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As i run a foot c:sm army people keep saying a need some form of transport. i have proxied a few rhinos i just find the die to easy and don't really do much. also i don't like the idea of drop pods just doesn't seem tactical smart to drop half of you army in front of you opponent. i also play very defense in style countering my opponent moves and forcing him to fight me on my terms . only trouble I'm having is against gun line armies like eldar tau and ig

Man I missed you zilka, I was getting used to understanding the majority of the posts that I read on here (even if I didn't agree with them). I'm sure glad you are back.

No, you don't need transports, but they can help. However if they don't fit your playstyle, and you don't think they do much for you, then they don't fit you, and you can play just fine without them.

Dont forget that they can help you even if they are destroyed.
An enemy rushing a land raider forward and you ramming it with 2 rhinos can black or slow it down considerably even if they are destroyed. They are also a decent way to add extra terrain that you can make use of or block areas from enemy. Heck, even if they are destroyed, they produce a crater that you can use for cover or is difficult terrain to enemy coming in.

years ago, i played mostly infantry chaos marines and it was fun to look at an ork players face when he saw that i actually "outnumbered' him. if you dont feel the need, dont do it.

Just seems the liability of rhinos out wight ther usefulness.

There is no liability. At best they still provide sight blockers where YOU put them, and at worst they explode which your marines don't really care about and still provide a cover crater. They are only 35 points after all and don't use up FOC slots.

All the Space Marine dedicated transports are pretty good if you use them correctly. MSU lists can benefit from Razorback spamming, and both Rhinos and Drop Pods are great for delivering a unit broken into combat squads.

Speaking as a Drop Pod player, I think you're selling them vastly short. Keep in mind that you never HAVE to drop them up front, you can always drop them on your board half if you want to. But up front is usually where you want to be anyway. So many of your Space Marine special weapons are limited by a very short range, and the Pod completely negates the need to walk through a hail of punishing gunfire in order to drop some plasma/melta/flamer fire into the opponents' faces.

Your tactical squad can easily be split into an assault and a heavy weapon squad, can cover one another, or can be used to peel the bubblewrap back from protected units so that the second combat squad can fire at a now unprotected target.

I lost almost all of my games when I first started Space Marines, and was also told to buy vehicles. I waffled back and forth, but ended up buying a lot of six pods off of E-Bay, and found my games getting SO much easier after that. There was an adjustment period, I admit, since Drop Pod tactics can vary so greatly from normal footslogging tactics, but once I got the hang of it, I've been running some truly powerful lists.

If you have any specific questions about Drop Pod tactics, then feel free to PM me! I'd be happy to help.

Indeed, several pods dropping down on a flank that it not heavily defended can allow you to not only totally wipe out a flank on turn one but set up a forward "base" that forces the opponent to split their forces to address and that forward 'base automatically is defended by the pods themselves to block LOS to the squads and allow thm to settle in or set up for a further offensive.

To me rhinos are just to easy to be destroyand not worth it. and drop pod seem to be giving the advantage to ur opponent. I faced many drop pod armies that never stood a chance against me drop pod armies are very weak imo as they dont have the number to last very long. droping half ur army in front of opponent means ur doom

Its your army. if you have made up your mind to not use transports than any tips or advice we give you is wasted.Good luck, I think you can still make a decent go of it without them if you try.

I'm a little unclear what you're after zilka. You've asked for help in advising you which (if any) transports to choose. Although nearly everyone is responding helpfully with ways in which to use rhinos, razorbacks, and drop pods, you seem to have already made up your mind before posting that you don't actually want to use transports. If that's the case, then a title like 'sm transports' kind of gives the wrong impression. I think, however, that you'd be better served by investigating the drop pod, rhino, or razorback situation a little more carefully.

I have several competitive wins under my belt with Drop Pod lists, so I can personally attest to their effectiveness. You only 'give the advantage to your opponent' if you play the list incorrectly, which as I've said, takes a little bit of time to gain the experience to avoid. (As with any list, experience will be the strongest part of it.) Once you have the strategies for a Drop Pod deployment down, you'll find that the list is not only strong, but considered by some to be TOO strong. Since 6th edition dropped, I can't count the number of people who I've heard complaining that First Blood 'basically means Jim gets a free point' and that they might as well give me the Slay the Warlord point, too. My Pod lists have been accused of being overpowered on a number of occasions.

However, it seems like you aren't that interested in the opinions you've solicited, and have made up your mind to remain a footslogger. In that event, you're going to have to resign yourself to an uphill battle when it comes to gunline lists, since they're going to have superior firepower against you. Space Marines are a balanced army. By playing a largely static gunline, as you seem to be indicating you do, you are weighing yourself towards the shooty end of the spectrum. On the balance, that's going to give you the advantage over many assault oriented armies, but it's going to leave you vulnerable to some of the heavier firepower. A true IG tank wall might give you some trouble too. If you continue to face difficulties in that regard, consider investing in some fortifications. Stronghold Assault provided some great options to up your firepower output from static positions. Another cheap, long range option is the Gun Sentries from Forgeworld. The Plasma Spotter tactic I like so much might very well be a nice fit in your army, and provides near-unparalleled anti-infantry capability.

In any event, I hope you find the solution you're looking for. Good luck!

You are aware of his previous threads/contributions right Jimsolo? If not, it's a fun few minutes read to get that he never listens to anything and just complains.

I love o play marines who just sir back or slowly walk towards me with my guard army.
Now, a marine army racing down my throat or podding at me makes me a little nervous because then I'm not just shooting fish in a barrel and actually have a game on my hands. lol

Not trying to complain just trying to give my point of view on them from my gaming experience as i never once seen how any transport for marines is useful

zilka86 wrote:
Not trying to complain just trying to give my point of view on them from my gaming experience as i never once seen how any transport for marines is useful

ok have fun footslogging

Why is so bad to footsloging better then given free kill points with rhinos

You dont want to use transports, dont use them. Dont want to hear other's views on them, dont post asking for those views.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
i see you have multiple of this thread i different sections of the forums. which one. How many do you need to ask the same question?

zilka86 wrote:
Why is so bad to footsloging better then given free kill points with rhinos

footslogging's not bad, have fun

I just wanted to see why people thought you need them . i think they don't really add much to your army more of just free kill points

They do save your squad at least one turn of shooting from a wave serpent or war walker squadron. First blood is the least of my concern most games now a days.

zilka86 wrote:
I just wanted to see why people thought you need them . i think they don't really add much to your army more of just free kill points

okay dude i'm glad you have fun with foot marines

I'm still very confused as to way ever one views sm foot armies as a bad thing . as vehicles are not as durable as they should be. Giving 3to 5 victory points to my opponent for useinf rhinos our drop just sounds like a bad idea

zilka86 wrote:
I'm still very confused as to way ever one views sm foot armies as a bad thing . as vehicles are not as durable as they should be. Giving 3to 5 victory points to my opponent for useinf rhinos our drop just sounds like a bad idea

it's all about enjoying the game dude, i'm glad you have fun without transports

There is only one mission out of 6 that is kill points if their its little Los blocking terrain and you need to hold an objective park your rhino in front of an objective disembark and hope the rhino gets wrecked not an explosion lol.

We do not play objective games. we play kill point games our table your opponent games

zilka86 wrote:
We do not play objective games. we play kill point games our table your opponent games

That seems like a rather narrow-minded approach. Playing an objective game offers a totally different challenge and considering that 5/6 of missions are objective-based, you're missing out on a huge part of the game. I'd strongly consider asking your opponents if they want an objective game, it's far more of a tactical challenge and adds so much variety to the game.

If you're only playing KP, then it's no wonder you have trouble against gunlines, as they can just sit and shoot, objectives force them to move out and this can level the playing field. By just playing KP, you're playing into the hands of eldar/tau gunlines.

Depends on the meta you play against and how you use the vehicles. Footslogging armies only work (particularly for marine armies such as CSM) if you build entirely around it while Rhino-based armies have a bit more flexibility given that it is more mobile and less dependent on all its units working in concert with one another to compensate for whatever you use to allow your footslogging marines to get to the middle of the board; whether it is through sheer numbers or basing it upon tough units like plague marines.

Given that you keep repeating that you don't understand/comprehend why its a viable tactic despite the viable tactical comments other people have proposed I feel that my attempt at explaining will be a wasted effort. At the end does it really matter? People can play how they want regardless of whether or not it is the most efficient tactical choice. Whether you understand it or not is irrelevant.

Objective games favor gun lines as they can sit on there own objective to win. playing for kp and to table your opponent is way funner the trying to take some objectives and hold it for 5plus truns

zilka86 wrote:
Objective games favor gun lines as they can sit on there own objective to win. playing for kp and to table your opponent is way funner the trying to take some objectives and hold it for 5plus truns

i'm very glad that you enjoy kill point games

zilka86 wrote:
Objective games favor gun lines as they can sit on there own objective to win. playing for kp and to table your opponent is way funner the trying to take some objectives and hold it for 5plus truns

Seeing as objectives must be placed more than 12" apart and you'll be placing half of them, and that most game types use d3+2. you won't be winning any by just staying still, so even gunlines have to move. It's not a case of holding them for 5 turns, it's about fighting the battle to make sure that, by the 5th turn, you are in a position to take the objective. It's still heavily focused on fighting the enemy, but for a reason rather than just random destruction. It helps the narrative of the game and the variety, and really, you won't know how much you're missing out until you try it.

So if you get three objectives markers you just place them all in your deployment zone and then it's easy to hold them if more objectives where placed in the middle of the table it be more fun to play objectives games but as it is all the objectives are placed in ether deployment zone that's why firstblood so big to get.