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I know most would never even consider the possibility, living as they do a fanatical, monastic lifestyle. And those that do tend to break completely and fall to Chaos rather then bending.

But does there exist a mechanism for Space Marines to become civilians should they desire? Or do they have to go renegade if they wish to leave their Chapter life behind?

I know seriously injured Marines can become instructors, but this is still within the Chapter structure. I also know if would be very difficult for a Marine to integrate into daily life due their size and psychology, but this is more a question of if such a thing is permitted, not how successful it would be.

I also don't see why a Space Marine couldn't take a left-field transfer and become an Inquisitor or a Rogue Trader. If they can't quit being a Marine, are they also not allowed to transfer into other Imperial departments?

No. Marines stay marines till they die. They might become injured and be forced to stay at base and help with chapter upkeep and training, but there is no true retirement.

Only in death does duty end

What happens if they request it? Or ask for time off due to burnout? We're talking people who live and fight for sometimes hundreds of years without so much as a holiday.

Is the desire to leave the life of a Marine considered Heresy in itself?

Hierophant wrote:
What happens if they request it? Or ask for time off due to burnout? We're talking people who live and fight for sometimes hundreds of years without so much as a holiday.

Is the desire to leave the life of a Marine considered Heresy in itself?

Yes.


Space Marines are designed to be weapons. Their life is war, and only in death does duty end.

The novel Space Marine says that if you're old enough you can opt for "honorable euthanasia", but I don't really think that's canon anymore. Either way, the answer is no. Once a marine.... always a marine.

I think that, effectively, if you can be a Space Marine, you aren't going to want to quit or retire.

They carefully screen their applicants, then engage in extensive hypno-indoctrination. These guys have their minds and personalities rebuilt so extensively that many don't even remember their former lives or even their former names. Their entire psychology is restructured (aka And They Shall Know No Fear) and all sorts of basic mental/physical needs are altered (partial brain sleeping, non-existent or dramatically controlled sex drive, blah, blah, blah).

I'm pretty sure that in the process of making them functionally immortal, fearless, fanatically loyal, killers, they would be sure to alter their desires to kick back and relax. Then, the few marines who experienced strange urges to take long vacations and shirk off work could be considered corrupted and shot.

Sadly I dont think any Space Marine has ever tried giving the Emprah a "Dear Boss" letter.

The only chapter I could thing of where something "close" mught happen is the salamanders as they are the token "people marines".

Granted such a position would still probably be withing the chapter's structure but it might involve working with or supporting the civilian population of Nocturne or scouting recruits. Even then a marine is still a marine, essentially they are property of the imperium. Genetically and mentally altered to be mankinds most deadly warriors untill the day they die.

As for holidays or burnout, supposedly marines are so different in their mindset that they can't really be said to think the same as a mortal so who knows?

No way. For them, battle is the vacation. Way better than garrison with your 15 minutes if free time a day.

I remember in the old 3rd edition blood angels codex, it makes mention that Tyco was recommended for xontast combat, because the time he spend away From the front line would drive him mad.

Well, I'd say they propably could, but doubt that none of them actually would.

No, only in death does duty end.

Now that's not to say that it's not unusual for older marines, the truly venerable, that are not in some sort of command position or already in a Dreadnought sarcophagus, can be appointed as elders or ancients in their own right. Taking on the duty of maintaining the history and honors of the chapter and relaying that to new generations.

As with anything in the imperium the universe is big enough for something to happen, however Marines are not human, they don't think of respite for respites sake they would only stop fighting so they can fight better tommorow

I think it's possible an obscure chapter or two might be ok with the idea, but it would be very unusual and close to heresy, becoming a trainer makes so much more sense

Hierophant wrote:
What happens if they request it? Or ask for time off due to burnout? We're talking people who live and fight for sometimes hundreds of years without so much as a holiday.

Is the desire to leave the life of a Marine considered Heresy in itself?

They would get executed for even having such thoughts. Clearly they lack proper dedication and devotion, making them vulnerable to corruption and a liability to the Chapter.
Marines simply don't retire, even after a 1000 years, they would never even consider it. Their only retirement is death.

Pretty sure I've heard of injured/ old marines adopting a purely training role. But no, you don't retire. And you definitely don't quit, that's heresy.

Old, but not injured. An injured marine gets patched up with cybernetics and sent back to the front line, unless they're so badly off that they get interred in a dreadnought and sent back to the front line.

Marines have a culture similar to the samurai of feudal nippon. in fact, "life is the emperors currency" is one possible translation of a famous phrase from the hagakure.

Quitting = going crazy, marines definitely go crazy and remain in the service of the emperor but corruption would be the closest thing to quitting i can think of.

I could see an injured Ultramarine 'retiring' into an administrative role in governing the Ultramar system. The precedent is already there with the Tetrarchs.

Captain Tycho wasn't happy with being a marine anymore.

He was devastated by an ork psychic attack, which resulted in him slipping deeper and deeper into ennui and self-loathing, making him more and more tempremental. Eventually he succumbed to the black rage and finished his career in the Death Company, where he was able to eventually meet an honourable end.

I believe Commander Dante also isn't as enthusiastic with his lot as when he was younger either.

They can be retired due to age or injury, but will doubtlessly go on to serve the Chapter in some new manner. There is at least one exception, that being Captain Ezekiel - aka "Cloud Runner" - of the Dark Angels and his veterans. After the Plains World mission they settled down to become tribal leaders, and did not return with the Dark Angels when they came to investigate what had happened. They just gave back their Terminator suits and asked that they be kept white in memory of the Fallen.

I recall at least one instance of a Space Marine being permitted to undergo a sort of one-man crusade, going off to do a lone wolf thing. I believe this was an Imperial Fist, but I can't be sure. He was given a small ship and supplies and sent off to go smite things forever. All throughout the fluff you'll find instances of singular marines or small groups being sent off or voluntarily leaving the fold to go and do a thing, never to return. There are also instances of lone marines wandering off to become hermits.

Can this be considered retirement? Unknown, because you have to take into account the psychological changes of an Astartes. Remember, they aren't just juiced up physically. Their brain chemistry is altered and they're hypnotically conditioned. A marine is only capable of being a warrior in one sense or another; most of their basic humanity is stripped away from them and they spend centuries pursuing war, so it's unlikely that they ever want anything else.

The first few books of the Horus Heresy (before it devolved into nonstop bolter-porn) deal with the Remembrancers trying to get a feel for what it means to be an Astartes, to try and translate it into something that normal people could understand, and all these poets and artists and wordsmiths just couldn't reconcile the Astartes mindset with being a normal person. "I don't know what event these murals are meant to commemorate, but it must have involved lots of standing on corpses and screaming with your arms raised." So the idea of these arm-raising corpse-screamers wanting to assimilate back into society is a bit off.

Last thing you have to remember is that each Astartes is supposed to be harvested upon their death. THeir progenoid glands are meant to be implanted into two new marines to continue the line. So many chapters will closely guard these organs, refusing to allow their warriors to simply walk off with the reinforcements.

Only when you turn renegade you can choose your own destiny.

Of course they can retire. They can take the Twenty Millimeter Retirement Plan. I've heard it has fantastic benefits, although it sounds a bit fishy coming from a Krieg Quartermaster.

Chances are the level of disillusion required to quit would be picked up on long long before it built up enough to result in the request, and you'd have received "help" by then. Forcibly or subtly. The average marine would never reach the point of making that choice.

Any wavering in the fanatical devotion when surrounded by other fanatical devotees, well, they're gonna notice.

Technically, Corax quit, though he could be considered to have embarked on a one-man crusade. Same with Leman Russ.

Also reading up on Meric Voyen, who quit to become a full-time healer, seemingly without issue.

Though I know Thunder Warriors are not Space Marines, for what it's worth, Arik Taranis managed to live a civilian life. Sure, he was a crime lord, but he operated from the shadows, and not as a warrior.

Hierophant wrote:
What happens if they request it? Or ask for time off due to burnout?

Your assumption is flawed because these things will not happen. A marine would never ask for time off, nor would he need any.

He does have the mental or physical limitations of a human which leads to "burnout". He has been programmed to be the perfect killing machine, and to enjoy every second of it.

There is a semi-retirement of sorts. Occasionally a marine may get permanently assigned to the chapter's homeworld to train recruits or some other duty at their main fortress. This usually happens only in the case of a marine becoming injured to the point where even augmetics can't keep him worthy of battle, or he is seen as having too much knowledge and experience to risk in battle. So he is assigned to train initiates and pass on his knowledge. This is as close to retirement as a marine can get. Its both a great honor and a curse. Its a honor to train the next generation, but a curse to not do what a marine is supposed to do(fight for the Emperor).

 bossfearless wrote:
I recall at least one instance of a Space Marine being permitted to undergo a sort of one-man crusade, going off to do a lone wolf thing. I believe this was an Imperial Fist, but I can't be sure. He was given a small ship and supplies and sent off to go smite things forever. All throughout the fluff you'll find instances of singular marines or small groups being sent off or voluntarily leaving the fold to go and do a thing, never to return. There are also instances of lone marines wandering off to become hermits.

What you're refrencing is from the novel "Sons of Dorn"
A Space Marine Captain (I forget the name) requests an opportunity to go on a pilgrimage for redemption of the lives lost under his command.
The Chapter Master tells him to go feth himself and puts him in charge of the 10th (scouts).
By the end of the novel, more scouts die (due to lysanders tactical jackassery) and he adds them to the name he has to repent for.
He still wanting a pilgrimage, but not feeling so crappy about himself, since he made some scouts into fine space marines.

P.S. a pilgrimage in 40K is basically suicide unless you're a primarch.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Your assumption is flawed because these things will not happen. A marine would never ask for time off, nor would he need any.

He does have the mental or physical limitations of a human which leads to "burnout". He has been programmed to be the perfect killing machine, and to enjoy every second of it.

Sure, and the Horus Heresy never happened. Corax didn't have a nervous breakdown that led to him running away either. No marine, clearly, ever experienced self doubt.

This thread reminds me of the Salamander who'd survived Isstvan and had PTSD and constant shaking.

I think some SMs "retire" to train recruits or so. If they're pretty messed up (physically) they're put to do other things than frontline combat. Dreadnought isn't for just anyone; it's for those deserving.

 ChazSexington wrote:
Dreadnought isn't for just anyone; it's for those deserving.

As the Soul Hunter novel let us know, sometimes they're interred unwillingly.