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I'm looking to make a somewhat competitive World Eaters list (if such a thing is possible) and one thing that is always a double edged sword is Blood Frenzy.

On one hand, it is great, because you get an extra d6 movement... On the other hand, you can't shoot, and run off toward the nearest fast skimmer or monolith usually.

Talisman only costs 5 points and basically doubles your chance of Frenzying, but it's still just a chance, and even if you do, I usually roll a 1 for distance...

A good rhino costs 58 pts (with smoke and armor) and you always get to move 12", but can't assault, and of course are potentially coffins if you get a pen, also there is still the possibility my men will rage.

Also, having rhinos actually gives me the chance of shooting plasma pistols when I disembark...

So, anyways, I guess the question is, which is more tactically sound, Rhinos or Talismans?

The armies that scare me with foot-slogging khorne are Godzillas, and mech eldar

I think I'd prefer the rhinos. But if I were doing WE, I'd have plenty of bloodletters, and rhinos are excellent for hiding icons.

The problem with walking is that daemons can come in way too soon and too far away.

But consider both. Rhinos AND the talismans. If you're daemon lite, you simply use the rhinos for cover/LOS blocking.

Drive up sideways 12" turn 1, but stay in the Rhino.

Turn 2, get out, move, and assault (And potentially rage)

New Rhino Rush, but not as good as the old one.

...and don't forget to pop smoke the turn you stay in the rhino.

I've used both rhinos (with destroyer upgrade) and TBB with the rhino points spent on an uber bikebomb squad. Both work about equally well, but make for a different kind of game.

In the rhino army the berzerkers are more important, and the ones who's rhino doesn't get killed actually usually reach close combat within a turn of the daemons. But you can pretty much assume at least one rhino isn't going to make it.

In the bike/TBB army, the game is won or lost on the bike movement and summoning placement. The berzerkers are marginalized as a mop-up wave and function mainly to draw fire and apply tactical pressure, but often don't even make it into combat.

Also don't forget you can use the rhino's as mobile shields for the 'zerkers to walk behind as well as ride inside of!

I do the huge squads of berzerkers like 16 per squad and i give the AC a power fist and TBB thats it all with axes of khorne they do move across the table pretty fast, But also get your self a unit of possessed marines and give them flight with axes they will get up there fast and keep units from firing at ur Deamon prince Plus its pretty nice too have BT in that possessed sqaud as a anti tank weapon once he comes out he will be un in front and the emeny will have to deal with him and the units of bloodlettters

my 1850 army is BT
a deamon prince no too pricey about 169 in points
two squads of bloodletters 8 in each squad
and three squads of berezkers of 16 each
it a huge army but very effective again tau and gaurd and marines and sspretty good agian bugs from my experience


thom

Talsiman every time. Your Berzerkers will still have a chance to run out of the rhino even if you don't have the Talisman, and that's 50+ wasted points.

I had a friend who always mounted his 'zerkers in rhinos.

It was always funny because he had horrible rolls, so he always BF'ed out of the rhino so I could shoot him.

if you take rhinos, never mount in them, just walk behind for mobile cover.

If you are limiting my choices to TBB or rhino I say take TBB.  There seemed to be a popular list or two a while back that took as many 8 man TBB squads as you can fit, and some possessed predators.

That list isn't good.  And in todays world of deep strike/skimmer tank/unshakeable hidden ordnance barrages, it is just asking to get tabled.

your best bet for a competetive world eaters list is to bomb with it.  Obviously the lack of infiltrate makes you go with bikes.   Then I would take the third option... Neither TBB nor rhinos.  If you'd like to try it, and you want to try something pre-built.  Try this one...

cheap lieutenant
8 khorne berserkers furious charge power fist
land raider

2x4 khorne bikers skilled riders
3x8 bloodletters

possessed predator lascannon/heavy bolters


I've played a dozen games with a list just like this, I've accepted more than one concession on turn two.  I've tabled people on turn three, I phased a double monolith necron on turn 2.  I have also conceded more than once on turn 3.  And have nearly been tabled on multiple occasions.

With a list like this.  You are going to win BIG or lose BIG.  In a casual gaming environment, this a fun list and pretty nasty.  In a tourney world with skimmer tanks and drop pods, your only defense is to castle up, or join in the skimmer dropping fun.  Since you can't do either of those things, then I'd keep a realistic appraisal of your power level when you buy and paint these guys.

one mans opinion...

Lack of infiltrate depends on who you're playing...By the actual rules, beserkers can infiltrate.

Infiltrating berzerkers probably isn't a good tournament strategy since you never know if the local judges will allow it or not.

I've never tried the flying possessed with Khorne--that's a good idea. I've used it successfully with Thousand Sons. The unit is insanely expensive, but with flight and a 5+ invulnerable they have a good chance of getting where you want them.

I've palyed around a bit with WE, and a lot against them, and to be brutally honest: zerker's suck against any mobile or really shooty opponent, in other words against every good army. They're dead cool and really fluffy (sending 6x8 frothing psychopaths across the board is great fun), just not playable.
Bloodletters are the only really usable troops, 2+ units of those are wonderful.

Speed Lord, 3x8 bloodletters, 7 bikers w/ Asp Champ, 2x tri-las pred = 1500pts.