interested in is a very time consuming process. And even if you do put the time in, there is a huge backlash against "resurrecting" old threads for no other reason than the date of the last posting in that thread.

So, we have three problems. First, locating previous discussions is hard: search still sucks monkey balls and is probably the wrong way of doing it anyway. Second, even if you do locate something of interest you can't contribute to that old discussion without retribution. Now combine that with the third problem where new people are constantly coming in and have no idea what the recurring topics are but have the exact same questions...

That is absolutely hate, and one of the things that I seriously hate about the community. It's really idiotic how much people post and complain when you resurrect an old discussion. One time when I did, I literally got at least five of the next posts all addressed at the fact that I had resurrected a discussion. There should seriously be a one week block for anyone who does that, because of how disruptive it is.

 Inquisitor Ehrenstein wrote:
It's really idiotic how much people post and complain when you resurrect an old discussion.

It really depends on the topic, and where it is on the forum.

Ressurecting old posts in News and Rumours, for example, generally serves very little purpose. While ressurecting, say, a modelling tutorial from a year ago can serve to bring it to more peoples' attention, and isn't something that really goes 'out of date'.

Conversations in other parts of the forums are generally allowed to lie once they have been dormant for a while, because people involved in the discussion will have moved on... Dredging it up and responding to someting that somebody said six months ago causes all sorts of confusion, and the previous discussion is often no longer relevant.

So as a general rule, outside of the P&M sections we tend to prefer people start a new thread rather than performing the dreaded Threadnomancy on threads more than a couple of weeks old.

Can't tell if Mod is trolling, being sarcastic, or trying to send a message....