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I'm trying to come down to which of these two lists would be stronger, I figure if there is anywhere that could help me come up with the stronger list, dakka would be the place.  Both lists are at 1850 and are cut throat, they use the same trait setup which isn't going to win friends.

Traits: Cleanse & Purify + Heed the Wisdom of the Ancients
Disadvantages: Without Allies + Eye To Eye

List 1

HQ
Epistolary w/ Fury, Fear, Storm Bolter, & Terminator Armor - 159 Points
Terminator Command Squad - 220 Points
4 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Elites
Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Troops
Tactical Squad - 210 Points
10 Marines - 2 Meltaguns, Vet w/ PF & Teleport Homer
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Tactical Squad - 210 Points
10 Marines - 2 Meltaguns, Vet w/ PF & Teleport Homer
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnought - 150 Points
Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor, Tank Hunters (Ran out of places to spend points)
Drop Pod - 30 Points

List 2



HQ
Epistolary w/ Fury, Fear, Storm Bolter, & Terminator Armor - 159 Points
Terminator Command Squad - 220 Points
4 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Elites
Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Terminator Squad - 260 Points
5 Termaintors - 2 Assault Cannons, Tank Hunters, Teleport Homer

Troops
Tactical Squad - 115 Points
6 Marines - 2 Meltaguns
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Tactical Squad - 145 Points
8 Marines - 2 Meltaguns
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnought - 140 Points
Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Venerable Dreadnought - 140 Points
Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor
Drop Pod - 30 Points

Basically the difference is that in list two I drop the # of power armored Marines, lose the Power Fisted Sarges but I keep the same anti-tank firepower, in exchange for a second Venerable Dread in a pod.  I'm not sure if the loss of bodies and CC potential is worth the second venerable dread.  In some cases I can see it being worthwhile, where in other cases it wouldn't be.  I'm trying to come up with which one puts me in a better situation. 

With the extra Dread I have more scoring units and the tactical squads become throwaways that I can put in suicide runs to kill important targets.

The Dreads would always get up close and personal when it made sense to do so.  

I do lose the bolter firepower and CC potential of the PF Sarge but I get another assault cannon and something else that can really cause trouble.

Advice would be appreciated.

I would drop the Librarian's storm bolter, he won't fire it. And I personally use furious charge with my Librarian and termie command squad. And I would put a chainfist in each termie squad instead of using tank hunter.

I personally would modify list #1 by dropping a termie squad, adding the second dread and increasing the remaining two squads by one termie each.

Id as well drop the Storm Bolter and upgrade to a Librarian. The rest is preference. Nowerdays there arent many things around where Dreads really shine. So you can drop thouse all together as long as you arent interested in the models too much. Tank Hunter on everything is ok (bye bye Skimmers). Drop the Meltaguns from your troops though, you ve got anti tank overed.

Get Plasma and Apothecaries with Bolterplasma and Fist. Thouse can save your Termis too. When points allow get 3 small squads with max heavy weapons.

Maybe I am wrong because I posting from memory (don't have a copy of the codex on my workplace) but using those traits you may get dreadys as heavy support and elites, but the venerables will fill elites slots and not heavy support.... so neither list 1 nor list 2 are legal...

Changing your dreadys into normal (no-venerables) ones... will free some points to get another tactical squad, or some snipers scouts or even a tornado.... that?s for you to choose

The Libby has a Storm Bolter because that's what the model came with. Assuming that the DA get a new Libby Terminator model released, I'll probably convert that to have a power weapon + Force Weapon so he gets the extra attack, not sure where I'll get the 10 points from to have it over the storm bolter though.

I really hope that happens as I don't like the current terminator libby model.

Also, check the Space Marine FAQ, you can have 6 Venerable Dreads, there is no 0-1 limit anymore.

I went dual meltagun because I do have an fear of armor and because it gives me good anti-MEQ punch on the drop in case there isn't any armor worth busting. Plus I can fire both off and assault afterwards, though that's really only an issue in the first list since I have PF Sarges in both Tac squads.

I prefer Tank Hunters and no Chainfists. Tank Hunters on assault cannons takes down AV12 Skimmers, I only have to point you guys to every freakin thread on Eldar right now to show exactly how many AV12 skimmers will be running around. It also makes them the best anti-armor gun in the game since it's now that much better against AV10-12 targets so I can deal with Rhino/Pred Side armor and it gets me more glances on speeders/vypers.

you are rigth abourt the faq trait....

the elites must be venerables, but the heavy support dready can be upgraded (or not) to venerables...

my fault.. bad reading...worst understanding...

sorry mate...