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Im sure this topic has been covered a hundred odd times, and still remains a matter of preference, but I wanted to get some feedback from some people
who arent the 2 guys that game around my area.
I currently have a Tau Empire force, Eldar, Chaos and Orks.
The thing that currently comes to mind is that most of these armies are mostly shooty based, Tau being the obvious, Eldar still pack a lot of firepower, and oddly enough even my Orks are pretty shooty (outshooting a marine army into the ground, and killing 2 squads of attack bikes and a 10 man crusader squad by turn 2).
Chaos is a very mixed army, in that it can function a number of ways, shooting, midrange shooting and closecombat (amongst many others no doubt).

I still have mixed feelings about the new chaos book, and am sorta stuck as far as what I even want to do with them. I have a decent sized Iron Warriors army (again, mostly shooting)
and a bigger Death Guard army(mid ranged firefight). I do have khorne berzerkers, but never hear anything good about them, so dont bother with them much.

Tyranids have always been a really cool army to me, but they definetly lack some of the character (hero or villian on the table), but Im almost not interested in another horde army. Orks can be enough I think! So, I guess the question that remains is: What kind of armies have you all played that are challenging, not overly shooty (not to say they dont have it, but maybe less, while still being able to support the advance of the force), and dont necessarily require a ton of models? I usually start forces around 750-1000pts, so if anyone has suggestions or lists, feel free!

Thanks-

Try Farsight on for size. You've already got the Tau, so why not? Try starting with 2 squads of 2 Crisis suits and some Fire Warriors and go from there. Maybe a couple Broadsides or some stealths for fun.

I've never actually even seen a Farsight army in action, so I think they sound fun, but that's because my Shas'O ends up in combat atleast once every game. He even killed a Daemon Prince in combat just tonight.

Tyranids, they're one of the most unique armies- little to now firepower, especially at long range, and they have the horde mentality as opposed to the hero/small squad based armies like SM, Eldar, and to a certain extent, Tau.

Those two posts kind of go against what I was talking about a little.
O'Shovah's faction is still going to include a lot of shooting, while tyranids kind of fall under that horde list Im not sure if I want to go for after doing Orks.
Im certainly not trying to be difficult about it!

Just as an aside thought....would units of 30 termagants be a feasible, decent troop choice or a waste of points?
I know I just said something about "no hordes" but the Living Ammunition rule had me thinking a little.....

Also, any Chaos players that have had some luck with any non-cookie cutter lists, please post them here!

Thanks!

I once tried a guard scout force. This was chellenging and the way i made it wasn't the usual guard shooty. No ordance, as many sentinals as possible, few troops and those that you had aim for the more elite types. Assasins etc. Great for heavy terrain tables. playing it the best way was devide and conquer and concentrate on taking a table quater at a time and hiding from big scarry sruff until you can deal with it/hold it up while you take the rest of the board.

Also try feral orks, go for the less shooty 'higlander' type models. Thinking getting medieval with them, big swords, convert big shootas/zzapp guns etc into cannons.... Bikers on horses that sort of thing. Yes it will still be shooty but won't nessicasily appear shooty due to the theme.

Just try picking an army and limiting shooty options.

Hope that gives you some ideas....

BatCommander wrote:Tyranids, they're one of the most unique armies- little to now firepower, especially at long range, and they have the horde mentality as opposed to the hero/small squad based armies like SM, Eldar, and to a certain extent, Tau.

Not sure what Nid armies are in your area but over 75% of the most competitive Nid armies I have seen at the GTs involve usually a fair amount of TMCs (6 Fexes, 2 Tyrants) that are armed to the teeth with ranged weapons. Remember a Dakka Fex can put out 8 S6 shots that reroll failed to hits and wounds while a flyrent with 2 devoueres can put out 12 of the same. Zilla packs a lot of Fire Power in a few Monsters.

Now back to the topic at hand. You can do a search for Steeler Shock lists which will give you an army of close to 40 - 60 models depending on the points value of the game that have a nice assault aspect to them.

You can also try the 50/50 shooty assaulty Nid list which is something like this

flyrent w/ 2 twin linked devourers, EC, WF, ES (and a few other tools that slip my mind)
6 Warriors with Tallons + Claws, EC, and leaping

3 Dakka Fexes (Basically B3 w/ TL Devourers)

4x3 Ripper Swarms with leaping (and what ever gun you can give them)

3x2 Raveners w/ talons and Claws

3 Gun Fexes (Tooled out any way you like them w/ Barbed Strangler and Venom Cannon)

If you don't want to take the Nid route you can use either Blood Angels or Wytch based Dark Eldar.

For Blood Angels you just need 3 Assault Squads 3 Tac Squads with Rhinos. A sizeable Death Company. Mephiston and a Chaplain. Take either Baal Preds or Vindicators w/ POMS to keep them moving up the field. use the vehicles to screen your advance and once you have reached your enemy's lines you can jump out from behind the vehicles and assault them. 10 man assault squads are tough to deal with.

A good nid force to try would be heavy with genestealers and a few carnifexes.

Try a Deepstriking list. Blood Angels or Black Templars in drop pods are both really assault heavy lists that can get some heavy support options.

Also, drop podding guard isn't exactly assault heavy, but you will get into assault often, and you get to do insanely close deepstriking, which is always fun. Add in some basilisks for indirect fire. I like sentinels with multi lasers because they can drop in and take out armor, and they are scouts, so they show up at the beginning in escalation, and they keep infiltrators away from your basilisks if necessary. This army is strong because it shoots you before you have the possibility of shooting it. If you're hot with a scatter die, this list is fun.

'Nids can have a more characterful feel to them if you really go to town with the modelling. Add individual-looking models amidst your hordes, and base your Tyrants etc. with thematic bitz. That'll really help make them easier to relate to.

Have you considered a small Last Chancer force? Talk about individual conversion choices...

You also might enjoy trying a Lysanderwing or other Terminator-dominated force. They're compact, mix shooting and CC well, and have tons of character because you can concentrate on individual models.

Try 13th company Space Wolves. Small elite lists, challenging to play, and about as weighted towards CC as you can get. They're also pretty cheap to get going if you don't mind a little converting and already have a bunch of chaos bitz.

Thanks everyone for your feedback!

Im really torn lol! There's so many good lists to consider.....
Tyranids would involve a bit of purchasing, and though Im selling a part of my eldar for $150, so
with that in mind Ive already got the 6 genestealers, 10 termagants and odd spore mines from Battle for Macragge, so Id have a fair way to go, lol.
I do like the sound of the modeling/converting possibilities though.....

13th Co. is great, and Ive been waiting for a new SW codex for as long as everyone else, but the models are, Im pretty sure, direct form GW, so, Id have to pass.

The army Im going to be fighting more then likely is Orks. I just read up on that Crimson Fists Vs. Orks campaign in the new White Dwarf and that seemed pretty sweet,
The starting pts for the next game is going to be 750pt more than likely, so any ideas on 750pts 'Nids list? or Space Marines that stay near the Crimson Fist traits?

I mean, figure $150 can score you a few tactical squads, rhinos, maybe a landspeeder too. I do already have a useable Master/Captain, so that's covered.

For bugs you can get a pair of 'fex, some stealers and....? Im not even sure haha.

Considering your idea for a Terminator heavy force, Savnock, Im not opposed to it, and with $150, I could get 3 units straight up, Deathwing isnt bad at all, but I dont have any drop pods.
These are all great suggestions, you guys are making it difficult! haha!

Thanks

Terminators can deep strike without drop pods. You will need a couple units of Scouts too (from what my opponents have played- beware, I don't play Marines but have faced them often).

As for 'Nids, you could do well with a couple boxes of Guants (spinegaunts, you can get bitz to make all 16 with spinefists easily), plus a couple boxes of Genestealers. Stealer shock would be a good starting point for 5th ed. A pair of 'fexes would give you some fire support to shoot over the infantry, but honestly more 'Stealers is a better idea. Check the army lists here for more Stealer Shock builds.

So, without doing the points (because its late, and I dont have the codex in front of me)
a possible direction could be:
Termie Librarian (already own)
2x5 man squads of Termies (1 assault squad? or if Deathwing, at least one Lit. Claw)
2x5 man scout squads bolters + hvy bolter, sgts w/ tele homers.

or

Warriors x3-6
2x box of genestealers
2xcarnifex set up for shooting (1x VC/BS, and 1x 2xTwin Deavourers) +whatever other upgrades?

again, Id be shooting for 750pts against orks, so it's gonna be tough either way. Definetly outnumbered, unless Im looking at the 'nids wrong.
The thing is that if I did end up going Astartes, I already have a 3-4 Dreadnoughts laying around, a Pred Destructor, and a LRCrusader unpainted.
The downside to that is my previous idea of Crimson Fists would be out as I believe if you run them according to Codex, they get one less elite, fast and heavy, so no need for so many dreads heh.

If you can show me what a 'Nid list at 750pt might look like, that'd be helpful.

Thanks
Torn between and /marines in general.

The only problem with the terminators and librarian list is that everybody has seen it already. I'll admit to playing one, but if you're looking for a unique list terminator heavy Space Marines ain't it.

Additionally, while termies certainly hold their own in HtH, they're not great, and generally get owned by dedicated assault troops.

I had a similar predicament -- I wanted a non-shooty force that wasn't horde (and for me not MEq). I was gonna go with dark eldar until I saw that the new models are on the way (worth waiting for). So I'm working on stealer shock at the moment. The point cost of scuttle/extended carapace genestealers makes it a fairly cheap army moneywise and also not a horde for painting/playstyle.

Main problem I see is a stealer shock list is a MEq killing list and will struggle to deal with a well made ork list, which seems to be your main opponent.

For bugs you can get a pair of 'fex, some stealers and....? Im not even sure haha.

Voodoo Boyz had a nice breakdown in general discussion of doing stealer shock very very cheap by buying maccragge genestealers from warstore/battlewagon bits. I decided to go with the multipart kits myself though.

I will say that at the end of the day, the marine dex makes subpar assault armies that true assault based armies will mop the floor with.

you said you want a assult based army so here are some options

orks- 6 squads of 30 slugga boyz lol or you can try my nob army i posted earlier

chaos- Khorne

imperial guard- give them light infantry, close order drill, hardened fighters, cheminhaler, and warrior weapons

nids- yeah umm they're nids.

sm- this isn't to hard

necron- there is a way to do it it's not very good

inquisitorial- greyknights

dark elder- wyches

elder- aspect warriors (banchees in serpents)

i think thats about it.

Main problem I see is a stealer shock list is a MEq killing list and will struggle to deal with a well made ork list, which seems to be your main opponent.

I have played against a few orc hordes with my stealer shock army. They are indeed very tough to beat, however I found that my sniper fex's generally win the day for me. 3 big plates make big holes in the tightly packed hordes. Also if you hit 1 squad of orcs with all your stealers at once you can generally thin the kill zone enough to not lose too many 23pt stealers back. If you do this on the correct flank then his other mobs of boyz can't get around the meele to help thier brothers out either. The #1 problem with orc hord is bottlenecks and traffic control. It is almost impossible to spread them out and very hard for them to support each other in CC.

This is not to say that a top orc horde list can't school a stealer shock list if your not very careful and a bit lucky.

If you're going for SM, I would make up your own chapter and scheme, and simply change the traits or "counts as" rules for them when you want something new. That's what I do with my marines, and it keeps them from going stale.

If you are bored with Orks.... you arn't creative enough!

Well how many Killa Kans & Deff Dreads do you have? Take two Big Meks (Kff) and field two Dreads as Troop (thanks to the Meks) and three squads of three Killa Kans. Now you have a Walker army from Orks!

Or take two warbosses, field three BattleWagons as heavy and two units of nobs as troop (thanks to the bosses) and buy them Dedicated BattleWagons and then three units of nobs as elite and Dedicated BattleWagons for them to. Thats 8 AV 14 front vehicles!

Its not a matter of being bored with Orks, quite the contrary!
Its just the fact that Im going to be FIGHTING orks more often than not, and decided that orks vs. orks wouldnt be all that exciting.
I think I might actually go with space marines. Ive never been able to decide on a chapter, and ended up with one of those "make your own" projects that only panned so far.
I started a chapter awhile back called the Serpent Lords, based on GW's LotR haradrim color scheme. Managed to get a master, chaplain, 5-6 man command squad, dreadnought and a 7 man tactical squad done.
Maybe now's the time to get some other figures and finish the army.

Tyranids are awesome to be sure, but I think would cost me a bit more than Id like to invest right now.

Anyone put together any really successful 750pt marine lists? Keep in mind those units I mentioned above if anyone wants to contribute! heh.
Also, the 750pt is only the first couple games Ill be playing against orks, possibly in an ongoing campaign.
I also have a Pred destructor, LR crusader, a vindi and like 3 unpainted dreads. Im thinking more tactical, maybe scouts and probably some assault marines.

Thanks to everyone for their input, this has been infinitely helpful!

Thanks!