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 TheAuldGrump wrote:

 agnosto wrote:
Understand the law and the topic of conversation? Pshaw! It's much easier to jump to extreme conclusions, make wild accusations, blindly throw legal threats around and exit stage right. All done on an anonymous discussion board of course.

Because the lawyers were chosen for attitude, not experience!

The Auld Grump

QFT. I wouldn't be shocked if they hired some of the white knights on this board or elsewhere for high level positions then.

Davor wrote:
With all this talk of Kirby is doing this and Kirby is doing that, why is he not under investigation? These are all illegal allegations being made. If true he could be in prison. If not true, people can be sued for slander.

If true there should be an investigation and then he should answer for his actions. Seeing this is not happening and the shareholders are not asking questions I don't think this is the case.

If not true, a slander case can happen agiasnt some members of Dakka now. A line has been crossed when you start making fun of a persons wife.

I don't think anyone has accused him of breaking the law. Nepotism, while dumb, is not illegal. Since I was (I believe the first in this thread) to point out the issue with the website occurring while Kirby's wife was interim director of IT for the company - and showed that through GW's own documents (should hope those should be truthful)...I don't think there is anything to even approach slander.

Off color (or otherwise) remarks of what Kirby did with his wife, or what she did to get the job aside (pretty sure those would be largely truthful - being married and what not) would also not amount to slander.

I think the only one who really hinted at any sort of illegal activity was Backfire...when he came to GW's defense. I don't think there is any sort of embezzlement going on, just incompetence by someone who is out of their depth.

As noted by Xca|iber though - even the off color comments become (relatively) fair game as soon as they decided to include her in the report as a director of a significant division of a global company (IT isn't just beepers and email anymore...companies live and die by effective management of their IT departments). At that point, she becomes the IT director who headed up a significantly overcosted website rollout - who also happens to be the Chairman and CEO's wife.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:

Davor wrote:
With all this talk of Kirby is doing this and Kirby is doing that, why is he not under investigation? These are all illegal allegations being made. If true he could be in prison. If not true, people can be sued for slander.

If true there should be an investigation and then he should answer for his actions. Seeing this is not happening and the shareholders are not asking questions I don't think this is the case.

If not true, a slander case can happen agiasnt some members of Dakka now. A line has been crossed when you start making fun of a persons wife.

I don't think anyone has accused him of breaking the law. Nepotism, while dumb, is not illegal. Since I was (I believe the first in this thread) to point out the issue with the website occurring while Kirby's wife was interim director of IT for the company - and showed that through GW's own documents (should hope those should be truthful)...I don't think there is anything to even approach slander.

Off color (or otherwise) remarks of what Kirby did with his wife, or what she did to get the job aside (pretty sure those would be largely truthful - being married and what not) would also not amount to slander.

I think the only one who really hinted at any sort of illegal activity was Backfire...when he came to GW's defense. I don't think there is any sort of embezzlement going on, just incompetence by someone who is out of their depth.

As noted by Xca|iber though - even the off color comments become (relatively) fair game as soon as they decided to include her in the report as a director of a significant division of a global company (IT isn't just beepers and email anymore...companies live and die by effective management of their IT departments). At that point, she becomes the IT director who headed up a significantly overcosted website rollout - who also happens to be the Chairman and CEO's wife.

Mind you, folks have sued over the competition spouting inconvenient truths. (AT&T sued Verizon over the competition's 'There's a Map for That' ads that were using AT&T's own statistics on how poorly AT&T covered the U.S. for 4G.... The judge even pointed out during the trial that using the truth in advertising isn't illegal....)

Mind you, they are unlikely to win, but....

The Auld Grump

This is true - the burden for bringing suit is pretty low...

...I aint scared though. Pretty sure Mr. and Mrs. Kirby would be more interested in keeping Warrior and Associates particulars out of the public eye than they would be in silencing anyone's commentary on her qualifications to head an IT department.

WayneTheGame wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Frankly I really don't want to think about Kirby's sex life. Is there another direction we can take this conversation please?

Sure! BoLS has an interesting article up comparing GW's financials to Asmodee's (gaming company that just merged with Fantasy Flight Games) financials:
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/01/games-workshop-vs-asmodee-tale-2-companies.html

And with the typical BOLS type of comments too. "People have been saying GW will go out of business since 2004".

Lightweights.

People on usenet were saying GW will go out of business since at least 1995.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

WayneTheGame wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Frankly I really don't want to think about Kirby's sex life. Is there another direction we can take this conversation please?

Sure! BoLS has an interesting article up comparing GW's financials to Asmodee's (gaming company that just merged with Fantasy Flight Games) financials:
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/01/games-workshop-vs-asmodee-tale-2-companies.html

And with the typical BOLS type of comments too. "People have been saying GW will go out of business since 2004".

Lightweights.

People on usenet were saying GW will go out of business since at least 1995.

so, you haven't read the last three financial reports?

OMG. Kid_Kyoto: you have to write a preamble for the next annual report, and release it like a few days before the 'real' one comes out. Would love to see that.

So, is the allready a wager running when GW is going belly-up? Any quotes? Come on, I thought the Brittish would bet on near-anything.

 Kosake wrote:
So, is the allready a wager running when GW is going belly-up? Any quotes? Come on, I thought the Brittish would bet on near-anything.

It is like betting on how long you can live while being fed your surgically removed body parts: there is still good eating on the carcass of GW.
Since I have got reacquainted with Palladium Books and their Kickstarter I now know it is possible to continue on with a shoestring budget for decades.

The real question would be: how do you know when they reach the stage they are no longer relevant?

The possible answer is when you no longer care and the question is pointless to you.

 Talizvar wrote:

 Kosake wrote:
So, is the allready a wager running when GW is going belly-up? Any quotes? Come on, I thought the Brittish would bet on near-anything.

It is like betting on how long you can live while being fed your surgically removed body parts: there is still good eating on the carcass of GW.
Since I have got reacquainted with Palladium Books and their Kickstarter I now know it is possible to continue on with a shoestring budget for decades.

The real question would be: how do you know when they reach the stage they are no longer relevant?

The possible answer is when you no longer care and the question is pointless to you.

For a lot of people that point has past.

 Torga_DW wrote:
OMG. Kid_Kyoto: you have to write a preamble for the next annual report, and release it like a few days before the 'real' one comes out. Would love to see that.

I could never, ever top Tom "our crops with wither' Kirby. I mean seriously, I would have sworn that was a parody when I saw the cheap shot about 'laws meant to keep people from stealing pigs'.

As Tom Leher (allegedly) said when Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Peace Prize...

How do you top that?

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Torga_DW wrote:
OMG. Kid_Kyoto: you have to write a preamble for the next annual report, and release it like a few days before the 'real' one comes out. Would love to see that.

I could never, ever top Tom "our crops with wither' Kirby. I mean seriously, I would have sworn that was a parody when I saw the cheap shot about 'laws meant to keep people from stealing pigs'.

As Tom Leher (allegedly) said when Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Peace Prize...

How do you top that?

Yes, though you do lack the skills, you do have the right attitude and that's what GW is looking for.

 Talizvar wrote:
Since I have got reacquainted with Palladium Books and their Kickstarter I now know it is possible to continue on with a shoestring budget for decades.

Palladium doesn't have the manufacturing nor retail overhead GW has. Palladium sends all their books to printers they don't own to be printed and has no retail wing. All they really have to pay for is each printing with however much that cost, some sort of warehouse, a small website and whatever talent the contract with on per book bases. Palladium could be run out of someone's house and still be in business with no major issues.

GW on the other hand has manufacturing overhead that has to be paid regardless of what is being produced. They also have a retail wing that eats money even if nothing is sold. GW also sees itself as a model making company, not a game company and as such, will almost never contract model production to another company nor would they manufacture for another company which might compete in their own space.

Big difference between companies.

 Talizvar wrote:

 Kosake wrote:
So, is the allready a wager running when GW is going belly-up? Any quotes? Come on, I thought the Brittish would bet on near-anything.

It is like betting on how long you can live while being fed your surgically removed body parts: there is still good eating on the carcass of GW.
Since I have got reacquainted with Palladium Books and their Kickstarter I now know it is possible to continue on with a shoestring budget for decades.

The real question would be: how do you know when they reach the stage they are no longer relevant?

The possible answer is when you no longer care and the question is pointless to you.

My answer:
When GW's largest competitor has greater net sales than GW.

Alternately:
When the net sales of the combined competition outsells GW by 3:1. (A full majority.)

Already, GW's dominance outside of their own stores is slipping.

In Oz... they may already have become irrelevant.

The Auld Grump

 TheAuldGrump wrote:


Alternately:
When the net sales of the combined competition outsells GW by 3:1. (A full majority.)

That's been the case for a while. Even optimistic surveys of the competition buy GW at 15-25% of the Wargaming market. Expand that to include cards and boardgames and they'll drop to single digits.

There are literally thousands of wargames manufacturers out there, though only maybe a couple dozen 'big' ones, who are on multi-million annual revenues.

Herzlos wrote:

 TheAuldGrump wrote:


Alternately:
When the net sales of the combined competition outsells GW by 3:1. (A full majority.)

That's been the case for a while. Even optimistic surveys of the competition buy GW at 15-25% of the Wargaming market. Expand that to include cards and boardgames and they'll drop to single digits.

There are literally thousands of wargames manufacturers out there, though only maybe a couple dozen 'big' ones, who are on multi-million annual revenues.

I was being a bit narrower than that - assuming 'fantasy and science fantasy miniatures gaming' rather than 'wargaming' or the more general 'tabletop gaming'.

If we throw in boardgames then Hasbro is the winner.

The Auld Grump