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395 -- Epistolary w/ FotD, FotA, Terminator Armor, CCW and Terminator Command x4 w/ Assault Cannon x2, Chain Fist

240 -- Terminator x5 w/ Assault Cannon x2

255 -- Terminator x5 w/ Assault Cannon x2, Tank Hunter

145 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Plasma Gun x2, Drop Pod

145 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Plasma Gun x2, Drop Pod

145 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Plasma Gun x2, Drop Pod

175 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Veteran Sargeant, Power Fist, Melta Gun x2, Drop Pod

175 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Veteran Sargeant, Power Fist, Melta Gun x2, Drop Pod

175 -- Tactical Marine x6 w/ Veteran Sargeant, Power Fist, Melta Gun x2, Drop Pod

51 Models, 7 pods, 6 Plasma Guns, 6 Melta Guns, 6 Assault Cannons, ~13.5 dead meq on a statistical initial drop. Basically, I didn't like dreads (all or none in my opinion) or land speeders (no shoot on the drop), which leaves all-infantry. I don't like apothecaries for this reason: If you go second and drop, in an average 6-turn game you're going to get 4 turns max to make the 25 points back, which means 2 regular guys or 1 terminator. The odds, imo~, favor not taking them. That's just my thoughts though, I know some people have a lot of success with them.

For pods, I was thinking either the above list or a terminator/dread heavy list. What I came up with, though, only puts out ~11.5 on the intial drop statistically (4 terminator units/3 dreads) and doesn't feel like it's near as resilient. Venerable or no, all the AT is going to be focused on those dreads.

I've basically narrowed it down to pods (either type) or Iron Warriors for a new competitive army that I'd like to put together. The notional IW list killed ~27.5 meq per turn in normal/slightly advantageous conditions (4 hits per pie plate, all units rapid firing at >12", and no cover saves). I know it's just theoryhammer, but I feel like you need some baseline to compare armies. Anyways, this is basically the same dakka that the pod list puts out with everything shooting, but is static vice the initial maneuverability of the pods.

Anyways, on to the questions:

Is my pod list competitive? What tweaks would make it more so? Is the premise sound (no armor)? What about the tentative IW list (6 las/plas, 4 pie plates, 6 oblits)? How do you make a dread/terminator drop list work?

...And damn the forum monster for making me retype this entire thing! (You'd think I'd remember to copy the text prior to hitting submit...)

Only two points I am concerned with--
1- no homers?
2- those 6 man fist squads look a little bit thin. Only 3 dead marines before they get to the juicy bits.

If I were to do IW, I'd go with 4 possessed, mutated predators and 4 oblits (2, 1, 1), then whatever else. The pieplates are just not as good as they look on paper.

You know, I went through every page of army lists available and I found a grand total of two IW lists. I know more people have to be playing them...

Edit: ...And 215 points for a 3 lascannons, one of which is twin linked? Erm, doesn't that seem a bit expensive for what it provides considering how cheap and easy you can snag lascannons via troops and obliterators?

Ugh, sorry--It's late and I was flipping through the book too quickly. You really think that the mutated hull is worth it though?

Also... 2 Defilers, 1 Vindicator, and 1 Basilisk can be purchased for ~600 points give or take. You think that'll perform superior to 4 pie plates? Those plates slaughter meq's...

AV 14 means S7 can't hurt you. That means plasmaguns, autocannons, and some other crap I'm not thinking of I'm sure. It also means S9 penetrates you drastically less often (need a 6 to penetrate, vs. needing a 5,6 to penetrate).

Yes I think it's worth it but only if you buy it on all four and use them to protect each other.

Let's look at some numbers and factoids on pie vs. not pie.

Pie does not do a lot of damage to vehicles due to the hole scattering off a lot of the time. Particularly if you move and fire.

S8 pie hitting 5 marines - deals out 2.8 dead marines in 5+ cover. The problem is a more realistic number of average hits with a defiler is significantly less than 5. It'll scatter off completely a fair bit of the time, and get 3 partials and nothing a lot of the time too. Once your opponents stop bunching up and start using cover, you get 1-2 dead marines a turn.

TL Las/Hb predator vs. marines: hits 89% of the time, dealing .75 dead marines, .5 dead marines in cover. Heavy bolters deal 6 shots, 4 hits, 2.66 wounds, .89 dead marines. So you get around 1.4 dead marines from the TL las/HB predator. Admittedly, not its optimal target, but not much worse than shooting a pie plate at spread out marines in cover.

I'm not sure I would go all that route, in thinking about it some more. Maybe 4 autocannon/hb predators with possession/hull, some shootie tac squads and obliterators. Maybe a mix of a vindicator, 2 predators and a defiler?

I've seen a lot of people using a vindi, bas, and 2 defilers though, and they rarely do that well.