Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

130 - Autarch - jetbke, mandiblasters, laserlance

292 - 10 Dire Avengers (Exarch, twin cats, bladestorm) in Waveserpent (TLEML, sh.cannon, and spirit stones)

124 - 4 jetbikes - 1 is Warlock w/spear, 1 bike has sh.cannon

124 - 4 jetbikes - 1 is Warlock w/spear, 1 bike has sh.cannon

124 - 4 jetbikes - 1 is Warlock w/spear, 1 bike has sh.cannon

124 - 4 jetbikes - 1 is Warlock w/spear, 1 bike has sh.cannon

227 - 5 Shining Spears w/Exarch, Starlance, Withdraw

150 - 2 Vypers with brightlances

185 - Falcon w/scatter laser, sh.cannon, spirit stones, holofield

185 - Falcon w/scatter laser, sh.cannon, spirit stones, holofield

185 - Falcon w/scatter laser, sh.cannon, spirit stones, holofield

 

I feel dirty taking 3 falcons, but its arguably the most effective tank in the game.  Autarch goes with Shining Spears.  Not sure warlocks are necessary with jetbikes but it gives them a chance to pop armor up close.  Tear it apart, tell me what you'd change.

Part of the point cost of a Falcon is the transport ability it brings to the table, and you're not using that ability.

Maybe free up some points by: Dropping the Vypers (expensive S3 brightlances on a superfragile platform....eh.), dropping one or two spears or one whole jetbike squad (three should be plenty).

Use the points to get two 6-man DA squads and one six-man Storm Guardian squad or close combat aspect, thus making full use of the transport capacity of Falcons.

Thoughts?

-Adso

Are your jetbike squadrons legal?

Your guardian jetbikes need to number 3-10, to which you can add a warlock.

You have a Fast Attack slot free so seperate your Vypers.

Yes, the bikes are legal. Its 3 bikes plus a warlock; its been edited for clarity.

Thats a good point. I could drop something and get some cheap 6 man fire dragon squads at 96pts a pop to stick in the falcon, Im just concerned about escalation games and having something deploy on the table and be basically useless and/or a gigantic target. If I took the vypers out or took the brightlances off them, what am I going to do against tanks? Im locking myself into having to destroy them with side shots. I figure even thought theyre fragile they can sit at the back and take potshots at tanks, using their maneuverability to remain hidden from most of the weapons that would try to bring them down, not to mention Id have 3 falcons and a serpent flying around which would probably be more of a target.

Well, if you went with the cheap Dragons, you'd be adding an anti-tank threat to make up for the lack of Vypers.

Besides, you have other things in the force capable of tankhunting -- Starlance on the Exarch, Singing Spears on the Jetbikes, Pulse Lasers on the Falcons, and EML.

Also, being as you'll be outmanuvering anything on the table, you should be able to get plenty of side & rear shots to make up for your lack of Lances. The bottom line of it is that Lances are heavily overpriced on a BS3 platform, unless you know you'll be seeing a LOT of Land Raiders and Russes.

I would suggest shuffling out one Guardian Jetbike squad and the Vypers for two or three small Aspect Squads. Together, that would give you just over 250 pts to play with -- enough for two small squads of bare bones Dragons, extra jetbikes and hence an extra shuricannon or two.

-Adso

 

Ditch the shining spears for another autarch. Use th extra points to beef up two of the jetbike squads.

1 autarch with enough attacks and the laser lance does as much damage as the shining spears unit and with the extra wounds of the jetbike units, isn't as fragile. A shining spears unit will get targeted fast, and should it get stuck in a prolonged combat die easy. The autarchs, with their numbers, should last a lil but. I'd stick a reaper launcher on both for some shooty goodiness.

Ditch the vypers too...those are easy victory points for an opponent. can you firt 10 guardians with a bright lance platform? same thing as the vyper, but less mobile but essentially 9 wounds.

 

A shining spears unit with withdraw power will never get stuck in combat--and the autarch can withdraw with them if he's joined to their unit. Shining spears have more durability against big things with str6 armor-ignoring attacks (which will instakill an autarch with a single wound if he fails an invulnerable save).

Cookiecutter = bad. Autarch + spears is better than 2 autarchs.

Falons are no longer "best tank in the game". They are most durable by far, but regarding offensive power per points they are really bad (this can be somewhat compensated by carrying a highly offensive but fragile unit).

Posted By Raider on 12/25/2006 12:32 PM
Falons are no longer "best tank in the game". They are most durable by far, but regarding offensive power per points they are really bad (this can be somewhat compensated by carrying a highly offensive but fragile unit).

I disagree. Unless something else has transport, boatloads of guns, is harder to destroy, and is a fast skimmer tank?

But back on topic. What are we considering your list for? I will assume competative tournament play since you didn't mention otherwise. Consider Godzilla nid wth 2+ armor saves, terminators and drop pods. I think you've focused too much on popping tanks that you'll only find against mech IG, Tau and Eldar, of which you won't find them taking top places in any tourny. I think a terminator drop pod list will ruin your day entirely, you've got nothing to fight them with... 3 pulsar lasers won't cut it. You've got hardly anything to rip apart carnifexes with either. And drop pod marines really won't care if you are shooting shuriken cannons at them or not. Unless you had about 20 of them.

The short story you need ways to penetrate armor or have massive amounts of crappy firepower that works thru attrition.

I think what Raider means is the tanks will be spending alot more time being shaken now, since the spirit stone no longer makes them immune.

 

Withdraw during your turn and in their turn that unit gets shot up. Or, even worse...with all those attacks, you wipe out the enemy unit, have no one to massacre to, and then get shot up. No warlock with the squad means no Conceal save. I'd rather have numbers and a small chance at a cover save then nothing.

If you stick around a turn, and wait to withdraw in their combat phase, then you can get swamped and hit by counter attack squads.

 

New version of the list

130 - Autarch w/jetbike, laserlance, mandiblaster

96 - 6 Fire Dragons

96 - 6 Fire Dragons

287 - 10 Dire Avengers w/Exarch, twin cats, bladestorm

Waveserpent w/TL scatters, shuriken cannon, spirit stones

292 - 10 Dire Avengers w/Exarch, twin cats, bladestorm

Waveserpent w/TL EML, shuriken cannon, spirit stones

124 - 3 jetbikes + warlock w/spear, shuriken cannon

76 - 3 jetbikes w/ shuriken cannon

76 - 3 jetbikes w/ shuriken cannon

76 - 3 jetbikes w/ shuriken cannon

227 - 5 Shining Spears w/Exarch, starlance, withdraw

185 - Falcon w/scatterlaser, shuriken cannon, spirit stones, holofield

185 - Falcon w/scatterlaser, shuriken cannon, spirit stones, holofield

 

More anti-troop in a second squad of dire avengers.  More (better) ap2 in the fire dragons.  Figured a warlock in each jetbike squad was unnecessary.

That's the kind of list I wish I had the models to field!

I miss the Warlocks -- the spear gives the unit some powerful versatility, as would Destructor, but you can't have everything. This list should keep your opponent's head spinning -- but do be careful of AP4 weapons. Stuff like 4-heavy-bolter Devastators and 3-heavy-bolter Russes should be your highest targeting priority, since they can make mincemeat of your otherwise nice, expensive Aspects.

Other people can chime in -- could a squad of Scorps instead of the second squad of Fire Dragons be useful? Just a thought.

Otherwise, looks like a great list to me, typically Eldar -- fragile, fast, mean, and concentrated.

-Adso

If you can find a few points, a fusion blaster is a nice addition to the autarch.

I feel its rather foolish to take transports without vectoring engines, but whatever works for you.

The jetbikes seem somewhat underpowered to me. In a solid army, every unit should scream shoot me now or feel lots and lots of pain. The falcons, spears, and avengers all do. (and by extention, the autarch, dragons, and serpents) The bikes, however, have limited threat capability and can be brought down reliably with standard infantry fire. (meaning they can wait several turns before paying any attention to them whatsoever) I believe you have enough points to turn those 4 jetbike squads into another spear squad and a jetbike farseer. (i didnt calculate it out though) Although there are plenty of other fine options