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Hello

I am wondering how good Imperial cults and militias? and what there mains strengths are.

1) 30k is NOT comepetative, it really isn't.
2) IM/C's strengths are it's numbers and customizability, simple as that. when you can bring 130 infantry in a 1,000 point list, and have 40 of those be marine equivalents, then you are basically set.

They're mostly meant as an ally faction at this point. IF you were to try and play them on their own the main thing that sticks out at me is the high number of super heavies and high AV you can potentially take. Without allies Imperial cult/militias are almost completely reliant on vehicles for special and heavy weapons. If you go Traitor the "cult horde" and "tainted flesh" make for a distinctively hordy close combat army. If you want them loyalist Survivors of the Dark Age brings the army a greater degree of survivability with a pseudo marine build to your main troops along with the option for rhinos and land raiders. Either way its masses of light infantry or medium infantry that need you to bring vehicles to get anything done.

I think the army could play well, but it'd take a large investment to have enough minis and tanks to do it.

Agreed. It's hard to say beyond that, as different provenance armies play totally differently.

As a rule, your tanks are cheap and shooty, your men are plentiful but easily killed, leadership is a weakness unless you take it out of the equation with cult horde, and your hq choices suppirt your army well but are god - awful in a fight.

You'll run out of slots before points, though, and the 'horus heresy is nothing but marines' brigade are unlikely to have an army built in the expectation of 300 infantry and a tank company led by a baneblade...

i have played a few games With the millitia lists and its a very fun and good army to play Probably the second best army after mechanicum . Force Commanders that can pick warlord traits, get the city fighting one and you are golden. provenances(doctrines) changes Your army completely i have been using abhumand and Survivors of the dark age. 20 Grenaders With an orderlie, With str 4 range 30 lasguns t4 3+saves fnp and 2 meltaguns for a mere 180p. that is so good value. i use 3 squds of them as my base core then i have 2 units of 5 lasscanons With an orderlie 160p each.
Outflanking/infiltrating recon Squad With a democharge 55p!

well okay thats the great Things about the list big problem is leadership and only 6 troop slots gakky Close combat unles you build Your provenances around that.
rapier teams and leman russes are ok Heavy suport. but not amazing. you should be able to og toe to toe With any Space marine force.

I am more drawn to the Solar Auxilia, myself. But I really like the options that the Imperial cults and militias have in Book 5. The abilities are pricey, though. But lots of flavor.

Kronk I agree. The Solar Auxilia have their appeal and I think play as a more cohesive force that are more flexible on the tabletop. Most of what Militia offer is off the table thematic flexibility. I think both are missing some necessary elements.

Solar Auxilia for instance could benefit from thematic flexibility if they had a troop choice that wasn't three potentially large squads; short of the two people I've heard of that have 180+ auxilia infantry armies, no one else is ever going to use all those troop slots. I feel like auxilia should have a troop choice that kinda functions like Veterans in the Imperial Guard 40k codex with some customizable roles.

I think Militia need more troop slots or the ability for Grenadiers to be optionally taken as Elites as well as troops; it seems weird how short of bodies the Militia list can become if you're using mostly grenadiers and want them mobile. I think Militia need more Fast Attack choices; I think it'd make sense if they abstractly had access to Rough Riders and Hellhounds or some 30k equivalent, in that same way the "Ogryn" entry is used to generically represent a unit that can really be any number of things.

saitani wrote:i have played a few games With the millitia lists and its a very fun and good army to play Probably the second best army after mechanicum . Force Commanders that can pick warlord traits, get the city fighting one and you are golden. provenances(doctrines) changes Your army completely i have been using abhumand and Survivors of the dark age. 20 Grenadiers With an orderlie, With str 4 range 30 lasguns t4 3+saves fnp and 2 meltaguns for a mere 180p. that is so good value. i use 3 sqauds of them as my base core then i have 2 units of 5 lasscanons With an orderlie 160p each.
Outflanking/infiltrating recon Squad With a democharge 55p!

well okay thats the great Things about the list big problem is leadership and only 6 troop slots gakky Close combat unles you build Your provenances around that.
rapier teams and leman russes are ok Heavy suport. but not amazing. you should be able to og toe to toe With any Space marine force.

I agree that setup for Grenadiers is great, I also like the prospect of taking Laslocks with the Advance weapon options for mobile S5... but like you said the biggest problem is there aren't enough Troop slots... part of the problem is if you try to make use of transports since none of the squads really fit the transport capacity of any of the options without compromises.

I think when it comes to vehicles what I think would work well is building the army around a solid gun line with R30; take a Gorgon with a bulk of Militia or Levy with medicae and Discipline master supported by a Fire Support squad with Heavy Flamers. When it comes to Gorgons I think its rare you'll use its full capacity...

I think I'd want a small squad of Grenadiers in a transport as something reactionary... I wish you could take the land raider with Augury and still use it as a transport. Rhinos are a source for a heavy weapon, but because of the limited space you won't get any special weapons on your Grenadiers, so you'll have to decide if that's worth the trade off; it might be if you could spam more troop choices, but the best use of troop slots just doesn't leave much room for something that runs off on its own. That's the only reason I think Recon Squads are a bit lacking.

"Ogryns" become tempting when you consider that with a load of upgrades they end up with 6T and a Sv 3+...

I wish Platoon Command Cadre or Grenadiers could also be an Elite choice, as it is I feel like as an army it really needs a greater number of units to do well and take advantage of what it has going for it.

Levy can't take a medicae - one of their downsides compared to auxilia 'regulars'.

I agree the force needs a way to get multiple units per choice, platoon- or tercio-style. That's the main limitation.

The two 'core' units you can build an army around are either grenadiers (because they're competent) or inducted levy (because you get enough models for board control). Regulars are for the most part, best used to get a Gorgon and then fill half of it along with a heavy flamer squad, as noted.

S5 Laslocks.... I dunno. The problem is that, assuming (a) you've taken survivors of the dark age as at least one provenance, and (b) you're facing either astartes infantry or mechanicum automata, there's very little advantage to the laslocks. If you don't want to charge - and, remember, the militia have no assault vehicle transports, not even the **** gorgon in this incarnation - one S5 shot is rarely as good as 2 S4 shots.

Abhuman/Survivors ogryns are indeed impressive tanks - take a few boarding shields for defensive grenades as well, and hand the rest power axes. They'll need support to hold up in melee leadership-wise, though. Discipline Collars and a Discipline Master gives you rerollable stubborn Ld9, which is a pretty good start.

The S5 laslocks are mostly something I'd want as a throw away troop choice, who's main purpose is to kinda run ahead and be a mediocre speed bump... I think the S5 laslocks might be worthwhile for harassing and glancing light vehicles like rhinos, especially when mounted in a Heavy Bolter or Melta upgraded Rhino... maybe an Arvus or even a Land Raider. Still trying to figure it out. I think the greatest thing going against this is that the other builds for Grenadiers are just that much more of a necessity.

I like Malcadors and I'm always a fan of Quad Guns, but I feel that its easy to put too much emphasis on anti-horde and leave you inadequately prepared to deal with enemy vehicles. I think Fire Support squads are much more important here than they are for 40k Imperial Guard, just because of the lack of heavy weapons. I like the Heavy Flamers because of how threatening they can be as a mobile element for your army, but I'm not sure what the best weapon for them in a static role. I feel like its gonna be Autocannons or Lascannons because of the lack of mid-power anti-vehicle weapons you're forced to take what you can here. But once again the limited Troop slots make it difficult to take more than one or two without cutting into the necessary bulk of troops. Where are you getting your anti-vehicle?

How do you feel about the cost of Grenade Launchers on the Platoon Command squad? -Worthwhile?

 aka_mythos wrote:
They're mostly meant as an ally faction at this point. IF you were to try and play them on their own the main thing that sticks out at me is the high number of super heavies and high AV you can potentially take. Without allies Imperial cult/militias are almost completely reliant on vehicles for special and heavy weapons. If you go Traitor the "cult horde" and "tainted flesh" make for a distinctively hordy close combat army. If you want them loyalist Survivors of the Dark Age brings the army a greater degree of survivability with a pseudo marine build to your main troops along with the option for rhinos and land raiders. Either way its masses of light infantry or medium infantry that need you to bring vehicles to get anything done.

I think the army could play well, but it'd take a large investment to have enough minis and tanks to do it.

I feel calling them a ally faction hits the nail on the head.

Well the Cult hoard gives some nice bonuses, the fact that the only snap shot rule also effects all units (Witch I assume includes tanks) bassicly shoots the army in the foot at any chances of functioning as a stand alone army since it means no blast or flamer weapons in the whole army. well the most extreme example; in general I feel alot of the doctrines are geared towards customizing cheap hoards of infantry for allying into other armies. (With most of them being based around LD and survivability buffs.)

Survivors of the Dark Age is the only one that stood out to me as something that helps them function as a stand alone army.


I do plan to build/convert a small force of Cult hoard/tainted flesh milita from some lots of plastic cultists i picked up off Ebay. But I would never consider expanding the force into anything but a ally for my Traitor Solar-Aux and Iron Warriors.

I'm thinking of doing Squats with Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age... I'm still trying to figure out how to make it work.

abhuman helots +1 strength seems good

 aka_mythos wrote:
I'm thinking of doing Squats with Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age... I'm still trying to figure out how to make it work.

lol, I had played with the idea for abit myself. But lately I've been playing at to many GW stores to use full 3rd party models for a army.

T4 with a +4sv gives the fire support squads some decent survivability. That then helps get the fire-power into the list you need so bad.

I also like the idea of buying explosive collars for Stubborn, but "count-as Squat Stubbornness". If you roll Double 6's, instead of their heads explodeing it's because they were so stubborn that they refused to run away. Ending up in them getting whipped out, instead of running away or getting to safety.

As for the two squads of power-armoured grenadiers... the fluffy thing to do is land raider proteus for squads. But the arvus lighter with twin-linked lascannon in reserve is a decent choice. Thows S5 Las-Locks could tear some squads up, and you get the chance to peg a tank on the side/rear armour with a lascannon.

Then you go other Malcador or Leeman Russ Squads in the heavy support.

 Lockark wrote:
Well the Cult hoard gives some nice bonuses, the fact that the only snap shot rule also effects all units (Witch I assume includes tanks) bassicly shoots the army in the foot at any chances of functioning as a stand alone army since it means no blast or flamer weapons in the whole army.

It only affects models with the Provenance rule (since Provenances of War are the upgrades you can buy for your detachment if you have a Force Commander present). Most Infantry units have the rule, but Vehicles do not - similar to the Legion Astartes rule for a Crusade Army List. There are some exceptions though - Rogue Psykers, Enginseers and their Servo-Automata and Mutant Spawn don't have the rule. Artillery units like the Rapier and Heavy Ordnance Batteries do have the rule on the Infantry models in the unit however, meaning the guys firing the guns do get affected by the Provenance.

A Cult Horde can definitely still use Vehicles fine. Hordes of fearless Inducted Levy Squads bubble wrapping Leman Russ or Malcador tanks is pretty legit. You just wont be able to use Rapiers or Heavy Ordnance batteries very well...

 GoonBandito wrote:

 Lockark wrote:
Well the Cult hoard gives some nice bonuses, the fact that the only snap shot rule also effects all units (Witch I assume includes tanks) bassicly shoots the army in the foot at any chances of functioning as a stand alone army since it means no blast or flamer weapons in the whole army.

It only affects models with the Provenance rule (since Provenances of War are the upgrades you can buy for your detachment if you have a Force Commander present). Most Infantry units have the rule, but Vehicles do not - similar to the Legion Astartes rule for a Crusade Army List. There are some exceptions though - Rogue Psykers, Enginseers and their Servo-Automata and Mutant Spawn don't have the rule. Artillery units like the Rapier and Heavy Ordnance Batteries do have the rule on the Infantry models in the unit however, meaning the guys firing the guns do get affected by the Provenance.

A Cult Horde can definitely still use Vehicles fine. Hordes of fearless Inducted Levy Squads bubble wrapping Leman Russ or Malcador tanks is pretty legit. You just wont be able to use Rapiers or Heavy Ordnance batteries very well...

My mistake then, thank you. I never actually bought Book 5 and only know what I can recall from when me and a friend spent a night picking over the list and the notes I took when we did it. I was convinced it effected tanks lol.


(Getting book 5 has been a low priority since the only thing i wanted from it was the milita/cult list for allies, and due to the amount of typos in that list i was reluctant till it got atleast a massive errata. I'm actully super happy I put it off now, since it's going to be in the next red book. As for my friend, luckily he got it for the ultra rules and not that list. lol)

 Lockark wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:
I'm thinking of doing Squats with Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age... I'm still trying to figure out how to make it work.

lol, I had played with the idea for abit myself. But lately I've been playing at to many GW stores to use full 3rd party models for a army.

T4 with a +4sv gives the fire support squads some decent survivability. That then helps get the fire-power into the list you need so bad.

I also like the idea of buying explosive collars for Stubborn, but "count-as Squat Stubbornness". If you roll Double 6's, instead of their heads explodeing it's because they were so stubborn that they refused to run away. Ending up in them getting whipped out, instead of running away or getting to safety.

As for the two squads of power-armoured grenadiers... the fluffy thing to do is land raider proteus for squads. But the arvus lighter with twin-linked lascannon in reserve is a decent choice. Thows S5 Las-Locks could tear some squads up, and you get the chance to peg a tank on the side/rear armour with a lascannon.

Then you go other Malcador or Leeman Russ Squads in the heavy support.

It'd be a very conversion heavy army. I saw these guys and I think I need to steel it: http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/08/showcase-squats-40k-duardin-mashup.html


An idea is to build and convert a Stormhammer, two gorgons, and a malcador to look like they form a land-train together and separate to go into combat, but I don't know if I'm ready for that level of commitment.

I like the idea of taking Proteus Land Raiders, but the cost is a bit high when weighed against a Gorgon... between the sacrifice in troop transports and the absence of special weapons in a 10 man grenadier squad it makes it hard for them to fit in cohesively with the rest of the army. This squad makes the most sense to me as either a fully kitted command squad or grenadiers with S5 laslocks. The Command Squad if downgraded to 8 models could take the Augury for some Reserve help and the Scout rule... which is good if combined with Arvus Lighters. Really makes me wish for an Elite Grenadier squad, since I wouldn't want a command squad so far in front. Between a Proteus and Arvus Lighters you end up with some decent enough Lascannons striking at side and rear. I feel like it makes for a good forward distraction that might help keep your opponent from running straight upto your gunline.

The wording on Dedicated transports seems designed to make things frustrating, since Grenadier Squads have to number 20 models to take them it means adding Discipline Masters or Medicae means whatever other unit decides to ride the Gorgon has to be reducible in size below 20, no line of fodder troops running ahead of your grenadiers....

Anybody know.... the Advance Weapon rule says if you pay 20pts to upgrade you las-weapons for Grenadiers or the Command Cadre "all such squads in the army must be so upgrade... does that mean:
A) Upgrading a grenadier squad all grenadier squads must be upgraded, but not necessarily Command Cadres or
B) Upgrading either grenadiers or the Command Cadre means all of both must be so upgraded?
IF (B), even though it might be cost prohibitive, can you still upgrade to Boltguns, Heavy Stubbers, or Grenade Launchers per the normal options?

 aka_mythos wrote:
Anybody know.... the Advance Weapon rule says if you pay 20pts to upgrade you las-weapons for Grenadiers or the Command Cadre "all such squads in the army must be so upgrade... does that mean:
A) Upgrading a grenadier squad all grenadier squads must be upgraded, but not necessarily Command Cadres or
B) Upgrading either grenadiers or the Command Cadre means all of both must be so upgraded?
IF (B), even though it might be cost prohibitive, can you still upgrade to Boltguns, Heavy Stubbers, or Grenade Launchers per the normal options?

B is correct. You can upgrade every grenadier and command squad in your army, or not take the upgrade at all. And yes, you're still free to upgrade to other weapons, it's just a terrible idea to do so. Bolters are just as good (and better against other horde armies) so STR 4 lasguns are just a waste of points. I honestly have no idea why this rule even exists.

 aka_mythos wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:
I'm thinking of doing Squats with Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age... I'm still trying to figure out how to make it work.

lol, I had played with the idea for abit myself. But lately I've been playing at to many GW stores to use full 3rd party models for a army.

T4 with a +4sv gives the fire support squads some decent survivability. That then helps get the fire-power into the list you need so bad.

I also like the idea of buying explosive collars for Stubborn, but "count-as Squat Stubbornness". If you roll Double 6's, instead of their heads explodeing it's because they were so stubborn that they refused to run away. Ending up in them getting whipped out, instead of running away or getting to safety.

As for the two squads of power-armoured grenadiers... the fluffy thing to do is land raider proteus for squads. But the arvus lighter with twin-linked lascannon in reserve is a decent choice. Thows S5 Las-Locks could tear some squads up, and you get the chance to peg a tank on the side/rear armour with a lascannon.

Then you go other Malcador or Leeman Russ Squads in the heavy support.

It'd be a very conversion heavy army. I saw these guys and I think I need to steel it: http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/08/showcase-squats-40k-duardin-mashup.html


An idea is to build and convert a Stormhammer, two gorgons, and a malcador to look like they form a land-train together and separate to go into combat, but I don't know if I'm ready for that level of commitment.

I like the idea of taking Proteus Land Raiders, but the cost is a bit high when weighed against a Gorgon... between the sacrifice in troop transports and the absence of special weapons in a 10 man grenadier squad it makes it hard for them to fit in cohesively with the rest of the army. This squad makes the most sense to me as either a fully kitted command squad or grenadiers with S5 laslocks. The Command Squad if downgraded to 8 models could take the Augury for some Reserve help and the Scout rule... which is good if combined with Arvus Lighters. Really makes me wish for an Elite Grenadier squad, since I wouldn't want a command squad so far in front. Between a Proteus and Arvus Lighters you end up with some decent enough Lascannons striking at side and rear. I feel like it makes for a good forward distraction that might help keep your opponent from running straight upto your gunline.

The wording on Dedicated transports seems designed to make things frustrating, since Grenadier Squads have to number 20 models to take them it means adding Discipline Masters or Medicae means whatever other unit decides to ride the Gorgon has to be reducible in size below 20, no line of fodder troops running ahead of your grenadiers....

Anybody know.... the Advance Weapon rule says if you pay 20pts to upgrade you las-weapons for Grenadiers or the Command Cadre "all such squads in the army must be so upgrade... does that mean:
A) Upgrading a grenadier squad all grenadier squads must be upgraded, but not necessarily Command Cadres or
B) Upgrading either grenadiers or the Command Cadre means all of both must be so upgraded?
IF (B), even though it might be cost prohibitive, can you still upgrade to Boltguns, Heavy Stubbers, or Grenade Launchers per the normal options?

In my notes, it looks like me and my friend went with the B interpretation, and that you could still use bolters and such if you wish. Also note that the upgrade also effects the your rotor-Cannons.

I'm very tired writeing this so i hope to keep is sort, but have a idea for how to convert the tanks. If this didn't PM me after I pass out from this sleeping pill and try agien..



Useing Insta-mold/mould magic to make green-stuff push molds of the badges, celtic knots, ect from anything you can from the dwarf range. These green-stuff moulds help you quickly get that "dwarf bling" you will need for your tanks. Dwarven Symbols from unit standards would be the 1st choice. Also this kit you should take a look at:

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-CA/Gyrobomber

The celtic knots, and dwarf faces could be press moulded from that kit, helping to get more press moulds of the sort of details you need to convert your normal Imperial Vheclies into Dwarven/Squat ones.


Scibor's celtic plates are also a source of alot of thows celtic knot details you could made a push mould off, and then transfer to the tanks you are converting. Little Details like that can completly change the way a tank looks.
http://sciborminiatures.com/en_,shop.php?group=158


Finally, well thows Squat convertions look cool, the problem is that Bob Olley's Scrunts look good, have everything you need in the game. Power Armoured Dudes for you grenadiers, normal looking guys for your standard troopers and with generic heavy weapon team figures to make converting the teams a dream, and even Gnomes to use as your levi squads. lol
http://www.olleysarmies.co.uk/home.html

anyway, if you do do this, i under stand to see what you decide to do! I'm going to go pass out now lol

I like the celtic knot plates, I'll probably get some.

The Bob Olley stuff is classic, he sculpted the whole Squat line back in his GW days... but more and more I'm leaning towards power armored grenadier squads and there doesn't look like there will be room for the Militia squad I wanted to mix in. This army really needs some sort of Elite Grenadier squad as its just too easy to run out of troop slots.

 Peregrine wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:
Anybody know.... the Advance Weapon rule says if you pay 20pts to upgrade you las-weapons for Grenadiers or the Command Cadre "all such squads in the army must be so upgrade... does that mean:
A) Upgrading a grenadier squad all grenadier squads must be upgraded, but not necessarily Command Cadres or
B) Upgrading either grenadiers or the Command Cadre means all of both must be so upgraded?
IF (B), even though it might be cost prohibitive, can you still upgrade to Boltguns, Heavy Stubbers, or Grenade Launchers per the normal options?

B is correct. You can upgrade every grenadier and command squad in your army, or not take the upgrade at all. And yes, you're still free to upgrade to other weapons, it's just a terrible idea to do so. Bolters are just as good (and better against other horde armies) so STR 4 lasguns are just a waste of points. I honestly have no idea why this rule even exists.

Its obviously meant as part of the same backdoor throwback to Squats that having Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age allow... in the Rogue Trader era rules Squats had S4 Lasguns instead of the S3 lasguns all the normal humans had.

For the Command Cadre the upgrade is the same cost for bolters or S4 las, while for Grenadiers its 10pt cheaper than bolters. Alternatively you can get R30 S4 Rapid-fire Las for 5 points over the cost of Bolters for a whole squad of 20 grenadiers, that ability to out range bolters makes up for the AP5 and cost difference especially across so many models.

 aka_mythos wrote:
I like the celtic knot plates, I'll probably get some.

The Bob Olley stuff is classic, he sculpted the whole Squat line back in his GW days... but more and more I'm leaning towards power armored grenadier squads and there doesn't look like there will be room for the Militia squad I wanted to mix in. This army really needs some sort of Elite Grenadier squad as its just too easy to run out of troop slots.

 Peregrine wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:
Anybody know.... the Advance Weapon rule says if you pay 20pts to upgrade you las-weapons for Grenadiers or the Command Cadre "all such squads in the army must be so upgrade... does that mean:
A) Upgrading a grenadier squad all grenadier squads must be upgraded, but not necessarily Command Cadres or
B) Upgrading either grenadiers or the Command Cadre means all of both must be so upgraded?
IF (B), even though it might be cost prohibitive, can you still upgrade to Boltguns, Heavy Stubbers, or Grenade Launchers per the normal options?

B is correct. You can upgrade every grenadier and command squad in your army, or not take the upgrade at all. And yes, you're still free to upgrade to other weapons, it's just a terrible idea to do so. Bolters are just as good (and better against other horde armies) so STR 4 lasguns are just a waste of points. I honestly have no idea why this rule even exists.

Its obviously meant as part of the same backdoor throwback to Squats that having Abhuman Helots and Survivors of the Dark Age allow... in the Rogue Trader era rules Squats had S4 Lasguns instead of the S3 lasguns all the normal humans had.

For the Command Cadre the upgrade is the same cost for bolters or S4 las, while for Grenadiers its 10pt cheaper than bolters. Alternatively you can get R30 S4 Rapid-fire Las for 5 points over the cost of Bolters for a whole squad of 20 grenadiers, that ability to out range bolters makes up for the AP5 and cost difference especially across so many models.

The reason the upgrade exists mostly because it ads +1 to all las weapons, not just normal lascarbines. Las-locks are S4 already, so the upgrade makes them S5. If used with the Lasrifles it gives you a 30" range S4 gun.

But if you wanted to use lascarbines with the upgrade then yes, the bolters are better. Same price with better AP straight up.

Also if you take Survivors of the Dark Age you have to take 2 grenadier squads for compulsory troops. But after that you can buy any of the milita squads who are now running around in +4sv

But the moment you take the upgrade, you're committed to either S4 Las Carbines or paying wasted points on your Command Cadre. That's the only reason to second guess the cost effectiveness of it.

Abhuman Helot + Survivor of the Dark Age Ogryn Brute squads... 35 pts per model... I imagine a squad with a mix of Boarding Shields and Power Weapons would make for a nice assault unit. You guys have any other good ideas of how you'd use them?

Would this faction be a viable way to make '30k legal' Orks?

 Dakkamite wrote:
Would this faction be a viable way to make '30k legal' Orks?

Kinda (a poor proxy, if anything), though Orks are already "30k legal" the only issue is 'balancing' the point costs. 9.9 times out of 10, people will have 0 issue with a 30k v ork game.

 Dakkamite wrote:
Would this faction be a viable way to make '30k legal' Orks?

Like Brennojw said Orks were around so their codex is already appropriate but assuming people want to force you to use a list out of one the FW HH books, its probably the most workable of all such lists though its an imperfect fit.

Its more that the 40k Ork book is kind of lame and unfun to play with, would be open to running them as "humans" taking options for higher toughness etc

Generally "30k orks" is ork codex plus their FW units in the age of darkness FOC. None of the ork formations allowed. Formations aren't a thing in age of darkness. (That is how it works more or less for codex demons.)

I've seen it house ruled that in 30k orks should be able to be 1-3 of the same troop choice in one troop slot. But that only matters when you start playing games in the larger points.

What you could do with the list the is make a diggaboyz army?

You can actually do a pretty fail approximation.

Abhuman Helots gives you T4, I2, and Feral Warriors gives you WS4 and the option of A2. That's pretty close to a generic ork statline - you lose out on S4 on the charge, but even then your 'ardboyz can be grenadiers with augmented weapons.

The one thing you lack is orky leadership - lacking Mob Rule, you're vulnerable to losing combat and suffering sweeping advance...but then so is every other bugger in 30k games.

Discipline Master Cadres and Discipline Collars are the order of the day.

The big problem is that I think you have to make your force commander your warlord, so no ogryn boss warlords (who would be Da Biggest!)

Maby what you want is a 30k beast men army? abhumans and tainted flesh work prety good together. Minotaur ogryn fitting well inot the force. The rending from tainted flesh helps a lot for any cc focused force. Also the explosive collars helps with any LD concerns.

It's the reason I'm not sold on doing "orkz" because of the LD issues if you want to use anything but levy squads.

Rending just makes such a huge difference for these guys I feel.

you could take dicipline officers and say they are nobs and put the in your squads if you are worried about leadership

No mob rule? Sold. That nonsense is just unnecessary RNG in one of the most important stats in the game.

Would be nice to have fearless or whatever, but have heard that this isn't a thing in 30k before.

Which books, supplements, and so forth would I need to look at to find Imperial cults, mutant chaos armies, or whatever else could be a good approximation?

Larger points were the only 40k games I bothered with, so I'll keep in mind the hard and fast rule for transferring them over.