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Now, this is an interesting question I've found myself pondering as i read through battle reports, army lists, and play games.
Some people max out their HQ slots, and throw as many toys onto those HQ's as possible. I myself find i usually take only the mandatory 1 HQ, and keep him fairly bare-bones and low cost, so I can afford more units, and bodies on the field.
I understand some armies try and get as many psychic powers onto the field as possible, and tau need their buffmander which costs a pretty penny. But what side of the fence do you fall on? In a 2k game, do you find yourself spending 500 points on HQ's, or maybe 200? What army do you use? Toys before Boys? Or Boys Before Toys? What tactic do you need all those HQ's for? What do you buy with the savings if you dont shell out?

Just thinking out loud.

Imperial Guard here - What's a "hero"? My codex doesn't seem to have any. All I have is an HQ tax

Do you take a tooled out CCS in a chimera, all with plasma guns however? lol

Sure, but it'd be much better if I got the same thing with a Veteran squad, because they can score. So really it's just there because it has to be

I don't mind a tooled up hero for some lists, but usually I run them more bare bones.

I guess it really just depends on the army. When I play my guard I take 2 HQ's. A lord commisar and a company command squad. They cost me 130 points total. However when I do marines I usually have 2 big hitting HQ's. It most depends on the armies. I think the more elite armies need the bigger commander (marines, chaos, necrons for example). However armies that can get away with cheap hqs have a strength that they will pour all there points into. Orks into troops, Guard into Heavy support, Eldar into there aspects warrior etc. I think it really just depends on who you play and there style.

My two Flyrants are basically the lynchpin of my heavy reserves Nid list, and that's over 500 points right there, so I'm definitely in the HeroHammer category.

 ravengatorfan wrote:
I guess it really just depends on the army. When I play my guard I take 2 HQ's. A lord commisar and a company command squad. They cost me 130 points total. However when I do marines I usually have 2 big hitting HQ's. It most depends on the armies. I think the more elite armies need the bigger commander (marines, chaos, necrons for example). However armies that can get away with cheap hqs have a strength that they will pour all there points into. Orks into troops, Guard into Heavy support, Eldar into there aspects warrior etc. I think it really just depends on who you play and there style.

I pay probably 160 points total for my HQ for my crons, however, I admit my Space Marine Chapter Master Costs a pretty penny more, closer to 220

I mostly play Orks, and I usually have a mix. I have a Warboss completely kitted out, and a Big Mek with only the KFF. Those both costly a total of 225 points, the same as Ghazghkull! What costs me points is the Nob Biker retinue I put in with my BikerBoss! That costs me 500+ points, depending on how I kit them out!

Well, most armies have herohammer units, and support commanders for hordehammer. It all depends.

Heroes are usually just beasts in combat, although they may bring a slight army boost, usually by unlocking scoring units. A chaos lord on a bike is a beatstick, but the mark of nurgle he has unlocks plague marines.

Other HQ's are force multipliers, and their effectiveness depends on how many units they can buff. Imperial guard commanders fall into this category, so do farseers, dark eldar haemonculi, chaplians, priests etc.

Many choices will fall somewhere between the two, as they can be used to fight, but also benefit their unit/army. Overall, it comes down to the type of list you want to run. If you go beatstick you can build a lot of your list independent of the HQ. With a support choice, you need to make sure the HQ can provide maximum benefit and be a force multiplier, so the list often dictates the need for such a character.

I play IG, I usually take an Astropath with my CCS, and usually a Lascannon team, because they are usually behind the Aegis Line anyhow, and it would be a shame to waste BS4 by not taking some kind of long range weapon. Lascannon is perfect for that, especially when you can give yourself twin-linked shooting at vehicle or MC.

I also take a Commissar so my units can pass orders at Ld 10, and if I start taking heavy fire can stay in formation, thought I typically send him up with my conscripts to hold an objective. If I need them to stay there, they need that Ld buff.

What I take on the commissar depends on the points level, if its 2000 I usually take carapace armor and a plasma pistol. If its below that, just the carapace armor.

CSM are near required to have a kitted up HQ to work right.

Haven't played a Daemon list I enjoyed that didn't have a decked out superbeast flying around murdering everything.

I'm personally a fan of herohammer. Mind you I play daemons so Fateweaver is pretty much manadatory then 3 or 4 heralds majorly buff other squads so I can end up spending 1/3-1/2 of the points on HQs.

That said Tzeentch heralds TL + making horrors shooting Str6 makes them amazing for VoF even if he costs nearly as much as the unit. Similarly a Khorne Herald granting Rage/Hatred to flesh-hounds makes them much more powerful and grants them some ability to punch through armour saves.

For Eldar, I usually don't bother on HQ upgrades (except on the Avatar if I take him).

Nids, it depends on my list, however, my HQs usually have quite a few upgrades.

I build lists with tooled up Tyrants, then realize that if I replace them with a 90-100 point Prime, I can take dozens more gargoyles and Termagants... so hordehammer all the way!

I've enjoyed playing it every which way. I do like to have as many Astartes on the field as I can for the points, but there is something really awesome about a really powerful commander to lead the army.

I guess, esp in the case of demons, what makes the buffs a herald gives out better than a second unit of dogs? Is fateweaver so worth shelling out for that you couldnt take a LoC and front for heralds with the leftover points to afford more units instead of one decked out deathstar of dogs or screamers?

Why don't more Tyranid players USE primes instead of tyrants? The savings is massive, and would result in more hordi-ness.

Eldar deck out their HQ's for maximum buff overload obviously.

Question is, what drives players to shell out half of a lists points in just the HQs?

 iGuy91 wrote:
Eldar deck out their HQ's for maximum buff overload obviously.

I don't. Unless you count taking a full Warlock Council as decking out my HQ.

On Eldar HQs I either spend 30 points in upgrades or 0. It depends on whether or not I take the Avatar.

I play IG. Typically I run a CCS with advisers for the Reserve manipulation and Baby Basilisk shenanigans. Give them a Chimera to increase longevity and Order range, then add some sniper rifles for long range shooting. And that's usually it.

I prefer swamping the field with dozens of squads of tanks and infantry that are kitted out to deal with various threats. The theory is that I outnumber and outgun any opponent (at least in my meta) so he has to pick and choose which 50-point squad he wants to waste first. If I have the points, I might throw in a Lord Commissar for Stubborn blobs or a Primaris for his magic abilities (though he's more hilariously useless than anything). It's absurd how many lascannons and the like I can fit into an 1850 list. Boys before Toys!

As a Space Wolves player it's almost mandatory to take (and damned unfluffy if I don't) a tooled-up HQ, usually in the form of a Thunderwolf-mounted Wolf Lord with all the trimmings. I love him. If I'm feeling adventurous I may even take a WGBL on Thunderwolf on top of that, and each lead a pack of Thunderwolf cavalry, just because I HATE 'Nid monsters...

Seems to be a trend with marines, since their HQ's really aren't big in the buff department, you have to load them for bear, or leave them basically with nothing.

 iGuy91 wrote:
Seems to be a trend with marines, since their HQ's really aren't big in the buff department, you have to load them for bear, or leave them basically with nothing.

Don't get me wrong, a pack of Grey Hunters with an attached Wolf Priest can be, and often are, deadly. Similar with Rune Priests, for reasons I'm sure we're all familiar with. It's just, for me, I find it easier to use a beatstick like a TW-WL than try and keep a GH pack on track.

I mostly use less than the amount of highest costing single Troop choice in my list and this goes for the GK Codex. It would be wrong to say that I am towards Hordes as there are no Hordes in GK Codex.

But I still take two, most likely Coteaz and a second Inquisitor.

I have not ever needed 240 pts HQ Choice or similar when playing GK.

With BA I often fall towards Herohammer with Mephiston and Gabriel Seth, but this is because i play them mostly on fluffy games.

When playing with Eldar, taking Autarch and Farseer with Jetbike is the way to go for me.

With Tau I just end up having the same commander, (MSS+PENC+some stuff) and without a second HQ.

When playing with Marines I usually have two HQ:s because I use allies. MotF is my choice of poison when it comes to Spice Mayreens.

Ha i ran a really really fun salmander+ eldar list.

hq
librarian
cammand squad all with flamers+ apothicary+dro pod
techmarine with servo harness and combi flamer

librarian
cammand squad all with flamers+ apothicary+dro pod
techmarine with servo harness and combi flamer

troop:
5 tac with pc
5 tac with pc

eldar allies (iyanden supplent)

4 spirit sears 280
10 wraithgaurd 360.


thats a list with 0 fast attack, 0 elits, 0 heavy support, and is over 900+ of HQs!!!!

surprisingly i won all 3 rounds!

It depends on the army.

SM: I tend to run either SCs or Captains decked out in relics (my current favourite is a captain with Armour Indomitus, Teeth of Terra and The Primarch's Wrath. Who thought a guy with a bolter and chainsword could cost over 200 points?)

BA: Cheap librarian, low model count is already and issue and most of the SCs are poor.

SW: Wolves are all about the heroes, so it's usually Ragnar and a Rune Priest, sometimes a Wolf Priest as well. Sagas and gear all round.

IG: Lord Commissar and Primaris, mostly for fluff reasons, and usually a priest chucked in as well.

DA: Belial/Azreal for Deathwing tax, (or a Company Master with PW/Artificer armour/combi-plasma if I'm going Green), and a 65 point divination librarian is just to good to give up.

GK: Usually Crowe and an Inquisittor, sometimes swap Crowe out for a GM or Libby, both tooled up.

 iGuy91 wrote:
I guess, esp in the case of demons, what makes the buffs a herald gives out better than a second unit of dogs? Is fateweaver so worth shelling out for that you couldnt take a LoC and front for heralds with the leftover points to afford more units instead of one decked out deathstar of dogs or screamers?

Have you seen the warp-storm table? Results 2-4 are devastating to the Daemon player, fateweaver with his given WT offers a measure of protection, his re-roll a single dice is also insanely useful nd can get some good buffs/de-buffs that suit his role as a flying dakka boat.

As to the heralds question, I could run another unit of dogs for the same price as the herald but they still struggle against units with 2+/3+ saves and tanks, giving the hounds rage or hatred means they hit that much harder and means they can actually take on units they'd otherwise struggle against. Generally the herald gets challenged first round, then second round cleans up shop. Having running horrors with a herald for most of my games I can say yes he is worth it I don't think FF is particularly powerful (especially as horrors are only bs3) however throw prescience and a conjuration loci in there and you're annhilating units left, right and centre. You also have better odds of getting FF off (herald + horrors) and the DtW roll is generally worse against the Heralds shooting.

depends on the army...
Daemons flying circus and screamerstar (2 strongest builds) require fateweaver for grimoire

I imagine IG get less out of their HQ's as daemons I almost always use biggie + heralds

The highest for any of my armies is Belial at 190. IG i just run a CCS barebones and orks its either a KFF big mek or a 150pt Bikerboss.

I gravitate towards Librarians as my HQs.

Having said that, marines rather need a beatstick HQ in a lot of situations. They are definitely not the best CC army with the exception of a tooled up Chapter Master, and although avoiding CC altogether is the best solution it helps to have a contingency. Thus you have a beatstick who can wade in, law down the law, and ultimately prevent or counterack a linebreaking assault.