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I have been trying to come up with a good slogger and toyz list for a while now, and here's what I've come up with.

Warboss in mega armour: Da Lucky Stikk; attack squig; bosspole 145

30 Boyz: shootas; 'eavy armour; 2× big shoota; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (twin-linked shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 388

3 Meganobz: kombi-weapon with rokkit launcha, power klaw; kombi-weapon with skorcha, power klaw; bosspole 135

Blitza-bommer 135

3 Killa Kans: rokkit launcha; 3× grot riggers 165
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers; extra armour 100
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers; extra armour 100
Morkanaut: kustom force field; extra armour; grot riggers 310

1,478 points

The plan is to put the Warboss with the 30 Boyz, and all the toys go in front of them. The Meganobz will most likely go in the naut. All of the toys have riggers in them for the IWND, so hopefully that'll make meks unnecessary. I know 30 boys is low, but I'm not sure if getting rid of something to gain more boys would be worth it. Please, any comments and suggestions would be great.

Riggers on Kans are wasted points (not great on Dreads either!).
It only gets used if your Kan takes a single Hull Point. On a 2 HP model, that won't happen often. Kans mostly go from good to dead, so giving them expensive upgrades that see no use isn't the best plan.

Thanks for the advice. I got rid of the riggers on the kanz, and that let me put a gitfinda and cybork body on the Warboss. I did a little fine tuning, and was able to throw in a Painboy for the boys, Warboss, and Meganobz, but I had to drop them down to 28 boys (which is ok I guess. Give up two bodies for a 5++). I also dropped the attack squig in exchange for a Mek to go in the naught and try to repair it / come out and fix kanz/dreads. Is there really any point in putting the nobs in the naught? Should I just let them slog it with the rest? It seems like a better idea for the mek to go there.

30 Ard boys with a Painboy is a bit over kill. I know, I tried something similar to this. Take off the eavy armor on the boys its redundant with a cover and FNP. Should give you almost enough points for 2 more kans at least. I would also drop the Mega armor on the Boss. If he is with the squad they wont be able to run if they need to. Mega armor have S&P so no run. Him with eavy armor and FNP is more then enough. The boys should all have BShootas or all have Rokkits. Don't mix them. I Lean towards BShootas myself.

Anyways I hope this helps. Its a fun list for sure.

So, something more like this? I'm a little confused on the Warboss/Mek "Mekaniaks" rule. If I take the Mek with the Warboss, can he go and repair the naut, etc. since they aren't part of his unit?

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; twin-linked shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole; cybork body; gitfinda 132
• Mek: kombi-weapon with rokkit launcha 20
Painboy: bosspole; grot orderly 60

30 Boyz: shootas; 3× big shoota; Boss Nob (twin-linked shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 268

3 Meganobz: kombi-weapon with rokkit launcha, power klaw 125

Blitza-bommer 135

5 Killa Kans: 2× rokkit launcha 250
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers; extra armour 100
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers; extra armour 100
Morkanaut: kustom force field; extra armour; grot riggers 310

1,500 points


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just realized my list wasn't legal or would have to be Unbound. Had to alter/remove some stuff, but how's this?

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole; cybork body 124
• Mek 15
Painboy: grot orderly 55

30 Boyz: shootas; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw) 245
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35

3 Meganobz: bosspole 125

Blitza-bommer 135

5 Killa Kans: 2× rokkit launcha 250
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
Morkanaut: kustom force field; grot riggers 300

1,499 points

The added Gretchins would go on the Boyz flanks.

 Minion_of_Gozer wrote:

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole; cybork body 124
Cybork is not needed as you already have FNP from the Painboy. Drop it for sure.
• Mek 15
Where is he going now? Its not bad to have him in the 30 boy squad to accept a challenge. But other then that a bit pointless.
Painboy: grot orderly 55

30 Boyz: shootas; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw) 245
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35
Not a fan of Gretchin as a unit. Waste of 70 points IMHO.

3 Meganobz: bosspole 125
Personal taste I like kombi Skorchas on them. Especially being transported you can hope out and flame a unit, Since they can't charge out of the Morkanaut.

Blitza-bommer 135

5 Killa Kans: 2× rokkit launcha 250
Is that 2 Rokkits and the others with BShootas? Rokkits are free upgrade might as well make them all Rokkits.
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
Morkanaut: kustom force field; grot riggers 300

1,499 points

All in all I think you have something going for you here. This is my list.

Mek: KFF, Stick, PK, Eavy, BP
Painboy:

Shootas x30: 3xBShootas (Mek, Painboy Here)
-Nob: PK, BP

Burnas x5:
-2x Mek: KMB

Deffkoptas x5: 2x KMB, 3x Rokkits

Morkanaut: KFF, Riggers (Burnas go here)
Kans x6: 3x KMB, 3x Rokkits
Flash Gitz x8:

1499

I line up Kans towards the middle with boys behind with Mek covering most of the Kans if not all. I stagger them having the Rokkits in front so the AP2 KM' survive longer. The Morkanaut covering the Gitz and hopefully a Kan or 2 depending on terrain and what not. Koptas to try to get first blood on rhino or other tank keeping out of charge range hopefully. It works pretty well. Marines I have destroyed a lot with this list. Eldar give me troubles and the new Necrons give me trouble. Other then that not a bad little list. Up it to 2K I add in 5 Manz in a trukk and add two Dread w 4xDCCW, Riggers.

How do you have 4 heavy choices?

He would have to play it unbound, and I totally missed that. lol

Yes. I thought he wanted to not do unbound. Just trying to point that out...lol

Thank you all for all of your help. I've taken it all into consideration, and I did some more tweaking, and came up with a theoretical list that looks pretty dangerous. I checked it over, and I think it's finally Ork Horde legal, haha. How does this look? I'm not trying to do too much with it am I? I posted an earlier list to /r/Warhammer, and they said I may be trying to make my orks more into a SM type army, but I don't see where it's a bad idea to cover all bases/possibilities. Anyway, new list looks like this...tell me what you think.

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole 119
Painboy: grot orderly 55
Weirdboy: Psyker (Mastery Level 2) 70

30 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw) 255
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35

5 Burna Boyz: Mek (kustom mega-blasta); Mek (kustom mega-blasta) 90

5 Deffkoptas: 5× twin-linked rokkit launcha 150
Blitza-bommer 135

4 Killa Kans: 4× rokkit launcha 200
Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
Morkanaut: kustom force field; grot riggers 300

1,499 points

Warboss, Painboy, and Weirdboy (wanted him originally, but couldn't fit him in) go with Boyz.
Gretchins are to make it Troop legal/hold an objective...hopefully.
Burna Boyz/Meks go inside Mork, with the Meks repairing toyz if needed (and dice gods willing).
Deffkoptas are for heavy armor infantry/light armor vehicle hunting...like them, but not quite sold on their purpose yet.
Blitzer for boom, and a little anti-air (since my Heavy slots are full).
Kanz, Dread, and Mork in front of Boyz unit (any suggestions on how to set this up for maximum enemy contact?)

All in all, I'm not really sure how I got it all in there, but this looks like a pretty decent sized army for 1500 points. I'm just worried about only having 30 Boyz. Am I slugging myself in the foot for fielding only 30 of them? I mean, it look like 7th kind of wanted to push away from Green Tides a bit.

-----

Just realized I only have 2 troops. Back to the drawing board.

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Ok. Hated to do it, but to make it legal, I dropped the Painboy' orderly, and one Deffkopta, and added a second troop unit of Gretchins. Does anyone happen to see 35 points I'm 100% wasting that I could take out to add them back in? I think I've cleared up all my useless points. Would it just be a better idea to go Unbound?

I hate to say it, but I think that you went too far with the toys before boys. Remember, nothing orks have is particularly "better" at anything compared to other armies. Where orks dominate is through volume, and bullying. Your list had a lot of really cool things, but very little in the way of means to absord losse, and outside of 24" you arent really going to be doing anything.

I'm afraid of that actually, so I have a backup list as well. Not quite as RAWR!!!, but a little more Boyz friendly.

Warboss: shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole 94
Painboy 50
Weirdboy: Psyker (Mastery Level 2) 70

30 Boyz: shootas; big shoota; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 260
10 Boyz: 'eavy armour; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 145
• Trukk: rokkit launcha; reinforced ram; boarding plank 50
10 Boyz: 'eavy armour; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 145
• Trukk: rokkit launcha; reinforced ram; boarding plank 50

5 Burna Boyz: Mek (kustom mega-blasta); Mek (kustom mega-blasta) 90

Blitza-bommer 135
4 Deffkoptas: 4× twin-linked rokkit launcha 120

Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
4 Killa Kans: 4× rokkit launcha 200

1,499 points

Is that a little safer? I left the Truk Boyz as slugga/choppa's since they hopefully will get into CC quicker.

Mmmmmmmm Not really.
Trukk boys are pretty good, but your army needs to mostly move at one speed. Maybe swap those trukk squads into another big slogging blob, perhaps with a painboy?

Also, what are those burna boys doing?

Hmm...got ya. Maybe this would be a little more terrifying.

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole 119
• Mek: kustom mega-blasta 20
Painboy 50
Weirdboy: Psyker (Mastery Level 2) 70

30 Boyz: shootas; big shoota; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 260
10 Gretchin: + 1 Runtherd 35

Blitza-bommer 135
4 Deffkoptas: 4× twin-linked rokkit launcha 120

Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
3 Killa Kans: 3× rokkit launcha 150

-----

CAD: Dok Payne, Nurz AAGH!, and the Hurtz Boyz:

Painboy: bosspole 55
Painboy: bosspole 55

20 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; big choppa; bosspole) 170
20 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; big choppa; bosspole) 170

1,499 points

Me personally I believe in toys before boys. It works for me and always has.

Boys can only do so much. They are great for dealing with infantry. What are you going to do to kill tanks? Well that's where the toys come in. As you saw my list I had only 30 boys. I have yet to lose them in a single game. With cover from the Kans and the Inv from my Mek and FNP from the Painboy, I am always getting a save. Sometimes even two.

Most of the people that I play against are so scared of the walkers. My Boys tend to not be that big of a target. I tend to bring as many as I can fit. They can be hard to deal with especially if I am rolling the KFF saves.

Now on to the list. Again you are unbound as it is. The first CAD has one few troop. For the Horde detachment you need 3 troops if that is how you are getting 3 HQ's. I think in a way you are trying to much. I have yet to find a list that will really utilize the Weirdboy well enough. You could drop him to fit something else in there. Or it would at least make it a normal CAD.

Do you have to keep it battleforged? Cause honestly its not that necessary for Orks IMHO. If you don't have to I would play around with unbound.

I don't really HAVE to I guess, but if I ever decide to enter any tournaments at my FLGS, I doubt they would go for Unbound in a tournament. I was just making it tourny legal so I wouldn't have to worry about it in the future.

My feeling is its in the rules its tourney legal. I understand where you are coming from.

Ok, So I went ahead and made a list with some of the units you wanted. I made it CAD so that should help.

Boss: PK, BP, Stikk, Shoota
Painboy:

Shootas x30: 3xBShootas(Boss, Painboy)
-Nob: PK, Bp
Shootas x15: BShoota
-Nob: PK, BP
Shootas x15: BShoota
-Nob: PK, BP

Deffkoptas x5: 3x Rokkits, 2x KMB
Blitza Bomma:

Killa Kans x6: 2x KMB, 4x Rokkits
Dread: 2xRokkits, Riggers
Dread: 2xRokkits, Riggers

1500/1500

I really feel you need some KMB's in the list. Their AP2 really helps with long range tank destruction. Gives you toys and boys. I am not sure how long they will last without the KFF, but hey *shrugs.

Anyways enjoy and good luck.

I'd rather take Extra Armour then Riggers.
A Dread that can't move is useless, I'd rather have it moving (and hopefully charging) than have a small chance of getting a Hull Point back.

Tankbustas are better than Killa Kans when you're doing 200pts in Kans. It's 210 for 15 + nob + boss pole. That's 15 wounds in models, it's 15melta bombs in close combat, it's 5 hits 4 wounds with tank hunters special rule and an extra possible first blood point when shooting... Where 4 kans are 200 with rokkits, 8 hull points which can be lost in 4 shots, when they explode can actually damage each other, they can become scared if shot, when in cc they are str 7ap2, when shooting they are 2 hits 1 wound...

I don't even see a reason to take them unless you're a mek army and then, only if you take grotzookas against infantry

Bustas need a ride unlike kans.

But yep, kans are a very underwhelming unit now, unfortunately. They look cool and the idea behind them is awesome. But realistically, they should cost almost 2 times less for what they get.

As it is now, i think that designers first updated the point cost for 7-th with more sturdy vehicles and walkers actually standing a chance against MC, than decided to nerf them instead of going up in price. But in the end, forgot to return pt cost back.

It seems to me that you are trying to basically make an ork list without transport vehicles? If this is the case, you either have to have fast moving infantry, or a LOT of them. For this reason I recommend the green tide, and then you can take whatever else you like with them you could use some of the killa kans, deffkopta dreads or a pain boy.

grendel083 wrote:I'd rather take Extra Armour then Riggers.
A Dread that can't move is useless, I'd rather have it moving (and hopefully charging) than have a small chance of getting a Hull Point back.

But extra armor only works on one of the damage charts. Seems a bit iffy to me.

FratHammer wrote:Tankbustas are better than Killa Kans when you're doing 200pts in Kans. It's 210 for 15 + nob + boss pole. That's 15 wounds in models, it's 15melta bombs in close combat, it's 5 hits 4 wounds with tank hunters special rule and an extra possible first blood point when shooting... Where 4 kans are 200 with rokkits, 8 hull points which can be lost in 4 shots, when they explode can actually damage each other, they can become scared if shot, when in cc they are str 7ap2, when shooting they are 2 hits 1 wound...

Bolters can't hurt Kans. Kans hit on 4+, sure there might not be as many, but they will hit more. Kans can have KMB and AP2 is pretty important to Orks at this point it the game.

koooaei wrote:Bustas need a ride unlike kans.

But yep, kans are a very underwhelming unit now, unfortunately. They look cool and the idea behind them is awesome. But realistically, they should cost almost 2 times less for what they get.

As it is now, i think that designers first updated the point cost for 7-th with more sturdy vehicles and walkers actually standing a chance against MC, than decided to nerf them instead of going up in price. But in the end, forgot to return pt cost back.

I don't think they are underwhelming at all. 12 hull point unit is pretty scary IMHO. With 6 shots from anti tank weapons. It seems pretty good to me for the points.

Tiny_Titan wrote:It seems to me that you are trying to basically make an ork list without transport vehicles? If this is the case, you either have to have fast moving infantry, or a LOT of them. For this reason I recommend the green tide, and then you can take whatever else you like with them you could use some of the killa kans, deffkopta dreads or a pain boy.

Transport vehicles are not necessary. In most cases all they do is give First blood to the enemy. I haven't used a transport vehicle with my Orks in some time now. Orks are fine with walking across the field.

One of the big problems with kans is that the entire unit can become shaken if they take casualties. Why do orks get the only vehicle in the entire game that suffers morale issues. Sure, the dreads will help with that a bit. But even dreads have not been impressive to me.

The difference between the killing abilities of the bustas versus the kans is that the bustas: wont accidentally kill themselves (gets hot), reroll armor penetration, and can hurt AV 14. Plus, they can survive an iron clad dread. Kans? Not even

Worrying about giving away first blood as an ork player? Any time orks dont go first, or arent runing a green tide, first blood gets gone. Have you looked at FW gunwagons as a transport option? They are pretty sturdy(13/12/10), cost half as much as a BW, and can be taken in squadrons, so that you can finagle shots to keep the transport in back from getting murked. I run them in twos, with the front vehicle just carrying shoota boys, and the back vehicle carrying something like bustas, burnas, MANZ, etc. And theyre tough enough that my opponents dont just crack them instantly. Titan wasnt saying that the vehicles were necessary, but he does have a point: for foot sloggers, there are not a lot of wounds in this crew.

BossMakk wrote:
One of the big problems with kans is that the entire unit can become shaken if they take casualties. Why do orks get the only vehicle in the entire game that suffers morale issues. Sure, the dreads will help with that a bit. But even dreads have not been impressive to me.

For the morale you have to lose 2 kans in a 6 kan squad 4 HP. And you need to roll a 3+. A 2+ if a Dread is near bye, not very hard to do.

The difference between the killing abilities of the bustas versus the kans is that the bustas: wont accidentally kill themselves (gets hot), reroll armor penetration, and can hurt AV 14. Plus, they can survive an iron clad dread. Kans? Not even

Gets hot is not even really an option most of the time. You can have a warlord ability that lets you reroll ones. There is a Mysterious Objective that lets you reroll ones. I have killed Iron clads with Kans before. Shooting with Str 8 weapons and charging. All you have to do is glance a vehicle to kill it. The Kans and Bustas have the same str weapon. And the Kans can have AP2. But ymmv

Worrying about giving away first blood as an ork player? Any time orks dont go first, or arent runing a green tide, first blood gets gone. Have you looked at FW gunwagons as a transport option? They are pretty sturdy(13/12/10), cost half as much as a BW, and can be taken in squadrons, so that you can finagle shots to keep the transport in back from getting murked. I run them in twos, with the front vehicle just carrying shoota boys, and the back vehicle carrying something like bustas, burnas, MANZ, etc. And theyre tough enough that my opponents dont just crack them instantly. Titan wasnt saying that the vehicles were necessary, but he does have a point: for foot sloggers, there are not a lot of wounds in this crew.

I very rarely give away first blood with my Orks. If I do its to a lucky Pen 7+. Which can be done for any army. This was the quote "an ork list without transport vehicles". Stating that Orks need transport vehicles. I disagree with this. Kan wall is still a viable option for a list and can work. No it is not last editions kan wall but it is still an option. And at 1500 points he has a lot of models and a lot of armor to go through. I think it is totally fine. Again ymmv..

 balsak_da_mighty wrote:

Tiny_Titan wrote:It seems to me that you are trying to basically make an ork list without transport vehicles? If this is the case, you either have to have fast moving infantry, or a LOT of them. For this reason I recommend the green tide, and then you can take whatever else you like with them you could use some of the killa kans, deffkopta dreads or a pain boy.

Transport vehicles are not necessary. In most cases all they do is give First blood to the enemy. I haven't used a transport vehicle with my Orks in some time now. Orks are fine with walking across the field.

yes, unless you take gun wagons with armor 13

I'll provide you with 5 flash gitz free of charge.

It's probably not much better, but I was able to come up with this, which is a little closer to a Baby's First Green Tide list.

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole 119
Painboy: grot orderly 55

30 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 260
30 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 260
30 Boyz: shootas; 2× rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 260

Blitza-bommer 135
4 Deffkoptas: 4× twin-linked rokkit launcha 120

Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
4 Killa Kans: 4× rokkit launcha 200

1,499 points


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Does the "Ork Warband" formation combine the 6 units of Boyz into a single unit, like the Green Tide, or are they six individual units?

Spread deffkoptas in 2 units

Make one unit of boyz sluggas and stick boss + painboss in there.

Also, i prefer 20 strong footslogging shoota squads over 30 unless there's an HQ in there. With 18" range it's a rare day that >20 will be able to shoot anywayz. And it's better for board controle to have more squads present in case of shootas. But that's a matter of preference ofc.

Cutting a few points here and there, you'd be able to field 30 sluggas with boss + painboss and 3 squads of 20 shootas with rokkits and bp/pk nobz. One shoota squad can even go without a pk on nob if you're short on points. Still worth it.

Another option is to go for double cad or ork specific FOC and add another indep.

More like this? Are two units of 2 koptas able to survive relatively well though?

Warboss: Da Lucky Stikk; shoota; power klaw; 'eavy armour; bosspole 119
Painboy 50

30 Boyz: big shoota; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 230
20 Boyz: shootas; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 185
20 Boyz: shootas; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 185
20 Boyz: shootas; rokkit launcha; Boss Nob (shoota; power klaw; bosspole) 185

Blitza-bommer 135
2 Deffkoptas: 2× twin-linked rokkit launcha 60
2 Deffkoptas: 2× twin-linked rokkit launcha 60

Deff Dread: rokkit launcha; grot riggers 90
4 Killa Kans: 4× rokkit launcha 200

1,499 points

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Man. This is a complicated thing to accomplish. I may just end up doing a Green Tide and CAD with a Painboy, Weirdboy, Blitza-bommer, and some Deffkoptas lol.