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KalashnikovMarine wrote: So to offset the negative cop videos. Here's a police officer in Oceanside doing it right. Now I do have an issue with this mook carrying because he didn't have his I.D. or CCW on him. Both of which you should have if you have your weapon on you. So this guy was clearly trying to prove a point in /not/ making life easy on the extremely professional and reasonable officer.
Also fun fact, open carry whether your have a permit or not is now illegal in California.
When did that change?
January 1st 2012 according to a Cali CCW website.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
That sucks, although I can understand the reason Cops don't like it.
Their training is to identify potential threats. Someone with a gun is a potential threat.
The Cops know that the person abiding the law with a CCW permit, or even Open Carry, is not a danger(yet)
The yet is what unsettles the officers. They are only human after all, at the end of the day they want to go home to their family.
This can lead to the officers making bad judgements, it is a high stress job. Even without the threat to their personal safety, all the crap they go through every day can wear them down.
They see the worst humanity has to offer. We got to cut them slack on occasion, and make sure they recieve proper resources to deal with it. Including better education about the laws they are enforcing alongside with proper counciling services.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Be reasonable and polite to police and you generally don't have an issue. Even the border patrol stops between San Diego and Yuma have a sense of humor if you're polite about it. Story time:
The third time we were "randomly" stopped because my buddy in my passenger seat was a mexican fellow he decided he decided he didn't speak english and he does a hell of a confused stupid look. He just kept repeating softly to himself "not the trunk again" in spanish. The cop asked where we coming from before asking for ID and when I told him north of LA he chuckled at my buddy and waved us through.
On a serious note always lock your car if you exit and make sure the windows are up. In california not doing this is an open invitation to a search. This is more for people who annoy the cops and teenagers but hey, figured I'd throw it out there.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/09/27 20:04:07
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We have ID cards in Israel. The cops ask for it if you're speeding or going into an airport. It's not a big deal and the world didn't end. People need to stop being so paranoid that 1984 is right around the corner. No Westernized country is in danger of becoming a totalitarian police state.
Kaldor wrote: To be honest, most of the problems I've seen (and I never encountered any myself as a LEO) result not from officers getting pissed off that someone is exercising their right to not be identified, but officers getting pissed off at donkey-caves acting like donkey-caves to prove a point. To paraphrase many of the incidents I've seen:
"Can I see some ID?"
"I DON'T HAVE TO SHOW YOU JACK, YOU STUPID PIG! NEENER NEENER, CAN'T TOUCH ME, I KNOW MY RIGHTS!"
And things generally go badly from that point.
I agree.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I think it's a bit ridiculous for the police to randomly ask for papers, but I can't think of any legitimate reason why someone should have a right not to comply.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/09/27 20:30:41
As a discussion grows in length, the probability of a comparison to Matt Ward or Gray Knights approaches one.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
More like I can't see a legitimate reason for someone not to just show their ID and be on their way.
Nobody bats an eyelash when the bartender or cashier asks for ID because you're buying some Beer, but if a Cop asks for it people get all huffy.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Which part of the video?
I don't remember seeing that.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Ok, thats wrong.
But from what it shows the officers probably didn't even notice that guy.
Given the guy taking the video's attitude and such all their attention would be on him and not really concious of the guy on a bike thats gone by them.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
But from what it shows the officers probably didn't even notice that guy.
Given the guy taking the video's attitude and such all their attention would be on him and not really concious of the guy on a bike thats gone by them.
For what it's worth I kind of agree that that last one isn't a great example....
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
If the guy taping had been with a white buddy of his riding, both had been lacking their helmets, and his buddy didn't get a ticket then he might have a point.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/09/27 21:10:04
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Grey Templar wrote: That sucks, although I can understand the reason Cops don't like it.
Their training is to identify potential threats. Someone with a gun is a potential threat.
The Cops know that the person abiding the law with a CCW permit, or even Open Carry, is not a danger(yet)
The yet is what unsettles the officers. They are only human after all, at the end of the day they want to go home to their family.
This can lead to the officers making bad judgements, it is a high stress job. Even without the threat to their personal safety, all the crap they go through every day can wear them down.
They see the worst humanity has to offer. We got to cut them slack on occasion, and make sure they recieve proper resources to deal with it. Including better education about the laws they are enforcing alongside with proper counciling services.
It's generally more a case of some panicked civilian calling up and saying "Oh my god, there's a guy here with a gun, hurry!" and the cops having to think "well, it's probably just a case of someone openly carrying a firearm, but I suppose it could be a psycho about to shoot up the neighbourhood." Of course they're going to be a bit on edge en-route to their job, they could be about to confront some psychopath who is going to try and kill them. This tension doesn't just dissolve when they realise it's just some moron with a camera trying to prove a point about his rights, it bleeds over and makes the entire encounter more tense than it needs to be, and makes it much easier for the officer to get pissed off when the moron in question starts acting like an donkey-cave.
"Did you ever notice how in the Bible, when ever God needed to punish someone, or make an example, or whenever God needed a killing, he sent an angel? Did you ever wonder what a creature like that must be like? A whole existence spent praising your God, but always with one wing dipped in blood. Would you ever really want to see an angel?"
Harriticus wrote:We have ID cards in Israel. The cops ask for it if you're speeding or going into an airport. It's not a big deal and the world didn't end. People need to stop being so paranoid that 1984 is right around the corner. No Westernized country is in danger of becoming a totalitarian police state.
There's so much about Israeli society that simply doesn't translate here that you point while well ińentioned is meaningless.
Avatar 720 wrote: You see, to Auston, everyone is a Death Star; there's only one way you can take it and that's through a small gap at the back.
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
Harriticus wrote:We have ID cards in Israel. The cops ask for it if you're speeding or going into an airport. It's not a big deal and the world didn't end. People need to stop being so paranoid that 1984 is right around the corner. No Westernized country is in danger of becoming a totalitarian police state.
There's so much about Israeli society that simply doesn't translate here that you point while well ińentioned is meaningless.
Why does your 'intentioned ' have an enye... Sir I'm gonna have to see your papers
H.B.M.C. wrote:
"Balance, playtesting - a casual gamer craves not these things!" - Yoda, a casual gamer.
Three things matter in marksmanship -
location, location, location
MagickalMemories wrote:How about making another fist?
One can be, "Da Fist uv Mork" and the second can be, "Da Uvver Fist uv Mork."
Make a third, and it can be, "Da Uvver Uvver Fist uv Mork"
Eric
KalashnikovMarine wrote:I used to think carrying a 1911 at condition one was insane... now that I've actually done it I'd say on average it's safer then carrying a glock period XD.
You're gonna have to explain this one to me. How in the world have you managed to arrive at this conclusion, especially with regard to the safety that glocks employ.
You mean their bs nonexistent safety? A 1911 has a passive grip safety, and an active thumb safety. A Glock has no safety. On the positive it can be used as a brick to back stop your car when you work on it. ;P
I have both types. I switched to DA (S&W style) for an M&Pc when shifting from .45ACP, as my hand shaking was getting progressively worse. I went with DA because its what I use in IDPA, and I figured, in a problem scenario, muscle memory would have me pull and try to shoot and not run the the thumb safety. but if you drill regularly with a thumb safety, you should be in an a much safer position.
KalashnikovMarine wrote:I used to think carrying a 1911 at condition one was insane... now that I've actually done it I'd say on average it's safer then carrying a glock period XD.
You're gonna have to explain this one to me. How in the world have you managed to arrive at this conclusion, especially with regard to the safety that glocks employ.
Glocks have a bit of a reputation with their "internal only" safety for accidental/negligent discharges. In fact depending on your opinion the Glock doesn't have a safety at all. Certainly nothing vaguely as safe or effective as a manual safety. The last bit was honestly more or less a joke though I personally am not a Glock man. I do find their safety system a bit suspect but with the sheer number of Glocks in LEO and civilian hands world wide it's clearly effective, I even have a Smith and Wesson M&P that is set up similarly... though for just that reason I carry it at condition three. (Mag inserted, no round in chamber)
I read the article... it keeps referring to glock's accidental discharges, but I was always under the impression that most of glock's misfires were the result of the design's highly stupid manner of disassembly, and people firing into their own hands. (I should say at this point, I personally dislike glocks and greatly prefer the 1911 as well.)
No. "Glock leg" is a real deal. Especially with numbnuts who lighten the triggers.
inversely I've seen guys go the other way and put New York triggers on their Glocks.
KalashnikovMarine wrote: So to offset the negative cop videos. Here's a police officer in Oceanside doing it right. Now I do have an issue with this mook carrying because he didn't have his I.D. or CCW on him. Both of which you should have if you have your weapon on you. So this guy was clearly trying to prove a point in /not/ making life easy on the extremely professional and reasonable officer.
Also fun fact, open carry whether your have a permit or not is now illegal in California.
When did that change?
Last six months. Not sure if it has gone through the court system yet.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2012/09/28 00:28:16
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
My Glock has a 3 lbs 10oz trigger pull. It has a 3.5 lb connector, and a leaf trigger spring instead of the stock coil. The stock trigger is supposed to be 5 the normally clock in at 5 4oz and 5 8oz.
Avatar 720 wrote: You see, to Auston, everyone is a Death Star; there's only one way you can take it and that's through a small gap at the back.
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
Grey Templar wrote: Which has more to do with the police not being educated on the laws they are supposed to enforce.
This isn't exactly their fault. A cop has better things to do then read up on our fethed up laws.
I think this is a great point back on topic. It seems like things would go a lot better if LEO were better trained on how to act when citizens express their right to film them and also their right to question detainment. Here is a good example of a police officer overreacting..albeit he remained calm. he didn't need to call in 6 or 7 other LEO's though. That was quite ridiculous.
GG
I'm confused: he was originally pulled over because he was not wearing a helmet while operating his vehicle, and in the end he was issued a valid ticket for not wearing a helmet while operating his vehicle.
Exactly what rights were violated?
None.
The scooter is electric and under California law that requires the rider to wear a bicycle helmet. Apparently the rider's legal knowledge was less than he thought.
AustonT wrote: My Glock has a 3 lbs 10oz trigger pull. It has a 3.5 lb connector, and a leaf trigger spring instead of the stock coil. The stock trigger is supposed to be 5 the normally clock in at 5 4oz and 5 8oz.
Yeah, see, I wouldn't carry that. Just personal preference. Hell, I think the PPQ trigger is too light for carry.
AustonT wrote: My Glock has a 3 lbs 10oz trigger pull. It has a 3.5 lb connector, and a leaf trigger spring instead of the stock coil. The stock trigger is supposed to be 5 the normally clock in at 5 4oz and 5 8oz.
Yeah, see, I wouldn't carry that. Just personal preference. Hell, I think the PPQ trigger is too light for carry.
Different strokes I suppose. In the same vein I wouldn't bring a tactical or a hunting rifle below 2-3lbs and guys out there have hunting rigs with 4oz triggers. It's comfort zone.
Avatar 720 wrote: You see, to Auston, everyone is a Death Star; there's only one way you can take it and that's through a small gap at the back.
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
I dont understand the hype about this, in my country the police is allowed to check your papers.
Also why would you not want them to see them if you didnt do anything wrong?
motyak wrote:[...] Yes, the mods are illuminati, and yakface, lego and dakka dakka itself are the 3 points of the triangle.
Daemonhammer wrote: I dont understand the hype about this, in my country the police is allowed to check your papers.
Also why would you not want them to see them if you didnt do anything wrong?
And what happens when the police say you did something wrong and you didn't
H.B.M.C. wrote:
"Balance, playtesting - a casual gamer craves not these things!" - Yoda, a casual gamer.
Three things matter in marksmanship -
location, location, location
MagickalMemories wrote:How about making another fist?
One can be, "Da Fist uv Mork" and the second can be, "Da Uvver Fist uv Mork."
Make a third, and it can be, "Da Uvver Uvver Fist uv Mork"
Eric
Basically if you haven't done anything wrong/anything to give the police "reasonable suspicion", it's none of their business who I am, where I live, etc. I have the right to privacy, except where that right is abridged for legitimate safety reasons.
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Daemonhammer wrote:I dont understand the hype about this, in my country the police is allowed to check your papers.
Also why would you not want them to see them if you didnt do anything wrong?
Mannahnin wrote:Basically if you haven't done anything wrong/anything to give the police "reasonable suspicion", it's none of their business who I am, where I live, etc. I have the right to privacy, except where that right is abridged for legitimate safety reasons.
There's this perfectly reasonable response and my Merika Hurr response:
Because I have the God given right to wave my fourth amendment rights in the face of the rozzers.
Avatar 720 wrote: You see, to Auston, everyone is a Death Star; there's only one way you can take it and that's through a small gap at the back.
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
AustonT wrote: My Glock has a 3 lbs 10oz trigger pull. It has a 3.5 lb connector, and a leaf trigger spring instead of the stock coil. The stock trigger is supposed to be 5 the normally clock in at 5 4oz and 5 8oz.
My Beretta has a 4lb trigger. I am about to send my M&P in for a 3.5lb job. I swear my 29 has a 1ounce trigger. I breath heavy in SA mode and it goes off.
AustonT wrote: My Glock has a 3 lbs 10oz trigger pull. It has a 3.5 lb connector, and a leaf trigger spring instead of the stock coil. The stock trigger is supposed to be 5 the normally clock in at 5 4oz and 5 8oz.
Yeah, see, I wouldn't carry that. Just personal preference. Hell, I think the PPQ trigger is too light for carry.
Ayah I am keeping my M&Pc at its factory pull. Without a manual safety I wouldn't trust it otherwise.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/01 02:11:40
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
KalashnikovMarine wrote: How do you like your M&PC Frazzle? I love mine... it's not quite a pocket carry but it's damn close.
Its new so experimenting with different holsters still. Its pretty accurate and about the same size as my old Kimber ultra carry. The S&W holster I acquired seems too fat, but we'll get it down. Does yours take all types of ammo? Mine doesn't seem to like Remington golden sabres so I'm using old school hardball until I test out some Hornady XTPs I just procured.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
