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I posted this somwhere else and was told to start my own thread to here I am.

Back when I was writing a mock 5th ed I had changed how grenades work in combat.

Inspired by the scene in Starship Troopers where, Rico jumps on the back of the tanker bug and drops a grenade in him. I had it to where infantry could use thier grenades against monstrous creatures. However they would only get one attack much like on a walker. Then roll to wound as normal using the following profiles.

Frag Grenade S4, AP6
Krak Grenade S6, AP4
Melta Bomb S8, AP1

It would help much weaker armies fair better agains "big 'uns" in hand to hand combat.

This would make Assault Marines and Storm Troopers unstoppable in close combat.

Absolutely. Unstoppable.

It would have to be something specifically useable against Monstrous Creatures and Vehicles, and even then, hitting only on a 6, like how the Tyrannic War Veterans in the SM Codex work with Krak grenades.

Besides, would you really want to throw a Frag at someone you're fighting with in hand to hand combat? at that proximity, you'll kill everyone involved in the brawl.

CK

smart_alex wrote:I posted this somwhere else and was told to start my own thread to here I am.

Back when I was writing a mock 5th ed I had changed how grenades work in combat.

Inspired by the scene in Starship Troopers where, Rico jumps on the back of the tanker bug and drops a grenade in him. I had it to where infantry could use thier grenades against monstrous creatures. However they would only get one attack much like on a walker. Then roll to wound as normal using the following profiles.

Frag Grenade S4, AP6
Krak Grenade S6, AP4
Melta Bomb S8, AP1

It would help much weaker armies fair better agains "big 'uns" in hand to hand combat.

What it LOOKS LIKE to ME is that you're bothered that your IG (Eldar, Tau, <enter puny race here&gt don't fight well in HtH against the big boys.

Would your rule be offset by making the grenade-using models twice as expensive or by reducing the points cost of Monstrous Creatures?
You couldn't just throw the rule in there without seriously offsetting what balance there is in the game.


Eric

So basically the Ultramarine Tyranid Hunters rule generalized to everyone? Likewise I don't see how this could make Storm-Trooper and Assault Marine squads "unstoppable". They'd only get one attack, subject to the 2" kill-zone, their initiative order, and they'd have to survive to assault, and so on.

I have to say, all this talk of 5th edition has me simultaneously very hopeful and quite worried...

Don't worry. GW has a very good track record of studiously ignoring fan projections of editions. If some fan proposes an idea for the n+1 edition, you have good assurance that the proposal will not be implemented. Usually because the fans don't bother to rigorously explore the consequences of their proposals, but sometimes because the Studio doesn't either! It's useful to keep in mind that GW operates on the basis of scheduled releases of editions. It's a given that every few years GW will release a new edition, ostensibly clean up the accumulated mistakes and detritus of the previous edition. Closer inspection suggests that planned obsolescence is involved, which would make sense under the assumption that GW is carefully planning decades ahead, but we know GW doesn't plan ahead like that. Non-rigorous rule development provides the same effect at a fraction of the cost: since it ensures problems without having to invest in planning ahead to manufacture them.

Basically anything labelled n+1 edition (5th edition while the 4th edition is the latest that's out) is fan-speak for home-brew. Not to say it's not important that people repeat the same process of trial and error in order to learn about the game and how to write rules, but that's it's nothing to worry about if one religiously restricts oneself to GW-brand rules in one's play.

I wouldn't have a problem fighting them if I could flee from a charge, but since you cant this is likely the next best thing. And Yes it would be similar to the tyranid hunters.

The argument of grenades in hand to hand says that you should not use melta bombs then on vehicles, cause its the same thing. If you could do it to vehicles why not MC?

Alpharius wrote:I have to say, all this talk of 5th edition has me simultaneously very hopeful and quite worried...

No need to worry overly much. If you don't like 5th, just keep playing 4th. You don't have to buy and play with the new rules if you don't want to.

Unless you play RTT's, either way, competitive play tends to be less fun. Thats why this apoc stuff is so much more fun, a lot more loose with certain requirments.

Corpsman_of_Krieg wrote:This would make Assault Marines and Storm Troopers unstoppable in close combat.

Absolutely. Unstoppable.

It would have to be something specifically useable against Monstrous Creatures and Vehicles, and even then, hitting only on a 6, like how the Tyrannic War Veterans in the SM Codex work with Krak grenades.

Besides, would you really want to throw a Frag at someone you're fighting with in hand to hand combat? at that proximity, you'll kill everyone involved in the brawl.

CK

if your about to get hacked to peices anyways wouldnt you rather pull the pin make it quick and take the enemy out with you?
as fun as getting torn to peices by a chainsaw sword sounds i'll pick the grenade. besides you cant do this in 5th ed any ways