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JW how many people actually like/enjoy this addition to the game?

I personally think its silly. IMHO*
I can understand the other additions, like random obj and mystery terrain, its just extra stuff to add if you need that lil extra or just want to use it for fun and most people can agree to use or not to use no biggi.

But the fortifications are legit options to your list anyone can take and dosnt make alot of sense in most cases.( for cinematic/fluff purposes )
Maybe if a specific mission allowed or included them, that could understandable, but now everyone just takes an aegis. =Lame

Because You know all those xenos races are callin up the Emperor and ordering X amount of aegis lines, etc for all there detachments(arguably they could steal them :/ )... = Lame
Even if they include Xenos style ones, still=Lame

Aegis will be a standard. While we are at it why not just bring our own terrain that benefits whatever race i decide to bring. Rant= Done


Whats your opinions?

There are plenty of ways to convert a Counts As imperial bastion or Aegis Defense Line or Skyshield or FoR.

Orks, just loot it.

Eldar, ADL can be modeled as a series of shield generators and a stationary gun platform. Bastion is a convenient Imperial building they placed a HB equivilent in.

Dark Eldar, as above.

Chaos, add spiky bits.

Nids. ADL can be modeled as a hardened growth. Or its simply somthing that happens to be in a convenient location. Bastion can be modeled as a capilary tower with some ranged weapons of the same statline as a HB. Same with a FoR.

Tau. Tau equivilents, similer to Eldar.



And I am almost 100% sure they will eventually release faction specific terrain pieces.

 Grey Templar wrote:
There are plenty of ways to convert a Counts As imperial bastion or Aegis Defense Line or Skyshield or FoR.

Orks, just loot it.

Eldar, ADL can be modeled as a series of shield generators and a stationary gun platform. Bastion is a convenient Imperial building they placed a HB equivilent in.

Dark Eldar, as above.

Chaos, add spiky bits.

Nids. ADL can be modeled as a hardened growth. Or its simply somthing that happens to be in a convenient location. Bastion can be modeled as a capilary tower with some ranged weapons of the same statline as a HB. Same with a FoR.

Tau. Tau equivilents, similer to Eldar.



And I am almost 100% sure they will eventually release faction specific terrain pieces.

And those are all great terrain ideas!!

As for it being apart of everyone's list and a legit part of the FOC. = lame

Why is it lame? Fortifications are an important part of warfare.

They should be Optional game additions at best.


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 Grey Templar wrote:
Why is it lame? Fortifications are an important part of warfare.

Your right!
That is what terrain is for!

So you think fortifications just randomly show up on a battlefield with no input from the participants?

 Grey Templar wrote:
So you think fortifications just randomly show up on a battlefield with no input from the participants?

That is called deployment... Or else you would always arrive from reserve....

What? That makes no sense at all.

It could easily be a mission type... Attack and defend, an you can buy aegis or a fortification with ur FOC.... That's a raw example, but that would take it away from being something everyone has in there list which is mostly what makes it lame

Given that you roll for mission and deployment AFTER you set up your list it wouldn't work.

Having them be a purchasable option is much more realistic and reasonable to impliment.

 Grey Templar wrote:
What? That makes no sense at all.

I understand what you were trying to say...

That could be shown like how a webway portal is used for example...


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 Grey Templar wrote:
Given that you roll for mission and deployment AFTER you set up your list it wouldn't work.

Having them be a purchasable option is much more realistic and reasonable to impliment.

Agreed. Then just a mission type that it's included.
Like fantasy and the tower mission or w.e. it's called. ( at work don't have my books )


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Or like I said before, optional game addition rather then how it is always allowed regardless...

Terrain should only be allowed to be taken by the defender, ie the one that has the time to set up defenses, not the guy showing up on the raid. =P

What about a case of trenchwarfare?

Or perhaps the fortifications on one side have been captured from the other player.


Remember, 40k is NOT to scale. a model that is 48" away could be several miles away. And one within 6" could simply be 50 meters away.

I just finished reading angel exterminatus and i'm inspired to replicate the fort made of rhino's, it'll die easy but be really thematic .

 Diezel wrote:
They should be Optional game additions at best.

The are Optional, pg 109 shows full FOC and says Fortifications (Optional)

Optional in the same way that a second HQ, 4 troops, Elites, Fast Attack, and HS are optional.

The OP's point is that every battle seems to turn into a pitched one due to both players feeling obligated to take such terrain. Now this is not always the case (at my club I haven't seen anyone using the terrain options), but I would imagine that in a GW shop people'd be doing it all the time just to get some edge on their opponents (yeah, I have a really low opinion of people that play there).

The OP has a point. I too am of the opinion that certain scenery piece being part of the FOC is silly. Something about it just seems... off, at this scale (it works in Epic Armageddon and FOW (maybe, do you buy fortifications in that, never played) due to the scale) but in 40k it just strikes me as odd. Maybe it's also as many see it as a blatant cash grab by GW if you wish to remain competitive.

Something just does not seem right to me to have such a thing in the standard game. To have it in something like Planetstrike or another expansion, fine. But in the standard game it simply does not gel in my mind.

 Grimtuff wrote:
The OP has a point. I too am of the opinion that certain scenery piece being part of the FOC is silly. Something about it just seems... off, at this scale (it works in Epic Armageddon and FOW (maybe, do you buy fortifications in that, never played) due to the scale) but in 40k it just strikes me as odd. Maybe it's also as many see it as a blatant cash grab by GW if you wish to remain competitive.

Something just does not seem right to me to have such a thing in the standard game. To have it in something like Planetstrike or another expansion, fine. But in the standard game it simply does not gel in my mind.

Thanks...

yes in standard games it's silly.
It is definatly a cash grab! GW clearly not selling enough terrain lol.

TFG's and power gamers or both lol Must love this as it is an additional topping to their cheese

I don't think FOC slots for terrain make much sense, since terrain can be used by both sides. FOC slots are better reserved for players to construct their armies using models they know they can control.

That said, you do spend points on fortifications, so there should be some rules around them. I say, if you want 10 Aegis Defense lines, take 'em.

I play IG as my main army and most the people i play against hate playing against Guard as is, let alone adding in a aegis! lol Or i can cheese out and take a Fortress of redemption or even a imperial Bastion and hide all my artillery behind it which is guaranteed blocked LOS first turn! (also would be great for DE) Thats just an example of why and how its silly. and im sure imperial bastions and the fortress are built on the battlefield in record time also right? lol 6th is a good edition, not perfect, but i could argue most of the new changes but this one i just cant find a solid argument for being included as a always available option to the FOC




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techsoldaten wrote:
I don't think FOC slots for terrain make much sense, since terrain can be used by both sides. FOC slots are better reserved for players to construct their armies using models they know they can control.

That said, you do spend points on fortifications, so there should be some rules around them. I say, if you want 10 Aegis Defense lines, take 'em.

Skyshield Landing pad, i believe is 75 points?
which gives ALL units on top 4+ inv save...

So for 75 points or 150( taking 2 with double FOC ) i can have my whole IG gun line get a 4+ inv save plus my artillery as well!

( Raw Example Here as i dont have my list but it should be legal )So one pad has 9 lascannon HWS with CCS also has a HW, giving orders, all getting 4+inv save, while other pad has 3 basilisks a manticore getting 4+ inv save as well. Dont forget its got a decent height so you should get LOS fairly E.Z.

Does that not seem just a little Silly lol

 Diezel wrote:
But the fortifications are legit options to your list anyone can take and dosnt make alot of sense in most cases.( for cinematic/fluff purposes )

Why doesn't it make sense from a fluff/cinematic point of view? You never heard of trench warfare?

Any time you play a game, there's two people creating their own 'background' for the force. If someone takes a fortification, they're obviously creating a background where their force is defending.

Now, sometimes players have to adjust their background for the battle. After all, your opponent isn't always going to have the exact same background you want him to! So sometimes your 'defending' force with a fortification is going to need to fight an urban battle over a defense complex, with some parts held by the enemy and some parts held by you. Sometimes you're going to have to engage in trench warfare with both forces deployed in defensive fortifications.

That's part of the charm of the game.

 Kaldor wrote:

 Diezel wrote:
But the fortifications are legit options to your list anyone can take and dosnt make alot of sense in most cases.( for cinematic/fluff purposes )

Why doesn't it make sense from a fluff/cinematic point of view? You never heard of trench warfare?

Any time you play a game, there's two people creating their own 'background' for the force. If someone takes a fortification, they're obviously creating a background where their force is defending.

Now, sometimes players have to adjust their background for the battle. After all, your opponent isn't always going to have the exact same background you want him to! So sometimes your 'defending' force with a fortification is going to need to fight an urban battle over a defense complex, with some parts held by the enemy and some parts held by you. Sometimes you're going to have to engage in trench warfare with both forces deployed in defensive fortifications.

That's part of the charm of the game.

That again is terrain.
You setup D3 per 2', you want trenches, put em in.

 Grimtuff wrote:
Maybe it's also as many see it as a blatant cash grab by GW if you wish to remain competitive.

This about sums up my thoughts on them. I don't mind them, but I do mind how, with the incorporation of fliers, they can be almost mandatory sometimes.

The only thing I like fortification wise is how you can put up gun emplacements with whatever guns are in the codices on them. 6 lasguns strapped together on a turret? You know everyone will completely bail on objectives to capture that beast of a doomsday weapon.

I'll use them in larger games, but probably not for the smaller ones. By this I mean in ones up to 2000pts I'll play the game like I would any other, but over that, when the big guns come out, I may take some Aegis for a heavy weapons platoon or the like. ...This is purely because this thread's just made me scratch build a set of Aegis on a whim for my chaos (plasticard and wire mesh are the bane of GW I suspect)-they're prefabricated looking, but more Tuchankan than Imperial...perfect. XD

That 4+ invuln on the Skyshield is ONLY ranged attacks. And you can take it over and benifit from it yourself.

I agree its undercosted, but its hardly game breaking.

 Diezel wrote:

That again is terrain.
You setup D3 per 2', you want trenches, put em in.

Yeah, it's terrain. But it's terrain that heavily advantages one side over the other. If your opponent doesn't want to deploy his own trenches or fortifications, you gain a significant advantage. Why should that be the case? If you want the advantages offered by a fortification, you should have to pay for it.

It makes perfect sense from any way you look at it, IMO. The only times it DOESN'T make sense is where, taking advantage of terrain placement, your opponent renders your fortification useless by placing large LOS blocking terrain right in front of it.

0.o People use that D3+2 for each table quarter thing? It always came across to me as not enough. Then again I like to just put everything on the box on the table and make a nice, cramped looking city.

 Wyrmalla wrote:
0.o People use that D3+2 for each table quarter thing? It always came across to me as not enough. Then again I like to just put everything on the box on the table and make a nice, cramped looking city.

Depends on the size of the terrain pieces. Most of my terrain is ruined buildings with a 12" x 8" foot print, or near enough. You'd be hard pressed to fit three in each quarter, let alone five. I never used the D3+2 myself, I just set up a table that looks cool and then my opponent and I roll for table sides.

What's wrong with fortifications? I admit they're a little short thematically, but a nice cuddly bastion or defense line is helpful for cover saves. It's a way to assure some cover saves for your gunline.