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hello been a fan of the hobby for some time but just started playing and was wondering if i could get some insight and tips for my list Thank you.

Chaos space marines:
HQ
Chaos lord 90pts
Terminator armor 30pts
Daemon weapon 25pts
145pts
Chaos sorcerer 100pts
Warp time 25pts
Bolt of change 25pts
Mark of Tzeentch 30pts
Personal icon
185pts

Elites
Chaos terminators 5
Reaper autocannon 25pts, chainfist 15pts, crombi melta 5pts, power fist 10pts
205pts

Troops
Chaos space marines 10
Champ power weapon & plasma pistol 45pts
Icon chaos glory 10pts and heavy bolter 10pts
205 pts
Khorne Berserkers 8
Skull champion power weapon & plasma pistol 66pts
198pts

Fast attack
Chaos raptors 6
champ w/lightning claws 60pts
plasma gun 15pts& melta gun10pts
185pts

Heavy support
Chaos space marines havocs 8
Champ power fist & plasma pistol 55pts
2 heavy bolters 15pts each and missile launcher 20pts
225pts
Obliterators
150pts

Total 1493

why do the standard marines have a champ with power weapon, plasma pistol, and then a heavy bolter. seems to me one of those things is going to get unused in the course of a game. my suggestion is drop the heavy bolter and switch it with a plasmagun, since you have the points to spare.

also the havocs should not have a champion with plasma pistol, and power weapon. most people don't even put champs in those squads. that for sure is a waste of points, either for the champ or the heavy weapons. also i usually don't like mixing heavy weapons on havocs (missiles being for anti-tank and HB's for anti infantry) but if you really want to i guess go ahead.

next for the raptors, i'd use the points saved on the havoc champ to add in one more, and swap that meltagun for a plasmagun, simply to kill stuff like termies, MC's and weak AV tanks still. i wouldn't personally taker the lightning clawsm, but they aren't bad so keep em'

finally swap the plasma pistol on the berserker squad to one of the squad members, because you don't want to fry the champion on an unlucky overheat.

Any insight is welcome I just started playing and had a very different list and had been decimated by a mech tau army. So im looking for a good balance between mechs and horde armies so I can still be completive. And like I said I just started playing the game so any comments are welcome, like the not mixing up the heavy weapons in a havoc squad or dropping the champ for another raptor. What would be best a lascannon or a missile launcher? And 2 or 3 in the group. sorry to sound like a newb but still trying to get the grasp and find out what is best so I dont run into a wall and am unable to do any dmg against the army im up playing.

No it understandable, sorry if I sounded like a jerk, but i just try to cut straight to the chase. Anyway yea for the Havocs i personally like using them as compete anti infantry, since their weapons are more expensive, and you would want to concentrate fire on a big infantry unit to kill many, where with tanks you can kill them in one shot, so shooting with more than one may become overkill. So i'd say give the havocs either 3-4 autocannons, plasmaguns, or heavy bolters, and if you want them take lascannons on small marine units.

here's what i'd do for your list. I dropped the sorceror, as he won't do too much the way he is made up (needs termie armor) and is too many poitns for my taste, but if you want one feel free to replace something in this list for him. I'm just drawing up a template for what i'd do with your list, no need to follow it exactly.

HQ
-Chaos Lord: 145pts
w/ Terminator armor, Daemon Weapon

Elites
-5 Chaos Terminators: 190pts
w/ Reaper Autocannon, Power Fist, Combi-weapon

Troops
-10 Chaos Space Marines: 235pts
w/ Champion, Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol, 2 Plasmaguns, IoCG
-Rhino: 50pts
w/ Extra Armor

-5 Chaos Space Marines: 105
w/ Lascannon, IoCG

-8 Khorne Berserkers: 198pts
w/ Skull Champion, Power Weapon
-Rhino: 50pts
w/ Extra Armor

Fast Attack
-8 Raptors: 230
w/ Champion, Power Weapon, 2 Plasmaguns, IoCG

Heavy Support
-6 Havocs: 145pts
w/ 3 Plasmaguns, IoCG
-Rhino: 50pts
w/ Extra Armor

-2 Obliterators: 150pts



this bring you to a total of 1498pts, and you can still add/subtract some things to make the list more fit your personal desires.

Wow I love the idea of the 5 man with a lascannon and the extra armor on the rhinos as the reason I dumped them is had my havocs in there tried to get them into position and got raped by a deep striker. And no I didnt think that at all about the jerk thing lol. Just looking for more experienced players advice and how to meld the units together better. I will try w/o the sorcerer even though he was my hero in my first two games lol. But as I am still getting the hang of it im willing to try anything lol, to find what melds for me and my play style (I like the shooting but love the hand to hand). Also should I keep my lord in reserve with the termies to deep strike so I can get him into position as against a very mobile army he was next to useless? But if anyone comes to him they are done for. But thank you for the advise and fixing my list now lol.

yea the lord I'd hold in reserve against a list that will be somewhat static, so that he can get into combat. Against mobile armies I'd have him deploy with the rest of the army, and then just shoot at your opponents weak units, and use his guys for counter charges. Yea if you prefer the sorceror then use him in place of the lord. I just don't think you really need that extra power from having both as you already have raptors, termies, berserkers, and the character

cool love the input here is the revised list and THANK YOU SOOOOO MUCH!!!! also are the plasma guns that good?

HQ
Chaos space marines:
Chaos lord 90pts
Terminator armor 30pts
Daemon weapon 25pts
145pts

ELIETE
Chaos terminators 5
Reaper autocannon, chainfist, crombi melta, power fist
205pts

TROOPS
Chaos space marines 10
Champ power weapon & plasma pistol 45pts
Icon chaos glory 10pts 2 plasma guns 30pts
235pts
rhino extra armor 50pts

Chaos space marines 5
Icon of chaos glory 10pts lascannon 20pts
105pts

Khorne Berserkers 8
Skull champion power weapon & plasma pistol 66pts
198pts
rhino extra armor 50pts

FAST ATTACK
Chaos raptors 7
champ w/lightning claws 60pts
2 plasma gun 15pts
210pts

HEAVY SUPPORT
Obliterators 2
150pts

Obliterators 2
150pts

Total 1498

looks good. the oblits definitely can make you opponent sweat (IMO they are too fragile tho but that's only a minor problem). Lots of plasma, plenty of lascannons, and enough close quarters fighting to take those foes down a notch. play this right and it should turn out quite effective for you

You can't take heavy weapons in chaos marine squads unless they're 10 men or more. This is the reason I think everyone advocates using the cult marines nowadays.

i would suggest dropping the 5 man squad with a lascannon in it (since its illegal anyway) for another obliterator and then spending the reamining 30pts on an icon for someone, possibly khorne for your raptors.

lol I am an idiot. Well I don't use heavy weapons myself, so I overlooked that. Regwon has the right idea, drop the squad for the obliterator, and i'd say with the 30pts buy another terminator. I say the more the merrier.

I like that idea of the khorne icon for the raptors. lol ya I forgot about that with the lascannon in the 5 man. And 2 units of oblits one with 3 one with 2 and an extra termie I love it thank you all. I cant wait to play test this list once again THANK YOU SOOOOO MUCH for all your insight. But ya think I should keep the oblits in reserve for a deep strike or just have them there to taunt the other player when I set up?

Never ds your oblits.

There's no reason to waste multiple turns of obliterator fire.

It's not like they are terminators wanting to shoot on drop, and hide in close combat, after all.

I did it once, a long time ago. The Ork player laughed at me and killed 'em. I'll not make that mistake again.

Yea oblits are basically your better form of havocs, so as with havocs you'd not want to DS then (if you could havocs).

I've had then DS behind my guard line before, well rather that was the intention, but they scattered right into one of my units, killing two of the three. the last one failed to hit the tank, and i responded with two plasmaguns. there was roasted oblit all over hte place

cool i thought the obits were termies with better weapons and less of them but now im understanding they are havocs on steroids with a ton of weapons at there disposal and better saves. lol im loving all the info guys lol once again THANK YOU and i cant wait to get some practice games in wiht the new list.

HQ
Chaos space marines:
Chaos lord 90pts
Terminator armor 30pts
Daemon weapon 25pts
145pts

ELIETE
Chaos terminators 5
Reaper autocannon, chainfist, crombi melta, power fist
205pts

TROOPS
Chaos space marines 10
Champ power weapon & plasma pistol 45pts
Icon chaos glory 10pts 2 plasma guns 30pts
235pts
rhino extra armor 50pts

Khorne Berserkers 8
Skull champion power weapon & plasma pistol 66pts
198pts
rhino extra armor 50pts

FAST ATTACK
Chaos raptors 7
champ w/lightning claws 60pts
2 plasma gun 15pts
icon of Khorne 30pts
240pts

HEAVY SUPPORT
Obliterators 2
150pts

Obliterators 3
225pts

Total 1498

nice list there, good amounts of punishment up close and from a distance.

darn all you making me see the use of oblits, i might just have to add a few to my marine list