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Ok, I used to play 40k like is was the only thing that could keep me alive, then...life took a turn and I joined the Marines right after high school, which in many ways, killed my time to play 40k all together. Now that Im getting closer to my time of getting out, Iv learned alot about the military, along with small unit tactics from field ops, camofladge techniques learned in sniper school, and just an all around idea on how vehicles, weapons, and uniforms are weathered over time.
Now do to this, Iv become obsessed with the idea or a infantry heavy Space Marine army, based around a desert theme, from my times in Iraq, and possibly utilizing the Raven Guard rules for the chapter. In this, Iv done up some lists, which seem they would work well, but they consist of about 50 plus Marines (including scouts) and about 1-3 vehicles which will either be Razorbacks or whirlwinds. No psychic men would be used, and no unrealistic models used too heavily (such as all my marines wearing robes or something)...now, Im wondering since its been awhile and the rules have changed a little, that if this army would work. And is it me, or has the military blocked my sense of imagination towards unique armies, or am I takin a realistic approach towards this? PLEASE HELP!!! :S

I thinkn that the new rules are possibly more supportive of this sort of marine army. Obviously take devastators to deal t=with the large threats. I've played this army before and where I've found it failing is it can be a bit too realistic against an unrealistic foe. For example playing against nids who have go for several carnifexes and other big nasties with a fast moving swarm cuse major probs. Either knock out a few biggie sand hope you're not overrun or blast the little critters away only to find tha tyou can't fight back against the big fellas. The effectiveness of a marine infantry army I find can usually come down to what you're up against. A ballanced enemy tends to be mroe of a problem than a themed enemy. Hope that helps?

Well, think of it this way, x4 10 men tactical squads, two with heavy bolters, and two with lascannons, 2 vet squads, maybe around 5-6 in the squads who are going to be used for close combat, 2 squads of scouts used as sniper units, probably 2 devistator squads with optional heavy weapons (possibly depending on opponent) with possible razorback transports, a whirlwind, and possibly a close combat commander with a decent squad attached to him... Thats basically what Im lookin at as of now...the infantry will be capable of offering anti tank capabilities and all the bolters and such from them will provide anti infantry capabilities along with the whirlwind...see where Im going with that?

Hmm. On the right track. The way the game tends to play out, you want big close combat units and smaller shooting units. Whirlwinds are a good pick for an infantry heavy Space Marine army - they can sit out of LOS and deny your opponent vehicles to shoot at. I would not bother with Razorbacks - these are more a way of supplementing a vehicle heavy force to drown your opponent in targets. (meaning one of your tanks or other will get to shoot back)

Multiple Whirlwinds are pretty mean too. If you're not playing against an army with large numbers of weakly armoured infantry, you can take the Castellan cluster rounds to lay small minefields around chokepoints and seriously disrupt your opponent's plan.

Marine Scout Snipers, unfortunately, are not as proficient in this game AS snipers as they are in real life. They're more like weak, expensive riflemen with a bonus against Monstrous Creatures. (those big pretend guys that other people will be using) If you take them, grab a missile launcher per squad. I suspect you'll find yourself mostly using them when your friends take out those dakkafexes/Ctan/Squiggoths...

In Cleanse missions a five man devastator squad can be a nuisance against assault oriented armies. If you roll first deployment, place them as close to the center as you can. For 75 points this buys you another 6" - or one turn for walking infantry - plus a few S4 shots.

Stereotypically, a Space Marine "melee" Troops choice is ten strong including flamer, heavy bolter and a Veteran with a Power Fist. This gives the squad a bit of shooting ability plus staying power and a way of hurting some of the very tough imaginary people that populate the 40k universe. A stereotypical "shooty" Troops choice is six strong with a lascannon and plasma gun.

My sense is that you might have a fair bit of luck with something along the lines of 1 Master with power sword and close combat weapon, 2x10 Tactical squads each with a Rhino (just leave the turret off a Razorback) with extra armour, smoke launchers, maybe an extra storm bolter, a flame thrower, a heavy bolter, and a power fist as a somewhat mobile reserve, 4x6 Tactical squads each with lascannon and plasma gun for your line units, Whirlwinds to taste.

I get the feeling somehow that you wouldn't be into Jump Packs which is why I suggest the two ten-man units of Tacticals in Rhinos. If you are all right with them, I would say to run one squad of Jump Pack Marines in lieu of one of the Tac Rhinos for the sake of variety. Power fist and two flame throwers for these guys.

lol all the imaginary guys, no I understand the fluff and unrealistic armies that are out there, Im a big fan of star wars and love the whole aliens idea, its just that for an army that I would like to control, I would like things to be realistic. I was thinkin of doin some jump pack marines, but Im on the fence with that. I originally had two whirl winds for the reason you described, with the Castellan missles and all, but I was wanting 2 dev squads. And the main reason why I have 10 man tactical squads, is that they can use their bolter fire in large numbers, and if they were to come into close combat, they can have a good number of fighters.

Redmond wrote: And is it me, or has the military blocked my sense of imagination towards unique armies, or am I takin a realistic approach towards this? :S

If you want to play a themed space marine army that represents your experience with the real marines, go for it! In my opinion, that's what they are and are well suited to represent modern times military structure. As far as will it work, probably not the way you would think it should work. But the advice above about space marines being effective with small shooty combat squads supported with some big assault oriented tactical squads is going in the correct direction. With the traits, there is more room for imagination and adhering to actual military organization. There are lots of ways to qualify space marine units as actual units. For example, if you can envision assault jump marines as airborne rangers paradropping or being fast-roped from a blackhawk. You can also rationalize termies deepstriking as some elite special ops from blackhawks.

Here is an optional theme:

FIREBASE
Whirlwind x2
Devastator squad w/ heavy bolters

Tac combat squads w/ lascannons and/or missile launchers

Captain w/ storm bolter

RECON
Scouts w/ sniper rifles x4

ASSAULT FORCE
Jump marines 2x8 w/ vet sarge & pf
Chaplain w/ jump pack

Tactical squad w/ vet sarge & pf, flamer/ RHINO

Termie 1x6 w/ assault cannon

MOBILE FIRE SUPPORT
LS Tornado x2


I play with a military themed space marine army in GT's that is mechanized shooty and it is competitive:

Captain term armor w/ command termie squad (rangers)

6 tactical combat squads in razorbacks (humvees)

predator tanks (abrams)

Land speeders (blackhawks)


Anyway, have fun with it!

Hmm - if recall correctly, you could buy a doctrine to allow devastators to be chosen as elites so long as they purchase a Veteran Skill - not too bad with tank hunters and missile launchers for a cheaper S9 weapon than a lascannon. Plus you can set them up AFTER your troops. That lets you get those two dev squads you wanted on top of the Whirlwinds.

...and if you use transport helicopters models, play them as drop pods for those ten man power fist units.

Just make sure to stay away from swarm armies such as the new orks, and nids. Also be cautious of playing chaos, and eldar. Chaos because the thousand sons army will rip this list to shreds S4 AP3 bolters good night. Eldar because you dont have enough vechile killing power to deal with multiple falcons.

Well, see I figured that with 2 tactical squads with lascannons, the razor backs I was talking about can have lascannons, the two devi squads with possible anti troop or anti armor, then the scouts with the sniper rifles and rocket launchers, then two squads of veterans with an assortment of close combat weapons (including powerfists) and a jump pack HQ choice with a possible fast attack squad of assualt marines to aid him...to me..I think there is a good mixture of close combat (since all SM are close combat capable to begin with) and a good assortment of anti troop and anti armor capabilities (the assualt marines could even carry melta bombs... and Im not trying to relate them so much to now-a-day military units, yet more or less use a realistic approach to the tactics on how Im going to utilise them, alot like how the Raven Guard are known for their small unit tactics.

Make them Razorbacks Rhinos for the veterans in case you end up with an Alpha level mission and one squad of Devastators Elites with missile launchers and tank hunters. Make the other on the small size armed with a heavy bolter or two. Stick with powerfists, except on the HQ. Consider making one squad of Veterans an ordinary ten-man fist/flamer/heavy bolter squad to have an empty elites space to give the Assault Squad Furious Charge. If you take a Reclusiarch with Terminator Honours, Jump Pack, ccw, frag and melta (in case they swing near a parked tank he can leave the squad to blow it up then come back the following turn) this will make for a bloody nasty counterattack unit. On the assault that's 3 WS4 S5 I5 attacks EACH from the marines plus 4 S9 no save swings from the Sergeant and 6 S4 WS5 power sword attacks from the Chaplain, all of them rerollable from assaulting with Litanies of Hatred, on top of whatever flame templates you opt to purchase for them...and did I mention they're fearless?